Teal Swan - (Therapist Reaction #2) - Illegal To Speak Of Emotions
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- Опубліковано 5 лют 2025
- Dr. Kirk Honda reacts to Teal Swan.
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My parents divorced when I was 2 y/o and left me behind, my maternal grandparents adopted me, I felt like I was such a terrible person that not even my biological parents wanted me, my dad (adopted) always worried about me and told me:
* the only thing that has no solution is death
* don't make permanent choices for temporary problems.
* even the WORST day only lasts 24 hours.
My dad passed 3 years ago, but he made me feel like I was truly loved, I always like the ending of the videos where Dr. Honda says to take care of ourselves, because we do deserve it 😊
Thank you for these reminders, and thanks to your dad, who sounds like he was a wonderful man.... Sending lots of love ❤️
That was nice 🙂. Good advice 😊
I think the problem with her type of wellness leader/guru (or what ever the title?) is that they themselves feel they've found a cure for their problem and then they try to push that same cure for everything and everyone. They don't take into consideration that people differ a lot in temper, in personality, in trauma history, in experiences, in motivation etc. It's pretty obvious that one shoe can't fit all.
True, and there's a sort of smugness that comes along with it which I feel that Teal has in spades... Very off putting to me but maybe just looks like self-assuredness to others.
I think a troubling aspect of this is that maybe they haven't necessarily found a "solution" for their concerns, and that in fact their position/influence is somewhat a part of the manifestation of their difficulties and a way of coping. I'm basing this off of the behaviour and reactions I saw from her in the documentary.
You just explained the world for real. Everyone (group) these days seems to find whatever niche works for them and then push it on others 👏 👏 👏
I think they do realize that but one sided, black and white, one cure for all type of content always sells better. apocalyptic view, end of the world, gender hate, racism, it all sells and works because it has that good/bad mentality that's very easily digestible and produces views, subscribers etc! that's what i think :D
@@TheSweeeet1234 totally agree with this! One size fits all psychology is unscientific, we have so much proof otherwise.
0:22 Therapists don't just tell people not to think about suicide
0:49 On telling suicidal people that they'll ruin someone else's life
2:10 On self selected group of mistreated by therapists people, continuing education
5:40 Visualizing death, suicide taboo, not talking about it, reasearch, licenses
11:40 Imagine death, commit to life
15:40 Not legally prevented from talking
17:30 Consciousness and the brain and philosophy
👏👏👏👏
I posted this on the first video but wanted to post it here to. I suggest folks watch "Growing up with Teal Swan." It's an interview with her childhood best friend, Diana Hansen Ribera on the Mormon Stories Podcast here on UA-cam. She brings a lot of clarity and background to Teal that seem to explain a lot of Teal's fantastical stories and her personality. For example, Teal's therapist as a kid was Barbara Snow, the Satanic Panic therapist.
And they also have an interview with a man who used to live with her which was very interesting and moving
Sounds interesting! I'm going to watch that. I guess, some of these aspects are not new to Dr. Honda as he has already listened to the Podcast "The Gateway" from Gizmodo.
I was going to say the same thing! Diana was so brave to come forward.
I went and watched it after reading your comment and also highly recommend it. I also watched their interview from 2 years ago with Jared (I don't remember his last name), who I think was one of her ex-husbands? What really struck me after watching them both was that they were in her life at completely different times but basically corroborate each other's depictions of her personality and tendency to lie about her experiences.
@@virginiasoares826 I watched that interview, too! With her ex boyfriend/follower. It was fascinating and like you said, moving. That guy gained so much wisdom from his difficult experiences.
For me, hearing how my potential suicide would devastate my family for the rest of their lives is what gets through to me when the waves hit. Yes, there are times where I feel even worse because that one final option not being an option makes me feel even more hopeless, but I do think hearing it has helped me
I think that’s very thoughtful and compassionate to stick around for your loved ones. During my darkest hours I have asked “Life to take over and surprise me. Show me what ya got” and it did. Life does have surprises around the corner. Just a little surrender and open mindedness and creativity can go a long way to designing and welcoming in a happier and more peaceful life. Again. Good job sticking around. It really does hurt to loose a friend or family member to suicide. I hope things get brighter in your world real soon.
Me too- and same for me- I believe it shows we are not self absorbed and care about others
When i was ideating badly in my teens, i felt enslaved by my family. Being told to consider them first only pushed me closer to the edge. I felt like death was the only way to escape them and get to be truly myself. Now as an adult, I am haunted by the idea of dying first and the liberties they will take with my body, belongings, funeral, memory, etc. unfortunately not all people have the privilege of a loving family, and the use of family connection can also be a strong reminder of being alone.
This is soooo important, I’d dare say it’s the MOST important problem with self-help gurus like this. I lost a dear friend to suicide earlier this year, and we met in a community like Teal’s (it literally doesn’t matter which one; they really are all the same). Coercive control groups like this literally gather folks who’s mental health is fragile, trauma bond them together and constantly retraumatize them, add a big dose of sleep deprivation, and deliberately alienate them from peer-reviewed methods of real healing. Folks who have been “in” cults like this, even when they’re out, often have a long road to be even able to re-engage and trust licensed professionals, because they’ve been manipulated to mistrust them. All too often, the clock runs out before they can connect with help.
I'm so sorry for your loss, and so sorry you went through something so traumatic. It's unbearably distressing that vulnerable people who are suffering get taken advantage of like this. Sending you so much love and hugs and hope through the interweb, I hope you can feel it wherever you are my friend!
