Awesome, this was exactly the info I was after. I recently purchased a strap from artem with the matching deployant. I still haven't received them yet, and I was a little hesitant about the deployant. This video is making me feel a bit more confident about my purchase. Thanking you muchly. 💜❤
I just received the BP FF deployant after 3 weeks waiting for delivery. I had my Breitling Superocean heritage ii on a blue/white stich Artem strap. I was able to get a decent fit with the stock tag but this deployant made it feel like a new watch. They are very good quality and up there with OEM deployant's for well under $100 UDS. The polish finish is superb and a great match to the finish on my watch. I think I can cut off the loose keeper as it just fits so well. Thanks for the video.
This video popped up in my feed today somehow. Well timed. I actually ordered a 23mm strap and deployant from Artem just the other day. The deployant is a decent investment, but I thought it was worth it. Your video just gave me lots of reassurance. 👍
BUT what is the width of the buckle at the buckle end, to know what is the strap width? I assume you are quoting the lug width at the watch end... strap width at buckle end?
I had the same question. The website doesn't state the width of the Blancpain and RM style buckles. Are they 18, 20mm at the buckle end? I also wanted to know if they are compatible with other aftermarket straps. It looks like the straps have particularly large holes, so the posts on the deployants might not fit other straps. The straps look great, but the XL selection is very limited.
@@MichaelG1986 I believe they are 18mm at buckle end, but you are right will they fit other straps. The blanpain FF buckle I think is 20mm at the buckle end. Probably the only way is to buy them and try/ see if they fit.
@@stevenuk Thanks for the reply. I have largish 7.5 inch wrists, so usually get longer straps. The ARTEM site sells only one iteration in XL - at 20mm lug width. I have several watches the straps would look great on, but unfortunately, they're 22mm lug watches. If they had a 22mm size in XL I'd buy one or more and some buckles in a flash.
Hi Steven, sorry for the late reply, I have been a little preoccupied The width at the buckle end is 17.8-17.9mm (in that range) Hope that helps mate 👍
Omega-style is the only one I really "understand." What's the point of having a deployant where you still have to tuck the tail end in to the keeper? Seems like extra steps and hassle.
That's how most deployant clasps work. They are more useful on leather than other strap materials, since the act of bending leather to put it through a tang buckle can put some serious wear on the leather-- not good if you've paid $100+ USD for a custom/OEM strap!
Some people want to maintain the traditional watch strap look. With the omega you don’t get that. I personally prefer how the strap looks when the end is going through the keeper. But if you don’t care about that the omega would be the way to go.
Hi Peter. Looks fantastic overall. How do you find the quick release spring bars? Are they well built and quality made in the same manner as the buckles? Thanks.
When the Blancpain style is closed, how many mm thick is it? Height-wise sitting on the wrist. I have an OEM Omega Rang Buckle, and it is the slimmest buckle I have ever had? Great video mate. Keep up the good work.
I picked one of these straps up a while back but I can’t stand a buckle. I tried one of my Ocean Crawler deployant clasps (omega style) and it wasn’t so great with that sewn in keeper. Maybe some keeper surgery is in order because it really is a great strap.
Hi Peter, danke für das Video. Das Tang Buckle habe ich soeben direkt in 21mm bestellt. Das Strap wird großartig an meiner Union Glashütte Belisar Sport Datum aussehen. 👌 Beste Grüße aus Germany. 🙋♂
They have considerable thickness to them. I use them on my SLA043 Seiko diver with the original fat spring bars that come on the watch..awesome combo 👍
Hi Peter, I have a question for you. I like the straps and clasps but my question is if these straps work well with a Girard Perregaux Sea Hawk. The Sea Hawk have curved pins so how does it go together? Originally the GP clasp do not need holes in the strap. It’s more like cut to fit. Do you make those as well? Please let me/us know.
@@PeterKotsa for the Omega style clasp to sit properly under the wrist it needs to be used with an Omega style strap, where the "short" side strap is nearly the same length as the long side. Otherwise it will wear uncomfortably off center.
Love your content! I would love to see you review the Formex ESSENCE ThirtyNine "Deployant" Clasp with Fine Adjustment. It looks like they make one of the best clasps in the industry. But I can't say for sure since I havent tried it yet. Keep up the good work.
