Rev has always been capable of owning Seth.Heres the thing with him,his main ability is pulling things where you can't expect it,he can use pretty much anything and make it help scaling,but his arguments aren't actually very good,he misinterpents a lot of stuff(about Seth),but he is great at debunking uneducated nonsense.He seems pretty badass with his giant Xs on his debunks vids,the intimidating masked Bardock profile that you subconsciously identify him with,his high profile call outs and all the dirty language but behind that you just know he is a pathetic punk ass asshole that's weak when not behind the screen and he wants to feel at least a little glimer of power in his life via what he is doing.
@@utoresa5193 A lot of times in his debate strategy is to Talk over you and get the last word and claim victory. Basically, because I got the last word in and I am louder I win. Its been a long time since I saw one of his debate videos so he might have changed but not really sure. I am basing this off of a debate he had with Chuck about who is stronger Cell or original Movie Broly! If you have to talk over a person during a debate it is no longer a debate but an argument. I wish his debates were more like political debates, where the moderator asks someone a question and he answer and the other person has to counter his point and vice versus. His debates need to be more organized otherwise it just an argument and the one who yells loudest wins
he didn't debunk anything though , I just watched Seth video after watching this and I gotta say I agree with Seth on this topic ... people over rate Beerus too much
Davis Okeke lmao!! He wrote the bullet points, designed characters. The script for the anime was actually written by toei. The movies, such as DBS Broly was written by toriyama himself. Now, if you want to go there you’re going to Prove my point even further because according to toriyama’s *PERSONAL* writings broly is the strongest and he is being compared to BEERUS! The light novel further insinuates that. Akira Toriyama actually works more closely to Toyotaro who is doing the manga and in the manga beerus is STILL CONSIDERED THE BAR. Toyotaro has a *DIRECT* line to Akira Toriyama. Now, your point is?
True but frieza was stonger than hit but hit just had technique in the manga hit couldn't keep up with ssb in power and was kinda keeping up with ssg so unless you think goku got 50x stronger from rof to u6 ark then its slightly broken
hi x I’d say golden Frieza was stronger than Hit in the ToP. I have nothing concrete that shows he was stronger than hit anytime before that. I do remember Frieza being a little stronger than SSB Goku in revival of F, and hit killed a post revival of F SSB Goku that we all know was much stronger so, again the rule stands true. Every new enemy is stronger than the last.
@@da_hitmanhart6650 he killed goku with durability ignoring attacks and he stopped gokus heart but that was after the black arc hit was just more haxx based
hi x I understand that but you cannot take away the fact that he killed a stronger SSB Version of Goku. And even if you want to ignore that still there isn’t anything that states golden Frieza was stronger than hit. What *is* evident and can be proven without a doubt is that hit killed a stronger SSB Goku.
Yes but it wasn't hit from the u6 arc like you said golden frieza surpassed supressed beerus so I'm using the hit who couldn't use killing techniques frieza was stronger than this hit not sure about post black arc
Great video as always, RevoluShane!👍👍👍 I agree that Beerus is a moving goal Post and I promise you we all will learn that MUI Goku has never surpassed beerus before they have their rematch. Beerus is still the bar.
Nooooooooooooo!! You people just don't want goku to surpass beerus just bc his name is Lord beerus and hes a god of destruction. MUI goku HAS surpass beerus you just don't wanna believe it. Why is goku not allowed to pass beerus huh. I mean jiren is stronger then his god so why is goku not allowed to. Ohhhh myyyyy it makesssssssss noooo sence. Mui and beerus are very close in power
Beerus got beat up in the God battle royale and couldn't win while Jiren flat out beat a GoD they wrote themselves into a corner Beerus is a badly written character....simple
Either that or he trains Off-screen, Remember he lives for ever as long as he is God, he could easily train in some God version of time chamber for 1 thousand years if he feels like it must be done.But yea writting is fucked, i think Beerus is too popular and they do not want him to become obsolete yet.
I honestly do believe that too, there has to be a reason as to why they are keeping his power still an unknown value. Same with the other gods of destruction, not enough is said about them.
It hasn't been used as the basis for any other material so no. I do hope that eventually the Manga and Anime realign and tell the story the same way agin though because Toyotaro has potential.
All they got to do to Justify Beerus Still being stronger is what they did with Master Roshi at the 22 Martial Arts Tournament or their explanation for Roshi at the Tournament of power. When Goku got Master UI Beerus decided to get serious with his training because of he afraid that they would surpass him
Thank you!!! Cause people just say random stuff on Beerus. Like it’s not rocket science that the Beerus is the Apex character both in the Anime and the Manga.
