President trophy are won the Stanley cup 8 times in the past 39 years (I know you looked at the last 10 years just trying to get a bigger sample, maybe the cursed started 10 years ago and we should hunt and blame a team as patient zero haha). there is 16 teams and on average(if all teams are equal) each slot position would win it 2.4x (over 39 years). (again all using average stats do not read to much into it haha). But Statistically, those with the President Trophy are roughly 3-3.5x more likely to win the Stanley cup. We just have to not forgot there is 16 teams and that everyone will try to fight tooth and nail for that cup. Also some division are weaker then others making 1 team stand out with more points. Brief, I would say no, but nice video to give out perspective! Still if we check the smaller sample like last 10 years it does seem to have horrible results! but maybe the issue is the last place team being in "playoff mode" before it even started ? If last place team are performing well it make sense that the first place would not since they are basically against each other in the first round. It would be interesting to see the Winners for each slot! We would see the last place probably be performing better then the 7th place of that conference. But at the end of the day we can make #'s say what we want by choosing different samples, but in my opinions the wildcard spot team is are bringing much more intensity in the first round compared to any other team.
I think it just comes down to how different the playoffs are from the regular season and how to play, when teams are on the cusp of a wildcard spot, they buckle down and start playing hard and I feel like they generate a momentum that often carries over into the playoffs, whereas a team that is a hsuing for the presidents choice award, often slows near the end of the season to rest their players up, so it’s a false sense of security
But it's not JUST the team that ends up with the best regular season record that has been resting players and easing off the gas pedal in the last few weeks of the season. Oftentimes, the race for the President's Trophy is decided in early April, so the second- and third-best teams in the league might have been just a win or two away from getting it. So theoretically, they also have the false sense of security, they also have no momentum because they haven't played a meaningful game in weeks...and yet they tend to do a LOT better in the playoffs than the team that gets the trophy. And they are also playing teams that have been on the edge of playoff qualification for months, pushing themselves hard, and thus having momentum without the burden of an expectation of success that plagues the best teams. So I don't really know what to make of this "curse."
Congrats in the 100k! The editing was a little scattered at the 6:45 and onward mark but didn't change much. Just an fyi. Always enjoy your videos. Id watch more if the title said more instead of clickbait ;p
I don't think that it is only psychological. The playoffs are structured and refereed differently than the regular season. It is almost a different sport altogether. The president's trophy winner is the best team at the style of hockey that is played during the regular season. It is not a surprise that that team is not the best at playoff hockey.
Tampa went on to win back to back cups during Covid. Tampa admitted they put their all into collecting history and regular season wins. That’s why when they won the cup they were the 3rd seed. They sat back and coasted through the regular season. They turned it on when it mattered most. You’re also not realizing how dominant Tampa was before that 2019 run. They’ve played more playoff games than anyone else since 2015 and it’s not even close.
@@Taubogason.40 did you fall down and bump your head? Tampa won the presidents cup and finished with 128 points? The following two seasons they finished 3rd and won the cup both times…
I don’t consider Tampa coasting, moreso waiting to turn it up a gear in postseason. If you coast in the regular season, you’re either the best team in the league, or amongst the worst.
Tampa is done for a long time. They had their little bouts of success, I guess, but their time is over. They gave away their chance at another cup when they traded the absolute legend, and I do mean LEGEND, Pat Maroon. If Tampa wanted another shot at the title, they would have kept the only reason they made it in the first place.
@@Tina_Delvecchio Tampa has been the gatekeeper of the East since 2015. 4 Stanley cup appearances w/ 3 straight winning 2 of those. Tampa has several deep runs between all of those cup appearances. There’s not one team in the league who wants to face a healthy vasi in the playoffs. Tampa might not be as dominant as they once were but they’re dangerous to all comers.
I fell it depends how much challenge the top team faces during the season. Usually the team that claws and fights to get into the playoffs usually been playing far more critical games than the top team. I'm hoping this year will be an exception. Although, Edmonton is very scary going into the playoffs
It's not a curse, and I wouldn't even say it's because of the differences between regular season and playoff hockey. It boils down to the fact that only one team can win the President's Trophy, but there's not a significant gap between the winner and the runners-up, and even a low seed is still a team that was good enough to make it to the playoffs. So we have one President's Trophy winner and 15 non-winners who range from "still good enough to make the postseason" to "just as good as the President's Trophy winner but they were one or two points off." It's not a curse, it's just one of the great things about the Stanley Cup Playoffs, that the best team can be overcome at any time.
The NHL is top teir in its competitiveness between all teams. No other major sport is comparable, in that regard. I think it's just way more noticeable, come playoffs.
@@CelabWilliams-gb6rmNFL aside, because they play 1 game play off. But in the first round, NHL has loads of upsets. In 2nd round, normally the favorites win.