So after seeing several comments about the formex clasp I went and looked it up. Very, very impressive - kind of puts these older style of deplo clasps to shame. My curiosity is certainly piqued and I hope yours is too; I'd enjoy seeing a quality review of them.
I have never owned a sailcloth strap. However, when I do finally buy one, I'm going straight to the top (quality wise) and buying an Artem! They just look so comfortable! Question - is it leather or rubber on the interior of the strap? If leather, I dont imagine they do well with the summer heat, right? I just cant tell if its rubber or leather. Thanks!
At first I noticed the extra bulk underneath my wrist but I eventually got used to it. I think deployants are awesome (especially the "Omega style") as they make donning and doffing a watch easy and feel more like a bracelet.
The Artem straps are beautiful, there is no doubt about it. Unfortunately their customer isn't as good and I didn't enjoy the experience I had with them. I ordered a strap and next day the order was cancelled by them due to stock shortage. Only one day later the straps restocked. Frankly I felt the mickey taken out of me and to this day I lost the desire to order again from them. But that doesn't change the fact that these straps and clasps are superb. Nice one Pete! 👍
That’s unfortunate Alex, I think you were probably caught in between a re stocking period. As for myself and so many others I’ve heard or read comments, their customer service is exceptional Sorry to hear about your experience 🙏
Looking at it closely, I don't see any reason why not..obviously the width of the leather would have to be the same as the sailcloth..it should work cheers
Hey Peter, just a question. What's the point of these clasps? I'm old school, & I find normal straps secure, so I'm not really sure of the benefits. Like it raises the price considerably, so I'm just wondering is it just for looks? Because I do like the look of them, they look premium.
The deployant clasps are designed to save the strap from long term damage. When using a standard tang buckle, the strap end is faded through as its put through. The deployant doesn't bend the actual strap cheers
I have some deployants (not ARTEM) and I was impressed in the beginning but now I have gone off all of them - they are too complicated for what they need to do. Yes, they do prevent distorting and bending the strap around the buckle and tang, but releasing them always is a pain and if the bead that goes through the hole in the strap is not a firm fit it keeps falling out. But the big part is taking the watch off. With a buckle, you have a firm grasp on the strap when undoing it, the watch can't really fall. With a deployant, the most you can grasp is two spring pushers if you are lucky, then the mechanism opens up and it's a game of grab the bit that just moved to not drop the watch. I've switched back to buckles and tangs everywhere I can. But, the engineers in me can at least appreciate the idea
Butterfly style deployants where you have to snap down the sides _and then_ tuck the tail end under the keeper are a lot of fuckery and hassle IMO. My favorite is the Omega style that Peter doesn't like.
the Tongue buckle of the Artem straps is very flat, hope they make it a little bit curvey so it won't put a big gap between the strap and the buckle itself after fastening.
I can tell you that RM model is the better one cause of the screw. First one, if its only pressure holding the space hole ( I'm really bending my vocabulary here) it can casually go out when the strap is braked in. But, these deployant clasps are way superior for the longevity of the strap than the standard one. You just have to get use to the metal beneath... it's a little different feeling than the regular buckle (you need more space for it). Artem here looks really nice.
Maybe if you connect several straps back to front then you can achieve 18 inches..😂 I don't think the 3/4 will come into play when we're talking 18 inches ??? lol
@@PeterKotsa it a big problem getting leather good straps for my rist my father past away and he had bout us all citezenpro masters had to get spair links to fit does Watch companies nut cater for larger rist sizes 🙄 thanks for your help
@@mitchellgreenhowe7891 Sorry to hear about your father.. I thought you were playing around when you said you had an 18 inch wrist. I can see now its s typo..obviously you have an 8 inch and 3/4, correct?
Rado do a nice deployment clasp, it has an extension that opens up to get the strap over your wrist. The tail is tucked away omega style, so very neat and comfortable. None of the clasp comes into contact with your wrist. I don't personally see the point of a deployment clasp where you still have keepers ? All that metal clasp touching your skin, it's a poor design in my opinion. Rados is very slimline , and yet strong. The whole point to a deployment clasp is hide the tail and do away with the keepers , giving a luxury feel. Let's be honest a lot of straps have keepers that stretch over time and start moving about , very annoying. A good deployment strap eliminates this. Nice try but no cigar this time old bud. Lol.
