I really made this video and then they made another Splashdown LOL Edit: They did a good job with this one, one day when I do a big special design video i'll talk about it.
The new splashdown would’ve been so much cooler if, instead of fists, the other explosions were clones and you could swap between them freely to make you harder to shoot down and choose where to land a little.
I think it'd be excellent if Reefslider could use Drop Roller. - It makes Drop Roller relevant on more weapons - It lets those weapons survive after Reefslider - Drop Roller gives movement buffs too, so it's perfect for following up the explosion Imagine, you Reefslider, roll away from attacks into position, then use the extra mobility to follow up. It's not a total fix but it'd help immensely.
Drop roller gives an element of unpredictablability to the special and something to do during the endlag allowing for a seamless transition into gameplay
I'm not even joking it would be so funny if reefslider and stamp both got crazy mega buffs that instantly made them meta so the meta instantly began to revolve around idk Luneo, L-3 D, Tetras and S-Blast
Given the patch history of this game, I feel like this mythical buff that makes slider meta would be something like a damage radius buff, that makes its explosion so ridiculously large it outranges anything short of an unscoped splat charger.
I’ve never cared that Splashdown was bad because it was fun when you used it right. Super jumping to teammates in firefights and splashdowning on them to help them was one of the most fun things to do!
Never forget early on you could squid roll to survive reef's explosion before they massive buffed the damage to offset the armor. And don't get us started on how it still can't fizzle bombs out.
I know it was mentioned in the video but there's literally no reason for Reefslider to wait until touching the ground before startup. Even if the special itself needs proper buffs, my number one hope is that this trait is removed (or at the very least, make it so you can complete the startup middair and then go the moment you land)
my guess is that its to prevent players from accessing areas they're not supposed to be able to. if it had any forward momentum when going through the air, it could theoretically get into enemy spawn on some maps, and unlike inkjet or zipcaster, it doesnt have you return to your start position once the special is over, so you could stay in enemy spawn indefinitely.
@@lukehoffman9742 The startup is so long that you probably couldn’t get anywhere anyway though with the flatter verticality (MAYBE you could get somewhere on Flounder idk, still a bit tough to gauge because the spawn snipes are far enough from the heights). Plus my idea of just making it done the startup middair and then only move on landing still stands for what it SHOULD probably do
@@sonicrunn3r895 oh yeah, they 100% should do it that way, wasn't disagreeing with that. i was just speculating on the dev's reasons for not designing the special like that in the first place.
I have an idea, what if you could jump off of the Reefslider? Unlike detonating early the slider still goes the full distance but you just off and are in the air like after a squid surge
Another idea to add onto this: bailing off early would significantly reduce the explosion radius, sacrificing some of the special’s strength for reliability and safety. This would even help balance Zones cheese - if you want that instant flip, you have to fully commit and risk dying for it.
@@xraenon1664 Plus it could also work where you can jump off right before it explodes, it would still be predictable and vulnerable but it would allow for a mix up and dualies can quickly drop to the ground
from a salmon runner's perspective man i HATE reefslider, why is it so susceptible to knockback (from which you don't travel at all and just explode), and any slight elevation change (even on a small hill) means anything caught at point blank still manages to live... and even the SALMON can punish your endlag in that case
Or how it's not considered bomb damage despite exploding, so the Fly Fish just casually laughs at ya while throwing MLG missiles. It's literally meant to be an anti stinger or anti eel, assuming Salmonids don't get too close for a free hit. The rushing mode has more value than the exploding part, which for some salmon run situations is downright pathethic.
Just make it give ink armor after use, or even invulnerability. It's meant to help you go in, but right now it doesn't have any follow up inherent to the special.
I always thought splashdown should work kinda like how super chump does, you activate it in safe land and fire yourself at the enemy. Then, hopefully, dont immediately die. Reefslider was basically that concept, but in execution its that "then dont die" part that fails it... thing is, if you somehow stopped that it becomes unpunishable so, its a tough one.
Yeah, making it start before the lines finish appearing would be nice, on top of the obvious necessary nerf of reduced endlag. That'd really be all it needs, but a superjump dive similar to what Splashdown had (For an animation, imagine the Flipper Flopper but its a Reefslider shark) or just the ability to dive off ledges or activate mid-air would be really nice.
The fact that Reef can't even slightly turn baffles me, not to mention the heads up it gives the other team by showing a giant light trail to warn everyone you're about to slide in.
