This can't be stressed enough. I could write pages about my last relationship. He was separated from wife #3 when I met him, and living with a seriously troubled woman with severe alcohol abuse, who, it turned out, had been giving him a place to live and paying the bills with her Social Security just so he would stay with her. (I wouldn't fully understand that until later.) I let him move in with me directly after he left her. I asked him to leave after five months, because, even though he had a full-time job, he didn't contribute financially. I thought that if we weren't living together, it would make it clear to him which resources and responsibilities were his, and which were mine. Nope. He went to live on his daughter's couch, and continued to scream at me until I gave him the money I needed to live on, while consistently flaking on me. He kept needing to "take a break" to "work on (him)self". He was actually working on several other women. After the last time I saw him, in 2019, he just disappeared. Within six months, he was divorced from #3 and married to someone outside the immediate area, whom I had no clue about. He, somehow, got her family to finance a house for him. And then messaged me to tell me he was mistaken, and that I was the love of his life, after all. As much as I don't wish him on anyone, at least he's someone else's problem now. Watch out for guys who have never lived alone in their adult lives.
I was so in love with him! I believed the words of love he expressed and the wonderful things he did from time to time. My experience was ALL psychological and emotional! I realized early that he wasn’t trying to give me a “new” way of looking at things, he was trying to alter my reasoning and judgment! I thought he acted that way because he was “misguided” and in need of help, patience and sympathy! It took me 10 years to realize that he was playing the “long game”! He was patiently waiting to find the kink in my armor, then leave me drowning in my own confusion! Finally, I stopped focusing on how much I loved him and I focused on the “type” of relationship I wanted with him. When I realized he wasn’t going to “self-improve” and give me the relationship I wanted, I ended ours! The best decision is always the one that keeps you safe and sane!
Wow! I have a very similar story! I was engaged to a "wonderful" man back in 2021. Two weeks after our engagement party, he was arrested from our home. During the days that followed, I learned exactly who he is - which is a professional conman and a diagnosed sociopath (according to his family). I spent about 2 weeks mourning the "death" of a fake fiancé and moved out of state. Here it is, 2 years later and I'm still not dating. There's SO much more to my story that should be the next episode of Dirty John. 🤦♀ My heart goes out to anyone who has encountered a narcissist.
Well here I am 6 years later from being the healthiest 35 years old woman to being diagnosed with Lupus and these same day I got the news I cought him cheating and now I am broken hearted and sick nbcz of all the stress he put me in and my hope of remaking my life now is not even on the list since I feel broken empty who will want a sick depressed woman with ptsd? 🤷🏻♀️
@@tazgee599 Taz you have been traumatized physically and emotionally! You’ve gotten away from a user and abuser and now it’s time for you to heal and get the help you need! Take care of yourself mentally and physically! Put you FIRST!
Your SOOO LUCKY you DIDN'T marry him, i married mine and had 28yrs of ABUSE ABUSE ABUSE, long story short divorced good few years now but he put me through HELL, he was finally caught out with new supply so i had TG evidence, God God bless you and telling you (know it hurts like hell), but your soooo BLESSED you found out before you married, you will move on and find a nice decent honest man, take care of yourself.
Wow. I so appreciate Abby’s vulnerability. I was conned by a man for almost 6 years…he gaslighted me so bad I ended up broken and in a mental institution. Shining the light on such matters prevents others from going down the same path and also helps victims heal.❤
Its been five years since I made it out of my marriage of thirty-six years to a narcissist. the nightmares he used to have frightened me very much. I slept in a separate room. I'm still not functioning. I don't want to deal with people. My own family doesn't believe me when I tell them what I've been through. I believe more and more that I'm a magnet for narcissistic people. I can't seem to get out of my own way in order to live again.
@@patriciaconnorspaszek6259 thank you for sharing this. The last two sentences are exactly how I feel. Im sorry that your family cant come around to believing what you've been through, and giving you the support you deserve. Please know that there are plenty of us out here who can validate your experiences, and how you feel.Sending you warmest wishes for a complete recovery of your knowing how to live again.
For me it was a weird "sad-relief" - relief that your intuition was correct and horrific sadness that you didn't even know this person. Thanks for another great episode ❤
This was really excellent. I lived with a pathological liar for far too many years, out now but damage was done. They attack you and your character when you call them out on their lies.
“These people are charming”! Absolutely! Narcissists can be very captivating and entertaining, but when ANYONE shows you negative, toxic and harmful behavior, protect/remove yourself from them!
My perception: she is eaten up by distrust and you can see it in her face, body and especially her eyes. you have a choice on how to look at the world, and the way you do will determine whether you are living a happy life or a fearful one. she has made her choice. you attract what you express.
Self confidence is what is a major Narc repellant. These narcs want to try to attack those with self confidence as they have none of their own, narcs hate themselves and rightly so!
What you said about a changed relationship with trust really hit home. I'm not mistrustful but I don't think I will ever the same as I was before the Liar. But I've also learned that I actually have pretty good instincts about people and, now I trust my gut.
It seems that people who are conned haven't had the experience of authentic relating so they cannot identify the red flags. The answer is in listening to our body and trusting our feelings. Abby bless her heart is so in her head. I didn't hear many feeling words or embodiment experiences. I offer this as what could be helpful. I also had to learn to trust my feelings rather than deny or discard them. They're full of information.
She is so intellectual. I am too and have been conned by a very stupid con artist. He didn't have education, no career, but he played me so bad with master's degree.
I knew what my husband was doing was painful but I never thought I’d it as abuse. As a person who was an abused child, it was normal to me. It took all of your videos for me to see that it WAS abuse.
This is exactly what I feel, was so embarrassed about I couldn’t talk about because they were looking at me like I was the one who’s crazy. They will make you question your own thoughts. It took me forever to get out of my situation because I didn’t know what I was dealing with. Once I understood what it was I started healing but it’s going to be for a while to even trust anyone. This podcast I think once more people share these experiences, a lot of people can relate and it’s helping a lot of people.
I met an online conman in the midst of being vulnerable after my divorce. At first I was elated that someone might love me. Then the danger began - and detectives were lurking around my name, not his.
Ms. Ellin was smart for going with the logical side of her brain and questioning what this guy was telling her. She knew something was off and didn't ignore it. That is really key. So many women would have looked the other way and pretended everything was fine. Good for her for getting out of a messy situation relatively quickly. I appreciate Ms. Ellin's honesty.
She did ignore it when she knew something was off. She said he would write her very strange notes. This was before they began dating. She said he was not really good looking (to her). She had no interest in him until he started showing more interest by writing more letters. She regularly doubted his stories. She saw the red flags but ignored them because of his profession, status and income.
@@SamStone1964 I wrote the above comment before watching the entire podcast. After watching the entire segment, I will say that you are probably correct, although only Ms. Ellin knows her motivation. When I say she got out, I mean she got out in a relatively short period of time (1 year) before marrying this person.
@@transitionsnc Yes absolutely she dodged what could have descended into a greater nightmare had she married or combined their finances or homes. And she's lived to tell the tale.
@@SamStone1964 Yes. I agree with you. I also agree she stuck around longer than needed probably to get the story...her motives were not completely pure.
@@transitionsnc In an ideal world we'd run at the first red flag. Or we'd have a strong support network of friends and family who would push us to run.