Aaaannnnndddd another case of a gen z'er acting like something new is happening in the nhl. This has ALWAYS been a thing. When u lose less games than it takes to win the cup(16 wins)all season, u forget how to lose. When u don't lose 2 games in a row ALL YEAR u don't know what to do when it counts. Ur in "coast" from Feb till the playoffs start and ur playing a team who's been playing like it's their last game that whole time. And,well.....the "curse"
The problem with Toronto is that it becomes incredibly hard to outscore your problems in the playoffs. They just don't have the ability to lock it down and attrition will slow down their scoring in later rounds. Its the same reason TB likely won't win another Cup. We lost our best defensive D-man (McDonagh) and all of our defensive minded forwards not named Cirelli.
the bolts as a whole did have a lot of long runs between 2015 and 2022 and that mileage I think has caught up to those that are still there today. Ofc yes key pieces in those 2015, 2016, 2018, 2020, 2021 and 2022 runs like mcdonagh, gourde, goodrow, paquette, palat, perry, johnson, killorn, coburn, callahan, stralman, etc are all gone but those that still remain have a lot of mileage on them
@@ethanparker7900 Yeah, from 2015-2022 they made it to the conference finals 7 times as well as 4 trips to the Final. That's not only a LOT of extra hockey, but a lot of playing injured.
6 conference finals actually. But yes either way that was by far the most games than any other team in the regular season or playoffs combined within that timespan. And ofc don't forget to that 2020 run specifically with its weird ass schedule changes due to pandemic restrictions @@boltinabottle6307
in the regular season sure but the playoffs are an entirely different beast. Plus it takes a team not just some to win it and get as far as they did all those years@@chelious1973
I think it also has to do with teams elevating their play come playoffs. Lower seed teams know they need to do this if they want to win against top teams. The top teams have dominated all season which gives them a false sense of security, and so they don't elevate their game the way other teams do. And then the wheels really start to fall off once they experience adversity, because they haven't dealt with it all season.
So uh, why start the analysis at 2014? Not addressed or explained in any way. The President's Trophy has been awarded for like 40 years, it shouldn't be difficult to parse all that data. Wouldn't it be crazy if the year before he started collecting data (for absolutely no reason at all) the team that won the President's trophy also won the Stanley Cup? Yeah, that sure would be crazy. Turns out, PT winners (since the inception of the trophy) have won 63 rounds, with 17 Conference Finals, and 8 Stanley Cups and 1.7 Average Round Wins. An actual crazy stat is that the PT winner has the same number of Cup wins as 1st round exits, that is pretty wild.
@@RobTalksHockey This implies you are saying the "modern" era began in 2014. I've never heard anyone say that, and again, you don't explain why you think it begins there. I've seen the modern described as beginning after the dead puck era, which ended with the '04 lockout season. That includes a bunch of 1st round exits by PT winners, for the record. The bottom line is, while the PT curse is fun to talk about (and I definitely think it is), I don't think the actual numbers back it up as a claim.
@@RobTalksHockey How is 10 years an ample size? It's just a coincidence that the PT winner won the cup the year before you started your sample, not to mention the ONLY 10-year period of time with no PT winner also being a cup winner? This trophy has only been around for 37 years, it's not like you had 100 years of data to sift through. My first comment took less than 5 minutes to look up and parse. I hope this isn't coming across as super harsh or anything, as that is not my intent at all. I watch your videos regularly and will certainly continue to do so. It's just that the explanation of 10 years is good enough as a sample size doesn't sound like a reasonable explanation when we are talking a 37-year period in totality, which would take very little additional effort to provide the data on. I find that suspect, along with the multiple coincidences of the time period you chose being unique to make the case of a curse.
Interestingly enough, in the last decade, three teams won the Stanley Cup the year *after* winning the Presidents trophy: the 2018 Capitals, the 2020 Lightning and the 2022 Avalanche. The Panthers meanwhile made the Finals in 2023 after winning the Presidents trophy the year prior. So maybe it isn't that much of a curse after all?
the avs were the runner up to the presidents trophy in 2022 as well. If it hadn't been for the panthers then it would've been back to back presidents trophies for them like the capitals in 2016 and 2017 and the canucks in 2011 and 2012
The 2014 bruins,2015, rangers, 2018 predators, and 2020 bruins won the presidents trophy the season after making a cup finals appearance Another interesting pattern
I think the more interesting thing to explore with the President's Trophy Curse is seeing how previous seasons adveristy applies to to future cup runs. Canucks core has seen their fair share of adversity over the last 3 or 4 seasons does that contribute to getting through the curse or does the curse have a short memory and only care about how the team is doing the season they win the President's trophy
Really good points. I don’t fully agree but the adversity thing is a key component to the project I am working on … … what you didn’t consider is the fact that that the NHL has had 16 teams in the playoffs since the WHA merger making it the top 16 out of 21 teams and the talent gap was wider … The presidents trophy wasn’t awarded until 1986 but generally the top seed coasted in the first round. You didn’t see a lower seed upset a top seed until the 14 seeded oilers swept the Canadians in the first round …. Looking back … it wasn’t an upset … This has a bigger impact than the lack of adversity bc in an 82 game season, even Presidents trophy winners who won the cup faced adversity even thought the ability to handle any challenge is a key component to winning when there is such a tight gap between the top and bottom in this wonderful league.
