Believe it or not, there is actually a map for the first law trilogy. You're welcome ;) atlasoficeandfireblog.wordpress.com/2018/09/17/a-map-of-joe-abercrombies-first-law-series/
I only recently read Senlin Ascends (Tower of Babel map) And I've never looked back at a map that often. It might be simple, but I was still interested in it. Most of the time I don't really look back at maps, so there you have my fav, I guess. ;) Also, the first book of this series is awesome and to see where it left off, and looking at the reviews, it only gets better from there. ^^ I recommend it if you haven't read it.
I’m torn between WoT and ASOIAF. The maps that I reference to the most throughout a series rather than just at the beginning are the ones I love the most as they are integral to my understanding and enjoyment of the story.
Ok, you said something in the Mistborn Trilogy, that, as a geologist, I feel the need to correct. at 12:02, you state "Mountains on the coast isn't the most common thing... Yeah. It is. More common than mountains in the center. Plate Tectonics works in such a way that mountain building events happen on the edges of continental plates, not in the center. Think the Rocky Mountains, the Andes, the Australian coast... even the Appalachian Mountains used to be on the coast, but they are pretty old, so the eastern coast has sort of "filled in" from the sediment eroding off the older mountains. Ok, you might be thinking "But what about the Himalayas and the Alps... they aren't on the coast. Well, they were, but when Italy and Greece and Iran (all coastal mountainous lands) and India pushed their way north, they built mountains, that were coastal, until the coasts got lost to the mountain building event. Look up a lost ocean called the Tethys. Seriously re-look at the map of the world. Where are the mountains in Africa? They are coastal. The Atlas, The Drakensberg, these chains are coastal. Otherwise, they are volcanic. Kilimanjaro is reminiscent of Dragonmount, or Lonely Mountain. North America. South America. Australia. All coastal. Sorry for the rant.
Although I knew there were mountains on the coast I never realized until I read this that almost all mountains are on coasts and, where they are not, it is actually two coasts colliding. Good worldbuilding point.
I think you meant Sierra Nevada's and not Rocky Mountains as the Rocky Mountains go from New Mexico upwards through Canada with no large bodies of water other than rivers. I agree with everything else though, look at Hawaii and the Volcanoes in Alaska's North Western Coast
@@giantspiderproductions3356 Why would you not care just because its all in a dream? It's not real in the first place, it's a series of video games. The lore of it being a dream is just a way to explain what the Elder Scrolls really is, he ideas or "dreams" of people who have created and worked on the games.
There is actually more woodland now than there was in the middle ages, due to farming efficiency. The moors of England all used to be bronze age farmland.
@@yourpalcal1412 uhm no lmao, I hope you are joking cause till the late carolingian era most of central europe was literally a single big ass forest, and during the bronze age this was true for everything nord of the alps, populations there were still nomadic and only partially reliant on agriculture, and their crop fields were significantly smaller than classical era ones, and fewer, due to the really small population
Ya'll know he referenced fantasy maps multiple times talking about that right? He's also rating them on the story it tells of the land. That's why he was asking if it had a purpose.
My thoughts on west coast maps: 1) Due to wanting to cram in as much detail as possible, rectangular continents are the most useful shape in general (if not the most original) 2) West coast maps are probably easier to draw for right-handed people. 3) Tolkien
I never knew this was an issue, but now that I know about it here's my initial theory. Some of the major discoveries and campaigns in our world have been east to west. Genghis Khan, the Europeans conquering North and South America. I think the point of Fantasy is to make things different than our world's history. If I wrote a novel or made a fantasy map, I would definitely go west to east - or be accused of my characters following the route of Lewis and Clark or something similar. I do like his idea of going north/south, south/north though! That does seem more rare. And another map critic mentioned that most fantasy maps take place in the northern hemisphere - where it's colder as you go north. I like his idea of making a map/story in the southern hemisphere - change things up a bit =) .
@@natureterp About the major campaigns being east to west, well, Alexander conquests were west to east. Same with the Persian Empire, the Russian Empire, and the Abbasid Caliphate. And The Roman Empire, Umayyad Califate, Ottoman Empire, Byzantine, and the British went both ways. I believe these things were pretty mixed. And there are the Mesoamerican Empires, that normally went south/north or vice-versa. It indeed would be cool to see more fantasy settings in the Southern Hemisphere!
I’m guessing the West Coast map is so common because most of them are drawn by right-handed people. It’s just easier to see the development of your coastline if it is on the left side of the paper, when drawing with your right hand.
I use my right hand when drawing maps and it's always eastern. I don't know why but my continents just end up being on the right hand side of the compass.
I'd rather say that most of them draw heavy inspiration from middle-age European culture and themes, and naturally Europe has the main body of ocean water to the west, and tales of sailing to the west span back as old as time. It's merely a matter of perspective, and from my experience the stories that aren't drawing thematic inspiration from classic Europe also feature more variety in their maps in comparison.
Random note from a geology major, but mountains along a coast are actually quite common. They are caused by subduction zones between oceanic and continental plates, and are almost always volcanic in nature. An example of this is the ring of fire along the US west coast all the way around the pacific.
@Sungindra Setiawan it's not a paradox to say that he says in his own video that he's only doing cities and countries, if he follows that rule or not is irrelevant to my comment that wasn't a defense, it wasn't even an opinion. You are literally arguing with someone not having an argument bud.
If you look closely, you'll find that Europe has all the coasts. Westerm, eastern, northern, southern. So, even if you base your map on Europe, heaving only western coast on it, is pretty clishé.
@@n1ppe honestly, I draw fantasy maps and western coastlines are what feels natural to me but I haven't seen nor read any of Tolkien's work so I'm not sure that's it
@@edgar7456 Tolkiens work is extremely influential so It's pretty obvious that it's the biggest influence here. You just can't deny that it has influenced authors. I personally find North-eastern coast more natural because it's at the top right and I'm right handed, so it's easie to draw the world
Good list. However; "Mountains on the coast like that is just not the most common thing." Erm...almost the entirety of the British Columbia coastline is mountain. Japan has a large, mountainous coast. And then there is the Andes. How could you forget about Peru like that? When you look at it, the majority of the west coast of South and North America are mountains.
