10:28 I always thought that Shifting Sands seems a little too hard to find without a guide, but you’re right that chasing the bunny was probably how most people who didn’t have one found it. Wonder how intentional that was.
I mean, MIPS stops directly in front of the portal, tempting players into diving at it. It kinda feels like the original Super Mario Bros, how the first Goomba in World 1-1 was placed in such a way that you'd likely hit a block while jumping over it, leading you to discover the Mushroom power up.
I certainly found Mario 64's hub to be more maze-like and filled with secrets vs Sunshine. Both games have a hub that feels like a believable world within them. I miss those days.
Oh that's interesting. Honestly, I always figured my issue with sunshine was I didn't play it when I was 6 years old so I didn't care much about spending time in the Delfino plaza like I did in Peach's Castle. Hence why I felt like it was more complicated to figure out where the stages were. And likewise probably because of how young I was and how much time I spent on 64 I felt like it was much simpler to get around 🤷🏻♂️
I disagree that the exclusion of the comet observatory wouldn’t devalue galaxy 1. All of this is just my opinion, but my biggest complaint about galaxy 2 was the fact that it had such a limited hub. Hub worlds not only serve as a playground for the player’s movement, but also as a form of world building. Of course Rosalina has a giant observatory that can send you around the galaxy! Why wouldn’t she? I think that galaxy would lose a lot of it’s charm in terms of world building if you had to select levels via menu. It would feel more like a video game where you have to play all the levels, rather than a quest to save the galaxy. Seeing people live their normal lives can make the world itself more believable and more investing to the player.
I think I can agree to an extent, but not entirely. Obviously, just personal opinion lol. I don't want to regurgitate what I said in the video but I think if it was more like an enclosed ship rather than an observatory where you just turned on/powered on the lights to advance, it could've had a larger impact imo. I think the skeleton is there but it just feels a little too bare bones for me
Agreed. Galaxy was SUCH an atmospheric game. A menu would definitely devalue it. I'm okay with the menu system of Galaxy 2, since the focus was a lot more on trying out as many diverse worlds as possible, but the first game was dedicated to the story.
I agree. Comet Observatory isn't great, but it's a nice reprise between worlds. The value it adds is being able to see Rosalina and listen to her story. Plus, the calming music and just a small sense of wonder when you unlock the next observatory. Meanwhile, Galaxy 2's head is a net negative to the game. There's nothing of value there. They force you back to it too often for no reason, and it's just annoying.
The Comet Observatory just needed more stuff to do. It has great asthetic and theme, it serves it's role in the story and it is actually quite fun to move around in. If only there were a few hidden stars requiring some detective work or tricky platforming it would feel like there was a purpose to moving around other than getting to the next mini-hub. It is the biggest waste of potential to place the flying powerup for use here, and not have 1-2 stars requiring you to fly.
Tbh, that might actually be what makes the Comet Observatory special. While games like SM64 has a hubworld made for the sake of exploration, Mario Galaxy has a hubworld made for the sake of those more ethereal feelings. The Comet Observatory isn’t a place to be explored; rather, it’s a place meant to instill a sense of grandeur. Mario Galaxy was the first Mario game to really have a classical genre of music as its theme. No other game in the series (not even Mario Galaxy 2) could ever instill what it feels like to ponder the vastness and loneliness of space like Mario Galaxy 1 can. The musical stings that help that game define that grandeur, and the visual aesthetics of the comet observatory convey that grandeur better than I feel any hubworld has in the Mario franchise. While it can’t convey that feeling of exploration that SM64 can, what sets it apart is the fact that it does the best job it can to convey the themes that the game is trying to convey, and I think that’s definitely something special.
the one thing I dislike is how some things only unlock after you have enough stars, but you aren't told there's something there, or that there's a star requirement. you could go into the courtyard early, see there's nothing there, then not think to go back and therefore miss BBH
Thinking about the end, everlasting surf shells and caps or perhaps even on demand would have been a cool gift. Press the d-pad and get to explore every level on a surf shell that doesn't break while you can listen to the banger sound track of metal cap mario. And when you fall off from a mountain top, immediately get wing cap. Who needs 99 lives 😅
The Comet Observatory focuses on your plot objective and atmosphere, becoming more lively to represent you fixing the situation for Rosalina and the Lumas and more accessible as the goal is to restore it and take the fight to Bowser. It's a shame it lacks utility for its size but does its actual job really well without getting in the way. Guess both Sunshine's and Galaxy's give you an objective and a representation of plot progression to reward you and spur you on.