Splashdown was never gonna be easy to fix in Splatoon 2 but the best way I could've seen it getting fixed was to have the armour start up faster whilst making the overall special linger in the air about half a second longer so that players might have something to react too.
I think another thing to bring up about Splashdown v Reeflsider is that Splashdown doesn't add to your positioning. Reef takes you to new places. Splashdown would keep you in place while Reef adds to your movement. Really love Reefslider more.
Expanding on the "Reefslider x Superjump Splashdown", imagine they make your inkling Izuna Drop the shark for the Splashdown part. Not exactly practical but cool as hell.
Outside of the obvious flaw of bad endlag and startup mechanics, I think Reef could really use an increase to how long the explosion lingers, like Booyah bomb. It would create a smokescreen for a short while after exploding, lets say a whole second to be generous, and it would allow for you to slide in, explode, and then get out or approach from a different angle without the opponent seeing. Imagine a Tetra sliding in, blowing up, and then doing four rolls out at you from a random angle that you couldn't see due to the smokescreen, or an UCB actually getting some kit synergy by using the smokescreen time to set up two mines and/or get its shield up.
Wait a minute you might be onto something. We could make the smokescreen make sense because it's a vehicle. Though the endlag would still drag it down a bit
It's crazy, Reefslider went from "this special is INSANE, what am I supposed to do about this?!" to "oh i'm glad they clicked reefslider now i can kill them" in, like... a month's time from the game's launch. Also, you could've EASILY filled this video with some of the pre-buff Reefslider shenanigans. People used to SQUID ROLL THE EXPLOSION and just shoot the person who used it! And it used to have 60 damage which neutered half of the weapon combos!
The ability to super jump into the splashdown was honestly one of the most fun things to do in Splatoon 2. Too bad I got into the game near the end of its life... Giving the Reefsliderthr splashfoen jump would be pretty cool. Like, the player pulls out the shark and suplexes it into the ground.
My solution to the reef slider issue is to make so you jump off of it right before it explodes (immediately after you press the activation button). It would certainly be awesome to do at the very least. You could input were you would jump to too, simliar to the rolling caused by that one super jump upgrade you can get on your shoes. No inputs would just make you jump straight up and land in the explosion's center. Separate from that idea, just give the ability to slightly turn around while swimming. Nothing big, but something noticeable. Not a solution to the main issue, but it would increase it's ability to be unpredictable and deadly.
Ive seen clips of people dying using splashdown on a super jump. Like it was frame perfect bomb explosions, but the person died before hitting the ground, not evrn using the splashdown because a perfectly timed bomb killed them a frame before.
One of the biggest issues I see with USE of Reefslider is folks failing to recognize opportunities for it. You can't just think about being able to hit your target, but if the target is able to react to it, and if your end position will make you vulnerable. A lot of folks will slam the special only to have their opponent move because they had space and time to react to it, and then die in the end lag because they're left completely exposed. In addition to acting as an effective counter-special for many of the other specials in the game, it works great as a mobility aid that can get short-ranged weapons too far from a weapon that outranges it over to a protected position fast enough that they can then attack within the required timeframe. Cases where you would actually use the explosion itself to get splats is when enemies are barricaded in a position and have nowhere to run from the explosion radius, and opportunities of that kind present themselves often. If done right you'll ideally pressure enemies into taking defensive positioning in those very locations and then use Reefslider to finish the job because they're trapped within the fatal range of the explosion. All that said, it does need buffs, namely slightly reduced startup time to increase the range of opportunities that present themselves, the ability to destroy sub weapons, and either a full heal so you're not as vulnerable at the end, or lean into the "press stick to die" problem with a quick respawn effect so if you do die the penalty is lessened.
I use Reefslider as more of a "get out" Special than a "get in" one, at this point. I don't bother trying to get anyone with the explosion or trying to get into a fight with it, but it does a decent job at letting me *retreat* with the low startup lag - it's not good at fighting, but it does a decent job being invincible while I race for enough cover to regroup.
Taking this opportunity to once again throw out my idea to make reefslider good: just before the slider explodes there is a window where you are able to squid roll in any direction with the same amount of invincibility as before (but also the same amount of lag)
The image of pulling a Dr Strangelove ride down a Superjump on a Reefslider is too good to pass up. Also yeah, having less ending lag seems like it would help the special a lot.
