I know this was a review of the Zniper, but yea, everything you are walking through in trying to figure out if it is you or the equipment is so very familiar to me and my barebow journey... I really like this one Jake. I appreciate an Olympian sharing the struggle. Thanks !
The setup of the ZNIPER rest is nomaly pretty easy when you do it in the right order. 1. After mounting the rest drop the wire down and adjust the upper nylon screw, so that the wire of the rest is not touching the shelf of the bow. 2. Adjust the lower screw for tuning the triggering of the rest. When you insert an arrow and you pull and put down the bow the rest should not triggering. If it does ajust it whith the triggering screw. 3. Shoot arrows with your 50 meter crawl (because with your 50 meter crawl you have less nock travelling) and the rest should be triggered down. 4. If Point 2. and point 3. are O.K. adjust the wire of the rest and test point 2. and 3. again. If point 2. and point 3. are not O.K. and can not be adjusted then your nocking point and or your tiller are not O.K. and you have to change it. You have to note, that the ZNIPER rest directly shows you if your bow is tuned well or not because the rest is not cover up any bad tuning of the bow. Therefore when shooters have problems setting up the ZNIPER rest, it is usually due to a general bad tuned bow which was before covered up by a normal arrow rest.
@@florenciaferreccio1857 Grip directly under the lower nocking point (your grip for the furthest distance), to tune the NIPER rest. If you need to shoot futher but you can't because you're already gripping direct under the nock, then use the ZNIPER tab with the anker plates. When using the ZNIPER tab with the anker plates you can keep your actual anker point but because of using the anker plates your hand will come more down and the angle of the arrow will rise, the result is, that you can shoot further. Therefore the ZNIPER tab is also highly recommented to barebow shoters with low pountage because with the ZNIPER tab you will shoot further and may reach the 50m ;-)
Hey Jake. I’ve been shooting a Zniper on my Barebow rig for a couple years now. I can’t speak to arrow tuning because I started shooting VAPs at the same time, tuned them together and have been happy ever since. One thing that took a little time with the Zniper? Resetting the rest with each shot and integrating that motion into my shooting sequence. I end up sliding the arrow onto the shelf and use the shaft to lift/reset the rest as I nock. Then my nocking hand lifts the arrow onto the rest. If you come up with a more efficient way to do it, I’d love to see!
Another magnificent review. Jake . Your nearly covering each and every technical side of archery. Something that has been missing in our sport for many years . Thank you
@@JakeKaminskiArchery you certainly are that guy . This past two years you've done more for those archers of all levels than anyone out there . Believe me you are appreciated and looked on with very high regard. Thanks
Hey Jake, thanks for going into so much detail with the effect on tune, learning as much about diagnosing and solving issues as I am the Zniper! Nice work as always.
Ever tried releasing under your chin when string crawling ? U can put the tip of the arrow right on target and I found it way better than releasing off to he cheek 👍
The Zniper is great at a fixed crawl and distance- however here in the UK our rounds are pretty much all multi-distance based, i.e. 100yards, 80 yards and 60 yards - and I found that you have to set it up for each distance again- which when shooting a comp is a no-go. I've had to make mine into a standard rest for outdoor shoots, but if Im practasing at a fixed distance its okay.
I have had 2 Zniper arrow rests (one broke and they immediately sent a replacement) and I have noticed that the plastic adjustment screw at the top has a tendency to loosen making the rest arm to successively go lower, making arrows consequently dropping down significantly. It got me mad until I understood what the problem was. Putting a tiny bit of sealant-tape solved the problem completely. For me it's definitively a quality issue Zniper has to solve. Good arrow rest anyhow, and extremely consistent once tuned properly.
Great review and info! Looking forward to follow-up info once you got your tune dialed in. I am glad you found it compelling enough to want to pick one up... that's a good sign!
Hey Jake, another great job walking through the process of trying something new. I saw that your anchor and crawl is putting the nock in contact with your nose. When my crawl causes the nock to contact my nose, my groups are really effected. I will adjust my tune to a point that the nock doesn't contact. Like you, I'm set on where I want my anchor.
The drop rest will not change the crawl for the longer distances, but compresses the shorter distance crawls. Should result in even crawl across the board.
Jake, great video! I stopped using the Zniper. It eats my arrows. They keep bumping into the body of the rest. Whatever adjustments i made. The worst thing coming with the rest is the lack of a good instruction of at least how to start out with the rest. As if the manufactor does not even know how to. After Being instructed by some barebow aces and deceptions, i have decided to return to the trusted ZT.. I am shooting a Spig 650, WNS 40#
You should set up the bow in a vise, nock arrow, decrease drop force screw until arrow drops, back up 3/4 revolutions - all set. Then you use the upper screw and vertically position the rest.