Most teams that make it in to the playoffs as an 8th seed in either conference have probably been fighting for that playoff spot for the last 10-15 games and therefore don't have to adjust their mindset once they get to the playoffs . It's been fun to watch the Canucks season so far and I'm really happy that they are experiencing their dip in play at this point as apposed to say the first rd of the playoffs . I absolutely do not want to see the Canucks win the Presidents trophy !!!!!!! ANYBODY but the Canucks can win that trophy !!!!!!!
Messier, Gretzky, and Lowe summed it up when they lost to Calgary with a dominant team. When you are completely dominant you are completely confident. When you are this confident you aren't nervous about the game. If you aren't nervous you don't care about losing. If you don't care about losing you don't think about it. Next thing you know you've just lost four games and it's over. 😬
Take it from a Bruins fan who watched almost every game in their record season last year. The Bruins gave away the series to Florida with dumb turnovers, bad clears, and over passing. The crazy plays they made all season just didn't work in the playoffs.
Gongrats on 100k rob! Sorry for not being here right away i was hitting the slopes but better late than never. But gongrtas you deserve it sure as hell🔥
maybe a curse, but it seems like the president's trophy winner always does well the following year, either by winning(TB 2020, WSH 2018, AVS 2022) or making the finals(FLA 2023).
It's interesting to see the stats for the last 10 years because I ran the numbers many years ago (probably in the early 2010s) and the president's trophy winning team actually won more than their share of cups. Assuming each team has a 1/16 chance (about 6%) the #1 team had won more than their share (I think above 12%). I think this speaks to the parity in the league now. I'm just guessing but I imagine if you look at all of the placements you wouldn't find any with a massive advantage
I have always felt like momentum plays a big part in a team's playoff push. Teams that were really on fire, or even just a goaltender that is on a hot streak, can carry a team deep into the playoffs with a strong regular season finish. Many of these top teams coming into the playoffs basically coasted in and often rest their star players the last week or two of the regular season to avoid injury. They have no fire or passion coming into the playoffs, so their play reflects that. However, lower seeds are often battling for home ice, so they often will do better than a team coasting.
Statistically the average number of round wins in the postseason is 0.9375 which being as close as you could possibly get says that it is not a curse just they are statistically not benefited. The issue is that often the top team may start of dominant and ends the season coasting and gets lazy and tend to be not be super motivated to play their hardest going into the playoffs. But another factor is that I don't hear about is that they have players with big contracts and may not be able to make some of the moves at the trade deadline that other teams may be able to make any issue that they may have had in general that could beat an average or middling team goes unchecked. I think a slightly worse and less cap restrained team may be able to both have an easier time seeing where issues are and then making trades at the deadline to adjust afterwards. For example where do the Rangers look to improve vs where do the Lightning look to improve.
Really love your videos man! Have started checking UA-cam just to see your newest videos. My only thought to improve is your titles, they are very clickbaity and make the videos look lower quality than they are!
Yes🎉! The curse exists because a regular season team is a different beast to a playoff team. Get the most points doesn't translate to willingness to win
The first half of the season only helps your chances of getting into the playoffs. If a team goes 39-2 to start the year, finishes 60-22 with 120 points, they are going to be falsely assumed the favourites given their record, but their second half isn't even playoff worthy. So the President's Trophy doesn't put greater emphasis on how the team is performing heading into the playoffs. They struggled heading in, so why would they be favoured to win? Momentum and the idea of "playoff-style hockey" in Febeuary/March is real, towards how a team goes into the playoffs.
2006 sabres won the presidents trophy. Lost the conference final to Carolina because of injuries on the defense. Had to call up ahl players who hadn't played in months. The curse is real!!!!!!
The Blackhawks won the cup the year they got the presidents trophy. It was the shortened season though. Still incredibly impressive that they had a 21+ game point streak
Boston last year lost three games straight. Even in such incredible regular season they did lose three straight in it. So what we've seen in that first round against was nothing THAT shocking. In was SECOND time that very season it happened. Surprising? Sure but no curse. Three loses in playoffs format vs. three loses in regular season - that makes the difference. Regular season shows more of long term qualities of teams, playoffs are more about momentum, luck, day to day results.
As a Bruins fan ill say that Tampa team that got swept was by far better than the bruins team of a year ago and besides stamkos (who wasnt old) had their core players in their prime. The Bruins had an aging core with some great pieces around them. I also feel like the Bruins last year felt like a team that tried harder than most teams did in the regular season. Once they got rolling and the records kept falling they got greedy and kept pushing. Which eventually ended up getting Bergeron and Ullmark hurt in the last 2 regular season games that were meaningless. As we know the Lightning more than made up for the next 2-4 years but i dont think the bruins will.
