The Sir Barton/Man O' War was the first horserace to be completely filmed. Also I found footage of Sir Barton's Derby race at the Derby website.(thought you might want to know, carly)
Thanks for all the video's Carly. I've been reading a book about all the Triple Crown winners and it's nice to be able to see the real horse in action.
Let's clear up this nonsense about Sir Barton being a "bad" horse. He was top notch, definitely as good as any given HOY type horse of any given year. The horse was fair as a 2yo, never winning until the Derby. After that, he frequently won big stakes, always finished respectably, and set several time records including at Saratoga over the great EXTERMINATOR. Please, let's not forget that.
I want to correct several of the misstatements posted here. The first is about the photo showing his ribs. If you go to the race track you will often see the horses ribs when they are breathing hard. They are lean and athletic. The Triple Crown races were raced May 10th, May 14th and June 11th 1919. At the Belmont Sir Barton easily won running 2:15 2/5 seconds an American record. He also won the Withers Stakes 10 days after the Preakness.
I really hope that's the case, even though it's still sad. I was just a little shocked at the first picture, where you can see all his ribs, and he just looks wasted away. Is that the picture you're talking about as well? But also, I just can't help but think he wasn't around the best people because horses don't "HATE all human and are bad-tempered" without good reason.
Looking at these pictures make me sick. What kind of utter bastards did he have for owners/trainers? He looks skeletal, the poor dear. What a sad life he had.
One reason Sir Barton ran so often is because he was a lazy horse that liked to eat and didn't like to train. Also horses today take the drug Lasix which helps control them from bleeding in their lungs but severely dehydrates the horse and takes a couple of weeks to recover.Many horses use to run on a few days rest. Ross had a filly named Milkmaid who ran in the 1919 Preakness with Sir Barton and a few days later she ran in the first Pimlico Oaks and won. Oaks is now the Black-Eyed Susan.
The real problem is breeding for speed over soundness, nad Lasix contributes to that. The Mr. Prospector inbreeding gives us horses who fill betting cards, run six good races, earn 100k, and produce 50 more good horses who fill betting cards, and so on. We also have a lot more racing than in Europe so our talent pool is much more diluted.
Just read book about Sir Barton--- if you love Horse Racing History, you will enjoy the book.. Jennifer Kelley(I think) he deserves a lot in making the Triple Crown what it became
Also, it's misleading to say "he never won another race" after MOW. Silly statements like that (the same as with War Admiral, although that was actually less true) imply the horse ran dozens times more and blew it. SB and WA ran all of about 4x each IIRC after their famed matches. Big deal they didn't quite manage to win from so few.
@red2138 Of course it's less risky. Where does it end? Having 6 months rest? Regular horses had/have to work every day all the time. I see no big deal about running a horse every day. Before 1900, horses were frequently running every day or even - gasp - having to RUN OFF a DQ - i.e., running 2 races in a day (HINDOO).
@MelC1954 Not 14 days. Closer to 5 weeks total, as it still is. Except I think as many horses before the '70s, he ran in another major race between the Preakness/Belmont. MOW did the next year - Withers between Preakness and Belmont. And Sir Barton WAS a top horse beyond the TC - he was much better. He wouldn't have been HOY if not - and he beat Exterminator and set records (matched by MOW). The horse was NOT bad.
Conquistador Cielo won the Met Mile five days before the Belmont, something which will never be done again since they moved the Met Mile to Belmont day due to the recreational audience that used to come out on Memorial Day not bothering.
@LadyTwenties The reason is genetics. HASTINGS was a nasty horse who really hated about all living things, and there is no "good reason" for that. Not every bad character is caused by "evil" humans - why on earth would they hate horses? As for the photos - I don't know, but that conformation shot may be later retired photo. Don't accuse JKL Ross (who was MUCH younger than the late photo shown - i.e., photos out of context) of cruelty based on an undated photo.
They ran horses into the ground back then. I mean there didn't seem to be any common sense even if they weren't on meds. Should have had a higher opinion of him it seems!
No common sense? You mean the "sense" of "don't run them" and keep them like hot-house precious flowers? Latter mollycoddling is probably why many of them end up failing if gasp they run more than every 3 weeks...they're not conditioned enough (including real racing).
@@theOlLineRebel I really doubt you know much about horses in general. They exercise them daily and they're not hot house treated. I bet ten bucks you're a Trump fan that's never trained a day in your life. I'm not against racing, but the purses were smaller, they ran them a lot.
