Even in film about Churchill they never address the man-made famine. We indians are get excited when any Tom, Dick or Harry jusy say "india". But we don't demand an addressal of our grief that they have caused. And extremely got saddened when Sardar Udham Singh was not being sent for official Oscar nomination.
I was trying to concentrate, but her hair is just so gorgeous that I caught myself staring at it a lot 🤣 I am not Indian of course, but I have always found India such an interesting country. My mother lived 2 years in India because of her job in the 80s, she adores her memories of that time (we're latinas and live in LATAM). I appreciate videos like this, so even though not Indian myself, it's great to be educated, in order to avoid either insulting someone from a certain culture we might meet, or if we even get to go to said country someday. I'm curious if you could look into a soap opera from Brazil that was VERY popular in 2009 that depicted a lot of the story supposedly in India, and talks a lot about caste system and such, mixed in with culture and situations in Brazil. I won't lie that visually the story is very enchanting and very well acted, and of course I am not expecting the story to be 100% culturally correct lol, but I'd love to see you dive into it and see your perspective and also taking into account this was made in 2009, different times. The writer of the story (Gloria Perez) was famous for doing another soap opera based on Muslim religion and Arabic culture, Morocco, and Brazil, and it was and still is, an international hit (named O clone), so she later took on India for the story mentioned before, called Caminho Das Indias in Portuguese. Anyway, love the content, new sub!
16:20 Those 2 seconds of "mat bol na phir!" is pure meme material! Someone should cut it and use it each time a diaspora Indian mispronounces something in a tv show/movie!
I think the problem is also about how mindy kailing claims that she's breaking stereotypes and representing indians in a true sense which is apparently false. Aneesa saying she has to wear hijab in swimming pool just converts to how indian Muslims are conservative. Nalini's character especially in first season is poorly written but she has nice character development. Indian mothers won't allow their kids to date but will agree if it's indian boy. Even lily singh is way too stereotypical. PC seems like a decent representation.
Omg finally someone else who cringed at every mention of "bonn" for sister. I felt like it was so unnecessary to put in Bridgerton, if you aren't even gonna pronounce it right,
So growing up Indian-Canadian, I have to say that the homogenization of community is something you see much more in the older children of immigrant parents. Back when there were fewer Indians who had to exist in very White spaces so a lot of the nuances were lost. But a lot of us diaspora kids are very in touch with our culture and have been immersed with and surrounded by it all our lives. I hate that these shows made by brown people continue to paint us diaspora kids as white-washed, caricatures of Indian culture, especially to Indians back home, when in reality a lot of us are really connected to our roots. It is inevitable with the sort of id-pol representation craze Hollywood has been having, that the faults in such a storytelling style will start showing. You cannot paint cultures with the broad strokes that identity politics tries to, and you especially cannot tell individual experiences with culture in that way. It will always be ineffective, uninspired and come off as caricature rather than authentic.
I really appreciate this. The wounds caused by the western takeover are yet to heal, and it seems most of their culture does not even recognize their colonial pasts. Only issue I had w this is w The Darjeeling Limited. For me it has been his best work so far when it comes to storytelling, set design and narrative structure. Wes has a clear influence from both Jean Renoir and Satyajit Ray. The movies soundtrack alone is like an ode to him and his impact. The only somewhat valid criticism I saw was about the Indian “snake-charmer” bit that happens on the train. But, that also is about the almost sociopathic lack of emotion in the train conductor(plus he just put the animal in a bin and didn’t really do the nonsense flute bit) making the girl want to cheat on him even more. The movie explored death, grief and family in such a charming way and was much less dollhouse like compared to his recent ones. Hope you change your mind on it or educate me in case I’m totally off ❤
Hey, there's absolutely nothing wrong with loving a film and don't let anyone 'educate' you against it. :) Like I said, I couldn't finish the film so I really shouldn't comment on its contents. I'm purely talking about the visual portrayal of India that seemed completely myopic to me. But that doesn't mean the film can't have value otherwise. Like I said, there are problems in Never Have I Ever but I still liked it.
@@Cinemawali looking back at my initial comment, the last couple of lines may be a little too passionate about the movie lol. I don’t think he is in any way helping the Indian representation in films by treating everyone in his films as props in his doll homes. But, as a huge Ray fan myself, any prejudice towards someone casually name dropping is a 100% justified. Keeping my bias towards this movie aside, I really appreciate the work that you have put into this video and the channel. I hope you go even bigger and better this new year :)
You forgot about the infamous dinner scene from Octopussy. It did put India , especially Rajasthan on the hotlist of western tourist spot but was equally derogatory to the Indian representation in western cinema.
Britain's extreme reluctance to admit the extent of its crimes against India does stand out a lot. I watched the new BBC production of Around the World In 80 Days, which I thought was pretty good and which did its best to correct the source material's xenophobia-- it was a huge relief, at any rate, that Mr. Fogg doesn't rescue a helpless Indian girl (and his eventual love interest of course) from being burned alive by her neighbors this time. But it seemed weird to me that the young Indian man being court-martialed for desertion (he was denied permission to go back home for his own wedding and went anyway) is treated so well by the English soldiers. They clearly regard him as an equal and a dear friend, when I imagine that was...not the case in real life.