Just outside RTH's 10 year window for president trophy winners 2011 - Canucks go all the way to game 7 of the Stanley cup finals 2013 - Blackhawks win the cup Surprisingly Boston was apart of both SCFs lol
Now. I just wanna say. Look at that CBJ roster that swept the Lightning. They were mad underrated and had good firepower and goaltending.. Should they have swept the bolts? No. But is it THAT shocking with the roster the Jackets had??? Also no.
@@RobTalksHockeyTrue,that would make it a trend that can be reversed and not a curse that is out of control. Bill Barilko's fate was a curse,winning the president's trophy sets a team up to crumble in the playoffs but if a team figures out why they can overcome it. I Remember this talk back in the 90's about the Rangers breaking two curses at once and being lauded until Dallas,Colorado and Detroit put that to rest.
The big change in playoff hockey is the referees forget their whistles. A team built on skill and finesse are bullied by a team built on brawn and aggression. Tampa had great teams who died in playoffs until they added the likes of Maroon and Schenn who could push back.
But also game five should’ve been a Bruins win, but the stupid hand pass call when I think it was Bertuzzi had a goal removed because it hit another Bruins gloved, even though there’s no intent to pass the puck with that players hand
At some point, I think teams phone it in against the top teams during the regular season. After 40 games, why put your best effort against the league leading team? Save that for a game you have a much better chance of winning. I think this contributes to the presidents trophy team being overrated before the playoffs.
If you include the 2013 season then the "President trophy" would be 13-1-1-1.2, the "Runners up" numbers would be 19-2-2-1.7, and the "Last place" would be 11-3-0-1.0. Not great, but not as bad as you make it out to be.
Ha ha, I'm from Siri, kiss me, and I'm gonna never followed camp. However, only the flyers before I knew any better. The Rangers until 1995 I know they had a good team but they seem to be falling apart.
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Does the curse actually exist?
President trophy are won the Stanley cup 8 times in the past 39 years (I know you looked at the last 10 years just trying to get a bigger sample, maybe the cursed started 10 years ago and we should hunt and blame a team as patient zero haha). there is 16 teams and on average(if all teams are equal) each slot position would win it 2.4x (over 39 years). (again all using average stats do not read to much into it haha). But Statistically, those with the President Trophy are roughly 3-3.5x more likely to win the Stanley cup. We just have to not forgot there is 16 teams and that everyone will try to fight tooth and nail for that cup. Also some division are weaker then others making 1 team stand out with more points. Brief, I would say no, but nice video to give out perspective! Still if we check the smaller sample like last 10 years it does seem to have horrible results! but maybe the issue is the last place team being in "playoff mode" before it even started ? If last place team are performing well it make sense that the first place would not since they are basically against each other in the first round. It would be interesting to see the Winners for each slot! We would see the last place probably be performing better then the 7th place of that conference. But at the end of the day we can make #'s say what we want by choosing different samples, but in my opinions the wildcard spot team is are bringing much more intensity in the first round compared to any other team.
As a Bruins fan . . . .rather not talk about it!
no refs bias is the reason the lack of penalty calls by the refs although more penalties are committed by the lower teams
I think it just comes down to how different the playoffs are from the regular season and how to play, when teams are on the cusp of a wildcard spot, they buckle down and start playing hard and I feel like they generate a momentum that often carries over into the playoffs, whereas a team that is a hsuing for the presidents choice award, often slows near the end of the season to rest their players up, so it’s a false sense of security
I'd also add that the top teams don't struggle at all during the season
But it's not JUST the team that ends up with the best regular season record that has been resting players and easing off the gas pedal in the last few weeks of the season. Oftentimes, the race for the President's Trophy is decided in early April, so the second- and third-best teams in the league might have been just a win or two away from getting it. So theoretically, they also have the false sense of security, they also have no momentum because they haven't played a meaningful game in weeks...and yet they tend to do a LOT better in the playoffs than the team that gets the trophy. And they are also playing teams that have been on the edge of playoff qualification for months, pushing themselves hard, and thus having momentum without the burden of an expectation of success that plagues the best teams. So I don't really know what to make of this "curse."
Not necessarily@@adriankalitka3762
Everything you said is truth but once you said "presidents choice award" I had a small laugh..
@@dylanjones268 yeah… i realized that acter and decided to keep it as is
Congrats in the 100k! The editing was a little scattered at the 6:45 and onward mark but didn't change much. Just an fyi. Always enjoy your videos. Id watch more if the title said more instead of clickbait ;p
I don't think that it is only psychological. The playoffs are structured and refereed differently than the regular season. It is almost a different sport altogether. The president's trophy winner is the best team at the style of hockey that is played during the regular season. It is not a surprise that that team is not the best at playoff hockey.
wild that the Blackhawks are the last team to win the presidents trophy and cup in the same year.
