The Battle of the Diets: Is Anyone Winning (At Losing?)
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- Опубліковано 21 тра 2008
- January 17, 2008 presentation by Christopher Gardner for the Stanford School of Medicine Medcast lecture series.
The case for low-carbohydrate diets is gaining weight. Christopher Gardner, PhD, assistant professor of medicine at the Stanford Prevention Research Center, has completed the largest and longest-ever comparison of four popular diets using real-world conditions, which he discusses - the lowest-carbohydrate Atkins diet came out on top.
Stanford University School of Medicine:
med.stanford.edu/
Stanford University Channel on UA-cam:
/ stanforduniversity
53:53
" I don't know. I'm not pushin' it yet, I'm just thinking about it. You've gotta realize what a bitter pill this was for a 25 year vegetarian to have to write, in a paper, that Atkins did better than the other diets. Y'know I should get a little extra credibility for sayin' that cuz I was going totally the other way when I started this study. " Christopher Gardner
This man is so discretely heroic in his thinking. I respect that what we put in our bodies is very personal thus controversial matter. But I also respect the pitfalls of bad thinking and the enormous ability we have as humans to ignore new, useful information. What I admire about the guy is that he is that rarest kind thinker open to changing ones mind, and whose opinions actually might change with that new information instead of doubling down on bias. That's what good science and great scientists are made of.
Hat's off to Dr. Gardner for having the rare intellectual courage to say "I don't know" and invite other possiblilities. He deserves all the 'extra credibility' he asks for and then some.
I'll say I'm proud of dr. Christopher Gardner.. I've been (last 5 yrs., 2015) researching diet sciences (as a background young M.D., trying to find what's best for patients), and while I'm biased towards Keto/Carnivore.. I am usually more proud of vegan or WFPB/keto *that admits when they don't know* & stick to the scientific process.
Bias is certainly part of research, sometimes it is what drives it, but in the end it's all about safety, methodology and results. Most previous 2005 below nutritional sciences are junk (with the observational/self-reported types).. and I can see why in 2005-2020 there was practically a war between WFPB (Whole Carbs) vs. Keto (High Fat), which is a good thing since they're doubling-down on their own respective research.
While past/ancestral diet of humans are definitely flexible/'Omnivorous', research on future human diet is still valid, since in the future we have more choices for 'food/macros' (since past outcomes doesn't predict future outcomes). If I have to guess... by just implementing low-moderate GI (glycemic index) foods whether WFPB/Keto, not over-eating + intermittent fasting (IF), that'll be the one to come on top. Research-wise tho... I think the easiest 'diet data' to accomplish in order are:
1) Carnivore Diet [since they basically eat just animal-products, easier to source/control]
2) Keto [since their definition of Macros are mainly high-fat]
3) WFPB/Vegan (since the macros varies between high carb, mid, to low; not to mention the countless vegetations variables; does Plant Fats/Seed Oils, PUFAs matter?)
Anyways.. interesting years 2020-2030 will be for nutritional science.
The only issue is this is _fifteen years ago_ , and if anything new has gone more to one extreme, and it certainly isn't the study that by far out performed the others in this presentation. Just see his latest documentary or the work he is doing with ZOE. He literally cited Ron Krauss multiple times in this video but is still behaving this way in 2024? It's a shame.
I like how he suggests that different people might do better on different diets, unlike most people that claim there is one diet that everyone should follow.
Yes, that's obvious from watching the video.
We are the same species. Of cause there is a species specific species diet. But there is variables from individual to individual
whole food plant based diet. So, no, the "anyone could eat a different diet" is not correct. 1+1=2, every time. same as our diets. Whole foods are healthy, processed aren't.
I LOVE THAT LECTURE. I've watched it half a dozen times, read Good Calories, Bad Calories. Gary Taubes is a genius.
I agree with you. He is full of information. Great talk.
Gary Taubes- 👍👍👍
What a wonderful, well balanced presentation. The irony of a 25 year vegetarian proclaiming that the Atkins diet beat the other 3 diets in every single category, including weight loss.
I have never been able to successfully lose weight. I have lost almost 20 pounds on keto/intermittent fasting. I am 65. I have gone from 198 to 182 and am testing my blood sugar. My doctor said my Ac1 was 6. I cant wait to get my new Ac1 number. I am very excited. It is so much easier to just not eat. I am a testament to HFLC success. (High fat low carb)
Really great presentation from Doctor Gardner.