I really don’t want to be THAT guy, but I must confess I was disappointed with my Artem sailcloth band. I didn’t buy a deployant clasp (although I wish I had). The band looked fantastic on my watch (and on my wrist), and was comfortable. The problem was that it cracked badly around the clasp holes, because of the bending required to insert the end of the band (which is pretty firm and unyielding) into the tabs/holders. Oh well. The band lasted about 6 or 8 months before the cracking started. Such is life…
I will give you everything looks nice and "premium" but those people are out of their tits charging over $300 for a rubber/sail cloth strap with chinese deployment buckle! I have a leather craftsman that custom cuts alligator straps any color under the sun with a deployment clasp , all hand sewn. Beautiful work , shipped for $90! Alligator and Crocodile leather!!! That Artum is ripping off the watch community! Just because you have the money to buy a Rolex doesn't mean you should purposely rip them off.
Awesome, this was exactly the info I was after. I recently purchased a strap from artem with the matching deployant. I still haven't received them yet, and I was a little hesitant about the deployant. This video is making me feel a bit more confident about my purchase. Thanking you muchly. 💜❤
Decent engineering from down under! My feeling is that Artem is pioneering with those clasp innovations. Nice video mate 👌
Thanks Erik
I just received the BP FF deployant after 3 weeks waiting for delivery. I had my Breitling Superocean heritage ii on a blue/white stich Artem strap. I was able to get a decent fit with the stock tag but this deployant made it feel like a new watch. They are very good quality and up there with OEM deployant's for well under $100 UDS. The polish finish is superb and a great match to the finish on my watch. I think I can cut off the loose keeper as it just fits so well. Thanks for the video.
Ever had a look at Formex deployants?
Micro adjust (yes!), light and stylish, makes every other clasp feel prehistoric.
This video popped up in my feed today somehow. Well timed. I actually ordered a 23mm strap and deployant from Artem just the other day. The deployant is a decent investment, but I thought it was worth it. Your video just gave me lots of reassurance. 👍
Enjoy 👍👍
Thanks for the video and quick response! I'll definitely be ordering myself a couple of these clasps.
BUT what is the width of the buckle at the buckle end, to know what is the strap width? I assume you are quoting the lug width at the watch end... strap width at buckle end?
I had the same question. The website doesn't state the width of the Blancpain and RM style buckles. Are they 18, 20mm at the buckle end? I also wanted to know if they are compatible with other aftermarket straps. It looks like the straps have particularly large holes, so the posts on the deployants might not fit other straps. The straps look great, but the XL selection is very limited.
@@MichaelG1986 I believe they are 18mm at buckle end, but you are right will they fit other straps. The blanpain FF buckle I think is 20mm at the buckle end. Probably the only way is to buy them and try/ see if they fit.
@@stevenuk Thanks for the reply. I have largish 7.5 inch wrists, so usually get longer straps. The ARTEM site sells only one iteration in XL - at 20mm lug width. I have several watches the straps would look great on, but unfortunately, they're 22mm lug watches. If they had a 22mm size in XL I'd buy one or more and some buckles in a flash.
Hi Steven, sorry for the late reply, I have been a little preoccupied
The width at the buckle end is 17.8-17.9mm (in that range)
Hope that helps mate 👍
Omega-style is the only one I really "understand." What's the point of having a deployant where you still have to tuck the tail end in to the keeper? Seems like extra steps and hassle.
That's how most deployant clasps work. They are more useful on leather than other strap materials, since the act of bending leather to put it through a tang buckle can put some serious wear on the leather-- not good if you've paid $100+ USD for a custom/OEM strap!
I have the ”omega-style” deployant clasp from Artem, and I am totally happy with it
@@cedarcanoe The bead on the Omega style clasp is smaller than the hole. Is there any play?
Some people want to maintain the traditional watch strap look. With the omega you don’t get that. I personally prefer how the strap looks when the end is going through the keeper. But if you don’t care about that the omega would be the way to go.
The omega style is a much cleaner look. Not extra strap visible. Its all hidden under your wrist.
Hi Peter. Looks fantastic overall. How do you find the quick release spring bars? Are they well built and quality made in the same manner as the buckles? Thanks.
Absolutely. They look and feel like they will easily go the distance..