Congrats on the 100k subs my guy
thanks lil bro
@@itzjowii no problem mate
Its all rigged for betting odds lol. Since i started sports betting this is my 100% conclusion. Not even a hidden aspect of the game at this point.
Tampa went on to win back to back cups during Covid. Tampa admitted they put their all into collecting history and regular season wins. That’s why when they won the cup they were the 3rd seed. They sat back and coasted through the regular season. They turned it on when it mattered most. You’re also not realizing how dominant Tampa was before that 2019 run. They’ve played more playoff games than anyone else since 2015 and it’s not even close.
Coasting mid season did not have a big impact on that 2020 cup run tho. For the 2021 one, I could understand that.
@@Taubogason.40 did you fall down and bump your head? Tampa won the presidents cup and finished with 128 points? The following two seasons they finished 3rd and won the cup both times…
I don’t consider Tampa coasting, moreso waiting to turn it up a gear in postseason.
If you coast in the regular season, you’re either the best team in the league, or amongst the worst.
Tampa is done for a long time. They had their little bouts of success, I guess, but their time is over. They gave away their chance at another cup when they traded the absolute legend, and I do mean LEGEND, Pat Maroon. If Tampa wanted another shot at the title, they would have kept the only reason they made it in the first place.
@@Tina_Delvecchio Tampa has been the gatekeeper of the East since 2015. 4 Stanley cup appearances w/ 3 straight winning 2 of those. Tampa has several deep runs between all of those cup appearances. There’s not one team in the league who wants to face a healthy vasi in the playoffs. Tampa might not be as dominant as they once were but they’re dangerous to all comers.
I fell it depends how much challenge the top team faces during the season. Usually the team that claws and fights to get into the playoffs usually been playing far more critical games than the top team.
I'm hoping this year will be an exception. Although, Edmonton is very scary going into the playoffs
It's not a curse, and I wouldn't even say it's because of the differences between regular season and playoff hockey. It boils down to the fact that only one team can win the President's Trophy, but there's not a significant gap between the winner and the runners-up, and even a low seed is still a team that was good enough to make it to the playoffs. So we have one President's Trophy winner and 15 non-winners who range from "still good enough to make the postseason" to "just as good as the President's Trophy winner but they were one or two points off." It's not a curse, it's just one of the great things about the Stanley Cup Playoffs, that the best team can be overcome at any time.
I believe in the curse ... We miss burgey ... that is all 😅
The NHL is top teir in its competitiveness between all teams. No other major sport is comparable, in that regard. I think it's just way more noticeable, come playoffs.
Every sport ever has said this. It’s becoming cringe the more it’s uttered. “Our sport come playoffs”
@@CelabWilliams-gb6rmNFL aside, because they play 1 game play off. But in the first round, NHL has loads of upsets. In 2nd round, normally the favorites win.
Aaaannnnndddd another case of a gen z'er acting like something new is happening in the nhl. This has ALWAYS been a thing. When u lose less games than it takes to win the cup(16 wins)all season, u forget how to lose. When u don't lose 2 games in a row ALL YEAR u don't know what to do when it counts. Ur in "coast" from Feb till the playoffs start and ur playing a team who's been playing like it's their last game that whole time. And,well.....the "curse"
The problem with Toronto is that it becomes incredibly hard to outscore your problems in the playoffs. They just don't have the ability to lock it down and attrition will slow down their scoring in later rounds. Its the same reason TB likely won't win another Cup. We lost our best defensive D-man (McDonagh) and all of our defensive minded forwards not named Cirelli.
the bolts as a whole did have a lot of long runs between 2015 and 2022 and that mileage I think has caught up to those that are still there today. Ofc yes key pieces in those 2015, 2016, 2018, 2020, 2021 and 2022 runs like mcdonagh, gourde, goodrow, paquette, palat, perry, johnson, killorn, coburn, callahan, stralman, etc are all gone but those that still remain have a lot of mileage on them
@@ethanparker7900 Yeah, from 2015-2022 they made it to the conference finals 7 times as well as 4 trips to the Final. That's not only a LOT of extra hockey, but a lot of playing injured.
6 conference finals actually. But yes either way that was by far the most games than any other team in the regular season or playoffs combined within that timespan. And ofc don't forget to that 2020 run specifically with its weird ass schedule changes due to pandemic restrictions @@boltinabottle6307
@@ethanparker7900Kuch doesn't.
in the regular season sure but the playoffs are an entirely different beast. Plus it takes a team not just some to win it and get as far as they did all those years@@chelious1973
I think it also has to do with teams elevating their play come playoffs. Lower seed teams know they need to do this if they want to win against top teams. The top teams have dominated all season which gives them a false sense of security, and so they don't elevate their game the way other teams do. And then the wheels really start to fall off once they experience adversity, because they haven't dealt with it all season.