I appreciate his intellectual honesty in presenting evidence that went again not only his preconceptions, but his own dietary lifestyle choices and those of his children. He seems to have an open, curious mind and to be an experimental scientist of the first order.
I learned that my less than 100% compliance in the real world is probably natural ... and rather than be strictly low carb, I'll aim to get any carbs from vegetables and fruits.
Brilliant! 1) honest, straight reporting of the data, 2)letting the results speak for themselves without injecting bias, 3) forthright reference to others' results, 4) very useful, 5) throws interesting light on the subject of insulin resistance. Thank you!
As a vegan physician I share Dr Gardner's dicomfort to learn that carbs are probably dietary enemy #1. My wake-up came after reading Good Calories, Bad Calories, by Gary Taubes. I was surprised to learn that this idea is an old one, with lots of pre-WWII science behind it, and post-war fat-heart disease histeria against it. Thanks for your honesty and willingness to follow the data.
12 years later the battle is going on as strong as ever, i wouldnt mind a part 2 of this if dr. Gardner gets down to it at some point :)
As I learn more and more about diet, its more and more apparent that the only people getting any real benefit from carbs are pro athletes, like people who race in the tour the france.
How the hack can a high carb diet be still so popular? Maybe because carbs are a little bit addictive and also cheaper? idk
@@danielfaller5617 you're right, and wrong...sort of. It's true, you can't really eat loads of carb and sit around doing nothing. But we're not supposed to sit around doing nothing, we're supp-osed to move. And if we're not moving we should be eating fewer calories overall.
Fats are also pretty addictive, by the way. Have you ever had a cheeseburger? It's not the bun that people are going in for...
Butter's also pretty cheap and I don't know, anyone, who doesn't love butter.
You may have seen his recent twin study. Sadly, he has doubled down on the Ornish style diet.
I don't understand why some people can't understand. The Atkins diet is NOT for everyone. If u are insulin resistant it should work pretty well for you. Not that it is the only diet that could help you but it does seem to be the easiest to implement and easiest to actually lose body fat. Once again it won't work for everyone. Some people do just fine on high carb low fat. But guess what! If u gained weight by eating high carb low fat diet then Atkins will probably make u healthier over all. No offense to the millions of Asians who eat high carb low fat every day in Asia. Stick with it if it works for you. I can't eat legumes. I have a very strong
stomach reaction to them! I love them but know it doesn't work for me so I limit them to once or twice a year. Others can't eat dairy. Why is it so hard to believe that we don't all require the exact same diet?
Because a lot of ppl like to eat high fat. If u eat high fat, low carb, u can maintain a good weight (not saying g u would be healthy and have a low cholesterol level). And if if eat high carb low fat, u maintain healthy weight. So ppl would rather to eat high fat. I personally am grossed out with eating animals and high fat.
Chris Gardner has my seal of approval. That rarest of diet guys, he's actually willing to look at the facts, instead of trying to promote an agenda. There is more useful information in this video than thousands of crazy doctors with a vegetable or half crazed Australians!
Durianriders lol
The major take I get from these investigations is the weight loss failure rate from merely buying a book is +99%.
I have followed the Keto lifestyle for the last 3.5 years. I lost 120 pounds in 8 months and have kept it off. All of my lab markers are exemplary for a 66 year old and I feel great. I eat animal products and veggies that grow above the ground. The key is learning to live without sugar and all of it's sources. Whenever I get bored with this lifestyle, I take a minute to bend over tie my shoes!!
He is what scientists should be. Willing to accept findings even when they dont say what you want them to say. We got to the national dietary guidelines because scientists threw out studies that proved their hypothesis to be wrong and published their guidelines anyways.
Professor Gardner is so easy going and mellow and seems completely objective as well.
One of the most informative presentations on the subject I've seen so much. I truly learned a lot from that alone and start to understand what's going on with my health and what foods I should avoid (as a type 2 diabetic, omg carbs are so much easier to acquire if I am not careful :P). I also like that the presenter is not looking at it religiously but trying to present the facts and discuss them as objectively as possible. I really appreciate that.
Brilliant! Finally someone acknowledging that different people resond diffetently to diets. I am insulin resistant and I find low catb diets work for me... now I understand why. So much interesting info in this presentation. Well worth a watch.
for some reason i want to listen to some john denver now
nyame damballah Yesssss! Kept waiting for him to belt out... Country road take me home...
He looks a little like John Denver. I was thinking the same thing...
I thought he looked familiar...