Salmon Runner here. Reef is one of the weakest specials in SR due to all the reasons listed here. I would also add that it has a tendency to get "knocked off course" way too easily, rendering it useless. Positioning yourself where you'll get the most value out of your weapon (or special) is crucial for SR, so getting knocked off course, or even just getting "snagged" on a tiny ledge is devastating. You're only given 2 specials across 3 waves, so losing one due to a stupid accident is just... stupid. If you can pull it off though, it's still a great special for clearing swarms of lessers and bosses, making egg running safer.
I feel like they should just remove the endlag entirely, but to balance it out, they should make its paint like Splashdown and Booyah Bomb, where it doesnt fullt paint the area, to prevent the instant zone flip cheese. That way, it can still be used to paint the zone, but could be contested, like how you a Booyah Bomb can help flip a zone, but has counterplay. It would be worse at cheesing zones, but without the endlag, or with significantly reduced endlag, it would be so much better at what its actually meant to do.
I really wish the devs would embrace the splash down inspiration to reefslider by allowing the explosions to consume bombs and letting the user use it mid air/super jump.
An idea I had for Reefslider to have is maybe have an ink armor-esque ability after the explosion, protecting you briefly from being one shot, then after a second of the explosion, the ink armor fades.. Ink armor isn't a thing in three, and it would definitely help with it's survivability afterwards. To clarify, what I mean is that you use reefslider, the explosion happens, then after the explosion your are covered in a ink shield that prevents a couple shots from getting in or a bomb, but could still be bursted down quickly with other specials like stamp or inkjet.
I think the best way to use reefslider is for sneak attacks. Best case scenario, you see an enemy spreading ink down mid, you hide in some of your own ink until they're within range of your little puddle, and then POP! Literal sharking.
Here's what I thought could make it more useful: The outer biggest hitbox bubble now has a toxic mist effect for 60 frames after the explosion, transparent for the teammates, complete smoke screen for the opponents, unable to see past it, like the toxic mist bubble animation, but not transparent Reef slider user has less end lag, so they can mix it up and swim around the smoke screen, but if opponents predict the paths, they can splat them anyways
Let us turn/redirect the Reefslider OR make the end lag ~10 frames with an extra ~10-20 frames of invincibility BUT you can't shoot your weapon until those 10-20 frames have passed. It allows for a short period of repositioning after the explosion without giving you a free attack while invincible.
A rework of splashdown that I think could work would be “Belly Flop” You go up in the air for a bit keeping your movement momentum and then flop down on the ground making a shockwave like splashdown, after the special is over you continue your momentum and are put into either swim form instantly or have a short getup animation before your able to shoot. There would be time before the user hit the ground for avoidablility but not so much to make the special useless.
If they made it so you can leave the shark 0.5 seconds before it explodes (during the initial exploding animation) and if they let you keep the invincibility effect in those frames then you would be less vulnerable because you would be able to escape snipers or splash bombs and you would have more options.
I think what could be quite cool is after the slider explosion, a shield would pop up in the radius of the explosion. This would mean that your movements are still predictable, but it also allows you to act a bit more after the explosion. To kinda counterbalance this, the shield could be weak, and it could be not very tall, and only protect you from the sides.
I honestly got an idea for Slider: If you’re in the air after you activate it for ~30f you can explode onto the spot you hopped over. Would also like to see that also be usable on Super Jump, however with a longer delay after use, so it isn’t completely busted
I mean if the devs are so afraid why not try at least the impact of adding the long overdue bomb-destroyer the Reefslider lacks. Test that for 1 month and if there are new adjustments needed, do it after.
I always saw splashdown more as a quick painting tool rather than a way to score kills. I was kinda surprised when they reworked it into Reefslider because it lost a lot of it's instant utility which it already barely had.
How to fix slider; Muuuuuch shorter startup time or armor the instant the special is initiated. There is no “track” visible to the enemy team. There is no more end lag. It allows for aggressive plays that don’t end in a basically guaranteed death, while also still being very easily punishable.
What if to make reefslider valuable, it worked a bit like curling bomb. The less far it goes, the more the blast radius. And to buff splashdown, just make it jump a lot higher and take a lot longer to finish
Splashdown suffered from skill gain. It’s been around SO long that most people know how to look at the giant circle of death and just shoot the floating immobile dude in the middle.
Here's how I would fix reefslider: Allow you to transform into a squid immediately upon the explosion. It wouldn't stop the problem entirely, but it'd give the slider many more options rather than just dying right afterwards because they used their special.