My take is that lying and hypocrisy is a no go for any kind of relationship. My trust has diminished over time. I am so sick of being lied to and I certainly don’t trust governments . I will never marry , I will never change my name , and I will never share money with anyone
Dr. Ramani thank you this interview was outstanding. It was the best episode you have done, you touched on a subject that is so prominent in our society.
Dr. Romani..would love to tell you my story. Was married to a Pakistani man..being Indian. 18 years of cultural torture! A whole family of narcisistic people!! Thank you for all these pod casts. ❤
Lol😂 I always used to say I straddle the fence of “ignorance is bliss; knowledge is power” . The experience with the ex narc stole my innocence. And I no longer am blissful about much of anything, certainly not ignorance. I loved hearing this part of the discussion. Loved the discussion. I’ll look for Abby’s podcast and book. Thank you
I think she’s wound up so tightly because she doesn’t want to admit she feels ashamed. Things will get better for her once she can work through some of that.
Wow. This was such a fantastic conversation! I loved it. Great chemistry between you two intelligent and lovely ladies. Thank you both. 🙏 Also - you both look great in your respective colors 😎🌹
As a former white-collar wife I am greatly offended by Ms. Ellin’s comments when she not only implied but stated that white-collar wives on the whole are complicit in their husband’s financial crimes because they didn't want to give up their "nice car." What a stupid remark, especially from a journalist. Despite making a good living that afforded us a comfortable lifestyle, my ex-husband embezzled over 2 million dollars from a prominent teaching hospital. He was well respected among his colleagues, family members, within our close circle of friends, and our community. I had no reason to suspect his embezzlement as my lifestyle didn’t change and no additional funds appeared in our joint accounts or I would have known about it because I handled our finances. I would later learn that the stolen funds were earmarked for his new life with his mistress who was a former “friend” of mine. I knew about the affair and kicked him to the curb and filed for legal separation, and a few months later I learned he was under criminal investigation. I’m sorry Ms. Elin was duped by her boyfriend/fiancé and that she has been so emotionally harmed by this event, but her plight pales by comparison to those of us who were in long-term marriages (with children) whose lives were literally blown to pieces and who have had to endure not only an epic familial and financial betrayal, but the knee-jerk public stigma of presumed complicity that goes along with this living nightmare. Most white-collar wives are not willfully blind, but rather, blindsided and the only thing they are guilty of is implicit trust which is not a crime. I founded an international private support group for recovering white-collar wives which is sadly in the triple digits and we have received international recognition. I have had the pleasure of being interviewed on national podcasts and am excited to share that The White-Collar Wives Project Podcast will be airing soon and will include the topics of clinical narcissism, con men, and acute familial betrayal. It would be our honor to have the esteemed Dr. Ramani as a guest. I agree with Ms. Ellin that it is indeed in one's best interest to walk away from those who lie to us or betray us, and on a personal note, after listening to this podcast, I and my son feel as if we were duped by Ms. Ellin.
Hi Lisa, What you failed to mention in your comment is that I wrote about you and your organization in "Duped" and in the NYT (which basically put you on the map), brought you to NY to be on a panel on "Dirty John," and was trying to sell a TV show with you based on White Collar Wives. Which is to say--you and I have spent a lot of time together, and talked many times, and you know that I do not hold White Collar Wives "complicit" for their husbands financial crimes. Not at all! What you and I talked about repeatedly, and what I said on this show, was that there is a sense of "I knew but I didn't know," and therefore a subconscious complicity. I NEVER said anyone was responsible for the crime itself. Perhaps my definition of "complicit" is different than yours--I was not talking in the legal sense. And I was certainly not blaming anyone. I wish you great success with your podcast and I hope you have healed from your trauma. My very best to you.
No Ms. Ellin, you are suggesting we “know” someone is lying-whether “in our body” or intuition-and while you say you knew, there are people listening to you who absolutely had no idea. At the very least, you seem to think all of the “duped” basically know at some level that something is wrong. Why does it need to be all of us? Why are you succumbing to such black and white thinking about human behavior that is so complex?
It feels like abby had no pain. And feels/experiences no real empathy.Just fell into a windfall of a hot, uptrendng subject and is making bank on it? This is the first of dozens of dr Ramini guests I have listened to where I felt Dr Ramini is actually interviewing a manipulator. The way Abby "finished" dr ramini sentences but waited to hear that ending before she quickly said it to...like they were "tracking" together felt very contrived. I am so sorry for the heartache you've walked through. May the Comforter strengthen you.
Ms Ellin really makes a lot of good points in this interview. It's so easy to live a double (or triple) life these days...just something to be aware of.
They believe their lies because it fits the narrative . They justify the lie as they see themselves as the victim in their story. They lie to deflect what they are hiding. Everyone around them supports the lie and you become the bad one . Doesn’t matter what the reality is. No choice but to walk away for your sanity.
That’s called gaslighting and believe me I know just wish I had learned that behavior earlier in my marriage and would have been able to not let him always make me feel like I was the crazy person when I confronted him with his lies maybe then it wouldn’t have taken me so many painful years after we divorced to get healthy healed and to realize he was the crazy sick one not me💕
I think people who are impressed by people who seem to have “bigger lives” are much more vulnerable to con artists. If you’re not impressed by the BS you kind of gag at such people who present themselves as “bigger than life”…
I had a similar situation and at the time I trusted completely I remember my brother saying to me that I always gave away my trust up front to quickly to everyone and that was wrong and that people needed to earn my trust 😊 wish I had been told that much earlier in my life 😂
Aah ignorance can be bliss right? I have always said, since I was a young teen, that I wish so so much that I could not see reality so well and that those out there that are in denial or whitewash reality seem so much happier than those of us that simply can not deny the truth. The truth about humanity, reality, and the truth that the world is not as rosey and happy as we wish that it were. ❤
What I love about the truth is it puts things in “perspective”! It helps you to be more discerning with people and shows you the difference between the ugliness and the beauty in life!
I wondered if my ex was a con man, but my friends and family laughed at that -as they thought calling him a con man would be giving him too much credit. Years later, I look back and realize that he was just an idiot with grandiosity about himself but with nothing to back him up. Sometimes, these people aren't big bad villains but are just cattles walking around with a big old knifes looking for a butcher who would kill them gently and for a good price too lol
WOW, NO WAY!!! At exactly the same time (14mins 35), I came to the same conclusion and was coming to the comment section to say the same thing. She was using him just as much as he was using her 🤦🏽♂️😂. Birds of the same 🪶 flock together.
I didn't feel that and I've been around narcs a lot from birth. She is high speed for sure and doesn't suffer fools gladly but she seemed authentic and ambitious to me
30:03 “I used to think people really knew why they did things and they don’t!” Dr. Ramani you absolutely would not be out of a job if people knew why they did things! Everyone would regulate “their” behavior EXCEPT Narcissists! This would “multiply” the amount of people who would need you to “help” them cope with Narcissists! 🤣
24:00 my COVERT Narcissist just shuts down and walks away. And I was left with no ‘proof’ he ever told me that: which is another form of Gaslighting- it caused me to doubt my own sanity and I would overthink and Gaslight myself.