Wow! This iconfirms what I've learned by using myself as a guinea pig. I went all "Ornish" back in the mid 90's, and my triglycerides were not happy. I did Atkins against my better judgement in the late 90's to prove a point. It didn't prove my point, and my lipids looked great afterwards. I've been waiting for research to justify it to me before I could really accept it. This man needs to be a keynote speaker at ADA!!
Woah, this is an awesome lecture! I'm very glad I watched it. Fascinating!
I enjoyed the video! Great diets overview by Christopher Gardner. I'd love to follow this channel closely for more good stuff.
This is the best talk I've seen on diet because it addresses what I'd been suspecting. I have failed on low fat diets for years and did have metabolic syndrome. I tried low carb and it worked fabulously. But it is also true that there are a lot of vegan folks out there who also get good results with their diets. I nearly starved when I tried veg and was depressed but they say their energy and mood is great. I've thought both diets worked depending on the person. Looks like that is the case.
I have a small issue with this video. He stated "it's not all steak & whipped cream, like he tells you..." in reference to Atkins. Having read the first book, the 3rd and the latest (by Dr. Westman at Duke U.), Dr. Atkins NEVER said that. It's obvious he never read any of the books. If you only read the first 'phase' of the diet, you will come away totally misinformed.
Perfect video on diet from Stanford of course. Top notch. Excellent speech.
I wish I had eaten low-carb long ago because, even anecdotally, I do have more energy. I was a good athlete but would have liked the extra energy to use. Nice study. I liked the part showing the effectiveness of Atkins on insulin resistant folks. I also liked how Atkins lowered all numbers for common risk measures for heart disease... even though the control group couldn't hold to 15% carbs. It appears to be effective even if it isn't followed exactly... especially if you are insulin resistant.
Genuinely impressive lecture
How you could explain that Atkins diet, have improved health of these women, when in your opinion animal food is causing diseases?
Also how you will explain Tokelau ethnic group have no hearth disease, when 49% of their diet is saturated fat.
How you have determine, that animal food, not high carbohydrate consumption cause disease?
Ketoginic life style has saved my life ! Off 2 blood pressure pill & thyroid and 1/2 f my leukemia meds " I sleep like I'm 20 at 56 my energy is amazing each week gets better & better " i'v lose 49 lbs since August I could never lose a pound before ! I'v so got this now !!!!!! Life is good again !
If you are interested in treating diabetes the best results that ive had is called the ralfs remedy method (look for it on google) without a doubt the most incredible website i've had.
how do you manage your ketogenic bad breath?
Michelle Proctor Right huh ! I am such a fan. I am down 16 pounds looking forward to losing more. Go keto !
Etienne-Emile Antikatastaseis A problem. Let me know.
I was a vegetarian (HCLF) for 15 years and developed really bad IBS-D. Now I am a vegetarian ketogenic (LCHF Atkins) and eat eggs with tomato & onions, 1 avocado, hard cheese, and chia seeds with coffee, tea, and tons of water and some chocolate - once a day and I have a ton of energy and feel better (my IBS-D improved and my quality of life increased immensely). Christopher makes a great point that no size fits all so I am most likely carb-intolerant, but others who are not will flourish on a vegetarian HCLF diet.
Especially true when it comes to weight loss - it is important to recognise what the problem to the high weight is first if a e weight loss regime are to be succesful....
You need fish, meat to be really ok. Eggs are a good step thou
This is one of the best diet presentations I've seen because the researcher rationally discusses all of the other key variables as well as just presenting his results. This is the way to make progress in this field - not by pitting one nutrient against another in cult-like fashion, but realizing that it is necessary for each person to find the right balance for themselves, as well as making smart choices where all these variables are concerned such as water, sleep, exercise, portions, etc.
Always good to see some new information on an important topic.
I loved this! I absolutely love this speaker. He is very easy to listen to and likable. :)
If you don't understand the fuss then you are indeed fortunate to have a working metabolism and blessed with good genes. All the people in my family are plump around the middle regardless of diet. I have eaten a healthy whole foods diet with lots of veg, whole grains, and reasonable portions for years. I'm also a lifelong exerciser with lots of outdoor pursuits. And I kept slowly gaining weight anyway. It just isn't that simple. I had to drop my carbs to under 100 a day and now I'm slim.