As a Dapple Dualies Noveau main i rarely see anyone point out that the special most of the time does not work at all If you hug a corner, the special doesn’t affect you when it explodes. A lot of the time the special will explode and the enemy will stand there like nothing happened, and it doesn’t explode around corners. That’s the reason I don’t like Reefslider… the end lag is kind of whatever to me, it’s the fact that it feels like the special is a pretty-looking glitch 90% of the time
i think they should give you the ability to jump off at any point in the special with splashdown's height while still retaining the i-frames you'd get if you ended the special normally
I always thought the two specials had exact opposite design. Splashdown for some weapons you combo it AFTER using another attack, like a burst bombs into splashdown for vshot, a roller vertical into splashdown, and a torpedo into splashdown for clear dapples. For reefslider, you combo the reefslider damage BEFORE comboing with another attack, like how tetras dodge after activiting reef, some main weapons combo on their own, and undercover supposedly opens up its shield. Unfortunately, this doesnt apply for all weapons, and just some examples no more than the ones i listed.
I think what would be cool is if slider worked like the flipper floppers from salmon run with the ability to dive in and out of the ground. Give it 2-3 jumps with the final being an explosion. (Obviously don't give it the floppers area to paint over). It would provide agency with directional jumps, and would be less predictable.
Id like it if you could send out the shark by itself without having to ride by holding down the special button or you can ride it by just pressing the stick
Honestly as a super casual player who really hated facing Splashdown in 2 and died to it all the time, I genuinely see no problem with them letting reefslider actually live after the explosion. As long as there is startup time where if someone panic uses it mid fight you can still kill them, it should defo be allowed to actually live when it uses it from a safe location to get in, being an entry tool is what it should be!
the ultimate buff for reefslider: first of all no eng-lag, and a command that let you stay there after the explosion and with no lag and with the invencibility frames or a recall jump back to the start point, even a cancel option for the recall jumpo would be interesting so imagine in mid air you could start shooting or dodge roll in mid air with dualies, would make this special less garbage
Fun fact: Undercover meshes decently well with Reefslider. The massive hitbox gives a decent combo if you have good aim, and and the ability to shield yourself after the explosion is nice. The problem is that it’s Undercover: by the time you shoot, you’re dead.
I wonder if part of the reason why we got such cramped maps was to accommodate something like Reefslider. In general it's definitely the worst special, but it can be good when your team is already winning or you have enemies pinned down. But that's about it. Nobody wants their special weapon to be only occasionally useful.
In my opinion: 1. Strip its invincibility and make it launch the player in a direction of their choosing when it explodes, about the length of one squelcher dulie slide 2. Add an option for the player to bail with the reefslider still exploding at the end of its path 3. Add a small amount of steering, allowing the player to end up as much as one squelcher dulie slide to the right or left of the path This would give the player options without a frustrating i-frame issue. The bail option is essentially like throwing stamp, allowing the special to have an effect somewhere other than your player. The launching if you do stay on allows the player to escape bombs while still allowing for counterplay if the opponent knows where you are going. The steering allows the player to target moving players and escape potentially dangerous scenarios like a stamp, crab, or vacuum camping your launch or bail.
Easy fix for them: make it so Reefslider can turn and be directed, not on a linear line. Make it so splashdown instead rises up, and you can direct the splashdown in a limited radius. Also make it so both have better armour, which means give reef some armour. These specials are satisfying when used right, but they really are only good for single player stuff.
I think it would be cool if you had the option to sacrifice the ability to control where the reef slider stops in exchange for being able to jump off and it propel itself
Maybe slowing it down a bit and giving you a quasi instant recall ? That would change its use a lot, maybe focusing more on the paint than the splating, having it also paint along the slide, not just the explosion ?
The weirdest part to me is that splashdown in the splatoon 3 single player can't even splashdown from a superjump. You used to be able to do it from launch pads in splatoon 2 and in this game it's been nerfed despite the fact it's never gonna be in multiplayer
I remember being so excited to use splashdown in the single-player campaigns. Sadly, even the AI can easily shoot you out of the air. How the devs didn't see this as a problem right out of the gate I don't know.
I think Reefslider should be able to jump so it can clear small gaps and tiny walls. The ZL button could be used for that. Pressing and holding ZL causes the slider to submerge (indicator that it will jump) and releasing ZL makes you jump out of the ink and explode on impact.
