What If SANS Didn't Make The Promise?
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- Опубліковано 22 лют 2023
- What If SANS Didn't Make The Promise?
This video, I theorized about what would happen in the events of Undertale if Sans didn't make the promise to Toriel!
Discord: / discord
Undertale, Deltarune, Theory, Toby Fox, Underlab, Merg, keMadgik, MysticSlime, Shayy, Undertale Challenge, Deltarune Challenge, Undertale Speedrun, Deltarune Speedrun, Speedrun, Undertale Race, Deltarune Race, Race, Flowey, Napstablook, Toriel, Sans, Papyrus, Undyne, Mad Dummy, Mad Mew Mew, Mettaton, Alphys, Muffet, Asgore, Asriel, Frisk, Chara, Kris, Susie, Ralsei, Lancer, Jevil, Spamton, King, Queen, Berdly, Noelle, Nubert, Soulless, Souless Pacifist, Pacifist, Genocide, Neutral, - Ігри
nice video,and i like that you didn't just say "sans blasts the human with a gblaster right after they leave the ruins and its the dunked on scene".
Caused it wouldn’t kill frisk it does 1 damedge frisk isn’t in the genocide so no kr
@@Regirock-zd1os still deadly tho
@@Regirock-zd1os inv frames doesn't depend on kr
@@PGDreemurr what do you mean there’s no inv frames because of the kr
@@Regirock-zd1os correction- i does 1 damage in less than 1 second so it can still kill Frisk quickly.
Honestly, I don't think this is how it would go down at all.
Sans is lazy at heart. I don't think he would ever flat out attack Frisk as long as they're pacifist, I'd argue that at the most he would just be more helpful to Papyrus and Undyne(For instance, not distracting her while she chases Frisk, or possibly helping her corner them and even fighting alongside her if Papyrus was killed). I think the biggest possible change would simply be him fighting Frisk sooner in genocide route, possibly even pulling a Disbelief and convincing Papyrus to let him confront them in Snowdin(Which could lead to a plethora of ways to handle Papyrus from that point).
There are a lot of issues with this, but they're all quite minor compared to this: I just don't think Sans would ever willingly take such an active role unless he genuinely felt that he had to(which he wouldn't, outside of genocide and/or potentially routes where Papyrus is killed). His job is to watch for humans, not capture or kill them, so he would leave that to Papyrus and the guard and simply help them out in his own, lazy ways rather than put in such major amounts of effort to personally kill Frisk, just like how he never outright steps in to directly protect Frisk from monsters, instead helping them in small, subtle ways. That's the real meaning of his "dead where you stand" line: he wouldn't necessarily directly attack Frisk, but he doesn't believe they would have made it this far without the little things he does to help out. The joke is that he's being hyperbolic.
A few other nitpicks:
First... Papyrus' shed is easy to escape. Papyrus made the bars too big, so there's no way Undyne could make it there before Frisk escapes. Obviously, Papyrus and Sans could recapture them, but there's only so much they can do to stop them from escaping, and it could easily just end up as a chase scene similar to the one that happens during the Undyne fight. Plus, he's already a sentry, and there wouldn't be any point in making him one for capturing Frisk if he wasn't already: Once Frisk is dead, they won't need sentries anymore, because they'll be leaving the underground.
Second, Flowey showing up feels super forced, man has even less less reason to show his face than he did in canon, with the smiley trashbag himself taking a more direct role.
Third... I get that the pacifist buildup(the dates and true lab segment) wouldn't really be changed since Sans is uninvolved with it, but you just say outright that you cut this stuff by not having Alphys show up and having Undyne still hate Frisk. Eliminating large amounts of positive character development and lore for no reason at all is never good, so what's the point of eliminating it entirely?
Finally... What the actual f*ck, why would you kill off Asgore? Part of the point of pacifist is that it's the only way to save Asgore's life: It's literally what Flowey advertises it as in his post-neutral speeches, he specifically promises not to kill him, and he has no reason to go back on that promise if he intends to absorb the monster souls: That's one fewer easy-to-absorb monster soul, and more specifically a boss monster soul that is more powerful than the average and thus particularly valuable to him. Flowey randomly showing up midway is one thing, but this in particular feels like you pulled this out for the sole purpose of deviating from canon just a little bit more. "Forced" is an understatement, this is a full-blown asspull for pure shock value.