What a great topic of discussion! We also need to talk about portrayal of South Asians in East Asia. I was trying to watch chungking express but couldn't get through it because I just couldn't stand the representation. I searched about it online too but there are barely any articles. Everybody seems to love the movie. Maybe I need to watch more of it but I couldn't get past the first half. The stereotypes eat at me. We are often used in movies, as one article I read stated, for comedic relief or for villainous intent .There is also an air of superiority when it comes to the main characters from a movie from any country featuring South Asians, hinting at how we need to be 'saved'. Another instance is of a Korean song about 'curry' and it's just a song with random hindi words in its lines like "shanti" "curry" etc. This is a stereotypical song that is supposed to be funny I suppose and it is so harmful and offensive instead.
I'm not sure what you're referencing when it comes to Chungking Express because it's by a Hong Kong filmmaker named Wong Kar Wai. But yes, stereotyping is always a problem.
Mindy Kailing's 'peshabi pila' from ocean's 8, Mr incompetent Raj from Big bang theory and the worst on is Kumail from the eternals - "the Bollywood actor" (God damn the dance scared me) I feel priyanka can change the ways of Hollywood depiction of Indian culture bt she just doesn't get the proper chance. She has that talent bt Hollywood keeps casting her in as the exotic indian instead of giving her some good material to work with. She needs a good script!
The way India is going we will be portrayed as cult than the one who has been unified and created nation for all. Indian diaspora if you analyze them behaves like they didn't want to recognize 1947 but want to represent the culture with basis of religion they just happen to know. Our diversity is too complex for them to create art or maybe for us as well 😊
About the last point- I feel it's also the fault of pop culture. Most English content is either in an American or British English accent. Even I find it difficult to understand a Chinese person talking in english. But you're right; brown people feel the need to code switch in order to fit in, and not just for better communication. I have heard Indian Americans say that Indians outside are like Biharis outside Bihar.
I am from Tamil Nadu I was frustrated with the mindy kailinf's Indian(Tamil) representation in her most shows .I watch all your videos, the video is top notch and on the face for those "representatives" .
hi "i dont know your name yet" i just found your channel in my reccommendation of irfan khan ,then i watch radhika apte , then hasee toh pasee , then bariwali then a death in gunj........then charullata ..i have recently watched pather panchali but i couldnot make deep observation like you show in your video the film just went by across my eyes..i like that film but couldnot root to it so can you please give some observation skill because watching film many thing on unnotice by me i cant see thing metaphorically.....can you tell how you made your observation and also reccommend some good film available on youtube.
I don't know how much this would overlap with your current audience, but it would be so cool to hear your take on Indian portrayal in gaming. Fantastic video btw.
@@Cinemawali Yeah Venba was a very nice take on Indian culture. The reason I made the comment on the Indian representation in gaming is because certain Indian/south-asian elements are often used in gaming which still maintain the ye'old land of snake charmers vibe. Like uncharted uses the same formula as Indiana Jones, then some games have some not-so-nice representations of Kali too and I don't think I have ever seen a take on that.
8:10 na na na. The fact that they hired a child who speaks hindi with bengali accent is realistic and genius. Here most Bengali children, especially in rural household like the one depicted in that clip, barely speak hindi. Even if we do we speak with thick accent. It would have been weird to find a bengali poor child who speaks perfect hindi.
I am from Mumbai Maharashtra and when I was in Gujarat their they had some unique flavours of ice cream not found in Maharashtra and Maharashtra has some flavours not found in Gujarat . So I don’t know why nris paint India in one lens when they don’t know how many states India has .
U should do the same for different indian film industries how they portray each other in their own movies. 3:00 So called kali(it had different forms which was before it was hijacked) was brought in to existence by the indigenous/tribal people before it was hijacked in to Sanatan Dharma what we today know it as-Hinduism(in reality its bhraminism ,at most the sanatan dharma is 11 century old) and different gods like current day kali and their statues were hijacked and modified from the different tribal groups and made in to upper caste versions of them its like adding a new superhero in the avengers group😅 ,or disney buying every animated or superhero ip. To have more influence(social, financial , political) over the so called lower caste, indigenous people. The version of kali which is ancient has cannibalism in it and the worshippers did worship and had a canibilistic and human sacrifices to their rituals. Even the Brahminised version has a garland of skulls dangling around kali's body.
Problem is with each one of us. We like acknowledgement and representation. People are exploiting it by making either pro indian content or hateful content to get attention. Also most of these so called Indians are srilankan. They are not Indians or dont know india. Kapoor needs to look kapoor not out of place. In today’s world of views and comments , we Indians need to be careful of what we encourage.
