A little detail about the Archive Book that I’ve always been suspicious about, is the fact that it’s upside down. In the Archive Menu, you can see that the symbol for the Archive Menu is a Book with a unique Book Frame that causes the book to appear like it has a bump sticking out of it. If you look at the Archive Book in front of you, you can see this unique Book Frame with its design, and you’ll come to realize that the book is not actually facing you, it’s facing the other end of the Menu. It’s as if someone is reading the Archive Entries to us, so it isn’t us who is actually reading these Entries. Looking into more a few more details, there are actually two forms of Entries, the Inventory Entry, and the Archive Entry. Despite most items having the same Description in our Inventory Entry and Archive Entry, the Archive Entry often goes an extra step, and adds a little story, very good examples of this are the Materials. We even get Weapon Lore and Artifact Lore from the Archive Entries!! How else are we finding this Lore?? The Traveler doesn’t canonically learn these stories from the artifacts or weapons, they learn the story whenever it becomes relevant during their journey. (This does paint a rather hilarious image of the Traveler just staring at the artifacts and weapons in the middle of the day, where people start questioning the Traveler only to receive the most schizophrenic answer of “I’m reading their story.” I can imagine Paimon just hyperventilating from confusion, saying to everyone that the Traveler does this like several times a month.) Before I forget, there is a third alternative entry that sometimes gives unique lore, the Adventurers Guild Entries for Enemies. It’s where I’ve first learned about the Founder of the Treasure Hoarders, Reed Miller, it’s the only Entry that makes any mention of this guy. So yeah, Archive Entry, Inventory Descriptions, and Adventure Handbook Enemy Tracker. Inventory is obviously our most personal description of items, and Adventure Handbook is obviously information the Adventurer Guild has, and the Archive Entry comes from someone/something that is very knowledgeable about the world.
I just put it this way now, anything with that Irminsul background is what is recorded in Irminsul, and anything that is viewed through normal pause screens and UIs, are the ones we are seeing with what the people of Teyvat have recorded. It just makes sense for all the things we see so far. Yeah, I remember laughing at the treasure hoarder's founder name. Guy created a massive international crime organization and then has a whitebread ass flat name like Reed Miller xD Though it does make me question his origins. While Hoarders are no mostly seen in Liyue, his name very much strikes me as a Fontaine man instead.
Like, we know that the people of Liyue believe that Zhongli is *descending* from Celestia every year during the Rite of *Descension* . There's no reason that this means that he's an actual Descender, especially since Narzissenkreuz hypothesized that you don't actually need to descend from outside of Teyvat to become a Descender, you "just" need a will to rival the world.
@silverhawkscape2677 We don't know what that means, exactly, so we can't say. The Abyss Sibling should be as strong willed as the Traveler if they are actually the twin who could have been the main character as well, but they aren't a Descender, for as of yet unrevealed reasons. That said, the entire Liyue Questline was about Zhongli's willpower starting to crack after thousands of years of being an Archon and trying to see if he can safely retire. Of course, he's clearly also got some other plans in the work so we can't really 100% rule him out, either.
Game of the Rich teams in the quest for descenders: 1 - Dirty Face Darcy 2 - Genevieve and Poirot 3 - Rave's team 4 - Kid's Team (4th descender is said to be Traveler and this is the team joined in the quest too) If he is a descender he'd have to fit in one of these themes. I personally get the feeling that being classed as a descender is actually a pretty bad thing, like maybe it's a secret caste system or something. From our perspective Traveler is having a fun time but the truth of the situation and our Traveler's feelings could be very different. It'd be interesting if our Traveler ditches us and we then play from a 3rd person point of view with the abyss sibling or something.
"I personally get the feeling that being classed as a descender is actually a pretty bad thing", it does feel that way doesn't it xD Three of the four descenders have all been associated with supressing Teyvat in one way or another, or have brought destruction to it, so it isn't entirely a great list to be on if you're looking at it from a Teyvat native lmao.
@@silverhawkscape2677 no he doesn't. A Descender is someone who has a will that rival an entire world. If Zhongli's will actually rival the world, do you really think he would lose against an elemental being like Azhdaha? The thing whose body and eyes were made by him? He said it himself on second story chapter, even at his full power back 400-500years ago he could only seal Azhdaha. We're speaking of Descenders who (let's say Celestia) at times were able to drop down giant fricking nails when people or random gods (see orobashi) didn't fall in line with their guidelines. Zhongli isn't THAT strong.