She’s a genius and thank God many people are following her. She helped me with understanding my trauma like no other therapist could!
One thing she doesn't bring up (or hasn't yet...?) is that there is a huge risk for the client when talking with therapists about suicide. My understanding is that a therapist would have a legal obligation to intervene if they felt that someone was at immediate risk of completing suicide. For this reason, I would never ever under any circumstances tell my therapist if I was considering it. Because it's up to the therapist's judgement to decide what constitutes a risk, and worst-case scenario you're thrown in a mental ward where they just physically prevent you from doing it. And I do believe people should have a right to end their life. If you walk into a movie theater and the movie sucks, well maybe some people sit through it to see if it gets better, and some people walk out after giving it half an hour or 45 minutes. I happen to think it's okay to walk out of a crappy movie.
But to my original point, either laws need to change or there needs to be a better option for people who are considering suicide to talk to people without fear of being locked up. I can't be the only person who wouldn't talk to their therapist about suicide because they know the potential consequences.
Uuugh, yes! My step mother in law has been in a grief spiral since she lost my husband's dad suddenly 3 years ago. I've been doing what I can.. but I'm no professional. I see a therapist regularly and had convinced her to seek help and then they sent her straight to the hospital psych ward for a 10 day mandatory evaluation. She will never go back again. She will never get the help she needs, not for her grief and not for the trauma of being in abusive relationships literally back to back to back her entire life. It's fucking tragic.
Thank you so much for talking about the myth of not bringing it up.
I just want to say thank you for being extremely fair and open minded. As someone who has benefited from Teals teachings, it’s nice to see a balanced viewpoint rather than just jumping on a bandwagon of hating her. This is probably the most fair interpretation of her I have seen.
Thank you for that, people tend to attack her in a personal matter and your approach was really professional. I like her methods because they work, i like that she's really against those "mainstream" ways because it happened to me and it appealed my disgust by those psychologist who don't know S about anything..... But I can see where she can be failing.... That's why I just see her as a person with her own flaws... She opens the door for you to be able to leave or to not agree with her... Which is something I think we lack in this society. Anyway I will keep watching this series.
Thank you, Dr. Honda, for the analytical approach to making decisions on whether a method or clinician is effective or not requires a depth of research.
This is a great analysis. It answers all the questions I had from part 1 of this reaction. Great discussion of the literature. I learned a lot about myths around discussing SI and different CBT strategies for addressing that. Perhaps it's my personal bias, but after watching some of her videos, reading her instructions for visualizing suicide, and listening to some podcasts, I cannot be convinced that she would competently and safely deliver CBT to any of her followers - especially in the context of her demanding that her followers eschew all avenues for accountability, accept her as a god-like omniscient figure, deny their own perceptions in favor of hers, isolate themselves from support systems and medical professionals, and blame themselves if they don't "get better." I understand the value of a randomized prospective cohort study in evaluating the efficacy of her methods relative to others, but I would have identical qualms with a licensed practitioner making the same claims. It reeks of abuse. Still, I cannot say without a shadow of a doubt that her practices caused her followers to commit suicide.
I have seen a lot of different psychologist, therapist etc. and talked with them about my suicidal thoughts. Not one of them have ever said "think about your family". It's always been about me and my life and my quality of life. Yes, i have mentioned that myself as a reason not to do anything, so maybe that's why, but the vibe i've always gotten hasn't been like that. In fact i'd consider that highly unethical, and would never go see that person again.
(Although i do have had an experience with a psychologist with whom i was talking about my eating disorder and she said something so idiotic and horrible, which made my ED much worse. Definitely never saw her again.)
wait can you please explain what you'd consider highly unethical? and the vibe?
@@discoinferno2654 Ok i guess "highly unethical" is a bit of an exaggeration. Nonetheless the client should be the priority, not their family. It's also different to say something like "you mean a lot to your family and they will miss you", than to imply "you're being selfish here for thinking about doing this to your family".
Because a lot of times when people are suicidal the last thing they want to hear is "think about your family" they are aware of that they just want to not feel pain anymore, or sometimes they think that suicide may even benefit their family. Suicide is one of the biggest lies your thoughts create, sometimes just being able to talk about it can help someone feel less suicidal because they're sharing their pain with someone else.
Yeah I have a friend who suffers with depression and anxiety. She doesn't want to go to therapy because she believes she can find better help on UA-cam . She is a big Teal follower too. The self help and coaching field can be extremely damaging.
I can understand her tho as someone in the same boat. what people forget is that therapy is also EXPENSIVE. and to find a good therapist that actually understands and gets you is quite hard (mine and most of my friends' experiences). so sometimes you have to go 3/4 times to one therapist to see if you fit, and then it turns out it doesn't. For the last 2 years I've seen literally 6 or 7 different therapists, and every time I feel a bit down because I can't find people to help me. but what sucks here is that not only do I get sadder about not finding people, but I also lose money! when you're depressed AND broke, AND you're scrapping off for those hundreds of $ a few times a month, I can see why you'd get a little hopeless. So I totally understand her wanting to at least try on her own and buy a decent meal maybe for a change
@@TheSweeeet1234 I'm very sorry about your experience. And I understand it I went thru a couple of therapist until I found the one I have right now. Indeed you need to have a match with a therapist. And that's not always given. I hope you will find a right one ! As for my friend is not a question of money. Its more to do with inability to admit she is wrong and expecting the therapist to confirm her theories (which she have learnt on the Internet... ). Sometimes you just have to trust your therapist because they have studied it they have a processes and it takes loooong time for the change to happen. Actually the changes happen very often when you get irritated - it's usually when something doesn't match the pattern In your head. And those patterns are the problem.
