I bought the 2015 Cube Peloton SL (Aluminium) superb, I raised my seat yesterday by 40mm after a group of riders passed me & one said "your seat's too low", bloody hell it feels like I am now part of the bike, more power through the pedals, the bike feels more responsive & NO knee pain, amazing what the correct adjustments can feel like.
Yeah, to purge knee pain, just increase the seat height but not too much, best way to know if your seat is too high is if you turn your hips up and down one side at a time to ride your bike
I'm personally steering clear away from carbon after watching someone's carbon bike literally shear off and impale them causing them to get emergency evac'ed off a mountain. Aluminum just bends, but carbon splinters and snaps. It may weigh more, but im good.
The last 2 aluminum frames that I had didn't last long, they got cracks, metal fatigue is the extremely weak feature of aluminum. The UTS (ultimate tensile strength) of aluminum alloys is already very low (290 MPa for 6061, 415MPa for 6069) and metal fatigue means cracking well below the UTS.
Same here. About 15 years ago I bought a very budget aluminium mountain bike and over the years, regularly pushed it beyond its recommended use. Over the years, apart from tyres and inner tubes, literally the only maintenance purchases I've had to make for it are: break blocks (yes, old V brakes), headset bearings, a second hand fork after the original fork eventually seized, and grips. We've still got it now, although it's been relegated to become the wife's bike, as she doesn't do anything at all challenging so in effect, the bike is now enjoying retirement but is still used for light use, and is still showing no signs of any problems.
Anf Trew hehe, my bike is a really cheap one and i’ve been using it for 5 years now. Did some trails, not too technical, far beyond what it was designed for. Still works well, just changed the rear v-brake
I just recently bought a vintage m500 MTB with a rigid cromo fork. I just love the fluid shapes which were futuristic back in the day. Unibody construction started there.
I still own a cannondale 2.8 frame with 1" aluminium fork , stiff in climbs but very harsh over not so perfect roads but upgraded to carbon fork, carbon seat post and hollow titanium rails on saddle. Amazing results in ride quality!
As a former composites materials tester in a lab, I can tell you "failure" in composites isn't when it actually breaks. It occurs way earlier than most expect. Any impact can delaminate it with NO visible damage. The next impact it may fail catastrophically. It is Russian roulette when that will happen.
My best friend got a Cannondale m900 new in 1992. He gave it to me some years back. I ride it more than many commute in a car. It is still fantastic, strong, durable, comfortable, looks great.
All I can say I love my Cannondale CAAD12 105. Great bike, comfortable, light, durable, great handling, nibble, quick and most important it is bike that just push me to go fast.
John O’Brian actually you have it backwards. It would be a strong alkali that would reduce the aluminum causing corrosion. A strong acid or oxidizer would have little effect as the surface of aluminum alloy is protected from those via surface oxidation but caustic soda would corrode it rapidly.
There's a reason aluminum is used in cars now along with plastic, lighter than steel and rust resistant! Rust is a major problem for older cars specially pickup trucks
Does aluminium rust? yes it oxidizes within seconds of being exposed to air. That said the layer of aluminium oxide does not flake off and therefore the aluminium oxide works as a protective layer.
there’s also galvanic corrosion when electrochemically dissimilar metals such as aluminium and steel are in contact with each other and water is present.
My MTB is made with a bare brushed aluminium finish and I ride it through hell with no issues. I actually wonder why more bikes don't come with that finish? It's very robust and scratch proof . And no it doesn't rust. In fact I have another 35 years old MTB with aluminium frame and steel fork and even though 20% of the paint flaked off over the years, and it always sits outside in the rain, it never rusted, not even the fork!
Ed aluminum oxyde is also one of the harder material found on earth, sand paper and ceramics are actually made mostly from aluminum oxides... think planes, massive temperatures/humidity differences day in day out under pretty intense stress for over 30 years.
As the rider of an alloy Cannondale, I haven't felt GCN speaking to me this personally since whenever they last suggested I drink beer after riding (or was it before? during?)
Cool video GCN! I love the crazy insane expensive high tech stuff, but it is nice to see you do a video on the more affordable end of the bike spectrum. I am riding a carbon frame, but there are definitely some cool aluminum bikes out there. Might be nice to carry this theme into components as well. We can't all ride this years latest electronic components.
Aluminum cheat sheet: -2xxx series = soft/ductile = great for sport equipment -7xxx series = high specific tensile strength and good resistance to crack propagation = go to aluminum used in aerospace -6xxx series = middle ground between 2xxx and 6xxx
I make carbon fibre products that have CNC aluminium fittings on my youtube channel, but I ride a aluminium frame bike :| with carbon accessories. I just like riding my bike :)
I ride aluminium (Cannondales x 3), titanium (Merlin and Litespeed), and I have a few carbon bikes as well. A well designed aluminium frame is a thing of joy. My Caad 10 with Sram Red and Reynolds wheels is light, it turns with confidence, and it climbs like a homesick angel. It is very comfortable, but it's also very alive feeling. Ti bikes, as a rule, feel softer with less buzz. My Merlin has a lot of mileage on it, and it's the bike I choose when I'm traveling because it's indestructable. It's outlived four groupsets and three carbon travel bikes (including a Kuota that an airline flattened by running a vehicle over it). Carbon is nice, and it's the entry into the cool club. But I don't have good luck with long life; from a BMC that kept breaking seat stays, to a Pinarello that detached the bottom bracket. My TT bike (2009 Specialized Transition S-Works) being the obvious exception - it's godawful harsh while being noodle like flexible, it handles like a bucking bronco - but it's been shipped many times and ridden into the side of a car and it's still perfect. Bottom line, if the house was burning to the ground, I'd carry out my Cannondales and my Merlin, then I'd go back in for the dog. And then the girlfriend. Sorry pooch.
I just bought a Gravel bike. Aluminum frame with carbon fork. Very comfy on even the worst roads. To buy it I sold my 12 year old Aluminum Trek which was still in great shape.
I owned an Allez and for sure it is a great bike frame but for the money they give you shit components, you made a good call with the Giant. I now own a FELT F6 good riding
rode one of those at local bike shop, very harsh ride and bb bends so much under load the chain rubs the cage on both sides, maybe it's designed for less than 140 lb riders
Still riding my 7000 series mid-nineties Fondriest Megalu. Stiff (and harsh!) as hell but it has taken a shit-kicking as a messenger bike and is still rolling. Daily rider. Love it.
As I mentioned on another one of your videos, my 2005 Team Fuji carbon race bike had a frame (with forks) weight of 2041 grams. I now have a 2018 Fuji Roubaix 1.3 aluminium with a frame weight of 1500 grams. Carbon is not always the lighter material, and aluminum can be softened up by choosing a better grade, higher tpi tire.
I had an Italian steel bike that lasted about 60.000 kms (36.000 miles). It fatigued an inch down, the down tube. I had a carbon bike that did precisely the same thing but after only 20.000 kms. (Maybe my riding style had something to do with it) As I don't ride as far as I used to, I now have two aluminium bikes and am quite happy with both of them.
I was driving a coach this afternoon through Bletchingley (A25) from Godstone, Surrey, and I saw a chap donning the full GCN kit.. I slowed down and let him cross my path and I must say the kit is extremely striking in person!!.. I wasn't sure if it was one of you guys? or maybe just a Joe blogs.. It definitely could not have been Matt as this guy clipped in first time ☺... Keep up the good work guys
I ride aluminum or as they say in the UK, aluminium........I am very happy with my choice, I was able to get a much higher end bike w/r/t the components for less cost than a carbon bike.
Nice video. I'm 51 and and have been an avid rider since I was quite you g. I actually raced as a USCF category 4 racer for 3 years back in the mid-90s. I was really bad, but I gave it my best go of it. I've had several bikes. My favorite bicycle of all time to ride which I still own is a 1991 Marin Indian fire Trail made from 7005 series aluminum. It's a hardtail with a chromoly Fork. No suspension. I've written it hard in the mountains and anywhere else I can get it. My average weight over the course of owning this bike is around 250 lb. The frame has held up beautifully and is still comfortable while at the same time transmitting a maximum amount of my energy output into propelling me in the direction I want to go.