It's a great video to better understand how diets works and how to pick up the right one. Thanks for sharing
@ Christopher Gardner
Thank you so much for explaining that most of us get far too much protein. I've recently started to eat one meal a day and the keto people all say we need at least 0.8g of protein per kg of body weight and I was really concerned about that because I can't eat that much protein in one meal. I had a renal transplant six years ago and since then I have been primarily veg/pescatarian which has made me feel a lot better. After the transplant I suddenly just didn't seem to enjoy the taste of meat any more and couldn't seem to digest solids pieces of meat regardless of how long I chewed them for. I will occasionally still have a bit of pâté or something mince based if I go for dinner at other people's houses because I don't want to be a nuisance and that doesn't seem to cause me discomfort. Thank you for sharing.
This is right up there with Dr. Lustig's Sugar: The Bitter Truth.
Great video! Thanks for the unbiased research!
This talk is so interesting. My dad had serious heart disease. He was given Ornish's book that was in the 90s. Since it was in the house I read it cover to cover. I was in high school. Later, in 2001, I bought Atkins book. I did do Atkins and lost huge weight. But I also did Weight Watchers. On Weight Watchers I was within 5 pounds of my BMI but then I moved didn't have ww near me. Then I did physicians diet and it was really hard to do so I gave up. I am back at Weight Watchers lost 40+ pounds. I like because I can eat in the real world. It is slower but I don't mind. This was posted 10 years ago, has it been updated? Because I have friends who swear by the Paleo diet. It is funny to hear him talk about the Paleo diet because it must have been new at the time.
I have had a tremendous amount of success limiting carbs to less than 10% of my daily macro intake. I have lost over 30 pounds now and my recent physical showed essentially perfect results in every category (LDL, HDL, Tryg, BP, etc). I eat healthy fats and some that are considered to be not so healthy. However, I do load up on fats like coconut and the fats that are contained in nuts and seeds and avocados. I eat salads with mainly green veggies and some beans but no high glycemic veggies such as tomatoes. I have been losing fat and gaining muscle. I run and work out daily. In short it works extremely well and I have no difficulty keeping my carbs low. In fact most days my carb intake is under 5%, sometimes 2-3%. The days when it is above 5% are days when I eat salads. I try to do that at least 3 days a week so I get all my plant nutrients and good fiber. I will carb load every 7-10 days so I can do some heavy weightlifting and gain more muscle. That is something I am experimenting with to see if it will help me add some muscle mass more quickly then simply staying on a Keto diet all the time. I have seen some good results so far. So that is one or two cheat days every 10 days. That will usually be a Saturday or Sunday so I can lift heavy on Monday. On those days I will eat pancakes, potatoes, fries, really whatever I want with an emphasis on protein and starches.
+Jesse Sewell of course your diet works...every study ever done shows it works better than high carb / low fat / low protein diets. Vegans aren't really interested in diets primarily...they interested in promoting their love of critters over food. I just ignore them. I've lost 20 lbs in two month on LCHF diet....it's yummy...it works.
+Jesse Sewell Your diet sounds very much like John Kiefer's Carb Nite Solution. Ultra-low carb all week, and then one night you get carbs. It's supposed to reset your hormones and keep your
metabolism higher. Might be an interesting read for you.
Joe Hufford Thanks for the tip. I will look into him. It seems to be working really well. Its also just a nice emotional break because lets face it, Cheeseburgers with fries and an occasional Coke is Spectacular. I completely ate everything in site and my weight continued to drop over the weekend. Basically I allow myself one 24 hour period where I eat whatever I want. I don't go to the Buffet restaurant, but I don't limit my calories or choices at all. If I want cake, no problem, soda, pizza, whatever. I was honestly shocked that I did not gain a single pound. But I will say that I work out almost every day and I think that is very important to keep your metabolism going. At least it seems to me like everything starts to slow down metabolically when I miss workouts more than two days in a row.
+Jesse Sewell this kind of ketogenic diet seems to work good for weight loss and hormone level show great results. but i guess it takes a lot of research for what you can eat, so that it does not get boring and the also the logistic that you have that kind of food everywhere where you need it (for example at your workplace where you don't have a ketogenic food supply somewhere around).
I think these are the key factors to stay on it.
I really enjoyed your video. I simply started a physical fitness company were I selling crossFit workout devices and I discovered the details in your video to be quite helpful. I'm a doctor of chiropractic and I see that you are informed in this field. If you don't mind me asking, exactly how long of you been in this field?
After years of hearing everyone's personal pros and cons on these diets, it's wonderful to see this kind of presentation even if it is now 7 1/2 years later.