So uh, why start the analysis at 2014? Not addressed or explained in any way. The President's Trophy has been awarded for like 40 years, it shouldn't be difficult to parse all that data. Wouldn't it be crazy if the year before he started collecting data (for absolutely no reason at all) the team that won the President's trophy also won the Stanley Cup? Yeah, that sure would be crazy.
Turns out, PT winners (since the inception of the trophy) have won 63 rounds, with 17 Conference Finals, and 8 Stanley Cups and 1.7 Average Round Wins. An actual crazy stat is that the PT winner has the same number of Cup wins as 1st round exits, that is pretty wild.
Because each era has different results. In some eras the “curse” is non existent. But in the last decade there has been some crazy results
@@RobTalksHockey This implies you are saying the "modern" era began in 2014. I've never heard anyone say that, and again, you don't explain why you think it begins there. I've seen the modern described as beginning after the dead puck era, which ended with the '04 lockout season. That includes a bunch of 1st round exits by PT winners, for the record.
The bottom line is, while the PT curse is fun to talk about (and I definitely think it is), I don't think the actual numbers back it up as a claim.
I did not claim any specific era. 10 years is an ample sample size for the point of this topic
@@RobTalksHockey How is 10 years an ample size? It's just a coincidence that the PT winner won the cup the year before you started your sample, not to mention the ONLY 10-year period of time with no PT winner also being a cup winner? This trophy has only been around for 37 years, it's not like you had 100 years of data to sift through. My first comment took less than 5 minutes to look up and parse.
I hope this isn't coming across as super harsh or anything, as that is not my intent at all. I watch your videos regularly and will certainly continue to do so. It's just that the explanation of 10 years is good enough as a sample size doesn't sound like a reasonable explanation when we are talking a 37-year period in totality, which would take very little additional effort to provide the data on. I find that suspect, along with the multiple coincidences of the time period you chose being unique to make the case of a curse.
Wait a minute... Is that the music from Golden Eye ? .. Yeah it is ;-)
I was thinking the same thing!
Interestingly enough, in the last decade, three teams won the Stanley Cup the year *after* winning the Presidents trophy: the 2018 Capitals, the 2020 Lightning and the 2022 Avalanche. The Panthers meanwhile made the Finals in 2023 after winning the Presidents trophy the year prior. So maybe it isn't that much of a curse after all?
the avs were the runner up to the presidents trophy in 2022 as well. If it hadn't been for the panthers then it would've been back to back presidents trophies for them like the capitals in 2016 and 2017 and the canucks in 2011 and 2012
The 2014 bruins,2015, rangers, 2018 predators, and 2020 bruins won the presidents trophy the season after making a cup finals appearance
Another interesting pattern
Curses aren’t a thing it’s all mental and physical we’re only human after all even mcdavid or any other superstar
I think the more interesting thing to explore with the President's Trophy Curse is seeing how previous seasons adveristy applies to to future cup runs. Canucks core has seen their fair share of adversity over the last 3 or 4 seasons does that contribute to getting through the curse or does the curse have a short memory and only care about how the team is doing the season they win the President's trophy
Really good points. I don’t fully agree but the adversity thing is a key component to the project I am working on …
… what you didn’t consider is the fact that that the NHL has had 16 teams in the playoffs since the WHA merger making it the top 16 out of 21 teams and the talent gap was wider …
The presidents trophy wasn’t awarded until 1986 but generally the top seed coasted in the first round. You didn’t see a lower seed upset a top seed until the 14 seeded oilers swept the Canadians in the first round …. Looking back … it wasn’t an upset …
This has a bigger impact than the lack of adversity bc in an 82 game season, even Presidents trophy winners who won the cup faced adversity even thought the ability to handle any challenge is a key component to winning when there is such a tight gap between the top and bottom in this wonderful league.
100k well deserved. Love the channel. Love your voice.
Most teams that make it in to the playoffs as an 8th seed in either conference have probably been fighting for that playoff spot for the last 10-15 games and therefore don't have to adjust their mindset once they get to the playoffs . It's been fun to watch the Canucks season so far and I'm really happy that they are experiencing their dip in play at this point as apposed to say the first rd of the playoffs . I absolutely do not want to see the Canucks win the Presidents trophy !!!!!!! ANYBODY but the Canucks can win that trophy !!!!!!!
Flames in 6
Messier, Gretzky, and Lowe summed it up when they lost to Calgary with a dominant team. When you are completely dominant you are completely confident. When you are this confident you aren't nervous about the game. If you aren't nervous you don't care about losing. If you don't care about losing you don't think about it. Next thing you know you've just lost four games and it's over. 😬
And what is now the worst kept secret in the NHL or is the title better than "president's trophy curse"?
Edit: title change, nice 😮
Congrats bud i always enjoy the vids I been here since the early days let's getter to 200 thow
Rob congratulations on 100K man I’m happy for you been here since like 15 to 20K
Take it from a Bruins fan who watched almost every game in their record season last year. The Bruins gave away the series to Florida with dumb turnovers, bad clears, and over passing. The crazy plays they made all season just didn't work in the playoffs.
