Demon: To clarify a bit better: You could get the twister still but if you don't have a strong lock down, they can pull free. I find that keeping my shoulders on the mat after the initial roll keeps them 'spread out' well.
i really like the little flexibility quirks from jui jitsu. it seems like common sense, but i liked how you grabbed on to your own leg left leg with your right hand. Just being able to hook your legs around the opponent's leg breaks the technical kesa gatame-- very useful in a judo match where you can win by pressing your opponent for a certain amount of time. great post!
Good eye Matrix: It can be done both ways. Some people don't even lock the leg (they just sqeeze it together in a typical half guard). The best lockdown is outside leg over first.
ha ha, Good post! I put up the simpler version (when the guy already has the underhook) a few months back. I was going to put this version up also since a few people had asked me about it, but now I don't have to. this will definitely come in handy :)
Look up the Guillotine videos for wrestling and you see that the "twister" is guillotine in wrestling (some modifications). You'll all see lots of wrestling guys get their necks cranked really badly from this move too. Wrestling doesn't use neck cranks as a move but they happen all the time from stuff like this (just like the full, half or 3/4 nelson jacks your neck too).
Good eye. I think to get the elbow lock the opponent (black) would need to shift his head (as counterweight) onto Ari's (white) wrist so to create an optimal fulcrum at the elbow. Then, I think he could get it. That would mean black would have to create a certain degree of space between the two, so if Ari allowed it (or momentarily lost control) there might be potential.
yeah, I put up a video of that a few months ago if you want to check it out. it's basically the same thing, minus a few steps because you are already over his arm.
@antistyler It's really fun to flow from rubber guard to twister side control to the twister, you get reps in for a whole bunch of really important positions
@scottyiscute hells yeah dude. spinal locks are fine as long as you are doing them with somebody else who is experienced as well, and they agree to them beforehand. same goes for neck cranks, face locks, leg locks and other "dangerous" submissions.
@antistyler It's a spine lock... the lockdown stabilizes his lower back and when you crank you are applying lateral pressure to the top of the neck and spine... you don't want to get twistered... ever... it hurts like pain
@antistyler it's kind of like an iliotibial band stretch taken to logical extremes. It stretches the spine and the neck. There's always a danger with an kind of joint manipulation. In the case of a twister gone wrong it may involve messing up disks and such. I don't think its common. If you have bad back problems it's probably not a great idea though.
if you can ever wind up at 1:05 then there is a nice submission called the electric chair. a lot less complicated. however if they are flexible they might not tap. but theyd have to be like a yoga master.
Thank you so much for posting I've been rolling for around 2 months now and my usual sparring partner is stronger than so I can never sweep him from scarf. This technique is a must have for me and I will start drilling it asap. Also Ari congrats on the blue belt almost 2 hours of that and I wouldn't need to be choked to pass out. One last thing is there any other options to escaping scarf besides the traditional over the body sweep? Videos? Thank you guys
Mike Hes got 20 seconds. Rogan hes got his back. Wait. It looks like hes goin for a twister. OH. THE TWISTER He tapped AND ITS ALL OVER!!! Jung beasted it
it seems like the guy would have to be unaware of what you're doing for you to get this so if the guy is fairly skilled at the scarf hold he'll probably readjust and put his weight back on you when you try to hip out
sickk move, my friend always headlocks me like that. usually i move my body since his on it (leaning into my body) so he losing balance while i place my hands on his head pushing down so try and get a scissor choke.
I like how the BJJ community thinks this is something new , when this is part of a whole Catch wrestling series of neck crank and spine attacks . Sorry I just had to look up this famous " Twister ". I do like Submissions 101 though , always clean well executed techniques.
@i32504 some counter submission are fast, this one is obviously slow down greatly. Plus you need to be trained what is happening, IE: What counter is he doing. How many twisters have you seen in UFC/MMA? One? So I guess most people wouldn't be training for it, or know what it is, or how it's pulled off.
