Mud Test: G3/CETME
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- Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
- / inrangetv
The CETME/G3 uses the delayed roller blowback system which was spawned by German engineers right at the end of WW2. It was destined to potentially be the successor to the StG44, and a few prototypes were made, but it never got into production. The same German engineers landed up in Spain post war and their efforts manifested into the CETME - a 308 delayed roller blowback battle rifle. Ultimately Germany adopted the exact same rifle with minor modifications in the guise of the G3.
We previously tested the FAL here: www.full30.com...
How will the G3 do in the InRange mud test? Let us find out...
So when Ian uses the FAL...is it then known as "The Left arm of the Free World"?
I liked the part where he pulled the trigger then the gun worked.
Hella sick when the gun went bang!
Swiggity swooty, rooty tooty point-n-shooty.
mud was defective
Yep
Wait its suppose to go bang i thought that was a malfunction my glock never goes bang
So a G3 rifle + mud = bolt-action rifle
In 1989 I was a conscript in the Bundeswehr. I was a medic. The G3 was the only weapon I was trained on. The G3 struck me as surprisingly large and unwieldy and, above all, very heavy. During practice shooting, we regularly had jams. I can't tell whether there were an unusually large number of them.
Medical soldiers have weapons for self-defense, so even then I was amazed at such a large, heavy rifle.
I reckon if the G3 had a dust cover, be it modified or from the factory, I wouldn't be surprised if it went completely un-phased.
Many often forget that the G3/Cetme platform has been directly modified into belt fed variants and utilized for very odd circumstances... the G3 is the unsung hero of the small arms world.
This video shows that the design is so good that even if Century takes part in manufacturing the rifle, it can still work. I bet pure HK and even PTR rifles would do better. The ammo may be playing a part too.
Not bad, thats why i prefer the G3 to the G36, besides the caliber i have the feeling that it is more stable.
A comrade of my dad had a G3 which was run over by an Unimog. It was still working and he was able to hit the target. Not his own, but he supported the neighbour.
Just revisited this one after the recent G36 mud test - I just realized, that there is an interesting trend of HK Military rifles to have a freak failure on the first round after application of the mud. After that, they usually run fairly reliable...
Ha ha ha! 7:47 "Hey, it's California compliant now." Sad but true... ;-)
I don't get the new law, an SMLE is technically illegal, but an SKS isn't.
An SMLE isn't illegal in any way under California's AW laws for two reasons:
1. An SMLE does have a detachable magazine, but it doesn't have any "assault weapon features" (flash suppressor, pistol grip, collapsible stock, VFG).
2. An SMLE isn't even semi-automatic.
A rifle needs to be semi-automatic, have a detachable magazine, and have at least one "assault weapon feature" in order to qualify as an AW. You pretty much don't have to worry about anything manually operated unless it's (somehow) an SBR.
I just bought a C308 yesterday and been looking at reviews but after seeing how you of all people do all this to it I’m happy with my purchase.
Heheheh! If I'd seen this video 35 years ago, when I was a conscript using the G3, I'd have shown it my sergent and said: 'Cleaning is overrated, it works just fine'. :D
The picture of the soldier in Afghanistan is a Norwegian with a Norwegian made G3. The AG3 made at Kongsberg Armory.
I think they're a little harsh saying the G3 here failed. Its not done, it's merely bolt action. You might be in a bad spot but you're still shooting. Not to mention after a mag or so it would be back to working properly.
You guys should do a funny/mock 1980s m16 propaganda video comparing it to all these other guns..
Every time I see a video about the G3 I end up liking it that little bit more.
Having shot and handled both rifles (owning one of the two) I've always preferred the G3/CETME to the FAL. I actually made my longest range shot ever using my G3 clone at 1200 yards on a metal gong. I will say I wasn't a fan of the way it crimped my brass.
Dropping a G3 in the mud turns it into a bolt action rifle, for approximately two magazines. Good to know!