Huh I just realized something: Zhongli and Venti are the only Archons up until now that are still part of the original archons and that don't have "two versions" of themselves. -Raiden Shogun is a robot replica of Raiden Ei, who resides as a consciousness inside the sword. -Nahida is an uncorrupted twig of Rukkhadevata that took her place -Furina is the human part of Focalors, with her divinity removed so that the Archon throne can be destroyed -Mavuika is a reincarnation of herself that slept dormant in the Fire of Resurrection until the plan they devised became viable
And then the Tsaritsa have always been described to have completely changed after the Cataclysm and she's not of the OG seven, so maybe forshadowing there?
This is so neatly made!! I wouldn’t call myself a lore expert bc I don’t really go look for them, just passively learning about them through playing. But even then, this video did a great job of guiding and explaining things without dragging on or skipping over the essential parts
BANGER THEORYOMG??? I said "damn" just as you did at the end LMAO seriously banger theory. I have also been thinking about what those character stories could be, since it does seem like EVERY DAMN mechanism in this game, inside or outside of the actual gameplay, has some lore connections. This is so well researched and edited, well done!!
I would like to point out that irminsul erasal is not flawless it leaves blank gaps in memory like a void you can't fill as nahida described in her 2nd story quest I think so zhongli could remember that only 2 og archon remains but he can't explain why
Zhongli remembering Rukkhadevata or not is really confusing…Nahida’s character stories were changed after Rukkhadevata was erased but Zhongli’s wasn’t? I’m not sure about this one but some voice lines imply that the characters are speaking to Traveler. In a sense Nahida also saved Irminsul but Zhongli definitely wouldn’t expose that he remembers Rukkhadevata. Not even Traveler told Nahida or their closest companion about Rukkhadevata so why would Zhongli
His character story was altered, which already shows a form of effect. The character voicelines are always spoken to the Traveler, because each section is our question to them, and the voicelines are their answer. Zhongli is one of the original sevens, so is Rukkhadevata. So, he definitely would've known about her and would've said something if he still remembered her. If even Venti can remember a middle of the pack Pyro Archon that is Murata, then Zhongli would defo remember the first Dendro Archon, IF he did.
If we take the computer analogies more seriously, id say it goes like this: Heavenly principle/first decender make teyvat their bubble of influence with the whole fighting the native dragon n shit, then the 2nd descender came and fk shit up, so when the 3rd descender came, the 1st took no chances and just end them right then and there. Regarding the pov of the character stories, ive always meme about how every restriction of the game is due to paimon putting us on a certain track (as she literally "advise" us no to go further at the edge of the map), with how shes the only one who can move in the pause menu and volume setting, to set a certain kind of narrative. Just like how Focalors put Neuv through her own narrative so he can forgive Fontainian when the time comes. With the theme of nahida being a smaller version of rukkhadevata, some already pointed out the similarity of paimon with the heavenly principle. For what reason, maybe after killing the 3rd descender, they think its not a sustainable way, therefore choosing this way to change our mind so we wont snitch about their private teyvat server to the admin or smthing xD.
People theorized that Paimon controls time since she can move during the pause screen, and that would mean that she is one of the four shades, so it wouldn't be too far to think about xD
@@GoatLiffy not just time tho, i mean another level equal or maybe above teyvat wise. Like if the primodial one is the admin then the 4 shades are just managers. Imagine if teyvat is a PC system, then the descender would be the users who loggin onto it
The thing with Dainsleif and the Collected Miscellany... Fontaine has a very meta theme of "audience" and the "stage", right? If you look into the Ordo stuff, like the root cycle item, Remuria and Khraun-Arya are connected somehow. After 4.3, where Furina really becomes director some weird camera POV effects start happening and Dainsleif appears in the 4.7 trailer which is only like the second one he's been in. It would be long to list everything but there is a lot of evidence that he is her secret child. The star eyes thing... we don't yet have an explanation for why Khaenri'ahns have the star eyes but they do the star eyes effect on Furina a lot like in the 4.3 event, Clorinde's story quest, etc. The mask covers that he also has heterochromia. He has the "Twilight Sword" nickname that he's uncomfortable with like "Golden Hunter" Cassidor whose cat version also has heterchromia... I really think it's possible that Khaenri'ah is just Remuria 2.0 tbh. Anyway pretty much Dain is a nepo-baby so for sure he has access to a lot of stuff he hasn't yet revealed + post-Fontaine being kinda 4th wall breaking. Candace in the new event breaks the 4th wall so much and also happens to have heterochromia eyes.
A solid take away is that, Khaenri'ah wasn't the first sort of cataclysmic event Teyvat has seen. A lot of civilizations found demise at the hands of the Heavenly Principles, like the one that is upside down in the Chasm, that apparenly isn't part of Khaenri'ah? Khaenri'ah was just a bit more significant cause it showcased pure human defiance against gods, and well, the sibling was there so there's that too :P
There is the very important but unknown entity that entered into contract with zhongli (deus aureus) so that he wouldnt speak of certain parts of his teyvats history in exchange for? he definitely was there when the gnosis were first made so he knows of the dark fate of the third descender. He IS almost certainly the one who sealed the chasm until the traveller unlocked it. He was instrumental in the archon war that happened probably not long after the gnosis were first formed. (the dark gods were probably remnants of the second who came's creation or "mind control") Also just because the third descender perished it doesnt mean that the primordial one killed them. It could well have been the third descender sacrificing him/herself so that the second who came was defeated.