Hi again, I have made the same experience with the stiffness of the arrows using Zniper rest. It took me a while to find my best tune concerning spine, arrow length and crawl. It seems to me, the drop away provides a more clearer picture of the dynamics then the pushing impuls of the finger of the other rests, especially with the changing crawl length of Barebow shooters. Regards from Germany
I tend to adjust the tiller to allow for a very moderate change in poundage from point on to max crawl. That way arrow tune is the same no matter the crawl.
@@buckbond9642 It is a matter for trial and error. You have to adjust tiller, then adjust nock points so that max and min crawls work fine enough, (at this stage I tie nocks so they can be spun up and down the string), and measure the draw weight at max and min crawl. Within 1# is acceptable.
It would be an interesting exercise to see if setting the magnet on your Free Flyte Elite rest wire to retract on the shot would also reduce you crawls at all
If the adjustment screws loosen off from shot and vibe of the bow, use teflon plumbers tape around adj screws especially the teflon screw. Less chance screws come loose.
Also, make sure the rest is centered with your plunger to pivot around the right axle when you crawl. Now you pushed the rest in as far as possible without hitting the rest, focus should be to center rest vs. plunger.
Hello Jake, Thank you, for the videos! I just started (beginner) and you use terms that I don't understand. I think that your main audience are more experienced archers, however, it would be great if you could do a episode, explaining terms for beginners. I hope that this is worth your time. Best regards, from Sweden
Best results I've found is a 1/8" to 1/4" nock height. Your seems pretty high at the beginning of the video. Also you want the rest to drop at your smallest crawl (longest distance) and you want enough resitance to not have it fall due to bumping your riser, slightly dropping the arrow onto the rest. Think of it like engine timing you need just enough Also if your arrow is impacting extremely low (once you find your new 18m crawl) you can add more resistance to bring the arrow back up. Sometimes the bow vibrations will cause the bottom (timing) screw to come loose, keep a eye on it
Hello, I have a Hoyt Satori and would like to set it up with an elevated rest and plunger for hunting purposes. What would you recommend for a left handed bow? Thank you,
Been using the Zniper for about two years with CX Maxima RZs. Found after many shots, the magnet adjustment controlling drop sensitivity can work loose. Solved it with a drop of Loctite after getting it tuned. I also was frustrated digging out the tiny screwdriver and trying to make adjustments on the tiny screw, so I changed the screw for a knob type screw - no screwdriver required. Put a paint mark on the knob so I could visually detect if it started to move. Ironically I just switched to an AAE Free Flyte Elite to try for a while. The Zniper dropping prematurely while setting up the shot (lately) is messing with my timing having to reset it, especially while on the clock. I developed resetting the wire by sliding the arrow under the wire and lifting the arrow/wire with the bow hand index finger. I'll echo the cock fletch orientation comments. Most have found the least interference with "inverted Y".
I am curious to know what you think of the other products by zniper! In my opinion the zniper zextant plunger is a great and innovative product which I shoot now for almost a year and it has really convinced me. Especially the easy and clickable depht adjustment is great! I also think the zniper barebow tab looks good and I will definitely try it out in the future. Let's see if it can keep up with the Yost tab....
anyone know does it come specific version for Left Handed or it can be converted to LH? I only see shop selling RH no LH found yet at least locally here
Hi Jake, thank you for everything you are doing to the archery community, very valuable advices and impressive efforts. Here is a question that has been bugging me for a while now. I have a problem with my vertical groping on 70 meter. Arrows left and right group in the range of the yellow circle But vertically it varies up & down reaching the blue rings. Tuning wise my bareshaft & fletched groups are inside the yellow of the small 40 cm target, where the bareshaft is slightly up and to the right like 5 cm fare from the fletched ones. So what to do. I tried to experiment with my stabilizer, I have 2 weights behind the damper & 3+ the top weight infront of it I removed 2 weights from the front of the damper that made the horizontal group goes 7 left and right but vertically it was inline with the ten ring. Where is the trick to join both good performances??
My stabilizer is 4" extender, 30" long, 12" short, 45° vBar. 2 weights behind the damper on the long rod and 3+ the top weight infront of the damper For side bars just the top weights
As odd as this list may sound, trust me these are common issues people don't realize that cause vertical groups. 1. mouth open at full draw (make sure your teeth are touching) 2. head tilting differently forward and back 3. different hooking pressure 4. a large gap between nocking points 5. inconsistent hooking locating up and down on the string 6. inconsistent hand pressure in the grip (sometimes low, sometimes high) 7. inconsistent bow arm pressure (not towards the ten ring but only vaguely down range) 8. equipment variants (unbroken off vs broken off point weight sections) 9. different C series in arrows 10. inconsistently nocking beiter nocks (sometimes up or down)
Thank you a lot ... Any suggestion on how to organize my form with this list checked in mind? And can it get fixed permenantly after 1 or two trainings?