Sonic adventure literally shows you where to go each time you enter the hub with a cutscene, and tikal tells you where to go when you interact with her
There are a handful of moments where there is no guidance as to where to go. I know specifically in Amy's playthrough there's even a moment during the flashback where you're meant to turn around and go backwards and there's nothing that indicates that
Lol idk what to tell you. There were moments where I felt lost. They weren't THAT common but they were common enough to feel memorable. Mind you I love Sonic Adventure and I have a retrospective about 1.5 hours long on it where I'm mostly defending it. But the hubworld frustrated me on a few occasions and I didn't care for it for the most part
The only thing I don’t like about Peach’s castle is that after you have drained the water by stomping on the pillars, there is no way to refill the moat around the castle. It looks much more aesthetically pleasing with water.
Cannot agree about Sunshines’s hub. Delfino Plaza is the heart and soul of the game and its complexity is what makes it good; what parts were you stuck on?
So I don't think it's terrible. Don't even think it's necessarily bad, I just remember it wasn't as straightforward as I'd have liked the first time I played it, and there were multiple moments where I'd think I'd be heading to the right stage but end up moving in the wrong direction. Can't really mention specifics since it's been too long since my first playthrough though. That being said I don't agree about the plaza being the heart and soul lol. Not because the plaza is bad, but because the stages are so much more enjoyable for me
To be the voice of an unpopular opinion, I love the hub worlds in the Sonic games because the characters and stories are my primary motivator to play the games, so I like seeing the world that's being saved and the people in that world, especially when they have anything to say about characters that the main story won't highlight. The amount of work that can go into good hub worlds of games in general (especially when they have quests to find) also feels like getting more game for your purchase and I guess I'm of the mindset that more content is always good, even if it's not as good as the rest of the content; although getting lost in them is a possibility, breezing through them is also possible and by then, they become less of an obstacle to the "main event" of the games (not like movies with scenes that must be sat through to get to your favorite parts). Lego games probably wouldn't hold my interest without a hub world, since collecting things is about 80% of what they offer and even that wouldn't be as fun if the only place you could do so was the stages. Total tone shift, but Grand Theft Auto probably wouldn't even be a thing without its hub worlds. It's possible I haven't seen enough hub worlds to truly critique the practice and I'm aware that most of my gaming opinions are unpopular, but I dig me a hub world. Hopefully, this engagement on your video makes up for me having said absolutely nothing about Mario...
I have a whole sonic series retrospective playlist from earlier this year you might enjoy it you haven't seen it already lol. I loved going through it. But the summary for me is I like unleashed's and Shadow Gens hubs but not the Adventure and 06 hubs
@NintenDeen I only recently learned that Unleashed has a hub world because I played the PS2 version of the game and it's apparently different from the PS3 and 360 versions. I think a hub world would have improved my time with Unleashed (as well as Tails' plane stages) and I also like Shadow's hub world (as much as I like hearing from randos from Soleana, I like hearing from Omega more). Thanks for letting me know about the Sonic videos!