I'm fairly certain Zhongli got into a contract with something or someone related to the Heavenly Principles. And the seal that we unlocked on the Chasm was actually a seven star seal that was put by the Qixings themselves, not Rex Lapis. I don't think I mentioned anywhere in the video that the Primordial One killed the Third Descender? The lore piece I looked at all said that the Primordial One "collaborated" with the One who Came After (Not sure who this is yet), to make the Gnosis, and then we find out that the remains of the Thid one is in it from Skirk.
@@GoatLiffy Yeah in neuvillette's lore it says the collaboration to make the gnosis happened but it didnt say how the third was "defeated" just that their remains was used to make the gnosese. And yes it's possible some earlier qixing put it there but since zhongli rescued xiao from the chasm I'm assuming he did it.
@@Necrochaosium "For example, the great mine in the center of The Chasm has had a Seven-Star Array cast over it... By which I mean exactly what I say - it is a seal placed over the area by the Qixing." From the chasm world quest "Surreptitious Seven-Star Seal Sundering", it's confirmed lore that the Qixings were the one who put it there. And it's cause they wanted to ban anyone from entering it to mine since it was too dangerous.
@@Necrochaosium They did? The Seven Qixings were the one who placed it. Seven seals for each of the Seven Qixings. That's why the supervisor of the Chasm thought we had permits from either Keqing or Ningguang to open it. Maybe they had adepti help, but with someone as elementally capable as Ningguang on their side, and not to mention their wealth as a group, they probably did it mostly on their own. The Chasm wasn't sealed off centuries ago, it was closed off quite near the time the game's storyline began as a lot of in-game dialogue in Liyue's archon quest would mention "with the recent closure of the Chasm".
the second who came = nibelung we do know that he came back with forbidden knowledge so it fits well that he was the one to lead a war to destroy the order established by the usurpers - apep tells us about this imo zhongli is not a descender, but I think he is related to the dragon race, not just because of his dragon motifs but his apparent similarities to the Chinese yellow dragon, Loong. we know the aeon Lóng from the honkai universe was around roaming the cosmos at this time, leaving his offspring on various worlds. so I think this is where the dragon race may originate
Nibelung returned with forbidden knowledge before the time of the Second Descender, because of having to maintain divine nails (which had to exist due to the knowledge Nibelung brought) and fighting the SWC, is why HP had to create gnosis and archonhood. He shouldn't technically qualify to be a Descender as he is originally of Teyvat. Descenders are meant for beings that doesn't originate from Teyvat. The lore is pretty strict when it comes to differentiating who is who once they have established a name, so I think there would've been a mention somewhere if Nibelung is indeed considered the Second Descender, but all records so far have never really made a connection between those two events (the rematch of the Sovereigns and the war with the Second Who Came).
@GoatLiffy that's an interesting point. I still need to play through the narzissenkreuz questline but I'll come back here when I finish. I'm pretty sure one of the people there mentioned that a descender is a being that has a will which can rival the world, but doesn't necessarily have to come from teyvat. anyway, I don't think the dragons actually are originally from teyvat. like I said earlier, I think they too are alien, offspring of Lóng, but were the first divine beings to settle there I just find it hard to understand what other being could be so powerful that they significantly injured the HP and made them unable to enact their full authority, but then immediately after just seems to vanish from thin air. I'm hopeful that we find out more information in the near future fingers crossed capitano gives us some lore in 5.2, since the fatui are the ones who use the term descender quite frequently
Absolutly perfect! Im blown away aha! And it is totally believable! I agree, Zhongli = Descender is just so stupid and illogical in my opinion. And also ALL the gods are said to descend from the Heavens, meaning most if not all comes from the Heavens. Zhongli is said to have descended (From the Heavens) Remus, Deshret, Raiden twins are the same. Heck even Adepti too. Chenyu Vale Lore told us clearly. You need more subs bro this is incredible, im subscribing!