C W I've been riding a 1995 Trek bonded aluminum mtn bike with chromoly fork since new. Bike has been rode hard in WV, Nevada, PA, and Ohio and still going. I couldn't afford Trek's OCLV back then but the bonded aluminum has certainly impressed me.
It would be very nice if you do more videos like this (carbon vs steel, aluminium vs steel, titanium vs carbon, magnesium vs aluminium, etc. etc. etc.)
Bit tricky though making a bike from uranium, don't you think? Any aero advantage would be lost because they would have to wear a full radioactive suit, with mask, gloves and boots as well!
Love my old 2006 aluminum Specialized Allez Comp. I rode an old Peugeot steel 10 speed before that, and a chromoly hardtail mountain bike. I have newer carbon bikes that I also enjoy and they all have their good points, aero, climbing and endurance, but it's all about the ride and liveliness and how they make you feel on the road. Every Spring I start out my riding season on my Allez. I tested a Cannondale Caad12 105. That is a sweet bike. Ended up buying a leftover orphaned Cervelo R2, thought.
Misleading answer about corrosion! Aluminum will oxidize on its surface, but the corrosion won't spread into the interior of the metal and eat away at it like rust does. The extremely thin layer of aluminum oxide that forms on the surface will protect the metal below it from further oxidation. Corrosion is therefore only a cosmetic problem for aluminum, unlike for steel, which can completely disintegrate.
8 років тому+43
I still prefer the ride of ALuminium. I own 3 x bikes (2 x carbon and one aluminium) and have ridden about 20. I prefer aLuminium everytime - it just feels more alive. Carbon (for me) has always been like that hot chick whose pants you were desperate to get into ... only to learn ... she's a dead lay. I'll take the less glamorous and more lovin bike/women everytime.
lol....Joints on the aluminum frame i looking at almost as good as Carbon joints...not much in it for looks now unless you have quality Carbon built frame for weight reasons & wanting to go up lots of hills or Cyclo Crossing...the thing over your back:))
Depends on whether you prefer the Cadillac or Ferrari ride quality. Personally I like the "dead" or "mute" feel of Carbon... vibration is not a thing I like to feel when I ride, and I don't even own a Carbon bike.
After cracking my last Aluminium frame ( probably metal fatigue) after only about 10000km on the bike , I bought a Titanium frame . Done 12000km on it and hoping to ride it for few more years. I still have another Alu bike , but I hate the ride compared to Titanium
Can I ask what ti frame you bought? I have tried the Enigma Evade and it was better at absorbing rough road than I had expected, however, it is not so cheap when you take into account the cost of buying frame, fork and all the bits. I have an aluminium frame. It isn't bad but it can get buzzy at the front end and will jump me of off the saddle over a big bump. I personally, do not like it's rigidity. I guess too much stiffness can be a bad thing. I don't have the luxury of having great roads, so it's hard to avoid poor surfaces. It would definitely ride better over good roads, but as most roads here are average to poor I want a nippy but more forgiving frame. I have also have a steel frame which I bought off ebay and built up. Its a more sedate ride compared to the aluminium frame but it is definitely better at taking the rough road and I don't feel beaten up after 30 or more miles. I guess everyone feels things differently, but I really cannot get to enjoy my aluminium frame. I am on the lighter side as well, perhaps a heavier rider will feel less beaten up as they have more body weight. Not sure how much is true as I haven't asked anyone much heavier than me who rides an aluminium frame?
My Ti Frame is a Vannicholas Ventus , a pretty basic frame but comfortable. Do not expect to beat speed records with this frame, it flexes and on climbs I usually open the rear brake to avoid rubbing, but my biggest issue I have with this frame is the very short wheelbase when climbing with gradients over 15% the front of the bike jumps every time I press on the pedals forcing me to stand and lose grip on the rear . I also have a Aluminium frame ( Specialized Allez) but I cannot feel my hands after long descents. I would love to use a Carbon frame , but I was working in Kurdistan when I needed a new bike and had to go with the most likely frame to survive a crash . My previous Aluminium Frame was French Made with carbon seatstays and was a lot more comfortable and lighter than the Specialized, but a lot more fragile. and it did develop a crack on the downtube below the barrel adjusters. My next bike is a Carbon
"The cheapest bikes are made of steel." Well yeah, maybe cheap steel. But some of the most expensive as well as middle ground bikes are made of high grade steel, ranging from chromium alloy to stainless. It would be nice to see them included in a fair comparison.
Thanks...so it's a bit like life....most things are a compromise. If you want raw stiffness and power, and sacrifice some comfort go carbon and try to ride on good roads! If you want more comfort over bad roads but sacrifice some all out stiffness and power go titanium.
I have been pleased with my Trek One series made with the Alpha aluminum. For me, it was the best frame I could afford at the time on very limited budget. One day I hope to step up to carbon, but for those looking for a strong, lightweight, modern road bike on a budget, go with an aluminum frame. Great job again GCN!
What you will find is that the carbon bike rides no better and costs a lot more, the weight difference is insignificant and tires are more important for a good ride. Perhaps CF sprints slightly better in the top end. If you are racing that might be a tiny advantage if you are willing to risk that much of an investment. Around here the best racers generally aren't. So you want to buy a $10,000 bike for the Thursday training ride?
I second that. My trek pilot 1.0 (?) is my fave bike. 500 quid and still perfect wheels and tyres after years! It's all about having a nice comfy upright position and geometry to start with. It's a real shame that so many people buy / are sold agressive bikes that you can't do anything with postion-wise. It's a real pleasure to start with comfy and then tinker with position for when you want to appear more pro :)
Excellent video! Thanks! I have a problem and im a bit worried. My aluminium bike frame recently suffered an impact and, consequently, a dent on the top tube. I use it for trail, downhills and jumps. Is it safe to ride my bike with that dent or i need to replace my frame?
Aluminium does corrode but unlike steel ( and other steels excluding stainless) it self-passivates. The aluminium oxide layer acts as a barrier to oxygen and generally keeps the corrosion at bay, whilst the FeO (various oxidation states also) generally does not and remains "permeable" to oxygen. (Notable exception is Magnetite, which does offer some protection but not on the same level as the alumina.
I have been saving for a Cannondale Super Six; however, recently test rode a CAAD12, and now my once dead set on the Super Six heart, is having a serious reconsideration moment. The bike is amazing; far superior to either of my current aluminum roadies (Defy 3 and Podium 3) - so; I may be an Aluminati member for life!! Currently have 4 alum. bikes (2 roadies, 1 single speed, and my track bike) and 1 one old steelie (former commuter) and have been itching for carbon watching your vids and the plethora of carbon-crew members rolling the hills in the Bay Area... oh; decisions, decisions, decisions!!
Aluminum is a great choice for any one looking for something Light Weight and Affordable. My 3 personal bikes all use an aluminium frame with a carbon fork and I love riding each of them. All three have been reliable, durable, and fun to ride. A lot of people say Aluminum bikes are stiff and not good for longer rides but I believe if you get a good bike fit and the right saddle/chamois combo you will be good for many mile/km's. My (n+1) collection includes: Roadie Group Ride - 98' Cannondale CAD 3 R1000 in purple/green colorshift Cyclocross Races / Bikepacking / Gravel - 08' Santa Cruz Stigmata in Anodized Purple Track / Urban - 16' Cannondale CAAD 10 Track in Green and Brushed Aluminum setup brake-less Other brands/ Aluminum bikes I would consider adding to my collection: LOW Bicycles (anything they make), Salsa Cycles (Stormchaser), Specialized (Allez Sprint), and Klein (Quantum).
I'm enjoying my £150 aluminium road bike at the moment but that's because its got automatic shifting. NuVinci hub and Arduino working together gives me a permanent smile on my face.
