It's important to remember that Tacitus is also removed from the story by great physical and cultural distance. It's unclear what exactly his sources were, but there's certainly a few degrees of separation, including some point where the story would have had to be translated. And honestly, it can be hard enough to get an accurate summary of historical events and cultural practices even when you're speaking directly with people who participated. So it's possible, I'd say almost certain, that the story was at least somewhat warped by the time it was written down. Inconsistencies like Nerthus' gender could easily arise from simple miscommunication.
@@adamroodog1718 but did he? You'd be surprised how many people have written entire books about other cultures without ever speaking to anyone actually from that culture, even when they easily could have. And even if he did, it's very hard to verify if this or any other specific story came straight from the horse's mouth. And even if it did, we can't be sure if he correctly understood and transcribed what he was told, or indeed if those Germanic warriors even knew all that much in the first place. They would probably be laymen, after all. Try to figure out how Mass works by interviewing a random Christian who hasn't attended in a year and I think you'd get a pretty garbled impression of that, too.
@@adamroodog1718 I'm not saying he didn't, I'm saying we dont know if he did, and if he did we dont know if this specific part is well sourced. The name and the repetition of the wagon motif are certainly interesting and I agree that suggests he's not pulling things entirely out if thin air, but that doesn't mean the rest of the story is 100% accurate. I think there's probably some truth to it, but it could be anywhere from an accurate representation of a Germanic ritual practice to literally the only thing he got right is that they have a god named Nerthus. Or anything in between, like he's conflating different rituals, or the ritual is real but he's assigned it to the wrong god etc. etc. The existence of a 'priest' is right there in the Germania, so either Tacitus would be talking to laymen or his description is inaccurate anyway.
Almost all of Tacitus' sources for Germania actually came from the writings of a governor of Germania Inferior, a book title which I cannot remember, which was lost in time. Tacitus had never been anywhere near Germania, but his source came from somebody who's whole life revolved around the Germans.
I need to look it up but as I remember from my course in pre christian scandinavian religion there was some accounts of either an effigy or the relics of Erik the holy that where driven around the fields around Uppsala in a similar way.
Great video! I'm always bummed, being of modem German descent, that there is next to nothing preserved of the pre Christian Saxon, Angle, Jute or Frisian religion or mythology. Such a clear example that these, along with the Norse, were indeed once a much more unified culture is fantastic for understanding the context that the peoples of "the germanic tribes" emerged onto the world stage in. Keep up the great work, Crawford! Also.... You going to the Heilung show in January, my dude??
Hey Doc. You just helped me to put some things together. The thing is that there are similar rituals recorded in 19th century Balkans. And from studies we can tell that the goddess is associated with earth fertility, Mokosz (or sometimes her daughter Marzanna - also chtonic goddess who is associated with realm of death, sleep, dream, winter, ) and she also has a brother Jarylo - beautiful god of spring, life, and all those sort of things. If you can see those incredibly striking similarities would you rather say it's because of the same Indo-European core or because of the influences?
Hello Dr. Crawford. I'm planning on buying a book in Norwegian. I read hauge's poem din vegg and understood it quite well because he is very clear in his writing. I wanted to know if you have any recommendations for a book in Norwegian that would be interesting and help me with my learning ???. I've read a book I found in my college library about a collection of newspaper comics from the 1920s and it was fun. Maybe you should try it too, since the characters' speech is written phonetically because they are farmers from the East lands living in Minnesota. But the commentary (and the well sudied characters) speak basically the Dano-Norwegian language of Oslo in the 1920s. The book is called "Han Ola og Han Per"
Given that Skadi is used as a male name in the Volsung Saga, and Njordr is probably related to Nerthus, is there any possibility that Skadi and Njordr were once gender-inversed? A female fertility/ocean goddess and a male mountain god? Njordr's domains certainly seem to be related to summertime activities, like good weather, fishing, sailing, and crop fertility. Meanwhile, Skadi is more of a wintertime deity with her connection to skis, snowshoes, mountains, and hunting. So put together, was their marriage originally a seasonal myth?
This "carriage" transporting god-components sounds eerily similar to transporting the Ark of the Covenant in 2 Samuel 6. (Except when touched the Ark and cart strike out at folk.) As typical, with Tacitus, we are only give a minimal story (and never enough explanation for events).
Dr Jackson: "Coitus with his wife"
Freyr: blows the camera over
I love videos like this where you show consistencies between two very different sources.
Great commercial break! Thanks wind!
Dramatic ad break worthy of the sagas!
It's important to remember that Tacitus is also removed from the story by great physical and cultural distance. It's unclear what exactly his sources were, but there's certainly a few degrees of separation, including some point where the story would have had to be translated. And honestly, it can be hard enough to get an accurate summary of historical events and cultural practices even when you're speaking directly with people who participated.
So it's possible, I'd say almost certain, that the story was at least somewhat warped by the time it was written down. Inconsistencies like Nerthus' gender could easily arise from simple miscommunication.
@@adamroodog1718 but did he? You'd be surprised how many people have written entire books about other cultures without ever speaking to anyone actually from that culture, even when they easily could have.