I know it is important for some, but I think that Geographical oddities should not negatively affect a fantasy map. Their is nothing to say that the natural forces of the world are anything like earth. In many worlds the magic has/could have changed the landscape.
Yeah, Geographical Oddities shouldn't have a negative effect, as long as said Oddities aren't absolutely everywhere and there is a Lore reason behind why it exists Take a map of Tamriel for example, specifically Morrowind and the Island of Vvardenfell, the Island has a Huge Volcano called Red Mountain right in the middle of it, when it has no business being there, the reason behind this is that both the Island and the Volcano formed after a battle between Two Gods, Akatosh and Lorkhan, the battle ended with Lorkhan's death as Akatosh tore out Lorkhan's Heart and hurled it across the World, the heart landed in the Sea directly where Vvardenfell is on the Map, and in The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind, you actually find the Heart at the end of the Main Quest within where else but Red Mountain itself
If anything I’d say the Inheritance map is better than the WoT map. WoT just looks like a blob whereas at least Inheritance has a bit of character (desert in the center, mountains in the east and south, elves live in the north, etc)
Harvey Sowerbutts Lol. Now your bias is showing. WoT map is not a blob just because you’re fave lacks originality. He was ranking them based on whether or not they told a story. Alagaesia doesn’t really do that. It looks a bit too much like Tolkien’s map. It’s got some variety, sure, but it doesn’t have the significance of a lot of the other maps. Forest of elves to the north, empty desert in the middle, mountains in typical spots, and a capital in the center near the coast. Like I said pretty typical fantasy map, nothing too unique or integral to the story. I agree with Daniel. Not a bad map but nothing special about it either. The author was 15 when he made it. He did a decent job, but yeah, it’s not the best.
West coast maps work because we read from left to right; and you read the map in the same way (from left to right). Thus as the story proceeds (like from the Shire to Mordor, in a famous story with a West Coast map you may have read) you can read the map and understand the journey (without even reading the story) and if you go from left to right, you can trace the journey without even knowing what the journey in the story will be. It is the natural kind of map for us to interact with.
I'm an author. I consciously chose to have a west coast for the initial setting because I live in San Diego. The city we start in is inspired by San Diego, but overall having a western coast weirdly helped with my own comfort and orientation in the world because that's how I am positioned in the real world. But in the second book the story moves across the sea, so it has an east coast map. I don't know if people choose west coasts because they want to be like Tolkien (unless you're Terry Brooks or Christopher Paolini). I suspect it truly has something to do with the migration of western civilization, how the "old world" (Europe) is in the east with a mostly western coast.
Daniel: "Can we get an east coast map?!" Me: "Chronicles Narnia is an east coast map... And Wheel of Time is a west coast map..." Me: "I'll see myself out."
Interesting. I've read the first novel and didn't particularly love it. So I should give it another shot and read a few more of them? Just pick up the next one or one further down the road?
@@jonasvanmaldeghem688 absolutely yes. I always say that you should read the Discworld books in publication order. You don't *have* to, but I honestly think it is worthwhile since a lot of books reference events and concepts from previous books. The second book is a follow-up to the first book, but the third jumps to different characters (and if you read in publication order then prepare to keep jumping between various casts). The fourth book, Mort, is the first of the Death books and where I think the series really got going. If all else fails, skip to Guards Guards, since the City Watch books are easily some of the best (alongside the other Death books)
If you're planning on a second Fantasy Map Tier video, here's my recommendation for you to scale. - Elantris - Warbreaker - Tamriel - The Poppy War - The Powder mage - The Rage of Dragons - Black Leopard Red Wolf - Extended Middle Earth map (From the lore)
Also The Death Gate Cycle map, each of the different world maps for the series are so incredibly absurd and fascinating I'd love to hear Daniel's opinion on them.
Also Krynn (Dragonlance), Forgotten Realms, Furies of Calderon by Butcher, Gilenor (RuneScape videogame), Tress of Emerald Seas (I forgot the world name), Silmarilion's, and everyone already mentioned Narnia. I wrote a comment myself, but figured I'd add my list to yours since everyone else has. Gives him one, conclusive list for part 2. :-)
The ridiculously "small" scale of Skyrim (and some other TES games) is really just a gameplay mechanic. In the lore, the world is much, much bigger. And if you think the WoT map looks like Alaska, just wait until you see the map of the Realm of the Elderlings :)
Danile already knew that (I think he even said what you mentioned exactly) skip to 13:50 you'll see But yeah ES games have this habit of butchering lore (I think starting in oblivion) as they've attempted to streamline wich I think is a mistake because the lore is probably the best part of it. Lord knows I ain't loading up skyrim for the story/characters and combat
The "mountains by the coast" thing is actually pretty common in real life, like others have commented. The reason why is because mountain ranges are caused by tectonic plates subducting. It's all about density. Oceanic crust is incredibly dense and as soon as it is being pushed towards land or land is being pushed towards it, the oceanic crust will subduct and as a result the land (continental) crust will be pushed up, forming mountains. In the case of the Andes mountains, pockets of the ocean crust will be heated and melted under the surface and forced up through the continental crust, forming volcanoes which may fall dormant and create mountain ranges that way.
Narnia is one of the rare maps that has an Eastern Coast. Although this may be due to the fact that Tolkien and C. S. Lewis were creating their worlds at the same time, while keeping correspondence with one another, and Lewis didn't want to be seen as copying.
Great video, I love when a series has a good map to go along with its story. As a point of reference, mountains do form along coasts quite regularly due to dehydration melting and accretion.
I don't know if this is canon but in Wheel of Time the area where most of the story happens is real world Europe after the Breaking and whatever geoengineering that happened during the Second Age. Further support for this is that the Sean Chan lands strongly resemble the Americas.