@@alsosusieq256 Yes I'm a Trump supporter (not a "fan") - what has that to do with it? You're right, I don't train or touch them; only rode early on. Yes, so I'm not allowed any opinion. But there's a noticeable difference in how horses were treated now, and when they ACTUALLY HAD TO WORK in the old days, when people knew horses all around and used them seriously, not just a few people having them for fun. And regardless of your heavy experience in horses AND racing, I don't think you can simply dismiss trainers of old whom many historians regard highly, placed in the HOF, not to mention undoubtedly the next-gen trainers who would've come after in a training tree. BTW, I'd agree surfaces were simpler, but what is the point of how much he ran?
@@theOlLineRebel My point was that Trump and his followers are into macho things. I don't know if you realize this, but Trump destroyed a wonderful colt when he bought one yrs ago, by insisting against the trainer's advice to get it out and run it after they'd had a viral assault at their stable. Totally destroyed it's entire career and almost its life. They suffered later in life with problems related to being run on these surfaces and so much. It's not that horses today are hot house etc now so much than they've been inbred so much to those that have bad legs. Some of the top speed horses over the last 30 had very bad legs, but were repeatedly bred and then inbred so it's been inherited. Now they can't sustain and why they break down all the time. Limited gene pool.
The Sir Barton/Man O' War was the first horserace to be completely filmed. Also I found footage of Sir Barton's Derby race at the Derby website.(thought you might want to know, carly)
Yep, on British Pathe.
They should make a movie about this horse!
I agree
Love this horse🐎🐎🐎
Jewels of the Triple Crown, a DVD a friend sent me a long time ago. When the screen starts out black, then slowly you see the picture, is from the DVD
Thanks for all the video's Carly. I've been reading a book about all the Triple Crown winners and it's nice to be able to see the real horse in action.
Late reply but what book? I'm researching the triple crown winners now!
Let's clear up this nonsense about Sir Barton being a "bad" horse. He was top notch, definitely as good as any given HOY type horse of any given year.
The horse was fair as a 2yo, never winning until the Derby. After that, he frequently won big stakes, always finished respectably, and set several time records including at Saratoga over the great EXTERMINATOR.
Please, let's not forget that.
There's a whole book about how right you are! 😃
I want to correct several of the misstatements posted here. The first is about the photo showing his ribs. If you go to the race track you will often see the horses ribs when they are breathing hard. They are lean and athletic. The Triple Crown races were raced May 10th, May 14th and June 11th 1919. At the Belmont Sir Barton easily won running 2:15 2/5 seconds an American record. He also won the Withers Stakes 10 days after the Preakness.
One thing you need to always remember is that there were not that many racehorses back in those days.
I always enjoy watching the videos you post. Keep up the good work!
Now 13 times. Here after the win by Justify
I really hope that's the case, even though it's still sad. I was just a little shocked at the first picture, where you can see all his ribs, and he just looks wasted away. Is that the picture you're talking about as well? But also, I just can't help but think he wasn't around the best people because horses don't "HATE all human and are bad-tempered" without good reason.
Looking at these pictures make me sick. What kind of utter bastards did he have for owners/trainers? He looks skeletal, the poor dear. What a sad life he had.
He was prone to gaining weight easily so they would keep him as fit as they could.
It doesn't say what city he was buried at it is douglas wyoming
One reason Sir Barton ran so often is because he was a lazy horse that liked to eat and didn't like to train. Also horses today take the drug Lasix which helps control them from bleeding in their lungs but severely dehydrates the horse and takes a couple of weeks to recover.Many horses use to run on a few days rest. Ross had a filly named Milkmaid who ran in the 1919 Preakness with Sir Barton and a few days later she ran in the first Pimlico Oaks and won. Oaks is now the Black-Eyed Susan.
The real problem is breeding for speed over soundness, nad Lasix contributes to that. The Mr. Prospector inbreeding gives us horses who fill betting cards, run six good races, earn 100k, and produce 50 more good horses who fill betting cards, and so on. We also have a lot more racing than in Europe so our talent pool is much more diluted.
Just read book about Sir Barton--- if you love Horse Racing History, you will enjoy the book.. Jennifer Kelley(I think) he deserves a lot in making the Triple Crown what it became
Thank you!
You’re right. “Sir Barton and the Making of the TC”. Good book. Only just found out about it recently.
