How Austin's Allegro briskly took BL to bankruptcy
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- Опубліковано 3 чер 2021
- The Allegro was supposed to be a fresh start for Austin after being starved of resources in the 1960s. It replaced the highly successful Austin/Morris 1100 and 1300, and was a well-funded project to take on the might of Ford in the UK, and European car manufacturers on the continent. So, why was the Allegro nicknamed “All Aggro” by some, and the “flying pig” by others?
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Sources:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austin_...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMC_ADO16
www.aronline.co.uk/concepts-a...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austin_...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morris_...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_Hay...)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrola...
www.aronline.co.uk/cars/austi...
www.aronline.co.uk/concepts-a...
www.aronline.co.uk/concepts-a...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innocenti
www.aronline.co.uk/cars/austi...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renault_5
www.macsmotorcitygarage.com/r...
classiccars.brightwells.com/vi...
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In about 1985 my dad went around a corner in our purple allegro and the back door I was leaning up against swung open resulting in me rolling along the tarmac splitting my head open. This is why I remember our allegro, it also had a rust hole in the floor
This must be why they made seatbelts mandatory for all passengers.
Same thing happened to me as a kid, in a Swedish car of all things, known for their safety?
@@Hattonbank it's something I will never forget, and I have the scar to remind me
Never had a problem with allegro doors opening on corners, this was common on cortinas😅
Jeez
One man stood up and said let's fit a square steering wheel, and instead of everyone throwing pens at him they all nodded and said hmmm square, good idea lmfaooo ❤️❤️❤️
A truly dreadful car. I remember going into a BL showroom with my Dad (a chartered mechanical engineer) to see one of the first Allegros and being very embarassed by his undisguised contempt for the shoddy workmanship. He actually bent the front bumper out of shape with the fingers of one hand. I'll never forget the look on the salesman's face!
I would love to see someone bending a chromed steel bumper with their fingers😂
@@petemaxwell1136 you had to be there.
@@davidtaylor8822 I would have liked to have been there to see that😁
😂😂
Did the salesman say anything?
My dad bought a brand new All Aggro soon after it came out. A few months later he was driving in the dark, went over a bump, and all the lights went out! Scary and very dangerous. It appears that none of the wires going into and out of the fuse box had actually been soldered! His next car was a Fiat.
That's an hilarious story
wonderful cars but doubt lasted due to rust
@@goodwood-rc4nxhow a car this bad and ugly can be wonderful?
@@traviswalker8933I think they are good looking
His next car was a Fiat.... The poor man must have been a glutton for punishment.. 😂
My friends dad and his mate bought one around the same time. My friends dads car had an awkward lump in the boot that his mates car didn’t have. He put a screwdriver under it and it popped off, revealing a closed cigarette packet that had been thrown in the boot and sprayed over! And people hanker for the good old days. This would never happen at British Nissan or Toyota factories.
I wondered where my packet of Benson & Hedges went that day. 😉
Ah, the golden days of British Industry!
In the american car factories back they they left soda cans in the doors.
Back in the 70's I had an uncle who ran back street garage and was always being offered all sorts of plastic bags full of BL car parts i.e. top and bottom ball joints, brake components etc. I think there was more parts being stolen than there were being fitted to cars in the factory.
British Leland...No other manufacturer offers a free pack of cigs with every purchase...
Apparently when the last Allegro Equippe was sold, the designer was given a wooden spoon. But my Dad had one as a company car, and although the headroom was not really good enough for me in the back, the engine was fantastically torquey when I was learning to drive. It was a 'put it in 5th gear and leave it there even going up Telegraph Hill in Devon' sort of engine. and in my view, the relatively fat 175 tyres finally made it look right. It was a design that needed fat tyres to work.
Fat pig looking car, fat tyres. makes sense.
To think: BL made a bunch of hatchback-shaped cars,… that weren’t hatchbacks, in a time when hatchbacks were en vogue.
That encapsulates British Leyland management in a nutshell.
Had the Allegro been at 'Japanese' level of build quality as well as been reliable; that alone would've garnered many more sales and, especially good will. With all those perks in hand, Austin could've easily added a hatchback and, still be making $$$
Compare the All Aggro to the Alfasud . The Alfasud , to give it its due handled and cornered well , but the inboard front discs were prone to shatter from thermal shock due to insufficient cooling .
They did a rework of the Princess too with an actual hatchback and called it the "Ambassador" 👍
@@PhilipBallGarry
After it had already been a failure…
Maybe people believed that fastback meant hatchback
Harris Mann said in an interview that he hadn't been told that the E series engine was to be used. And while the Mk2 Escort was more stylish, it rusted at the sight of water, while the Allegro was very rust-resistant than most of ots competitors.
"... to make sure that the doors really do fit." (12:50)
Stunning attention to quality, not seen anywhere else.
That's why I included that quote. I found it crazy they'd have to check that, or even that it would be pointed out!
I assume on the regular Allegro the doors didnt fit then ?. They certainly didnt on my 1980 Maxi. You had to slam the doors so hard the glass nearly smashed. Just to get them to latch.
I remember watching that documentary about Vanden Plas, and as soon as I heard that comment I knew that the management of BL would be throwing up their hands in despair. Supposedly a compliment, but absolutely deadly in marketing terms.
@@herseem or maybe rubbing their chinn, wondering; “Hmmmmm, maybe we should try that next? ............. Nahh, Joe Public never wanted doors that fit,,,,,,,,,, or shuts”.