I really appreciate. When it's been ongoing like this -- and that space of being out of denial *and* not seeing a way out, traumatized, still reaching out for help, it just feels so painful. It can get to a level of being stuck in this paralysis, cptsd freeze response. When it started from day 1 and remembering , realizing just how abused i was ... i thank you for your story, ny'er here too. I lol'ed at what you guys were talking about the skeptic or something and being miserable. Thank you so much ❤🙏
Man o man- this lady comes off as CRAZY! She jumps from one thought or circumstance to another without ever making sense or finishing the sentence. Not that I don't believe what she went through, but I don't believe for one minute that ANYONE would be happy about being lied to & having their own intuition & agency put into question relentlessly. SHE NEEDS LOTS OF HELP! 🦋
That is a big statement about a stranger. As someone with ADHD I am aware that I have a different style of describing things and energy than others and that doesn’t make me “crazy.” It does make me aware of different personalities, kinds of energies and and styles of communication. And we ALL need lots of help in one way or another, I think. It makes me sad whenever I see women use reckless language about each other, especially when the subject is speaking their truth about trauma to help others. What’s the point of criticizing someone who has been through some shit. If the way they come off feels unusual and it’s something worth discussing, maybe use words that are not “crazy.” I always wonder about folks who say such strong things about people they don’t know and seem to have little empathy for. What does doing that do for the criticizer? That’s what I’m interested in.
The older generations had more integrity than people today. It wasn’t unusual for our grandparents & great grandparents to meet, truly fall in love and live happily ever after. People like that are incredibly rare in the dating world today. So her parents meeting in the the Catskills & marrying 3 months later is a great story, but nowadays would be considered unwise for just this experience this woman had. There are a whole lot of these con jobs out there. Married and unmarried.
I married one of these. It was fascinating (and shocking), watching him take his personality down and take on another person's. I almost missed the death threat it was so subtle. He lied about everything. Googling a professional liar doesn't help because they go to great lengths not to have an online presence, and when they do, it is to support their false life. When he left, he didn't take any of his clothing because he changed his wardrobe to a completely different style to match the personality of the next target.
Agree!!! Trust was an issue when I met my ex!!!!!! And he conned me!!! Now that will be horrible for the people that want to be in my life! Not fair to them or me!!! It’s a big struggle! Many of us become cat ladies later in life!!!
This podcast resonates so much with me. My two year online relationship with alleged John Mayer - seemed plausible in the age of COVID , with everyone online and we both from the same hometown. But with multiple writing styles, the proposed meetings canceled, the proposal- was too good to be true. And then why a man worth 45 million dollars demands money from my ailing mom was the dealbreaker. How could I be so foolish. Was I just a social experiment. Post divorce vulnerability- lift me up to throw me down: ( according to a VA hospital psychiatrist). And why, post divorce , if big brother was dwelling in my I phone - why did they not catch it. While I was being so scrutinized. Thank you for this piece.
I wish people would refrain from saying emotional abuse is worse than physical. It’s not You cannot be physically abused without it being emotional abuse. At least with only emotional, your life is not in danger too. (although it can change in but a moment) The emotional component of physical abuse is just compounded with fear I’ve actually seen a woman go BACK to a physical abuser because people were saying it’s not as bad as emotional abuse. She really didn’t realize she was emotionally abused too. And Abby mentioned you can see the bruises. Most often you cannot. These abusers protect themselves by avoiding obvious areas for the most part
I think what she and others mean is that once you present with bruises you're believed but emotional abuse isn't recognised by society nor often times the victim themselves. It's not meant to denegrate extreme physical abuse and the fear that comes with that
The UA-cam channel too called, "Love Fraud Lessons" is worth watching every once in awhile to help us not get too impressed by someone's credentials. Because only having proof of credentials is no guarantee that the person who is speaking to you is not lying. Like when they are asking to marry us with those just earned top credentials after attending the same school together for awhile or whatever.
Would love to dissuss the survivor responsibility in falling for a deciever predator. What empaths often ignored, the denial, the esteem,lonliness, characteristics that are neglected within that leaves one susceptible to predators, and how to heal overcome being easy prey. Thanks❤❤❤❤
The biggest red flag was when he wanted my mother to give to money “ musician to musician “ he said - when he was / is supposed to be a multi millionaire music prodigy.
I think having had to deal with an outrageous narc, you deserve to have a few doors opened and some direction provided by the universe as to what your next moves should be.😂😢😊
I wish this lady would speak slowly and ennuciate so we can all follow. This is very important. Funnily she is aware and speaks about friends n family asking her to slow down!!😊😊😊
I was reading DUPED and had considered returning for my PhD in psychology and took it with me on a weekend with my ex at a lodge he property managed. He asked me to get something from his truck and I found a set of keys to a brand new kawasaki motorcycle He told he he found them in the streets in SF. Turns out his new gf helped him Or he helped her purchase it while we were in a relationship. Mind you the first year of our relationship he coerced me to buy us a brand new Ducati that he was supposed to make payments on and when asked about first payment he made some excuse about paying child support. But he was also going on a trip with his mom to Oregon to see the eclipse so I left him and took the bike when he was gone. He eventually talked me back into a relationship and this was one event that caused me to leave again.
I think he might have some sort of professional backround... Some spies get caught as conmen, because that's kind of their profession and they wont admit to espionage as it would just worsen their sentence.
🎉 I ❤ her transparency & how she owns how she’s benefited from the experience. She is not only a smart woman but she’s a survivor!!! I absolutely respect ✊🏾 her for this. 😢Just wish I had known what was happening before I lost my kids & financial stability!!!😢 Never be so vulnerable that you let them suck you up with lovebombing into their lies & chaotic inner world. It becomes your painful reality 😢😢😢
Even if you're asked for money by someone you know in person, suppose you do for some reason want to lend some, always have them sign a contract. That goes for family members as well, unless maybe it's a really close loved one who you've known for a long time, who you know very well and you trust them 100%.
Abby is a journalist! Her job is to fact find the truth. We need hard facts in our world! Did this guy have a mother? Father? Lying starts in grade school. Kids are punished for being honest. What was that relationship like? I would have know idea what my ex husband did outside the home. I’ve learned they lie because they hate confrontation. Like their mother… Look how many people are good lying at sales…. “Fake it until you make it” is essentially future faking, pre-supposing or believing who you want to be until you become it.
She says she dated him for the story but then she was “fooled”. So she’s complicit but then she didn’t know but had one leg out? I’m guessing she hasn’t dealt with what happened since she got into yet another deceitful relationship but she’s busy spinning plates how she’s so smart. It’s exhausting. It won’t get better until she stops lying to herself. It’s okay to trust and love. It’s okay to admit she had low self esteem. it doesn’t make her a bad person for doing something so human. She needs to let go of the past and learn.
My NM lied to me my whole life. I found out the truth after she died. I could have lived my whole life never knowing the truth...that she married my dad to have someone support her...she didn't love him or my brother & she never wanted or loved me. Everything was a lie!
I was in limerence with a con man for 2 years. He knew how crazy about him I was and started using me for money. I never knew a man would actually use a woman for money…. But he did… and I never suspected it until the end when he became super mean and cold towards me and basically fucked up my life leaving me homeless. Then a year later he got married to a beautiful yoga teacher. I cannot imagine how that is when he has to be a narcissist or sociopath to do the things he did to me. But who knows what’s going on with that.
