We Ran Our Electrical Wires on the OUTSIDE?!?!
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- Опубліковано 28 гру 2022
- Find out why we decided to run the electrical on the exterior of this modern barn build.
We wanted a clean interior look to the finish of this barn, and that meant avoiding conduit if at all possible. We found the solution by running the electrical outside of our sheathing and WRB and then pulling it into the building only where there were fixtures and outlets.
As always, remember to keep your air-sealing and weather barrier intact around the entire structure. For our penetrations we used a hybrid system of fluid applied sealant and zip tape to seal out water and air.
Good to see you posting again
Beautiful project. Thanks for taking the time to share the progress and details.
Holy heck Jordan, I love the idea. This is going straight into my back pocket for future development. Going through permitting with the county currently to expand my permanent structure allotment. If we get it approved, this strategy is getting used. Thanks again man, I love your videos. So glad you're back to uploading.
I love it. I've used this style for many CLT buildings with great results.
Great to hear!
@@JordanSmithBuilds actually thought this had a clt roof before you showed the detail with the t&g
Good luck.
Love the idea, I am the guy who is coming back making repairs after 30 years and I promise they will be wishing you had run those wires in either plastic or metal conduit for ease of repair/replacement/addition. Just my thing though. Hopefully everything went well and nothing was shorted🙏. Keep up the good work!
I’m not into barns, but I have to admit this is a nice one!!! Really neat solution to a very common detail. The main downside to this might be the permanence of it… gotta get it right the first time!
Awesome! Thank you!
Happy new year 2023 from #PowerLearningChannel
Very interesting. I wonder if exterior conduit might help protect the wires? That barn's interior look is awesome!
The final metal sheathing will enclose it all. Thanks!
Okay what are the plans for me to live in a barn like that
Not sure about the US but, in the UK, you’d get coded running it on the outside of the insulation as it can cause a bridging effect in the cavity for moisture.
If you need wiring designs for future projects, there are designers (like myself) who offer these services.
hi.. question: what were the workers screwing down in to in the final shot? Was the screw going down in to the 2x6 tongue-n-groove? Would it help to have a washer on that screw to help distribute the force?
What prevented running some sort of protective conduit? Extra expense but not much for the peace of mind and insurance against accidental damage. Curious. Looks cool and unconventional methods, I like unique styles, well done.
Nothing but time and expense and difficulty, but could have been done for sure. Thanks for the comment!
I would have wanted some kind of continuity device that could alarm if a wire got hit
Interesting idea but I would have covered all the wire with some kind of hat channel for protection.
If we weren’t able to mark them as well as we did, that would be a good idea to protect them
Hey this is phenomenal cause I cant stack my R30 rockwool in the attic with all those wires … i was about to retro fit my child hood home with all wires strictly in the studs behind the CMU’s anyways whats the program you use or the software you’re using for those 3D models im assuming you made it from scratch thanks ! That might be a video idea for ya on how you design the aesthetic goodluck
I think standard NM-B isn’t allowed in damp locations, it should be NMC/UF unless it’s protected. The wall condition is debatable.
So wait. Now to replace a wire in the future I have to rip whole roof off?
Why would you need to replace wire? We’re running four conductor with a ground to each fixture. I’m pretty sure we’re covered for every eventuality.
Or meke any interior changes. As simple as my wife wants new light fixtures that require a different pattern. Great idea but poor consideration for future modification. In commercial construction we do this all the time with structural and finish framing with a ducted cavity. This is a good concept if the owners are good with no changes, ever.
That hurts my brain. But in essence, you've done everything normally. You've built a normal-ish wall assembly and then you have a barn inside of it. Given the Texas sized ass pain that could be caused by a screw causing an electrical short, I would have run hard conduit, like commercial grade.
Form over function. Not a good tradeoff when it comes to electrical wiring!
So the wires are between the exterior panels and the interior wall panel like 99% of buildings.
Yeah. It’s just built in the most difficult way possible :)
Matt Risinger is shaking his head and saying "I failed to teach him".
Multiple wires in one hole?
hahaha. Probably so.