yea... sometimes people just take things face-value like with the "descended" thing my hill to die on is that this phrase "[Mora] is a catalyst of sorts, in that it is a medium for physical transformation. That is why so many things can only be accomplished through the use of Mora" simply means "you can exchange mora for other things", in particular because of the phrasing "of sorts". people interpreting this as mora as literally, physically used in alchemy is frankly ridiculous to me
2:31 someone a month ago I forgot who added more to the theory by stating Zognilee (sorry if I misspelled) it isn't counted as one because let the shade of void brought him to the world then again their whole theory was about how the shade avoid and the sustainer was actually the same so they didn't really bring up any evidence that the shade of void brought him to tyvat the only thing that he mentioned was that she could have brought him in the same way as when she stepped out of the portal to greet us and our twin😅 I'm not saying I believe it I'm just saying if I found it interesting
@GoatLiffy sorry I'm just so used to saying it it's based on the theory of each shade represents the artifacts Goblet of logos supposedly represented void and the theory went that one of mint one of the shades is shade of void😅 I'm sorry
I just realised something not connected to this video but..i will say it anyway. So we know that phegisten is the planets primordial energy from where primordial one created the seven elemantes so what if soveraigns are called the most purest of the elemantale life form because thsy are entirely made out of phegisten.but leter elementel beings like adepti and gods are born from the elemantel energy that crested by po. Also erosion is a form of memory lose wright ? So we know that nemory is just a none physical form of elementel enargy so what if long lived life forms slowly lose elementel enargy and thats why thay lose memories too.we know that if a god or any elementel life form loose too much elementel enargy thay forgot some of their memories.so what if erosion is just losing elementel enargy and memory lose is just side effects of that.and thats why it's called natural law of the world.
I've seen that particular video around as a lowkey lore player, i know that theory video is stupid. Even before the reveals from Neuvillette character story, there's just no way Zhongli is a Descender. If the person actually read and think they'd know every ruling Archons were supposed to go to Heaven (especially when they got the Gnosis) and then came back down to Teyvat. Hence "descended" from the Heaven. But you don't see people making claims Ei is a Descender. Not only that from the description of Descender from Narzissenkreuz Ordo, we know a Descender is a title for someone who has the "strength of will to create the world, destroy the world, sustain the world" and something that i forgot. And that they say a Descender is someone whose will rivals the entire world. Being a Descender is all about strength of will. Zhongli himself said he needed Traveler to be a witness bcs even he won't last against the tide of time and erosion. His strength of will cannot rival the entire world when he couldn't even get rid of Azhdaha in the first place. He said it himself, even at full power he could only sealed Azhdaha. And this person telling me Zhongli is a Descender? Someone who can't even kill one powerful elemental being? Lol. And kudos to your Irminsul theory! That's actually makes sense. I always thought those things were written by Alice or something the way character miscellany was made. But Irminsul recording makes more sense.
Yeaaa, I tried to give the Zhongli descender theory a shot, but in the end, the logic of it just does not make sense at all. And by ignoring the logic you'd ignoring 90% of the Old War lore, which builds the entirety of Teyvat, so it's a bit hard to just skip past :P ONE DAY, we'll get to see Alice do something more in this game. xD
@@GoatLiffy as someone whose age is 6000, the records in his character details are severely lacking. I understand Hoyo is trying so hard to keep in the same way they kept Venti 2nd chapter in the basement, but every other detail regarding Descender doesn't matched up. Let's say we talk about Neuvillette's eminent "rebirth", it was already dropped when Hoyo released Enkanomiya. The talk about the Four Shining Shades also already dropped even in Mondstadt with the world quest about 1000 wind and God of Time. IF Zhongli is actually a Descender, they would definitely foreshadow it way long ago. Rather than a Descender, I'm more inclined to believe he's related to the Four Shades due to his involvement in creating and spreading "Adepti Art" which can help Ley Lines but disrupt Earth Veins. And guess what is Earth Veins? It's some kind of Ley Lines but related to the Earth instead of "Heavens" (Celestia). Earth Veins theorized as to where the ancient dragons anchor/get their powers from.
There's a actually a complete lack of records on not only Zhongli, but like the Teyvat of 6000 to 4000 years ago, since it was thought of to be a long period of peace or something. Meanwhile kingdoms like Remuria and all that stuff was going through the rockers just getting absolutely swept xD Until 3700 years ago when I guess the Heavenly Principles straight up hunger games the gods of Teyvat lul.
A little detail about the Archive Book that I’ve always been suspicious about, is the fact that it’s upside down.
In the Archive Menu, you can see that the symbol for the Archive Menu is a Book with a unique Book Frame that causes the book to appear like it has a bump sticking out of it. If you look at the Archive Book in front of you, you can see this unique Book Frame with its design, and you’ll come to realize that the book is not actually facing you, it’s facing the other end of the Menu.
It’s as if someone is reading the Archive Entries to us, so it isn’t us who is actually reading these Entries.
Looking into more a few more details, there are actually two forms of Entries, the Inventory Entry, and the Archive Entry. Despite most items having the same Description in our Inventory Entry and Archive Entry, the Archive Entry often goes an extra step, and adds a little story, very good examples of this are the Materials.