Cheers
@@PeterKotsa Thank you very much :)
When the Blancpain style is closed, how many mm thick is it? Height-wise sitting on the wrist. I have an OEM Omega Rang Buckle, and it is the slimmest buckle I have ever had?
Great video mate. Keep up the good work.
I measure it in at around 7 to 8 mm give our take
cheers
Very nice. I have an Artem strap with tang buckle. A deployant one may be in order.
Very nice tend to find the cheaper ones pinch you as you close or feel uncomfortable, definitely something il look at as an alternative
Thanks for the review. I always wonder how these clasps work.
Which Deployant Clasps do you like the best out of those two? im about to buy one. im leaning towards the richard mill version.
The RM is very comfortable you can't go wrong
I now use the Omega deployments on their new loop less sailcloth straps..thats my preference
cheers Mike
I picked one of these straps up a while back but I can’t stand a buckle. I tried one of my Ocean Crawler deployant clasps (omega style) and it wasn’t so great with that sewn in keeper. Maybe some keeper surgery is in order because it really is a great strap.
great video! which clasp would you recommend for a panerai with a 22mm (at the lug) to 20mm (at buckle) strap?
Personally I’d go either with loopless and Omega style clasp
Ir the hybrid which I’ve been really enjoying lately
Yiasou Peter / Petro do you have straps that tuck the excess strap under the buckle instead of over the buckle ?? Thanks!
The new Artem loopless ones do that
Hi Peter, danke für das Video. Das Tang Buckle habe ich soeben direkt in 21mm bestellt. Das Strap wird großartig an meiner Union Glashütte Belisar Sport Datum aussehen. 👌 Beste Grüße aus Germany. 🙋♂
Enjoy when it arrives 👍
Hi, thanks for these reviews. What’s the thickness of these artem straps (near the lugs). Would they be suitable for heavy divers?
They have considerable thickness to them.
I use them on my SLA043 Seiko diver with the original fat spring bars that come on the watch..awesome combo 👍
@@PeterKotsa thanks! Appreciate the reply!
Hi Peter,
I have a question for you.
I like the straps and clasps but my question is if these straps work well with a Girard Perregaux Sea Hawk. The Sea Hawk have curved pins so how does it go together? Originally the GP clasp do not need holes in the strap. It’s more like cut to fit. Do you make those as well?
Please let me/us know.
Fantastic video! Thanks for the detailed shots. What would you recommend for a small wrist?
I think the RM style is ideal for small wrists..
cheers
@@PeterKotsa thank you!
lovely clasps! ordering one soon!
Nice. Deployant clasps tend to be a bit bulky so nice to see the RM one being so thin.
I think it compliments the strap perfectly 👍
The clasp is the only thing part of RM watches, lol
They look well engineered, better than the old style that keep undoing
These definitely look to be of a higher quality than the all polished, chintzy, butterfly junk that I usually see.
Great showcase of the clasps. Between the Omega and RM styles, which would you recommend for a tighter fit (for a smaller wrist)?
I don't like the Omega style, for me the RM for sure...
cheers
@@PeterKotsa for the Omega style clasp to sit properly under the wrist it needs to be used with an Omega style strap, where the "short" side strap is nearly the same length as the long side. Otherwise it will wear uncomfortably off center.
Love your content! I would love to see you review the Formex ESSENCE ThirtyNine "Deployant" Clasp with Fine Adjustment. It looks like they make one of the best clasps in the industry. But I can't say for sure since I havent tried it yet.
Keep up the good work.
So after seeing several comments about the formex clasp I went and looked it up. Very, very impressive - kind of puts these older style of deplo clasps to shame. My curiosity is certainly piqued and I hope yours is too; I'd enjoy seeing a quality review of them.
formex essence thirtynine deployant
How strong is the RM style strap. I have one on the way but I am a bit worried about putting an expinsive watch on a spring loaded strap
The spring bars are very firm, I’ve not had any issues with any of them
I have never owned a sailcloth strap. However, when I do finally buy one, I'm going straight to the top (quality wise) and buying an Artem! They just look so comfortable!
Question - is it leather or rubber on the interior of the strap? If leather, I dont imagine they do well with the summer heat, right? I just cant tell if its rubber or leather. Thanks!
The strap is designed to be water-resistant, so its not leather. I have not had any issue with mine in water 👍
cheers
Wow, thanks Peter 🤔👍.