I am used to shooting mainly Olympic style recurve, recent months have been trying out barebow string walking. I was using Spiga ZT for my barbow rest, of which I soon noticed that the arrows are bouncing off the ZT rest at shorter distances with a lower crawl. I then bought the Zniper. It took care of the arrow bouncing off the rest problem and I crawled higher at the same close distances. Great! However when I wanted to use the Zniper to shoot Olympic style recurve I realized I need a higher nocking point to activate the Zniper to drop-away. If not , my vanes will be damaged by the undropped wire . Which in turn my sight pin had to be adjusted lower to accommodate a higher nocking point. Not sure if you , Jake , had experienced the same? Thanks in advance for your feedback.
Please let us know what you find. I have no problem dropping 100 on it, but will wait before pulling the trigger until you get it tuned. Once you do get everything set, please do a video of your overall setup, Keep up the awesome videos! Mark from Virginia.
Does the reduction of crawl mean that you have reduced the point on distance of your setup? Asking as currently I am hitting 50m without any crawl so if I add this rest would I need to gap shoot you think?
You get use to the fact that if you knock your bow that the arrow will drop. Yes the Zniper does require some playing with but worth it. Like you I had to sort it all out by myself. For 18m I use a nearly full length Victory VXT, 150gr points, 100mm XS Wing fletches and the Zniper always drops property. As to the issue of weak vs stiff I don't know never noticed. Just so you know I've been using the Zniper for 2 years. As to grouping I found only a marginal improvement over the XT. I agree that it is a bit of your time, but don't discount the release as well. I've had a feeling that since the arrow is no longer supported throughout its flight from the bow that our release is more critical.
im having a ridiculously tough time getting my zniper tuned.. im getting contact the arm only allows my plunger to barley move .. the part that sticks out of the rest body acts like a false plunger/centershot. is it possible my kintec vygo is to slim? should i space it out from my riser.. im almost ready to get rid of it .. ive tried everything thats commonly a issue with it .. sounds goofy considering everyone loves these.... anyone ideas?
Now try to put this Zniper on Gillo GT =) There are some minor issues unfortunately. For faster arrows you can try Victory 3DHV. They are among the lightests for spine 500 and with 80 grain points they can approach 5 gpp threshold. I would also suggest some top-end Uukhas for even more speed increase - while not as "super recurve" as Border limbs, they don't have gpp limits.
I found this video helpful when setting up my Zniper arrow rest ua-cam.com/video/S0t3KrbYjdI/v-deo.html. From memory I think I ended up with an even tiller and the nocking point was about 1/8” above centre.
Hi Jake, did you get round to following up on your thoughts of using the Zniper after using it for a while? Have you covered it in one of your other videos? Thanks for reviewing it here - I’ve purchased one after hearing your initial thoughts on it but wondered if you had any further tips or if you’ve perhaps stopped using it.
If it changes your crawl for 18m about 1cm upwards (as I understood) , what about at 50m? If it is also changing it may be that you cannot reach 50m? (my crawl for 50m is 0)
@@timh9246 mine doesn't, and I've seen BB top level archers keep using that, especially the swedes and John Demmer. even when set a itty bitty too stiff and don't drop always, the point on stays the same for me.
It works well for some archers, and not so much for others, like almost any piece of equipment. To suggest that it won't reduce point on distance for all archers is misleading, it may or it may not. It doesn't for you, but that doesn't mean that it won't for anyone.
@@timh9246 it shouldn't, with a good tune. with a bad tune even the well known and appreciated Spigarelli ZT may make you lose point on. and this rest need his own tuning, don't expect to just swap it and be done with it. the firsts things that come to mind if the point on drops, is the nocking point is too high, and or magnet sensitivity is the too soft, making it drops to early. (because actually, even if it doesn't drop, point on stays the same and there's no even fletching contact). also, one singular case doesn't make a trend...so, what's more misleading?
It shouldn't affect your stiff weak, but if your crawl is reduced that does affect your stiff weak tune. Watching this and your previous videos, you definitely had a bounce off of the rest wire with the deep crawl. A consistent bounce, so a usable one.