I went to a bike shop recently and they had nothing but Trek bikes. I'm not familiar with this brand honestly, but the bikes look amazing and I might just get one.
my impression is that carbon frames are generally designed to withstand forces being applied to it while pedaling. They also do impact testing on forks to simulate a head on collision, but I think that's about it. So while it is advantageous in that carbon is able to generally use less weight to achieve the desired performance characteristics, it doesn't account for the other forces that happen when a bike crashes. Alloy is completely uniform throughout, so it doesn't care where the forces are coming from.
You mean Titanium alloy of which there are many different grades as is so with aluminium (you select according to intended application). Ti has no useful mechanical properties unless blended with other metals. Example: 6AL4V (comprises aluminium and vanadium) continentalsteel.com/titanium/grades/
Both my road bike and my mountain bike are aluminum. They each had carbon options for about $2,000 extra that saved about 2 pounds off the weight of the bike. I'm happy with aluminum.
Congratulations on the Bowman references. Nice to hear a small new company get a mention. I ride one of their bikes, a Palace and it is stunning. Who needs carbon when alloy can be this good?
Can first hand testify for the general awesomeness of a high(ish) end aluminium bike. My ROSE Xeon RS2000 is an absolute rocketship. Well under 8kg (and that's with a "heavy" 105 groupset fitted!), and ride feel that makes ballsy cornering irresistible. The claimed frame weight for size medium is 995g (note it is anodised black with no paint, which saves a lot of weight).
+Chris Jeffery So are GCN independent, or do they take 'donations' from different bike manufacturers to promote one and denigrate another? I too was more than surprised that the CAADs weren't mentioned. Looking at the Aluminium bikes shown, apart from the tapered top tube, they seem to have very little of the tube shaping and profiling of the Cannondales.
I had a 2010 Trek 2.3 (105 gruppo) and it was absolutely fantastic! It's a shame the Trek 1.x are not up to the same standard as the 2.3, which became the "Madone 2" but seems to have gone completely now. The 2010 2.3 was one of the best value high-quality entry-level road bikes for people who want to ride fast. I guess the closest to the 2.3 now would be the Emonda ALR 5. p.s. alu frames are far from equal -- by a big margin. A couple of years ago I bought a Moda Intro to ride in the UK and it is nowhere near something like the recent Cannondale alus or the Trek 2.3, even though it has a carbon fork (that fork may be carbon but it feels like it's made of rock). Harsh is an understatement. You can mitigate the harshness to some extent with 25 mm tyres (or even with tires).
My dad used to do this on his solo rides to make him fitter for the group rides when he would use a lighter bike. Sometimes would even pull out the steelie on a group for all the cycling snobs to mock. However, he didnt give a shit and kept up with them on their carbon frames.
I ride one of those stiff kleins a 1996 quantum and it feels fine to me. I was able to fit some 28c tires and that made all the difference from the skinny 25c(measured out to 22c) tires that came on it .
Steel is the cheapest GCN? I would beg to differ the cheapest road bikes out there are all aluminium, most expensive are steel! Mercian bikes ain't cheap!
PeowPeowPeowLasers Thats true, also my local department store dont sell bikes, but all decathlon road bikes are aluminium and the cheapest road bike on amazon.co.uk is also aluminium...
I have an Aluminium hybrid bike as my commuter, feels nice and robust and despite having decent specs it didn't cost that much, great material for a mix of value, weight and ride.
Had two aluminium bikes my first was an Alan glued together bike in about 1989 and today i have a Principia sx psl with carbon forks. I like my bike so much i spent heaps on new carbon wheels instead of buy a new bike.
In the case of 6160-T6 there should be little to no aging effect at all. Some older aluminum alloys become more brittle over time, but not 6160-T6. It's also very resistant to corrosion, 6160-T6 forms a hard oxide layer as it corrodes which generally stops further corrosion.
i love aluminium alloys though, they do the job pretty well, my bike is the cyclocross carrera tanneri LTD 2015 edition and i have had it for a year now, it's doing an amazing job, i love it to bits, including my contact II continental tyres for my bike, plus the brakes clarks amazing stuff on how they utilize to materials to road bikes and cyclocross bikes.
They make car suspension components out of aluminium. They handle a lot more weight than bikes, day in, day out for years. Even if aluminium gets a bit fatigued, it would still be more than capable of supporting a rider.
I'm a high school stud and my parents want me to spend my own money on a carbon frame. That's my reason to use an Aluminum bike, and tbh I enjoy it. *drops mic*
I had a Raleigh Technium with aluminum mainframe and steel stays and fork. Guess where it broke...the steel chain stay. It was probably 80s bike, broke couple years ago. I had the stay welded, worked great until recently stolen.
OK - people have misconceptions about strength and stiffness ALL the aluminium alloys have about the same stiffness. (about 10000 ksi) Same with ALL the steel alloys (about 29ksi). 6061 is as stiff as the 7000 series. 1025 mild steel is just as stiff as 4130 chrome moly steel. Their ultimate strength varies, of course. But no human would be able to feel any difference in stiffness in riding a 6000 alloy bike or a 7000 series. Same with steel. Strength and stiffness are not the same! Stiffness is deflection under load and all aluminium alloys deflect the same, as do all the steel alloys. The high strength alloys will break at a higher load, but deflection (and stiffness) is the same.
True in respect of molecular properties; but in terms of a frame the higher the material strength, the thinner the tubing can be and so the frame tends to be more forgiving - which a rider can notice. It's not the material property per se, but it is correct to state that a 6000 series and 7000 series of Alu have different stiffness/strength characteristics when formed & welded up into a bike frame, not owing to the alloy itself, but the way it has been made.
The claim was that one alloy of aluminum was stiffer than another alloy. Stiffness can be varied with tube shape and diameter but the metallurgical claim was false. Moreover, comfort is much more a function of frame geometry and tire size and pressure than stiffness. Any frame stiff enough to handle well is not going to have nearly as much compliance as the tires. All the common wisdom in cycling mainly exists to separate cyclists from as much money as possible. Bicycles generally last for decades and chances are if you are dropped on a $1,000 bike that you will also be dropped on a $5,000 bike. If you are a serious competitive cyclist than saving a pound or being a little more aerodynamic might be worthwhile but for everyone else small changes do not make cycling faster or more enjoyable beyond placebo affect. When I was in tie biz' rotating weight was the buzzword. We got people to buy super light wheels and sewups because everyone knew that taking weight off the wheels was many times more effective than taking weight off the frame. Then aero rims came out and cyclists were racing on rims heavier than what they used to train on but now they were faster because they were more aero. Now we can't have cyclists riding harsh buckboard stiff aluminum frames can we? What they really need is the magic carpet ride of carbon. Whatever you do keep buying!
Aaaah, so, dispite many of the chromoly 6061,7000 series, mild steel 1025 having similar stiffness, their strength and deflection limits are much different. It is also amazing to know how much stiffer aluminum is compared to other stuff.
Well, my alloy frame cracked after only few years, replaced it with another alloy one 5 years ago and...so far, so good. Till yousing my dad's 50 years old steel bike till now from time to time.
+Kjetil Korsveien I have found that by sealing all the frame holes that would ordinarily leak and by increasing the volume of helium in the frame my average time trial speeds have been increasing significantly.
Helium is 7 times lighter than air. That sounds like a lot? Not so fast, a liter of air weigh about 2 grams. Guessing you have no more than 2 liters of air in your frame. Then you save a gram or two at the most.
Where steel can rust through, when aluminum(ium) oxidizes, that layer doesn't go very deep and prevents further oxidation. Anodization creates a thin layer of aluminum oxide, which creates the toughness and corrosion resistance we love about it. and don't forget the cool colors.
Aluminum is subject to galvanic corrosion when dissimilar metals are in contact.. In bikes this can show up where a steel bolt is used to secure into an aluminum frame. I remove bolts periodically to check them and use a dielectric grease when reassembling.