I think it would be helpful to see you wearing these with a watch. I'm thinking of buying a deployant clasp but I'm wondering if it's comfortable.
At first I noticed the extra bulk underneath my wrist but I eventually got used to it. I think deployants are awesome (especially the "Omega style") as they make donning and doffing a watch easy and feel more like a bracelet.
Ive got a few snaps and short vids on Instagram if you like..cheers
Tag heuer makes an excellent style imho. One can convert most straps to work in the clasp style.
Great design and excellent fit and finish. Any possibility of Artem producing an 18mm deployment clasp?
Will the clips work on other straps?
Not sure, I have not tried them on other straps
The Artem straps are beautiful, there is no doubt about it. Unfortunately their customer isn't as good and I didn't enjoy the experience I had with them. I ordered a strap and next day the order was cancelled by them due to stock shortage. Only one day later the straps restocked. Frankly I felt the mickey taken out of me and to this day I lost the desire to order again from them. But that doesn't change the fact that these straps and clasps are superb. Nice one Pete! 👍
That’s unfortunate Alex, I think you were probably caught in between a re stocking period. As for myself and so many others I’ve heard or read comments, their customer service is exceptional
Sorry to hear about your experience 🙏
Great video but I wonder if I could fit the clasp onto my leather strap?
Looking at it closely, I don't see any reason why not..obviously the width of the leather would have to be the same as the sailcloth..it should work
cheers
@@PeterKotsa
Thanks for the review, i want to fit also one(50 fathoms) to a Leather strap, you know what is the max thikness of the strap to fit?🇧🇪
@@peterspaepen2861 not sure myself..
Hey Peter, just a question. What's the point of these clasps? I'm old school, & I find normal straps secure, so I'm not really sure of the benefits. Like it raises the price considerably, so I'm just wondering is it just for looks? Because I do like the look of them, they look premium.
The deployant clasps are designed to save the strap from long term damage.
When using a standard tang buckle, the strap end is faded through as its put through. The deployant doesn't bend the actual strap
cheers
@@PeterKotsa thanks mate. Love your videos. Hopefully this lockdown ends soon, I'm also in Melbourne.
@@antdenzic7977 yeah, best of luck to both of us bro..
I have some deployants (not ARTEM) and I was impressed in the beginning but now I have gone off all of them - they are too complicated for what they need to do. Yes, they do prevent distorting and bending the strap around the buckle and tang, but releasing them always is a pain and if the bead that goes through the hole in the strap is not a firm fit it keeps falling out.
But the big part is taking the watch off. With a buckle, you have a firm grasp on the strap when undoing it, the watch can't really fall. With a deployant, the most you can grasp is two spring pushers if you are lucky, then the mechanism opens up and it's a game of grab the bit that just moved to not drop the watch. I've switched back to buckles and tangs everywhere I can.
But, the engineers in me can at least appreciate the idea
Butterfly style deployants where you have to snap down the sides _and then_ tuck the tail end under the keeper are a lot of fuckery and hassle IMO. My favorite is the Omega style that Peter doesn't like.
Hey, Pete. What is the price of the clasps ? Great video as always. Greetings from Croatia.
Here is a link to their website with all the pricing : artemstraps.com/collections/accessories
cheers Dorian 👍
@@PeterKotsa thank you 😁
They are nice and was looking to purchase one but wow are they pricey!
the Tongue buckle of the Artem straps is very flat, hope they make it a little bit curvey so it won't put a big gap between the strap and the buckle itself after fastening.
do these clasps work with leather straps? i don't like these straps but i like the clasps.
I’m sure they do, you just need the same size (width) strap
Cheers
Man I wish you would have showed how to remove the original tang buckle and how to install the RM deployant.
Great review👍 How I wish they also made leather strap versions….😢 I dont really wear sailcloth straps, but these clasps looks slim and comfortable.
Yeah, hopefully they can branch out with some more variety. These Sailcloth are excellent, would love to see what else they bring to the table 👍👍
There is nothing stopping you from buying a deployment clasp and putting it on a leather strap
You can buy the strap separately luckily. I am buying one for my grand Seiko
Does water penetrate and soak like a nato or does it bead and run off like a rubber strap?
I suppose it depends on the nato itself (if it has some sort of waterproofing on it)
Cheers
Clasps work in any strap? Or only artem straps?