Except the end HAS come,the series is over for more than 2 years.Its gonna be a new phase when it starts again for sure,they might go for the angels levels.The intro always said "surpass the gods" and there were statements they surpassed the gods in the TOP arc.Vegeta surpassed GOD Toppo,Jiren was above Belmod and Goku surpassed Beerus
Wasn't Jiren said to be the mortal stronger than the god of destruction of his universe, later revealed to be Belmod, who Whis then said was stronger than Beerus, though Beerus denied & simply said he lost an arm wrestling match?
at this point Beerus is just useless , he doesn't even do his job and even Zeno said so himself ... let's just go ahead and replace him as GoD ... if I had to place Beerus somewhere it would be Gogeta = UI Goku > Broly > Jiren > Beerus
If this is the case, this would put UI Omen 3 Goku, Jiren full power, Full power broly, Vegito Blue (merged zamasu arc) and Beerus all in the same power bracket. In my opinion: Bracket 1 1. Gogeta Blue (Broly Movie) 2. Mui Goku (T.O.P) 3. Limits broken Jiren 4. Moro (Full power) 5. UI omen Goku (Moro arc) = Evolution Blue Vegeta (Moro Arc) Bracket 2 6. Full Power Jiren 7. Vegito Blue (Zamasu arc) = Beerus Full power = Full Power Super Saiyan Broly 9. UI omen phase 3 Goku (T.O.P) Bracket 3 - The most difficult bracket to judge due to it being difficult to directly compare SS2 kefla to G.o.D Toppo. If all 4 of them battled based on raw power alone it could go either way, if we ignore ui omen goku's superior speed. 10. SSB Evolution Vegeta 11. UI Omen phase 2 Goku 12. G.O.D Toppo 13. SS2 Kefla Bracket 4 14. UI omen phase 1 Goku Bracket 5. 15. SS Kefla 16. SSB Kaioken x20 Goku
Can't really consider him as a "moving goalpost" because his power has never really been defined. Patiently waiting for your video on how Goku is the true villain of DBS.
But that's exactly what it means. We were given MULTIPLE points where we were given Beerus' general ballpark and all of them push him further away from Goku and Vegeta to the point of it getting ridiculous. He should never have even been in the CONVERSATION about Merged Zamasu and Vegito Blue.
@@jamainegardner4193- when did they change the criterion for Beerus' power level? As a matter of fact when did they tell us that his power level was at a certain number? If anyone is a "moving goalpost" in DB then it's Frieza or Goku. Hell plot armor alone is enough to see that those two are the actual moving goalposts.
Given that retcons exist, does the word of the author hold any real meaning?! If the Author says yes, but the Publisher/Editors say no, does the Author still matter, despite it being their job to fix the Author's mistakes or refuse to publish if they don't like the idea. inversely?! I believe that writer death occurs after the first retcon, as it shows their word has no meaning, due them changing what was established.
Broly most likely would still lose to Jiren and MUI Goku because of there speed advantage. Jiren did go toe to toe with MUI Goku after many times Goku increased his energy which boosted his speed drastically. In the manga Jiren did have a similar limit breaker transformation like in the anime and it did prove to counter MUI Goku. Broly merely has more battle power but he doesn’t wield it properly.
How when he tossed ssb goku and vegeta and frieza we gonna forget king vegeta literally said he can be a threat to the universe and what broly has ridiculous speed and strength
Saint Gogeto There was another statement from the novel, where Frieza stated SS Broly to be so strong that no one could defeat him. Revolushane covered it in his previous vids on Broly and Jiren last year.
@@MrOverhaul thanks, I'll check it later. However the novel statement of Golden Frieza puts Broly as the strongest IN EXITSENCE. So then would'nt the statement be invalid due to it also arguing ssj Broly > Zeno ?
Mr. Overhaul You wouldn’t actually scale him above everybody in existence. This is just what Frieza believes. So considers Friezas perspective. If Broly is the strongest person Frieza has ever seen in that statement,then everyone’s power who he has witnessed pales in comparison. So basically Broly>everyone Frieza has actually fought or whose powers he’s witnessed first hand.