@ 19:30 -what holds a lot of us back from trusting others (besides the feeling of being duped) is the pain. I feel like I should be able to avoid getting into predicaments where I get hurt. And not just heartache, but the agony of losing my sense of self. The exhaustion of once again..not being able to trust the gut instinct we’ve literally developed from said abuse for so many years. Because victims of repeated abuse DO NOT want to relive the trauma…and to trust again= potential pain and suffering of questioning our own reality or worse losing our ability to trust our own judgment leading to all kinds of unhealthy coping mechanisms. It’s a constant battle to avoid falling into the depressive, overthinking, self doubting shell of a human we swore we would never allow ourselves to become again. So yeah….we struggle to trust.
Interesting dynamic in this interview. Abby seems totally unhinged but that's not necessarily because she's manic or in denial but she's very confused about what her role in this podcast is. She's trying to be an equal host with dr Ramani but she can't match her expertise and authority so she's trying to mach her with more energy which makes her seem totally crazy. And dr Ramani is trying to be a host and trying to therapize Abby but it's not working and it's clearly annoying her. So interesting.
The comment that really struck me the most was when Dr. Ramani asked her what did the narc get out of marching on her and she said it was her “cool personality”. I felt gaslighted.
I am definitely self- doubting and wondering if I am indeed too gullible. My move-in (rather then 'living with') boyfriend of 5 years was NAVY too. Does military training create narcissist?
Wow! A lot of unhealed empaths commenting here. There is nothing ‘off’ with this woman. She’s smart, intelligent and has self Confidence - that’s what’s triggering y’all. Evidence you all need to work on your own self esteem issues. I love this woman! I’m also about to release my first book 📚 documenting my experience with 4 of these vile creatures and how to get out. Yes the Shame and embarrassment is major for survivors.
But Abby says she's not a survivor....I didn't read her book but from the podcast her story doesn't strike me as moving or genuine....and lots of people seem to be humping on "write a book" wagon....not all should
@32:35 Sis, the mistress gets lied to the most! 😂 Trust me, I know. Usually. The wife KNOWS who she’s married to. She knows exactly what her husband is capable of, and what he’s doing. At best, she just doesn’t know exactly who he’s doing it with. 😒🙂 But she knows. 😂 The mistress is the one who only knows his “representative” and Thinks they have a future.
I dated a handsome pathological liar and compulsive gambler and dumped him after he said he ran out of gas - twice - as the bells and whistles from the slot machines went off in the background at a casino that he spent the night in. Ridiculous!
My first boyfriend I truly believe he was a psychopath. He would lie on a whole different level and he would believe the lies no matter the evidence against him. People who would first meet him would be put off immediately and say its something in his eyes. He would never apologize at all and literally when something bad would happen like a death or anything it just wouldn't phase him. He ended up dying in 2014. But looking back it would is kind of scary and it was a very hard relationship. I ended up having a serious nervous breakdown. I had to end the relationship right after that. I stayed for almost 8 years.
Probably because your heart was unguarded. Also, when we sleep w/ someone without knowing their character, we will bond. I encourage you on your next relationship to take things slow and be friends first. Pray too! God doesn't want to you traumatized.
Narcissists are professional con artists , they could fool anyone. Particularly as they are often very good at masking themselves. Don’t beat yourself up. But now you know better ❤
Mine did that didn’t want anything that was in the house, but definitely want it. Both vehicles from the divorce is sleeping with the brother-in-law sister, and so much more craziness.
Isn't it better to say NOTHING when you lack good things to say?! I would not say to my FRIEND you look good in the dress when you think it looks horrendous! First of all who made me a Fashionista? And if I don't think she looks good in that dress?! Isn't it better not to spew your poison unto a friend?! I think your deceitful opinion is worse than just say nothing at all! Your friend might find out what you really thought and they'll be devastated that they have a deceitful friend!!!
1:14:00 scams. I fell for an online dating scam were a supposed "soldier" needed airfare. It was around $650. I didn't get my money back from him but I got it back in a round about way. The guy who was couch surfing here wasn't paying anything. I made him pay $200 per month until he left.
Things that don’t make sense bc they aren’t in alignment. Our brains can only process truth and aligned messages. Incongruent data will bang around in our heads until it can be worked out logically with truth
OMG the cons may have been set up and executed, but the aftermath sucks. Even after youve walked away from a narc we often deal with their unending invisible bad behaviors waves. I've had at least 5 strangers get in touch with me since leaving NarcX almost two years ago. I already left and I just did not want to know or engage in the BS. After 22yrs i figured if hes gonna drag me down more than he already did police or lawyers are gonna show up. Cause thats the type of person he was.
Best quote ‘ Nobody falls in love faster then a narcissist who needs a place to live’ ES
Narcissist/ Hobosexual.
This can't be stressed enough. I could write pages about my last relationship. He was separated from wife #3 when I met him, and living with a seriously troubled woman with severe alcohol abuse, who, it turned out, had been giving him a place to live and paying the bills with her Social Security just so he would stay with her. (I wouldn't fully understand that until later.) I let him move in with me directly after he left her. I asked him to leave after five months, because, even though he had a full-time job, he didn't contribute financially. I thought that if we weren't living together, it would make it clear to him which resources and responsibilities were his, and which were mine. Nope. He went to live on his daughter's couch, and continued to scream at me until I gave him the money I needed to live on, while consistently flaking on me. He kept needing to "take a break" to "work on (him)self". He was actually working on several other women. After the last time I saw him, in 2019, he just disappeared. Within six months, he was divorced from #3 and married to someone outside the immediate area, whom I had no clue about. He, somehow, got her family to finance a house for him. And then messaged me to tell me he was mistaken, and that I was the love of his life, after all.
As much as I don't wish him on anyone, at least he's someone else's problem now.
Watch out for guys who have never lived alone in their adult lives.
wow, that just hit home
Very important point about healing yourself and not needing closure from a liar who doesn't care about you.
I was so in love with him!
I believed the words of love he expressed and the wonderful things he did from time to time. My experience was ALL psychological and emotional!
I realized early that he wasn’t trying to give me a “new” way of looking at things, he was trying to alter my reasoning and judgment!
I thought he acted that way because he was “misguided” and in need of help, patience and sympathy!
It took me 10 years to realize that he was playing the “long game”!
He was patiently waiting to find the kink in my armor, then leave me drowning in my own confusion!
Finally, I stopped focusing on how much I loved him and I focused on the “type” of relationship I wanted with him. When I realized he wasn’t going to “self-improve” and give me the relationship I wanted, I ended ours!
The best decision is always the one that keeps you safe and sane!
Smart!!!! You did exactually what you need to do!!!
And I ignored all the red flags, because I wanted to be loved and validated too much - by someone else.
I feel you sister. I hate myself for that.
Wow! I have a very similar story! I was engaged to a "wonderful" man back in 2021. Two weeks after our engagement party, he was arrested from our home. During the days that followed, I learned exactly who he is - which is a professional conman and a diagnosed sociopath (according to his family). I spent about 2 weeks mourning the "death" of a fake fiancé and moved out of state. Here it is, 2 years later and I'm still not dating. There's SO much more to my story that should be the next episode of Dirty John. 🤦♀ My heart goes out to anyone who has encountered a narcissist.