I have been reading A LOT about high fat/moderate protein/low carbohydrate diets and nutritional ketosis, and I have been experimenting. It makes sense to me, since eating high fat/moderate protein/low carbohydrate and achieving nutritional ketosis have shown improvement in so many things...weight management, energy, hormones, anti-inflammation (and epileptic seizures and cancer). And it seems more scientists and nutritionists are arriving at a similar conclusion.
The only drawback is that converting our bodies from burning carbohydrates to burning fats is extremely difficult for many people...including me. It probably doesn’t help that I was the best at low fat/no fat eating…for over 30 years. Not necessarily important, but here's my story: facebook.com/HealthyKetopia/posts/842506689138147:0
Later this month, I will be taking a brand new product (releases 7/10) that resets your body and allows it to achieve nutritional ketosis within hours...rather than days. It is the culmination of work by Dr. Dominic D'Agostino, PhD. Anyone who is interested in also trying it or seeing how this turns out for me is welcome to contact/follow me on Facebook using the above link.
I did and I am continuing to eat keto, as well as continuing to take the exogenous ketones. I can see and feel the benefits for myself and others around me...especially my 87 year old mother, who is so much sharper in her thinking and speaking, upbeat, and much more active.
Ketosis is only nutritional when you are ill or starving because then it keeps you from dying for lack of food. Forcing your body into a state of starvation mode and calling that ‘health’ makes no sense. It is anorexia’s uglier cousin.
Great video and inspiring...keep up the good work and hey...good job
what i like about this is he lets everyone continue on the study, because that is real life, some people have more resolve than others and some stray but do a version of the diet they were prescribed. Solid science because he doesn't make an leaps from the data. More science like this will help to clear up all of the nutritional mess that is out there.
What a great speaker.
This is a great video. Very impressive to come from someone who is a vegetarian.
Thank you for the informative response :)
I take it as an adequate endorsement of low carb diets. I am following one and seeing good results.
Coming from Stanford, this has a lot of weight.
I observe that keto diet has not found a mention.
Great talk!
From my own experience substituting carbohydrates for fat is quite easy if you allow yourself to eat carbohydrates now and then.
My personal experience is that my mucus membranes got less infected resulting in ease of breath, I also didn't get any extreme spikes in blood pressure after a meal.
And in my opinion it tastes a lot better, fat(specially animalian fats) are much more tasty than carbohydrates which tend to get quite bland. I got a whole lot of new culinary delights introduces to me.
god bless this dude!!!
The effect of a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet versus a low-glycemic index diet on glycemic control in type 2 diabetes mellitus
The diet lower in carbohydrate led to greater improvements in glycemic control, and more frequent medication reduction/elimination than the low glycemic index diet. Lifestyle modification using low carbohydrate interventions is effective for improving and reversing type 2 diabetes.
It is refreshing that honesty in scientific research still exist. Despite his bias against Atkins, he presented the data as it was and not as he wanted it. The 1977 Senate Committee by Senator McGovern and the USDA with the food pyramid is largely responsible for the obesity and diabetes epidemic facing us today. They proposed the low fat (necessarily high carb) diet for the American people and what did it result in? That is government programs for you.
@alphacause Thank you very much for taking the time to give me a detailed response. I appreciate it.
assuming. not necessarily, but its important to remember that high is a relative term. plus, carbs can be diluted. i will look into the blog. thanks.
Ancient Greeks had a saying : '' Pan metron ariston'' which means ''everything but in moderation''. Furthermore, Hippocrates the father of medicine maintained that ''food is the body's medicine''. You don't gorge on medicine,do you?Therefore eat small portions,be active and exercise and keep a balance enjoying all foods.Has worked for me. I don't believe that excluding any category of foods is the answer,we only live once and we should be able to enjoy all foods.Of course this applies for most people,as there is a minority with special problems who should take a different approach.
Very helpful video.
GREAT video.
He's on the right path. Another sign of hope for the future of the official nutritional advice in the US.
The official dietary guidelines are still a decade later are still based on myths solely to profit the Medical Pharmaceutical Agricultural Complex!
at 23:00 - atkins/paleo/keto is *very* effective once carbohydrates are cut below 50g daily. Once the body becomes adapted to burning fats instead of carbs, all hunger pangs and sugar cravings go away. The issue with carbohydrates is that once the liver becomes saturated with glucose(less than 200g), whatever glucose is left in the blood will spike insulin production and cause all those miserable feelings experienced when eating merely calorie-restricted diets. Just replace carbs with fats.