As a Tamil person, I literally could not get through the first two episodes of Never Have I Ever. Something about the constant jarring attempts to reintegrate into one’s culture while simultaneously fighting to live in the American present (not to mention all the talks of sex and the, you know, “rebellious promiscuous indian”) just never sat right with me. Also as a Tamil person I’m just SAD that this is the only mainstream Tamil representation western audiences will get. Like I’m going to have to be compared to fucking Devi. like cmon
First of all, these recent movies are not really representing India. Even NRI, know very little about the India we live in. They are representing the only the the American or British Indians, so we shouldn't be complaining. If they wanted authentic Indians they could have approached any of our Indian actors, They are making these movies, they are putting the money into it. Hamar kya jata hain, I hated Brighton 2 seasons, Kate character was obnoxious and stupidly self righteous.
16:13 I can't stop laughing. Bone becomes bon 🤣🤣 1)Okay but one thing I want to correct. Indians don't have clearest accent. I have been hearing this nonsense since kid but it's absolutely false. It's sound clear to us bcs we r raised in an environment where we r aware of the language that the accent is based of. But that knowledge is not available to non-Indians and that's why they can't understand. Americans will naturally gravitate towards French and other European even Australian bcs they all are from white. Historically they r connected to and has lot of cultural influence. English also takes lot of words from old German and Welsh. Hence, why it will be easier. So it's not their fault for not being able to understand Indian accent. Also accent is highly influenced by what you hear. That's why people's accent keep changing with location. 2) Now coming to cultural representation. I have seen reiews of recent representation based films by many natives. It's interesting how all (the one I saw) have same thing to say as you. Shang Chi, Ms.Marvel, Black Panther, Raya and Last Dragon, Xo Kitty, Aladin. Alot of natives were not getting the representation. Infact in some cases it was abysmally hollow. Like in case of Raya and Crazy Rich Asian. Where in Raya, all SEA countries were mixed and cherry picked into sections based on personality as if it's Harry Potter and they were done. No country was given individual identity. Pretty much all the movies have one complain i.e not getting the nuances of the culture. Representation is definitely there but on surface level but not in deep. I think the issue is bcs of American identity attached to every other ethnicity. All these are written by American-Indian/African/Chinese/SEA etc. Naturally the values and topic will be American hot topic. Notice how despite all being cultural diverse. The core conflict ends up being self-identity. A current hot discussion in America. After seeing this I understood they r not representing India or any other country. They r representating American-Indian/etc. It will never be authentic. These are American show at the end of the day and they always will be. Therefore, the true representation is to watch shows from various country and recognize them.
Fair enough. I agree with your point about the accent. But the fact is they will still hold French culture in the highest regard without exoticizing it in the same way they exoticize Indian or other cultures. Like they are very firm about pronouncing French words correctly but they confidently say 'naamastay' regularly with no remorse. There is a lack of respect. French culture is something to be cultivated while Indian culture is something to be observed as a tourist.
I felt the comments about saree vs lehenga, clothing, accessories that appear in never have I ever are more of a nit-pick than a critique of thought or understanding. While we ask for more brown representation, we must not forget that our "brown" vs their brown is totally different. What I mean is that they are representing Indian Americans, American first, and Indian next. Their "Indian-ness" in calling a saree a lehenga is not wrong, just like how their bharatanatyam dancers not being able to "correctly" pronounce technical terms in bharatanatyam is not wrong. I do agree that Kamala's character is not well researched enough, given her background. Yes, there are some flaws but, they aren't so fundamental to snatch the credit of seeing brown representation in mainstream media in Frontline roles and characters away from them.
Also, there's absolutely nothing wrong in parents not teaching their children the nuances in their Indian heritage. Firstly, these nuances are picked up somehow naturally when you have a large enough diverse population to interact with. Speaking from personal experience of living in the US as an Indian, I honestly do not see as many Indian people from diverse backgrounds in my city. Many states are not even represented, forget the nuances. Yes, there is a savarna dominance and I must say somehow their savarna heritage is taught to children more than the nuances of the regions they are from. There is no problem in not teaching nuances because frankly it makes no difference to these Indian American kids. Being the only Kannadiga kid in their cohort, I wouldn't force my kid to learn Kannada to feel more Indian here, or learn to differentiate between various Kannada accents if they don't want to. But, what I would teach is the caste lens which we all Indians still widely use to look at people, to decide whom to interact with, whom we criticize and whom we victimize. This, in my opinion is more important for an Indian American kid to know than the nuances of their ancestry which frankly doesn't make sense when we don't have enough representation to begin with.
What I'm trying to point out is that there is a lot of difference in how I think of India, and how an Indian American would think of it. Both these notions are valid, honest and there is no right or wrong. We need better writers and cinematographers who understand this fundamental distinction and acknowledge them. We need representation of both immigrants and citizens in the US for example, who are Indians. It's very hard for two working Indian parents to teach even their two different mother tongues, when there's no one else speaking or teaching those languages. Things are far more complicated and subtle.