We even get Weapon Lore and Artifact Lore from the Archive Entries!! How else are we finding this Lore?? The Traveler doesn’t canonically learn these stories from the artifacts or weapons, they learn the story whenever it becomes relevant during their journey. (This does paint a rather hilarious image of the Traveler just staring at the artifacts and weapons in the middle of the day, where people start questioning the Traveler only to receive the most schizophrenic answer of “I’m reading their story.” I can imagine Paimon just hyperventilating from confusion, saying to everyone that the Traveler does this like several times a month.)
Before I forget, there is a third alternative entry that sometimes gives unique lore, the Adventurers Guild Entries for Enemies. It’s where I’ve first learned about the Founder of the Treasure Hoarders, Reed Miller, it’s the only Entry that makes any mention of this guy.
So yeah, Archive Entry, Inventory Descriptions, and Adventure Handbook Enemy Tracker. Inventory is obviously our most personal description of items, and Adventure Handbook is obviously information the Adventurer Guild has, and the Archive Entry comes from someone/something that is very knowledgeable about the world.
I just put it this way now, anything with that Irminsul background is what is recorded in Irminsul, and anything that is viewed through normal pause screens and UIs, are the ones we are seeing with what the people of Teyvat have recorded. It just makes sense for all the things we see so far.
Yeah, I remember laughing at the treasure hoarder's founder name. Guy created a massive international crime organization and then has a whitebread ass flat name like Reed Miller xD
Though it does make me question his origins. While Hoarders are no mostly seen in Liyue, his name very much strikes me as a Fontaine man instead.
Like, we know that the people of Liyue believe that Zhongli is *descending* from Celestia every year during the Rite of *Descension* . There's no reason that this means that he's an actual Descender, especially since Narzissenkreuz hypothesized that you don't actually need to descend from outside of Teyvat to become a Descender, you "just" need a will to rival the world.
Wouldn't Zhongli have that Will?
@silverhawkscape2677 We don't know what that means, exactly, so we can't say. The Abyss Sibling should be as strong willed as the Traveler if they are actually the twin who could have been the main character as well, but they aren't a Descender, for as of yet unrevealed reasons.
That said, the entire Liyue Questline was about Zhongli's willpower starting to crack after thousands of years of being an Archon and trying to see if he can safely retire. Of course, he's clearly also got some other plans in the work so we can't really 100% rule him out, either.
Game of the Rich teams in the quest for descenders:
1 - Dirty Face Darcy
2 - Genevieve and Poirot
3 - Rave's team
4 - Kid's Team (4th descender is said to be Traveler and this is the team joined in the quest too)
If he is a descender he'd have to fit in one of these themes. I personally get the feeling that being classed as a descender is actually a pretty bad thing, like maybe it's a secret caste system or something. From our perspective Traveler is having a fun time but the truth of the situation and our Traveler's feelings could be very different. It'd be interesting if our Traveler ditches us and we then play from a 3rd person point of view with the abyss sibling or something.
"I personally get the feeling that being classed as a descender is actually a pretty bad thing", it does feel that way doesn't it xD
Three of the four descenders have all been associated with supressing Teyvat in one way or another, or have brought destruction to it, so it isn't entirely a great list to be on if you're looking at it from a Teyvat native lmao.
@@silverhawkscape2677 no he doesn't. A Descender is someone who has a will that rival an entire world. If Zhongli's will actually rival the world, do you really think he would lose against an elemental being like Azhdaha? The thing whose body and eyes were made by him? He said it himself on second story chapter, even at his full power back 400-500years ago he could only seal Azhdaha.
We're speaking of Descenders who (let's say Celestia) at times were able to drop down giant fricking nails when people or random gods (see orobashi) didn't fall in line with their guidelines. Zhongli isn't THAT strong.
As a lore nerd, this was a great addition to listen to, and definitely convincing. Keep it up!!
Will try to keep it comin xD
Huh
I just realized something: Zhongli and Venti are the only Archons up until now that are still part of the original archons and that don't have "two versions" of themselves.
-Raiden Shogun is a robot replica of Raiden Ei, who resides as a consciousness inside the sword.
-Nahida is an uncorrupted twig of Rukkhadevata that took her place
-Furina is the human part of Focalors, with her divinity removed so that the Archon throne can be destroyed
-Mavuika is a reincarnation of herself that slept dormant in the Fire of Resurrection until the plan they devised became viable
If I recall correctly, the Tsaritsa is also the same since the Cataclysm, maybe even older
And then the Tsaritsa have always been described to have completely changed after the Cataclysm and she's not of the OG seven, so maybe forshadowing there?
venti technically copied his form from the nameless bard….so in a way he does have a deceased “copy”
This is so neatly made!!