Looking at Splashdown, if it's SUPPOSED to be a panic button, _It should function as a panic button,_ and the opponent's counterplay should result in "okay I'm not dead," likely by being "get out of the way." Reefslider doesn't really seem like it's supposed to be a panic button, though. Some ability to move but not shoot after it ends might reduce it's predictability, like jumping off of it in some kind of roll instead of just standing around after the explosion.
I think the player should leap off the reefslider at some point in the process. Not even necessarily in a recall way, make it more freeform and turn reef into a movement and utlility tool as well as an offensive one. This also allows you to leap forward rather than just backwards or away.
I really made this video and then they made another Splashdown LOL
Edit: They did a good job with this one, one day when I do a big special design video i'll talk about it.
i guess we know why they didn’t give reefslider a superjump option
I came back to this vid just to say that. lol
The new splashdown would’ve been so much cooler if, instead of fists, the other explosions were clones and you could swap between them freely to make you harder to shoot down and choose where to land a little.
Nintendo saw this and decided to shut you up xD
@@0mO493 same
I think it'd be excellent if Reefslider could use Drop Roller.
- It makes Drop Roller relevant on more weapons
- It lets those weapons survive after Reefslider
- Drop Roller gives movement buffs too, so it's perfect for following up the explosion
Imagine, you Reefslider, roll away from attacks into position, then use the extra mobility to follow up.
It's not a total fix but it'd help immensely.
That might be really cool and really fun I like it
@@TorayNixthey should do it for all transformation specials tbh
@@asianclicks3368 heh, not really sure about that tho
The other transformation specials doesn’t need that compared to Slider
@@TorayNix just an idea to make drop roller better
Drop roller gives an element of unpredictablability to the special and something to do during the endlag allowing for a seamless transition into gameplay
watch slider get a crazy buff that makes it meta next season !!
I'm not even joking it would be so funny if reefslider and stamp both got crazy mega buffs that instantly made them meta so the meta instantly began to revolve around idk Luneo, L-3 D, Tetras and S-Blast
@@sonicrunn3r895what about ink nouveau
@@JVSTG4L4XY Probably niche for a few maps
@@sonicrunn3r895Wiper go brrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Given the patch history of this game, I feel like this mythical buff that makes slider meta would be something like a damage radius buff, that makes its explosion so ridiculously large it outranges anything short of an unscoped splat charger.
Well, I'm ready to see the sequel video in a month.
You don’t have to wait long 😅
I’ve never cared that Splashdown was bad because it was fun when you used it right. Super jumping to teammates in firefights and splashdowning on them to help them was one of the most fun things to do!
Agreed. I like Splashdown way more than Reefslider
Never forget early on you could squid roll to survive reef's explosion before they massive buffed the damage to offset the armor. And don't get us started on how it still can't fizzle bombs out.
I really wish reefslider was more mobility focused. Getting to ride a shark for a few seconds while using your main weapon sounds so fun.
I know it was mentioned in the video but there's literally no reason for Reefslider to wait until touching the ground before startup. Even if the special itself needs proper buffs, my number one hope is that this trait is removed (or at the very least, make it so you can complete the startup middair and then go the moment you land)
my guess is that its to prevent players from accessing areas they're not supposed to be able to. if it had any forward momentum when going through the air, it could theoretically get into enemy spawn on some maps, and unlike inkjet or zipcaster, it doesnt have you return to your start position once the special is over, so you could stay in enemy spawn indefinitely.
@@lukehoffman9742 The startup is so long that you probably couldn’t get anywhere anyway though with the flatter verticality (MAYBE you could get somewhere on Flounder idk, still a bit tough to gauge because the spawn snipes are far enough from the heights). Plus my idea of just making it done the startup middair and then only move on landing still stands for what it SHOULD probably do
@@sonicrunn3r895 oh yeah, they 100% should do it that way, wasn't disagreeing with that. i was just speculating on the dev's reasons for not designing the special like that in the first place.
I have an idea, what if you could jump off of the Reefslider? Unlike detonating early the slider still goes the full distance but you just off and are in the air like after a squid surge
Another idea to add onto this: bailing off early would significantly reduce the explosion radius, sacrificing some of the special’s strength for reliability and safety. This would even help balance Zones cheese - if you want that instant flip, you have to fully commit and risk dying for it.