@@hecantguardme15 but i stele think that for goku jiren full power with no break limits is not above beerus,because i expected goku to compare broly with jiren but he compare broly with berus and they say that broly is the strongest opponent he never face why goku compare broly with beerus and not with jiren
I don’t understand. It’s *clearly* implied in both the anime and the manga that Belmod was stronger than Beerus. And it’s *clearly* stated that Jiren is stronger than Belmod. And UI Goku was stronger than him. I don’t understand the confusion here. UI Goku > Jiren > Belmod > Beerus
Bro wtf you talkin about they stated many times that beerus is the strongest god of destruction the strongest villain they compare always with beerus,beerus was the only god that recodnize immiedatly the ultra instinct in goku at ep 110 when the other gods they don't know what power goku was using against jiren,beerus for now is the only god can be able to tap in ui but not mastered in the anime wish told this at goku in the manga beerus with a temporany ui was able to dodge 12 gods that was insane,beerus with only one ki blast would kill must part of the gods including Belmod if was not for sidra,if realy Belmod was the strongest god he would get up an go to fight against beerus and quitela,but Belmod know that there is no chance against this two,at the end of the broly movie goku compare broly with berus and not with jiren this things would make you think how beerus is far stronger than we think, and even goku black say that beerus was the must troublemake god probably he say that beerus is the strongest god of destruction,and beerus himself admited after beat vegeta mssb with one shot that vegeta in anothers universe would be a candidate for a god of destruction position but in my universe no and beerus say that before vegeta would matchim he would past millions of years basicly If a mortal is stronger than beerus is probably stronger than all gods only an idiot can say that beerus is not the strongest god of destruction there is no doubt that beerus is the strongest god of destruction
Fo Aka Before I initiate my rebuttal, let me just say that I am utterly flabbergasted that you managed to fucking type a whole damn college thesis with no decent punctuation or concept of legible grammar. I legitimately think I got dumber reading that. Critiques aside, here’s why you’re not only wrong, but a dumbass: the *whole fucking point* of Jiren’s “character” (if you could call it that) was that he was stronger than a God of Destruction that was stronger than Beerus. You just fucking cheery picked scenarios where it could be interpreted based off of one’s own personal bias that Beerus is stronger. Why does Goku compare everyone to Beerus? One: he’s the Destroyer of his own universe, and he hasn’t seen the power of the other deities first hand. Two: just because Goku compares someone to Beerus rather than Jiren, that does *not* mean that Beerus > Jiren. You’re going into that with your own head canon bullshit which skews your comprehension of the scene. When Goku compares Broly to Beerus, what he’s saying is “Wow, you’re really close to Beerus’s level,” in other words he means Broly is closer to Beerus, not Jiren. And that manga shit you brought up literally counts for nothing. Beerus claiming that Vegeta could be a GoD in other universes *doesn’t* mean every other fucking universe. And regarding Belmod’s actions during the God of Destruction Brawl, not only is that scene open to interpretation (although it’s pretty fucking clear it was inserted to demonstrate Belmod’s superiority over the other gods since he took *zero* damage), but when Belmod trapped the other gods in his technique, only the fox could break out - by your backwards hillbilly ass logic that puts Liquor over everyone else too. Maybe instead of going into something with a set mindset, actually fucking process and comprehend what the show tells you. Christ. Please don’t waste my time with another god awful reply. If you have something to say, make it halfway decent goddamnit.
Earl Pearl Oh boy. Firstly, you can’t take Whis’s statement out of context. Goku specifically asked about their chances in the tournament, Whis responded with alluding to the existence of a being stronger than a God of Destruction, who so happens to be stronger than Beerus. Yes, purple cat man said it was just an arm wrestling match, but that still means Belmod is *physically* stronger than Beerus. Since strength is powered by ki in DB, then that means that Belmod’s ki is greater than Beerus’s. Second, I’ve said it before, so I suppose I’ll humor you by reiterating myself. Belmod was the only god who came out unscratched. He didn’t play dead the whole time because there are literal manga panels of him fighting, and doing pretty damn well mind you. Additionally, it’s clear he wasn’t even trying. Never mind all of that, there are egregiously obvious narrative cues that Belmod is stronger - it’s literally what gives the arc any tension at all.
The sentence about Broly might being stronger is the evidence for that you scaled Beerus wrong, because SS Broly is on the level of SS Gogeta and we can scale SS Gogeta. Base fusions have a massive increase in power, as seen in the Buu and FT saga. The movie follows the manga continuity (the movie has no SSBKKx20 and SSBE) and from here we use manga Jiren who was stronger than 3 SSB tier fighters combined (Goku, Vegeta and Frieza), but we can boost this and say that Jiren equals 5x SSB. Gogeta is a fusion of 2 SSB tier fighter "and then some". Which means that base Gogeta could easily be 2.5x SSB tier (Gogeta couldn't have fought Broly in SS if his SS was only 2.5 times stronger than Goku's or Vegeta's SS). Gogeta then became SS, which increased his power by 50 making him 125x SSB and SS Broly equals SS Gogeta. This is why Jiren can never be equal to Broly (even if we use 10x mutliplier for SS, SS Broly would be stronger). Also, you used the term "might" when quoting that promotional artwork about Jiren's power, which says it all. It's no certainty. Beerus might be a moving goalpost, but whether or not he is, his treatment works because his power hasn't been that well defined to begin with. He was holding back against Goku, Vegeta and was taking on all the other GoDs at the same time which is leagues above anything Beerus had shown until that point due to sheer number of GoDs he was facing with ease and then the ToP came in which Goku (not Beerus) faced off against someone who was stronger than one of those Gods (one out of the eleven he faced at the same time).