The family met me and knew me- and they never told me. His family was in so much fear of him.
Well here I am 6 years later from being the healthiest 35 years old woman to being diagnosed with Lupus and these same day I got the news I cought him cheating and now I am broken hearted and sick nbcz of all the stress he put me in and my hope of remaking my life now is not even on the list since I feel broken empty who will want a sick depressed woman with ptsd? 🤷🏻♀️
@@tazgee599
Taz you have been traumatized physically and emotionally!
You’ve gotten away from a user and abuser and now it’s time for you to heal and get the help you need! Take care of yourself mentally and physically!
Put you FIRST!
Wow was it my ex? Love bombed into a marriage in 5 months and discarded after 5 weeks - well I kicked him out when the mask disintegrated rapidly
Your SOOO LUCKY you DIDN'T marry him, i married mine and had 28yrs of ABUSE ABUSE ABUSE, long story short divorced good few years now but he put me through HELL, he was finally caught out with new supply so i had TG evidence, God God bless you and telling you (know it hurts like hell), but your soooo BLESSED you found out before you married, you will move on and find a nice decent honest man, take care of yourself.
Wow. I so appreciate Abby’s vulnerability.
I was conned by a man for almost 6 years…he gaslighted me so bad I ended up broken and in a mental institution.
Shining the light on such matters prevents others from going down the same path and also helps victims heal.❤
Same
@@tricia007100 I hope you are doing better.
Its been five years since I made it out of my marriage of thirty-six years to a narcissist. the nightmares he used to have frightened me very much. I slept in a separate room.
I'm still not functioning. I don't want to deal with people. My own family doesn't believe me when I tell them what I've been through.
I believe more and more that I'm a magnet for narcissistic people. I can't seem to get out of my own way in order to live again.
@@patriciaconnorspaszek6259 Same here. It seems I'm stuck in trauma for the rest of my life.
@@patriciaconnorspaszek6259 thank you for sharing this. The last two sentences are exactly how I feel. Im sorry that your family cant come around to believing what you've been through, and giving you the support you deserve. Please know that there are plenty of us out here who can validate your experiences, and how you feel.Sending you warmest wishes for a complete recovery of your knowing how to live again.
For me it was a weird "sad-relief" - relief that your intuition was correct and horrific sadness that you didn't even know this person.
Thanks for another great episode ❤
this was a really good episode, nice seeing a conversation between 2 knowledgeable older women as a younger person watching this. thank u!
This was really excellent. I lived with a pathological liar for far too many years, out now but damage was done. They attack you and your character when you call them out on their lies.
“These people are charming”!
Absolutely!
Narcissists can be very captivating and entertaining, but when ANYONE shows you negative, toxic and harmful behavior, protect/remove yourself from them!
She’s confident, smart and assertive. She also isn’t allowing herself to be victimised by what happen. She has taken her power back.
My perception: she is eaten up by distrust and you can see it in her face, body and especially her eyes. you have a choice on how to look at the world, and the way you do will determine whether you are living a happy life or a fearful one. she has made her choice. you attract what you express.
Self confidence is what is a major Narc repellant. These narcs want to try to attack those with self confidence as they have none of their own, narcs hate themselves and rightly so!
What you said about a changed relationship with trust really hit home. I'm not mistrustful but I don't think I will ever the same as I was before the Liar. But I've also learned that I actually have pretty good instincts about people and, now I trust my gut.
Yes!
It seems that people who are conned haven't had the experience of authentic relating so they cannot identify the red flags. The answer is in listening to our body and trusting our feelings.
Abby bless her heart is so in her head. I didn't hear many feeling words or embodiment experiences. I offer this as what could be helpful.
I also had to learn to trust my feelings rather than deny or discard them. They're full of information.
She is so intellectual. I am too and have been conned by a very stupid con artist. He didn't have education, no career, but he played me so bad with master's degree.
I knew what my husband was doing was painful but I never thought I’d it as abuse. As a person who was an abused child, it was normal to me. It took all of your videos for me to see that it WAS abuse.
Sad😢
This is exactly what I feel, was so embarrassed about I couldn’t talk about because they were looking at me like I was the one who’s crazy. They will make you question your own thoughts. It took me forever to get out of my situation because I didn’t know what I was dealing with. Once I understood what it was I started healing but it’s going to be for a while to even trust anyone. This podcast I think once more people share these experiences, a lot of people can relate and it’s helping a lot of people.
I met an online conman in the midst of being vulnerable after my divorce. At first I was elated that someone might love me. Then the danger began - and detectives were lurking around my name, not his.
Ms. Ellin was smart for going with the logical side of her brain and questioning what this guy was telling her. She knew something was off and didn't ignore it. That is really key. So many women would have looked the other way and pretended everything was fine. Good for her for getting out of a messy situation relatively quickly. I appreciate Ms. Ellin's honesty.
She did ignore it when she knew something was off.
She said he would write her very strange notes. This was before they began dating. She said he was not really good looking (to her). She had no interest in him until he started showing more interest by writing more letters. She regularly doubted his stories. She saw the red flags but ignored them because of his profession, status and income.
@@SamStone1964 I wrote the above comment before watching the entire podcast. After watching the entire segment, I will say that you are probably correct, although only Ms. Ellin knows her motivation. When I say she got out, I mean she got out in a relatively short period of time (1 year) before marrying this person.
@@transitionsnc Yes absolutely she dodged what could have descended into a greater nightmare had she married or combined their finances or homes. And she's lived to tell the tale.
@@SamStone1964 Yes. I agree with you. I also agree she stuck around longer than needed probably to get the story...her motives were not completely pure.
@@transitionsnc In an ideal world we'd run at the first red flag. Or we'd have a strong support network of friends and family who would push us to run.
At 37.32 Dr Ramani's face says it all 😂 "OMG if you ask me a question, at least let me answer it"! You did well to almost hide it Dr Ramani....
Nice catch! lol. The guest seems a lil' off sometimes.
@aktchungrabanio6467 It's because I had the same reaction lol 😆
this woman is too much😒
My take is that lying and hypocrisy is a no go for any kind of relationship. My trust has diminished over time. I am so sick of being lied to and I certainly don’t trust governments . I will never marry , I will never change my name , and I will never share money with anyone
Me neither. Smart!
Dr. Ramani thank you this interview was outstanding. It was the best episode you have done, you touched on a subject that is so prominent in our society.
Dr. Romani..would love to tell you my story. Was married to a Pakistani man..being Indian. 18 years of cultural torture! A whole family of narcisistic people!!
Thank you for all these pod casts. ❤
Lol😂 I always used to say I straddle the fence of “ignorance is bliss; knowledge is power” . The experience with the ex narc stole my innocence. And I no longer am blissful about much of anything, certainly not ignorance. I loved hearing this part of the discussion. Loved the discussion. I’ll look for Abby’s podcast and book. Thank you
I think she’s wound up so tightly because she doesn’t want to admit she feels ashamed. Things will get better for her once she can work through some of that.