I always liked to theorize that reducing your crawl puts more energy into the arrow. With a deep crawl, the string harmonics basically create a brief period of dry fire before the system starts to carry the arrow forward. This period is reduced when you crawl less, more energy is spent on the arrow, hence the weakening of arrows.
this actually makes perfect sense, i have never shot barebow so i hadnt considered this at all. though i would explain it a bit differently; remove the arrow and bow for a second. when you pull a string at any point between two anchors and let go, that part of the string will move faster than any other point because it wants to conform back to its original position. so when you are shooting barebow and you crawl, you are moving the fastest part of the string away from the nocking point and the arrow. very interesting.
Definitely. I think the term "dry fire" is a bit misleading, but it's certainly less efficient. You can use tiller to compensate for this to a degree, but not completely. And doing so introduces other variables that you have to learn to deal with (including balance and stability). I think that's why you see more than a few barebow archers with three different setups: indoor, which is all about reducing crawls; outdoor, which is about getting a 50m point on with as much speed and and as little wind resistance as you can muster, and field/3D which is about having manageable, repeatable crawls or finding a sweet spot that is forgiving of ranging mistakes.
@@JakeKaminskiArchery thinking about it, it seems like with your anchor what you'll want to do is really dial in different setups for different types of shooting (indoor 18m, outdoor 50m, and field) to have as efficient of a bow as possible. Another route, which allows someone like John Dillinger to use the same setup for indoor, outdoor, and field, is to set up a very fast bow with a flat trajectory. This lets him have all of his crawls within about 1-1.5". But without a high anchor, this needs a long arrow. I don't think you can get an arrow long enough for that to work for you, and the trade off definitely isn't worth changing your anchor (but is useful for archers without access to a wide variety of equipment).
Actually, it is counter intuitive. Thanks to the slack (“dry fire”) due to bigger crawls, the initial impulse hitting the arrow is greater, resulting in a weaker reaction. Think like this: what happens if you accelerate the arrow to basically the same end velocity in a shorter distance (use a chrono to see different outgoing velocities). This can be empirically tested with bareshafts and fletched with different crawls, for most deeper crawls will show bareshafts weaker, and close nock will be stiffer. Very counter intuitive, but explained by that initial impulse.
Jake, because many people are infected by COVID-19, and you are making a good recovery, and given that many archers are elderly, what do you think has helped you mitigate the symptoms and improve your recovery? I know that you have a good work ethic, and eat healthier and exercise, but do you have any tips?
You're kind of stuck in between traditional and compound world. I shoot a Martin Hunter and do it fix crawl. Learning about FOC and Archer's paradox and how to adjust your arrows for best flight is what it's all about. Make the full jump to traditional!
I know this was a review of the Zniper, but yea, everything you are walking through in trying to figure out if it is you or the equipment is so very familiar to me and my barebow journey... I really like this one Jake. I appreciate an Olympian sharing the struggle. Thanks !
The setup of the ZNIPER rest is nomaly pretty easy when you do it in the right order.
1. After mounting the rest drop the wire down and adjust the upper nylon screw, so that the wire of the rest is not touching the shelf of the bow.
2. Adjust the lower screw for tuning the triggering of the rest. When you insert an arrow and you pull and put down the bow the rest should not triggering.
If it does ajust it whith the triggering screw.
3. Shoot arrows with your 50 meter crawl (because with your 50 meter crawl you have less nock travelling) and the rest should be triggered down.
4. If Point 2. and point 3. are O.K. adjust the wire of the rest and test point 2. and 3. again. If point 2. and point 3. are not O.K. and can not be adjusted then your nocking point and or your tiller are not O.K. and you have to change it.
You have to note, that the ZNIPER rest directly shows you if your bow is tuned well or not because the rest is not cover up any bad tuning of the bow.
Therefore when shooters have problems setting up the ZNIPER rest, it is usually due to a general bad tuned bow which was before covered up by a normal arrow rest.
Hello Peer may I ask you what if I don t have any crawl at 50 m ?
@@florenciaferreccio1857 Grip directly under the lower nocking point (your grip for the furthest distance), to tune the NIPER rest.
If you need to shoot futher but you can't because you're already gripping direct under the nock, then use the ZNIPER tab with the anker plates.
When using the ZNIPER tab with the anker plates you can keep your actual anker point but because of using the anker plates your hand will come more down and the angle of the arrow will rise, the result is, that you can shoot further.
Therefore the ZNIPER tab is also highly recommented to barebow shoters with low pountage because with the ZNIPER tab you will shoot further and may reach the 50m ;-)
Thank you very much for taking the time to answer me so completely😘😘😘
does it work with recurve bows too? should it drop too or should it be used in a fixed position? thanks
Hey Jake. I’ve been shooting a Zniper on my Barebow rig for a couple years now. I can’t speak to arrow tuning because I started shooting VAPs at the same time, tuned them together and have been happy ever since. One thing that took a little time with the Zniper? Resetting the rest with each shot and integrating that motion into my shooting sequence. I end up sliding the arrow onto the shelf and use the shaft to lift/reset the rest as I nock. Then my nocking hand lifts the arrow onto the rest. If you come up with a more efficient way to do it, I’d love to see!