I wouldn’t call myself a lore expert bc I don’t really go look for them, just passively learning about them through playing. But even then, this video did a great job of guiding and explaining things without dragging on or skipping over the essential parts
Glad you could enjoy it just as well, thanks for coming by :D
Bro got hyped from his own yapping 😂
BANGER THEORYOMG??? I said "damn" just as you did at the end LMAO seriously banger theory. I have also been thinking about what those character stories could be, since it does seem like EVERY DAMN mechanism in this game, inside or outside of the actual gameplay, has some lore connections. This is so well researched and edited, well done!!
Love the pfp, SS Link makes the funniest faces
@@catdownthestreet absolute icon he is
One day, the graphic settings will have its own lore xD
this is actually so underrated, great theory!!
Glad you enjoyed it :)
I would like to point out that irminsul erasal is not flawless it leaves blank gaps in memory like a void you can't fill as nahida described in her 2nd story quest I think so zhongli could remember that only 2 og archon remains but he can't explain why
This was such a great video! Gave me some good food for thought!
Glad you enjoyed it :D
Zhongli remembering Rukkhadevata or not is really confusing…Nahida’s character stories were changed after Rukkhadevata was erased but Zhongli’s wasn’t? I’m not sure about this one but some voice lines imply that the characters are speaking to Traveler. In a sense Nahida also saved Irminsul but Zhongli definitely wouldn’t expose that he remembers Rukkhadevata. Not even Traveler told Nahida or their closest companion about Rukkhadevata so why would Zhongli
His character story was altered, which already shows a form of effect. The character voicelines are always spoken to the Traveler, because each section is our question to them, and the voicelines are their answer.
Zhongli is one of the original sevens, so is Rukkhadevata. So, he definitely would've known about her and would've said something if he still remembered her. If even Venti can remember a middle of the pack Pyro Archon that is Murata, then Zhongli would defo remember the first Dendro Archon, IF he did.
If we take the computer analogies more seriously, id say it goes like this:
Heavenly principle/first decender make teyvat their bubble of influence with the whole fighting the native dragon n shit, then the 2nd descender came and fk shit up, so when the 3rd descender came, the 1st took no chances and just end them right then and there.
Regarding the pov of the character stories, ive always meme about how every restriction of the game is due to paimon putting us on a certain track (as she literally "advise" us no to go further at the edge of the map), with how shes the only one who can move in the pause menu and volume setting, to set a certain kind of narrative. Just like how Focalors put Neuv through her own narrative so he can forgive Fontainian when the time comes. With the theme of nahida being a smaller version of rukkhadevata, some already pointed out the similarity of paimon with the heavenly principle. For what reason, maybe after killing the 3rd descender, they think its not a sustainable way, therefore choosing this way to change our mind so we wont snitch about their private teyvat server to the admin or smthing xD.
People theorized that Paimon controls time since she can move during the pause screen, and that would mean that she is one of the four shades, so it wouldn't be too far to think about xD
@@GoatLiffy not just time tho, i mean another level equal or maybe above teyvat wise. Like if the primodial one is the admin then the 4 shades are just managers. Imagine if teyvat is a PC system, then the descender would be the users who loggin onto it
The thing with Dainsleif and the Collected Miscellany...
Fontaine has a very meta theme of "audience" and the "stage", right? If you look into the Ordo stuff, like the root cycle item, Remuria and Khraun-Arya are connected somehow. After 4.3, where Furina really becomes director some weird camera POV effects start happening and Dainsleif appears in the 4.7 trailer which is only like the second one he's been in. It would be long to list everything but there is a lot of evidence that he is her secret child. The star eyes thing... we don't yet have an explanation for why Khaenri'ahns have the star eyes but they do the star eyes effect on Furina a lot like in the 4.3 event, Clorinde's story quest, etc. The mask covers that he also has heterochromia. He has the "Twilight Sword" nickname that he's uncomfortable with like "Golden Hunter" Cassidor whose cat version also has heterchromia... I really think it's possible that Khaenri'ah is just Remuria 2.0 tbh.
Anyway pretty much Dain is a nepo-baby so for sure he has access to a lot of stuff he hasn't yet revealed + post-Fontaine being kinda 4th wall breaking. Candace in the new event breaks the 4th wall so much and also happens to have heterochromia eyes.
A solid take away is that, Khaenri'ah wasn't the first sort of cataclysmic event Teyvat has seen. A lot of civilizations found demise at the hands of the Heavenly Principles, like the one that is upside down in the Chasm, that apparenly isn't part of Khaenri'ah?