Great talk! Great dynamics! So informative and interesting! Thank you so much for this uploading ❤
Wow. This was such a fantastic conversation! I loved it. Great chemistry between you two intelligent and lovely ladies. Thank you both. 🙏 Also - you both look great in your respective colors 😎🌹
As a former white-collar wife I am greatly offended by Ms. Ellin’s comments when she not only implied but stated that white-collar wives on the whole are complicit in their husband’s financial crimes because they didn't want to give up their "nice car." What a stupid remark, especially from a journalist. Despite making a good living that afforded us a comfortable lifestyle, my ex-husband embezzled over 2 million dollars from a prominent teaching hospital. He was well respected among his colleagues, family members, within our close circle of friends, and our community. I had no reason to suspect his embezzlement as my lifestyle didn’t change and no additional funds appeared in our joint accounts or I would have known about it because I handled our finances. I would later learn that the stolen funds were earmarked for his new life with his mistress who was a former “friend” of mine. I knew about the affair and kicked him to the curb and filed for legal separation, and a few months later I learned he was under criminal investigation. I’m sorry Ms. Elin was duped by her boyfriend/fiancé and that she has been so emotionally harmed by this event, but her plight pales by comparison to those of us who were in long-term marriages (with children) whose lives were literally blown to pieces and who have had to endure not only an epic familial and financial betrayal, but the knee-jerk public stigma of presumed complicity that goes along with this living nightmare. Most white-collar wives are not willfully blind, but rather, blindsided and the only thing they are guilty of is implicit trust which is not a crime. I founded an international private support group for recovering white-collar wives which is sadly in the triple digits and we have received international recognition. I have had the pleasure of being interviewed on national podcasts and am excited to share that The White-Collar Wives Project Podcast will be airing soon and will include the topics of clinical narcissism, con men, and acute familial betrayal. It would be our honor to have the esteemed Dr. Ramani as a guest. I agree with Ms. Ellin that it is indeed in one's best interest to walk away from those who lie to us or betray us, and on a personal note, after listening to this podcast, I and my son feel as if we were duped by Ms. Ellin.
Hi Lisa, What you failed to mention in your comment is that I wrote about you and your organization in "Duped" and in the NYT (which basically put you on the map), brought you to NY to be on a panel on "Dirty John," and was trying to sell a TV show with you based on White Collar Wives. Which is to say--you and I have spent a lot of time together, and talked many times, and you know that I do not hold White Collar Wives "complicit" for their husbands financial crimes. Not at all! What you and I talked about repeatedly, and what I said on this show, was that there is a sense of "I knew but I didn't know," and therefore a subconscious complicity. I NEVER said anyone was responsible for the crime itself. Perhaps my definition of "complicit" is different than yours--I was not talking in the legal sense. And I was certainly not blaming anyone. I wish you great success with your podcast and I hope you have healed from your trauma. My very best to you.
I heard about blue collar before. What's white collar?
No Ms. Ellin, you are suggesting we “know” someone is lying-whether “in our body” or intuition-and while you say you knew, there are people listening to you who absolutely had no idea. At the very least, you seem to think all of the “duped” basically know at some level that something is wrong. Why does it need to be all of us? Why are you succumbing to such black and white thinking about human behavior that is so complex?
It feels like abby had no pain. And feels/experiences no real empathy.Just fell into a windfall of a hot, uptrendng subject and is making bank on it? This is the first of dozens of dr Ramini guests I have listened to where I felt Dr Ramini is actually interviewing a manipulator. The way Abby "finished" dr ramini sentences but waited to hear that ending before she quickly said it to...like they were "tracking" together felt very contrived. I am so sorry for the heartache you've walked through. May the Comforter strengthen you.
"People aren't self-aware. I AM. They're not"
Grandiose much, Abby?
Knowledge is power and success for us. Ignorance is bliss until the emotional, physical or financial abuse starts, then it gets expensive.
Ms Ellin really makes a lot of good points in this interview. It's so easy to live a double (or triple) life these days...just something to be aware of.
My ex also attacked me when I confronted him with his lies. To deviate/deflect and turned it out on me, typical narcissistic behavior.
They believe their lies because it fits the narrative . They justify the lie as they see themselves as the victim in their story. They lie to deflect what they are hiding. Everyone around them supports the lie and you become the bad one . Doesn’t matter what the reality is. No choice but to walk away for your sanity.
That’s called gaslighting and believe me I know just wish I had learned that behavior earlier in my marriage and would have been able to not let him always make me feel like I was the crazy person when I confronted him with his lies maybe then it wouldn’t have taken me so many painful years after we divorced to get healthy healed and to realize he was the crazy sick one not me💕
I think people who are impressed by people who seem to have “bigger lives” are much more vulnerable to con artists. If you’re not impressed by the BS you kind of gag at such people who present themselves as “bigger than life”…
Sadly plenty of narcs & con artists don't present themselves as that & you have no clue until they've deeply wounded you.
@@JonathonsWifeForeveryes..true..they study you & tailor make an abusive approach to your specific personality..it's very personal
I'm happy you are doing a podcast!!
I had a similar situation and at the time I trusted completely I remember my brother saying to me that I always gave away my trust up front to quickly to everyone and that was wrong and that people needed to earn my trust 😊 wish I had been told that much earlier in my life 😂
What a wonderful conversation!
connecting to my current life!
❤❤❤❤❤!
Aah ignorance can be bliss right? I have always said, since I was a young teen, that I wish so so much that I could not see reality so well and that those out there that are in denial or whitewash reality seem so much happier than those of us that simply can not deny the truth. The truth about humanity, reality, and the truth that the world is not as rosey and happy as we wish that it were. ❤
What I love about the truth is it puts things in “perspective”!
It helps you to be more discerning with people and shows you the difference between the ugliness and the beauty in life!
@@teal1010 Right on!
I wondered if my ex was a con man, but my friends and family laughed at that -as they thought calling him a con man would be giving him too much credit. Years later, I look back and realize that he was just an idiot with grandiosity about himself but with nothing to back him up.
Sometimes, these people aren't big bad villains but are just cattles walking around with a big old knifes looking for a butcher who would kill them gently and for a good price too lol
Watching 14 minutes of this podcast, i think this woman is also a narcissist and Dr.Ramani had sensed that if I'm not mistaken!
She’s something for sure and it’s uncomfortable.
She is a journalist and has confidence. Some narc target are just confident people.
WOW, NO WAY!!! At exactly the same time (14mins 35), I came to the same conclusion and was coming to the comment section to say the same thing. She was using him just as much as he was using her 🤦🏽♂️😂. Birds of the same 🪶 flock together.
My gut was rumbling also....
I didn't feel that and I've been around narcs a lot from birth. She is high speed for sure and doesn't suffer fools gladly but she seemed authentic and ambitious to me
A gaslight is a lie with the added twist of "you're crazy"
Good point
30:03
“I used to think people really knew why they did things and they don’t!”
Dr. Ramani you absolutely would not be out of a job if people knew why they did things!
Everyone would regulate “their” behavior EXCEPT Narcissists!
This would “multiply” the amount of people who would need you to “help” them cope with Narcissists!
🤣
Aw negating her own vulnerability via transparency.. to some extent. It hurt me a little, it saddened me. Wishing all the best
Wowww !!!! What an amazing podcast!!!! Soo much information for us ladies to always digg deep!!! & don’t overlook the red flags!!!
24:00 my COVERT Narcissist just shuts down and walks away. And I was left with no ‘proof’ he ever told me that: which is another form of Gaslighting- it caused me to doubt my own sanity and I would overthink and Gaslight myself.