I haven't passed a value judgement on how immigrant parents bring up their kids. These are observations- analysing the problem with the representation. Coming to the thing about clothing- it is important to critique not just the clothes they wear in films and shows but also NRI fashion in general because while NRIs fail to respect Indian textile, refuse to spend their money on it despite their spending power and continue to wear polyester saris and plastic jewellery, weavers in Indian are out of jobs and several of our handloom styles are going extinct. Yes, it is not the NRI's job to buy authentic Indian clothing but it is certainly our job to call out their tacky attempt at fast fashion which does a very poor job of copying what Indian clothes look like. I'm not saying they need to be as Indian as Indians living in India. But Indianness should never be performative, and in this case, it definitely appears to be nothing more than that.
@@Cinemawali While I do agree with you about the need for better fashion designing teams, the show stands out as an Indian-American drama with an Indian-American girl as a lead character. This deserves a celebration too is my humble opinion. This is a one-of-its kind American show, with the emphasis on the word "American". Actually, you do pass on value judgement on how Indian parents bring up their kids. You start off by saying the root of the problem lies here. Well, they bring up their kids as Americans, because their kids are in fact, Americans. As I've said, they are Americans first, and Indians next. There is no right or wrong way of being "Indian". These are two different notions, experiences which simultaneously exist here -- One is that of an immigrant Indian, and the other is that of their American kids. The way you and I feel about being Indian is largely driven by our experiences living in India, which of course can't be replicated in America, no matter how much their parents try to "teach". These are cultural experiences, one simply cannot "teach" them. You in fact blame the parents for not teaching them these "nuances". If this is not a value judgement, what else is it? Your socio-political commentary at the end only comes from the point-of-view of a true nationalist at heart which we all Indians are, but you fail to understand that this show is made for Americans and when they speak of brown representation, they are speaking of their brown people -- Indian Americans, Latinx-American, etc. We of course need more Indian (our Indian) representation, but only a team comprised of people having lived in India could produce such a show. I don't see what our brown kids do here as a humiliation in any sense. They are being Indian in their own way. The american culture is such that it is a heterogeneous salad bowl, and Indians homogenize to some extent only because it is the natural thing to do. What else can you expect? And our Indian brown kids later want to explore their roots, just like how we have all done, in different situations, with respect to diferent issues while in India. Your first two lines in the reply about this particular issue of being the "right kind of Indian", neither talks about the questions I've raised nor acknowledges the problematic statements you've made.
You're very conveniently leaving out the one term I used to describe the biggest issue here- Savarna culture. Indians carry the exclusivity of casteism and religious intolerance abroad and it shows through how they are portrayed on screen. So sure, enjoy the homogenous culture you have cultivated. Nobody is stopping you. But when someone is questioning the problems with it, you might want to read up on the rise of Hindutva in the West and the caste-based discrimination many Indians are still facing at the hands of their peers especially in educational institutions, before calling someone's well-researched observations problematic. At the end of the day, what these showrunners needed to do was research and they failed to do that. Period.
Bridgerton is not a historical show. Its a historical fantasy. The depiction need not be accurate. It just needs to be good within the context of the world of bridgerton which it is.
I have addressed that in the video. The fact is, they have still done a terrible job at representing Indians even if we think that it's okay that they never address colonization. British history, on which this fantasy is based, would not be what it is without the colonisation of India.
@@Cinemawali Yes, attempts are usually half-baked. I am not arguing that point at all. It is just that I have come across a lot of people who grew up in the North complaining about why the sisters call their dad Appa. As someone who grew up outside the South, I also discovered this as late as 18 when I had a Malayali professor called Ms. Verma.
@@EagleOverTheSea someone who calls their dad "appa" wouldn't really call their sister "didi" 😂 it stuck out like a sore thumb to me like they sincerely could have researched a littttttle more into this shit
Even in film about Churchill they never address the man-made famine. We indians are get excited when any Tom, Dick or Harry jusy say "india". But we don't demand an addressal of our grief that they have caused.
And extremely got saddened when Sardar Udham Singh was not being sent for official Oscar nomination.
I was trying to concentrate, but her hair is just so gorgeous that I caught myself staring at it a lot 🤣 I am not Indian of course, but I have always found India such an interesting country. My mother lived 2 years in India because of her job in the 80s, she adores her memories of that time (we're latinas and live in LATAM). I appreciate videos like this, so even though not Indian myself, it's great to be educated, in order to avoid either insulting someone from a certain culture we might meet, or if we even get to go to said country someday. I'm curious if you could look into a soap opera from Brazil that was VERY popular in 2009 that depicted a lot of the story supposedly in India, and talks a lot about caste system and such, mixed in with culture and situations in Brazil. I won't lie that visually the story is very enchanting and very well acted, and of course I am not expecting the story to be 100% culturally correct lol, but I'd love to see you dive into it and see your perspective and also taking into account this was made in 2009, different times. The writer of the story (Gloria Perez) was famous for doing another soap opera based on Muslim religion and Arabic culture, Morocco, and Brazil, and it was and still is, an international hit (named O clone), so she later took on India for the story mentioned before, called Caminho Das Indias in Portuguese. Anyway, love the content, new sub!