I think Sonic Adventure's hub is more than just "go to the next level 4head" and to say otherwise is pretty disingenuous and shows a lack of understanding of what makes Sonic Adventure a good video game. It's not just a Sonic game, it's a Sonic ADVENTURE. The levels in Sonic Adventure are good and fun (yes, even Big's I played DX on the Gamecube and didn't have a bad time), but those are just half of the game. The Hub world isn't about just getting to the next level, it's about exploring it, every nook and cranny, taking the time to actually appreciate the world you're trying to save. That's why they have the emblems, they're a system that's telling you "hey, don't just run from point a to point b, enjoy the journey!" That's why there's NPCs to talk to, they all say something different and after each level, they have new lines and there are even individual storylines that you can follow between characters. For example, in Station Square, there's a girl who is standing outside of the burger shop at the beginning but slowly works her way inside before eventually working there. It turns out she has a crush on the male employee working there and she's incredibly shy, slowly working her way in to be more comfortable around him. It's stuff like this that makes the hub world more than just a "glorified level select" and it's something so many people will immediately write off because it's not the same as the fast paced action stages. You have to think of Station Square, Mystic Ruins, and the Egg Carrier as more than just a "hub" they're actual levels that the developers took time and effort to flesh out.
@simplyhoodie I couldn't have said it better myself! I love little touches like the train door slamming on Big's tail and he says Ow. I love how the people of Station Square know Amy because she lives there and one of them will tell Sonic to be good to her because they care about her. There's also a funny thing where someone in Station Square thinks that Gamma is somebody's grocery-bot, which helps tell you that Gamma is much calmer around civilians than Eggman's other machines (any other Badnik or E-100 would surely have clunked around and broke things to the point that everyone would know they're kill-bots). I love that hubs seem to be making a comeback and are looking to improve from what Frontiers offered (which was great, but the pop-in was bad). I too never had a bad time with Big. He's not the most exciting guy, but I love that Adventure 1 told one grand story from multiple perspectives, including civilians like Big and Amy and made them play that way too.
@@seantaylor424 Also, Sonic Adventure's Hub does the very same thing he praises Unleashed and SxSGs for. It has people to talk to and collectibles and powerups to find.
That's a fair perspective. I've been thinking more about it and the comet observatory has the skeleton of a good hub world. Just needed a bit more work and it'd have been perfect
one of my favorite little things about the castle, is how the obvious first door to use your key on (the one in the main foyer) is actually wrong, and instead you need to use it to unlock the basement. edit: I made this comment before finishing the video lol
It’s funny you mention Zelda, since OOT original game design included an actual hub world which was Gabon’s castle. Although the idea was scrapped as a whole Ganon’s castle took this design as a dungeon.
So sunshine was too complicated, and galaxy was too easy lol. I know what you mean though. Personally, I enjoy exploring and looking around. The hub world is the place to relax and have fun between stages, so I say the more there is to explore and see the better.
Yeah, I'd say compared to M64 lol. But tbf I did say they're not even Bad implementations, I just wanted to compare them for the sake of keeping it within the franchise
@NintenDeen I know, was just messing with ya. Really enjoy the videos, and subscribed when I saw you actually engage with your followers. Much respect. Hoping in the future you'll do banjo kazooie
Thanks! I used to reply to every comment but if it's hard to keep up I'll at least heart them so people know I'm reading lol. Banjo will probably come soon enough. I want to do the 4 Rare N64 games at some point soon
I like your opinion on the hub world of Mario 64 overall (The Castle), so instead im gonna talk about the Sonic Adventure one To be honest I think it has more of an function than just be an place to test sonic controls, like I think it helps to the worldbuilding, and also to tell the story (even if the story is still silly) Like, the hub of Sonic Adventure has many cutscenes on it, from giving you an reason to go to an stage, to just start an boss battle there, or just you know where in the story this is happening, something that helps the pace of the story a lot. For example in Sonic Adventure 2 that is an HUGE problem I have with the game, it feels the characters just jump from place to place, yeah, in story it makes sense, but it happens so fast that it just bothers me tbh, and like it makes me think the places are just very very gamey-like to the point i dont have an huge attachment to it aside of that I like the level obviously, to at the end of the game i think that happens less, but well, like I said for the story I think the hubs of Sonic Adventure are great for that Now tbh I don't like them as much