@@BigCar2 I'm still in doubt why they put that line in the script. Perhaps the PR people had no idea what the workers at VandenPlas were actually doing and just made stuff up. Or the BL-built coachwork was indeed so shoddy that the doors barely fit, and VandenPlas had to redo it just to reach a quality level that might justify the price.
Either way it was a PR disaster.
Leyland made quite a habit of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory
My grandfather got an early Allegro with all it's "features" like water leaks and so. After grandpa passed away, the car remained in the family until the garage issuing the annual roadworthy certificate politly asked not to come again next year... :-)
I had one and can confirm: Overtaking had to be planned two miles before the event, rust was a real problem, the suspension was actually really good and comfortable, controls were adequate, economy was adequate, parts availability was very good. Why did it go? I put mine into reverse and the wheels did just that but the car stood still - ripped the control arms clean from the bodywork.
Could have been much better I suppose but I do miss it!
God love you Brits and your understatement. "My car split itself in two. It wasn't bad. Could've been a little better, but overall ok." 🤣
*”It doesn’t even have four doors! What was my father thinking?”*
_- Richard Hammond on the Allegro estate his dad had, The Grand Tour (S3 E14)_
Didn't that one get destroyed in a despicable act of violence?
Richard Hammond is irritating , has nothing worthwhile to say and in my view a bit or a prat.
Hammond the little tosser
Yeah, but for a single guy with two giant home-built domestic loudspeakers to carry around, a second-hand Allegro estate was fantastic value in the mid-80's. And I'd modded the engine so heavily that when I had a prang in my MkII Allegro estate, I bought a MkIII and had my local garage transfer the engine and gearbox to it. So my MkIII estate had a MkII engine that had been rebuilt by a former Rolls-Royce engineer with parts heavily modified by Mini-spares and Mini Sport. Great companies.
@@retr0naut823 I'm sure he's got a lot of good things to say about you as well, old boy.
Ah, the car that defined my childhood - an orange P-reg Allegro with plastic seats that burned in summer. It died a slow, painful death due to lack of servicing, plus a windscreen replacement that rusted the floor away as it let in so much water we did the "Jaws" theme every time we went in it. I think my dad paid the scrap yard to take it!
the wheel fell off my uncles allegro on the motorway, he didn't realise until he pulled off about 100 miles later.
I'm very thankful of that kind of content. The combo of BL mishaps and the thorough use of Lucas Electric parts is always fascinating to me
Ah, yes, Lucas, Prince of Darkness!
I was an apprentice for two ‘leyland’ companies in the early 80’s. I can tell you now that workers taking home car parts was rife. Downing tools at the drop of a hat was rife. Hatred towards management was rife. It’s no wonder the British car industry went down the pan... The camaraderie was brilliant though and we had a great time - pretty good pay, easy work and good redundancy pay offs. With hindsight it was the unions that were really the spoke in the wheels of industry back then. In my opinion.
I never had an Allegro but I had a few Triumph Dolomite Sprints (which required new sills at only 4 years old) and Maestro and Montegos. Gosh. Cars were shite back then.. I’ve got a 2001 BMW X5 that I’ve had for 8 years and it’s still going strong after 20yrs. Just shows how engineering has advanced.
I wonder if a 2021 car will be around in 2031..
He failed mention that these little wonders didn't rust. The preceding 1100/1300 and the following Maestro were complete rot boxes. Most Allegros probably lasted 10-15 years /100k miles with OK reliability. I agree that we seem to have gone through a period (say mid 90s to early 2010s) where cars were built to last much longer, I have an 03 Freelander thats still rot free. But new cars won't last as they are far too complex with small highly stressed engines designed for "environmental" criteria, the irony being they are less reliable and need replacing years earlier.
There were similar tales about the Ford Halewood plant, plenty of new spares on sale in the pubs, and special order cars having extras fitted on the line for employees to buy, but yes BL were worse.
Thanks for the video, very interesting.
Around? Sure, allowed to travel in certain cities? Probably not!
You know how "keep the diesel and old cars out of our city" plans go!
It is almost a shame but it makes sense that you see electro-restomodding done to old cars.
@@johndoyle4723 Worse? The word you're looking for is 'Better'.
@@simonroyle2806 To be fair, any cars suffered with rust back then.
When it comes to quartic steering wheels the Ferrari LaFerrari is clearly the Austin Allegro's spiritual successor!
I hear it is also faster in reverse.
@@BillLaBrie I think you'll find the Ferrari is probably faster in reverse than the Allegro is going forwards
@@herseem Hearsay. I want a test.
Dodge had a square steering wheel in the 50s
I took my driving test in an Allegro. The radiator sprang a leak on the way to the test centre and we patched it with Radweld for the test. It held together and I passed first time.
Parents had an Equipe which they ordered with a black vinyl roof. It was fun to drive and was pretty quick for the day. It was also completely reliable.
I love my Allegro LE. Only three left on the roads. 200 or so Allegros in general left.
Three too many.
@@KarlHamilton Thanks for that, I intend to keep it on the roads for many years to come to annoy the likes of you .
I had a Marina TC, it was an equally awful car but.......
Rear wheel drive and terrible rear leaf springs LOTS OF FUN 👍👍👍
You know its a bad car when there are still more Lada Rivas on the road 40 years later. 👍
@@retr0naut823 what do you like about it?