The Dreamlands from Dream of Unknown Qadath by HP Lovecraft has an amazing map. I'm also a big fan of maps of Dante's Divine Comedy, which is basically fanfiction/fantasy on religious themes, and i'm not sure if anyone's ever made a definitive one, but a map of William Blake's cosmology in his later prophetic poems would be amazing as well, particularly Milton and Jerusalem: The Emanation of the Giant Albion.
Now I'm wishing for a science fiction version of this! Though what can beat Ringworld? A ring around a star, 1 AU in radius, a million miles wide band with 1000 mile high walls to keep the air in. 3 million times the surface area of the Earth, and the guys that put it together literally have 1:1 maps of nearby planets built in, loaded with species they abducted from each. Spinning to create gravity so fast that one point goes around in 11 days that take Earth a year.
One of my favourites is the map for Joe Abercrombie’s “The Heroes” - it’s a small scale map of the area in which the battle the book centres around is based. Throughout the book the map is updated with the positions of the major players in the battle - really nice touch.
Nice video Daniel! I'm reading Elantris now and think it has some interesting maps in it. Check also the full-world maps from David Edding's Belgariad and Malloread
I recently drew a map for my dnd campaign; i drew several shapes, modified it until I was happy with it. I looked at it the next day: it had almost the exact shape of middle earth. I think west coast maps are unconscious, I certainly unconsciously copied tolkien
Theory: Most fantasy maps focus on the west coast because people read from left to right (in English), and you want the most important part of the map to catch the reader's eye first. Since coastal regions tend to be more populated than inland regions, the most important cities on the map are likely to be located on the coast--in which case, a west (or left) coast is preferable.
The west coast map theme actually makes a lot of sense. Westerns (most known fantasy is western) read from left to right and same thing goes for how we view images. While we tend to unconsciously compose imagery in that direction, it is also easier for our brains to read an image this way as well. Also there's a composition tendency to put the "evil" and the "unknown" in the right part of an image. Check a lot of the Star Wars posters with this in mind cause the placement of the characters or even where they are looking at gives up a lot of the plot. I'd love to know if Tolkien knew this last bit cause he placed Mordor in THE default "evil corner", and if he did that on purpose, he's got extra genius points for this. But yeah, in graphic terms, placing a map on a west coast is what makes sense for our western brains. Plus, Europe is always a big influence in fantasy.
The map of Sigil for the Planescape setting for D&D is my big one. I have also found some really nice maps of Thra lately with the new Dark Crystal show out.
imagine making such a good map that decades later people are making near exact copies of it bc its that good also Tolkien worked on the world of lord of the rings so i like to think if there is a heaven hes still expanding on it
I always loved the Maps of Joe Devers Lone Wolf series of Books. Each new book introduced a new area to explore leading up to the first map of the entire continent in the 11th book if I recall.
"mountains on the coast isn't the most common thing" like Norway or most of the westcoast of south america? With that said, love your content and keep it up!
I've used fractal map generators which helps keep the west coast disease at bay. Wheel of time map is hard to me to take in from a geographical perspective. Could only be explained by evens in the deep lore of the book and even that is a stretch.
My favorite map of all time is Tamriel from The Elder Scrolls. It's what got me into maps and fantasy. After Tamriel I would say that I like Azeroth (WoW) and Tyria (Guild Wars 2) for video games. For books my fav maps so far are from Game of Thrones or from Stormlight. I would say that the maps in the Witcher series are probably the best from a realistic/technical perspective. The cities and countryside are so realistically done, they actually make sense and could exist in a real world.
The Belgariad has oceans on both east and west! I forgot which series had this but a day of search I found it! Hah! And best part: it’s classic fantasy
I always get in the weeds when creating a fantasy map. Is it an inlet, a sound, a bay? Is this group of islands technically an archipelago? Then I remember it’s a fantasy map and the rivers and oceans could all be blood red. They could be the literal circulatory system of some great earth goddess and it wouldn’t be out of place.
I have two stories in my head that have maps. One is kinda a West coast and no I didn't do that intentionally it's just how it formed in my head. But my second one is in fact a island hopping map. The entire world is made up of islands and at least a couple of small continents. And there's a lot of history and reasons for why it's that way.
Where does the Beleriand map fall from The Silmarillion? Especially like how it ties to the LotR map. It's arguably more closely tied to the story, as well.
In case if you didn't knew about what happened, let me tell you. Because of a powerful Dark Lord named Morgoth, he dominated most of Beleriand and fall into his hands. At the time this happened, the War of Wrath begins. After 42 years of unstoppable fighting, Morgoth is finally captured by the Valar (who are God-like beings), leaving Beleriand being a completely desolate continent. As a result, it was finally sunk into the sea.
Mountains on the coast are a very real thing, because of destructive plate boundaries where a heavier marine plate is forced under a lighter terrestrial forcing crumpling of the earth’s crust near the ocean
There was one big one I missed in this list :) Osten Ard from Tad William's Memory, Sorrow and Thorn series. It's just another west coast map though... but it's a good book series! (Even one of GRRM's inspirations)
West coast, as an artist, I can say comes easier to right handed artists that are not entirely aware of what they're doing. This usually happens with authors that do their own maps and then get an artist to render it on a higher graphical level. Just a theory, but always seemed to make sense to me watching my non artist friends draw their maps (roleplaying). Best wishes.
you should check out "the edge chronicals" books by Paul Stuart and Chris Riddel. Kinda Pratchett esqe, and a little on the younger end of fantasy as a genre. Has some of the coolest map work I've seen in fantasy.
Loved this so much - you should do a part 2 of this video! I can think of some great ones that I'd love to hear your thoughts on... The map at the start of The Phantom Tollbooth, for example! :)
Hey Daniel! I’m glad you are able to be full time! More videos from you makes me happy :) hope you’re having the best of luck on your writings. Edit: also, I was wondering. Will you be making a map for your fantasy book?
West coast- We read from left to right. Maps tell the story. It feels right to the reader to have the narrative travel right ( and down?) So starting leftward with a sea, tells you which direction to expect the characters to go.
ahh, its nice to hear more pratchet from you ! I feel like you dont talk much about discworld ! I thought you already have read some. Discworld is my way in of the fantasy genre, followed closely by HP !