tho, and that's because the unique good one is City Square, Mystic Ruins and the jungle I would say they are kinda bad, as to be honest I dont find them good to go around, things are hidden or well, not easy to find, and those are the unique places where for example Sonic gets gemstones to just go to more levels for no reason more than finding the chaos emerald (well in City Square happens too, but in those 2 other it happens more), the cutscenes that do happen there I think are still great, but gameplay wise I just don't find them fun to go around, the ruins I think they are still fun to an extend, the problem is that you are gonna get lost finding what you are supposed to do even if the place isn't big at all, but the jungle for example, just sucks for that and to go around too, even what happens there the unique cutscene that I like are the Sonic and Amy ones, the rest are just like, they find Eggmans base, something odd happens, or you just go to the stage, which I think it kinda defeats the purpose of having the hub world if im still thinking the place where like, Tails is going doesn't make sense at all (Sand Hill) while having poor exploration I think Sonic Adventure hubs would be great if they decided to always give you an good cutscene or something in the hub world to have an reason to go to the next stage, more than just sometimes they do, or sometimes they give you an key or you have to get the hint from Tikal to know where the hell to go as they didn't say anything at all so you are just lost, and if they just were as fun to play and see as City Square with his citizens and locals
Sorry for taking so long to reply! I actually think we're agreeing here. I don't think the locations are bad, they're just slightly lacking. There's a good setup for a good hub world that just needed a bit more work imo
I actually hard disagree on your take for the Sonic Adventure hub world. I always felt it added to the story. You were exploring all these places that were connected to each other, events were happening in these spaces and you could even talk to the NPCs and they would have full on story arcs. They always weren't too big, which is the main issue I have with the 06 ones, and were fun to explore. It added to the charm for me and I was disappointed when Adventure 2 didn't have them.
For everyone wondering when he finally starts to actually talk about Peache's Castle: @7:45 ... Dude has wasted WWAAAYYY to much time for the intro and explaining what a bad hubworld is before starting to speak about the topic of the video.
Video was originally titled let's talk about hub worlds lol. I later changed the name so it fits more with the rest of the playlist. But I suppose I should add a timestamp
Sonic Adventure would be much worse without a hub world. Sorry seems like a skill issue as the hub world is very easy and fun to navigate. It's funny how you mention Shadow gent's hub world being good where as a big enjoyed of hub worlds I found it very lack luster and repetitive so it wasn't that good imo.
We can agree to disagree lol. I didn't find Sonic adventure's hub as intuitive nor as useful. And Shadow Gens was just much more appealing to me. I still love SA1 btw. I was a Dreamcast kid
Nintendo moved away from hub worlds for a reason. Mario 3 introduced the perfect way to navigate levels and I'm glad they have returned to that model. Peach's Castle was great because the game needed a safe place for players to learn Mario's new 3D movements, but nowadays that's old Cappy and unnecessary.
Anyone else blown away by how you figured this stuff out as a kid? If I hadn't played it before, I honestly don't think I could beat M64 without a guide as an adult. Yet somehow my 8-year-old self beat the game 100% with no guides and without talking to anyone? (no one else I knew had the game). I don't understand how I figured it out lol. Same with games like Lego Star Wars. That game has a million secrets (minikits, red bricks), yet I beat it 100% without any guides. Kids are just built different I guess...
9:13 boo doesn't bait you until you have enough stars to enter big boo hunt, until then there's no boo
Ooh, good catch. Thanks
10:28 I always thought that Shifting Sands seems a little too hard to find without a guide, but you’re right that chasing the bunny was probably how most people who didn’t have one found it. Wonder how intentional that was.
I mean, MIPS stops directly in front of the portal, tempting players into diving at it. It kinda feels like the original Super Mario Bros, how the first Goomba in World 1-1 was placed in such a way that you'd likely hit a block while jumping over it, leading you to discover the Mushroom power up.
I certainly found Mario 64's hub to be more maze-like and filled with secrets vs Sunshine.
Both games have a hub that feels like a believable world within them. I miss those days.
Oh that's interesting.
Honestly, I always figured my issue with sunshine was I didn't play it when I was 6 years old so I didn't care much about spending time in the Delfino plaza like I did in Peach's Castle. Hence why I felt like it was more complicated to figure out where the stages were. And likewise probably because of how young I was and how much time I spent on 64 I felt like it was much simpler to get around 🤷🏻♂️
I disagree that the exclusion of the comet observatory wouldn’t devalue galaxy 1.