When I was a kid in the late 70s and 80s the Allegro was everywhere, even we had an estate version for a bit and it was lovely and to ride in, I remember me and my sister loved the striped seats, it was an Allegro 2 from the 80s
I served my apprenticeship on the BL range. The Allegro was a breath of fresh air at the time, being so easy to work on compared to the other cars in the range. This helped to keep them reliable as long as the service schedule was adhered to. I actually quite liked them.
They actually weren't as bad as people make them out to be. They were just pig ugly
In the eighties I had an Allegro, which after 50,000 miles was drinking around a litre of oil every 100 miles. My wife worked at the Porsche importers in Reading and got a couple of the guys in the workshop to re-build the engine. They built it so tight that they couldn't start it, so had to tow it along the A4 at around 40 mph and then crash it into second gear. So we had the only Allegro with an engine built by Porsche engineers.
Did it at least work somewhat fine after that?
Also, the things that must have gone through the Porsche guys' minds when they saw BL's legendary precision...🤣
@@doctoremil2678 The engine was brilliant after the rebuild - not quite a 911 but at least there wasn't a cloud of blue smoke in the rear view mirror - unfortunately the body let it down badly and I sold it for not very much. One other story - I parked the car in a Unipart spares carpark to buy a can of spray paint, came back, unlocked the door and was about to get in the car when I noticed that someone had fitted car seat covers and furry dice to the mirror. Wrong car. I think I could have unlocked it and my car with an ice lolly stick, let alone the wrong key.
The Allegro was nowhere near as bad as the motoring press made it out to be. We had an 1100, an Escort, a Cortina, two Allegros and a Maestro in the family garage over the seventies, eighties and early nineties. Dad went back to Allegro after Cortina and then on to Maestro. He found the Fords to be more form than function which for him, an engineer, was missing the point of a car. He always thought that a car was there to do a job which was not simply to look good.
My father was a product of his time and would be in his trademark blue overalls maintaining and servicing (tinkering) with the family car most weekends. The only car that let us down in terms of unexpected breakdowns was a mk3 Cortina. The only reason a Maestro appeared was to accommodate the arrival of grandchildren.
My Dad: a Saturday tinkerer and family man fondly missed.
Your dad sounds like a top guy!
Thanks for that……. …
Michael Goode wrote :~
"
The Allegro was nowhere near as bad as the motoring press made it out to be"
100% Agree based on my "hands on" experience of two. Same with the Marina Coupe I had. Got images of all my cars over the years. Vauxhalls and Fords owned or company cars provided maybe looked better, but were far less reliable.
Herr Clarkson and his brainwashed followers have a lot to answer for.
@@mgjohn8534 Clarkson doesn't like Porsche 911's either. He just likes to stir controversy.
@@PhilUKNet In my opinion ...
The worst Motoring Journalist ...
IN THE WORLD!
Interesting the “bizarre” add for the regent in Italy is a take off on Steven Spielberg’s first movie “Duel”
Yes, so it was. I didn't notice that.
I caught that too
Duel, the movie that inspired me to become a truck driver.
@@americansupervillain4595 Did you keep track of how many cars you ran off the road?😟
And fair to say the Allegro looks much more inspired than the Mk3 Plymouth Valiant.
My parents bought one new in 1978. Within days they noticed oil leaks on the drive and called the dealer. The workshop foreman came round to tell them it was a design fault with the sealing washer to the sump, nothing they could do! In the Winter it was slightly warmer leaving the heater off than on (seriously, I do not exaggerate). Bearings in two wheels went after just two years and cost a fortune to replace, £115 in 1980, and repairs kept coming year after year. My father sold it three years later and to my amazement bought a Marina! You can guess the rest.....
I had an Allegro 1.3 HL
To be fair. Its was a good car... It got me around, never let me down, was serviceable at home with very basic tools
The 1.3 was undoubtedly the best variant, enough power without the gearchange & weight woes the bigger E series powered versions inherited.
I must confess I had a brown one, with brown interior, about summed it up
We had an Allegro Equipe 1750 (twin carbs btw), interestingly you could opt for simpler and narrower coachline stripes (same colour red & orange) not Starsky and Hutch swoops so we did just that. Passed my test in that car. V reg. Happy days foglights, deep black air dam and corroding alloys!
My dad had one in the 70s. Steering wheel was the only thing at the time that had the Mickey taken out of it at the time. Always had affection for the car especially the front wheel drive. Appreciated the breaks as well as there was one incident when in the snow it stopped quite well in icy conditions when I was certain we were going slide into the car in front. Can't remember any mechanical problems with it though it was bought new.
I remember shaking my head every day on my way to school in the late 70s as I walked past my neighbour's Allegro Vanden Plas. Timeless indeed 😁
Pavarotti had an Allegro.
Then he got a Nissan Dorma.
Ha ha, then he got a Nissan Note, Honda Concerto, Ballard, Quintet....isnt Google amazing!
Get your coat - it's been thrown into the garden.
He must have had a Prelude first!
Boom boom!
In Uruguay at the beginning of the 2000s a consignment of cars that had been confiscated in the port for more than 20 years were auctioned and these were Austin Allegro and Morris Marina from the importer of the time that had gone bankrupt; the result was that for a while we had Allegro and Marina for sale 0km in the market ...