Here's more control studies and their conclusions. "A low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet versus a low-fat diet to treat obesity and hyperlipidemia: a randomized, controlled trial."
CONCLUSION
Compared with a low-fat diet, a low-carbohydrate diet program had better participant retention and greater weight loss. During active weight loss, serum triglyceride levels decreased more and high-density lipoprotein cholesterol level increased more with the low-carbohydrate diet than with the low-fat diet
One of the major factors, that is often overlooked, in macro-nutrient studies, is the actual QUALITY of food. Is it organic, natural, un or minimally processed, high nutrient,etc.? Or is it degraded unhealthy processed crap full of chemicals and lacking in nutrition? All of these diets will work infinitely better if the actual quality of the food is vastly improved.
what does Organic have to do with anything. Organic is a religion not science
Great video its nice to see some really honest science.
This video is rather old and what Dr. Gardner has done further with this study as a base as far as genetics and diet goes hase been quite interesting.
Love the Stanford Fashion.
can I repost this in mu Nutrition Blog? My name is Luis Born I'm a new student in Science of Nutrition with Christopher Stanford and getsmart, blesses!
Great video. Eating healthy is the key to a leaner body.
could someone please put subtitles in Portuguese in this video?
It is very important that everyone knows that.
Our discussion is pretty much over but thanks for your questions and time. In sticking with science and facts, the current servings guideline is now 9 per day, no longer 6. Its natural that we like veggies because that's the food we are designed to eat for optimum health.
Low carb, get the grains out. The amount of fiber needed in our diet is zero if we aren’t eating carbs
If you support this for ethical reasons, I salute you. You are willing to die for your morals.
My mother believed whole heartedly in vegan ways. Read every book, ordered thousands upon thousands of dollars in vitamins and supplements.
You have not one shred of evidence to share. Read the research. However, once again...very happy that so many are vegans. Very good news for the rest of us.
This is a really good presentation. There's one part of it that i don't understand, though. While the Zone, Ornish and USDA diets are "static" (your meal plan doesn't change from the first week to the last one) Atkins diet is dynamic, it starts with very little to zero carbs and it adds them as the diet progresses. Can't all the weight gains be attributed to the addition of carbs?
@IskurBlast
any links to his newer work?
i am on low carb diet for almost 2 months, somehow, I managed to lose around 5 kgs. And I am now, monitoring my Blood sugar if it will also go down.
This was very intresting.
I work with some elderly who are overweight. Will the LCHF diet work for 80-somethings?
Why didn’t you think, maybe if low carbs is good for you is it possible that everything we have said is possibly wrong. Due to what we presumed in the first place.
A big point here is this guy doesn’t want Atkins to be right. He is a vegetarian
There are 2 things one must know: (1) It is not about low-carb vs high carb. It is about low glycemic eating which is the healthiest way to eat, and (2) eating for your own metabolic profile is best. (There is a well researched questionnaire - consisting of 50 questions - to help you know which you are - Para Sympathetic, Sympathetic, or Balance). And corn - it is high glycemic, therefore unhealthy, and it - and its' byproducts - are in most processed foods. (I have the questionnaire)
I think a major flaw with is work is ironically the way he designed the study to be more practical. He makes the decision to study how people in his opinion would react in the general public when trying these diets, after some instruction and a reading assignment.. Especially the Ornish diet which may be seen as difficult. I think he's neglecting another aspect of human nature in that the more evidence provided to substantiate a particular diet the more people will be willing to follow the stricter guidelines. The problem is that as any method of doing anything, in any profession gains credibility it gets much easier to learn, follow, and adhere to. Advancements are made and we never look back. So basically no one in the study was actually on the Ornish diet, or if there were a few, their results were not looked at independently. I think this is more of a study on which diets are easier to learn and follow, and thus show the better results currently based on a number of factors including compliance, but I think it's a bit too early for compliance to be such an important factor, because that can always be improved with education, evidence based research, better recipes, etc... Wed need to determine optimal goals first and work on achieve-ability later, when we have a clearer understanding of our goal, and getting people to buy in will be much easier. Unfortunately these types of mistakes happen often when organisations/ governments try with all good intentions to save the most people. They dumb down the evidence and try to find solutions that are palatable to the highest percentage of people in the population. I think this short term thinking may initially provide better results, but in the long run hurts everyone. Science and the scientific method always provides the best answers. If you run the experiment correctly, yes, initially only those who are highly motivated and willing to sacrifice will benefit, but human nature dictates that with results even the least educated among us will adopt the system that provides the best results. So although it's extremely difficult to "house and feed" participants...That's the kind of data we need to move on from the question of "What?" to "How?".....
awesome thanks for sharing. I have upped my fat, been trying to avoid grains (wich eliminates a ton of foods) and have some protein daily I feel much better.