Another magnificent review. Jake . Your nearly covering each and every technical side of archery. Something that has been missing in our sport for many years . Thank you
Im trying to fill that gap and be that guy!
@@JakeKaminskiArchery you certainly are that guy . This past two years you've done more for those archers of all levels than anyone out there . Believe me you are appreciated and looked on with very high regard. Thanks
Hey Jake, thanks for going into so much detail with the effect on tune, learning as much about diagnosing and solving issues as I am the Zniper! Nice work as always.
Cheers!
Ever tried releasing under your chin when string crawling ? U can put the tip of the arrow right on target and I found it way better than releasing off to he cheek 👍
This Drop Away rest reminds me of the Barner Inertia Rests of the 90's. Which worked very well on Compound Bows using mechanical
releases.
Interesting to see the process, that even experienced archers get confused about the setup/shot once in a while.
The Zniper is great at a fixed crawl and distance- however here in the UK our rounds are pretty much all multi-distance based, i.e. 100yards, 80 yards and 60 yards - and I found that you have to set it up for each distance again- which when shooting a comp is a no-go. I've had to make mine into a standard rest for outdoor shoots, but if Im practasing at a fixed distance its okay.
I have had 2 Zniper arrow rests (one broke and they immediately sent a replacement) and I have noticed that the plastic adjustment screw at the top has a tendency to loosen making the rest arm to successively go lower, making arrows consequently dropping down significantly. It got me mad until I understood what the problem was. Putting a tiny bit of sealant-tape solved the problem completely. For me it's definitively a quality issue Zniper has to solve. Good arrow rest anyhow, and extremely consistent once tuned properly.
Great review and info! Looking forward to follow-up info once you got your tune dialed in. I am glad you found it compelling enough to want to pick one up... that's a good sign!
Indeed! after fiddling around, my groups are back to normal if not better.
@@JakeKaminskiArchery Awesome! 👍
Hey Jake, another great job walking through the process of trying something new. I saw that your anchor and crawl is putting the nock in contact with your nose. When my crawl causes the nock to contact my nose, my groups are really effected. I will adjust my tune to a point that the nock doesn't contact. Like you, I'm set on where I want my anchor.
Thanks for the input. Ill keep an eye on that.
The drop rest will not change the crawl for the longer distances, but compresses the shorter distance crawls. Should result in even crawl across the board.
does it work with recurve bows too? should it drop too or should it be used in a fixed position? thanks
Jake I’d like to see some slow mo videos to see what is happening at the rest with different arrows. And different crawls.
Agree, a cheaper high frame rate camera is on the list of stuff Id like to play with on this channel
Great to see your attempts and hear your thoughts, a lot to learn. Maybe some closeups with a macro lens of the rest mount would be a good addition.
Yep, I will be working on better production value as this channel continues to grow. Much more to come.
Jake, great video! I stopped using the Zniper. It eats my arrows. They keep bumping into the body of the rest. Whatever adjustments i made. The worst thing coming with the rest is the lack of a good instruction of at least how to start out with the rest. As if the manufactor does not even know how to. After Being instructed by some barebow aces and deceptions, i have decided to return to the trusted ZT.. I am shooting a Spig 650, WNS 40#
You should set up the bow in a vise, nock arrow, decrease drop force screw until arrow drops, back up 3/4 revolutions - all set. Then you use the upper screw and vertically position the rest.
Hi again, I have made the same experience with the stiffness of the arrows using Zniper rest. It took me a while to find my best tune concerning spine, arrow length and crawl. It seems to me, the drop away provides a more clearer picture of the dynamics then the pushing impuls of the finger of the other rests, especially with the changing crawl length of Barebow shooters. Regards from Germany
Thanks for the input!
I tend to adjust the tiller to allow for a very moderate change in poundage from point on to max crawl. That way arrow tune is the same no matter the crawl.
That would be how much negative tiller?
Still trying to absorb all this new knowledge.
@@buckbond9642 It is a matter for trial and error. You have to adjust tiller, then adjust nock points so that max and min crawls work fine enough, (at this stage I tie nocks so they can be spun up and down the string), and measure the draw weight at max and min crawl. Within 1# is acceptable.
@@Ezzie0304
Thanks for the reply!