Thedas (Dragon Age) is another East Coast one with a few different countries which is interesting bc the games are set around different countries and with characters and the cultures of other countries represented. Needs a bit more detail on geographical features like mountains and rivers connecting all the towns and cities together.
dude you shouldve used the map from A World of Ice and Fire for the game of thrones map...its the best fantasy map ever made!! so detailed ans beautiful
I actually started with an east coast map, and my characters were traveling from south to north, but later changed it, because the geography wasn't working quite right for me, to a west coast map where my characters are traveling from west to east. This had nothing to do with it being a fantasy map or whatever. I think It might be because people read from right to left that west coast maps are so common, or maybe it has to do with the golden ratio or something. Or maybe we all really are just subconsciously influenced by Tolkien. :| Although, I might change that now that I've heard your complaint. I've never really thought about trying to tell a story with my map. I might just have to put some more thought into it.
Dan the maps on the inside of classic fantasy books are great maps from Belgariad, Shannara has a north east south and west. And on a completely different subject have you heard of or read The blackbird in darkness trilogy I'm looking for it to read again, author is Freda Warrington the books are about 35 years old, cheers bud
I feel like my first instinct when thinking about a journey is that it should happen West to East... maybe because English reads left to right? This could be a factor in West coast maps.
I would have liked you to have included The Old World from Warhammer and Caen from Warmachine/Hordes. Also Robin Hobbs Six Duchies. And Narnia! Did you have Narnia? Would you consider sci fi ones at all?
![On Worldbuilding: Mountains in Fantasy Maps! [ ASOIAF | Dune | Stormlight ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cSFIEYmOAp0/mqdefault.jpg)
What is your fantasy map tier ranking?
Believe it or not, there is actually a map for the first law trilogy. You're welcome ;) atlasoficeandfireblog.wordpress.com/2018/09/17/a-map-of-joe-abercrombies-first-law-series/
@@Nasser851000 quite a nice map too.
I only recently read Senlin Ascends (Tower of Babel map) And I've never looked back at a map that often. It might be simple, but I was still interested in it.
Most of the time I don't really look back at maps, so there you have my fav, I guess. ;) Also, the first book of this series is awesome and to see where it left off, and looking at the reviews, it only gets better from there. ^^ I recommend it if you haven't read it.
I’m torn between WoT and ASOIAF.
The maps that I reference to the most throughout a series rather than just at the beginning are the ones I love the most as they are integral to my understanding and enjoyment of the story.
You should have picked tal verrar as map for gentleman bastards. It looks a 100x cooler
Ok, you said something in the Mistborn Trilogy, that, as a geologist, I feel the need to correct. at 12:02, you state "Mountains on the coast isn't the most common thing... Yeah. It is. More common than mountains in the center. Plate Tectonics works in such a way that mountain building events happen on the edges of continental plates, not in the center. Think the Rocky Mountains, the Andes, the Australian coast... even the Appalachian Mountains used to be on the coast, but they are pretty old, so the eastern coast has sort of "filled in" from the sediment eroding off the older mountains.
Ok, you might be thinking "But what about the Himalayas and the Alps... they aren't on the coast. Well, they were, but when Italy and Greece and Iran (all coastal mountainous lands) and India pushed their way north, they built mountains, that were coastal, until the coasts got lost to the mountain building event. Look up a lost ocean called the Tethys.
Seriously re-look at the map of the world. Where are the mountains in Africa? They are coastal. The Atlas, The Drakensberg, these chains are coastal. Otherwise, they are volcanic. Kilimanjaro is reminiscent of Dragonmount, or Lonely Mountain. North America. South America. Australia. All coastal.
Sorry for the rant.
Although I knew there were mountains on the coast I never realized until I read this that almost all mountains are on coasts and, where they are not, it is actually two coasts colliding. Good worldbuilding point.
don't apologize for a good point
I think you meant Sierra Nevada's and not Rocky Mountains as the Rocky Mountains go from New Mexico upwards through Canada with no large bodies of water other than rivers. I agree with everything else though, look at Hawaii and the Volcanoes in Alaska's North Western Coast
Sir you deserved way more likes
Very educational! I'm gonna save this for some fun research/history later. Thanks!
Daniel: Mountains on the coast aren't common
South America: Am I a joke to you?
Japan and Norway too
New Zealand too
Italy and Greece as well
And Mongolia
@@kk-ei5zz **claps** boy you stoopid or what?
Skyrim is just a kingdom. On a continent named Tamriel. On a planet named Nirn. You should have used the whole map, its amazing
In a solar system called mundus, in a universe called the aurbis or the arena.
It’s all a dream anyways so who cares?
@@giantspiderproductions3356 wait no it isnt?
@@giantspiderproductions3356 Why would you not care just because its all in a dream? It's not real in the first place, it's a series of video games. The lore of it being a dream is just a way to explain what the Elder Scrolls really is, he ideas or "dreams" of people who have created and worked on the games.
TimeIsIllmatic The Elder Scrolls universe is a dream of the Godhead. In C0DA Vivec managed to become a new Godhead
4:06
The "big forests" are simply realistic, during the middle ages europe was covered in this stuff for something like 80%
There is actually more woodland now than there was in the middle ages, due to farming efficiency. The moors of England all used to be bronze age farmland.
@@yourpalcal1412 uhm no lmao, I hope you are joking cause till the late carolingian era most of central europe was literally a single big ass forest, and during the bronze age this was true for everything nord of the alps, populations there were still nomadic and only partially reliant on agriculture, and their crop fields were significantly smaller than classical era ones, and fewer, due to the really small population
@@yourpalcal1412 u are wrong. Europe is massively deforestated mate, i know because i had to research a bit to edit the map of a mod (strategy game)
This is true for central Europe.
Ya'll know he referenced fantasy maps multiple times talking about that right? He's also rating them on the story it tells of the land. That's why he was asking if it had a purpose.