Bad thing in Japan is the picking season for strawberries is winter. Luckily they do sell strawberries in the summer.
That was a great lecture. While he still thinks that saturated fat is bad and fiber has to be good (it can be, but it can also cause problems in excessive amounts for some people), he is surprisingly neutral and focuses on the science. That's rare in the field of nutrition. Most people have their opinions and try to find science to support their views (usually observational studies).
Agreed...lots of raw vegetables and fruit with a relatively moderate to small amount of protein .
by diluting i am talking about fiber again. fiber slows down the breakdown of carbs; this is why atkins people subtract grams of fiber for a net carb count. id be interested in getting exact figures for your Kitavans, South Americans and Okinawans. where can i find this?
Well, but you also have to consider that your body and metabolism adapt over time. So if someone is bombing his blood sugar constantly up or only eats in big but scattered chunks (like 2 big meals a day), he shouldn't wonder that his body is in constant starvation mode and stores fat. That is the reason why you can even get fat, despite eating less calories than your TDEE.
70's hair, but great speaker and interesting subject.
I've been watching documentaries like this for a while. In the comments, I see people who swear that they have been doing low carb, high fat and have lost weight and achieved better "numbers". There seem to be just as many people who swear that the low fat, high carb approach has done the same for them. So it's occurred to me that maybe it's not the carbs OR the fat that's bad, but rather the carbs AND the fat, eaten in large amounts together. That would mean that if you cut either one drastically, you can eat lots and lots of the other and not develop metabolic syndrome, etc. Any thoughts on this?
Ellen Beckett Sure that can work. There are just a few things low-carb diets have going for them: in just about every study comparing low-carb, high-fat to low-fat, high-carb, the lchf group lost the most fat and decreased their triglycerides, blood pressure, insulin resistance, and LDL cholesterol. Furthermore, people on the low-carb diet say that they don't get hungry on this diet because fat and protein improve satiety, whereas a high-carb diet can mess with insulin and leave one feeling hungry. Thus a low-carb diet requires less suffering and now calorie counting, while a high-carb diet requires more self-control to not eat while still hungry and calorie counting.
Low-fat, high carb diets seem to work better for people who live a more active life-style than those who don't.
Ellen Beckett Also, there are no essential carbohydrates. There are essential fatty-acids and there are essential amino-acids. One's body can survive and thrive without carbohydrates. One's body will suffer and eventually get sick and die without essential fatty-acids and essential amino acids. So if you want to cut something from your diet, maybe cutting non-essential macros that can increase appetite and are a fairly difficult way to lose weight.
Put another way, the world has been told to go on a high-carb, low-fat diet for the past 50 years. Obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer have all been on the rise at an alarming rate in the last 50 years. Maybe the diet we've been on for the last 50 years that has led to these epidemics isn't the diet that works. Especially since the data shows that 95% + diets based on this idea fail.
I would agree. Some people are not able to tolerate the low carb high fat/protein diets, and others seem to have trouble with high carb low fat/protein. I believe everyone can benefit from a plant-based diet however.
I have a problem with plant based diets because they are very restrictive and their benefits are questionable at best. If you are vegan because of moral reasons, more power to you. However, being vegan because it's healthy is based on spurious data.
Here's a study by Dr. Barnard (prominent vegan) showing the results of a vegan diet compared to the diet recommended by the ADA on diabetic patients: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2677007/
If you don't feel like reading it, he put people on a vegan diet for 72 weeks (about 1.5 years) and their Hb1Ac dropped from 8 to 7.6. Anything above 6.5 is dangerous and 5-6.5 is not good. So after a huge amount of time on a very strict diet, some improvement and they lost 4.4kg.
Now here's 24 weeks (1/3 of the time) on a low-carb diet:
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/2633336/
The low-carb HbA1c went from 8.8 to 7.3 (much bigger drop than the vegan diet in much less time) and also lost 3.9kg. So if we want to be honest and fair, a low-carb diet is far better than a vegan diet if it takes 3x as long for a vegan diet to get almost as good results as a low-carb diet. Vegan diet decreased Hb1Ac 0.4 while low carb dropped it 1.5 and lost a similar amount of weight, but all in 1/3 the time frame.