And even if he did, it's very hard to verify if this or any other specific story came straight from the horse's mouth. And even if it did, we can't be sure if he correctly understood and transcribed what he was told, or indeed if those Germanic warriors even knew all that much in the first place. They would probably be laymen, after all. Try to figure out how Mass works by interviewing a random Christian who hasn't attended in a year and I think you'd get a pretty garbled impression of that, too.
@@adamroodog1718 I'm not saying he didn't, I'm saying we dont know if he did, and if he did we dont know if this specific part is well sourced.
The name and the repetition of the wagon motif are certainly interesting and I agree that suggests he's not pulling things entirely out if thin air, but that doesn't mean the rest of the story is 100% accurate. I think there's probably some truth to it, but it could be anywhere from an accurate representation of a Germanic ritual practice to literally the only thing he got right is that they have a god named Nerthus. Or anything in between, like he's conflating different rituals, or the ritual is real but he's assigned it to the wrong god etc. etc.
The existence of a 'priest' is right there in the Germania, so either Tacitus would be talking to laymen or his description is inaccurate anyway.
The gender of Nerthus is almost certainty female. Nearly every Northern European deity associated with the soil and earth is female.
Almost all of Tacitus' sources for Germania actually came from the writings of a governor of Germania Inferior, a book title which I cannot remember, which was lost in time. Tacitus had never been anywhere near Germania, but his source came from somebody who's whole life revolved around the Germans.
I think there has to be an Indo-European root here. Celts, Slavs, even some in India have something very similar.
Thank you for igniting a love of norse language and history within me! You're videos are very entertaining and informative.
Pre-ordered your book, Dr. Crawford. Looking forward to reading it!
I need to look it up but as I remember from my course in pre christian scandinavian religion there was some accounts of either an effigy or the relics of Erik the holy that where driven around the fields around Uppsala in a similar way.
I enjoy reading Tacitus’ work, and this was new to me. Thank you.
Great episode!
Fascinating topic, thanks!
Apparently the Lombards originated in scandinavia
Dr. Crawford, doing all his own stunts
As usual, expectations were met. 👍
Freyr didn't like you finding out his secrets I suppose
Great video! I'm always bummed, being of modem German descent, that there is next to nothing preserved of the pre Christian Saxon, Angle, Jute or Frisian religion or mythology. Such a clear example that these, along with the Norse, were indeed once a much more unified culture is fantastic for understanding the context that the peoples of "the germanic tribes" emerged onto the world stage in. Keep up the great work, Crawford! Also.... You going to the Heilung show in January, my dude??
There are similar episodes in both Ynglinga saga and Hauks þáttr hábrokar that are interesting.
Strange that the Arith Härger video 'What is Vanatru' had consistent interruptions, while high winds attempt to destroy your camera in this video.
Hey Doc. You just helped me to put some things together. The thing is that there are similar rituals recorded in 19th century Balkans. And from studies we can tell that the goddess is associated with earth fertility, Mokosz (or sometimes her daughter Marzanna - also chtonic goddess who is associated with realm of death, sleep, dream, winter, ) and she also has a brother Jarylo - beautiful god of spring, life, and all those sort of things. If you can see those incredibly striking similarities would you rather say it's because of the same Indo-European core or because of the influences?
Hello Dr. Crawford. I'm planning on buying a book in Norwegian. I read hauge's poem din vegg and understood it quite well because he is very clear in his writing. I wanted to know if you have any recommendations for a book in Norwegian that would be interesting and help me with my learning ???. I've read a book I found in my college library about a collection of newspaper comics from the 1920s and it was fun. Maybe you should try it too, since the characters' speech is written phonetically because they are farmers from the East lands living in Minnesota. But the commentary (and the well sudied characters) speak basically the Dano-Norwegian language of Oslo in the 1920s.
The book is called "Han Ola og Han Per"
You should try contacting him via email or his Patreon, he rarely replies to comments.
@@swinhelm389 you're right. I will
Hindus have similar practices today.
Given that Skadi is used as a male name in the Volsung Saga, and Njordr is probably related to Nerthus, is there any possibility that Skadi and Njordr were once gender-inversed? A female fertility/ocean goddess and a male mountain god? Njordr's domains certainly seem to be related to summertime activities, like good weather, fishing, sailing, and crop fertility. Meanwhile, Skadi is more of a wintertime deity with her connection to skis, snowshoes, mountains, and hunting. So put together, was their marriage originally a seasonal myth?
Could the author of the saga be familiar with Taciti writing?
I was thinking the same thing - but don't the history of Tacitus' manuscripts.
Tacitus was rediscovered in the 18th century iirc
You didn't mention anything about your Patreon Crowdcast No. 5 with Prof. Ármann Jakobsson - Crowdcast on October 30th . Is it still happening?
As far as I'm aware, yes-- if anything changes I suspect Dr. Crawford will post it on Patreon.
This "carriage" transporting god-components sounds eerily similar to transporting the Ark of the Covenant in 2 Samuel 6. (Except when touched the Ark and cart strike out at folk.) As typical, with Tacitus, we are only give a minimal story (and never enough explanation for events).
Hekkin wimbdy.
Hmm, vanir. *marija gimbutas increases* There could have been a dudewagon in non-electric ladyland.