Also, this is ultimately irrelevant to the actual content of the video, but a small correction... Sans made the promise to Toriel long before Frisk's arrival. Remember, Sans showed up immediately after Frisk left, and even if he hadn't, he says that Toriel phrased it as if a human coming through the door might not happen(which wouldn't be the case if Frisk had already left), so Sans couldn't have made the promise after Frisk left the ruins. Plus, Toriel didn't have time to speak to Sans between Frisk's arrival and them leaving the ruins, since she was focused on getting the stuff to make her pie and then actually making it while Frisk was on their own. As soon as she was done with the pie(a couple hours at most, as one of the Froggits in the ruins confirms that the events of Undertale take place over just one day.), she went to call Frisk and presumably let them know she's coming back, only to find that they made it to her, and from there we know what she's doing: Reading, then trying to destroy the door.
So she was just happened to be thinking of humans. The idea that she did it after Frisk's arrival is a bit of a pet peeve of mine, mostly because I'd like to assume it was either the anniversary of Chara and Asriel's death, or the anniversary of the day that whichever of the six between Chara and Frisk she was closest with left. And she wasn't crying, just not laughing "very much" Even though she was feeling sad, she was still enjoying the jokes, and actively laughing, just not as much as she usually does: And it may not even have been a big difference compared to usual, because Sans is very good at noticing subtle changes in behavior.
You wrote all this for 3 likes? Nah I'm not calling it this deserves more
On top of the last paragraph, Snas directly mentions the promise in the genocide route in his pre-fight dialouge. After he asks the funny "Do you wanna have a bad time?" And Frisk takes another step forward, Sans then says "welp. sorry old lady. this is why I never make promises"
I didn’t read all of this but yes undyne could make it there fast enough, if you call a papyrus right after undyne house gets on fire, undyne says she ran very quickly to get to papyrus’s house
This could be for a non canon full hard mode of Undertale
Not reading all of that sorry homie
My biggest thing with Sans's "You'd be dead where you stand," comment, especially in the context of the Pacifist run, is that it genuinely makes Sans look terrifying. By this point in the game, you've done all the right things and have earned the friendship of a ton of monsters, and you've probably grown to feel pretty safe around Sans, too. But then he just drops this disturbing comment with a pretty clear intent to scare you. Even if you've proven yourself a friend to the monsters of the Underground, Sans STILL does not like you or trust you. Which --- considering it's heavily implied he knows better than most exactly what you are and what you can do --- isn't necessarily hard to believe.
At the same time, if he really is serious about that line, it does make him a pretty lousy judge. Because at the end of the game, he always judges you and his responses tend to fall in line with the general theme of Undertale --- the idea that everyone deserves mercy. But the idea that Sans ONLY spares you because he made a promise to Toriel would kind of suggest that he doesn't even believe in the things that he says and is just begrudgingly being nice because he feels obligated to. Which I guess is possible.
Still, I would present an alternate take. I do think it's worth noting that Sans will let you pass him peacefully in almost every single scenario --- including when you kill his brother. It's clear that Toriel's promise was important to him, but somehow I have doubts that that promise was SO important that he would keep it even if you had proven yourself a menace to society (I mean, come on, it's suggested they hardly knew anything about each other). I would argue that at least to an extent, Sans DOES believe in the value of mercy and genuinely wants to give you chances to do better. Because let's be honest --- if it was all just about him being lazy, he wouldn't bother looking out for you or trying to nudge you in the right direction at all. He would just take no interest.
Rather, despite remaining on the sidelines, he does become invested in your journey. I have to wonder if perhaps he doesn't say, "You'd be dead where you stand" because he means it literally, but instead because he wants to warn you in his own way that he can and will hurt you if you step out of line. Just a theory of mine, anyway.
@Wolfgalaxy It certainly COULD be that simple, but logically for me it's still a stretch. Mainly because Sans is not like the other monsters that you come across. For instance, Papyrus doesn't really want to hurt you, and Undyne only really wants to hurt you because she's loyal to Asgore. They can both be charmed by you and become your friends.