I also had this idea, was surprised when I saw someone else have the same idea :)
@@xraenon1664 Plus it could also work where you can jump off right before it explodes, it would still be predictable and vulnerable but it would allow for a mix up and dualies can quickly drop to the ground
from a salmon runner's perspective man i HATE reefslider, why is it so susceptible to knockback (from which you don't travel at all and just explode), and any slight elevation change (even on a small hill) means anything caught at point blank still manages to live... and even the SALMON can punish your endlag in that case
Or how it's not considered bomb damage despite exploding, so the Fly Fish just casually laughs at ya while throwing MLG missiles.
It's literally meant to be an anti stinger or anti eel, assuming Salmonids don't get too close for a free hit.
The rushing mode has more value than the exploding part, which for some salmon run situations is downright pathethic.
As a tetra dualies player, I seriously wish reefslider was better. I always die once the special ends... 😭
Dappler here and same. I die when the special starts too 🥲 Too much startup time…
You guys at least get to roll, me and my S-blast can barely ink my feet to flee 😭
@@hermitcrab5586you can just see me awkwardly attempting to swim away
Just make it give ink armor after use, or even invulnerability. It's meant to help you go in, but right now it doesn't have any follow up inherent to the special.
I always thought splashdown should work kinda like how super chump does, you activate it in safe land and fire yourself at the enemy. Then, hopefully, dont immediately die. Reefslider was basically that concept, but in execution its that "then dont die" part that fails it... thing is, if you somehow stopped that it becomes unpunishable so, its a tough one.
I love reefslider and splashdown so much, it's a shame they are too weak...
It's not weak by any means. It's just too vulnerable. You die more often for using it than kills you may get
@Whodjathink it is weak when the most it can do is predictable and counterable. Damage isn't an issue since they all do that
@@Trattt Which means it's too vulnerable, not really weak. When it works it's oh so nice. The problem is even when it works, you die anyway
It's not weak, you can hit a MASSIVE area at once. It's just that you are extremely vulnerable after the explosion.
I wish Reefslider was faster to activate, it takes a lot of time and I normally get splatted before I can start sliding.
Yeah, making it start before the lines finish appearing would be nice, on top of the obvious necessary nerf of reduced endlag. That'd really be all it needs, but a superjump dive similar to what Splashdown had (For an animation, imagine the Flipper Flopper but its a Reefslider shark) or just the ability to dive off ledges or activate mid-air would be really nice.
The fact that Reef can't even slightly turn baffles me, not to mention the heads up it gives the other team by showing a giant light trail to warn everyone you're about to slide in.
Splashdown was never gonna be easy to fix in Splatoon 2 but the best way I could've seen it getting fixed was to have the armour start up faster whilst making the overall special linger in the air about half a second longer so that players might have something to react too.
Slightly Decreases it's Staying in the air time like with the armor so it lands a bit faster like 3-5 frames it Really needs it
@@PenguinXD4 Problem with that is it makes it harder to react and get away from.
I think another thing to bring up about Splashdown v Reeflsider is that Splashdown doesn't add to your positioning. Reef takes you to new places. Splashdown would keep you in place while Reef adds to your movement. Really love Reefslider more.
Expanding on the "Reefslider x Superjump Splashdown", imagine they make your inkling Izuna Drop the shark for the Splashdown part.
Not exactly practical but cool as hell.
Needs to happen 👏😤
Outside of the obvious flaw of bad endlag and startup mechanics, I think Reef could really use an increase to how long the explosion lingers, like Booyah bomb. It would create a smokescreen for a short while after exploding, lets say a whole second to be generous, and it would allow for you to slide in, explode, and then get out or approach from a different angle without the opponent seeing. Imagine a Tetra sliding in, blowing up, and then doing four rolls out at you from a random angle that you couldn't see due to the smokescreen, or an UCB actually getting some kit synergy by using the smokescreen time to set up two mines and/or get its shield up.
Wait a minute you might be onto something. We could make the smokescreen make sense because it's a vehicle. Though the endlag would still drag it down a bit
It's crazy, Reefslider went from "this special is INSANE, what am I supposed to do about this?!" to "oh i'm glad they clicked reefslider now i can kill them" in, like... a month's time from the game's launch.
Also, you could've EASILY filled this video with some of the pre-buff Reefslider shenanigans. People used to SQUID ROLL THE EXPLOSION and just shoot the person who used it! And it used to have 60 damage which neutered half of the weapon combos!