Sorry, but no. In my humble experience, an aluminium frame, if not treated correctly, can corrode deeply enough to be rendered useless. In a former life, I worked in the bike trade, basically right through aluminium's brief reign and the ascendancy of carbon. Over that time, my "career" (haha) took me in two distinct directions: 1) frame repair and painting; 2) triathlon support. In the paint shop, we loved the old Cannondales because the paint would fall off 'em. Most of the time, they never needed to go into the stripping tank, just the degreaser. After an overnight soak, I'd drop the frame into a giant washtub and rinse it off with an ordinary garden hose. The paint would slide off into the tub. Unfortunately for some owners, that terrible paint was poor defense against sweat and salt. Over the years, we refused to paint the odd frame or two because the corrosion was too severe to be deemed safe. Corrosion around "braze-ons" (those awful plastic brake guides and especially gear cable stops and lever bosses riveted to the frame) was endemic. Though I'm now an old hairy-legged Fred on an abominably heavy steel (Reynolds 725) expedition tourer complete with stainless racks AND mudguards, I'm astounded at the quality of modern road bikes, both carbon and aluminium. The finish on a production frame is light years ahead of that of 15-20 years ago. And the weight! The other day, I picked up some kind of tricked out Look wunderbike in my mate's shop and was aghast when comparing to my old 1999 KG251 - a bike which was a revelation to me for its light weight, lively ride and good looks back at the beginning of the century.
+Michael Toohey That sounds like quite the experience! I volunteer for a not for profit bike garage helping people learn to fix their bikes and see some of the worst frames come in, not for restoration, but just to get rolling. When I was in the Navy, in our radiological defense material storerooms we had some very corrosive materials. Any exposed steel would rust through quickly and we had to keep the paint layer thick on the walls, as every compartment on a ship is made of steel. The aluminum racks that held the materials and defense gear would have that rough oxidized feel and stayed strong. Though the bolts holding it together would have to be replaced regularly. Aluminum is not impermeable to corrosion, especially salts in solution (sweat), but the natural corrosion resistance of the metal is incredible.
Chappeu for the volunteering - that's a worthy project. And yes, you are so right that the corrosion resistance of aluminium compared to steel is amazing. I have some motorcycle crankcases that are over a hundred years old (1913), and they are still useable. I'd also add that after rinsing an alloy frame off, I could hang it on a hook to dry, bead blast it later in the day and paint it the next day if I wanted to. A steel frame, on the other hand, would need to have the first coat on ASAP after stripping and bead blasting. Never liked to have them sitting around "in the raw" waiting for the rust bug to bite. Perhaps that was the problem with the early (80s and 90s) aluminium frames. The stuff seems so forgiving (it terms of finishes and corrosion resistence) that the guys got a bit too lax with the paint and less smart design features -e.g. riveted-on cable stops. Anyhow, I was musing on this today as I looked at my wife's inexpensive Giant commuter/tourer. The fit & finish on the hydroformed frame would make a 1990 Cannondale (or Klein) blush.
I bought the 2015 Cube Peloton SL (Aluminium) superb, I raised my seat yesterday by 40mm after a group of riders passed me & one said "your seat's too low", bloody hell it feels like I am now part of the bike, more power through the pedals, the bike feels more responsive & NO knee pain, amazing what the correct adjustments can feel like.
Yeah, to purge knee pain, just increase the seat height but not too much, best way to know if your seat is too high is if you turn your hips up and down one side at a time to ride your bike
A little ❤ goes a long ways!
I'm personally steering clear away from carbon after watching someone's carbon bike literally shear off and impale them causing them to get emergency evac'ed off a mountain. Aluminum just bends, but carbon splinters and snaps. It may weigh more, but im good.
Aluminium doesn't bend it cracks steel bends.
Bartooc is that a joke - aluminium is a metal, metals are ductile - therefore aluminium bends.
I wonder if that carbon fiber bike frame is from a reputable brand manufacturer or a no-brand China?
@@nathanjohn367 Try to bend hardened aluminium and chromoly steel and tell me what happens...
Nathan John
Drill bits are made out of metal, but they don’t bend too well.
I have a 17 year old aluminium mountain bike that has been through the wars and is in great shape still.
Which wars ?
The last 2 aluminum frames that I had didn't last long, they got cracks, metal fatigue is the extremely weak feature of aluminum.
The UTS (ultimate tensile strength) of aluminum alloys is already very low (290 MPa for 6061, 415MPa for 6069) and metal fatigue means cracking well below the UTS.
ouztaki been through the wa(r)sh?
Same here. About 15 years ago I bought a very budget aluminium mountain bike and over the years, regularly pushed it beyond its recommended use. Over the years, apart from tyres and inner tubes, literally the only maintenance purchases I've had to make for it are: break blocks (yes, old V brakes), headset bearings, a second hand fork after the original fork eventually seized, and grips. We've still got it now, although it's been relegated to become the wife's bike, as she doesn't do anything at all challenging so in effect, the bike is now enjoying retirement but is still used for light use, and is still showing no signs of any problems.
Anf Trew hehe, my bike is a really cheap one and i’ve been using it for 5 years now. Did some trails, not too technical, far beyond what it was designed for. Still works well, just changed the rear v-brake
As a welder, Cannondales aluminum always leaves me impressed. Nice lines and beautiful welds. Honestly, Cannondale is the master of aluminum.
Hmm.. Hambini is always slagging off Cannondale, though I have one and really like it, it's with the aluminium frame and carbon forks.
Yup, got a 2006 CAAD 8, that frame is beautiful and was still made in the US.
Jamis is incredible with aluminum especially with 7005 the far superior and best aluminum on the face of this planet!
I just recently bought a vintage m500 MTB with a rigid cromo fork. I just love the fluid shapes which were futuristic back in the day. Unibody construction started there.
Agreed, big fan of their aluminium frames!!
C'mon guys, you've forgot the best of them all the Cannondale CAAD Alu frame!
Is that the plastic aluminum combo?
Absolutely bro he could do a whole video on the cannondale aluminum development.
I still own a cannondale 2.8 frame with 1" aluminium fork , stiff in climbs but very harsh over not so perfect roads but upgraded to carbon fork, carbon seat post and hollow titanium rails on saddle. Amazing results in ride quality!
Watch out with the carbon seatpost in an alu frame. Give it at least twice a year some fresh carbon paste. Otherwise they will stick together!
As a former composites materials tester in a lab, I can tell you "failure" in composites isn't when it actually breaks. It occurs way earlier than most expect. Any impact can delaminate it with NO visible damage. The next impact it may fail catastrophically. It is Russian roulette when that will happen.
Any tips for better using alloy for longer durability?
@@AK-ox3mv he clearly ment carbon
My best friend got a Cannondale m900 new in 1992. He gave it to me some years back. I ride it more than many commute in a car. It is still fantastic, strong, durable, comfortable, looks great.
All I can say I love my Cannondale CAAD12 105. Great bike, comfortable, light, durable, great handling, nibble, quick and most important it is bike that just push me to go fast.
Unless you are cycling though some very strong acid or something that is a great oxidiser your aluminium frame is going to be fine
John O’Brian actually you have it backwards. It would be a strong alkali that would reduce the aluminum causing corrosion. A strong acid or oxidizer would have little effect as the surface of aluminum alloy is protected from those via surface oxidation but caustic soda would corrode it rapidly.
Yuo. Some people have very acidic sweat that can damage allum frame and parts if you dont wash it with water after a ride
@@archiearevalo5648 True like my pal Wolf man Jack.
There's a reason aluminum is used in cars now along with plastic, lighter than steel and rust resistant! Rust is a major problem for older cars specially pickup trucks
Does aluminium rust? yes it oxidizes within seconds of being exposed to air. That said the layer of aluminium oxide does not flake off and therefore the aluminium oxide works as a protective layer.
there’s also galvanic corrosion when electrochemically dissimilar metals such as aluminium and steel are in contact with each other and water is present.
I had my bike without paint and it never rust and it went through heavy rain and snow.
My MTB is made with a bare brushed aluminium finish and I ride it through hell with no issues. I actually wonder why more bikes don't come with that finish? It's very robust and scratch proof .
And no it doesn't rust.