Khaenri'ah was just a bit more significant cause it showcased pure human defiance against gods, and well, the sibling was there so there's that too :P
There is the very important but unknown entity that entered into contract with zhongli (deus aureus) so that he wouldnt speak of certain parts of his teyvats history in exchange for? he definitely was there when the gnosis were first made so he knows of the dark fate of the third descender. He IS almost certainly the one who sealed the chasm until the traveller unlocked it. He was instrumental in the archon war that happened probably not long after the gnosis were first formed. (the dark gods were probably remnants of the second who came's creation or "mind control")
Also just because the third descender perished it doesnt mean that the primordial one killed them. It could well have been the third descender sacrificing him/herself so that the second who came was defeated.
I'm fairly certain Zhongli got into a contract with something or someone related to the Heavenly Principles. And the seal that we unlocked on the Chasm was actually a seven star seal that was put by the Qixings themselves, not Rex Lapis.
I don't think I mentioned anywhere in the video that the Primordial One killed the Third Descender? The lore piece I looked at all said that the Primordial One "collaborated" with the One who Came After (Not sure who this is yet), to make the Gnosis, and then we find out that the remains of the Thid one is in it from Skirk.
@@GoatLiffy Yeah in neuvillette's lore it says the collaboration to make the gnosis happened but it didnt say how the third was "defeated" just that their remains was used to make the gnosese. And yes it's possible some earlier qixing put it there but since zhongli rescued xiao from the chasm I'm assuming he did it.
@@Necrochaosium "For example, the great mine in the center of The Chasm has had a Seven-Star Array cast over it... By which I mean exactly what I say - it is a seal placed over the area by the Qixing."
From the chasm world quest "Surreptitious Seven-Star Seal Sundering", it's confirmed lore that the Qixings were the one who put it there. And it's cause they wanted to ban anyone from entering it to mine since it was too dangerous.
@@GoatLiffy Yeah they wanted it applied but who cast it?
@@Necrochaosium They did? The Seven Qixings were the one who placed it. Seven seals for each of the Seven Qixings. That's why the supervisor of the Chasm thought we had permits from either Keqing or Ningguang to open it. Maybe they had adepti help, but with someone as elementally capable as Ningguang on their side, and not to mention their wealth as a group, they probably did it mostly on their own.
The Chasm wasn't sealed off centuries ago, it was closed off quite near the time the game's storyline began as a lot of in-game dialogue in Liyue's archon quest would mention "with the recent closure of the Chasm".
I watched it from start to finish. Real good shit.
Glad you liked it enough to stick around :D
the second who came = nibelung
we do know that he came back with forbidden knowledge so it fits well that he was the one to lead a war to destroy the order established by the usurpers - apep tells us about this
imo zhongli is not a descender, but I think he is related to the dragon race, not just because of his dragon motifs but his apparent similarities to the Chinese yellow dragon, Loong. we know the aeon Lóng from the honkai universe was around roaming the cosmos at this time, leaving his offspring on various worlds. so I think this is where the dragon race may originate
Nibelung returned with forbidden knowledge before the time of the Second Descender, because of having to maintain divine nails (which had to exist due to the knowledge Nibelung brought) and fighting the SWC, is why HP had to create gnosis and archonhood. He shouldn't technically qualify to be a Descender as he is originally of Teyvat. Descenders are meant for beings that doesn't originate from Teyvat.
The lore is pretty strict when it comes to differentiating who is who once they have established a name, so I think there would've been a mention somewhere if Nibelung is indeed considered the Second Descender, but all records so far have never really made a connection between those two events (the rematch of the Sovereigns and the war with the Second Who Came).
@GoatLiffy that's an interesting point. I still need to play through the narzissenkreuz questline but I'll come back here when I finish. I'm pretty sure one of the people there mentioned that a descender is a being that has a will which can rival the world, but doesn't necessarily have to come from teyvat. anyway, I don't think the dragons actually are originally from teyvat. like I said earlier, I think they too are alien, offspring of Lóng, but were the first divine beings to settle there
I just find it hard to understand what other being could be so powerful that they significantly injured the HP and made them unable to enact their full authority, but then immediately after just seems to vanish from thin air. I'm hopeful that we find out more information in the near future
fingers crossed capitano gives us some lore in 5.2, since the fatui are the ones who use the term descender quite frequently
Absolute Cinema 🙌
Absolutly perfect! Im blown away aha! And it is totally believable!
I agree, Zhongli = Descender is just so stupid and illogical in my opinion.
And also ALL the gods are said to descend from the Heavens, meaning most if not all comes from the Heavens.
Zhongli is said to have descended (From the Heavens)
Remus, Deshret, Raiden twins are the same. Heck even Adepti too. Chenyu Vale Lore told us clearly.
You need more subs bro this is incredible, im subscribing!