I didn't make this
Also, it's misleading to say "he never won another race" after MOW. Silly statements like that (the same as with War Admiral, although that was actually less true) imply the horse ran dozens times more and blew it. SB and WA ran all of about 4x each IIRC after their famed matches. Big deal they didn't quite manage to win from so few.
He ran three more times and finished in the money, but no wins.
@cshaffer08 Actually it was 2:17-2, not 2:15.
Sir Barton was not a triple crown winner since it wasn't the Triple Crown until Gallant Fox won it in 1930.
He was retroactively recognized as the first Triple Crown winner in 1950.
It's the same three races and he had to do it quicker! 4 days between Derby and Preakness? Wow.
@@smileypv Except no one was aiming for it.
@red2138
Of course it's less risky. Where does it end? Having 6 months rest?
Regular horses had/have to work every day all the time. I see no big deal about running a horse every day. Before 1900, horses were frequently running every day or even - gasp - having to RUN OFF a DQ - i.e., running 2 races in a day (HINDOO).
@MelC1954
Not 14 days. Closer to 5 weeks total, as it still is. Except I think as many horses before the '70s, he ran in another major race between the Preakness/Belmont. MOW did the next year - Withers between Preakness and Belmont.
And Sir Barton WAS a top horse beyond the TC - he was much better. He wouldn't have been HOY if not - and he beat Exterminator and set records (matched by MOW). The horse was NOT bad.
Conquistador Cielo won the Met Mile five days before the Belmont, something which will never be done again since they moved the Met Mile to Belmont day due to the recreational audience that used to come out on Memorial Day not bothering.
Sir Barton set a World Record just a few weeks prior to racing Man O'War. He just became overshadowed, but an amazing horse nontheless.
And that WR was OVER the much-vaunted Exterminator, favorite of MOW-haters.
@LadyTwenties
The reason is genetics. HASTINGS was a nasty horse who really hated about all living things, and there is no "good reason" for that. Not every bad character is caused by "evil" humans - why on earth would they hate horses?
As for the photos - I don't know, but that conformation shot may be later retired photo. Don't accuse JKL Ross (who was MUCH younger than the late photo shown - i.e., photos out of context) of cruelty based on an undated photo.
No, just lightning. (then he'd prob'ly get back up and win!) :)
The only way ManO'War could have lost was if he was struck by lightning!
They ran horses into the ground back then. I mean there didn't seem to be any common sense even if they weren't on meds. Should have had a higher opinion of him it seems!
No common sense? You mean the "sense" of "don't run them" and keep them like hot-house precious flowers? Latter mollycoddling is probably why many of them end up failing if gasp they run more than every 3 weeks...they're not conditioned enough (including real racing).
@@theOlLineRebel Dude..read how many races he ran. The surfaces were below standard also.
@@theOlLineRebel I really doubt you know much about horses in general. They exercise them daily and they're not hot house treated. I bet ten bucks you're a Trump fan that's never trained a day in your life.
I'm not against racing, but the purses were smaller, they ran them a lot.
@@alsosusieq256 Yes I'm a Trump supporter (not a "fan") - what has that to do with it? You're right, I don't train or touch them; only rode early on. Yes, so I'm not allowed any opinion. But there's a noticeable difference in how horses were treated now, and when they ACTUALLY HAD TO WORK in the old days, when people knew horses all around and used them seriously, not just a few people having them for fun. And regardless of your heavy experience in horses AND racing, I don't think you can simply dismiss trainers of old whom many historians regard highly, placed in the HOF, not to mention undoubtedly the next-gen trainers who would've come after in a training tree. BTW, I'd agree surfaces were simpler, but what is the point of how much he ran?
@@theOlLineRebel My point was that Trump and his followers are into macho things. I don't know if you realize this, but Trump destroyed a wonderful colt when he bought one yrs ago, by insisting against the trainer's advice to get it out and run it after they'd had a viral assault at their stable. Totally destroyed it's entire career and almost its life.
They suffered later in life with problems related to being run on these surfaces and so much. It's not that horses today are hot house etc now so much than they've been inbred so much to those that have bad legs. Some of the top speed horses over the last 30 had very bad legs, but were repeatedly bred and then inbred so it's been inherited. Now they can't sustain and why they break down all the time. Limited gene pool.
"Only been accomplished 11 times"
I just laugh when I hear that now!
I didnt