Used it in the Portuguese Army! Not the best, but realible! Mud? Sad? No problem! remove the mag, clear the problem and it runs like clockwork! lol If it had a dust cover in the rifle... In Portugal, the army is doing trials for a new rifle, but...its hard to find a reliable weapon system that works like the G3... the HK 416 is a possibility...
has a cetme
doesnt do the thing that they're known for
_slap the bolt handle you heathen_
I like the ealyer mud tests better, one thing having Ian crawling around in mud was fun to watch but i allso think it gives a better image on how and where mud will get on a gun than simple dump a big load on mud on it. On a side note, after spending close to 8 years in the danish army i have still not manged to get this much mud on/in a gun ever, in the worst cases using water from a canteen or water stream will get most off it or even use your hands, i cant think of anyone there would use the rifle in that condition.
We only did 1 mud test video with crawling, the rest have been via this method. The crawling method isn't repeatable in regards to consistency nor availability here in AZ. ~Karl
Thats too bad but fair enough.
Remember it can take hours to clean an "McCollum® mud cleaning device type Ian".
Why waste fresh water when one could make use of urine after all its just a CETME.
MarbleDemo You've obviously never been to Az. You need a tanker full of piss to achieve the kinda of test mud here that they had in their first test. Sun is hot enough to crack cement on a regular basis.
The CETME takes so little credit it's sad, it's always about the G3
Como?? En spanish plis
Looking forward to the AR-15 mud test where it totally chokes.... oh wait.
Isn't it originally derived from the Sturmgewehr 45 (Gerät 06) prototype?
When I had problems with my L1A1 SLR (Australian issue FN FAL), I ran it with the gas plug on its tightest setting. Nil further problems (except a killer recoil!) Very interesting tests, thanks so much for posting these.
I have Century Arms versions of both. My FAL started life off as a Rhodesian contract gun. In terms of accuracy and comfort of shooting I love the FAL, but I'm pretty ambivalent about the CETME. I guess if I were in some seriously soupy combat situations I'd now want the CETME but otherwise I'd feel better served by the FAL.
Congratulations, you’ve successfully turned your g3 into a Mosin-Nagant
Thanks guys for the test of the G3 and the FAL. That was very interesting.I’m a little heartbroken that the FAL failed. When I joined the CAF in 1986, the FN C1 was the weapon I was issued with. It never really failed me….but I never got it that muddy. And that was a fair test for both rifles. Cheers 🍻
Any chance of getting a mud test of a BAR?
For as long as its not cocked (since its an open bolt gun) it will probably perform outstandingly
do a top 5 of the best guns to pass the mud test
I have had both in the past, DSA and HK 93 and sold them off. Now I can't afford to get my HK replaced but I do have 2 PTR 91's. They are just a superior design. The AR did better in the mud, however dont try to submerge a AR in water and try to fire it without draining it first. HK Wins!
THAT is the G3 robustness I remember firing 10K rounds with. To properly screw it: put mud in the rail opening on the left side where the charging handle runs.
Exactly!
Exactly!
You should try mud testing the SCAR 17 or SCAR 16. It'd be interesting to see how a modern rifle runs that isn't as sealed as the AR-15 but is used by the special forces.
To any of those interested in the c308 but have heard rumors of reliability and build quality it is literally hit or miss. I own a c308 and mine has run fantastically for over a year with four thousand rounds or so through it no problem. My friend shot it and fell in love so he picked himself up one and that thing struggled to stay running and had to be sent back twice in the past 6 months. I have in fact picked up a PTR 91 and I would definitely say it is a better built rifle and definitely worth the little extra. The c308 on my end has been a good gun however looking back I would simply go with the PTR for peace of mind and a better product.
nice german camo smock and feldmutze
Very nice test, comparison and conclusions. However,if my memory serves me well, when you did the AUG test you were careful to put mud in the charging handle's slot and that was what killed it. You haven't done this test the same way.
It hurts my heart to see such an expensive gun get wrecked in the mud like that.
"Now it's California compliant!" It's funny because this state is ridiculous. Great video!
Very informative and simple, thank you.
Im just waitin till I'm back in Texas then I intend to pick one of these up, gonna make it my new hog rifle.
Interesting points on the difference between gas operation and roller-delayed.
Very nice these mud test videos. It would be great to see a how a G36 performes when quenched in mud.
I have used the G3 (AK4) in Sweden during -35 C in winter and it works well👍🏻
I'm curious how well a proper PTR-91 would do in the test in comparison to the C308, it'd definitely be easier to remove those magazines since it has a paddle release.