Gongrats on 100k rob! Sorry for not being here right away i was hitting the slopes but better late than never. But gongrtas you deserve it sure as hell🔥
Thanks buddy!
Congrats on reaching 100K! Definitely well deserved! Now the road to 1 million shall commence!
maybe a curse, but it seems like the president's trophy winner always does well the following year, either by winning(TB 2020, WSH 2018, AVS 2022) or making the finals(FLA 2023).
Congrats on the 100k!!! You deserved it!!!
It's interesting to see the stats for the last 10 years because I ran the numbers many years ago (probably in the early 2010s) and the president's trophy winning team actually won more than their share of cups.
Assuming each team has a 1/16 chance (about 6%) the #1 team had won more than their share (I think above 12%).
I think this speaks to the parity in the league now. I'm just guessing but I imagine if you look at all of the placements you wouldn't find any with a massive advantage
I have always felt like momentum plays a big part in a team's playoff push. Teams that were really on fire, or even just a goaltender that is on a hot streak, can carry a team deep into the playoffs with a strong regular season finish. Many of these top teams coming into the playoffs basically coasted in and often rest their star players the last week or two of the regular season to avoid injury. They have no fire or passion coming into the playoffs, so their play reflects that. However, lower seeds are often battling for home ice, so they often will do better than a team coasting.
Statistically the average number of round wins in the postseason is 0.9375 which being as close as you could possibly get says that it is not a curse just they are statistically not benefited. The issue is that often the top team may start of dominant and ends the season coasting and gets lazy and tend to be not be super motivated to play their hardest going into the playoffs. But another factor is that I don't hear about is that they have players with big contracts and may not be able to make some of the moves at the trade deadline that other teams may be able to make any issue that they may have had in general that could beat an average or middling team goes unchecked. I think a slightly worse and less cap restrained team may be able to both have an easier time seeing where issues are and then making trades at the deadline to adjust afterwards. For example where do the Rangers look to improve vs where do the Lightning look to improve.
Pre-lockout it was way more common for the winner to make deep playoff runs or win the Cup.
Really love your videos man! Have started checking UA-cam just to see your newest videos. My only thought to improve is your titles, they are very clickbaity and make the videos look lower quality than they are!
“It’s a curse… BEWARE OF THE CURSE!! BEWARE!!”
-Beni “The Mummy”
Yes🎉! The curse exists because a regular season team is a different beast to a playoff team. Get the most points doesn't translate to willingness to win
The first half of the season only helps your chances of getting into the playoffs. If a team goes 39-2 to start the year, finishes 60-22 with 120 points, they are going to be falsely assumed the favourites given their record, but their second half isn't even playoff worthy. So the President's Trophy doesn't put greater emphasis on how the team is performing heading into the playoffs. They struggled heading in, so why would they be favoured to win? Momentum and the idea of "playoff-style hockey" in Febeuary/March is real, towards how a team goes into the playoffs.
congrats on 100k bro!
Congrats on 100k Rob, well deserved!
Thanks brother!
Awesome channel man, love your content, keep it up
I hear you, Goldeneye pause music 🤘👏👏👏
My man!! Good job on the 100k, you rock 👌👌👌
Thanks my man!!
Congrats on 100k rob!!
Congrats on 100k!
Good stuff about the 100K milestone. Now just don't take your foot off the gas Rob! Keep it up!
To win the regular season, you need to stay healthy and use your team up. To win the cup, you need a bunch of guys coming off of injury "fresh".
2006 sabres won the presidents trophy. Lost the conference final to Carolina because of injuries on the defense. Had to call up ahl players who hadn't played in months. The curse is real!!!!!!
The Blackhawks won the cup the year they got the presidents trophy. It was the shortened season though. Still incredibly impressive that they had a 21+ game point streak
6:50 mark has some edit cuts heads up
Boston last year lost three games straight. Even in such incredible regular season they did lose three straight in it. So what we've seen in that first round against was nothing THAT shocking. In was SECOND time that very season it happened. Surprising? Sure but no curse. Three loses in playoffs format vs. three loses in regular season - that makes the difference. Regular season shows more of long term qualities of teams, playoffs are more about momentum, luck, day to day results.
The hottest team at the end of the season is usually the last to make it to the second season. Thus giving the last place team a lot of momentum.
congrats on 100K brother!
100k 🎉
I have a few hobbies... hockey and cars .... Randomly stumbled upon a video with a recognizable voice and realized "wait is that Rob talks hockey"?
Hahaha. It’s been a minute, but I started that channel before this one
As a Bruins fan ill say that Tampa team that got swept was by far better than the bruins team of a year ago and besides stamkos (who wasnt old) had their core players in their prime. The Bruins had an aging core with some great pieces around them. I also feel like the Bruins last year felt like a team that tried harder than most teams did in the regular season. Once they got rolling and the records kept falling they got greedy and kept pushing. Which eventually ended up getting Bergeron and Ullmark hurt in the last 2 regular season games that were meaningless. As we know the Lightning more than made up for the next 2-4 years but i dont think the bruins will.