Sans comes out almost at the end of the game and says that he would kill you in that very moment if he could. He even does the eye thing, which only seems to happen in the game when he's angry. Which suggests to me he just hates you and wants to kill you, and somehow it's personal for him. It's a very different energy and a kind of intensity that none of the other monsters have when interacting with you. And yet --- he will spare you in every single timeline except the genocide run. And I find it hard to believe that if he really hated/distrusted you that much, that he would let you slip by him peacefully after you killed half or more of the monsters in the Underground just to keep a promise to someone he barely knew (of course, at that point one also needs to factor in that he knows going after you probably won't make difference anyway, but that opens up a whole other can of worms that I'm not up for at the moment lol).
But in any case, I don't know if I necessarily buy the simple answer. Very interesting hearing different people's theories though. A lot of things about Undertale, and Sans and Papyrus in particular, go unexplained, so I like considering the possibilities.
my reaction to that was just "wait can i tell toriel about this?"
Sans doesn't spare you because he makes a promise, the whole idea is that he spares you because he knows there's no point in fighting since reports have shown, timelines jumping left and right, stopping and starting
He knows there's no point in it because it's just be undone by the anomaly
Speaking of, sans doesn't know you can reset, from his reports the anomaly existed before you came down, so to his knowledge you're just some ordinary child
The promise was to *protect* the human
not to not kill them.
And as you said in the video, He was *protecting* you through snowdin.
Couple of things
1. Sans made the promise a while back there isn't time for him to make it between frisk leaving the ruins and the lamp
2. Sans is lazy so he wouldn't necessarily want to kill the human regardless as that's too much work (he won't pick up a sock why would he put that much effort in to kill a child)
3. All of sans' attacks do 1 damage. He needs to hit you 20 times for you to die. Karma might even heal you as it might work both ways (good=heal and bad=kill)
These are just some of the inconsistencies in this video
@Lemonade Well the 2nd statement is still a good reason to why sans wouldn't try to kill frisk several times throughout the underground. Also that could just be as when you fight sans you are supposed to be a lv 19. Why code something different if you aren't supposed to access it
sans doesnt really need to hit you 20 times during the fight, his gaster blaster attacks do multiple instances of 1 damage with the help of karma. so with only 20 HP, he'd probably kill you within 1 hit.
@@chuckisnthere Karma likely wouldn't have an effect at lv 1. I know it does if you break the game but the game isn't made so you can actually do the sans fight on a lower lv then 19. Karma means something good or bad happing from someone's decisions.
sans would give up after they doged the first blaster saying, "welp paps I tried im goin to grillby'z want anythin?"
🎵You are only still alive because I made a promise🎵
This was pretty sweet. Thanks for the video man.
Oh my goodness! This is an awesome video! You just broke the barrier for new subs to come! (including me)
This is a cool theory! I like it! You put in a lot of thought and effort, amazing job!
This would make for a good thing in some sort of a full hard mode fangame
I've been thinking about the hard mode concept and how it would work, and you just did 2 of the zones for me, thanks lol
I've never seen an undertale what if, but this was great. New Sub
The one thing I'm unsure of is the timeframe
I'm not convinced that Sans made the promise to Toriel immediately after Frisk left.
It was probably shortly after the FIRST Human fell, left the Ruins, and died.
Note how sans says it: "If a Human comes through this door..."
He says it in the FUTURE tense, quoting Toriel, indicating that this was probaby before Frisk fell, otherwise she'd ask Sans to "protect the Human who just came through this door."
Also, Toriel turned around and left. She's nowhere to be found anywhere if you turn back to explore the Ruins again.
Have you ever heard something called "reported speech"?
You can find her at the flower bed.
First of all, Sans wasn't alive back then. It would have had to have been sometime between the seventh human and Frisk, since Sans isn't old enough to have seen a human before.
Also, Toriel can be found back where you fell, taking care of the flowers Frisk fell on, which are presumably Chara's grave.
@@Missingno_Miner what do you mean sans wasn't old enough to see any humans until frisk?
@@mpeck1234 Well, you see... Sans is a fairly young guy. Most estimates put him in his late twenties, early thirties at the oldest, which is reasonable since we know he's older than Papyrus.