In fact I have another 35 years old MTB with aluminium frame and steel fork and even though 20% of the paint flaked off over the years, and it always sits outside in the rain, it never rusted, not even the fork!
Ugh hurts my brain
Ed aluminum oxyde is also one of the harder material found on earth, sand paper and ceramics are actually made mostly from aluminum oxides... think planes, massive temperatures/humidity differences day in day out under pretty intense stress for over 30 years.
Thanks for the breakdown guys! I love my trusty little aluminium :)
As the rider of an alloy Cannondale, I haven't felt GCN speaking to me this personally since whenever they last suggested I drink beer after riding (or was it before? during?)
Secretly sponsored by trek :3
Very true
wow 8 year old :3 :)
Cool video GCN! I love the crazy insane expensive high tech stuff, but it is nice to see you do a video on the more affordable end of the bike spectrum. I am riding a carbon frame, but there are definitely some cool aluminum bikes out there. Might be nice to carry this theme into components as well. We can't all ride this years latest electronic components.
When the steel vid comes around, we had better get Matt to present it. Surely he can and has appreciated a good steel stead.
I have an Orbea Avant aluminium frame. I'm very satisfied with it, and it also has life-time warranty.
Aluminum cheat sheet:
-2xxx series = soft/ductile = great for sport equipment
-7xxx series = high specific tensile strength and good resistance to crack propagation = go to aluminum used in aerospace
-6xxx series = middle ground between 2xxx and 6xxx
I make carbon fibre products that have CNC aluminium fittings on my youtube channel, but I ride a aluminium frame bike :| with carbon accessories.
I just like riding my bike :)
for the win
Don't you worry about galvanic corrosion or delamination?
I ride aluminium (Cannondales x 3), titanium (Merlin and Litespeed), and I have a few carbon bikes as well. A well designed aluminium frame is a thing of joy. My Caad 10 with Sram Red and Reynolds wheels is light, it turns with confidence, and it climbs like a homesick angel. It is very comfortable, but it's also very alive feeling. Ti bikes, as a rule, feel softer with less buzz. My Merlin has a lot of mileage on it, and it's the bike I choose when I'm traveling because it's indestructable. It's outlived four groupsets and three carbon travel bikes (including a Kuota that an airline flattened by running a vehicle over it). Carbon is nice, and it's the entry into the cool club. But I don't have good luck with long life; from a BMC that kept breaking seat stays, to a Pinarello that detached the bottom bracket. My TT bike (2009 Specialized Transition S-Works) being the obvious exception - it's godawful harsh while being noodle like flexible, it handles like a bucking bronco - but it's been shipped many times and ridden into the side of a car and it's still perfect. Bottom line, if the house was burning to the ground, I'd carry out my Cannondales and my Merlin, then I'd go back in for the dog. And then the girlfriend. Sorry pooch.
Informative....for me my dream bike is Ti (though it will almost certainly come with carbon forks)
My wife is considering getting into riding and this segment was really useful in debunking some things I had heard about Aluminum. Thanks GCN.
I just bought a Gravel bike. Aluminum frame with carbon fork. Very comfy on even the worst roads. To buy it I sold my 12 year old Aluminum Trek which was still in great shape.
Just bought my wife a Trek Emonda ALR. Super stoked, thanks GCN.
I own a Specialized Allez, is an Aluminum frame and its awesome. Its not super expensive and hacve great stiffness y Handles really well.
Yeah, I looked into that bike and then bought a Giant Advanced Defy. I'm pretty sure I could have bought the Allez and kept some money.
I owned an Allez and for sure it is a great bike frame but for the money they give you shit components, you made a good call with the Giant. I now own a FELT F6 good riding
The geometry would have been totally different though. The TCR is closer to the allez in geometry than the defy. but yeah.
+racebends My Allez came with full Shimano 105 in 11 speed, so it wasnt a bad deal.
rode one of those at local bike shop, very harsh ride and bb bends so much under load the chain rubs the cage on both sides, maybe it's designed for less than 140 lb riders
Still riding my 7000 series mid-nineties Fondriest Megalu. Stiff (and harsh!) as hell but it has taken a shit-kicking as a messenger bike and is still rolling. Daily rider. Love it.
As I mentioned on another one of your videos, my 2005 Team Fuji carbon race bike had a frame (with forks) weight of 2041 grams. I now have a 2018 Fuji Roubaix 1.3 aluminium with a frame weight of 1500 grams. Carbon is not always the lighter material, and aluminum can be softened up by choosing a better grade, higher tpi tire.
Will gravel bikes be allowed in the roubiax race?
I had an Italian steel bike that lasted about 60.000 kms (36.000 miles). It fatigued an inch down, the down tube. I had a carbon bike that did precisely the same thing but after only 20.000 kms. (Maybe my riding style had something to do with it) As I don't ride as far as I used to, I now have two aluminium bikes and am quite happy with both of them.
"Aluminium bikes can look just as sexy as carbon fiber bikes"
- Arya Stark
90's Cannondale were the sexiest.
Is this a GoT reference?
She never said that.
I agree 👍
TraumaER S:4 E:12 1:42:38
I was driving a coach this afternoon through Bletchingley (A25) from Godstone, Surrey, and I saw a chap donning the full GCN kit.. I slowed down and let him cross my path and I must say the kit is extremely striking in person!!.. I wasn't sure if it was one of you guys? or maybe just a Joe blogs.. It definitely could not have been Matt as this guy clipped in first time ☺... Keep up the good work guys
Can you do a seperate video for those of us in America who can only buy aluminum? Not all of us can get that fancy aluminium.
What?
Maybe he meant steel?
It's a joke on US pronunciation of "alumiNIUM" - they say it "alumiNUM"
Don't worry, it's the same thing. Brits don't know how to spell or pronounce it correctly. Also they call a pharmacist is a chemist.
Hi friends. American scientists call it aluminium. A pharmacist is a chemist who specialises in drugs. Bye friends.
my bike is a Marin Larkspur. the frame is aluminum and the welds on it are so beautiful. the tubes are triple butted too. i love it.
I ride aluminum or as they say in the UK, aluminium........I am very happy with my choice, I was able to get a much higher end bike w/r/t the components for less cost than a carbon bike.
Dayum! I read that in 2 voices 😅
Nice video. I'm 51 and and have been an avid rider since I was quite you g. I actually raced as a USCF category 4 racer for 3 years back in the mid-90s. I was really bad, but I gave it my best go of it. I've had several bikes. My favorite bicycle of all time to ride which I still own is a 1991 Marin Indian fire Trail made from 7005 series aluminum. It's a hardtail with a chromoly Fork. No suspension. I've written it hard in the mountains and anywhere else I can get it. My average weight over the course of owning this bike is around 250 lb. The frame has held up beautifully and is still comfortable while at the same time transmitting a maximum amount of my energy output into propelling me in the direction I want to go.
C W I've been riding a 1995 Trek bonded aluminum mtn bike with chromoly fork since new. Bike has been rode hard in WV, Nevada, PA, and Ohio and still going. I couldn't afford Trek's OCLV back then but the bonded aluminum has certainly impressed me.
I'd like to see one of these talking about the new high end steel frames that are becoming more popular.
Been loving on my Boston Merlin Road since 99. All effort is rewarded. Great Ride !
It would be very nice if you do more videos like this (carbon vs steel, aluminium vs steel, titanium vs carbon, magnesium vs aluminium, etc. etc. etc.)
I have a lugged bike with carbon tubes and Aluminium lugs and it rides very well for a 27 year old bike. Very informative. Thanks.
Are you guys going to do a video on each material, steel , aluminium (done) , carbon(done) and titanium?
Why stop there? They should push on and the entire Periodic Table. That would really be "GCN does science".
Bit tricky though making a bike from uranium, don't you think? Any aero advantage would be lost because they would have to wear a full radioactive suit, with mask, gloves and boots as well!
where's bamboo in the periodic table?
It's just organically sourced carbon macrotubing.