4:57 I believe her distortion comes from her megalomania. (And that’s the most gracious interpretation I can offer.)
this!!!
The times where i was suicidal and friends etc told me to think about the people i’m hurting, it made me feel so much worse and invalidated. I can’t imagine any person with suicidal thoughts to be comforted by that, it’s just selfish. Maybe people in very collectivistic society’s but it’s still toxic.
We are not living for others.
My son has two children who love him very much. I've worked with kids who have lost loved ones to suicide, I think for a parent with young children to commit suicide is selfish, in most cases. When you bring those babies home, you don't get to give up. Sorry, life can be so hard, but suicide is ensuring it will be really hard for them too. Maybe even harder. I think a parent is obligated to at least hang on until the children are grown, in most cases.
@@TheKim369 i’ve not thought about it from a mother’s perspective. Thank you for your comment
@@lucymziri1130 I've never thought about how selfish that reminder could sound coming from friends. (Really invalidating and selfish) Thanks for some new perspective, and look, you just gave a gift to a stranger! I bet you have a whole lot more you could share, I've never met a wise person who didn't go through struggle, and we need a whole lot more wise people! I hope you are able to find the place where you never have serious suicidal thoughts again.
@@TheKim369 Thank you for your precious comment, it brought tears to my eyes. And yes agreed, i think we can learn something from everyone, and thanks. I wish you joy and love.
I can imagine that those comments didn't make you feel better, yet sometimes the unstable noises around us can drive us to become more focussed on oursevles and really get into everything. People doing the right thing does not always result in a good outcome, and people in our eyes doing the wrong thing doesn't always mean it will be bad for our growth. If our surroundings seem poisonous, this can be a big pointer that you have grown out of it and that can be a big positive to realise.
I've known of teals teachings since 2012. She has helped me tremendously. I haven't watched a video of hers though since about 3 years ago, as I don't feel like I need her teachings anymore. I take what resonates. She does have a following where people idolize her, but they do it to themselves, it's not what Teal is after. She genuinely wants to help people, and she does. I feel bad that she let people follow her for 3 years, just for them to edit and manipulate the footage and deteer potential healing for others. Look at both sides for the truth
I agree and thank you for speaking up. Take the parts that resonate and leave the rest. Those who truly understand her and her message know this
You mean the documentary was manipulated?
@@fourofcats5803 Yes, watch Teals response to the documentary for more on that.
The only helpful conversations I’ve had with therapists on this topic were in an outpatient program designed to address suicide. The others didn’t seem to know what they were doing. I’m 14 minutes in and so far I’ve felt comforted by what she’s said. It is a sort of release to have someone ask how you would plan and not have them freak out and make you feel more alienated. The plan’s going to be there whether it’s recognized or not
Mainstream therapists should not be «insulted» when psychology and psychiatry is criticised. There is a reason why we need holistic treatments. How many have known somebody under psychiatric care, who killed themselves? I know four, who were all under treatment, on medication and one did it while commited. Others I have known tell me that being committed was a retraumatisation. My first psychologist fell asleep in my sessions, the second lent me a cd and told me he «knew» my father was the root cause of all my problems before an hour had passed (grave understimation) and a third one blatantly told me «her other patients had it worse than me». I gave up conventional therapies and I had more than mentioned here.
I am a survivor from suicide, chronic anxiety + depressions, fatigue: cptsd, and Teal Swan was the first person to make sense of my depression. She explains so well very complicated issues, breaks it down, and gives ideas to deal with it. All of her material IS FOR FREE while many self help gurus’ advice only are accessible if you pay (including my first trauma teacher. I could call anytime...it cost 40$ for half an hour and I could not afford it.) Teal Swans videos speak for themselves. Take it or leave it. She helped me so much, and I learned a lot. And btw extra sensory abilities have not only been prooved, it has been used by the US government to spy etc. Look up remote viewing...
I dont think Teal is critizing individual methods. She is actually trying to dismiss the entire field as manipulative or invalidating. What's insulting (i imagine) is that she is discounting EVERY option other than her own, when she isnt even trained or accountable. I agree that western medicine has some MAJOR flaws and shortcoming, on top of existing inside an ableist society. But we cant discount the field as a whole when the issue is training (which she doesnt even have)
I had depression for a good amount of time and the only thing i got was a 400 Euro Bill and some pills. I think teal may be a little harsh on professionals that actually are good at their job but the 99% of licensed therapists to wich people with little time and money go to are for sure not good. I feel like the „education“ on suicide is often, pills, talking about it with people who „read“ about suicidal people but get paid a good amount of money for doing so.
It's great to be confident in yourself and know your talents/place in the world, but when she says I'm a spiritual leader and a revolutionary, it completely skeeves me out. She seems to have drunk her own koolaid. I watched the series and that confrontation with the man asking who she looked to for help and guidance gave me enough to form an opinion on her. She definitely confirmed that opinion throughout the series.
Yeah… I agree. I don’t want to listen to someone who will put themselves on a pedestal like that. I’m a spiritual person myself and have ideologies that wouldn’t align with dr Honda… but this lady gives me cult following vibes after hearing that.