Once u stop at the shoulder you can also try an upside down guilotine choke or something because you have control of his arm and his head is basically open for that choke but idk correct me if im wrong
@daFBi yeah thats understandable alot of guys don't know about this position and i get alot of guys with a shoulder crank from the scarf hold i guess you'd have to have a fair amount of experience in bjj or have done judo to know how to defend againist this
oh my god thats insane, hey could you try an armlock from twister, lets say instead of going for the neck going beneath the elbow some sort of rear naked choke position on the arm, let me know if u try, thanks again and again for that twister variation
You guys are awesome, but I'm not sure that you could pull the aggressors shoulder down like that. As the defender, you're working against both his arms and probably body weight.. could you guys show a rolling clip with the aggressor doing his best to prevent his shoulder from being pulled?
I tried this today at my gym but the top leg was forward with the bottom leg being the one backwards. I couldn't get the leg triangle to transition to twister side control because of that.
@Xero555000 Thanks man, now I have an idea. No, sure I don't want to get caught in a Twister, but I might wanna apply it to someone else. And before I do I better know what it can do. Just like you shouldn't go for arm bars or leg locks before you don't know how much pressure is healthy for your training partner ;-)
Would this be even more effective if you were in modified scaf fold because you could go directly into the head crank? I think that is the hardest one to escape too.
I noticed the second time your grapevine was wrapped differently does it make a difference. I am reading Eddie Bravo's new book and trying to learn these moves...
What makes the guy tap? I´ve never been in a twister. Is it the rotation pressure on his spine? And what would happen if he didn´t tap? What would get hurt?
I read that spine locks are one of the most dangerous submissions. I'm just got my blue belt and do you guys think I'm ready to do this to someone during rolling? I don't wanna kill or paralyze anyone.
nice move, really. but do u have a variation without using leg hold? Cuz if some1 gets u with scarf hold, he would definetely try to get a baby position and not let me get his leg...
@geneticman13 - Cranks arent allowed in judo tournaments, so I will only submit everbody in my judo academy with this. They will bitch at me saying, "cranks arent allowed!!", and ill say, "I know".
I went for this in a BJJ tournament and the ref warned me of no spinal locks so I just took his back and got a RNC.. But would the banana split submission work from here..or would that be a leg lock?
when setting up the twister postion, if the opponent isn't very jiu jitsu savvy, and they don't roll into you to give you that leg, how do you hook that leg to establish the lock down?
@BrokenBon3sx what are face locks? ok how do I explain this... When a man and a woman love each other.. haha.. just kiddin.. theres no such thng as face locks
I learn BJJ thanks to you and now i am a blue belt in France , thanks you very much Submission101!
Hey Mike:
I remember seeing your version with the underhook..good one too!
cheers
Ari
Glad they are helping SeDq!
Demon:
To clarify a bit better: You could get the twister still but if you don't have a strong lock down, they can pull free. I find that keeping my shoulders on the mat after the initial roll keeps them 'spread out' well.
This is great if you get headlocked in wrestling!
i really like the little flexibility quirks from jui jitsu. it seems like common sense, but i liked how you grabbed on to your own leg left leg with your right hand.
Just being able to hook your legs around the opponent's leg breaks the technical kesa gatame-- very useful in a judo match where you can win by pressing your opponent for a certain amount of time.
great post!
Good eye Matrix:
It can be done both ways. Some people don't even lock the leg (they just sqeeze it together in a typical half guard). The best lockdown is outside leg over first.
ha ha, Good post!
I put up the simpler version (when the guy already has the underhook) a few months back. I was going to put this version up also since a few people had asked me about it, but now I don't have to. this will definitely come in handy :)
WOW!!!!! that was great! great clip!
I like to keep them on my hips. If they fall and their butt is touching the mat, the twisting is much less on their body.
Look up the Guillotine videos for wrestling and you see that the "twister" is guillotine in wrestling (some modifications). You'll all see lots of wrestling guys get their necks cranked really badly from this move too. Wrestling doesn't use neck cranks as a move but they happen all the time from stuff like this (just like the full, half or 3/4 nelson jacks your neck too).
this is in his book Mastering the Twister. In the book its called Judo Twister. Awesome move!
It makes it more secure but not set in stone.
You are talking about modified Scarf Hold (Kuzure-Kesa-Gatame). We don't have any yet but will makes some ;-)
This stuff is necessary at the ground.
Percussions are OK but JJ helps a lot.
Good eye.