I passed my test in one , it needed the suspension firming up a bit , & the gearchange also , so it felt less rubbery , but it went , well , never broke down , didn,t guzzle fuel , & was a basically simple car to learn on . When serviced right , a good car for it,s era . I heard all the nightmare stories , electrics catching fire , wheel bearings collapsing , but the one I used got serviced right , this made all the difference . (It belonged to an ex policeman , & the garage dare not mess HIS car up . ) All these years later I can still remember the reg, no.
Do you want to tell us what it is so we can look it up?
The difference between the concept art and the final product is amazing. How it ended up from the fairly futuristic looking and sporty car in the concept to the "grandpa mobile" is beyond me.
I can't help but like the Allegro a lot. Perhaps because I like underdogs, perhaps because I'm a huge BL apologist, perhaps because it is just a cool little car. Great video!
I thought it was pretty cool as well.
Cool car, BAD video! Known as a "flying pig" By whom? ANOTHER lie - but then that's to be expected!
@@nygelmiller5293
To be fair I've, never, ever heard them called that by anyone and I grew up around a lot of BMC and BL stuff!
Then it’s too bad that the cavalier attitude of the skin flint BL management hindered the potential of the Allegro. Harris Mann’s original design would have resulted in a much better product than what was sold.
@@nygelmiller5293 if you see him on the street are you gonna poo in your in hand and throw it at him?
This prompted me to dig out my Haynes and Autodata repair manuals I bought to keep my Bronze 1750 Sport TC and Yellow 1300 Estate on the road! I completely rebuilt the 1300 engine when it became a bit smokey. Both were bought second hand and well used. Thanks for the trip down memory lane, Big Car. :-D
You're welcome!
I’ve seen a 1980 chocolate brown Austin Allegro Vanden Plas in Glasgow a couple of years ago. Beautiful looking car.
I worked at The Birmid aluminium foundry in Smethwick in the 70s, made most engine castings and pistons for Brittish leyland. The whole town revolved around the various foundries, all gone now and all the skills as well, sad.
My father had a 1983 (?) white model with the four headlights. I'll always remember it as a capricious little monster refusing to startup on a sunday picnic morning....
Is that not a problem with most British cars? A little cloud in the sky....strip the distributor cap...Q20...reassemble....shower again...late for work. Ford Engines Kent1300 and 1600, a decade of dirty hands before work
I owned two and loved them both!
Most caring. Rog.
The Austin Morris 1100 is still a handsome design after all these years.
agreed
My grandparents had an Austin / BL dealership. As such my parents always had a demonstator car as their day to day car. Can remember when they had an Allegro and the one side of the suspension collapsed on the way back from holiday. Good old days :)
The Allegro was still underfunded. 21 million pounds were put into the Allegro’s development, when the Marina received 40 million quid for its development…
40 million on the Marina that's shocking
@@paulie-Gualtieri. Indeed, considering it was a totally conventional design.
@@paulie-Gualtieri. And the fact that (as far as I remember) the designer was told it had to be based on the running gear for the Morris Minor, FFS!
@@herseem
I know it's disgraceful
I’m glad BL went bust. They deserved it.
Thanks Big Car for the history of Austin Allegro!
You're welcome Costi!
Even though I didn’t know the existence of this car, I watched this video just to enjoy your storytelling skill! It’s such a great experience!
Cheers from Brazil!
Glad you enjoyed it. I love your printing prowess! 😉
My dad was a mechanic and loved these, he had one and it was great 👍❤
I used to work for a guy who was a car salesman back in the day. He told me that on the original models that came out that if you had a flat back tyre and went to change it, the back window would pop out, due to flex in the chassis. Made in Britain..
People jacked it up on what looked like the jacking point, but wasn't. They put stickers on it afterwards to tell them. The body shouldn't have flexed though.
www.aronline.co.uk/history/features-old-wives-tales/
I worked on police panda car allegro's and we had special bar that fitted into a trolley Jack to stop rear screen popping out, also could only Jack it up with all doors closed.....dont start on build quality
Amusing from the company that also built the Landcrab, the chassis stiffness of which wouldn't be surpassed until the 90s.
@@raytarrant514
You should have used the actual jacking point in that case, no 'special bar' required.
My favourite videos are about British Leyland cars. Big fan of the allegro thanks.
I remember seeing them as a child back in the 70's. Suffice it to say I was unimpressed even then.
Every time I learn something new about the British car industry I'm amazed at how they literally got everything wrong. I mean literally EVERYTHING.
I've been so looking forward to this! My mum owned one in the 70s. Within two weeks of taking delivery the entire engine had to be replaced under warranty. To be fair, it never gave her any trouble after that.
My Metro needed a new engine after 3950 miles - exactly £1/mile! It was a great car though.
VandenPlas is a Dutch name, and in the Dutch language, all consonants are spoken, so with the "s" at the end.
Sorry Ronald - my bad!
It was a Belgian company, but yes, a Dutch name. Belgium, Holland... almost the same! So yeah we Dutchies pronounce the S in the end. But I saw several British car vids, like the ones of the splendid Iain Tyrrell and he also pronounce it 'plah' instead of 'plas', so that must be the right English pronunciation. It was British from right after WW2, so just keep it 'plah' @Big Car
@@NLBassist I think someone thought "ah it's French", and pronounced it that way. To be honest that's what I thought - I didn't know the origin and got it wrong.