Love my old 2006 aluminum Specialized Allez Comp. I rode an old Peugeot steel 10 speed before that, and a chromoly hardtail mountain bike. I have newer carbon bikes that I also enjoy and they all have their good points, aero, climbing and endurance, but it's all about the ride and liveliness and how they make you feel on the road. Every Spring I start out my riding season on my Allez. I tested a Cannondale Caad12 105. That is a sweet bike. Ended up buying a leftover orphaned Cervelo R2, thought.
GCN: Fatigue on an aluminium bike.
Cannondale CAAD10: "What am I a joke to you."
Misleading answer about corrosion! Aluminum will oxidize on its surface, but the corrosion won't spread into the interior of the metal and eat away at it like rust does. The extremely thin layer of aluminum oxide that forms on the surface will protect the metal below it from further oxidation. Corrosion is therefore only a cosmetic problem for aluminum, unlike for steel, which can completely disintegrate.
I still prefer the ride of ALuminium. I own 3 x bikes (2 x carbon and one aluminium) and have ridden about 20. I prefer aLuminium everytime - it just feels more alive. Carbon (for me) has always been like that hot chick whose pants you were desperate to get into ... only to learn ... she's a dead lay. I'll take the less glamorous and more lovin bike/women everytime.
lol....Joints on the aluminum frame i looking at almost as good as Carbon joints...not much in it for looks now unless you have quality Carbon built frame for weight reasons & wanting to go up lots of hills or Cyclo Crossing...the thing over your back:))
Will Taylor 😂 well said. Not that CF is a bad ride, you just feel like you spent too much on dinner for what you got in the end.
Haha damn nice comparison ...
Hahahaha thats good im dying over here 👍👍👍😂😂😂
Depends on whether you prefer the Cadillac or Ferrari ride quality. Personally I like the "dead" or "mute" feel of Carbon... vibration is not a thing I like to feel when I ride, and I don't even own a Carbon bike.
GCN, always gives great information about bikes. Thank you gentleman.
I just welded my aluminum frame when it cracked by the crank, I took out the crank shaft
After cracking my last Aluminium frame ( probably metal fatigue) after only about 10000km on the bike , I bought a Titanium frame . Done 12000km on it and hoping to ride it for few more years. I still have another Alu bike , but I hate the ride compared to Titanium
Can I ask what ti frame you bought? I have tried the Enigma Evade and it was better at absorbing rough road than I had expected, however, it is not so cheap when you take into account the cost of buying frame, fork and all the bits. I have an aluminium frame. It isn't bad but it can get buzzy at the front end and will jump me of off the saddle over a big bump. I personally, do not like it's rigidity. I guess too much stiffness can be a bad thing. I don't have the luxury of having great roads, so it's hard to avoid poor surfaces. It would definitely ride better over good roads, but as most roads here are average to poor I want a nippy but more forgiving frame. I have also have a steel frame which I bought off ebay and built up. Its a more sedate ride compared to the aluminium frame but it is definitely better at taking the rough road and I don't feel beaten up after 30 or more miles. I guess everyone feels things differently, but I really cannot get to enjoy my aluminium frame. I am on the lighter side as well, perhaps a heavier rider will feel less beaten up as they have more body weight. Not sure how much is true as I haven't asked anyone much heavier than me who rides an aluminium frame?
My Ti Frame is a Vannicholas Ventus , a pretty basic frame but comfortable. Do not expect to beat speed records with this frame, it flexes and on climbs I usually open the rear brake to avoid rubbing, but my biggest issue I have with this frame is the very short wheelbase when climbing with gradients over 15% the front of the bike jumps every time I press on the pedals forcing me to stand and lose grip on the rear . I also have a Aluminium frame ( Specialized Allez) but I cannot feel my hands after long descents. I would love to use a Carbon frame , but I was working in Kurdistan when I needed a new bike and had to go with the most likely frame to survive a crash . My previous Aluminium Frame was French Made with carbon seatstays and was a lot more comfortable and lighter than the Specialized, but a lot more fragile. and it did develop a crack on the downtube below the barrel adjusters. My next bike is a Carbon
"The cheapest bikes are made of steel."
Well yeah, maybe cheap steel. But some of the most expensive as well as middle ground bikes are made of high grade steel, ranging from chromium alloy to stainless. It would be nice to see them included in a fair comparison.
Agreed
steel and ti bikes are lovley to ride they probably arnt going win any races on one but thats not what there for and that confuses some people
How do Ti bikes compare to your average carbon bike over poor surfaces - Do you know?
Richard M Ti has awesome vibration damping propertys and will last an eternity but its not as stiff as carbon
Thanks...so it's a bit like life....most things are a compromise. If you want raw stiffness and power, and sacrifice some comfort go carbon and try to ride on good roads! If you want more comfort over bad roads but sacrifice some all out stiffness and power go titanium.
Thanks Simon, this makes me eel better about the aluminum framed Fuji I just bought in April 2021. Good talk
Fuji kicks Ass!!!
This Alyoomineeyoom stuff sounds pretty neat!
Kyle Patton I wonder how it compares to aluminum.
welcome to the rest of the world
I think you forgot about cannondale's caad10 and caad12, some of the most impressive aluminum bikes from big manufacturers in this early century.
Awesome video. I'm still riding on some Columbus SL though. Don't expect me to budge from it, unless it is to an equally well crafted frame
I have been pleased with my Trek One series made with the Alpha aluminum. For me, it was the best frame I could afford at the time on very limited budget. One day I hope to step up to carbon, but for those looking for a strong, lightweight, modern road bike on a budget, go with an aluminum frame. Great job again GCN!
What you will find is that the carbon bike rides no better and costs a lot more, the weight difference is insignificant and tires are more important for a good ride. Perhaps CF sprints slightly better in the top end. If you are racing that might be a tiny advantage if you are willing to risk that much of an investment. Around here the best racers generally aren't. So you want to buy a $10,000 bike for the Thursday training ride?
I second that. My trek pilot 1.0 (?) is my fave bike. 500 quid and still perfect wheels and tyres after years! It's all about having a nice comfy upright position and geometry to start with. It's a real shame that so many people buy / are sold agressive bikes that you can't do anything with postion-wise. It's a real pleasure to start with comfy and then tinker with position for when you want to appear more pro :)
Excellent video! Thanks! I have a problem and im a bit worried. My aluminium bike frame recently suffered an impact and, consequently, a dent on the top tube. I use it for trail, downhills and jumps. Is it safe to ride my bike with that dent or i need to replace my frame?
Aluminium does corrode but unlike steel ( and other steels excluding stainless) it self-passivates. The aluminium oxide layer acts as a barrier to oxygen and generally keeps the corrosion at bay, whilst the FeO (various oxidation states also) generally does not and remains "permeable" to oxygen. (Notable exception is Magnetite, which does offer some protection but not on the same level as the alumina.
Title is a bit of a mashup: US Fiber and UK Aluminium. Can I get a sub-editor job?
The pronunciation is a bit off too - "allyminium"?
maybe you should make a video and show him how its done then!
I have been saving for a Cannondale Super Six; however, recently test rode a CAAD12, and now my once dead set on the Super Six heart, is having a serious reconsideration moment. The bike is amazing; far superior to either of my current aluminum roadies (Defy 3 and Podium 3) - so; I may be an Aluminati member for life!! Currently have 4 alum. bikes (2 roadies, 1 single speed, and my track bike) and 1 one old steelie (former commuter) and have been itching for carbon watching your vids and the plethora of carbon-crew members rolling the hills in the Bay Area... oh; decisions, decisions, decisions!!
Noah Froio love!!! CAAD12 former SUPER SIX EVO OWNER. I don’t know how Cannondale do it but the CAAD12 is an amazing bike!!!
3:42 made my day..
Aluminum is a great choice for any one looking for something Light Weight and Affordable. My 3 personal bikes all use an aluminium frame with a carbon fork and I love riding each of them. All three have been reliable, durable, and fun to ride. A lot of people say Aluminum bikes are stiff and not good for longer rides but I believe if you get a good bike fit and the right saddle/chamois combo you will be good for many mile/km's.