This is a Game of thrones TV map, where is Song of ice and fire map? The one that is much bigger
Is there a much bigger one...
@@ce666isa3 this is the old map, George rr Martin later updated the map to include bigger essos and other continents.
There is an entire published map set
@@ce666isa3 this is the official one that you can buy
geoawesomeness.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Game-of-thrones-Geoawesomeness.jpg
I have the atlas of ice and fire and the Braavos city map is a true masterpiece
My thoughts on west coast maps:
1) Due to wanting to cram in as much detail as possible, rectangular continents are the most useful shape in general (if not the most original)
2) West coast maps are probably easier to draw for right-handed people.
3) Tolkien
It's also based on Europe
@@redhippopotamus9144 Also true.
Wonder if its also because English is written left to right.
I never knew this was an issue, but now that I know about it here's my initial theory.
Some of the major discoveries and campaigns in our world have been east to west. Genghis Khan, the Europeans conquering North and South America. I think the point of Fantasy is to make things different than our world's history.
If I wrote a novel or made a fantasy map, I would definitely go west to east - or be accused of my characters following the route of Lewis and Clark or something similar.
I do like his idea of going north/south, south/north though! That does seem more rare. And another map critic mentioned that most fantasy maps take place in the northern hemisphere - where it's colder as you go north. I like his idea of making a map/story in the southern hemisphere - change things up a bit =)
.
@@natureterp About the major campaigns being east to west, well, Alexander conquests were west to east. Same with the Persian Empire, the Russian Empire, and the Abbasid Caliphate. And The Roman Empire, Umayyad Califate, Ottoman Empire, Byzantine, and the British went both ways. I believe these things were pretty mixed. And there are the Mesoamerican Empires, that normally went south/north or vice-versa.
It indeed would be cool to see more fantasy settings in the Southern Hemisphere!
I’m guessing the West Coast map is so common because most of them are drawn by right-handed people. It’s just easier to see the development of your coastline if it is on the left side of the paper, when drawing with your right hand.
Kyle Wood and also cuz Middle Earth is a West coast map, that's probably a major reason
Oh...
OOOOOHHHHHHHHHH
I use my right hand when drawing maps and it's always eastern. I don't know why but my continents just end up being on the right hand side of the compass.
@@HeadCannon19 probably because europe is west coasted...
I'd rather say that most of them draw heavy inspiration from middle-age European culture and themes, and naturally Europe has the main body of ocean water to the west, and tales of sailing to the west span back as old as time. It's merely a matter of perspective, and from my experience the stories that aren't drawing thematic inspiration from classic Europe also feature more variety in their maps in comparison.
Random note from a geology major, but mountains along a coast are actually quite common. They are caused by subduction zones between oceanic and continental plates, and are almost always volcanic in nature. An example of this is the ring of fire along the US west coast all the way around the pacific.
Why add the map of Skyrim and not the entire Tamriel
Or even Vvardenfell. Such an interesting area with the volcano and all.
Because he said countries or cities
@Sungindra Setiawan yes true about those world's you mentioned but what are you talking about borders for?
@Sungindra Setiawan it's not a paradox to say that he says in his own video that he's only doing cities and countries, if he follows that rule or not is irrelevant to my comment that wasn't a defense, it wasn't even an opinion. You are literally arguing with someone not having an argument bud.
Or all of Nirn!
"Wester coasts are unoriginal and try to copy middle earth"
*me, looking at a map of europe*: HHHHHHHMMMMMMMMM
Exactly my thoughts! Pretty sure no one is thinking of middle earth when making their maps! XD
If you look closely, you'll find that Europe has all the coasts. Westerm, eastern, northern, southern.
So, even if you base your map on Europe, heaving only western coast on it, is pretty clishé.
@@Miestwin but Europe in itself is "big landmass in the east (Asia), big sea in the west (Atlantic Sea)"
@@n1ppe honestly, I draw fantasy maps and western coastlines are what feels natural to me but I haven't seen nor read any of Tolkien's work so I'm not sure that's it
@@edgar7456 Tolkiens work is extremely influential so It's pretty obvious that it's the biggest influence here. You just can't deny that it has influenced authors. I personally find North-eastern coast more natural because it's at the top right and I'm right handed, so it's easie to draw the world
Good list. However; "Mountains on the coast like that is just not the most common thing." Erm...almost the entirety of the British Columbia coastline is mountain. Japan has a large, mountainous coast. And then there is the Andes. How could you forget about Peru like that? When you look at it, the majority of the west coast of South and North America are mountains.
Erm...
Shhh... Let him like his fantasy maps...
We are not talking serious geography here ;)
Let's not confuse him with the facts.
@@VicRibeiro777 I love all the maps. Maps are great. I was just being needlessly precise.
Yeah, I thought this was a really weird comment as well. Mountains frequently form near coastlines because of fault lines.
And new zealand and several other countries in the world lol
I know it is important for some, but I think that Geographical oddities should not negatively affect a fantasy map. Their is nothing to say that the natural forces of the world are anything like earth. In many worlds the magic has/could have changed the landscape.
True, I'm planning a map where a god raises a giant mountain range to split a continent in half.
Yeah, Geographical Oddities shouldn't have a negative effect, as long as said Oddities aren't absolutely everywhere and there is a Lore reason behind why it exists
Take a map of Tamriel for example, specifically Morrowind and the Island of Vvardenfell, the Island has a Huge Volcano called Red Mountain right in the middle of it, when it has no business being there, the reason behind this is that both the Island and the Volcano formed after a battle between Two Gods, Akatosh and Lorkhan, the battle ended with Lorkhan's death as Akatosh tore out Lorkhan's Heart and hurled it across the World, the heart landed in the Sea directly where Vvardenfell is on the Map, and in The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind, you actually find the Heart at the end of the Main Quest within where else but Red Mountain itself
Inheritance map: ah typical west-coast map, C-tier. WOT map: ah typical west coast map with fantasy tropes, A-tier hm
Ah, but with Reasons.