No biggie, just sounds odd to Dutch ears. Even the French would pronounce the 's' though. They're used to names not following the standard French pronunciation rules (eg Citroën, Moët & Chandon).
Hmmm.....its not Vandenplas but, Vanden Plas and even more strangely ...its in Flemish even pronounced " without " the " S" at the end.
Dont forget.....in that time the majority of the business was leaded by FRENCH speaking ppl( de upperclass still like to speak FRENCH) in Belgium!!! ( but thats not a issue for this channel 🤣) and thats the reason why its pronounced without the " S".
Even now in the 21 century, a lot off Belguim company names are pronounced the French way
Just as info offcourse 😋
I worked at Leyland in the seventies and bought a new Allegro 2 1100 in 1978. It was ok but very under-powered. The unions ran the shop floor production and all the management came from Shop Stewards. No wonder the place went bankrupt!
My first job after Uni was in Finance at Longbridge from 1977 to 1980. I got around quite a bit in the various power train plants, and saw a lot of incredible (mainly bad) things. The lack of investment in equipment over decades was astonishing. No wonder they couldn't make good power trains; most of the machines were so old they couldn't meet engineering tolerances. The industrial engineers spent hours negotiating with machine operators and shop stewards how long it should take to do an operation, and the operator would be careful not to work any faster. Even though they weren't on piece work.
My first new car (with 25% discount) was an Allegro 1300. It never broke down (unlike the following 2 TR7s), but the old A Series drank oil, and the dealer never fixed a squeak from the back suspension. traded it in after a year for a Canley built TR7.
@@originalkk882 I worked in finance at Fishers from 1978 to 1980. I was a Financial Analyst.
The only time I worked at Longbridge was 1978 for two weeks as a student doing industrial cleaning.
"The Nomad had gone down in AUS like a warm beer on a summers day"
LOL, the Aussies also said it was called that because No Mad Idiot Would Own One!
My sister's mate had a yellow one back in 1990, we called it the Flying Banana
How very optimistic
@@robertjonas6216
Not really.
I was given one as a company car, replacing a Austin 1300. The Allegro was so bad I asked for my 1300 back.
It was no worse than a lot of dross of the time
Really? Because my grandfather had them as company vehicles when he worked for BL Commercial Vehicles sales division and for the most part liked them a lot. He put a lot of miles on them in the UK and the continent as well.
I actually grew up with BMC/BL stuff and don't recall many issues and non of them serious.
You can always tell the internet trolls ,they either hound you with replys or never bother answering back .They have humteen other people they are trolling.I bet Alan Hindmarch was not even born until the 90s 00s.Also funny how his comment gets loads of likes ,but as usual no one else's does
@@LOTPOR0402 wrong I was born in the early half of the 1950s, never assume anything.
Happy to learn that wrong exterior design killed the car,
not the fact that it fell to pieces while driving.
Erratum: The Allegro was, as far as I can tell, never banned from the Mersey tunnel. I got this info from a Quentin Wilson documentary, and I presumed he'd checked his facts. However, I can't find direct evidence to say it had, and the Allegro owners club state it's not true, so there's no direct evidence to say it wasn't (but then try proving a negative!).
It was an urban legend at the time but never was the case.
@@caliom8427 The Allegro has more urban legends than any other car ever made. This makes it even more desirable to me!
@@retr0naut823 lets hear some😁
@@landmonkey22 windscreens pop out if you jack them up. Absolute rubbish. I've jacked many Allegroes up and the windscreens don't pop out.
Anybody can make something up, then say I can't prove it isn't true. The Allegro shell was more rigid than the 1100/1300 it replaced. The whole video is riddled with inaccuracies. You might at least try to get your facts right. I can't be bothered to list all of them. The Vanden Plas used the 1500 cc OHC engine as standard, some owners requested the 1750 and it was fitted. They are the same engine and not much different in power outputs. The reason why the Escort outsold the Allegro was because BL turned their back on fleet car sales as it was hardly profitable. A decision I'm sure they came to regret as they lost market share and hence critical mass. The Allegro estate had no issues with its nose in the air, unless greatly overloaded, as the hydrogas compensates for the loading. I have one incidentally.
My family had Austin HA van/ Mini / 1100/ 2 Marina”s / Allegro / Hillman Imp/ Chevette / over a period of 10 years or so.....so I had a great time experiencing the best and worst of the British car industry......👍🇮🇲👌
At last somebody mentioned the Hillman Imp. You have my sincere condolences.
@@Gary-Seven-and-Isis-in-1968 It wasn’t any old Hillman Imp , it was an ex works Rally car , in blue with the Black bonnet , full cage / suspension/ and a tuned motor , not particularly reliable , but my uncle had it for over a year till a front track rod broke and he put it in a ditch 👍🇮🇲
@@ManxAndy To have a head gasket last for more than a week would have been miraculous enough in a Gimp.
Over a year and to be written off in a unique fashion only goes to further embellish life's rich tapestry. 😂
Hopefully your Uncle got out OK.
O
@@ManxAndy Me Too - (The Imp's huge amounts of interior paint was chilly on romantic flesh in the winter) - Anyway Engine seized and locked rear wheels and tank slapped for a while and then somersaulted over a hedge and landed roof down, was a new driver and in the moment thought something had happened to the steering - Next five years was in a Saab 96 two stroke now that really was a great car!