@@sardonisms no one. That was her answer. How could you expect the person who is the best in their field to have anybody to look up to (is basically what she asked)? She doesn't look up to anyone because there is no one higher than her.
Yea she gives me cult leader vibes. Disgusting.
Using the koolaid phrase in this particular context is I hope NOT fitting, lol. (The phrase already existed in early 70s but it only really became popular after the Jonestown massacre)
@@theorycompanies I hope it's not fitting. But considering she basically made up a new treatment and had them practically waterboard a follower, who then proceeded to thank her and say she loved her... I'm not too confident, sadly. Hope the documentary will snap potential followers out of it because it seems like she could become dangerous.
I found her videos very helpful especially that I was resistance to therapy for the longest time.
I thoroughly enjoy it when you "ramble."
Wax on, wise one💙
This video is my first introduction to Teal Swan. She appears very upset with licensed therapists, perhaps due to her past experiences with therapists treating her trauma. Personally, I have greater faith in receiving treatment from licensed therapists who have training and are evaluated than a self-proclaim person who wants to help without training and supervision.
I hope he watches her episode on Narcissism and what she identifies as the root of narcissism. I am SO curious as to what he would think on that.
I think you’re (on behalf of mainstream psychotherapy) taking her words “personally” when she seems to be referring to the generalities of baseline mainstream responses to the concept of suicidal ideations.
«Psyche» means soul, whereas I would argue most psychology circles around «mental problems» and treating depression as «a lack of serotonin production» instead of addressing the root causes of trauma. Yes, part of psychology focuses on emotional and spritual help, but the vast majority of psychologists seem to treat people mentally, also forgetting the important factor of being present in the body and regulating the nervous system (f ex by breathing consciously).
im kind of sad about what you said about the "think of your family" talking point. I have such a visceral reaction to it from my own mental health struggles and recovery its one of the things i hated hearing from people the most. it felt like i was being shamed and that they were telling me that i should endure my torture and suffering because of other people and that my desire to want to not suffer was selfish. ooooooogh. i hate it so much
In my training we we're told that you had to ask for their plans, it's a part of their process. How can you truly help someone if you're missing a part of the process and it is quite amazing what a person can project if you just listen.
Where you get the patient to visualise the whole process is not really just Teal's way. This is a common method to get the patient to connect with the emotional process that is trying to come forth. In our trauma we resist and suppress our emotions, we refuse to feel because it's painful and uncomfortable and in doing so put a stop to growth and transformation that is trying to happen. With this process the patient is encouraged to be in the present moment and be willing to allow their emotions to sit and dissipate naturally. It's not new and I know quite prominent psychiatrists who even use it, it's not dangerous and I have found it works well in helping a person to connect with their past traumas so they can heal. I do think that she goes a step further though, in talking about after they have died, but hey, open mind.
Masters in Evolutionary biology with a focus on animal cognition (ie I spent way too many years evolving flies to be able learn better). I don’t have an opinion on if consciousness is generated by the brain or not, but I think it’s interesting. We’ve seen organisms without brains (even single celled organisms, and there’s even some weak evidence that each cell membrane is capable of learned behavior) learn and make decisions. You can cut a worm in half and the part of the worm without the brain will remember the learned associations from when it was intact. Plants can be classically conditioned as well despite having nothing like a brain.
If I had to stake my life on it, I’d say consciousness is a property generated by specialized cells, but I’m not certain. I don’t necessarily think it has supernatural implications if consciousness is attracted/manipulated by structures like brains to make evolutionarily advantageous decisions and isn’t generated by them.
Do you have an opinion on frequency and vibrations in relation to human energy and emotions?
@@jackjack4412 unfortunately I haven’t looked into that at all. It’s definitely not taught in university.
Suicide is an ugly subject, however Teal addresses the subject very well. You have to have guts to say what she says. Pussyfooting around a person's suicidal thoughts is cowardly. She confronts it directly, just as she should. Psychotherapy fails because doctor's are protecting themselves first. Only a person who has attempted or has suicide related dark thoughts can understand where we are. Teal is my favorite person. Hi Teal! Thank you. You're the best!
I really appreciate your respectful approach to this discussion. You validate the ways she has helped people, while also confronting the BS she spouts.
Others have been super nasty and dismissive of her, and that really does more harm than good. It fuels her followers to think she really is a godlike being who is being persecuted.
She's clever and persuasive. I think she makes some good points (ie. we used to scoff at certain therapies... medicine is always evolving). But she does not look like a kind-hearted person.
Thank you, Dr. Kirk. Looking forward to your video idea of the legality and difference between self help gurus vs. those providing treatment.
I would love to get your opinion on Byron Katie. She has such a enticing and welcoming spirit, she doesn’t claim to be a therapist or offer any clinical advice. But a lot of people love her perspectives and she doesn’t come off Woowoo at all
I love her. She's awesome
I love her work. Ofc she didn't invent that form of healing thru inquiry, but she makes it accessible to a lot of westerners.
I think a lot of people feel harmed by or disappointed in the mental health system. I certainly felt that way at some point. I was a pretty complex client and some therapists who didn't know how to deal with that really made me feel like I was this problem and it was my fault treatment wasn't working. I think clients often fear that if they express their dissapointment they will just be seen as difficult or delusional. There is a bit of a power dynamic in therapy that can make you feel like your voice will never be taken seriously. I can imagine people who have that experience feeling incredibly validated and empowered by teal. Paradoxically though, I think she has also created an environment where her methods can't be questioned and concerns are brushed off, so I can imagine that for some people this would be an unfortunate repeat of their difficult experiences in the mental health field.