16:20 Those 2 seconds of "mat bol na phir!" is pure meme material! Someone should cut it and use it each time a diaspora Indian mispronounces something in a tv show/movie!
I think the problem is also about how mindy kailing claims that she's breaking stereotypes and representing indians in a true sense which is apparently false. Aneesa saying she has to wear hijab in swimming pool just converts to how indian Muslims are conservative. Nalini's character especially in first season is poorly written but she has nice character development. Indian mothers won't allow their kids to date but will agree if it's indian boy. Even lily singh is way too stereotypical. PC seems like a decent representation.
Omg finally someone else who cringed at every mention of "bonn" for sister. I felt like it was so unnecessary to put in Bridgerton, if you aren't even gonna pronounce it right,
So growing up Indian-Canadian, I have to say that the homogenization of community is something you see much more in the older children of immigrant parents. Back when there were fewer Indians who had to exist in very White spaces so a lot of the nuances were lost. But a lot of us diaspora kids are very in touch with our culture and have been immersed with and surrounded by it all our lives. I hate that these shows made by brown people continue to paint us diaspora kids as white-washed, caricatures of Indian culture, especially to Indians back home, when in reality a lot of us are really connected to our roots.
It is inevitable with the sort of id-pol representation craze Hollywood has been having, that the faults in such a storytelling style will start showing. You cannot paint cultures with the broad strokes that identity politics tries to, and you especially cannot tell individual experiences with culture in that way. It will always be ineffective, uninspired and come off as caricature rather than authentic.
I really appreciate this. The wounds caused by the western takeover are yet to heal, and it seems most of their culture does not even recognize their colonial pasts. Only issue I had w this is w The Darjeeling Limited. For me it has been his best work so far when it comes to storytelling, set design and narrative structure. Wes has a clear influence from both Jean Renoir and Satyajit Ray. The movies soundtrack alone is like an ode to him and his impact. The only somewhat valid criticism I saw was about the Indian “snake-charmer” bit that happens on the train. But, that also is about the almost sociopathic lack of emotion in the train conductor(plus he just put the animal in a bin and didn’t really do the nonsense flute bit) making the girl want to cheat on him even more. The movie explored death, grief and family in such a charming way and was much less dollhouse like compared to his recent ones. Hope you change your mind on it or educate me in case I’m totally off ❤
Hey, there's absolutely nothing wrong with loving a film and don't let anyone 'educate' you against it. :)
Like I said, I couldn't finish the film so I really shouldn't comment on its contents. I'm purely talking about the visual portrayal of India that seemed completely myopic to me. But that doesn't mean the film can't have value otherwise. Like I said, there are problems in Never Have I Ever but I still liked it.
@@Cinemawali looking back at my initial comment, the last couple of lines may be a little too passionate about the movie lol. I don’t think he is in any way helping the Indian representation in films by treating everyone in his films as props in his doll homes. But, as a huge Ray fan myself, any prejudice towards someone casually name dropping is a 100% justified. Keeping my bias towards this movie aside, I really appreciate the work that you have put into this video and the channel. I hope you go even bigger and better this new year :)
You forgot about the infamous dinner scene from Octopussy. It did put India , especially Rajasthan on the hotlist of western tourist spot but was equally derogatory to the Indian representation in western cinema.
I started watching Octopussy but couldn't get through it. :')
Besides, I had to cut out a LOT from the video because it was becoming too long.
Britain's extreme reluctance to admit the extent of its crimes against India does stand out a lot. I watched the new BBC production of Around the World In 80 Days, which I thought was pretty good and which did its best to correct the source material's xenophobia-- it was a huge relief, at any rate, that Mr. Fogg doesn't rescue a helpless Indian girl (and his eventual love interest of course) from being burned alive by her neighbors this time. But it seemed weird to me that the young Indian man being court-martialed for desertion (he was denied permission to go back home for his own wedding and went anyway) is treated so well by the English soldiers. They clearly regard him as an equal and a dear friend, when I imagine that was...not the case in real life.
What a great topic of discussion! We also need to talk about portrayal of South Asians in East Asia. I was trying to watch chungking express but couldn't get through it because I just couldn't stand the representation. I searched about it online too but there are barely any articles. Everybody seems to love the movie. Maybe I need to watch more of it but I couldn't get past the first half. The stereotypes eat at me. We are often used in movies, as one article I read stated, for comedic relief or for villainous intent .There is also an air of superiority when it comes to the main characters from a movie from any country featuring South Asians, hinting at how we need to be 'saved'.
Another instance is of a Korean song about 'curry' and it's just a song with random hindi words in its lines like "shanti" "curry" etc. This is a stereotypical song that is supposed to be funny I suppose and it is so harmful and offensive instead.
I'm not sure what you're referencing when it comes to Chungking Express because it's by a Hong Kong filmmaker named Wong Kar Wai. But yes, stereotyping is always a problem.