Big appreciate yo, thanks for coming by :D
3:37 : ✨get the f out ✨
I HAD TO HAHAHAHA
yea... sometimes people just take things face-value like with the "descended" thing
my hill to die on is that this phrase "[Mora] is a catalyst of sorts, in that it is a medium for physical transformation. That is why so many things can only be accomplished through the use of Mora" simply means "you can exchange mora for other things", in particular because of the phrasing "of sorts".
people interpreting this as mora as literally, physically used in alchemy is frankly ridiculous to me
Except it's likely literal here. Hoyo is very detailed. Very likely some Mora really is used on the Alchemy table.
2:31 someone a month ago I forgot who added more to the theory by stating Zognilee (sorry if I misspelled) it isn't counted as one because let the shade of void brought him to the world then again their whole theory was about how the shade avoid and the sustainer was actually the same so they didn't really bring up any evidence that the shade of void brought him to tyvat the only thing that he mentioned was that she could have brought him in the same way as when she stepped out of the portal to greet us and our twin😅 I'm not saying I believe it I'm just saying if I found it interesting
Our asses never even heard of shade of the void xD
@GoatLiffy sorry I'm just so used to saying it it's based on the theory of each shade represents the artifacts Goblet of logos supposedly represented void and the theory went that one of mint one of the shades is shade of void😅 I'm sorry
I just realised something not connected to this video but..i will say it anyway.
So we know that phegisten is the planets primordial energy from where primordial one created the seven elemantes so what if soveraigns are called the most purest of the elemantale life form because thsy are entirely made out of phegisten.but leter elementel beings like adepti and gods are born from the elemantel energy that crested by po.
Also erosion is a form of memory lose wright ? So we know that nemory is just a none physical form of elementel enargy so what if long lived life forms slowly lose elementel enargy and thats why thay lose memories too.we know that if a god or any elementel life form loose too much elementel enargy thay forgot some of their memories.so what if erosion is just losing elementel enargy and memory lose is just side effects of that.and thats why it's called natural law of the world.
Cinema
:D
I've seen that particular video around as a lowkey lore player, i know that theory video is stupid.
Even before the reveals from Neuvillette character story, there's just no way Zhongli is a Descender. If the person actually read and think they'd know every ruling Archons were supposed to go to Heaven (especially when they got the Gnosis) and then came back down to Teyvat. Hence "descended" from the Heaven. But you don't see people making claims Ei is a Descender. Not only that from the description of Descender from Narzissenkreuz Ordo, we know a Descender is a title for someone who has the "strength of will to create the world, destroy the world, sustain the world" and something that i forgot. And that they say a Descender is someone whose will rivals the entire world.
Being a Descender is all about strength of will. Zhongli himself said he needed Traveler to be a witness bcs even he won't last against the tide of time and erosion. His strength of will cannot rival the entire world when he couldn't even get rid of Azhdaha in the first place. He said it himself, even at full power he could only sealed Azhdaha. And this person telling me Zhongli is a Descender? Someone who can't even kill one powerful elemental being?
Lol.
And kudos to your Irminsul theory! That's actually makes sense. I always thought those things were written by Alice or something the way character miscellany was made. But Irminsul recording makes more sense.
Yeaaa, I tried to give the Zhongli descender theory a shot, but in the end, the logic of it just does not make sense at all. And by ignoring the logic you'd ignoring 90% of the Old War lore, which builds the entirety of Teyvat, so it's a bit hard to just skip past :P
ONE DAY, we'll get to see Alice do something more in this game. xD
@@GoatLiffy as someone whose age is 6000, the records in his character details are severely lacking. I understand Hoyo is trying so hard to keep in the same way they kept Venti 2nd chapter in the basement, but every other detail regarding Descender doesn't matched up.
Let's say we talk about Neuvillette's eminent "rebirth", it was already dropped when Hoyo released Enkanomiya. The talk about the Four Shining Shades also already dropped even in Mondstadt with the world quest about 1000 wind and God of Time.
IF Zhongli is actually a Descender, they would definitely foreshadow it way long ago. Rather than a Descender, I'm more inclined to believe he's related to the Four Shades due to his involvement in creating and spreading "Adepti Art" which can help Ley Lines but disrupt Earth Veins. And guess what is Earth Veins? It's some kind of Ley Lines but related to the Earth instead of "Heavens" (Celestia). Earth Veins theorized as to where the ancient dragons anchor/get their powers from.
@@GoatLiffy IM HOPING ALICE WOULD BE AT LEAST MAKE AN APPEARANCE. 😭😭😭
There's a actually a complete lack of records on not only Zhongli, but like the Teyvat of 6000 to 4000 years ago, since it was thought of to be a long period of peace or something. Meanwhile kingdoms like Remuria and all that stuff was going through the rockers just getting absolutely swept xD
Until 3700 years ago when I guess the Heavenly Principles straight up hunger games the gods of Teyvat lul.
K-K ???
Krispy Kreme
Gonna leave the first comment.
Much appreciated xD