I think to get the elbow lock the opponent (black) would need to shift his head (as counterweight) onto Ari's (white) wrist so to create an optimal fulcrum at the elbow. Then, I think he could get it. That would mean black would have to create a certain degree of space between the two, so if Ari allowed it (or momentarily lost control) there might be potential.
yeah, I put up a video of that a few months ago if you want to check it out. it's basically the same thing, minus a few steps because you are already over his arm.
cool move, it looks like it takes some practice to work, because it is an intricate move
Chan sung jung saw this clip and utilized it, He won submission of the night aswell!
@antistyler It's really fun to flow from rubber guard to twister side control to the twister, you get reps in for a whole bunch of really important positions
I learned this in wrestling. Good move.
@scottyiscute hells yeah dude. spinal locks are fine as long as you are doing them with somebody else who is experienced as well, and they agree to them beforehand. same goes for neck cranks, face locks, leg locks and other "dangerous" submissions.
really enjoy learning all the new ju jitsu moves
@antistyler It's a spine lock... the lockdown stabilizes his lower back and when you crank you are applying lateral pressure to the top of the neck and spine... you don't want to get twistered... ever... it hurts like pain
@antistyler it's kind of like an iliotibial band stretch taken to logical extremes. It stretches the spine and the neck. There's always a danger with an kind of joint manipulation. In the case of a twister gone wrong it may involve messing up disks and such. I don't think its common. If you have bad back problems it's probably not a great idea though.
if you can ever wind up at 1:05 then there is a nice submission called the electric chair. a lot less complicated. however if they are flexible they might not tap. but theyd have to be like a yoga master.
this is actually a real good mat wrestling counter
not including the submission lol
I thought I invented this variation like 7 years ago. Finally found a video of it, hard to find.
Thank you so much for posting I've been rolling for around 2 months now and my usual sparring partner is stronger than so I can never sweep him from scarf. This technique is a must have for me and I will start drilling it asap. Also Ari congrats on the blue belt almost 2 hours of that and I wouldn't need to be choked to pass out. One last thing is there any other options to escaping scarf besides the traditional over the body sweep? Videos? Thank you guys
@masterofice Actually it just messes up your back... it's a spine lock... its a real highlight reel submission
Mike Hes got 20 seconds.
Rogan hes got his back.
Wait. It looks like hes goin for a twister.
OH. THE TWISTER
He tapped
AND ITS ALL OVER!!!
Jung beasted it
@f9hunter I use this all the time but without putting on the twister(no neckcranks). Its quite easy to take your oponents back.
would it hurt -yes- haahaa good answer that did make me laugh yes you aint wrong fella
great technique, gotta try this 1.....thanks.
it seems like the guy would have to be unaware of what you're doing for you to get this so if the guy is fairly skilled at the scarf hold he'll probably readjust and put his weight back on you when you try to hip out
sickk move, my friend always headlocks me like that. usually i move my body since his on it (leaning into my body) so he losing balance while i place my hands on his head pushing down so try and get a scissor choke.
I like how the BJJ community thinks this is something new , when this is part of a whole Catch wrestling series of neck crank and spine attacks . Sorry I just had to look up this famous " Twister ". I do like Submissions 101 though , always clean well executed techniques.
wow that is so simple it beautiful...thanks i love your stuff its great PEACE
this can be a pretty good way to reverse someone when your put in to a head and arm in wrestling
@i32504
some counter submission are fast, this one is obviously slow down greatly. Plus you need to be trained what is happening, IE: What counter is he doing. How many twisters have you seen in UFC/MMA? One? So I guess most people wouldn't be training for it, or know what it is, or how it's pulled off.
Once u stop at the shoulder you can also try an upside down guilotine choke or something because you have control of his arm and his head is basically open for that choke but idk correct me if im wrong
@daFBi yeah thats understandable alot of guys don't know about this position and i get alot of guys with a shoulder crank from the scarf hold i guess you'd have to have a fair amount of experience in bjj or have done judo to know how to defend againist this
yes
oh my god thats insane, hey could you try an armlock from twister, lets say instead of going for the neck going beneath the elbow some sort of rear naked choke position on the arm, let me know if u try, thanks again and again for that twister variation
You guys are awesome, but I'm not sure that you could pull the aggressors shoulder down like that. As the defender, you're working against both his arms and probably body weight.. could you guys show a rolling clip with the aggressor doing his best to prevent his shoulder from being pulled?