It would be an interesting exercise to see if setting the magnet on your Free Flyte Elite rest wire to retract on the shot would also reduce you crawls at all
If the adjustment screws loosen off from shot and vibe of the bow, use teflon plumbers tape around adj screws especially the teflon screw. Less chance screws come loose.
Loctite 243 is perfect for the ZNIPER rest...
Also, make sure the rest is centered with your plunger to pivot around the right axle when you crawl. Now you pushed the rest in as far as possible without hitting the rest, focus should be to center rest vs. plunger.
Hello Jake, Thank you, for the videos! I just started (beginner) and you use terms that I don't understand. I think that your main audience are more experienced archers, however, it would be great if you could do a episode, explaining terms for beginners. I hope that this is worth your time. Best regards, from Sweden
Best results I've found is a 1/8" to 1/4" nock height. Your seems pretty high at the beginning of the video. Also you want the rest to drop at your smallest crawl (longest distance) and you want enough resitance to not have it fall due to bumping your riser, slightly dropping the arrow onto the rest. Think of it like engine timing you need just enough
Also if your arrow is impacting extremely low (once you find your new 18m crawl) you can add more resistance to bring the arrow back up. Sometimes the bow vibrations will cause the bottom (timing) screw to come loose, keep a eye on it
How can you tell the rest is droping before the fletching reaches it or if the fletching is pushing the rest out of the way?
Could this work on Olympic recurve for fat arrows
I think so yes.
Hello, I have a Hoyt Satori and would like to set it up with an elevated rest and plunger for hunting purposes. What would you recommend for a left handed bow?
Thank you,
Been using the Zniper for about two years with CX Maxima RZs. Found after many shots, the magnet adjustment controlling drop sensitivity can work loose. Solved it with a drop of Loctite after getting it tuned. I also was frustrated digging out the tiny screwdriver and trying to make adjustments on the tiny screw, so I changed the screw for a knob type screw - no screwdriver required. Put a paint mark on the knob so I could visually detect if it started to move. Ironically I just switched to an AAE Free Flyte Elite to try for a while. The Zniper dropping prematurely while setting up the shot (lately) is messing with my timing having to reset it, especially while on the clock. I developed resetting the wire by sliding the arrow under the wire and lifting the arrow/wire with the bow hand index finger. I'll echo the cock fletch orientation comments. Most have found the least interference with "inverted Y".
Interesting on the nock position.
I am curious to know what you think of the other products by zniper! In my opinion the zniper zextant plunger is a great and innovative product which I shoot now for almost a year and it has really convinced me. Especially the easy and clickable depht adjustment is great! I also think the zniper barebow tab looks good and I will definitely try it out in the future. Let's see if it can keep up with the Yost tab....
Can you use this rest for Olympic style and is it allowed?
You absolutely can, general rule is if it's allowed in barebow it's allowed in Olympic.
I am a newbie to stringwalking and archery. What rest do you folks recommend?
anyone know does it come specific version for Left Handed or it can be converted to LH? I only see shop selling RH no LH found yet at least locally here
Good luck. People either love or hate the zniper rest.
Would it be possible to have a limb activated drop away rest for a recurve?
Jake thank you for this. I did not see a response to this but, did you not use your Shibuya test for Barebow because the wire was too light?
Hi Jake, thank you for everything you are doing to the archery community, very valuable advices and impressive efforts.
Here is a question that has been bugging me for a while now. I have a problem with my vertical groping on 70 meter.
Arrows left and right group in the range of the yellow circle
But vertically it varies up & down reaching the blue rings.
Tuning wise my bareshaft & fletched groups are inside the yellow of the small 40 cm target, where the bareshaft is slightly up and to the right like 5 cm fare from the fletched ones.
So what to do. I tried to experiment with my stabilizer, I have 2 weights behind the damper & 3+ the top weight infront of it
I removed 2 weights from the front of the damper that made the horizontal group goes 7 left and right but vertically it was inline with the ten ring.
Where is the trick to join both good performances??
My stabilizer is 4" extender, 30" long, 12" short, 45° vBar.
2 weights behind the damper on the long rod and 3+ the top weight infront of the damper
For side bars just the top weights
As odd as this list may sound, trust me these are common issues people don't realize that cause vertical groups.
1. mouth open at full draw (make sure your teeth are touching)
2. head tilting differently forward and back
3. different hooking pressure
4. a large gap between nocking points
5. inconsistent hooking locating up and down on the string
6. inconsistent hand pressure in the grip (sometimes low, sometimes high)
7. inconsistent bow arm pressure (not towards the ten ring but only vaguely down range)
8. equipment variants (unbroken off vs broken off point weight sections)
9. different C series in arrows
10. inconsistently nocking beiter nocks (sometimes up or down)
Thank you a lot ...