@@galaxystudios370 They were roughly equal. Just watch their fight. Gogeta had 3 punches more in than Broly. Most of their punches didn't even connect.
@@TheArchevil Well, maybe not stomped, but Gogeta clearly had the advantage, considering he had a smile on his face the entire time and Broly was the first to transform (which is the only transformation scene that was lackluster in the entire movie)
@@galaxystudios370 Yes, he smiled but he only had 3 connected hits more. Which I wouldn't call a clear advantage. It might have looked that way, but it's not impressive when you start to count. Try it.
In my opinion Beerus isn't the moving goalpost, Whis is.... He's stronger and higher up on the food chain so to speak.... He's obviously more invested in mortal affairs than Beerus.... Whis also carries much more impact to the story as he's directly tied into the storyline of like 5 different characters.... Like Goku who always had a master but decides instead to take the role of master for himself before training Uub at the end of DBZ..... Vegeta received major character development after swallowing his pride and asking to be trained by Whis..... Plus you have to consider Toriyama's scale and remember that the gap between Beerus and the Saiyans is relative and somewhat comparable to the gap between Whis and himself.... Where Goku is 4 away from being on Beerus level at the start of DBS.... Beerus was 5 away from Whis..... Long story short..... Every time you hear about "Beerus The Goalpost" moving further back, imagine how many laps Whis has ran around these guys.....
A villain would have came by now..beat up beerus to hype the villain.classic db.u know dat tho..but instead the nigga chills all day..not even worried about his boss..my point is he is proctected.so not yet surpassed to my view
See this is why I rock with you. You are literally the most accurate and unbiased DB Power Scaler on UA-cam.
FelixFloetryFox88 JW exactly. Other dB UA-camrs are cool but when it comes to Jiren, the wanking is un real.
Love how Rev dealt with Seth, classy debunk
Rev has always been capable of owning Seth.Heres the thing with him,his main ability is pulling things where you can't expect it,he can use pretty much anything and make it help scaling,but his arguments aren't actually very good,he misinterpents a lot of stuff(about Seth),but he is great at debunking uneducated nonsense.He seems pretty badass with his giant Xs on his debunks vids,the intimidating masked Bardock profile that you subconsciously identify him with,his high profile call outs and all the dirty language but behind that you just know he is a pathetic punk ass asshole that's weak when not behind the screen and he wants to feel at least a little glimer of power in his life via what he is doing.
Uto Resa 519 >I used the power scaling to power scale the powerscaler
@@utoresa5193 A lot of times in his debate strategy is to Talk over you and get the last word and claim victory. Basically, because I got the last word in and I am louder I win. Its been a long time since I saw one of his debate videos so he might have changed but not really sure. I am basing this off of a debate he had with Chuck about who is stronger Cell or original Movie Broly!
If you have to talk over a person during a debate it is no longer a debate but an argument. I wish his debates were more like political debates, where the moderator asks someone a question and he answer and the other person has to counter his point and vice versus. His debates need to be more organized otherwise it just an argument and the one who yells loudest wins
how is that?
he didn't debunk anything though , I just watched Seth video after watching this and I gotta say I agree with Seth on this topic ... people over rate Beerus too much
he's a moving goal post cause they would have said it directly that he has been surpassed or someone would have beaten him by now
yvngboiwelit 100k exactly! That’s another valid reason and point.
Da_Hitman Hart you do realize that Akira toryiama had nothing to do with dbs and it’s anime
Davis Okeke lmao!!
He wrote the bullet points, designed characters. The script for the anime was actually written by toei. The movies, such as DBS Broly was written by toriyama himself.
Now, if you want to go there you’re going to
Prove my point even further because according to toriyama’s *PERSONAL* writings broly is the strongest and he is being compared to BEERUS!
The light novel further insinuates that.
Akira Toriyama actually works more closely to Toyotaro who is doing the manga and in the manga beerus is STILL CONSIDERED THE BAR. Toyotaro has a *DIRECT* line to Akira Toriyama.
Now, your point is?