This isn't an anomaly. Every time you see data on a vegan diet, it's either observational data (worthless) or a very strict vegan diet compared to some stupid gov't formed diet (you know, the ones that have increased our rates of obesity, diabetes and heart disease for the past 50+ years). It never looks good compared to a low-carb diet, and even vegans like Dr. David Katz agree that a vegan diet does not extend one's life. He's vegan because he believes it will save the environment. Freedom vs Tyranny
Huai Li Thanks for your input and sources. I appreciate you taking the time to research these issues. It's true that plant-based diets can be equally as unhealthy as the standard American diet if done improperly. I do object to the treatment of animals in the meat, dairy, and fishing industries, but I certainly feel better on a Vegan diet as well (I was Vegetarian for about 3 years before I became Vegan). It is important for Vegans to make sure they are getting the proper balance of vitamins, minerals, protein, and fats yet this is also important for those not following a plant-based lifestyle. Plant based diets can be healthy if done correctly. :)
Saturated fat, if from healthy sources, is actually very healthy and needed in the body. Reducing or eliminating it is unhealthy.
Really? Nutritionfacts.org? Do you know who is the author?
Jordan ॐ fourhourworkweek.com/2009/06/06/saturated-fat/
Jordan ॐ All the science you posted has been debunked long ago. Also the studies that concluded that saturated fat is bad for you is from flawed and biased studies aka bad science. Everyone who keeps up with the science would tell you that a low-carb, high-fat diet is much healthier for you.
Jordan ॐ Not true at all. High Carb still means high sugar (since all carbs convert to sugar in the body). The body was EVOLVED to eat meat. Saturated meat is good for you.
+kaunas888
How exactly can one eliminate fat from one's diet. Even sugary fruits like dates have some fat. I suppose you could eliminate all fat in one's diet by eating nothing but table sugar. But, who is going to think that eating nothing but table sugar is healthful?
Eating high fat was what correlated positively with various metrics of heart health in this study, they didn't ask the participants if they ate meat. What they didn't measure was the long term effects of the high fat diet on cancer rates which I'd be interested to see to compare the results to the fat-cancer correlation found in "The China Study"
Oi! Why are some of the figures on the presentation blacked out? :(
amazing vid :)
Why are some parts of the presentation blacked out?
This was a great presentation - however they missed out on what carbs do your to your appetite and leptin. I have my clients do a Atkins style diet and allow then a 'treat day' this cause people to be very adherent knowing they will have a break. Once again excellent presentation, hearing a vegetarian say the meat diet was best is funny, but I have so much respect for him admitting the findings as opposed to others fudging numbers to fit their desired out come.
You really need to view the Primitive Nutrition channel on youtube. You have much to learn.
This is well out of date by now, youtube recomemmendation brought this up for me. Now we know low carb and especially keto and carnivore beat the crap out of high carb and especially vegan diets in weight loss and overall low inflammation and metabolic health for the average person of european heritage.
That’s right but Chris Gardner has gone even further done the WFPB diet forgetting everything he previously found, perhaps because it doesn’t align with his personal values.
Well but this study isn't saying anyting about longterm effects. Also Atkins weight was going up again after 6 months. Probably means that after 2 years they'd just be back at their normal weight
Hot kiss videos
"Meta-analysis of prospective cohort studies evaluating the association of saturated fat with cardiovascular disease"
Conclusions: A meta-analysis of prospective epidemiologic studies showed that there is no significant evidence for concluding that dietary saturated fat is associated with an increased risk of CHD or CVD.
He actually says that the people who took part in the study were told to follow the books to the letter, which they did not & the study reflects that. It makes it a much more realistic study as almost everyone will cheat on their diet. He does make that clear, maybe you missed that part.
Yes, I heard about that. Colin Campbell said:
"Never have I witnessed such unprincipled behavior as that of the JAMA editor when he denied all four of our letters, especially a letter from Dr. Ornish whose study was being so grossly misrepresented."
This is a pretty great alk on nutrition. And those are pretty hard to find.
It is hard to maintain low carb eating, not because there's anything inherently bad with it; many of us achieve very low carb daily. The problem is all the temptation, advertising, available junk food, basically a continuous high carb presentation. And then there's the line up of dietitians, doctors, nurses, PETA pushers, and your kids, all adamant you need high carbs on your plate, and you give in to them. When you get a group of Grok minded people together helping each other, it's very easy.