The ability to super jump into the splashdown was honestly one of the most fun things to do in Splatoon 2. Too bad I got into the game near the end of its life...
Giving the Reefsliderthr splashfoen jump would be pretty cool. Like, the player pulls out the shark and suplexes it into the ground.
My solution to the reef slider issue is to make so you jump off of it right before it explodes (immediately after you press the activation button). It would certainly be awesome to do at the very least. You could input were you would jump to too, simliar to the rolling caused by that one super jump upgrade you can get on your shoes. No inputs would just make you jump straight up and land in the explosion's center.
Separate from that idea, just give the ability to slightly turn around while swimming. Nothing big, but something noticeable. Not a solution to the main issue, but it would increase it's ability to be unpredictable and deadly.
Ive seen clips of people dying using splashdown on a super jump. Like it was frame perfect bomb explosions, but the person died before hitting the ground, not evrn using the splashdown because a perfectly timed bomb killed them a frame before.
Oliy you my goat for using so much hat in time music
Prochara: Splashdown And Reefslider are awfully design
Devs: Let add fist 👊👊 to Splashdown
One of the biggest issues I see with USE of Reefslider is folks failing to recognize opportunities for it. You can't just think about being able to hit your target, but if the target is able to react to it, and if your end position will make you vulnerable. A lot of folks will slam the special only to have their opponent move because they had space and time to react to it, and then die in the end lag because they're left completely exposed.
In addition to acting as an effective counter-special for many of the other specials in the game, it works great as a mobility aid that can get short-ranged weapons too far from a weapon that outranges it over to a protected position fast enough that they can then attack within the required timeframe. Cases where you would actually use the explosion itself to get splats is when enemies are barricaded in a position and have nowhere to run from the explosion radius, and opportunities of that kind present themselves often. If done right you'll ideally pressure enemies into taking defensive positioning in those very locations and then use Reefslider to finish the job because they're trapped within the fatal range of the explosion.
All that said, it does need buffs, namely slightly reduced startup time to increase the range of opportunities that present themselves, the ability to destroy sub weapons, and either a full heal so you're not as vulnerable at the end, or lean into the "press stick to die" problem with a quick respawn effect so if you do die the penalty is lessened.
I use Reefslider as more of a "get out" Special than a "get in" one, at this point. I don't bother trying to get anyone with the explosion or trying to get into a fight with it, but it does a decent job at letting me *retreat* with the low startup lag - it's not good at fighting, but it does a decent job being invincible while I race for enough cover to regroup.
Taking this opportunity to once again throw out my idea to make reefslider good: just before the slider explodes there is a window where you are able to squid roll in any direction with the same amount of invincibility as before (but also the same amount of lag)
2:25 the phrasing of that made me laugh way more than I think I was supposed to.
The image of pulling a Dr Strangelove ride down a Superjump on a Reefslider is too good to pass up.
Also yeah, having less ending lag seems like it would help the special a lot.
Well now they're both here
The AHIT music is very pleasing
Salmon Runner here. Reef is one of the weakest specials in SR due to all the reasons listed here. I would also add that it has a tendency to get "knocked off course" way too easily, rendering it useless. Positioning yourself where you'll get the most value out of your weapon (or special) is crucial for SR, so getting knocked off course, or even just getting "snagged" on a tiny ledge is devastating. You're only given 2 specials across 3 waves, so losing one due to a stupid accident is just... stupid.
If you can pull it off though, it's still a great special for clearing swarms of lessers and bosses, making egg running safer.
I feel like they should just remove the endlag entirely, but to balance it out, they should make its paint like Splashdown and Booyah Bomb, where it doesnt fullt paint the area, to prevent the instant zone flip cheese.
That way, it can still be used to paint the zone, but could be contested, like how you a Booyah Bomb can help flip a zone, but has counterplay.
It would be worse at cheesing zones, but without the endlag, or with significantly reduced endlag, it would be so much better at what its actually meant to do.
I really wish the devs would embrace the splash down inspiration to reefslider by allowing the explosions to consume bombs and letting the user use it mid air/super jump.
"1 year ago huh. You aren't reefslider.."