Da_Hitman Hart it is, but if Beerus’s power has been increased, there’s no point in having Jiren or Broly at this point.
Sung lol, what?!😆
Seth is one of those guys that was never spanked as a kid
I wasn't spanked ever,just punched and kicked in the balls.
L J E K don’t even bother with these guys if they debate Seth they’ll all get slapped into oblivion
This comment made me laugh so hard 😂you’re totally right tho lol
Nope, the rule of every new enemy is stronger than the last was not broken.
Golden frieza was stronger than the suppressed Beerus in BoG’s.
True but frieza was stonger than hit but hit just had technique in the manga hit couldn't keep up with ssb in power and was kinda keeping up with ssg so unless you think goku got 50x stronger from rof to u6 ark then its slightly broken
hi x I’d say golden Frieza was stronger than Hit in the ToP. I have nothing concrete that shows he was stronger than hit anytime before that. I do remember Frieza being a little stronger than SSB Goku in revival of F, and hit killed a post revival of F SSB Goku that we all know was much stronger so, again the rule stands true.
Every new enemy is stronger than the last.
@@da_hitmanhart6650 he killed goku with durability ignoring attacks and he stopped gokus heart but that was after the black arc hit was just more haxx based
hi x I understand that but you cannot take away the fact that he killed a stronger SSB Version of Goku. And even if you want to ignore that still there isn’t anything that states golden Frieza was stronger than hit. What *is* evident and can be proven without a doubt is that hit killed a stronger SSB Goku.
Yes but it wasn't hit from the u6 arc like you said golden frieza surpassed supressed beerus so I'm using the hit who couldn't use killing techniques frieza was stronger than this hit not sure about post black arc
11:02 I was not expecting to see that video in your video XD
Great video as always, RevoluShane!👍👍👍
I agree that Beerus is a moving goal
Post and I promise you we all will learn that MUI Goku has never surpassed beerus before they have their rematch.
Beerus is still the bar.
Or they could say Beerus has been training because he didn't want Goku to surpass him
Sonny Woods true too!! One way or the other MUI Goku has not surpassed beerus.
@@da_hitmanhart6650 He hasn't because Beerus still has his own incomplete form of Ultra Instinct
Uto Resa 519 👍
Nooooooooooooo!! You people just don't want goku to surpass beerus just bc his name is Lord beerus and hes a god of destruction. MUI goku HAS surpass beerus you just don't wanna believe it. Why is goku not allowed to pass beerus huh. I mean jiren is stronger then his god so why is goku not allowed to. Ohhhh myyyyy it makesssssssss noooo sence. Mui and beerus are very close in power
Beerus got beat up in the God battle royale and couldn't win while Jiren flat out beat a GoD they wrote themselves into a corner Beerus is a badly written character....simple
Either that or he trains Off-screen, Remember he lives for ever as long as he is God, he could easily train in some God version of time chamber for 1 thousand years if he feels like it must be done.But yea writting is fucked, i think Beerus is too popular and they do not want him to become obsolete yet.
lol, I liked seth video because it was funny.
this was also great to watch, really makes my day - LIKE :)
I do still think beerus is above mui goku and jiren until futher statements
At this point I can see that happening tbh. If they really come up with Beerus wank again, imma dip
I honestly do believe that too, there has to be a reason as to why they are keeping his power still an unknown value. Same with the other gods of destruction, not enough is said about them.
Since Toyotaro is Toriyama's chosen successor, shouldn't the manga be more canon?!
It hasn't been used as the basis for any other material so no.
I do hope that eventually the Manga and Anime realign and tell the story the same way agin though because Toyotaro has potential.
I have to give it to you, Shane. Seth might've been around longer, but you're proving to be the better man.
And you have more content variety.
All they got to do to Justify Beerus Still being stronger is what they did with Master Roshi at the 22 Martial Arts Tournament or their explanation for Roshi at the Tournament of power. When Goku got Master UI Beerus decided to get serious with his training because of he afraid that they would surpass him
Shane please debate and destroy seth about Broly vs Jiren
and when you debate please record so that we can also listen
Broly IS stronger then jiren
@@jh_dances2221 about equal
With broly last peformance
@@gogitothetruefusion1431 yes almost equal
@@jh_dances2221 no lmao broly is completely above jiren beerus would smack jiren and broly was compared to beerus ssj broly is stronger than jiren
I can see Beerus coming in to “eat” on earth and take out moro, proving again he is the moving goal post
Thank you!!! Cause people just say random stuff on Beerus. Like it’s not rocket science that the Beerus is the Apex character both in the Anime and the Manga.