My mother had one in the 70s and 80’s. Lovely comfortable car from what I remember, but there again, she was a civilised driver and not a pedestrian killer like some of the flat top hairstyles driving around in the Ford Escorts and Vauxhall Astras of the time..
I had one of these in the 1970's. I went through CV joints in much the same way a gorilla goes through bananas.One night enroute for Kent on the M1 about 80 miles from my destination. Lifted the bonnet and the loud clunk I heard was an engine mount shearing. Stuck on the hard shoulder looking around I spotted a piece of wood. I lifted the engine and mounted it on the wood. On a wing and a prayer I finally made it to Sevenoaks. On another occasion I was motoring down Commercial Road in the east end and the bonnet flew up and went over the car landing on the road. I retraced my steps and put the bonnet in the boot, again I finally reached Sevenoaks albeit very late. The car was a gift from my mother in law. I always suspected she didn't like me.
I appreciate this channel very much: it is interesting and full of information about the world of cars!
The last Allegros made weren't bad cars (I think they were called the Allegro 3). They benefited from the A plus engine and interior very similar to the Metro. Cheap to run and easy to service. I loved mine.
So did I!
@@nygelmiller5293 You actually bought one, paid money for it????
@@davidviner4932 okay, smart Alex, I bought a 9 year old, RUST FREE Allegro, and sold it, RUST FREE, when it was 21 years old! What could be wrong with that then?
Sorry man, I had one as my first car in 1990, in my defence I got it free, even that was too expensive, too say it was shite is an understatement, I used to get out dragged by buses, double decker buses, the only redeeming feature was.... nothing
@@stefanchapman7229 my old man 4 of the bloody things absolutely the worst car ever.
I think it's fair to say that the car designers within British Leyland at that time were severely hamstrung by all kinds of ridiculous constraints, such as the gearbox-in-sump and rather asthmatic engines. The A-series and E-series engines both had a tendency to leak oil because of the gear change rod entering the gearbox below the level of the oil, with sliding seals, close to the road and exposed to road spray. That's a deadly combination. My dad had a Maestro with the A+ engine and the VW gearbox on the end of the engine, and it was 100% reliable and very smooth. This meant that when my Dad had his Allegro Equippe, he had to carry a can of oil around with him all the time because of loss of oil through the gearchange, where there would often be a small puddle under the car when it had been standing for a while. Plus the very nice alloy wheels of the Equippe were porous, which meant the tyres would go down fast. Stuff like that was just stupid. I heard that David Bache was eventually fired because of an argument with management where he eventually punched someone. I don't know what it was about, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was frustration boiling over.
My Allegro didn't leak oil.But perhaps that's because the gearbox was AUTOMATIC, and therefore a different design
@@nygelmiller5293 I think that had a cable gearchange, didn't it? I admit, I'm hankering after a VDP automatic at the moment, lol! But annoyingly, I'm pretty sure the 1500 was only a 3-speed, whereas I'm pretty sure the gearbox on the 1300 was a 4-speed (still no torque-converter lock-up though)
17:14 - So appropriate that the Two Ronnies would promote it. "Until then, it's good night from me."
"And it's good night from him."
So did that mean the Allegro was a joke?
I loved my Allegro. Never let me down. In fact, I can't remember it having a single problem.
Sounds nothing like a BL car then. That must be a fake! :D
Then you realised you had actually owned a Honda
did it have lesney matchbox stamped on the chassis ? jokes aside i saw an allegro last summer and brought a smile to my face. Might not have been the best of cars in its day ,but how many of the generic cars on todays road will bring a smile in 40 years ?
One thing they did get right (well by 70's standards) was the rust proofing, particularly compared to the Italians
My 1976 Austin Allegro failed its MOT after 6 years when my foot went through the floor
Great video Andy! So many missed opportunities for BL with the Allegro. Especially if you compare it to the successful Alfasud you featured earlier!
I had to do the Allegro after doing the Alfasud - to me they're so similar to look at, yet one was lauded and the other vilified.
The Alfasud dissolved like tissue paper in the British climate. The top of the front wings were particularly prone to "speed holes"
@@retr0naut823 Maybe the two should have merged? Oh wait that would have given us the worst of both worlds: either as very rusty shell with an aging A series engine, or a flying rust proof pig with a preppy boxer engine. Such a thing would never happen...or did it with the Alfa Romeo Arna? Perhaps a good follow up to the Alfasud and Allegro videos?
True but Alfa quality was atrocious too, probably even worse than BL. When I was a youngster a neighbour of my Gran bought a new Alfasud Sprint (think it was X reg) and it was trouble from day one. Great design and a fine driver's car but not much use if it spends half the time being repaired. He changed it for a new Audi 80 after only 3 years.
@@retr0naut823 someone would have regretted not buying an Allegro, then, because I sold mine when it was 21 years old, with NO rust holes!
In the early 80’s my dad had a sporty white allegro company car. Drove really well, we loved it.
My Dad (we are from Denmark) bought his first Brand new! car in the late 1970, that was a Austin Alegro , he never had a car with so much repair and trouble in 2 years, he said to the shop owner , i am out of this sell it and give me my money back , after that he bought used cars for 20 years , Opel- Saab - Datsun (Nissan)- Then finally a brand new Mazda , then Honda , and VW Touran , the worst ever by far was still Austin Alegro , so i understand your video
Thank you. This was my most awaited Big Car story 😃 now I’m hoping for Princess story 😉
Hope you enjoyed it!