The multiple wires are moving from exterior wall cavity to interior wall cavity in most cases (in all the cases you saw in this video) There are places where we have two wires going into the same hole for the light fixtures, but we have air sealed those with fluid applied.
pretty sure zip tape is not an acceptable cable fastening method
It’s just there to keep it from moving while we insulate
@@JordanSmithBuilds No like electrical code acceptable. Wiring outside air barrier in cavity wall assemblies isn’t that rare on hospitals, etc. - normally there are clips every x inches to support self weight of wiring (but on a hospital it wouldn’t be NM cable obviously). Not that zip tape but won’t probably hold up fine in reality. Not that whatever is going up for rigid insulation won’t “clamp” it in place. Just a code concern. My guess is there’s some sort of plastic one hole clip for NM that can go up with a single screw. Obviously desirable not to make holes in WRB and/or air barrier but electrical code doesn’t know or care about that.
Normally there’s two criteria:
- wet location or not? outside WRB but behind cladding would be wet location by most sane definitions of wet location
- protected from mechanical damage or not? outside WRB and/or AB but behind cladding system may qualify as protected from mechanical damage, but I can imagine it not flying with a given inspector - unless I had confidence in the inspector’s consistency of opinion/communication I would assume this would need to be armoured cable or in a raceway.
As a master electrician, you would be failed for rough in in virtually any part of the country with that roof shenanigans. Tape is not a UL listed method of support or securement. It all looks like Romex on the roof which is not an approved environment. You have no effective means of preventing damage unless you went and jacked an entire second layer of roof on top of it on purlins or other 2X material at a minimum. You have massive potential for derate and overheat issues.
Honestly it's a cool concept on paper but never should have gone beyond that LMAO.
And before code Nazis get up my butt, I'll put any code references people want on here if they really want to learn from it.
Otherwise, catch the discussion over in the electricianU discord!
Thanks for the comment! I think you must have missed the part where there is a full roof deck above the insulation and below. Its basically a regular cavity wall or roof. 2X decking below, insulation in the middle, 1/2 plywood and standing seam metal up top. The conductors are safe and sound in between.
Yes, we are aware that ZIP tape is not UL listed, but since the cables would lay on the roof without restraint (like in an attic) and the cables pass over ZIP tape in the assembly anyway, the thought was that there would be no harm in using the tape to keep the cables from moving during insulation installation.
Derate and overheat is addressed by the wire runs being beneath the insulation. Much cooler for these wires than most wires in uninsulated attics. (as a side note, these roof runs are driving LED light fixtures with a relatively low draw for the size of conductors).
This assembly is engineered and the electrical was all installed by a licensed master electrician and we are confident that it is safe and fit for service.
I'll check out electriciansU on discord!
@@JordanSmithBuilds you guys must have been very lucky with your AHJ then. Things get a bit western in Montana, but several I work with brought up their input and code references where they would not have passed it, with protection and use of Romex in that environment being the chief concerns. Given the sandwich approach, and the fact it's on the bottom side of the insulation they can overlook the tape and just consider it supported by the plywood. The next concern was that with the use of a WRB directly on the deck, would that not be in the wet side? Or is the top roof assembly intended to be the primary WRB preventing any water ingress in that space with the insulation? If you have extra layers of underlayment and are going fully mechanically sealed, they may overlook the potential for that Romex to be in a wet environment, which would be a key violation.
Their general feedback was that any conduit based install would have been a no questions asked pass because there would be no possibility for damage provided the boxes faced into the structure. But the use of Romex it's right on the limits of code and even a small interpretation difference with an inspector would create a major issue.
As a recommendation for future work if you do this again, use UF in stead of Romex in that zone. At least then there is no potential concern for improper environment of install.
I saw the roof assembly. As did the inspector and the interpretation based on what appeared to be WRB was that that cavity could in fact be a wet environment. It may not be, it may be designed to stay completely dry. But that was an additional key reason for concern with the use of Romex.
To be clear, it's not the wires outside a structure that create the issue or risk or interpretation issue.
It's Romex in that use case. There are just better solutions that alleviate that
Another note.
I see that they are using 2X T&G so they have 1.25" from face. If anyone used anything thinner, it wouldn't work. 2X good, if not metal protection needed below NM. If the second layer of insulation is less than 1.5 you would need a continuous metal protection 300.4E. in this case it is indeed more. I would recommend putting the Metal protection above the NM either way for future reroofing. In regards to a Building code this roof system may not meet the IRC or Energy code for insulation or structural. That is going to depend on your region though. This was an engineered roof system to my knowledge so it should be good to go in your area
Sooo a barn that's not a barn.
A shop then :)
Major code violation. Stick to Legos or something you know about.
Which code? Which section? I’m not very good at Lego’s either.
Lol
how often do you have to replace wiring in homes?...
Not often for lighting. Probably never.