Most of the "malfunctions" seem to be due to the operator using cheap underpowered 7.62x51 that is made for gas system battle rifles. You can tell by the weak ejection pattern that the ammo is clearly underpowered for the G3 system as full powered .308/7.62x51 will throw the brass forward and far out several meters
+lolwutyoumad I was using military surplus 147 grain Hirtenberger. You know, the underpowered stuff that the military uses in their G3s? ~Karl
Funny you mentioned that since PTR specifically lists surplus Hirtenberger as a problem ammo with their rifles. So yes, underpowered ammo is a problem if the blowback isn't strong enough to cycle the heavy G3 bolt ( I had similar issues with Mexican Aguilla).If you try Monarch .308 that you buy from Academy for 9 bucks a box, you will be able to tell the difference in recoil, (proper) ejection pattern and a world of difference in reliability.
Not trying to be mean or anything, just a few things I learned with my own PTR
Karl can you redo this test with some hotter ammo? I really want see the g3 stomp everything else really bad.
InRangeTV He does make a fair point, could you please redo the G3 again?
When I am shooting 7,62x54R military surplus, they are much much weaker then new stuff in terms of recoil.
With new ammo my FAL throws brass 3 meters to the front from prone position with gas port open to 1/2.
Could it be that surplus ammo is "expired"?
Who would win
- Quality-made FAL
- H&K gun but made by a crap company
Just out of curiosity, do you guys think getting a little bit of mud out of the action by simply swyping your finger over the bolt (like you would propably if you didn't have to return fire immediatly) would make much of a difference? I guess reducing the amount of mud on the bolt would improve the chance of the gun cycling significantly since there is less material slowing the bolt down.
Sure it would defeat the purpose and comparability of the test, but it would be interesting to see if such little action would return the rifle to a working order.
8:20 "if I put another mag in this right now it's ready to run" but you can't because you can't remove the magazine sooo...
+Nick Clayton: Yeah, so a stupid idiot, who has trained him at this rifle? His Grandma? At "Gernan Bundeswehr" we trained at the G3 so long time till we could re- and assembly it blind! Including the delayed rollerblock! I never had problems to change the mag. Ridicolous that these guys need to prostitute themselves here and then failed so much...
Could you guys test an sks? That would be cool!
+The Hoser Gun Guy I would like to see that too. However, I suspect it would be very similar to the VZ58.. Milled receiver rifle with an open top. And it has the same locking system as the FAL shown in this video. The gap between the bolt carrier and bolt is also exposed in the ejection port cutout. Mud would probably get in there without issue, and cause problems. That being said, I love my Yugo SKS, and I wouldn't throw it out if it failed their test :)
crazyfvck I agree! I am just impressed that any rifle can survive that lol.
I miss my g3 :(
love this page y'all seem to do the right mud test everyone likes to paint some mud or dirt on the gun then wipe it off!!
I'd like to see some type of ranking eventually. I'm starting to lose track of how well each one performed.
I appreciate the review guys but you say PTR & Cetme as if they’re the same rifle. Different companies, different countries and completely different quality builds. But again thank you.
I suppose that if G3 was more popular than FAL and G3’s variants 32 and 52 chambered in AK mag were adopted by many contries around the world, maybe even AK would stop being the most popular rifle in the world and maybe AK-107 and AEK-971 (also AN-94) could be massively adopted across the globe.
G3, C308, HK91, PTR 91....for the win!
Great video
I also think the remudding was not fair on the rifle.
Running the test again to see if the feed malfunction was just some non mud-related error is a good idea, but doing it by remudding the already muddes internals is a bit harsh as a test.
You should have cleaned it before remudding, to give it a fair chance.
But nice to sse you do those tests, and I am glad to see the old girl running so well :)
I definitely want a CETME/G3 like that- when i move to a free state
:( I would probably get black furniture, or green maybe, to be different. I find the mechanism interesting
C-308 is seeming like a better and better deal. Affordable rifle, $3 mags, and very reliable.
I'm pretty familiar with Tucson mud, gives me a thought: what if you let the mud dry before firing? just for giggles.
I've got both the DS Arms FAL and the Century C308, both new. I paid less than half the price of the FAL for my C308 and I'd GTW with it any day over my FAL. It just so happens.