Any suggestion on how to organize my form with this list checked in mind?
And can it get fixed permenantly after 1 or two trainings?
I am used to shooting mainly Olympic style recurve, recent months have been trying out barebow string walking. I was using Spiga ZT for my barbow rest, of which I soon noticed that the arrows are bouncing off the ZT rest at shorter distances with a lower crawl. I then bought the Zniper. It took care of the arrow bouncing off the rest problem and I crawled higher at the same close distances. Great!
However when I wanted to use the Zniper to shoot Olympic style recurve I realized I need a higher nocking point to activate the Zniper to drop-away. If not , my vanes will be damaged by the undropped wire . Which in turn my sight pin had to be adjusted lower to accommodate a higher nocking point. Not sure if you , Jake , had experienced the same? Thanks in advance for your feedback.
Never shot it out of a recurve. Did you increase the sensitivity to make the rest drop?
Please let us know what you find. I have no problem dropping 100 on it, but will wait before pulling the trigger until you get it tuned. Once you do get everything set, please do a video of your overall setup, Keep up the awesome videos! Mark from Virginia.
Does the reduction of crawl mean that you have reduced the point on distance of your setup? Asking as currently I am hitting 50m without any crawl so if I add this rest would I need to gap shoot you think?
You get use to the fact that if you knock your bow that the arrow will drop. Yes the Zniper does require some playing with but worth it. Like you I had to sort it all out by myself. For 18m I use a nearly full length Victory VXT, 150gr points, 100mm XS Wing fletches and the Zniper always drops property. As to the issue of weak vs stiff I don't know never noticed. Just so you know I've been using the Zniper for 2 years. As to grouping I found only a marginal improvement over the XT.
I agree that it is a bit of your time, but don't discount the release as well. I've had a feeling that since the arrow is no longer supported throughout its flight from the bow that our release is more critical.
Jake are you shooting all vanes? No fletch?
im having a ridiculously tough time getting my zniper tuned.. im getting contact the arm only allows my plunger to barley move .. the part that sticks out of the rest body acts like a false plunger/centershot. is it possible my kintec vygo is to slim? should i space it out from my riser.. im almost ready to get rid of it .. ive tried everything thats commonly a issue with it .. sounds goofy considering everyone loves these.... anyone ideas?
Very interesting Jake 👍
does it work with recurve bows too? should it drop too or should it be used in a fixed position? thanks
It should be set up to drop with recurve too.
@@JakeKaminskiArchery and you think it will gives some advantages over a classic shibuya rest? I’m considering buying it for 70€ here in Italy
What vanes are you using on the arrows
Now try to put this Zniper on Gillo GT =) There are some minor issues unfortunately.
For faster arrows you can try Victory 3DHV. They are among the lightests for spine 500 and with 80 grain points they can approach 5 gpp threshold.
I would also suggest some top-end Uukhas for even more speed increase - while not as "super recurve" as Border limbs, they don't have gpp limits.
I found this video helpful when setting up my Zniper arrow rest ua-cam.com/video/S0t3KrbYjdI/v-deo.html.
From memory I think I ended up with an even tiller and the nocking point was about 1/8” above centre.
Hi Jake, did you get round to following up on your thoughts of using the Zniper after using it for a while? Have you covered it in one of your other videos? Thanks for reviewing it here - I’ve purchased one after hearing your initial thoughts on it but wondered if you had any further tips or if you’ve perhaps stopped using it.
I still love it.
@@JakeKaminskiArchery thanks for replying - that's good to know.
Yes it will affect your tune you arrow isnt bouncing around as much so you get a cleaner flight
what arrows are those?
If it changes your crawl for 18m about 1cm upwards (as I understood) , what about at 50m? If it is also changing it may be that you cannot reach 50m? (my crawl for 50m is 0)
nope. more like it compresses the short distance crawls. from 25m and up my crawls are the same.
Some archers (including at least one top level international barebow shooter) find that drop away rests like these decrease their point on distance
@@timh9246 mine doesn't, and I've seen BB top level archers keep using that, especially the swedes and John Demmer.
even when set a itty bitty too stiff and don't drop always, the point on stays the same for me.
It works well for some archers, and not so much for others, like almost any piece of equipment. To suggest that it won't reduce point on distance for all archers is misleading, it may or it may not. It doesn't for you, but that doesn't mean that it won't for anyone.
@@timh9246 it shouldn't, with a good tune. with a bad tune even the well known and appreciated Spigarelli ZT may make you lose point on.
and this rest need his own tuning, don't expect to just swap it and be done with it. the firsts things that come to mind if the point on drops, is the nocking point is too high, and or magnet sensitivity is the too soft, making it drops to early. (because actually, even if it doesn't drop, point on stays the same and there's no even fletching contact).
also, one singular case doesn't make a trend...so, what's more misleading?