All of this is just my opinion, but my biggest complaint about galaxy 2 was the fact that it had such a limited hub. Hub worlds not only serve as a playground for the player’s movement, but also as a form of world building. Of course Rosalina has a giant observatory that can send you around the galaxy! Why wouldn’t she?
I think that galaxy would lose a lot of it’s charm in terms of world building if you had to select levels via menu. It would feel more like a video game where you have to play all the levels, rather than a quest to save the galaxy. Seeing people live their normal lives can make the world itself more believable and more investing to the player.
I think I can agree to an extent, but not entirely. Obviously, just personal opinion lol.
I don't want to regurgitate what I said in the video but I think if it was more like an enclosed ship rather than an observatory where you just turned on/powered on the lights to advance, it could've had a larger impact imo. I think the skeleton is there but it just feels a little too bare bones for me
Agreed. Galaxy was SUCH an atmospheric game. A menu would definitely devalue it. I'm okay with the menu system of Galaxy 2, since the focus was a lot more on trying out as many diverse worlds as possible, but the first game was dedicated to the story.
I agree. Comet Observatory isn't great, but it's a nice reprise between worlds. The value it adds is being able to see Rosalina and listen to her story. Plus, the calming music and just a small sense of wonder when you unlock the next observatory.
Meanwhile, Galaxy 2's head is a net negative to the game. There's nothing of value there. They force you back to it too often for no reason, and it's just annoying.
The Comet Observatory just needed more stuff to do. It has great asthetic and theme, it serves it's role in the story and it is actually quite fun to move around in. If only there were a few hidden stars requiring some detective work or tricky platforming it would feel like there was a purpose to moving around other than getting to the next mini-hub. It is the biggest waste of potential to place the flying powerup for use here, and not have 1-2 stars requiring you to fly.
Agreed. I think the skeleton was there, just needed a bit more
Tbh, that might actually be what makes the Comet Observatory special. While games like SM64 has a hubworld made for the sake of exploration, Mario Galaxy has a hubworld made for the sake of those more ethereal feelings. The Comet Observatory isn’t a place to be explored; rather, it’s a place meant to instill a sense of grandeur.
Mario Galaxy was the first Mario game to really have a classical genre of music as its theme. No other game in the series (not even Mario Galaxy 2) could ever instill what it feels like to ponder the vastness and loneliness of space like Mario Galaxy 1 can. The musical stings that help that game define that grandeur, and the visual aesthetics of the comet observatory convey that grandeur better than I feel any hubworld has in the Mario franchise. While it can’t convey that feeling of exploration that SM64 can, what sets it apart is the fact that it does the best job it can to convey the themes that the game is trying to convey, and I think that’s definitely something special.
NEVER talk to Yoshi!
Seeing him leap to his demise bums me out. 🙃
the one thing I dislike is how some things only unlock after you have enough stars, but you aren't told there's something there, or that there's a star requirement. you could go into the courtyard early, see there's nothing there, then not think to go back and therefore miss BBH
Thinking about the end, everlasting surf shells and caps or perhaps even on demand would have been a cool gift. Press the d-pad and get to explore every level on a surf shell that doesn't break while you can listen to the banger sound track of metal cap mario. And when you fall off from a mountain top, immediately get wing cap. Who needs 99 lives 😅
The Comet Observatory focuses on your plot objective and atmosphere, becoming more lively to represent you fixing the situation for Rosalina and the Lumas and more accessible as the goal is to restore it and take the fight to Bowser.
It's a shame it lacks utility for its size but does its actual job really well without getting in the way. Guess both Sunshine's and Galaxy's give you an objective and a representation of plot progression to reward you and spur you on.
i did not click the video to hear you bermirsch the good name of mario sunshine.