It has been at least a hundred years since Chara's death, so we can rule out the possibility of Sans being around for the first few. Toriel also claims that it's been a long time since the seventh human fell, and considering that Toriel is a veteran of the war(we don't know the exact date, but Catty and Bratty claim it was several millenia, which could be hyperbole but means that Toriel is potentially two thousand or more years old), this would realistically have to mean a few decades for her to consider it a long time. Similarly, most monsters are incapable of recognizing Frisk as a human, even ones whose jobs directly involve humans like the dogs. Most monsters don't even know what humans look like, let alone have ever seen one. The exceptions to this rule are weebs and monsters old enough to remember Chara(Mainly Asgore and Gerson in the main underground and Toriel in the ruins), showing that most monsters Frisk encounters were not alive when the seventh human fell.
this feels more like good fanficiton than theory tbh as there are several ways this could go
Nice vid! But I have a few small things to say.
Firstly, there's no way right after Frisk leaves the Ruins that Toriel and Sans talk. We see Toriel walk away from the door after the fight and if you backtrack through the Ruins you will find her tending to the Flowers. So she would be literally on the opposite side of the Ruins when we leave. Also, Toriel says
"If a human ever comes through this door."
If Frisk just left, she wouldn't say *If* or *ever*
And a smaller note, Papyrus is already a sentry
I feel like it would be like TS!Underswap where Sans fights you in Snowdin but will greet you at first and doesn't fight you till the end of the area if you killed anyone but will automatically skipped if you haven't.
ok ok hear me out. someone should make this into an au
actually there is its name is promised sans fight
@@buiyifikir1078 no?
@@buiyifikir1078 no, promised is about sans breaking his promise because of the murders you've done in the ruins, not because of what the video narrates
@@buiyifikir1078 that takes place into genoside. in the video they were talking about pacifist.
I'd figure sans wouldn't use his blasters, he would probably only use bones, using his blaster if only needed to, for example if a genocidal murderer would empty the underground... He would likely use the overworld attacks such as undyne but instead of spears, it would be bones probably only using the blasters if the human posed a real threat.
the blasters are more threatening and way more cool than just bones, so I just left the bones for Papyrus while Sans mainly uses his blasters
Ah, makes sense
@@Darkveon_ Gaster Blasters aren't exactly the type of thing you would expect a normal skeleton monster to have in their arsenal, and I doubt undyne would allow for such power from these gaster blasters (even if they have 1 damage from sans) to be unused. In addition, it is very likely Papyrus has gaster blasters too (you would have been blasted to bits) and with his extra damage compared to sans, this means that it is highly unlikely that either sans or papyrus would EVER use gaster blasters unless they absolutely had to, such as in genocide, where papyrus dies first turn and sans uses them extensively.
you know i wonder how this would work gameplay wise i cant imagine having sans chasing you thought the whole game while trying to spare everyone it be an interesting chalenge run if there is ever a mode like that
my idea was that this was hard mode
@@Darkveon_ yeah this definently would be a good hard mode and the silly flavor text that you could add would be limitless
Great fangame idea. I'd play it.
Now someone should make a "No Promises" AU
2 days ago I was thinking about this... NOW ITS HERE YAY!
Ok I would love to see a fangame based off this
already exists
@@Cubistical270 I mean pacifist run not genocide
oh
I would like to play this scenario so much
snowdin and waterfall feels like something that would be in undertale hard mode if it ever got finished
This is turned into a faster hardmode
Sounds more like something that would happen in Underfell tbh.
interesting idea
Basically coss asriel to die and become as a flower chara possessed frisk in try to kill Monsters in underground
Imagine Toby was just trolling us and sans was really just joking this whole time
The thing about sans's Gblaster. The fact that They only do 1 damage, and human can't have karmic distribution. It makes them nearly useless
btw ppl need to make this a mod bro it would be so fun
Your so underrated dude...
i mean, he would only do 1 DMG. so his encounters would be super ez. the only reason you take so much damage in his genocide fight is cus of KARMA, which the more you have of it, the more damage his attacks do to you. in this route, since you spare everyone, sans attacking you would be next to useless since KARMA wouldn't work on you since the amount of sin you committed would be next to 0 or be 0.
Not gonna lie, I'm paying more attention to the Sans fight in the background.