WHIS NOT BEERUS
@@Dakingalbert2 Whis doesn't count. He can't fight anyone.
@@julienjeanmuller whis and angels can fight they just have to ask they father common sense because HE CAN FIGHT he not limited by those rules
I’m rewatching watching super and realizing Beerus was using UI against Goku on King Kai’s planet is great😂💯
Surpassing Beerus is the end goal for both Goku and Vegeta. Isn’t it obvious by this point? Btw Jiren fanboys are delusional
Except the end HAS come,the series is over for more than 2 years.Its gonna be a new phase when it starts again for sure,they might go for the angels levels.The intro always said "surpass the gods" and there were statements they surpassed the gods in the TOP arc.Vegeta surpassed GOD Toppo,Jiren was above Belmod and Goku surpassed Beerus
i strongly recommend sending this video to seth to defuse the heat towards you so he knows that you both share an opinion on beerus's power
Wasn't Jiren said to be the mortal stronger than the god of destruction of his universe, later revealed to be Belmod, who Whis then said was stronger than Beerus, though Beerus denied & simply said he lost an arm wrestling match?
at this point Beerus is just useless , he doesn't even do his job and even Zeno said so himself ... let's just go ahead and replace him as GoD ... if I had to place Beerus somewhere it would be Gogeta = UI Goku > Broly > Jiren > Beerus
Don't forget beerus can tap into UI also, may not be complete but will put him light years ahead of everyone imo
I really love your videos, especially where you talk about Beerus because the fandom seems to really underestimate his power.
To be honest, it's important that beerus is stronger than broly...💯
My theory is, if they decide to make GT canon, Beerus = UI SSGSS5 Gogeta/Vegito, if not Beerus = UI SSGSS3 Gogeta/Vegito.
Shane do you have discord server??
If this is the case, this would put UI Omen 3 Goku, Jiren full power, Full power broly, Vegito Blue (merged zamasu arc) and Beerus all in the same power bracket. In my opinion:
Bracket 1
1. Gogeta Blue (Broly Movie)
2. Mui Goku (T.O.P)
3. Limits broken Jiren
4. Moro (Full power)
5. UI omen Goku (Moro arc) = Evolution Blue Vegeta (Moro Arc)
Bracket 2
6. Full Power Jiren
7. Vegito Blue (Zamasu arc) = Beerus Full power = Full Power Super Saiyan Broly
9. UI omen phase 3 Goku (T.O.P)
Bracket 3 - The most difficult bracket to judge due to it being difficult to directly compare SS2 kefla to G.o.D Toppo. If all 4 of them battled based on raw power alone it could go either way, if we ignore ui omen goku's superior speed.
10. SSB Evolution Vegeta
11. UI Omen phase 2 Goku
12. G.O.D Toppo
13. SS2 Kefla
Bracket 4
14. UI omen phase 1 Goku
Bracket 5.
15. SS Kefla
16. SSB Kaioken x20 Goku
Can't really consider him as a "moving goalpost" because his power has never really been defined. Patiently waiting for your video on how Goku is the true villain of DBS.
But that's exactly what it means. We were given MULTIPLE points where we were given Beerus' general ballpark and all of them push him further away from Goku and Vegeta to the point of it getting ridiculous. He should never have even been in the CONVERSATION about Merged Zamasu and Vegito Blue.
@@jamainegardner4193- when did they change the criterion for Beerus' power level? As a matter of fact when did they tell us that his power level was at a certain number? If anyone is a "moving goalpost" in DB then it's Frieza or Goku. Hell plot armor alone is enough to see that those two are the actual moving goalposts.
could we have zeno and kami techi vs the living tribunal and the one above all
Um zeno gets rekt
@@hi__x ok
Given that retcons exist, does the word of the author hold any real meaning?! If the Author says yes, but the Publisher/Editors say no, does the Author still matter, despite it being their job to fix the Author's mistakes or refuse to publish if they don't like the idea. inversely?!
I believe that writer death occurs after the first retcon, as it shows their word has no meaning, due them changing what was established.
It's obvious that Beerus is a moving goalpost.
Broly most likely would still lose to Jiren and MUI Goku because of there speed advantage. Jiren did go toe to toe with MUI Goku after many times Goku increased his energy which boosted his speed drastically. In the manga Jiren did have a similar limit breaker transformation like in the anime and it did prove to counter MUI Goku. Broly merely has more battle power but he doesn’t wield it properly.
How when he tossed ssb goku and vegeta and frieza we gonna forget king vegeta literally said he can be a threat to the universe and what broly has ridiculous speed and strength
Beerus=Bullshit character
My scale...