5:00 that is an norwegian soldier before we adapted the HK 416
3:21 As Karl pointed out there wasn't mud more towards the charging handle, could that be a issue or is it sealed enough?
it would be an issue
I don't see it being much of one. Its just a hollow cocking tube. The mud would have to get in all the right places to hold the gun out of battery that I don't see being much harder to clear out than what was already doing it. It not going to be any worse than mud caking in around the FAL's piston system under the hand guard.
mark shuler I just think you would be unable to charge it if the tube got full of crap.
***** There is no empty part of the tube. The cocking handle and carrier takes up almost all of the space. The only real way mud could get in would be from the space left by the carrier when it reciprocates. But even then mud would be hard pressed to get in enough to cause a problem.
mark shuler plus lots of unused space for the mud that get in to make its home in. Meaning not getting in the way of the bolt.
It looks like most of the problems would be solved by first removing the mag, then open the action to clear it. Then either shake out the mag or put in another mag. It may be a little time consuming, but far less time consuming than having to motar that rifle between every shot.
I love these videos... but if there is one thing you learn from all of them, it’s that you should really try not to get mud in your gun.
Steyr M95 mud test maybe eventually?
I'm not one to say things like "not a soviet akm!!! Test is shit!" But testing the G3 rifle with a century built kit is very infair to the platform. Please do a test with a ptr91 they are not much more expensive but are not built by drunk Angry century factory beavers
We're testing the mechanical design of the gun and the PTR is mechanically identical to this rifle. The gun works, we've shown it work, and I've run it in a number of matches. This is not a relevant point. ~Karl
InRangeTV yes they are running the same system and have parts interchangeable but are you saying you put a German built Hk91 and a century built c308 are the same quality?
Why you arguing? the gun worked.
Its my understanding that PTR Industries is building the barreled actions for the Century C308. While Century is finishing the actions with their CETME components to make the completed product. So Century's input on the C308 is minimal.
Ace Of Blazes yes but your point is even more vaild for the 'decent' FAL and the AK. the only gun that hasnt failed is the AR.
yo trabaje perfectamente con el cetme c y aunque nunca hice esa animalada con mi fusil, si que vadee charcos, se lleno de barro y con limpiar con la manga de mi uniforme la ventana de expulsion y antes de tirar montar en vacio tres veces el arma me funciono y acerrojo perfectamente.
Sends the casings into orbit is an understatement that thing throws the casings as far as the bullet.
I used a fal in the Dutch army and fals are great rifles, when kept clean. I destroyed one fal by forcing it to operate, while it had dry sand. I had to recharge it every single shot.
One other fal I destroyed by forcing it to run on full auto for 4 mags and then putting it in wet grass.
So has there been a weapon that's worked particularly well after the mud test?
Ar15
Seems that a dust cover would be a much welcomed solution to this problem on the G3
you guys need to add another stage to these mud tests. a soldier in the field has a canteen of water on him for the most part, if the weapon will not run then use the contents of the canteen to see if the quick wash will get it working again.field expedient weapon cleaning device haha.
I know this is an old video but my cetme won’t return to battery after the first round is fired and ejected, it loads the next round but won’t fully return to battery. what might be the problem?
I'm not surprised, the Portuguese army as been using the G3 since the 50/60.... With great results during the colonial war from 61 to 75.
There were also some FAL's in service, but they got replaced by the G3. They did not resist the diversified climates of the colonies, they could not stand the dust or the mud, a simple "walk" in a rice field or the crossing of the crude swamps of Guinea condemned the FAL almost immediately.
Interestingly and ironically, the Portuguese G3 will be replaced as a standard weapon by the Scar of FN, the same that manufactures the FAL, rather than the 416 of HK, the same that manufactures the G3 (the Portuguese G3 were nevertheless manufactured in Portugal under license ).
Sorry my bad English ^^
I like it when mud converts automatic or semi-automatic rifles into bolt-action ones.
Looking to have a PTR 91 as a trunk gun and wanting to validate reliability and functionality. This video helps
I have a really fond respect for the G3, kinda sad we sold the PTR to the US for the G36s, the G3 it brought many of our soldier back home alive.