🤣🤣🤣 I love sunshine! Delfino Plaza was confusing for me at times though
Sonic adventure literally shows you where to go each time you enter the hub with a cutscene, and tikal tells you where to go when you interact with her
There are a handful of moments where there is no guidance as to where to go. I know specifically in Amy's playthrough there's even a moment during the flashback where you're meant to turn around and go backwards and there's nothing that indicates that
@@NintenDeen The whole hub is like 5 rooms with absurdly big cutscene triggers, and that flashback segment is 2 rooms
Lol idk what to tell you. There were moments where I felt lost. They weren't THAT common but they were common enough to feel memorable.
Mind you I love Sonic Adventure and I have a retrospective about 1.5 hours long on it where I'm mostly defending it. But the hubworld frustrated me on a few occasions and I didn't care for it for the most part
Oh, peach's CASTLE...
The only thing I don’t like about Peach’s castle is that after you have drained the water by stomping on the pillars, there is no way to refill the moat around the castle. It looks much more aesthetically pleasing with water.
Yeah, I remember this bugged me a lot as a kid
Cannot agree about Sunshines’s hub. Delfino Plaza is the heart and soul of the game and its complexity is what makes it good; what parts were you stuck on?
So I don't think it's terrible. Don't even think it's necessarily bad, I just remember it wasn't as straightforward as I'd have liked the first time I played it, and there were multiple moments where I'd think I'd be heading to the right stage but end up moving in the wrong direction.
Can't really mention specifics since it's been too long since my first playthrough though. That being said I don't agree about the plaza being the heart and soul lol. Not because the plaza is bad, but because the stages are so much more enjoyable for me
I watched your Wet, Dry world video and now I’m hooked. I haven’t played SM64 in so long so this video’ll be a time watching
Hope you enjoy! Technically the nostalgia vid is the first one in the playlist though :)
@ I skipped it. I’ll probably double back after everything.
@@NintenDeenalgorithm definitely seems to favour the wet dry world video and pushed it quite a bit 😅
To be the voice of an unpopular opinion, I love the hub worlds in the Sonic games because the characters and stories are my primary motivator to play the games, so I like seeing the world that's being saved and the people in that world, especially when they have anything to say about characters that the main story won't highlight.
The amount of work that can go into good hub worlds of games in general (especially when they have quests to find) also feels like getting more game for your purchase and I guess I'm of the mindset that more content is always good, even if it's not as good as the rest of the content; although getting lost in them is a possibility, breezing through them is also possible and by then, they become less of an obstacle to the "main event" of the games (not like movies with scenes that must be sat through to get to your favorite parts). Lego games probably wouldn't hold my interest without a hub world, since collecting things is about 80% of what they offer and even that wouldn't be as fun if the only place you could do so was the stages. Total tone shift, but Grand Theft Auto probably wouldn't even be a thing without its hub worlds.
It's possible I haven't seen enough hub worlds to truly critique the practice and I'm aware that most of my gaming opinions are unpopular, but I dig me a hub world. Hopefully, this engagement on your video makes up for me having said absolutely nothing about Mario...
I have a whole sonic series retrospective playlist from earlier this year you might enjoy it you haven't seen it already lol. I loved going through it. But the summary for me is I like unleashed's and Shadow Gens hubs but not the Adventure and 06 hubs
@NintenDeen I only recently learned that Unleashed has a hub world because I played the PS2 version of the game and it's apparently different from the PS3 and 360 versions. I think a hub world would have improved my time with Unleashed (as well as Tails' plane stages) and I also like Shadow's hub world (as much as I like hearing from randos from Soleana, I like hearing from Omega more).
Thanks for letting me know about the Sonic videos!
I think Sonic Adventure's hub is more than just "go to the next level 4head" and to say otherwise is pretty disingenuous and shows a lack of understanding of what makes Sonic Adventure a good video game. It's not just a Sonic game, it's a Sonic ADVENTURE. The levels in Sonic Adventure are good and fun (yes, even Big's I played DX on the Gamecube and didn't have a bad time), but those are just half of the game. The Hub world isn't about just getting to the next level, it's about exploring it, every nook and cranny, taking the time to actually appreciate the world you're trying to save. That's why they have the emblems, they're a system that's telling you "hey, don't just run from point a to point b, enjoy the journey!" That's why there's NPCs to talk to, they all say something different and after each level, they have new lines and there are even individual storylines that you can follow between characters. For example, in Station Square, there's a girl who is standing outside of the burger shop at the beginning but slowly works her way inside before eventually working there. It turns out she has a crush on the male employee working there and she's incredibly shy, slowly working her way in to be more comfortable around him. It's stuff like this that makes the hub world more than just a "glorified level select" and it's something so many people will immediately write off because it's not the same as the fast paced action stages. You have to think of Station Square, Mystic Ruins, and the Egg Carrier as more than just a "hub" they're actual levels that the developers took time and effort to flesh out.