I have-not tried them on other straps, but I don't see any reason why they shouldn't work
cheers
Great share, thanks
I can tell you that RM model is the better one cause of the screw. First one, if its only pressure holding the space hole ( I'm really bending my vocabulary here) it can casually go out when the strap is braked in.
But, these deployant clasps are way superior for the longevity of the strap than the standard one. You just have to get use to the metal beneath... it's a little different feeling than the regular buckle (you need more space for it).
Artem here looks really nice.
Unless I'm mistaken, isn't it the Blancpain model that uses the two piece screw and the RM that uses the fixed stud?
Will it fit my 18 and 3/4inch rist thanks
Maybe if you connect several straps back to front then you can achieve 18 inches..😂
I don't think the 3/4 will come into play when we're talking 18 inches ???
lol
@@PeterKotsa it a big problem getting leather good straps for my rist my father past away and he had bout us all citezenpro masters had to get spair links to fit does Watch companies nut cater for larger rist sizes 🙄 thanks for your help
@@mitchellgreenhowe7891 Sorry to hear about your father..
I thought you were playing around when you said you had an 18 inch wrist.
I can see now its s typo..obviously you have an 8 inch and 3/4, correct?
@@PeterKotsa thanks never noticed it my self 18 Inc rist lol😂
@@PeterKotsa you have me in tears never noticed 😂💯❤️buddy
Perfect rubber replacement on a everyday toolwatch. Fancy enough to be an alternative to black leather at the office!
It’s a lot
More hardware under your wrist tho compared to just a tang and buckle strap.. I don’t see the advantage here?
I have the Artem strap in 20 m with white stitching. It’s not for me, does anyone want it for free?
Wore it once and found it uncomfortable
Hey Rory give it a few days on the wrist (I found my white stitched one was also a tad stiffer than the black variant
Cheers
Hey Rory give it a few days on the wrist (I found my white stitched one was also a tad stiffer than the black variant
Cheers
The one with the screw seems a bit useless to me. You need to carry a screwdriver with you incase your wrist swells during the day
Rado do a nice deployment clasp, it has an extension that opens up to get the strap over your wrist. The tail is tucked away omega style, so very neat and comfortable. None of the clasp comes into contact with your wrist. I don't personally see the point of a deployment clasp where you still have keepers ? All that metal clasp touching your skin, it's a poor design in my opinion. Rados is very slimline , and yet strong. The whole point to a deployment clasp is hide the tail and do away with the keepers , giving a luxury feel. Let's be honest a lot of straps have keepers that stretch over time and start moving about , very annoying. A good deployment strap eliminates this. Nice try but no cigar this time old bud. Lol.
But I don't smoke 😂😂
@@PeterKotsa , well I will have one for you then, lol. Probably drive you to drink will all the annoying comments, lol.
These straps are cheap nylon looking sailcloth straps i ordered one and wish I could return it but cannot
Why aren't there micro-adjustments on deployant clasps for straps? So annoying.
Yes, have to buy formex clasp over this with the adjustment
I really don’t want to be THAT guy, but I must confess I was disappointed with my Artem sailcloth band. I didn’t buy a deployant clasp (although I wish I had). The band looked fantastic on my watch (and on my wrist), and was comfortable. The problem was that it cracked badly around the clasp holes, because of the bending required to insert the end of the band (which is pretty firm and unyielding) into the tabs/holders. Oh well. The band lasted about 6 or 8 months before the cracking started. Such is life…
Drop Artem an email and see what they say
@@PeterKotsa Thanks, mate. I sent them an email. Let’s see what happens…
@@jmw3938 on a side note, i have had zero issues with the deployant clasp, it takes the 'folding or bending' issue out of the picture
i'm grasping the clasping
😂😂
I will give you everything looks nice and "premium" but those people are out of their tits charging over $300 for a rubber/sail cloth strap with chinese deployment buckle! I have a leather craftsman that custom cuts alligator straps any color under the sun with a deployment clasp , all hand sewn. Beautiful work , shipped for $90! Alligator and Crocodile leather!!! That Artum is ripping off the watch community! Just because you have the money to buy a Rolex doesn't mean you should purposely rip them off.
Diese Schliesse verstehe ich nicht.
The RM one sucks. Waste of money
People who say Cartier isn't a real watch company or a high horology brand clearly need to check their history