Would you please mud test the H&K G36, MP5 and MP7 platforms?
The C308 is a fine rifle for the money. For the price that brand-name PTRs are going for right now, it would be foolish to pick one of their rifles up. Thanks for the videos!
Granted, but you do get more features with the PTR depending on the rifle you pick.
PTR is higher quality, period
How so?
Made on proper HK tooling. (PTR pretty much bought the HK G3 'factory' in Portugal I believe and brought all the machines to the US. Buying a PTR is pretty much like buying a HK G3.
Bang Switch
Depending on the rifle you choose, you can either get a bull barrel, paddle mag release, and standard HK style sights. Or if you're into the classic look, you can get their $900 PTR 91 GI with an actual steel lower and a paddle mag release. If you go back and see how Karl struggled to release the mag before the mudd test. Trying to add any of the above to a C308 will bring the price up towards a PTR. And if choosing between a PTR or a Century, I rather have a PTR.
You found a bad g3. My dad used it in war and it is reliable asf. Mud, sand do not make this gun stop.
Karl lost some lbs good job.
IWI Tavor, Beretta 92fs, Sig p226, HKp7, or Kel Tec Sub2000. I wouldn't mind seeing how a few revolvers hold up to the mud tests as well.
When it's not from HK, it's not a G3!
its allways a pleasure to see my old faithfull G3 doing great
you guys should do an sks mud test
That g3 seemed very hard to cock even before the mud test. Can't say I remember it being that sticky at all (though, norwegian version has an all metal cocking handle)
"It's California compliant now!" LMFAO
I have the same gun...This video pleases me immensely
Se nota que es un G3, el Cetme no se hubiera atascado
how come civilian G3's never have the HK paddle mag release??
It's Americanized for the civilian market over there. It's what they know so it sells better.
That doesnt make any sense because the standard G3's and MP5's have the button mag release as well as the paddle, the paddle is just ommited in the american ones.
Ahhh didnt think about that, the shelf takes the place where the paddle would sit so theres no room for it after
Odd that they didnt just mill out a space for it rather than releasing it with what is ostensibly an "oh shit i dropped the rifle and somehow snapped the paddle" mag release
***** sorry my reply was for the other guy, your comment wasnt there for me until after id posted it
Sabre Defence XR41 had them years ago. Sadly there are only a thousand rifles out there. :(
Cruel and unusual punishment for firearms!
FNC & R700 would be neat to see get personal with the mud.
And why first filled the right part and then the left? so that the dirt could leak out of the window to release the cartridges? Why didn't you fill the bolt handle slot on the barrel with mud? IT'S CLEAN!!!! On the "Tavor" it was filled with thick sand with small gravel. On the Tavor, the submachine gun was turned upside down and the trigger was filled in. Why did I do something wrong here? Why is it liquid without large fractions? Why didn't "Tavor" shake before the shots, but here you shake clearing the mechanism almost completely?
А почему сначала залил правую часть а потом левую? чтобы успела грязь вытечь из окна для выброса гильз? Почему не залил грязью прорезь для ручки затвора , что на стволе? ОНА ЧИСТАЯ!!!! На "Тавор" она была залита густым песком с мелкими гравием. На "Тавор" автомат был перевёрнут вверх брюхом и залит спусковой крючок. Почему здесь сделал не так? Почему гряз жидкая без крупных фракций? Почему "Тавор" не тряс перед выстрелами, а здесь трясёшь очищая механизм почти полностью?
Karl you slapped the mag.
You slapped the mag.
If you were in the German or Turkish army , your drill sergeants were slapping you.
It's a great battle rifle, i have served 9 months with this gun.
Germany can get muddy. Very, very, muddy.
Seeing this makes me feel solid about my ptr buy today
These videos are always hilarious.. Americans will plasma cut rifle in half and try to shoot him with a zip ties together, and says "Well, not as reliable as we think it should be". xD
Muchas gracias por el test con el cetme, lastima que haya sido un verdadero fiasco.
Esta claro que despues de ver el M16 y ver este solo debo decir que si hay que hacer la guerra quiero un M16 y nada de mi adorable cetme.
El sistema de acerrojamiento rodillos semirigido no funciona.
Made in Lizenz somewhere. The G3 is the best. No matter. It works