Just outside RTH's 10 year window for president trophy winners
2011 - Canucks go all the way to game 7 of the Stanley cup finals
2013 - Blackhawks win the cup
Surprisingly Boston was apart of both SCFs lol
For sure. But the curse has only really been a thing in the last decade. The game changes in each era
Now. I just wanna say.
Look at that CBJ roster that swept the Lightning.
They were mad underrated and had good firepower and goaltending..
Should they have swept the bolts? No. But is it THAT shocking with the roster the Jackets had??? Also no.
It’s the erroneous assumption of victory vs. the arrogance of overinflating the superiority of one’s skill
Congrats Rob on the 100K!!
W 100K!!! 💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯 been here since 20k
My man. You're an OG
Florida wasn’t a top 16th team. They were 17th overall the Flames were 16th but didn’t make the playoffs because of how the wildcard system works.
i love this background music its so intense hahaha
The flaw in your argument..... it looks bad the last ten years but the ten before that? 5 finals and 4 cups.
Absolutely. But the league changes in each era and in this era, it is clear that there has been a trend
@@RobTalksHockeyTrue,that would make it a trend that can be reversed and not a curse that is out of control.
Bill Barilko's fate was a curse,winning the president's trophy sets a team up to crumble in the playoffs but if a team figures out why they can overcome it. I Remember this talk back in the 90's about the Rangers breaking two curses at once and being lauded until Dallas,Colorado and Detroit put that to rest.
Congrats on the 100K Robbie! Now lets hope the Canucks don't win the presidents trophy haha.
Thanks Max! And haha exactly 👌🏼
grats Rob!!!
keep it up man, going fulltime was worth it dude
Thanks dude!
congratulations on 100K subs
soo does that mean Vancouver might be out first round
no doubt
Presidents or not, pretty sure they're out first round either way
yah it'll be like 2012 again prolly lol
The big change in playoff hockey is the referees forget their whistles. A team built on skill and finesse are bullied by a team built on brawn and aggression. Tampa had great teams who died in playoffs until they added the likes of Maroon and Schenn who could push back.
But also game five should’ve been a Bruins win, but the stupid hand pass call when I think it was Bertuzzi had a goal removed because it hit another Bruins gloved, even though there’s no intent to pass the puck with that players hand
as a Vegas fan this is the video i needed right now…
Hey man. You said "modern nhl record". What do you think "modern" means?? Because i dont think it means what you think it means.
i think there's something wrong with the editing or vid file, it lags couple time
A couple clips got claimed and got removed :/
Easiest answer for the Presidents Trophy Curse is they ran out of gas. Like serious they used all their energy in the regular season.
just to clarify the 22-23 Bruins was not the greatest season ever. Best since 2005 yes. The regulation ties makes it argumentative to say ever.
At some point, I think teams phone it in against the top teams during the regular season. After 40 games, why put your best effort against the league leading team? Save that for a game you have a much better chance of winning. I think this contributes to the presidents trophy team being overrated before the playoffs.
Bro.. if you were a scientist we would be pumping our trucks with canola oil
Selke is no longer about best defensive forward. Pavs and several others had better numbers than him. Same with defensemen. It's a popularity contest.
congrats on 100k. now u can laugh at the bruins losing the first round as a verified channel
It's all about who gets hot at that right time and whose goalie stands on his head
Last team to win the cup that also had the best regular season record was probably Detroit
The worst kept secret, the Captain shall not touch the trophy. 😅
Last team in is almost always on a run having just gotten their best 2-3 players off of IR.
Ain’t no better crowd cheer than kuuuuu in the leagues
These stats makes me more hopeful that my Rangers can win the Cup this year. LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
If you include the 2013 season then the "President trophy" would be 13-1-1-1.2, the "Runners up" numbers would be 19-2-2-1.7, and the "Last place" would be 11-3-0-1.0. Not great, but not as bad as you make it out to be.
Didn’t Tampa win the Stanley Cup the following season?
Might this mean Boston will win the cup this season?
This graphic is incorrect. NYR won presidents trophy in 2015 and lost in conference final. This was 8 seasons ago and inside the window
Implement all the rules they had in 1970 throw out the ridiculous rules of today’s NHL and I’ll start watching again
St Louis brought home a cup after being dead last by christmas.
Nice you made it to the 100k
Poor Vancouver there magical run has come to an end.
The playoffs r a different animal than the regular season!? Anything can happen in the playoffs!?
The perfect amount of injuries to get them past the cap limit you mean
What was the secret??? Can someone comment if they ever find out please
Two words... over confidence
this is like the Madden cover curse
Ha ha, I'm from Siri, kiss me, and I'm gonna never followed camp. However, only the flyers before I knew any better. The Rangers until 1995 I know they had a good team but they seem to be falling apart.