I really appreciate. When it's been ongoing like this -- and that space of being out of denial *and* not seeing a way out, traumatized, still reaching out for help, it just feels so painful. It can get to a level of being stuck in this paralysis, cptsd freeze response. When it started from day 1 and remembering , realizing just how abused i was ... i thank you for your story, ny'er here too. I lol'ed at what you guys were talking about the skeptic or something and being miserable.
Thank you so much ❤🙏
Thank you, Abby! And thank you, Dr. Ramani!
Man o man- this lady comes off as CRAZY! She jumps from one thought or circumstance to another without ever making sense or finishing the sentence. Not that I don't believe what she went through, but I don't believe for one minute that ANYONE would be happy about being lied to & having their own intuition & agency put into question relentlessly. SHE NEEDS LOTS OF HELP! 🦋
Perhaps she was happy because she realized she caught a big story and envisioned a book in her future.
I disagree, I followed her easily and she came across to me as well put together. Living authentically and being herself
@@bereal6590 Same.
That is a big statement about a stranger. As someone with ADHD I am aware that I have a different style of describing things and energy than others and that doesn’t make me “crazy.” It does make me aware of different personalities, kinds of energies and and styles of communication. And we ALL need lots of help in one way or another, I think. It makes me sad whenever I see women use reckless language about each other, especially when the subject is speaking their truth about trauma to help others. What’s the point of criticizing someone who has been through some shit. If the way they come off feels unusual and it’s something worth discussing, maybe use words that are not “crazy.” I always wonder about folks who say such strong things about people they don’t know and seem to have little empathy for. What does doing that do for the criticizer? That’s what I’m interested in.
The older generations had more integrity than people today. It wasn’t unusual for our grandparents & great grandparents to meet, truly fall in love and live happily ever after. People like that are incredibly rare in the dating world today. So her parents meeting in the the Catskills & marrying 3 months later is a great story, but nowadays would be considered unwise for just this experience this woman had. There are a whole lot of these con jobs out there. Married and unmarried.
Wonderful conversation, thanks.
I married one of these. It was fascinating (and shocking), watching him take his personality down and take on another person's. I almost missed the death threat it was so subtle. He lied about everything. Googling a professional liar doesn't help because they go to great lengths not to have an online presence, and when they do, it is to support their false life. When he left, he didn't take any of his clothing because he changed his wardrobe to a completely different style to match the personality of the next target.
Really good. Love both in the studio great quality
Agree!!! Trust was an issue when I met my ex!!!!!! And he conned me!!! Now that will be horrible for the people that want to be in my life! Not fair to them or me!!! It’s a big struggle! Many of us become cat ladies later in life!!!
When you are lied to so many times, you don't know what to believe. 😳
This podcast resonates so much with me. My two year online relationship with alleged John Mayer - seemed plausible in the age of COVID , with everyone online and we both from the same hometown. But with multiple writing styles, the proposed meetings canceled, the proposal- was too good to be true. And then why a man worth 45 million dollars demands money from my ailing mom was the dealbreaker. How could I be so foolish. Was I just a social experiment. Post divorce vulnerability- lift me up to throw me down: ( according to a VA hospital psychiatrist). And why, post divorce , if big brother was dwelling in my I phone - why did they not catch it. While I was being so scrutinized.
Thank you for this piece.
I wish people would refrain from saying emotional abuse is worse than physical.
It’s not
You cannot be physically abused without it being emotional abuse.
At least with only emotional, your life is not in danger too. (although it can change in but a moment)
The emotional component of physical abuse is just compounded with fear
I’ve actually seen a woman go BACK to a physical abuser because people were saying it’s not as bad as emotional abuse. She really didn’t realize she was emotionally abused too.
And Abby mentioned you can see the bruises. Most often you cannot. These abusers protect themselves by avoiding obvious areas for the most part
I think what she and others mean is that once you present with bruises you're believed but emotional abuse isn't recognised by society nor often times the victim themselves. It's not meant to denegrate extreme physical abuse and the fear that comes with that
The UA-cam channel too called, "Love Fraud Lessons" is worth watching every once in awhile to help us not get too impressed by someone's credentials. Because only having proof of credentials is no guarantee that the person who is speaking to you is not lying. Like when they are asking to marry us with those just earned top credentials after attending the same school together for awhile or whatever.
Would love to dissuss the survivor responsibility in falling for a deciever predator. What empaths often ignored, the denial, the esteem,lonliness, characteristics that are neglected within that leaves one susceptible to predators, and how to heal overcome being easy prey. Thanks❤❤❤❤
“Duped” is the perfect title and exactly the way that I feel.
I'm somewhat surprised by her “response to this Conman relationship”, the elation of the experience is a bit atypical ⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️ Bewildered ⁉️
The biggest red flag was when he wanted my mother to give to money “ musician to musician “ he said - when he was / is supposed to be a multi millionaire music prodigy.
I know exactly what the nightmares were. He was abusing drugs. The reason they caught onto him was he was writing scripts in other peoples names.
And this type of disordered personality can read us wanting a relationship LIKE A BOOK!
I think having had to deal with an outrageous narc, you deserve to have a few doors opened and some direction provided by the universe as to what your next moves should be.😂😢😊
I wish this lady would speak slowly and ennuciate so we can all follow. This is very important. Funnily she is aware and speaks about friends n family asking her to slow down!!😊😊😊
I was reading DUPED and had considered returning for my PhD in psychology and took it with me on a weekend with my ex at a lodge he property managed. He asked me to get something from his truck and I found a set of keys to a brand new kawasaki motorcycle
He told he he found them in the streets in SF. Turns out his new gf helped him
Or he helped her purchase it while we were in a relationship. Mind you the first year of our relationship he coerced me to buy us a brand new Ducati that he was supposed to make payments on and when asked about first payment he made some excuse about paying child support. But he was also going on a trip with his mom to Oregon to see the eclipse so I left him and took the bike when he was gone. He eventually talked me back into a relationship and this was one event that caused me to leave again.
I think he might have some sort of professional backround...
Some spies get caught as conmen, because that's kind of their profession and they wont admit to espionage as it would just worsen their sentence.
I had similar thoughts.
I don’t regret or worry about the other ask my issue is thank God I got out I regret how much time I stayed!!!
🎉 I ❤ her transparency & how she owns how she’s benefited from the experience. She is not only a smart woman but she’s a survivor!!! I absolutely respect ✊🏾 her for this. 😢Just wish I had known what was happening before I lost my kids & financial stability!!!😢 Never be so vulnerable that you let them suck you up with lovebombing into their lies & chaotic inner world. It becomes your painful reality 😢😢😢
Even if you're asked for money by someone you know in person, suppose you do for some reason want to lend some, always have them sign a contract. That goes for family members as well, unless maybe it's a really close loved one who you've known for a long time, who you know very well and you trust them 100%.
Abby is a journalist! Her job is to fact find the truth. We need hard facts in our world!
Did this guy have a mother? Father? Lying starts in grade school. Kids are punished for being honest. What was that relationship like? I would have know idea what my ex husband did outside the home.
I’ve learned they lie because they hate confrontation. Like their mother… Look how many people are good lying at sales…. “Fake it until you make it” is essentially future faking, pre-supposing or believing who you want to be until you become it.