What are those yellow circles stuck on the inside of your limbs ?
They are called Hush Pucks they come from drummers, but they don't do much for dampening. I use Limb Savers now.
Jake are you old enough ;>) to remember the old Barner ST1-11 magnetic drop a-way rest to see how similar the mechanics of the rest are???
I have seen lots of rests in my day but haven't heard of the st1-11
It shouldn't affect your stiff weak, but if your crawl is reduced that does affect your stiff weak tune.
Watching this and your previous videos, you definitely had a bounce off of the rest wire with the deep crawl. A consistent bounce, so a usable one.
Good call on the change of crawl and stiff/weak.
hey jake could you please test wiawis atfx flex so bad to see it。
Working on it.
@@JakeKaminskiArchery wow wonderful thx bro
You can have lower nock point with the zniper rest
Yep, ended up about 1/4" lower or so.
I always liked to theorize that reducing your crawl puts more energy into the arrow. With a deep crawl, the string harmonics basically create a brief period of dry fire before the system starts to carry the arrow forward. This period is reduced when you crawl less, more energy is spent on the arrow, hence the weakening of arrows.
this actually makes perfect sense, i have never shot barebow so i hadnt considered this at all. though i would explain it a bit differently; remove the arrow and bow for a second. when you pull a string at any point between two anchors and let go, that part of the string will move faster than any other point because it wants to conform back to its original position. so when you are shooting barebow and you crawl, you are moving the fastest part of the string away from the nocking point and the arrow. very interesting.
Agree 100%
Definitely. I think the term "dry fire" is a bit misleading, but it's certainly less efficient. You can use tiller to compensate for this to a degree, but not completely. And doing so introduces other variables that you have to learn to deal with (including balance and stability).
I think that's why you see more than a few barebow archers with three different setups: indoor, which is all about reducing crawls; outdoor, which is about getting a 50m point on with as much speed and and as little wind resistance as you can muster, and field/3D which is about having manageable, repeatable crawls or finding a sweet spot that is forgiving of ranging mistakes.
@@JakeKaminskiArchery thinking about it, it seems like with your anchor what you'll want to do is really dial in different setups for different types of shooting (indoor 18m, outdoor 50m, and field) to have as efficient of a bow as possible.
Another route, which allows someone like John Dillinger to use the same setup for indoor, outdoor, and field, is to set up a very fast bow with a flat trajectory. This lets him have all of his crawls within about 1-1.5". But without a high anchor, this needs a long arrow. I don't think you can get an arrow long enough for that to work for you, and the trade off definitely isn't worth changing your anchor (but is useful for archers without access to a wide variety of equipment).
Actually, it is counter intuitive. Thanks to the slack (“dry fire”) due to bigger crawls, the initial impulse hitting the arrow is greater, resulting in a weaker reaction. Think like this: what happens if you accelerate the arrow to basically the same end velocity in a shorter distance (use a chrono to see different outgoing velocities). This can be empirically tested with bareshafts and fletched with different crawls, for most deeper crawls will show bareshafts weaker, and close nock will be stiffer. Very counter intuitive, but explained by that initial impulse.
I baught one and can’t shoot corectely with it,i sold it and i prefer my arrow rest..i don’t lire the random impact..
You definitely don't want premature drop...🤣🤣
Looks like the fingernail clicker is working for you!
Loving it for sure.
Keebler Common
Never thought a recurve bow could use a drop away..
Glad you seem to be recovering well from COVID, wishing you and your family all the best.
Jake, because many people are infected by COVID-19, and you are making a good recovery, and given that many archers are elderly, what do you think has helped you mitigate the symptoms and improve your recovery? I know that you have a good work ethic, and eat healthier and exercise, but do you have any tips?
Very informative video. Good stuff.
I bought one and it's not worth the cash. You think you've set it up correct then after a few shots you need to fiddle with it again
Don’t be afraid to tighten it, never had to adjust mine
And my phone correct my words all the time
kada harat hehehe
They are a bad rest i had the arm brake on me and so did a friend in the same place.
Para mejorar la agrupación: gira 90 la pluma timón hacia arriba
You're kind of stuck in between traditional and compound world. I shoot a Martin Hunter and do it fix crawl. Learning about FOC and Archer's paradox and how to adjust your arrows for best flight is what it's all about. Make the full jump to traditional!
I am french and my anglish is not very good,sorry
vou should hear moi French. LOL
How can you tell the rest is droping before the fletching reaches it or if the fletching is pushing the rest out of the way?