Mindy Kailing's 'peshabi pila' from ocean's 8, Mr incompetent Raj from Big bang theory and the worst on is Kumail from the eternals - "the Bollywood actor" (God damn the dance scared me)
I feel priyanka can change the ways of Hollywood depiction of Indian culture bt she just doesn't get the proper chance. She has that talent bt Hollywood keeps casting her in as the exotic indian instead of giving her some good material to work with. She needs a good script!
The way India is going we will be portrayed as cult than the one who has been unified and created nation for all. Indian diaspora if you analyze them behaves like they didn't want to recognize 1947 but want to represent the culture with basis of religion they just happen to know. Our diversity is too complex for them to create art or maybe for us as well 😊
About the last point- I feel it's also the fault of pop culture. Most English content is either in an American or British English accent. Even I find it difficult to understand a Chinese person talking in english. But you're right; brown people feel the need to code switch in order to fit in, and not just for better communication. I have heard Indian Americans say that Indians outside are like Biharis outside Bihar.
Everything ab Indiana Jones gets me but especially them filming all the scenes of the village in sri lanka and having the villagers speak sinhalese 😭😭
I am from Tamil Nadu I was frustrated with the mindy kailinf's Indian(Tamil) representation in her most shows .I watch all your videos, the video is top notch and on the face for those "representatives" .
Even Bollywood doesn't represent India properly , what can we expect form western countries .
hi "i dont know your name yet" i just found your channel in my reccommendation of irfan khan ,then i watch radhika apte , then hasee toh pasee , then bariwali then a death in gunj........then charullata ..i have recently watched pather panchali but i couldnot make deep observation like you show in your video the film just went by across my eyes..i like that film but couldnot root to it so
can you please give some observation skill because watching film many thing on unnotice by me i cant see thing metaphorically.....can you tell how you made your observation and also reccommend some good film available on youtube.
I don't know how much this would overlap with your current audience, but it would be so cool to hear your take on Indian portrayal in gaming. Fantastic video btw.
I recently watched a playthrough of this game called Venba and it was sooo good!
@@Cinemawali Yeah Venba was a very nice take on Indian culture. The reason I made the comment on the Indian representation in gaming is because certain Indian/south-asian elements are often used in gaming which still maintain the ye'old land of snake charmers vibe. Like uncharted uses the same formula as Indiana Jones, then some games have some not-so-nice representations of Kali too and I don't think I have ever seen a take on that.
@@zalzeeraMulti-billion Studio can send man to research how on Mars atmosphere but they couldn't do research on a culture so beautiful
Such a good, information packed, wit filled video ❤ you've expressed all the things we feel when we witness the same, and so well.
Your channel is ao underrated, it needs more appreciation
8:10 na na na. The fact that they hired a child who speaks hindi with bengali accent is realistic and genius. Here most Bengali children, especially in rural household like the one depicted in that clip, barely speak hindi. Even if we do we speak with thick accent. It would have been weird to find a bengali poor child who speaks perfect hindi.
Bro, I'm Bengali. Her accent was American. 🥲
There is so much more wrong with the portrayal of kolkatta in Avengers. There are gangsters roaming around on street apparently.
This is great! I discovered your channel recently and am hooked
Mat bol na phir tu - I loved her frustration.
I loved your candor and how openly you talked about everything :))
"Tum saala ghulam log" 😂😂😂😂😂
😂
I am from Mumbai Maharashtra and when I was in Gujarat their they had some unique flavours of ice cream not found in Maharashtra and Maharashtra has some flavours not found in Gujarat . So I don’t know why nris paint India in one lens when they don’t know how many states India has .
Question- How to be patriotic?
Answer- *shares this video*
👏👏🔥
U should do the same for different indian film industries how they portray each other in their own movies.
3:00
So called kali(it had different forms which was before it was hijacked) was brought in to existence by the indigenous/tribal people before it was hijacked in to Sanatan Dharma what we today know it as-Hinduism(in reality its bhraminism
,at most the sanatan dharma is 11 century old) and different gods like current day kali and their statues were hijacked and modified from the different tribal groups and made in to upper caste versions of them
its like adding a new superhero in the avengers group😅 ,or disney buying every animated or superhero ip.
To have more influence(social, financial , political) over the so called lower caste, indigenous people.
The version of kali which is ancient has cannibalism in it and the worshippers did worship and had a canibilistic and human sacrifices to their rituals.
Even the Brahminised version has a garland of skulls dangling around kali's body.
I love your work and such extensive amount of research behind the videos!!
It works both ways. Bob Christo in umpteen Bollywood movies is a great example....
she went off bhai xdddddddddd
Imagine if they did that Indiana Jones Dinner scene today 😂
22:00 this hits hard
Amazing. Just amazing.
i'm so agreed you....
Sorry but I wanted this channel to be underrated only.
😢
@@Cinemawali for obvious reasons. This gold is not meant for everyone.
Us
This was so funny I loved ittt 😂
The root cause conversation was bang on
Amrish Puri is the Villain who can only save Bollywood these days 😅
U really need to get popular
For india❤❤❤❤❤❤
Problem is with each one of us. We like acknowledgement and representation. People are exploiting it by making either pro indian content or hateful content to get attention. Also most of these so called Indians are srilankan. They are not Indians or dont know india. Kapoor needs to look kapoor not out of place. In today’s world of views and comments , we Indians need to be careful of what we encourage.