My (n+1) collection includes:
Roadie Group Ride - 98' Cannondale CAD 3 R1000 in purple/green colorshift
Cyclocross Races / Bikepacking / Gravel - 08' Santa Cruz Stigmata in Anodized Purple
Track / Urban - 16' Cannondale CAAD 10 Track in Green and Brushed Aluminum setup brake-less
Other brands/ Aluminum bikes I would consider adding to my collection: LOW Bicycles (anything they make), Salsa Cycles (Stormchaser), Specialized (Allez Sprint), and Klein (Quantum).
I just love my CAAD10
Fantastic bike.
Cannondale Advance Aluminum Design 10 I love my CAAD10 too !!!
Me too. Great bike:))
Incredible frameset! R&D engineering is outstanding.
I love watching your videos it's really helpful
I'm enjoying my £150 aluminium road bike at the moment but that's because its got automatic shifting. NuVinci hub and Arduino working together gives me a permanent smile on my face.
Lol automatic shifting wow
You pay someone to put food in your mouth too and wipe your ass?
I went to a bike shop recently and they had nothing but Trek bikes. I'm not familiar with this brand honestly, but the bikes look amazing and I might just get one.
A mechanic tuned my bike first just because it's a trek.
titanium vs carbon video!
my impression is that carbon frames are generally designed to withstand forces being applied to it while pedaling. They also do impact testing on forks to simulate a head on collision, but I think that's about it. So while it is advantageous in that carbon is able to generally use less weight to achieve the desired performance characteristics, it doesn't account for the other forces that happen when a bike crashes. Alloy is completely uniform throughout, so it doesn't care where the forces are coming from.
Just finished my titanium Litespeed. Titanium is the best frame material.
You mean Titanium alloy of which there are many different grades as is so with aluminium (you select according to intended application).
Ti has no useful mechanical properties unless blended with other metals.
Example: 6AL4V (comprises aluminium and vanadium)
continentalsteel.com/titanium/grades/
Cardboard FTW
Actually gold is the best frame ever.
@@aslanjudah33 and platinum fork, for optimal flex
Both my road bike and my mountain bike are aluminum. They each had carbon options for about $2,000 extra that saved about 2 pounds off the weight of the bike. I'm happy with aluminum.
Can we talk about aluminium parts on carbon frames & vice versa yet? O.O
My road bike has aluminium frame
And it is awesome 🙂
I'd love to see a video about brands, specifically, GIANT, it would be great to hear how GCN rates GIANT...
These material choice videos have been great! Thanks GCN. Now I have some serious banter ammunition for my cycling mates.
Thanks for that Trek ad. Can you do a real video featuring aluminium and carbon fibre?
Congratulations on the Bowman references. Nice to hear a small new company get a mention. I ride one of their bikes, a Palace and it is stunning. Who needs carbon when alloy can be this good?
How do you have a video on aluminum bikes and not have a cannondale 👽
because it was paid by Trek :D
A caad12 should have been used
Can first hand testify for the general awesomeness of a high(ish) end aluminium bike. My ROSE Xeon RS2000 is an absolute rocketship. Well under 8kg (and that's with a "heavy" 105 groupset fitted!), and ride feel that makes ballsy cornering irresistible. The claimed frame weight for size medium is 995g (note it is anodised black with no paint, which saves a lot of weight).
CAAD 12, no more words needed.....
CAAD 12 just make it with a proper BB!
agreed!
A bit surprised Cannondale weren't mentioned. The CAAD 10 was possibly the best aluminium frame in the world, until the CAAD 12.
+Chris Jeffery
So are GCN independent, or do they take 'donations' from different bike manufacturers to promote one and denigrate another?
I too was more than surprised that the CAADs weren't mentioned. Looking at the Aluminium bikes shown, apart from the tapered top tube, they seem to have very little of the tube shaping and profiling of the Cannondales.
I had a 2010 Trek 2.3 (105 gruppo) and it was absolutely fantastic! It's a shame the Trek 1.x are not up to the same standard as the 2.3, which became the "Madone 2" but seems to have gone completely now. The 2010 2.3 was one of the best value high-quality entry-level road bikes for people who want to ride fast. I guess the closest to the 2.3 now would be the Emonda ALR 5.
p.s. alu frames are far from equal -- by a big margin. A couple of years ago I bought a Moda Intro to ride in the UK and it is nowhere near something like the recent Cannondale alus or the Trek 2.3, even though it has a carbon fork (that fork may be carbon but it feels like it's made of rock). Harsh is an understatement. You can mitigate the harshness to some extent with 25 mm tyres (or even with tires).
You get the best workout when you ride a vintage 70's road bike made of steel.
My dad used to do this on his solo rides to make him fitter for the group rides when he would use a lighter bike. Sometimes would even pull out the steelie on a group for all the cycling snobs to mock. However, he didnt give a shit and kept up with them on their carbon frames.
I have an 80s trek made from steal! It’s a heavy bike!
I ride one of those stiff kleins a 1996 quantum and it feels fine to me. I was able to fit some 28c tires and that made all the difference from the skinny 25c(measured out to 22c) tires that came on it .
Steel is the cheapest GCN? I would beg to differ the cheapest road bikes out there are all aluminium, most expensive are steel! Mercian bikes ain't cheap!
You can get very expensive steel bikes, of course, but if you go down to your local department store the very cheapest bikes are steel.
Yes but department store bikes aren't bikes, they're bike-shaped objects! :)
PeowPeowPeowLasers
Thats true, also my local department store dont sell bikes, but all decathlon road bikes are aluminium and the cheapest road bike on amazon.co.uk is also aluminium...
Mercian bikes are beautiful and amazing to ride. I am lucky enough to be able to ride one :)
Target in the US is 100% aluminum and has been since a decade and a bit ago when I was in that market as a child.
This guy is awesome it's like he was born to report on materials n bikes straight to the point doesn't act stupid very great job
Do steel
please*
Suggestion: We would like to see "5 things you didn't know about steel"
Yup!
Hand cut polished lugs or fillet brazed with custom tube selection and a custom paint job = PRICELESS!!!
STEEL IS REEEEEEAL!
Thanks for the video. I learned something from it.
I challenge anyone to ride a Cannondale CAAD12 and say its harsh. Go Al!
I challenge you to call the CARBON fork it has aluminum.
+MinikuiOtoko lol
Oh man! So right. Go carbon!
+Minikuiotoko - so give it a nivacrom steel fork so. Practically the same weight and even better damping and handling, and longevity at that
I have an Aluminium hybrid bike as my commuter, feels nice and robust and despite having decent specs it didn't cost that much, great material for a mix of value, weight and ride.
I still prefer steel all the way
Said it before and I'll say it again. Great work guys, keep it up.
Imagine your name was Giant Manitou!
I love my aluminum Scott
Had two aluminium bikes my first was an Alan glued together bike in about 1989 and today i have a Principia sx psl with carbon forks. I like my bike so much i spent heaps on new carbon wheels instead of buy a new bike.
Could you make a video about steel?
that would be cool
Just go find a rusty bridge somewhere and stare at it for a while.
I have a steel shopping bike. I quite often go on 80 miles rides on it. It's fine.
In the case of 6160-T6 there should be little to no aging effect at all. Some older aluminum alloys become more brittle over time, but not 6160-T6. It's also very resistant to corrosion, 6160-T6 forms a hard oxide layer as it corrodes which generally stops further corrosion.
6061 not 6160. Also this guy says CF frame is infinite life lol a lot of people break their CF MTB first year 🤑
Titanium!
i love aluminium alloys though, they do the job pretty well, my bike is the cyclocross carrera tanneri LTD 2015 edition and i have had it for a year now, it's doing an amazing job, i love it to bits, including my contact II continental tyres for my bike, plus the brakes clarks amazing stuff on how they utilize to materials to road bikes and cyclocross bikes.
Not a single mention about Cannondale CAAD series! Is it because Trek sponsored your show and they prohibit you to mention Cannondale in the show?