I use to do head lock Kesa, but after 1 too many escape and he jump on my back, I started to use underhook kesa, much better.
I tried this today at my gym but the top leg was forward with the bottom leg being the one backwards. I couldn't get the leg triangle to transition to twister side control because of that.
@antistyler I think it's technically a neck crank, right? It hurts like crap everywhere, though.
never seen this until the chan sung jung. fuckin amazing
@Xero555000 Thanks man, now I have an idea. No, sure I don't want to get caught in a Twister, but I might wanna apply it to someone else. And before I do I better know what it can do. Just like you shouldn't go for arm bars or leg locks before you don't know how much pressure is healthy for your training partner ;-)
@ms1454 Well said fellow wrestler .
Would this be even more effective if you were in modified scaf fold because you could go directly into the head crank? I think that is the hardest one to escape too.
I noticed the second time your grapevine was wrapped differently does it make a difference. I am reading Eddie Bravo's new book and trying to learn these moves...
@antistyler after you get into jiu claw you let them roll and then you fall into twister side control
@HomasterX
That's when you go for a different move.
What makes the guy tap? I´ve never been in a twister. Is it the rotation pressure on his spine?
And what would happen if he didn´t tap? What would get hurt?
other than the difference between a pin and a submission, what is the difference between the twister and the wrestling guillotine?
how do you defend it?
I've been looking all over youtube but I can't find any videos.
@Xero555000 How do you flow from rubbér guard to twister side? Sure you can sweep, but rubber guard isn't exactly a set-up for a twister, right?
wow dood from someones dominant position. Nice
is the twister invented by eddie bravo? or modified from a judo technique? if it is then from what technique?
I read that spine locks are one of the most dangerous submissions. I'm just got my blue belt and do you guys think I'm ready to do this to someone during rolling? I don't wanna kill or paralyze anyone.
how do you keep the guy from rolling all the way over himself? it seems very hard to stop the leg from rotating w/ just a triangle. is this just me?
turned on subtitles, nearly shit my pants laughing
ok but what if the kesa gatame was tighter so that you couldnt grab your own arm. From my experience it is much harder to get out of a pin like that.
nice move, really.
but do u have a variation without using leg hold? Cuz if some1 gets u with scarf hold, he would definetely try to get a baby position and not let me get his leg...
@luchador1764 What are face locks?
@geneticman13 - Cranks arent allowed in judo tournaments, so I will only submit everbody in my judo academy with this. They will bitch at me saying, "cranks arent allowed!!", and ill say, "I know".
@seanpetrash Explain that again? by opponent, you mean the guy in black? cause their legs are rapped up, so i dont get what you're saying.
Once you had the leg, it would be easy to pull the shoulder down. The trick would be to get the leg against a semi-decent guy.
Korean Zombie just used this to win a match, I had to look fo it on youtube to understand what it even is!
I went for this in a BJJ tournament and the ref warned me of no spinal locks so I just took his back and got a RNC.. But would the banana split submission work from here..or would that be a leg lock?
awesome
when setting up the twister postion, if the opponent isn't very jiu jitsu savvy, and they don't roll into you to give you that leg, how do you hook that leg to establish the lock down?
I get the same satisfaction from tapping judokas too.lol
What if the scarf hold your opponent has is with his arm under your shoulder and not around the neck?
nice.
still can work just a little bit harder i will make a video on it next week
bad ass thanks
@Submissions101 Is the Twister legal in most tournaments?
nice
@BrokenBon3sx what are face locks? ok how do I explain this... When a man and a woman love each other.. haha.. just kiddin.. theres no such thng as face locks
Why don't you get the twister if you overrotate?
@antistyler SImple his spine would brake as a consequence of rotation.And he would be in chair rest of his life...
@antistyler once you get in one you will find out
uh...then it's probably a good thing that this isn't freestyle wrestling...it's submission wrestling/bjj
where is your school?
@Submissions101 lawl
pracitce it
this looks just so freakin nasty man
judokas beware !