@simplyhoodie I couldn't have said it better myself! I love little touches like the train door slamming on Big's tail and he says Ow. I love how the people of Station Square know Amy because she lives there and one of them will tell Sonic to be good to her because they care about her. There's also a funny thing where someone in Station Square thinks that Gamma is somebody's grocery-bot, which helps tell you that Gamma is much calmer around civilians than Eggman's other machines (any other Badnik or E-100 would surely have clunked around and broke things to the point that everyone would know they're kill-bots).
I love that hubs seem to be making a comeback and are looking to improve from what Frontiers offered (which was great, but the pop-in was bad).
I too never had a bad time with Big. He's not the most exciting guy, but I love that Adventure 1 told one grand story from multiple perspectives, including civilians like Big and Amy and made them play that way too.
@@seantaylor424 Also, Sonic Adventure's Hub does the very same thing he praises Unleashed and SxSGs for. It has people to talk to and collectibles and powerups to find.
Counterpoint: in Mario Galaxy removing the observatory would miss the opportunity to see Rosalina read her backstory to the lumas
That's a fair perspective. I've been thinking more about it and the comet observatory has the skeleton of a good hub world. Just needed a bit more work and it'd have been perfect
The Comsic Observatory is all about groovy vibes man. ✌️
Ah. Yes, I forgot to consider that aspect 🤔
You know, for all Sonic Adventure DX did wrong apparently, the emblems did help out the hub a bit.
one of my favorite little things about the castle, is how the obvious first door to use your key on (the one in the main foyer) is actually wrong, and instead you need to use it to unlock the basement.
edit: I made this comment before finishing the video lol
Lol @ the edit
It’s funny you mention Zelda, since OOT original game design included an actual hub world which was Gabon’s castle. Although the idea was scrapped as a whole Ganon’s castle took this design as a dungeon.
Love a good hub world
Games with world hubs always excited me when i unlock a new area. What kind of level is next? It always was a treat to find out
So sunshine was too complicated, and galaxy was too easy lol. I know what you mean though. Personally, I enjoy exploring and looking around. The hub world is the place to relax and have fun between stages, so I say the more there is to explore and see the better.
Yeah, I'd say compared to M64 lol. But tbf I did say they're not even Bad implementations, I just wanted to compare them for the sake of keeping it within the franchise
@NintenDeen I know, was just messing with ya. Really enjoy the videos, and subscribed when I saw you actually engage with your followers. Much respect. Hoping in the future you'll do banjo kazooie
Thanks! I used to reply to every comment but if it's hard to keep up I'll at least heart them so people know I'm reading lol.