Thinking about how devastated my sister would be after my suicide was sometimes the only thing that kept me away from doing it. And what cured me was therapy and pills. I would like to confront this lady and call out few things.
Teal is a great human being.... Which is shown in her thousands of views and presence.
She extrapolates from her own personal experiences receiving treatment in the 90’s and thinks that’s universal. That’s really dangerous. Dr. H does a great job showing the larger picture. She also doesn’t ever think she can be wrong. Even more dangerous.
Sorry to say but its just not like that. As a teenager ive been pushed to commit suicide by a therapist, she abused me very heavily in her office and she never had to explain herself, the licensing board did nothing about it and she still works as a therapist.
not me saying what at 17:10 at the same time as Dr. Honda!! 😂😂😭
I think she went to a quack or two and assumes ALL doctors are like that. Pretty irresponsible generalization on her part. What if someone watches her and denies themselves life saving help based on what she says?
I think that’s already happened, sadly. There have been a few deaths already.
@@synesthesia7511 i liked your comment for the info but jesus that's horrible.
@@eriskalli it is a tragedy.
She terrifies me. What she teaches is drived from psychology and philosophy ( she will never admit that though) but it’s distorted to serve her purpose add to that her charisma and that is a dangerous combination for someone at risk or actively in mental health crisis
Psychology in Seattle, Dr. Kirk please react to The Deep End!!!
I love how Psychologists deny the fact they’ve always denied emotions as relevant. Sliding emotions back into the study is not realizing people don’t forget, lol.
I'm so glad you're reacting to her videos! I would also be interested in your opinion on the Deep End. Very interesting to see some of the inner workings of her closest group of followers
I'm curious Dr Honda what is your own personal relationship to spirituality?
There's thousands of people who don't have "credentials" yet have developed seminars/courses/workshops/books to help people on their healing journey. That doesn't mean that their work is invalid or not helpful. Just take from it what works for you and leave the rest :)
Teal is definitely *not* a cult leader lol.
She does actually have licensed people who work alongside her. One of her best friends is a psychologist. She recommends that people have therapists and engage in therapy.
Her workshops/methods are far more grounded in reality than people assume. She works within the frames of Attachment Theory, ISF/parts work, Shadow work, lots of CBT, Schemas, Inner Child work, art therapy, meditation, talk therapy etc. She doesn't exclude anyone. She doesn't have any "rules" that people need to follow. No special elixirs, crystals, diets, prayers, affirmations, clothing or anything like that.
When I first came across Teal Swan years ago, I was a little put off/sceptical by the way she looks (attractive, piercing eyes, monotone voice etc). But after getting to know her I've learned and can see beneath the exterior. She's just a cute little teddy bear with some quirks🧸 Like all of us.
There's not a single person on earth who has all the answers, or who can always "treat" a condition. No one thing will always work for everyone. She, like millions of others, are just offering something that may work or be helpful to you.
You cannot replace years of studying with a quick course or intuition... glad she helped you but same as you need qualified surgeon to operate on you - you need qualified mental specialist too. There is plenty of life coaches and self proclaimed spiritual guides. Some maybe are helpful but plenty are harmful. Same as medicine- this has to be regulated
No amount of workshops or seminars will replace the knowledge you get while getting psychologist degree, please don't ever compare that. As Dr. Honda said himself, it indeed does not negate the help she's given you. However, her methods are still irresponsible and may do more harm to others. That's the main issue and concern. Good and resposible theraphists know how to handle situations without doing any harm to the client, because they're not using anecdotal and biased methods.
I really can not agree. I have changed 10 different psychotherapists in my life. Some of them have had the higest possible level of education in this field, but just last one really helped me. Many of them made things much worse. Why? Because previous ones didn't have empathy, they didn't have personal experience with long term depression. They didn't really know what I am talking about, I could feel it. Because they have obviously never had depressed. This is not a math, or some other University where you have to remember data, rules etc, to follow what you have learned and get the result. It is about understanding mental problems in depth. It is about how to react to a client different states of mind shifts , about approach, sensitivity, personal experiance, and real passion for this kind of job. If you maybe do not know Teal really found a way to help herself after she was diagnosed as shyzophrenic, cut her body, long term depression, suicide trial more times etc. She maybe doesn't know exact verbal definition about bipolar , borderline etc, but she knows very much how brain of one depresed , sucidal person works . She has huge experience with all these things. That is why people listen to her. Not because she manipulate with us (we are not stupid, we can maka a difference), but because we recognize she is speaking exactly the same things as some depressed person is going through right now. Anyone who work in this field can not help everyone, that is for sure . You have to be good match with your therapist as well , but someone who learned about mental illnesses at the University (without personal experience) is the same like coach who learned about that sport only in books. Would you go to that couch (to prepare youself for some competition?) I really think NO.
Thanks for the video!!
Have you seen the “growing up with teal swan” vid on UA-cam? I feel like her childhood friend brought up some interesting behaviors or Teal’s while growing up that may shed light on her mentality
I'm gonna check it out! If you haven't listened to Some Place Under Neith podcast ep 38-40, I think you'll enjoy the deep dive on research on her.