Do you think you might make a video of what might happen during genoside
I might in the future but idk
@@Darkveon_ alright
this should be an au ngl
I think Sans's attacks would be really difficult to dodge, but he wouldnt do karma damage. So like, crazy amounts of blasters and bones, but no poison effect.
honestly imo it would just be
sans: uhh you're a human right? since im a sentry, i have to try and capture you
*batle start*
*1 bone attack*
sans: ok you win
I think the reason why he says you'd be dead where you stand is just to make you weary of going on a murder spree as you know sans can kill you
Alternative title: what if Sans had enough of endless genocides and makes him killing us legal, but we change into pacifist person
After genocide run you can't do pacifist run because they would turn into bad pacifist runs unless you make A CLEAR DELETE of your save file.
@@KEK714 no. It only changes the ending into showing that Chara is in some parts in control still, not into "Bad pacifist"
I smell fanon
1st nobody remembers what happend after genocide (except demon-chara)
2nd pacifist after genocide always has a bad ending
@@doubt2022 for all we know ending isn't bad, just Chara reminding us of Genocide. and showing us that Frisk has red eyes.
I think he would either kill human instantly or do literally nothing, like he does in game. He can leave human on his brother just because Papyrus really wants to meet human. We also know, that Sans knows timelines and can know, that human will just return because of his savings, so Sans might not fight Frisk at all, because it has no sense. And because he is too lazy to do things that are meaninless.
Then he just says "Just kidding" He is probably making some creepy jokes
i think its funny that sans thinks that you woud die instantly even tho you can make him be dust
sans thinks hes strong but hes weak and he says to much
👍 This is an amazing theory, almost like it does exist in the original game just an un-found path that no one has discovered yet.
Great theory
Also will there be a genocide version?
Well to be fair it would not matter much because sans only does 1dmg and if your in pacifist route he can’t do karma dmg so not that bad
imagine if there was a 1 in 10000 chance where you boot up undertale and sans didn't accept the promise
The funny thing is sans couldve trapped frisk in blue bones at any point and it wouldve been game over but he never did
Papyrus could have done that too
If hard mod got the full game this would be the game
And then along with this a theory there’s the other common one which is sans blasting the shit out of the human the second they walk out 😂
And then there's promised sans bam explained
So then is was he with asgore?
He'd be like: were not doing this s*** on the hallway, were doing this s*** in the ruins or Snowdin, dumba**
In my opinion, I think he would be to lazy to kill frisk.
ok but like explain genocide then
@@CloudMouth27 bro literally says he "can't afford not to care anymore"
@@kingdedede5570 ik
Sans is lazy to do anything, probably, if he weren't make promise, he went to fight you after killing papyrus or will fight with papyrus or might battle in mettaton hotel, he can battle anywhere he want.
1:01 Fun Fact: this particular line of dialogue isn't in comic sans
No he doesn’t even fight you if you spare like 1 monster in genocide he does 1 damedge it’s only kr that makes him hard kr isn’t caused by sans it’s caused by the genocide route
I mean he literally tells you what would happen
Long story short: if he didn’t make the promise frisk would get spawn killed
The End
Incorrect; sans relies on kr wich makes him weaker in pacifist, as he has 1 atk and 1 defence
1:07 almagamates: am I a joke to you?
yes. they are
What is a almagamates
Remember
Toriel never asked him to promise not to kill Frisk in the genocide route
He did
I didn't watch the video yet, but when I played the game and reached that part I asked to me kind of the same.
What I had clear after seeing that scene was that, if we never happen to meet Toriel first, we would be dead right where we're standing. After all, thr only reason Sans didn't do anything it's because of the promise, and where did the promise came from? From Toriel meeting the (or another) human.
Other way of saying this, if Frisk just appeared out of nowhere in Snowdin without crossing the ruins, Sans wouldn't be so nice.
what would happen if frisk won the encounter with sans and papyrus?
it's hard to make out in the video because of my voice, but Sans would still capture them if Papyrus failed
@@Darkveon_ not what i meant (sorry if unclear). what if they tired out sans as well? a skilled enough player could beat sans even at LV 1 and he likely wouldn't have karma
@@Darkveon_ Also are you going to make more of these "what if"s because they're really cool.
I have a suggestion (if you take those), what if asgore died to another human before frisk fell. Who would take over, what would happen to those who would have been inspired by him, what would frisk's journey have been like, what would flowey's journey have been?
Undertale what ifs are super cool, honestly.
Also these encounters would look really good as a fangame lol.