Banjo will probably come soon enough. I want to do the 4 Rare N64 games at some point soon
I like your opinion on the hub world of Mario 64 overall (The Castle), so instead im gonna talk about the Sonic Adventure one
To be honest I think it has more of an function than just be an place to test sonic controls, like I think it helps to the worldbuilding, and also to tell the story (even if the story is still silly) Like, the hub of Sonic Adventure has many cutscenes on it, from giving you an reason to go to an stage, to just start an boss battle there, or just you know where in the story this is happening, something that helps the pace of the story a lot. For example in Sonic Adventure 2 that is an HUGE problem I have with the game, it feels the characters just jump from place to place, yeah, in story it makes sense, but it happens so fast that it just bothers me tbh, and like it makes me think the places are just very very gamey-like to the point i dont have an huge attachment to it aside of that I like the level obviously, to at the end of the game i think that happens less, but well, like I said for the story I think the hubs of Sonic Adventure are great for that
Now tbh I don't like them as much tho, and that's because the unique good one is City Square, Mystic Ruins and the jungle I would say they are kinda bad, as to be honest I dont find them good to go around, things are hidden or well, not easy to find, and those are the unique places where for example Sonic gets gemstones to just go to more levels for no reason more than finding the chaos emerald (well in City Square happens too, but in those 2 other it happens more), the cutscenes that do happen there I think are still great, but gameplay wise I just don't find them fun to go around, the ruins I think they are still fun to an extend, the problem is that you are gonna get lost finding what you are supposed to do even if the place isn't big at all, but the jungle for example, just sucks for that and to go around too, even what happens there the unique cutscene that I like are the Sonic and Amy ones, the rest are just like, they find Eggmans base, something odd happens, or you just go to the stage, which I think it kinda defeats the purpose of having the hub world if im still thinking the place where like, Tails is going doesn't make sense at all (Sand Hill) while having poor exploration
I think Sonic Adventure hubs would be great if they decided to always give you an good cutscene or something in the hub world to have an reason to go to the next stage, more than just sometimes they do, or sometimes they give you an key or you have to get the hint from Tikal to know where the hell to go as they didn't say anything at all so you are just lost, and if they just were as fun to play and see as City Square with his citizens and locals
Sorry for taking so long to reply! I actually think we're agreeing here. I don't think the locations are bad, they're just slightly lacking. There's a good setup for a good hub world that just needed a bit more work imo
@@NintenDeen Glad we do kinda agree then
Are there any other 3D platformer games that have a hub similar to 64's?
I enjoyed the Spyro hubs
I actually hard disagree on your take for the Sonic Adventure hub world. I always felt it added to the story. You were exploring all these places that were connected to each other, events were happening in these spaces and you could even talk to the NPCs and they would have full on story arcs. They always weren't too big, which is the main issue I have with the 06 ones, and were fun to explore. It added to the charm for me and I was disappointed when Adventure 2 didn't have them.
For everyone wondering when he finally starts to actually talk about Peache's Castle: @7:45 ... Dude has wasted WWAAAYYY to much time for the intro and explaining what a bad hubworld is before starting to speak about the topic of the video.
Video was originally titled let's talk about hub worlds lol. I later changed the name so it fits more with the rest of the playlist. But I suppose I should add a timestamp
What about crash tag team racings hub worlds?
I haven't played that game in too long, but I remember liking diddy Kong racing's hub
@@NintenDeenTime to dust off the ps2 then.
Good icon
Do you mean Mario or my Avatar 😅
Sonic Adventure would be much worse without a hub world. Sorry seems like a skill issue as the hub world is very easy and fun to navigate.
It's funny how you mention Shadow gent's hub world being good where as a big enjoyed of hub worlds I found it very lack luster and repetitive so it wasn't that good imo.
We can agree to disagree lol. I didn't find Sonic adventure's hub as intuitive nor as useful. And Shadow Gens was just much more appealing to me. I still love SA1 btw. I was a Dreamcast kid
@@NintenDeen Yea agree to disagree
Defino Plaza is a hub world? 😅 damn I hate that game
Come on it's not that bad haha. Just the blue coins
Nintendo moved away from hub worlds for a reason. Mario 3 introduced the perfect way to navigate levels and I'm glad they have returned to that model. Peach's Castle was great because the game needed a safe place for players to learn Mario's new 3D movements, but nowadays that's old Cappy and unnecessary.
Anyone else blown away by how you figured this stuff out as a kid? If I hadn't played it before, I honestly don't think I could beat M64 without a guide as an adult. Yet somehow my 8-year-old self beat the game 100% with no guides and without talking to anyone? (no one else I knew had the game). I don't understand how I figured it out lol.
Same with games like Lego Star Wars. That game has a million secrets (minikits, red bricks), yet I beat it 100% without any guides. Kids are just built different I guess...
If I'm running around for 10 minutes now I'm tempted to google where to go lol. Back then I'd spend months trying to figure out a star