That interview explains so much about her
@@thelovedbodyofficial thanks for the rec! I’ll check it out 🖤
I appreciate you making these vedios honestly. This topic somewhat frustrates me, but its important. I see you are trying to be balanced. A few things, she didnt say she was the only one who has different views, she literally just sId un the beginning of the vedio. You kept asking "what does she mean by standard" and when Teal breaks down her method, you say but we do that already, but its not a go to. So I m like whatever is the go to is the go to, thats the standard." But also if you already so it, then whats the controversy about?, Regarding Therapists? Maybe because she is not licenced, but I think she is "qualified" to talk about it based on her reasons. And also I sont think she claims to read people's minds, she says ahe can see energy Nd the shifts that happen within people's bodie when emotions change. Is it a superpower? 🤷 Like she actually has aomething to say, has helped many people. I dont know why that wouldnt count. Also you said ahe has "distortion" and it might be coming from people who have had bad experiences with Therapist, but even if that was many of the pple she sees, wouldnt that be alarming?? I dunno how many people she had seen compared to you or the average Therapist, but if the numbers were the same, why is her perspective easily labeled as that and thrown away because "bad apples". The whole "she had increased suicide rates" why would you even entertain that idea? Is she that powerfull to single handedly make more pple complete???? Huh. Also the difference between Therapist and her is that we know the people who have commited suicide aftwr going to her but we dont know about the Therapist that are in the same boat? It is trully an insane conclusion to draw. I m glad you agree that the whole death thing is a taboo, which is interesting because no ine lives forever, its inevitable for everyone, thats really why people are attacking her, no one actually cares about procedures and whatnot cuz most people dont even know how to deal with people like this. And I am of the mind that this vedio as much as it might seems to be directed at therapists, is really for the people who do not know what to do, so they can understand that the whole "think good thoughts" "what about family" isnt going to work. I am not auggesting that they should then practice her method with thebut rathwr take them to someone who knows obviously.
Edit: Also Teal works with licenced Therapists and the likes, she has them at her retreats and whatnot.
Thank you
Dr Kirk, with due respect, but you seem to think that making clients feel worse is acceptable.
I would love to watch your reaction to that old Newlywed game show.
Teal Swan >>>>> modern psychology
Her certainly in her perspective may be attractive to some and quite different from many therapeutic approaches. My view of therapy is that the the person getting therapy has to explore and come to their own insights with support. She seems to dictate how to think about experience based on her higher spiritual vantage point. I’m not sure what she calls it.
14:58 I’ll try not to blow up your comments.
But did you know., she is and has practice with Julie Rowe and I believe attended Chad Daybell’s talks.
Just throwing that out there
No degree will help u be a good therapist. Either u got it or u don't.
Fact
Wow, although it’s not something I take pleasure in saying, because of course we would all hope that every therapist trained is good at what they do; but I’ve heard far too many bad stories. Also, my best friend of 38 years is a psychotherapist and she says there are definitely some bad apples in the field. I think what you said is so true. My mother was that kind of gifted person. Incredibly empathetic and her ability to read to and understand people at an incredibly deep level was astounding to me. I remember growing up, all my girlfriends always wanted to hang out and talk with my Mom when I had sleepovers because they could talk to her and feel understood. She was magical and I used to tell her so. I see Teal this way as well. My mom was extremely similar to Teal, very tender-hearted but she took helping people very seriously so was kinda intense. She even with the same passionate and serious facial expressions.
I always told her she should have been a therapist but she went the get married young and have babies route instead. But she did say that she always wanted to be a therapist but back then women didn’t really go to college. 😢There are people who naturally just get people and how to help them and Teal is one of those. And there are of course many gifted who ARE trained. I think if Teal would just go ahead and earn a degree, that would shut down most of the hate against her. And it would fine tune her amazing skills which could only be a good thing. I hope she does that one day.
At 17:10 after she says the thing about consciousness leading to the brain or vice versa, I said, "Uh, what?" at the exact same time Dr. Honda said it. Jinx!🥤
Great episode
You're inspiring, Dr. Kirk. Calm, grounded, in contact with reality. Your videos have helped me in getting out of that woo-woo crystal world. Much love, and keep going!
Dr H can you also do a video on better up, that’s another one that boggles me. All this new age stuff is all over the place. I fine with in so long as there is no money but these things give me big cult/Scientology vives
Remember "the filter" of capitalizing from this content. I see one person full of criticism because they feel the threat that "ppl will listen to "self help guru" instead of contacting a licesed clinitian, while capitalizing on the content from ppl watching the video ect)
I see that one of the biggest things these comparisons between liscensed individuals and self-help experts fail to get behind is that religious beliefs are inherently holistic and have boundless examples of being saved. And the fact that we cant betray the consolation of those who cant tell where their life wouldve ended up without it. I am not in any specific camp of thought schools, but subjugating thought schools with over arching phrases and labels is a disillusioned turn of mindset many people are plagued with.
WAIT! Teal Swan is real?! I honest to god thought that Deep End was a fictional series!! It’s real??!
This is hilarius!
I only watched the second and third episode and it felt extremely scripted. Apparently I live under a rock 🤷🏼♀️🤦🏽♀️😂
@@lilbarney2901 I actually know someone who was in the documentary, though they didn’t have a speaking part they where in it in passing xD
🤣🤣🤣
@@tulip5210 lol that’s wild! I’m still baffled 😂
that's not always true, if you have a bachelors in social work from an accredited program, you can receive your masters in social work in one year it's called advanced standing. Not every program is created equal though.