Their demons keep them up all night the one I married never slept and had nightmares
She says she always had one foot out the door....she fell in love???
I enjoyed this cast 👊
The part of the conversation about complicity left me feeling very uncomfortable. So very, very close to victim blaming & shaming.
She says she dated him for the story but then she was “fooled”. So she’s complicit but then she didn’t know but had one leg out? I’m guessing she hasn’t dealt with what happened since she got into yet another deceitful relationship but she’s busy spinning plates how she’s so smart. It’s exhausting. It won’t get better until she stops lying to herself. It’s okay to trust and love. It’s okay to admit she had low self esteem. it doesn’t make her a bad person for doing something so human. She needs to let go of the past and learn.
He picked her, because he wanted her to write about him. Narcissists always have an agenda. She fed his ego.
My NM lied to me my whole life. I found out the truth after she died. I could have lived my whole life never knowing the truth...that she married my dad to have someone support her...she didn't love him or my brother & she never wanted or loved me. Everything was a lie!
I was in limerence with a con man for 2 years. He knew how crazy about him I was and started using me for money. I never knew a man would actually use a woman for money…. But he did… and I never suspected it until the end when he became super mean and cold towards me and basically fucked up my life leaving me homeless. Then a year later he got married to a beautiful yoga teacher. I cannot imagine how that is when he has to be a narcissist or sociopath to do the things he did to me. But who knows what’s going on with that.
It was a play first in 1939 performed in London then renamed “Angel Street” when it came to New York.
It’s ok to be Extremely Right.
@ 19:30 -what holds a lot of us back from trusting others (besides the feeling of being duped) is the pain. I feel like I should be able to avoid getting into predicaments where I get hurt. And not just heartache, but the agony of losing my sense of self. The exhaustion of once again..not being able to trust the gut instinct we’ve literally developed from said abuse for so many years. Because victims of repeated abuse DO NOT want to relive the trauma…and to trust again= potential pain and suffering of questioning our own reality or worse losing our ability to trust our own judgment leading to all kinds of unhealthy coping mechanisms. It’s a constant battle to avoid falling into the depressive, overthinking, self doubting shell of a human we swore we would never allow ourselves to become again. So yeah….we struggle to trust.
Interesting dynamic in this interview. Abby seems totally unhinged but that's not necessarily because she's manic or in denial but she's very confused about what her role in this podcast is. She's trying to be an equal host with dr Ramani but she can't match her expertise and authority so she's trying to mach her with more energy which makes her seem totally crazy. And dr Ramani is trying to be a host and trying to therapize Abby but it's not working and it's clearly annoying her. So interesting.
The comment that really struck me the most was when Dr. Ramani asked her what did the narc get out of marching on her and she said it was her “cool personality”. I felt gaslighted.
How bizarre you felt gaslighted just because she said she was valued by him for her personality. That's not gaslighting
@@bereal6590 Agreed.
I am definitely self- doubting and wondering if I am indeed too gullible. My move-in (rather then 'living with') boyfriend of 5 years was NAVY too. Does military training create narcissist?
YES!! Good liars use truth and lies mixed!!!
Wow! A lot of unhealed empaths commenting here. There is nothing ‘off’ with this woman. She’s smart, intelligent and has self Confidence - that’s what’s triggering y’all. Evidence you all need to work on your own self esteem issues. I love this woman! I’m also about to release my first book 📚 documenting my experience with 4 of these vile creatures and how to get out. Yes the Shame and embarrassment is major for survivors.
Right? Snap judgment of her style of talk (talks fast and is confident). I've met her in person and she's a wonderful, kind person.
agree!
@@saraw112 your probably a narc yourself
@@saraw112 I suggest you get some therapy
But Abby says she's not a survivor....I didn't read her book but from the podcast her story doesn't strike me as moving or genuine....and lots of people seem to be humping on "write a book" wagon....not all should
@32:35 Sis, the mistress gets lied to the most! 😂 Trust me, I know. Usually. The wife KNOWS who she’s married to. She knows exactly what her husband is capable of, and what he’s doing. At best, she just doesn’t know exactly who he’s doing it with. 😒🙂 But she knows. 😂 The mistress is the one who only knows his “representative” and Thinks they have a future.
I dated a handsome pathological liar and compulsive gambler and dumped him after he said he ran out of gas - twice - as the bells and whistles from the slot machines went off in the background at a casino that he spent the night in. Ridiculous!
My first boyfriend I truly believe he was a psychopath. He would lie on a whole different level and he would believe the lies no matter the evidence against him. People who would first meet him would be put off immediately and say its something in his eyes. He would never apologize at all and literally when something bad would happen like a death or anything it just wouldn't phase him. He ended up dying in 2014. But looking back it would is kind of scary and it was a very hard relationship. I ended up having a serious nervous breakdown. I had to end the relationship right after that. I stayed for almost 8 years.
And I’m an intelligent person. How could I be so duped.
Probably because your heart was unguarded. Also, when we sleep w/ someone without knowing their character, we will bond. I encourage you on your next relationship to take things slow and be friends first. Pray too! God doesn't want to you traumatized.
Narcissists are professional con artists , they could fool anyone. Particularly as they are often very good at masking themselves. Don’t beat yourself up. But now you know better ❤
If I do bad things at work, is my husband complicit?
Mine did that didn’t want anything that was in the house, but definitely want it. Both vehicles from the divorce is sleeping with the brother-in-law sister, and so much more craziness.
Isn't it better to say NOTHING when you lack good things to say?! I would not say to my FRIEND you look good in the dress when you think it looks horrendous! First of all who made me a Fashionista? And if I don't think she looks good in that dress?! Isn't it better not to spew your poison unto a friend?! I think your deceitful opinion is worse than just say nothing at all! Your friend might find out what you really thought and they'll be devastated that they have a deceitful friend!!!
I truly believe that narcissist are born not made
I fell in love with a conman too. I think I am traumatized forever....
Googling somebody is not enough
The guest was different than the others ive heard on here............
1:14:00 scams. I fell for an online dating scam were a supposed "soldier" needed airfare. It was around $650. I didn't get my money back from him but I got it back in a round about way. The guy who was couch surfing here wasn't paying anything. I made him pay $200 per month until he left.
Oh she was def a source of supply. She’s just not ready to see what that was.
It took me a long time, speaking personally.
In all due respect, she doesn’t seem to have done her ‘work.’ Imo anyway
That night screaming is likely from his childhood…just sayin
Kudos to Dr. Ramani for being a much better person and A+ Professional at all times. 👌🏼💯
Things that don’t make sense bc they aren’t in alignment. Our brains can only process truth and aligned messages. Incongruent data will bang around in our heads until it can be worked out logically with truth
Yes! Doctor Ramani is a class act as always ❤️
OMG the cons may have been set up and executed, but the aftermath sucks. Even after youve walked away from a narc we often deal with their unending invisible bad behaviors waves. I've had at least 5 strangers get in touch with me since leaving NarcX almost two years ago. I already left and I just did not want to know or engage in the BS. After 22yrs i figured if hes gonna drag me down more than he already did police or lawyers are gonna show up. Cause thats the type of person he was.
I’ve dated 2 of these guys after my divorce. Both were on dating sites.
35:30 I now use the term Psycho-Spiritual Abuse.
Dang this is our government. So sad