Not just you waiting most for the Allegro story. It seems there are still some fierce Allegro fans
Phenomenal levels of detail and hard work go in to your fascinating videos and for that, I applaud and thank you my man!
Much appreciated Jack.
@@BigCar2 The Allegro was never banned from the Mersey Tunnel. Another invented myth such as windows popping out when it was jacked up. The back wheels falling off was true enough but only on cars made in the first 6 months or so.
Hard work went into this video? Yes, and plenty of lies about the Allegro, just because others had done so before him.A national sport. Such people are wasted in our time. In Nazi Germany, they could have repeated slurs about the Jews!
@@retr0naut823 the Mersey tunnel slur, was a classic of Quentin Wilson's, of course! But as a former Allegro fan and owner , I did admit seeing one that had shed a FRONT wheel when it had been turning a corner! AND a lady who had cherished and maintained HER Allegro, told me she sold hers after THAT she'd a FRONT wheel! Luckily no such things happened on mine!
@Nygel Miller Please let me know the "lies". I've put up a correction as a pinned comment about the Mersey tunnel point after you mentioned it. I take a lot of time to try to get these videos right, and monitor comments to post corrections when there's evidence to show I'm wrong. Let me know of any other issues, along with accredited sources (i.e. not just someone's opinion) showing it's wrong, or showing you're right and I'm happy to post more corrections. I'm keen to get these videos right!
I find it absolutely staggering that more than 600k of these were 'sold.'
Great content on this channel - better quality than some higher budget counterparts - inc some on tv. Thanks for uploads.
I worked on the production line at Longbridge which produced those things, not a happy period. It was the case of typical British management of a company, but on a grandiose scale, you simply would not believe some of the stories. I on a regular basis suggest they divert the production line from where it left the trim, through the offices, before it arrived at the mechanical assembly, just to remind them they made cars, because I'm sure most of the people there didn't know that. The expression it was a complete joke really doesn't cover it...
Bugging everyone doing actual work on actual company business with the most far out and ridiculous idiocracy possible and the most remote from the actual topic...
Isn't that the default mode of any management? At least it still is where I work at.
can you please share some stories? I find it fascinating to hear from people who actually lived through those times
Yessssss, I wanted this video so bad, thank you, sir!
I missed you, man !
Thank you for these documentaries 👍👍👍🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🙏
Quartic steering wheel as great. If they did aftermarket ones today, I'd fit one.
Having first hand experience I can say they are awful to use.
Thanks for these great videos on British consumer cars! I love getting a good historical background on all these cars I've seen on TV & movies my whole life, but never knew what they were. I've always been fascinated by the individual style languages of different car makers, and it's great to see the evolution of models I'm not immediately familiar with.
Well done, then Freddy Burger! But just don't be taken in some of the repeated lies about British cars, including the distinctive, characterful Allegro!
The three door 'estate' was actually awesome, a shooting brake small car that made the rest of the styling almost look good! Always seemed like a British 'Waynes World" car, the AMC Pacer, I'd totally drive one!
Yeah, I thought the Estate looked OK. Every time I saw an Allegro saloon, I just saw Terry and June, and old codgers driving back and forth to Sainsbury's, and their GP surgery. But the Estate had a bit more of a sporty look to it, I thought.
I called it a hearse for midgets.
The Allegro looked alright from the windscreen back....
@@leeenglandland2978 BL missed an opportunity there, now you mention it. Had they painted them all Black, they would have probably doubled their sales. 😄😄😄
@@martinandrews7380 actually I liked ALL of it! But cars are a bit like HATS. Everybody likes different ones!
I remember seeing one of these in my local high street. The front wheel had come off and was on the other side of the road. I was just a boy but still recall the wheel still had the brake disk in it.
Yet another interesting and informative documentary, thanks for this, I well recall a neighbour buying a new Allegro and even in those days not being very impressed, possibly the name did not seem a good idea, I was at the time into Renault cars. As said in the video, these Allegros are collectors items now and are great to see after all these years.
That opening footage makes me think of the line from Austin Powers, "You know what I love about England? It looks nothing at all like Southern California!" (as they drive past the Hollywood sign)
I loved my Allegro, it taught me so much about repairing engines.
Me too,knew nothing g about CAR maintenance until I had this. Comfy and God on petrol
When I’m having a rough day with my MG, I watch these videos and the happy gent who hosts them has me loving the cars, good and bad ones, in no time. Cheers!
I'm so glad Jim!
My 1st car was a 1979 Allegro 1500 in a nice frog green colour. I think I paid £750 for it in 1991. You had to double de-clutch to get it into 3rd and the engine eventually gave out after a few months. It was a good car to learn auto mechanics on as me and my friends ended up swapping the engine (bought from the local scrap yard for £50 each) 4 times before I eventually got rid of it for £50 in 1993. The 1st engine swap took us about 16 hours, by the 4th one we had it down to about 90 min. I still remember the reg number - ERM 656 V. Fond but probably rose tinted memories!
Edit: I just looked it up on the UK vehicle enquiry service and it was originally a 1750. I bought it with a 1500 but did swap a 1750 back into it.
James's may done very good piece on the allegro where he asked the designer how it went from his drawings to what was launched,his answer was the bean counters cutting corners and "disappointed " was not the word he used lol
Ah one of the overgrown school boys from top gear you mean?