Ah, but with obvious bias. There fixed it for you. Dont get me wrong, love WoT, but yeah bias definitely showing there.
If anything I’d say the Inheritance map is better than the WoT map. WoT just looks like a blob whereas at least Inheritance has a bit of character (desert in the center, mountains in the east and south, elves live in the north, etc)
Harvey Sowerbutts yeah I agree
Harvey Sowerbutts Lol. Now your bias is showing. WoT map is not a blob just because you’re fave lacks originality. He was ranking them based on whether or not they told a story. Alagaesia doesn’t really do that. It looks a bit too much like Tolkien’s map. It’s got some variety, sure, but it doesn’t have the significance of a lot of the other maps. Forest of elves to the north, empty desert in the middle, mountains in typical spots, and a capital in the center near the coast. Like I said pretty typical fantasy map, nothing too unique or integral to the story. I agree with Daniel. Not a bad map but nothing special about it either. The author was 15 when he made it. He did a decent job, but yeah, it’s not the best.
I’m waiting for you to say “my wonderful children...of the light”
Nathan Keyes Yes😂
*map of united states*
"Not realistic at all. D tier for sure."
West coast maps work because we read from left to right; and you read the map in the same way (from left to right). Thus as the story proceeds (like from the Shire to Mordor, in a famous story with a West Coast map you may have read) you can read the map and understand the journey (without even reading the story) and if you go from left to right, you can trace the journey without even knowing what the journey in the story will be. It is the natural kind of map for us to interact with.
I'm an author. I consciously chose to have a west coast for the initial setting because I live in San Diego. The city we start in is inspired by San Diego, but overall having a western coast weirdly helped with my own comfort and orientation in the world because that's how I am positioned in the real world. But in the second book the story moves across the sea, so it has an east coast map.
I don't know if people choose west coasts because they want to be like Tolkien (unless you're Terry Brooks or Christopher Paolini). I suspect it truly has something to do with the migration of western civilization, how the "old world" (Europe) is in the east with a mostly western coast.
Daniel: "Can we get an east coast map?!"
Me: "Chronicles Narnia is an east coast map... And Wheel of Time is a west coast map..."
Me: "I'll see myself out."
EmethMatthew for Narnia and for Aslan!
By the Lion, you are a true Narnian!
That's probably because Tolkien and C.S. Lewis schoolmates in college, so C.S. Lewis came before every fanboy made their own Tolkien map homage.
@@darkfool2000 actually, they weren't schoolmates, they were professors together.
This is why CS Lewis doesn't appear in the movie Tolkien.
@@Zander2212 Thanks for the information.
I'm so glad you kept going with Discworld!! The first book in the series really doesn't do the others justice.
Interesting. I've read the first novel and didn't particularly love it. So I should give it another shot and read a few more of them? Just pick up the next one or one further down the road?
@@jonasvanmaldeghem688 absolutely yes. I always say that you should read the Discworld books in publication order. You don't *have* to, but I honestly think it is worthwhile since a lot of books reference events and concepts from previous books. The second book is a follow-up to the first book, but the third jumps to different characters (and if you read in publication order then prepare to keep jumping between various casts). The fourth book, Mort, is the first of the Death books and where I think the series really got going. If all else fails, skip to Guards Guards, since the City Watch books are easily some of the best (alongside the other Death books)
“I’m in shadow! Deal with it my children!”
If you're planning on a second Fantasy Map Tier video, here's my recommendation for you to scale.
- Elantris
- Warbreaker
- Tamriel
- The Poppy War
- The Powder mage
- The Rage of Dragons
- Black Leopard Red Wolf
- Extended Middle Earth map (From the lore)
Also The Death Gate Cycle map, each of the different world maps for the series are so incredibly absurd and fascinating I'd love to hear Daniel's opinion on them.
Also Narnia, Magnamund, the Orokon, Derlavai, Nehwon....
Also ATLA, and someone already mentioned Narnia.
Also Krynn (Dragonlance), Forgotten Realms, Furies of Calderon by Butcher, Gilenor (RuneScape videogame), Tress of Emerald Seas (I forgot the world name), Silmarilion's, and everyone already mentioned Narnia.
I wrote a comment myself, but figured I'd add my list to yours since everyone else has. Gives him one, conclusive list for part 2. :-)
If you want an East Coast fantasy map, can't go past the Farseer Chronicles by Robin Hobb
The ridiculously "small" scale of Skyrim (and some other TES games) is really just a gameplay mechanic. In the lore, the world is much, much bigger.
And if you think the WoT map looks like Alaska, just wait until you see the map of the Realm of the Elderlings :)
Danile already knew that (I think he even said what you mentioned exactly) skip to 13:50 you'll see
But yeah ES games have this habit of butchering lore (I think starting in oblivion) as they've attempted to streamline wich I think is a mistake because the lore is probably the best part of it. Lord knows I ain't loading up skyrim for the story/characters and combat
The "mountains by the coast" thing is actually pretty common in real life, like others have commented. The reason why is because mountain ranges are caused by tectonic plates subducting. It's all about density. Oceanic crust is incredibly dense and as soon as it is being pushed towards land or land is being pushed towards it, the oceanic crust will subduct and as a result the land (continental) crust will be pushed up, forming mountains. In the case of the Andes mountains, pockets of the ocean crust will be heated and melted under the surface and forced up through the continental crust, forming volcanoes which may fall dormant and create mountain ranges that way.
Narnia is one of the rare maps that has an Eastern Coast. Although this may be due to the fact that Tolkien and C. S. Lewis were creating their worlds at the same time, while keeping correspondence with one another, and Lewis didn't want to be seen as copying.
I like how the Stormlight map looks like the landscape was shaped by the massive storms.
Great video, I love when a series has a good map to go along with its story. As a point of reference, mountains do form along coasts quite regularly due to dehydration melting and accretion.
I am a mapmaker and a fantasy author, and I tend to subconsciously create west coasts if I am creating a mainland map.
I don't know if this is canon but in Wheel of Time the area where most of the story happens is real world Europe after the Breaking and whatever geoengineering that happened during the Second Age.