Being judgemental is a sign of a lacking awareness of self
Gosh I can say so many things, but where I am gonna leave this at is. She intimidates you. She threatens your ego. This is exactly what she means by “standard” “mainstream” your lack of connection and comprehension to your consciousness. She’s got gifts your school and license don’t give you honey. She’s got a power within her your schooling and government can’t give you. Our government does not have our best interest at heart. You can learn from this woman and improve yourself instead of feeling threaten by her. Just saying. Lead with your heart not your ego. You look like a good guy but you are disconnected from your true essence. You say she’s distorted but I totally see that’s a projection from within you. Seriously you don’t know what she means by revolutionist lol we have arrived my love. The shifts are taken place and the new healers of this new earth creation isn’t gonna need “government license” I get both parts tremendously but the old ways don’t work. It’s time to break down the system and creat a new way. Just sayin 😇😇
I know when Dr Honda says ‘we’ he is referring to himself and other doctors in his field . When Teal says ‘we’ … what does she mean? Is she grouping herself in with the professionals ? Or is she referring to a group of people she’s ‘coached’ to ‘treat’ people using the same methods she does and push her ideology ?
2:22 ‘added pressure to the suicidal person’ I’ve heard about that in a lot of therapy memes over the years, so I wonder if perhaps that originates from therapy or her? Unsure
Ok got a big problem with what you said at 1.44 Dr.
[TLDR: you imply the majority of suicidal people think suicide is selfish and that helps them not do it, but forget that concept is perpetuated by the larger majority of society and having both groups promote that isolates the rest of the suicidal community who don't benefit from it. Leading to them not talking about it, or their suicidality to most people. So no, you can't confidently imply that the majority of suicidal people benefit from it, just that the majority of suicidal people who don't believe they're at risk of actually attempting suicide benefit from it. Leaving out a higher risk, more isolated group.]
You rightly point out she's generalising suicidal people and saying they'd all feel worse for hearing that they're effectively 'selfish' for ending their own pain the only way they know how.
You then proceed to generalise in the following way 'Most people who say this are clients themselves who tell me 'I could never attempt suicide because...''.
Surely you see the problem there. You highlight as group of people who have already decided that suicide isn't an option, so while they fight the urges they're not as much at risk because they have a hard limit on that. It doesn't stop them succumbing to it and I'm not arguing that, but you're saying the majority of suicidal people benefit from that because the people who bring it up the most are the ones who use it as their last lock to the suicide door.
What about those of us who don't have that as a lock, the 'majority' of us just feel like 'ok great, so I'm hurting people if I'm alive and I'm hurting people if I'm dead.' This is why I wished so hard I could have never existed as a kid, because it was the only way to stop my existence being harmful to the world (as I thought it was). Hearing how my only way to end my pain and my perpetual evil in the world is also evil just made the whole situation feel inescapable and like I was completely evil for existing, something I had no choice over but was responsible for having dared to do.
That stuff really scrambled my mentally ill brain by presenting me with an impossible situation. The thing that helped me was saying 'no suicide isn't impossible and everyone is responsible for their feelings. If I or anyone else goes that route, it is sad but I won't blame them for my pain of their going. And they shouldn't blame me.'
People blame someone who dies in an accident for 'abandoning them' but it's not selfish to die from an injury just because it hurts people, the notion is bizarre.
Now if focusing on the fact their death could hurt people also means their life benefits people might help, but the focus on the negative side often more so makes us too ashamed to even TALK about it.
Sorry this was a tangent but this rounds back to the beginning point; If the people most likely to talk about it repeat the narrative that 'suicide is selfish so I could never' it means those of us who don't benefit from that are less likely to talk about our suicidal experiences, and we feel alienated by both communities, so we struggle on our own.
Aka you saying 'the majority of people saying this are passively suicidal' doesn't mean the majority of suicidal people believe that.
I think it’s interesting that even though she’s not trained or licensed, she sure does use a lot of the treatments that you say you use as an expert in helping people with suicidality. Hmm, 🤔 perhaps that speaks to her natural ability to help people. Yes, I think it does.
I am not a New Ager I am an Orthodox Christian and it infuriates me that people in the Psychology field make snide remarks in regards to people who believe in a soul which MILLIONS of people in the world do.Maybe people dont always want to be treated by someone whose beliefs are purely secular. But like I said I dont share a lot of Teals beliefs but I respect them
MaHOOssive kudos to you on holding it together as you listen to this dangerous and socially irresponsible drivel.
More than one way to find healing.
Wtf is mahoossive?
She uses a lot of strawman arguments. That is quite dishonest if you ask me.
dr kirk i’d love for you to react to jordan peterson, feel like there’s a lot to go through there esp his views on hierarchies and gender differences etc.
side note: welcome to plathville s4 too, if this hasn’t already been suggested!
That's a great idea! He's supposed to be a clinical psychologist, but some of his opinions are...different 😬
In the end, every kind of teaching and every kind of therapy is on a spectrum. Not a single thing in this world is only good or only bad, we all have parts that can be damaging to others or ourselves.
I do believe that there should always be disclaimers, to let people know that they can choose if the information given fits them and their lives at this moment. That would prevent people from falling into a pattern of disowning themselves and only listening to that therapist or spiritual leader. Every person when giving advice should underline that the receiver is always steering the ship, and no one is able to really take over.
No truth is 100%, all perspectives in the world are much more like a puzzle so there is never a world view or a view of humanity that covers it all. We need to see that we can pick and choose what and who we listen to, no need to bend our own feelings or beliefs out of loyalty to the person giving us these pointers and tips for how to live life. Each perspective is as valuable as the other, from the cleaning lady to the president, to Teal Swan to this man talking.