Mastered Ultra Instinct Son Goku/ Gogeta ssjss
Broly
Gogeta ssj/ jiren/ ultra Instinct
Gogeta ss2/ kefla..
Do you have any other evidence regarding Broly as the strongest villain aside from one promotional statment for the movie?
Saint Gogeto There was another statement from the novel, where Frieza stated SS Broly to be so strong that no one could defeat him. Revolushane covered it in his previous vids on Broly and Jiren last year.
@@MrOverhaul thanks, I'll check it later.
However the novel statement of Golden Frieza puts Broly as the strongest IN EXITSENCE. So then would'nt the statement be invalid due to it also arguing ssj Broly > Zeno ?
Saint Gogeto Maybe. But can Frieza sense Angels,GODS and Zeno’s power?
Mr. Overhaul You wouldn’t actually scale him above everybody in existence. This is just what Frieza believes. So considers Friezas perspective. If Broly is the strongest person Frieza has ever seen in that statement,then everyone’s power who he has witnessed pales in comparison. So basically Broly>everyone Frieza has actually fought or whose powers he’s witnessed first hand.
@@magnificentdumbass7700 That's obvious. How else would you interpret that statement? lol
Until it's proven otherwise Beerus has been surpassed for me.
All They are going to say is that Beerus has been training ever since Goku got UI
Broly has been compared to beerus and goku couldn't beat broly 1v1 so beerus still stomps
exactly , until it's proven otherwise Beerus is no longer top dog .. Toriyama literally told us in the Broly movie that Broly is stronger than Beerus
@@hecantguardme15 right well I'll say they equal for now
@@hecantguardme15 but i stele think that for goku jiren full power with no break limits is not above beerus,because i expected goku to compare broly with jiren but he compare broly with berus and they say that broly is the strongest opponent he never face why goku compare broly with beerus and not with jiren
I don’t understand.
It’s *clearly* implied in both the anime and the manga that Belmod was stronger than Beerus. And it’s *clearly* stated that Jiren is stronger than Belmod. And UI Goku was stronger than him.
I don’t understand the confusion here.
UI Goku > Jiren > Belmod > Beerus
Bro wtf you talkin about they stated many times that beerus is the strongest god of destruction the strongest villain they compare always with beerus,beerus was the only god that recodnize immiedatly the ultra instinct in goku at ep 110 when the other gods they don't know what power goku was using against jiren,beerus for now is the only god can be able to tap in ui but not mastered in the anime wish told this at goku in the manga beerus with a temporany ui was able to dodge 12 gods that was insane,beerus with only one ki blast would kill must part of the gods including Belmod if was not for sidra,if realy Belmod was the strongest god he would get up an go to fight against beerus and quitela,but Belmod know that there is no chance against this two,at the end of the broly movie goku compare broly with berus and not with jiren this things would make you think how beerus is far stronger than we think, and even goku black say that beerus was the must troublemake god probably he say that beerus is the strongest god of destruction,and beerus himself admited after beat vegeta mssb with one shot that vegeta in anothers universe would be a candidate for a god of destruction position but in my universe no and beerus say that before vegeta would matchim he would past millions of years basicly If a mortal is stronger than beerus is probably stronger than all gods only an idiot can say that beerus is not the strongest god of destruction there is no doubt that beerus is the strongest god of destruction
Fo Aka
Before I initiate my rebuttal, let me just say that I am utterly flabbergasted that you managed to fucking type a whole damn college thesis with no decent punctuation or concept of legible grammar. I legitimately think I got dumber reading that.
Critiques aside, here’s why you’re not only wrong, but a dumbass: the *whole fucking point* of Jiren’s “character” (if you could call it that) was that he was stronger than a God of Destruction that was stronger than Beerus. You just fucking cheery picked scenarios where it could be interpreted based off of one’s own personal bias that Beerus is stronger. Why does Goku compare everyone to Beerus? One: he’s the Destroyer of his own universe, and he hasn’t seen the power of the other deities first hand. Two: just because Goku compares someone to Beerus rather than Jiren, that does *not* mean that Beerus > Jiren. You’re going into that with your own head canon bullshit which skews your comprehension of the scene.
When Goku compares Broly to Beerus, what he’s saying is “Wow, you’re really close to Beerus’s level,” in other words he means Broly is closer to Beerus, not Jiren.
And that manga shit you brought up literally counts for nothing. Beerus claiming that Vegeta could be a GoD in other universes *doesn’t* mean every other fucking universe. And regarding Belmod’s actions during the God of Destruction Brawl, not only is that scene open to interpretation (although it’s pretty fucking clear it was inserted to demonstrate Belmod’s superiority over the other gods since he took *zero* damage), but when Belmod trapped the other gods in his technique, only the fox could break out - by your backwards hillbilly ass logic that puts Liquor over everyone else too.