Further support for this is that the Sean Chan lands strongly resemble the Americas.
Finally what i needed as I’m starting to draw maps
Why didn't you get the whole map for ASOIAF?
David Emmitt that was the whole map
@@Spite555 that was the TV map, the complete map is much larger
@@Dan_G.R.S. Correct.
@@davidemmitt9439 what do you mean? the only instance of a bigger map is fanmade (that i know of)
@@ultratronger where is Ashai? Or the kingdoms of YI TI? There is a missing continent
The Dreamlands from Dream of Unknown Qadath by HP Lovecraft has an amazing map. I'm also a big fan of maps of Dante's Divine Comedy, which is basically fanfiction/fantasy on religious themes, and i'm not sure if anyone's ever made a definitive one, but a map of William Blake's cosmology in his later prophetic poems would be amazing as well, particularly Milton and Jerusalem: The Emanation of the Giant Albion.
Holy shit that's a god tier map, thanks for this
www.mockman.com/dreammap-bw.jpg
Holy cow. Daniel Greene puts WoT Map on A Tier. Is this for real? Or just a fantasy hallucination?
Well to be fair it should have been B-tier according to his criticisms.
It should be D Tier in any reasonable judgement. I love the WoT but the map is straight out terrible in multiple ways.
"Oblivion Games"
STOP RIGHT THERE
Now I'm wishing for a science fiction version of this! Though what can beat Ringworld? A ring around a star, 1 AU in radius, a million miles wide band with 1000 mile high walls to keep the air in. 3 million times the surface area of the Earth, and the guys that put it together literally have 1:1 maps of nearby planets built in, loaded with species they abducted from each. Spinning to create gravity so fast that one point goes around in 11 days that take Earth a year.
The tier list we don’t deserve, but the tier list we need!
I wonder how this list would look if he actually understood the lore behind all these worlds
One of my favourites is the map for Joe Abercrombie’s “The Heroes” - it’s a small scale map of the area in which the battle the book centres around is based. Throughout the book the map is updated with the positions of the major players in the battle - really nice touch.
Nice video Daniel! I'm reading Elantris now and think it has some interesting maps in it. Check also the full-world maps from David Edding's Belgariad and Malloread
I recently drew a map for my dnd campaign; i drew several shapes, modified it until I was happy with it. I looked at it the next day: it had almost the exact shape of middle earth. I think west coast maps are unconscious, I certainly unconsciously copied tolkien
Okay, I need to read Gentleman Bastards. With such a wonderful map full of water? How can I not?
I’d go with the audiobook, the narrator makes an already phenomenal story to the next level
Good series
A relatively narrow piece of land that connects two larger masses with water on both sides is called an isthmus.
The Joe Abercrombie’s “First Law” / “Circle of the World” map is included in the short story collection Sharp Ends. It’s solid.
'Having your world beyond a turtle's back is just: yes' Daniel, I love you man, you are so right at this one that I'm gonna die.
Don't you just love it when Daniel calls us his "beautiful wonderful children"?
No. It's gross. Like a cult leader.
Theory: Most fantasy maps focus on the west coast because people read from left to right (in English), and you want the most important part of the map to catch the reader's eye first. Since coastal regions tend to be more populated than inland regions, the most important cities on the map are likely to be located on the coast--in which case, a west (or left) coast is preferable.
You should make a second part of this, it would be cool. With the entire map of Tamriel this time
Going more into the map of roshar its actually mathematically derived, from 17th shard, "Its a 2d shadow of a 3d slice of a 4d Julia set"
The west coast map theme actually makes a lot of sense. Westerns (most known fantasy is western) read from left to right and same thing goes for how we view images. While we tend to unconsciously compose imagery in that direction, it is also easier for our brains to read an image this way as well. Also there's a composition tendency to put the "evil" and the "unknown" in the right part of an image. Check a lot of the Star Wars posters with this in mind cause the placement of the characters or even where they are looking at gives up a lot of the plot. I'd love to know if Tolkien knew this last bit cause he placed Mordor in THE default "evil corner", and if he did that on purpose, he's got extra genius points for this. But yeah, in graphic terms, placing a map on a west coast is what makes sense for our western brains. Plus, Europe is always a big influence in fantasy.
The map of Sigil for the Planescape setting for D&D is my big one. I have also found some really nice maps of Thra lately with the new Dark Crystal show out.
imagine making such a good map that decades later people are making near exact copies of it bc its that good
also Tolkien worked on the world of lord of the rings so i like to think if there is a heaven hes still expanding on it
I always loved the Maps of Joe Devers Lone Wolf series of Books. Each new book introduced a new area to explore leading up to the first map of the entire continent in the 11th book if I recall.
"mountains on the coast isn't the most common thing" like Norway or most of the westcoast of south america? With that said, love your content and keep it up!
Really glad to hear you're getting more and more into discworld after the rough start. Terry Pratchett is one of my biggest heroes!
Skyrim: B tier
"Oblivion" games
*BY THE NINE DIVINES*
*eight
@@TheGuardianDevil4 Godless Imperial
6:54
Me: *stares at skyrim map*
Gaurd: "ohhh let me guess, someone stole your sweetrole"
I've used fractal map generators which helps keep the west coast disease at bay.
Wheel of time map is hard to me to take in from a geographical perspective. Could only be explained by evens in the deep lore of the book and even that is a stretch.
My favorite map of all time is Tamriel from The Elder Scrolls. It's what got me into maps and fantasy. After Tamriel I would say that I like Azeroth (WoW) and Tyria (Guild Wars 2) for video games.
For books my fav maps so far are from Game of Thrones or from Stormlight.
I would say that the maps in the Witcher series are probably the best from a realistic/technical perspective. The cities and countryside are so realistically done, they actually make sense and could exist in a real world.
The Belgariad has oceans on both east and west! I forgot which series had this but a day of search I found it! Hah! And best part: it’s classic fantasy
So happy you included Discworld! Also it’s good to hear that you’re enjoying it as you read more.