In this timeline, Frisk is guaranteed to be captured. After they win against Papyrus, Sans doesn't refight them. He just captures them
@@Darkveon_ Ok, could you hypothetically kill sans? maybe create a few more neutral routes. A totally forced loss feels a bit weird.
What if frisk wins the first papyrus fight
I know it can be a little difficult to understand me sometimes, but if Frisk wins that fight, Sans will still bring them to snowdin town. I explained this a little more in detail in another comment
Same ending except asgores dead like in the other two endings lol
promised au lore:
Get dunkeeedddd on!!!😎😎😎
Papyrus was already a sentry not just sans
2:09 This sounds like the timeline *”promised.”*
is that an au someone else made? I've never heard of it
@@Darkveon_ Yes, it is.
@@mid_midster420 well, it's just a alternate timeline (AT), not an AU, it usually says *promised.* (No AU)
@@C4LVINTH3A55IST I know that it’s not an au, that’s why i said timeline in my comment.
@@mid_midster420 sorry-
I cant be the only one who is sad about asgore dying
Honestly
I don’t think sans is the type of person to kill someone easily 😂😂😂
This would probably be true, Since his special poison effect "Karmic Retribution" would actually not work in a *Pacifist* route.
@@TheWarriorLord heck it might even be reversed
@@TheWarriorLord It's just KARMA, and it's just regular poison. "Karmic Retribution" and the idea that it has any connection to the real-world concept of karma is pure fanon.
@@TheWarriorLord I mean I’m pretty sure people’s idea of how Karmic retribution works in game is just a fan theory considering how it work is by the fact that you don’t get any invincibility frames from getting hit
The game would just be harder and the lore would be tweaked a bit thats it
But, why kill asgore?
i think its a cool thoery but think this would be a better au
Whyd asgore die. He didnt do amything
A tad bit fan fiction like
Sans would never attack you on a pacifist run, or a nuteral run where he doesnt see papyrus to be in danger
Also why did you cut out litteraly all of the true pacifist content? What hapoens tot he amalgamates? Wouldnt undyne still hate humanity? It makes no sense and removes a bucnh of character arcs
Also flowey showing up halfway seems super forced
And sans is just so blatantly out of character, id expect this sttitude to be from something like swapfell sans
MR BEAST SANS!1!1!1!1!
So basicaly undertale hard mode
Sans's 1 attack 1 defense headass really thinks he's big shit with no karma
Jokes aside, this is an interesting theory! I can tell you put a lot of thought into it!
That’s exactly why people hate this fandom because sans is so damn overrated.
Even sr pelo hates the guy.
Yeah unless you're a murderer (Assuming that's how KR and those frames works, which, why else would it be called Karma?) Sans isn't nearly as powerful as most think-
It's kinda sad Asgore was killed off here for. . . Whatever reason. And Undyne and the true lab get skipped in this scenario. I don't really see why the pacifist events get rushed through. It's really sad that Undyne and Alphys' involvement are pretty much glossed over here, but that's not too different from how the fandom treats them, anyway.
If you had no karma this would mean you’d still be at LV 1 so you’d only have 20 HP. So the battle would still be just as hard…
@@idk-_- Nah, without kr you have I frames I believe. So he'd literally just be doing 1 damage for all his attacks.
Sure, they're hard to dodge, but the only reason he's actually a challenge is because of those ignored frames. Though to be fair to him, we'd only be coming out of the ruins with monster candy, bake sale items, and pie. So if he can exhaust those items, it COULD be more difficult.
He can dodge 21 times at most and considering this is a pacifist run, he won't use his desperate "I'll wait here until the end of time" move, either. He'd likely just end the fight there. I mean, he's still lazy, after all. And someone like Undyne with her perpetual willpower can take care of it.
Now, Sans PLUS Papyrus or Undyne would be an issue. His abilities strike me as someone with a support role. Imagine having to dodge Undyne's spears with gravity as an issue. Or being slammed around during Papyrus's attacks.
@@hammythewammy karma has nothing to do with the invincibility frames, though. It’s just poison damage
So bassically its gonna be a harder game and would be more annoying.
Nice username
Wow... Undertale in 2023
I know asriel is flowey i love undertale flowey and chara are great villains but you talk about asriel is evil that is a dumb video
Something no one is mentioning is that papyrus is already a sentry in undertale