Maybe instead of going into something with a set mindset, actually fucking process and comprehend what the show tells you. Christ.
Please don’t waste my time with another god awful reply. If you have something to say, make it halfway decent goddamnit.
Earl Pearl
Oh boy.
Firstly, you can’t take Whis’s statement out of context. Goku specifically asked about their chances in the tournament, Whis responded with alluding to the existence of a being stronger than a God of Destruction, who so happens to be stronger than Beerus. Yes, purple cat man said it was just an arm wrestling match, but that still means Belmod is *physically* stronger than Beerus. Since strength is powered by ki in DB, then that means that Belmod’s ki is greater than Beerus’s.
Second, I’ve said it before, so I suppose I’ll humor you by reiterating myself. Belmod was the only god who came out unscratched. He didn’t play dead the whole time because there are literal manga panels of him fighting, and doing pretty damn well mind you. Additionally, it’s clear he wasn’t even trying.
Never mind all of that, there are egregiously obvious narrative cues that Belmod is stronger - it’s literally what gives the arc any tension at all.
I think cell or ubb could be great replacements for bereus
Uub and I dont think they're strong enough by miles
Debate him then smfh
The sentence about Broly might being stronger is the evidence for that you scaled Beerus wrong, because SS Broly is on the level of SS Gogeta and we can scale SS Gogeta.
Base fusions have a massive increase in power, as seen in the Buu and FT saga.
The movie follows the manga continuity (the movie has no SSBKKx20 and SSBE) and from here we use manga Jiren who was stronger than 3 SSB tier fighters combined (Goku, Vegeta and Frieza), but we can boost this and say that Jiren equals 5x SSB.
Gogeta is a fusion of 2 SSB tier fighter "and then some".
Which means that base Gogeta could easily be 2.5x SSB tier (Gogeta couldn't have fought Broly in SS if his SS was only 2.5 times stronger than Goku's or Vegeta's SS).
Gogeta then became SS, which increased his power by 50 making him 125x SSB and SS Broly equals SS Gogeta.
This is why Jiren can never be equal to Broly (even if we use 10x mutliplier for SS, SS Broly would be stronger).
Also, you used the term "might" when quoting that promotional artwork about Jiren's power, which says it all. It's no certainty.
Beerus might be a moving goalpost, but whether or not he is, his treatment works because his power hasn't been that well defined to begin with.
He was holding back against Goku, Vegeta and was taking on all the other GoDs at the same time which is leagues above anything Beerus had shown until that point due to sheer number of GoDs he was facing with ease and then the ToP came in which Goku (not Beerus) faced off against someone who was stronger than one of those Gods (one out of the eleven he faced at the same time).
SS Gogeta stomped SS Broly.
@@galaxystudios370 They were roughly equal. Just watch their fight. Gogeta had 3 punches more in than Broly. Most of their punches didn't even connect.
@@TheArchevil Well, maybe not stomped, but Gogeta clearly had the advantage, considering he had a smile on his face the entire time and Broly was the first to transform (which is the only transformation scene that was lackluster in the entire movie)
@@galaxystudios370 Yes, he smiled but he only had 3 connected hits more. Which I wouldn't call a clear advantage. It might have looked that way, but it's not impressive when you start to count. Try it.
@@TheArchevil Ok, so if that's true, then base Gogeta is weaker than Blue Goku, which isn't true at all.
In my opinion Beerus isn't the moving goalpost, Whis is.... He's stronger and higher up on the food chain so to speak.... He's obviously more invested in mortal affairs than Beerus.... Whis also carries much more impact to the story as he's directly tied into the storyline of like 5 different characters.... Like Goku who always had a master but decides instead to take the role of master for himself before training Uub at the end of DBZ..... Vegeta received major character development after swallowing his pride and asking to be trained by Whis..... Plus you have to consider Toriyama's scale and remember that the gap between Beerus and the Saiyans is relative and somewhat comparable to the gap between Whis and himself.... Where Goku is 4 away from being on Beerus level at the start of DBS.... Beerus was 5 away from Whis..... Long story short..... Every time you hear about "Beerus The Goalpost" moving further back, imagine how many laps Whis has ran around these guys.....
A villain would have came by now..beat up beerus to hype the villain.classic db.u know dat tho..but instead the nigga chills all day..not even worried about his boss..my point is he is proctected.so not yet surpassed to my view
Beerus is not yet surpassed.simple