In fact Si mentioned Cannondale
+Enda Bigarella when did he say that must have missed it also
+Enda Bigarella When? Did I somehow miss it ?
+nightfly222 i think that guy just must be trolling as i watchee it twice to make sure.
nope, he mentioned "big names like Trek and Canyon" but never said anything about Cannondale.
Very informative! Loved it.
***Caution***
Lifetime warranty means lifetime of the frame, not your lifetime.
An aluminum frame's lifetime is usually reckoned at 7 years.
At least for the Cannondale warranty that is not true.
What are you basing 7 years on? there a pleanty of 20+ year old aluminium bikes still going strong. What is it that you believe fails over time?
They make car suspension components out of aluminium. They handle a lot more weight than bikes, day in, day out for years. Even if aluminium gets a bit fatigued, it would still be more than capable of supporting a rider.
Martyn Haswell the seat stays or downtube -headtube junction
I'm a high school stud and my parents want me to spend my own money on a carbon frame. That's my reason to use an Aluminum bike, and tbh I enjoy it.
*drops mic*
What no mention of pioneers and long time Al fundies Cannondale?
They're not sponsored by Cannondale
So they only sing their sponsors tune? boooo
Cannondale has been making Al frames for decades, it was their trademark and 'Hand built in the USA"
I had a Raleigh Technium with aluminum mainframe and steel stays and fork. Guess where it broke...the steel chain stay. It was probably 80s bike, broke couple years ago. I had the stay welded, worked great until recently stolen.
OK - people have misconceptions about strength and stiffness ALL the aluminium alloys have about the same stiffness. (about 10000 ksi) Same with ALL the steel alloys (about 29ksi). 6061 is as stiff as the 7000 series. 1025 mild steel is just as stiff as 4130 chrome moly steel. Their ultimate strength varies, of course. But no human would be able to feel any difference in stiffness in riding a 6000 alloy bike or a 7000 series. Same with steel. Strength and stiffness are not the same! Stiffness is deflection under load and all aluminium alloys deflect the same, as do all the steel alloys. The high strength alloys will break at a higher load, but deflection (and stiffness) is the same.
True in respect of molecular properties; but in terms of a frame the higher the material strength, the thinner the tubing can be and so the frame tends to be more forgiving - which a rider can notice.
It's not the material property per se, but it is correct to state that a 6000 series and 7000 series of Alu have different stiffness/strength characteristics when formed & welded up into a bike frame, not owing to the alloy itself, but the way it has been made.
The claim was that one alloy of aluminum was stiffer than another alloy. Stiffness can be varied with tube shape and diameter but the metallurgical claim was false. Moreover, comfort is much more a function of frame geometry and tire size and pressure than stiffness. Any frame stiff enough to handle well is not going to have nearly as much compliance as the tires. All the common wisdom in cycling mainly exists to separate cyclists from as much money as possible. Bicycles generally last for decades and chances are if you are dropped on a $1,000 bike that you will also be dropped on a $5,000 bike. If you are a serious competitive cyclist than saving a pound or being a little more aerodynamic might be worthwhile but for everyone else small changes do not make cycling faster or more enjoyable beyond placebo affect. When I was in tie biz' rotating weight was the buzzword. We got people to buy super light wheels and sewups because everyone knew that taking weight off the wheels was many times more effective than taking weight off the frame. Then aero rims came out and cyclists were racing on rims heavier than what they used to train on but now they were faster because they were more aero. Now we can't have cyclists riding harsh buckboard stiff aluminum frames can we? What they really need is the magic carpet ride of carbon. Whatever you do keep buying!
+1.What he said.
Oh my God...this is the best comment reply section i’ve ever seen in UA-cam . Thank you very much for writing this is very useful discussion!
Aaaah, so, dispite many of the chromoly 6061,7000 series, mild steel 1025 having similar stiffness, their strength and deflection limits are much different. It is also amazing to know how much stiffer aluminum is compared to other stuff.
Well, my alloy frame cracked after only few years, replaced it with another alloy one 5 years ago and...so far, so good. Till yousing my dad's 50 years old steel bike till now from time to time.
Could you make an super-ultra-light bike if you fill it with helium?
are you joking?
Yes. I do it every weekend.
If you replace the air in your bike with helium the volume isn't big enough to really matter.
+Kjetil Korsveien I have found that by sealing all the frame holes that would ordinarily leak and by increasing the volume of helium in the frame my average time trial speeds have been increasing significantly.
Helium is 7 times lighter than air. That sounds like a lot? Not so fast, a liter of air weigh about 2 grams. Guessing you have no more than 2 liters of air in your frame. Then you save a gram or two at the most.
Where steel can rust through, when aluminum(ium) oxidizes, that layer doesn't go very deep and prevents further oxidation. Anodization creates a thin layer of aluminum oxide, which creates the toughness and corrosion resistance we love about it. and don't forget the cool colors.
I miss anodized wheels
Aluminum is subject to galvanic corrosion when dissimilar metals are in contact.. In bikes this can show up where a steel bolt is used to secure into an aluminum frame. I remove bolts periodically to check them and use a dielectric grease when reassembling.
Sorry, but no. In my humble experience, an aluminium frame, if not treated correctly, can corrode deeply enough to be rendered useless.
In a former life, I worked in the bike trade, basically right through aluminium's brief reign and the ascendancy of carbon. Over that time, my "career" (haha) took me in two distinct directions:
1) frame repair and painting;
2) triathlon support.
In the paint shop, we loved the old Cannondales because the paint would fall off 'em. Most of the time, they never needed to go into the stripping tank, just the degreaser. After an overnight soak, I'd drop the frame into a giant washtub and rinse it off with an ordinary garden hose. The paint would slide off into the tub. Unfortunately for some owners, that terrible paint was poor defense against sweat and salt. Over the years, we refused to paint the odd frame or two because the corrosion was too severe to be deemed safe. Corrosion around "braze-ons" (those awful plastic brake guides and especially gear cable stops and lever bosses riveted to the frame) was endemic.
Though I'm now an old hairy-legged Fred on an abominably heavy steel (Reynolds 725) expedition tourer complete with stainless racks AND mudguards, I'm astounded at the quality of modern road bikes, both carbon and aluminium. The finish on a production frame is light years ahead of that of 15-20 years ago. And the weight! The other day, I picked up some kind of tricked out Look wunderbike in my mate's shop and was aghast when comparing to my old 1999 KG251 - a bike which was a revelation to me for its light weight, lively ride and good looks back at the beginning of the century.
+Michael Toohey
That sounds like quite the experience! I volunteer for a not for profit bike garage helping people learn to fix their bikes and see some of the worst frames come in, not for restoration, but just to get rolling.
When I was in the Navy, in our radiological defense material storerooms we had some very corrosive materials. Any exposed steel would rust through quickly and we had to keep the paint layer thick on the walls, as every compartment on a ship is made of steel. The aluminum racks that held the materials and defense gear would have that rough oxidized feel and stayed strong. Though the bolts holding it together would have to be replaced regularly.
Aluminum is not impermeable to corrosion, especially salts in solution (sweat), but the natural corrosion resistance of the metal is incredible.
Chappeu for the volunteering - that's a worthy project. And yes, you are so right that the corrosion resistance of aluminium compared to steel is amazing. I have some motorcycle crankcases that are over a hundred years old (1913), and they are still useable.
I'd also add that after rinsing an alloy frame off, I could hang it on a hook to dry, bead blast it later in the day and paint it the next day if I wanted to. A steel frame, on the other hand, would need to have the first coat on ASAP after stripping and bead blasting. Never liked to have them sitting around "in the raw" waiting for the rust bug to bite.
Perhaps that was the problem with the early (80s and 90s) aluminium frames. The stuff seems so forgiving (it terms of finishes and corrosion resistence) that the guys got a bit too lax with the paint and less smart design features -e.g. riveted-on cable stops.
Anyhow, I was musing on this today as I looked at my wife's inexpensive Giant commuter/tourer. The fit & finish on the hydroformed frame would make a 1990 Cannondale (or Klein) blush.