Most balanced viewpoint for me, in this comment section
This Teal person is creepy acting as an authority without really being one. She should be held accountable for what she is doing.
There is a theory that everyone is a scientist BUT specifically because they want to solve problems
From observation
She DOES NOT WANT HELP FOR HERSELF
But feels the need to help others
Is that the most appropriate way to go about being persuasive?!
In order to be persuasive you need logos, ethos, & pathos
She’s basically missing all according to her , due to internal (mental) and external (social) factors
The thing is she could get the licenses if she wanted but it would just be a waste of time since she already has access to the knowledge, all of the information in the study of psychology you can get out of books. I don’t think she sees herself as the only person that can treat suicide. I think certain people can benefit from therapy etc but a majority of people need more. Psychology as a subject is also changing as we progress, the truth is that we don’t know everything yet. And there is a common dogma called scientism that everything can be explained by science when it can’t. You can’t explain spiritual stuff by research, i’m able to see auras but nobody can proof this😅same as seeing chakra’s when i meditate. What sounds woo woo to you is reality for me.
There are instruments that can see auras and the Pentagon knows about this, it’s just not accepted in mainstream American society.
The human body has an electromagnetic field, this is science so auras are not exclusive to spirituality.
Agree 100%!
People have always been biased In the way they view and interact with the world. They always see the world though their past experiences and current beliefs. When it comes to things like what teal swan represents, I think people beliefs revolve around the sigma of going to a therapist. Maybe they don't like the idea of opening up to a stranger or doing like the idea of being on meds for the rest of their lives. Maybe they believe they can't afford it or something similar.
Self help gurus should be taken with a grain of salt as they can provide some kind of relief but they aren't infallible. Self help gurus usually are offering a somewhat similar way of doing what mainstream therapy would do. Usually it's mostly introspection or doing something like exercises. Teal would probably be against taking something like meds as she seems more about the natural life style. She may have come to the conclusion about mainstream not working by going to numerous therapists and psyche treatments only to have them fail for her.
In this day and age, just about anyone can call themselves a spiritual leader. The requirements are basically nothing and u don't have to prove anything. Usually terms like spiritual leaders and revolutionary are self defining terms along with a mash up of other beliefs, that are again filtered through their past experiences and current beliefs, into what they define as revolutionary.
She doesn’t want to get a license because she thinks she knows everything. She thinks she can read minds, she’s completely delusional.
So tldr; not all trained profesionals are effective and not all unlicensed therapists are charlatans
I have followed Teal Swan for years and also hang out with people who follow her. I have also went thought 4 years of psychotherapy. Therapy has been my best investment ever. Teals followers many times are against mainstream treatment and go to different energy healers etc. There's nothing wrong with that but I think its irresponsible to turn people against psychologists and psychotherapists.
I want to see this lady and Peterson have a conversation. I find them both so in full of themselves.
Someone has commented on this before, but I highly recommend the "1607: Growing up with Teal Swan - Diana Hansen Ribera" episode on the "Mormon Stories Podcast", the guest is a childhood friend of Teal who offers good insight into Teal's alleged background story.
Just because people listen to her doesn’t means self-selected group people listen to her because she has something to listen to
I thiiiink what she's saying at the 18:00 mark is the debate of consciousness. Are we aware of our brain and our thoughts because we have a higher consciousness (sentience), or are we sentient because of our evolved brains. Frankly there's a lot of convoluted semi religious dogma baked into this one and I'm not willing to touch that with a pole. But I fail to see how this thought experiment has anything to do with the subject at hand... Unless she's postulating that her 'esp' puts her in a god-like position and her followers are like... *Followers*....
I think what she’s getting at is that if consciousness gives rise to the brain, or that consciousness is what creates the brain - then just treating the brain using behavioral therapies possibly isn’t addressing the root of an issue. You would have to treat the consciousness itself, meaning a humanistic approach as the Dr here said.
I just don’t think she’s that revolutionary. She is just reiterating what other teachers in the past have said. It’s not groundbreaking at all.
Okay great, now that you're passed that, would you say you find her information/insights helpful, harmful or neither?
I know of 3 people over years who followed her that completed suicide, I don't know if there are more, and she has 130 m or so subscribers around the world. I don't know how that compares to the suicide rate of the general population by demographic by country.
Spiritual leaders... that in itself is a giant red flag.
Teal Swan is also a "therapist" who doesnt know what she is doing. Literally!🤣🤣
This is just so cultish.... Dont go to other professionals they are bad and terrible, just depend on me and just listen to me, I'm special and I have all the right answers...I'm a revolutionary and spiritual leader...
I've only seen a handful of Teal Swan's videos and started to watch Deep Dive but couldn't get through more than 15 minutes because there is something about her that just creeps me out.
Nooo, I wanted to listen to more
I get the feeling her thought process is a little out-dated. There are all kinds of modalities a person can choose from when it comes to trained, professional psychotherapy. I wasn't having much luck with CBT, so I tried something else that worked better for me. Hearing her use the term "mainstream" is just awkward.
makes a 3 parts of 20 min video each about her - "I don't know what she is talking about being a revolutionary"... LUL
If she went & got the education, she wouldn't be nearly as popular & rich. Duh.
She’s going to get sued.
Messiah complex.
Classic cult leader.