@@rob5944 You must be an accountant, because you chose to attack the presenter and not the doom makers of BL, namely the ‘bean counters’.
@@JamesAlexander14 no, just observations, based on what is in my opinion sound, comparisons. May I also add that sarcasm is the lowest form of wit, don't you know. Remember to keep comments respectful.
@@rob5944 Ironic, since you weren't exactly respectful in your first comment.
@@herewardthewake5433 no irony really, I'm not an accountant and they certainly are overgrown schoolboys.
"I see you have car!"
"Austin Allegro...Chocolate Brown".
Love little britain .
Another great video! Very interesting and informative.
Thanks!
You're always welcome Jeff.
Great explanation ! Well done. Very informative !
The later ones were nothing as bad as most people thought, and were no less reliable than other cars in its class of the time. I lived in Thailand for many years are there are a few of them there that were daily use till at least 2016 when I left.
I agree, I think styling is always a subjective thing but I had one as my first car. Being over 6ft I found Minis a bit cramped so wanted something a bit bigger and as I was working in a BL main dealer I bought a series 2 Allegro 1.3 did 25000 miles in it in just under two years, it never gave me any problems and my sister bought the car from me and did a further 15000 miles with no problems. Unfortunately those early cars suffered from poor quality control and whilst you could cause significant sill damage by jacking them up in the wrong place stories of screens popping out are a bit of an urban myth. That quartic steering wheel was an awful thing to use and in my opinion ruined the driving experience which is probably why so many people disliked it but the later cars with the round steering wheel were much better. In the mid eighties I had a 1750 Équipe for a few months and whist it was no RS2000 it was comfortable and quick enough for the time and I quite enjoyed it and again it gave me no problems.
My friend has a Mk3 Allegro estate I was surprised how good it was. It's now sitting off the road in storage I'm tempted to buy it of him. I want to dip my toes into lake Allegro.
@@philnewstead5388 Another friend owns square steering wheel Allegro. I found the shape of the steering wheel rim really uncomfy in the hands.
That being said I actually love the styling.
Edgar Beat I couldn't agree more about the steering wheel. I wouldn't say I love the styling but I think it's far from ugly and the front 3/4 few is fine and the top of the range cars with the nice wheel trims and chrome embellishment are quite good looking.
@@philnewstead5388 🙂 The only other car that had an uncomfy feel steering wheel was a pre 53 VW. It just seamed to go for the knuckle joints. I owned a 56 with a more rounded standard steering wheel no issues. But the Allegro eek not bothered with the square shape I love that. But the crass section of the rim. Very ugh. Thinking about it I think it's the same cross section shape as a round steering wheel. Fitted to marinas and Minis. My 78 mini van has the same feel. I find my hands do get sore. I'm 37 🙂 I sound older.
My father had one of these horrible things, I remember the engine falling off its mounts and bouncing over cats eyes on the sump!
I can't see how that is possible, it would have to shear the drive shafts as well. The Allegro engine mounts are quite well engineered, much better than the mini ones.
@@jonsmith6497 if the car was going fast enough, when the mounts break, and the engine falls, the engine would fall forward( with the direction of the driveshafts, because it would only be connected strongly there, apart form wired and pipes) and would turn about 20° up, hit the bulkhead and shear the shaft.
i bought an allaggro le brand new august 1st 1979 worst car ever no power at all
GREAT SHOW AGAIN,,THANKS
My 1st car was a 1964 Series 1 Austin 1100 (ADV 518B), bought for £175 in 1972. It was reliable and in very good condition with a smooth ride. It was cream with red vinyl seats and my dad DIY-fitted a heater element to the rear window. I was absolutely thrilled with my 1100, but what I REALLY wanted was a Maxi.
Oh, and I (sort of) ticked the Maxi box 12 years later when I bought a new Opaline Green MG Maestro 1600. It kept breaking down. A lot. Replaced with a Moonraker Blue MG Metro 1300 just 15 months later, which I still miss today.
Great video and story sir, I think opinions on the Allegro divide vastly, personally I liked and still like it, it’s an unusual car with its own character and as you said they do put a smile on your face when you see one of the few remaining examples still on the road today.
It was blasted as being rust prone, unreliable and ugly, but but you could say those things about a few manufacturers cars of the time, in truth they were no less reliable or rust prone than most 70’s cars.
The fact that they can fetch 4 figures sums today proves they weren’t a hated car at all, just misunderstood.
It has character all right - in that its sheer awfullness *IS* its character. Our next door neighbour bought one when it came out, and it was one of the more expensive in the range. It was forever breaking down and spent more time in the garage than on the road it was so poorly put together. He got rid of it after only a couple of years because of this. It's not misunderstood at all and is rightly harangued. I certainly don't smile when I see one, I just want to turn away because it's a symbol of British industry in the 70's - because when you look at the beautiful original concept drawings, they were on to a winner, but they managed to completely mess it up. Kind of like snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
@@Stig10001 Well you either like it or you don’t.
Each one to their own as the saying goes.
A friend of mine bought a new Allegro 3 estate (he was a family man). In the first 6 months it developed a list of basic faults including badly leaking windows and seats you couldn't recline without the covers tearing under the stress. He returned it demanding his money back.
Excellent documentary - crammed with facts, lucid and interesting!
The gearboxes I described thusly: Like trying to stir a box full of hammers with a screwdriver.
You guys must have been so proud of your home-grown torture machines! :P