"Hello my beautiful wonderful children" - so.... should i call you daddy ?
I always get in the weeds when creating a fantasy map. Is it an inlet, a sound, a bay? Is this group of islands technically an archipelago? Then I remember it’s a fantasy map and the rivers and oceans could all be blood red. They could be the literal circulatory system of some great earth goddess and it wouldn’t be out of place.
I have two stories in my head that have maps. One is kinda a West coast and no I didn't do that intentionally it's just how it formed in my head.
But my second one is in fact a island hopping map. The entire world is made up of islands and at least a couple of small continents. And there's a lot of history and reasons for why it's that way.
I hate that I'm watching this video so intently but here I am. Love this channel and Daniel has definitely reignited my love for fantasy!
Where does the Beleriand map fall from The Silmarillion? Especially like how it ties to the LotR map. It's arguably more closely tied to the story, as well.
In case if you didn't knew about what happened, let me tell you.
Because of a powerful Dark Lord named Morgoth, he dominated most of Beleriand and fall into his hands. At the time this happened, the War of Wrath begins. After 42 years of unstoppable fighting, Morgoth is finally captured by the Valar (who are God-like beings), leaving Beleriand being a completely desolate continent. As a result, it was finally sunk into the sea.
Mountains on the coast are a very real thing, because of destructive plate boundaries where a heavier marine plate is forced under a lighter terrestrial forcing crumpling of the earth’s crust near the ocean
There was one big one I missed in this list :) Osten Ard from Tad William's Memory, Sorrow and Thorn series. It's just another west coast map though... but it's a good book series! (Even one of GRRM's inspirations)
The Edge from the Edge chronicles has always been one of my favourites
You missed The Circle of the World from the First Law universe. I think it's S or A tier. It has everything from deserts to islands.
that does look like a good map.
West coast, as an artist, I can say comes easier to right handed artists that are not entirely aware of what they're doing. This usually happens with authors that do their own maps and then get an artist to render it on a higher graphical level. Just a theory, but always seemed to make sense to me watching my non artist friends draw their maps (roleplaying). Best wishes.
you should check out "the edge chronicals" books by Paul Stuart and Chris Riddel. Kinda Pratchett esqe, and a little on the younger end of fantasy as a genre. Has some of the coolest map work I've seen in fantasy.
Terry Pratchett's Ankh Morpork map, would have to be the most detailed fantasy map, I love it. Thanks for including his Diskworld map in this list.
I refuse to accept any fantasy map rankings without the One Piece map! It's the coolest & most unique map I've seen so far
Loved this so much - you should do a part 2 of this video! I can think of some great ones that I'd love to hear your thoughts on... The map at the start of The Phantom Tollbooth, for example! :)
Love the Discworld map. There is also a really good detailed city map called The Streets of Ankh-Morpork by the same artist.
I love Ankh-morpork map so much, hands down the best City map.
There is a whole series of maps of the Disc including the Ramtops, and Death's Domain. They're out of print, though.
This is a clever video idea. Never thought about ranking fantasy maps.
Hey Daniel! I’m glad you are able to be full time! More videos from you makes me happy :) hope you’re having the best of luck on your writings.
Edit: also, I was wondering. Will you be making a map for your fantasy book?
West coast-
We read from left to right. Maps tell the story. It feels right to the reader to have the narrative travel right ( and down?)
So starting leftward with a sea, tells you which direction to expect the characters to go.
Oh my god the mad man actually did it
ahh, its nice to hear more pratchet from you ! I feel like you dont talk much about discworld ! I thought you already have read some.
Discworld is my way in of the fantasy genre, followed closely by HP !
More tier lists
Really enjoying your map videos. Do you think it would be possible to make a video or series on fantasy map making?
Is he saying that we are all his whitecloak minions?
And yet he admits to sitting under the shadow! We must submit him to the questioners!
Thedas (Dragon Age) is another East Coast one with a few different countries which is interesting bc the games are set around different countries and with characters and the cultures of other countries represented. Needs a bit more detail on geographical features like mountains and rivers connecting all the towns and cities together.
dude you shouldve used the map from A World of Ice and Fire for the game of thrones map...its the best fantasy map ever made!! so detailed ans beautiful
Something I take into account about maps in fantasy novels, is how inclined I am to go back and look at it as I am reading.
I love fantasy maps!
Great video!
As someone from an east-coast country, when I try to draw a map, I initially draw an east-coast one.
Read east asian fantasy and you'll get an east coast map
I actually started with an east coast map, and my characters were traveling from south to north, but later changed it, because the geography wasn't working quite right for me, to a west coast map where my characters are traveling from west to east. This had nothing to do with it being a fantasy map or whatever. I think It might be because people read from right to left that west coast maps are so common, or maybe it has to do with the golden ratio or something. Or maybe we all really are just subconsciously influenced by Tolkien. :| Although, I might change that now that I've heard your complaint. I've never really thought about trying to tell a story with my map. I might just have to put some more thought into it.
Mountains on the coast make perfect sense just look at the Andes.
Dan the maps on the inside of classic fantasy books are great maps from Belgariad, Shannara has a north east south and west. And on a completely different subject have you heard of or read The blackbird in darkness trilogy I'm looking for it to read again, author is Freda Warrington the books are about 35 years old, cheers bud
YES! Daniel, I didn't think you were actually going to do this one, don't know why, but I'm happy I'm wrong.
I feel like my first instinct when thinking about a journey is that it should happen West to East... maybe because English reads left to right? This could be a factor in West coast maps.
I would have liked you to have included The Old World from Warhammer and Caen from Warmachine/Hordes. Also Robin Hobbs Six Duchies. And Narnia! Did you have Narnia?
Would you consider sci fi ones at all?
Mountains on the coast aren't common.
Me remembering my geography lessons in school: Oh um, actually....
I'd love to see your rating for the map from One Piece.
One of my maps is a west coast because it's a descendant of a story that was an LotR clone (now highly diverged, thankfully).
My fellow children we need to rise up! The amount of West cost maps is unacceptable! They are under represented, we need far more of them!