Such a deep dive.
As a Tamil person, I literally could not get through the first two episodes of Never Have I Ever. Something about the constant jarring attempts to reintegrate into one’s culture while simultaneously fighting to live in the American present (not to mention all the talks of sex and the, you know, “rebellious promiscuous indian”) just never sat right with me.
Also as a Tamil person I’m just SAD that this is the only mainstream Tamil representation western audiences will get. Like I’m going to have to be compared to fucking Devi. like cmon
And they choose A Sri Lankan artist for portrayal 😅
First of all, these recent movies are not really representing India. Even NRI, know very little about the India we live in. They are representing the only the the American or British Indians, so we shouldn't be complaining. If they wanted authentic Indians they could have approached any of our Indian actors,
They are making these movies, they are putting the money into it. Hamar kya jata hain, I hated Brighton 2 seasons, Kate character was obnoxious and stupidly self righteous.
ma'am which microphone you are using?
What is the name of the second film?
Do you mean the one where the bride is shown? That's from Eat Pray Love
@@Cinemawali the one at @03:47
11:57 the accent change 😂😂😂
🧡
Mu all time favorite movie
Happy Independence Day 🧘
😂👍 it was fun watch
16:13 I can't stop laughing. Bone becomes bon 🤣🤣
1)Okay but one thing I want to correct. Indians don't have clearest accent. I have been hearing this nonsense since kid but it's absolutely false.
It's sound clear to us bcs we r raised in an environment where we r aware of the language that the accent is based of. But that knowledge is not available to non-Indians and that's why they can't understand.
Americans will naturally gravitate towards French and other European even Australian bcs they all are from white. Historically they r connected to and has lot of cultural influence. English also takes lot of words from old German and Welsh. Hence, why it will be easier.
So it's not their fault for not being able to understand Indian accent.
Also accent is highly influenced by what you hear. That's why people's accent keep changing with location.
2) Now coming to cultural representation.
I have seen reiews of recent representation based films by many natives. It's interesting how all (the one I saw) have same thing to say as you.
Shang Chi, Ms.Marvel, Black Panther, Raya and Last Dragon, Xo Kitty, Aladin.
Alot of natives were not getting the representation. Infact in some cases it was abysmally hollow.
Like in case of Raya and Crazy Rich Asian. Where in Raya, all SEA countries were mixed and cherry picked into sections based on personality as if it's Harry Potter and they were done.
No country was given individual identity.
Pretty much all the movies have one complain i.e not getting the nuances of the culture. Representation is definitely there but on surface level but not in deep.
I think the issue is bcs of American identity attached to every other ethnicity. All these are written by American-Indian/African/Chinese/SEA etc. Naturally the values and topic will be American hot topic. Notice how despite all being cultural diverse. The core conflict ends up being self-identity. A current hot discussion in America.
After seeing this I understood they r not representing India or any other country. They r representating American-Indian/etc. It will never be authentic.
These are American show at the end of the day and they always will be.
Therefore, the true representation is to watch shows from various country and recognize them.
Fair enough. I agree with your point about the accent. But the fact is they will still hold French culture in the highest regard without exoticizing it in the same way they exoticize Indian or other cultures. Like they are very firm about pronouncing French words correctly but they confidently say 'naamastay' regularly with no remorse. There is a lack of respect. French culture is something to be cultivated while Indian culture is something to be observed as a tourist.
lesgoooooo
I felt the comments about saree vs lehenga, clothing, accessories that appear in never have I ever are more of a nit-pick than a critique of thought or understanding. While we ask for more brown representation, we must not forget that our "brown" vs their brown is totally different. What I mean is that they are representing Indian Americans, American first, and Indian next. Their "Indian-ness" in calling a saree a lehenga is not wrong, just like how their bharatanatyam dancers not being able to "correctly" pronounce technical terms in bharatanatyam is not wrong. I do agree that Kamala's character is not well researched enough, given her background. Yes, there are some flaws but, they aren't so fundamental to snatch the credit of seeing brown representation in mainstream media in Frontline roles and characters away from them.
Also, there's absolutely nothing wrong in parents not teaching their children the nuances in their Indian heritage. Firstly, these nuances are picked up somehow naturally when you have a large enough diverse population to interact with. Speaking from personal experience of living in the US as an Indian, I honestly do not see as many Indian people from diverse backgrounds in my city. Many states are not even represented, forget the nuances. Yes, there is a savarna dominance and I must say somehow their savarna heritage is taught to children more than the nuances of the regions they are from. There is no problem in not teaching nuances because frankly it makes no difference to these Indian American kids. Being the only Kannadiga kid in their cohort, I wouldn't force my kid to learn Kannada to feel more Indian here, or learn to differentiate between various Kannada accents if they don't want to. But, what I would teach is the caste lens which we all Indians still widely use to look at people, to decide whom to interact with, whom we criticize and whom we victimize. This, in my opinion is more important for an Indian American kid to know than the nuances of their ancestry which frankly doesn't make sense when we don't have enough representation to begin with.
What I'm trying to point out is that there is a lot of difference in how I think of India, and how an Indian American would think of it. Both these notions are valid, honest and there is no right or wrong. We need better writers and cinematographers who understand this fundamental distinction and acknowledge them. We need representation of both immigrants and citizens in the US for example, who are Indians. It's very hard for two working Indian parents to teach even their two different mother tongues, when there's no one else speaking or teaching those languages. Things are far more complicated and subtle.
I haven't passed a value judgement on how immigrant parents bring up their kids. These are observations- analysing the problem with the representation. Coming to the thing about clothing- it is important to critique not just the clothes they wear in films and shows but also NRI fashion in general because while NRIs fail to respect Indian textile, refuse to spend their money on it despite their spending power and continue to wear polyester saris and plastic jewellery, weavers in Indian are out of jobs and several of our handloom styles are going extinct. Yes, it is not the NRI's job to buy authentic Indian clothing but it is certainly our job to call out their tacky attempt at fast fashion which does a very poor job of copying what Indian clothes look like. I'm not saying they need to be as Indian as Indians living in India. But Indianness should never be performative, and in this case, it definitely appears to be nothing more than that.
@@Cinemawali While I do agree with you about the need for better fashion designing teams, the show stands out as an Indian-American drama with an Indian-American girl as a lead character. This deserves a celebration too is my humble opinion. This is a one-of-its kind American show, with the emphasis on the word "American".
Actually, you do pass on value judgement on how Indian parents bring up their kids. You start off by saying the root of the problem lies here. Well, they bring up their kids as Americans, because their kids are in fact, Americans. As I've said, they are Americans first, and Indians next. There is no right or wrong way of being "Indian". These are two different notions, experiences which simultaneously exist here -- One is that of an immigrant Indian, and the other is that of their American kids. The way you and I feel about being Indian is largely driven by our experiences living in India, which of course can't be replicated in America, no matter how much their parents try to "teach". These are cultural experiences, one simply cannot "teach" them. You in fact blame the parents for not teaching them these "nuances". If this is not a value judgement, what else is it? Your socio-political commentary at the end only comes from the point-of-view of a true nationalist at heart which we all Indians are, but you fail to understand that this show is made for Americans and when they speak of brown representation, they are speaking of their brown people -- Indian Americans, Latinx-American, etc. We of course need more Indian (our Indian) representation, but only a team comprised of people having lived in India could produce such a show. I don't see what our brown kids do here as a humiliation in any sense. They are being Indian in their own way. The american culture is such that it is a heterogeneous salad bowl, and Indians homogenize to some extent only because it is the natural thing to do. What else can you expect? And our Indian brown kids later want to explore their roots, just like how we have all done, in different situations, with respect to diferent issues while in India. Your first two lines in the reply about this particular issue of being the "right kind of Indian", neither talks about the questions I've raised nor acknowledges the problematic statements you've made.
You're very conveniently leaving out the one term I used to describe the biggest issue here- Savarna culture. Indians carry the exclusivity of casteism and religious intolerance abroad and it shows through how they are portrayed on screen. So sure, enjoy the homogenous culture you have cultivated. Nobody is stopping you. But when someone is questioning the problems with it, you might want to read up on the rise of Hindutva in the West and the caste-based discrimination many Indians are still facing at the hands of their peers especially in educational institutions, before calling someone's well-researched observations problematic.
At the end of the day, what these showrunners needed to do was research and they failed to do that. Period.
Bridgerton is not a historical show. Its a historical fantasy. The depiction need not be accurate. It just needs to be good within the context of the world of bridgerton which it is.
I have addressed that in the video. The fact is, they have still done a terrible job at representing Indians even if we think that it's okay that they never address colonization. British history, on which this fantasy is based, would not be what it is without the colonisation of India.
Does Bridgerton even have anything to do with India? I thought the Indian lady is supposed to be playing a British woman in that show.
They apparently are from India! I've addressed all of this in the video.
@@justanothermortal1373 yup but they have roots in India within the story
Sharma is a south indian Brahmin surname as well. It is spelled as Sarma.
Yes, I looked that up too but the way they spell and pronounce it makes it clear that they really didn't look into it. I mean, let's be honest. 🥲
@@Cinemawali Yes, attempts are usually half-baked. I am not arguing that point at all. It is just that I have come across a lot of people who grew up in the North complaining about why the sisters call their dad Appa. As someone who grew up outside the South, I also discovered this as late as 18 when I had a Malayali professor called Ms. Verma.
Is that all you got from the video? 😧
@@EagleOverTheSea someone who calls their dad "appa" wouldn't really call their sister "didi" 😂 it stuck out like a sore thumb to me
like they sincerely could have researched a littttttle more into this shit
Stop playing with hair ffs🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏
Your hair and your hands....very distracting from your content
How? Why you are concentrating on those instead of the essay she is explaining to us?