An idea I had for Reefslider to have is maybe have an ink armor-esque ability after the explosion, protecting you briefly from being one shot, then after a second of the explosion, the ink armor fades.. Ink armor isn't a thing in three, and it would definitely help with it's survivability afterwards. To clarify, what I mean is that you use reefslider, the explosion happens, then after the explosion your are covered in a ink shield that prevents a couple shots from getting in or a bomb, but could still be bursted down quickly with other specials like stamp or inkjet.
I think the best way to use reefslider is for sneak attacks. Best case scenario, you see an enemy spreading ink down mid, you hide in some of your own ink until they're within range of your little puddle, and then POP! Literal sharking.
Here's what I thought could make it more useful:
The outer biggest hitbox bubble now has a toxic mist effect for 60 frames after the explosion, transparent for the teammates, complete smoke screen for the opponents, unable to see past it, like the toxic mist bubble animation, but not transparent
Reef slider user has less end lag, so they can mix it up and swim around the smoke screen, but if opponents predict the paths, they can splat them anyways
Let us turn/redirect the Reefslider OR make the end lag ~10 frames with an extra ~10-20 frames of invincibility BUT you can't shoot your weapon until those 10-20 frames have passed. It allows for a short period of repositioning after the explosion without giving you a free attack while invincible.
I’ve always said reefslider is the special with the most missed potential. It could be really good if you could survive after it
was just boping to the AHIT ost, need to rewatch it to hear what chara actually said
Ya know I actually forgot that Tacticooler gives max super jump, so thank you for reminding me about that as an Nzap 85 player.
I've already seen the main ideas I have for the special mixed into the comments, so instead, props to Oliy for the aHiT music & quality editing.
A rework of splashdown that I think could work would be “Belly Flop”
You go up in the air for a bit keeping your movement momentum and then flop down on the ground making a shockwave like splashdown, after the special is over you continue your momentum and are put into either swim form instantly or have a short getup animation before your able to shoot. There would be time before the user hit the ground for avoidablility but not so much to make the special useless.
If they made it so you can leave the shark 0.5 seconds before it explodes (during the initial exploding animation) and if they let you keep the invincibility effect in those frames then you would be less vulnerable because you would be able to escape snipers or splash bombs and you would have more options.
I think what could be quite cool is after the slider explosion, a shield would pop up in the radius of the explosion. This would mean that your movements are still predictable, but it also allows you to act a bit more after the explosion. To kinda counterbalance this, the shield could be weak, and it could be not very tall, and only protect you from the sides.
I honestly got an idea for Slider:
If you’re in the air after you activate it for ~30f you can explode onto the spot you hopped over.
Would also like to see that also be usable on Super Jump, however with a longer delay after use, so it isn’t completely busted
Give me ink armor that lasts 2 seconds after the special ends. That way I have 1 second to react or something.
I miss canceling peoples Splashdown's with charger 😔
I don’t
Guys
The stationary training room dummies are right there 💀 Also yeah its back
I mean if the devs are so afraid why not try at least the impact of adding the long overdue bomb-destroyer the Reefslider lacks.
Test that for 1 month and if there are new adjustments needed, do it after.
I always saw splashdown more as a quick painting tool rather than a way to score kills. I was kinda surprised when they reworked it into Reefslider because it lost a lot of it's instant utility which it already barely had.
How to fix slider;
Muuuuuch shorter startup time or armor the instant the special is initiated. There is no “track” visible to the enemy team. There is no more end lag. It allows for aggressive plays that don’t end in a basically guaranteed death, while also still being very easily punishable.
What if to make reefslider valuable, it worked a bit like curling bomb. The less far it goes, the more the blast radius. And to buff splashdown, just make it jump a lot higher and take a lot longer to finish
Splashdown suffered from skill gain. It’s been around SO long that most people know how to look at the giant circle of death and just shoot the floating immobile dude in the middle.
The devs really need to give Reefslider a substantial buff. Imagine some Reef weapons unlocking their potential/usefulness if the special was good.
Funny how reefslider is now a really good special
Here's how I would fix reefslider: Allow you to transform into a squid immediately upon the explosion. It wouldn't stop the problem entirely, but it'd give the slider many more options rather than just dying right afterwards because they used their special.
Yeah that’s exactly what everyone wants: the removal of the endlag
As a Dapple Dualies Noveau main i rarely see anyone point out that the special most of the time does not work at all
If you hug a corner, the special doesn’t affect you when it explodes. A lot of the time the special will explode and the enemy will stand there like nothing happened, and it doesn’t explode around corners.
That’s the reason I don’t like Reefslider… the end lag is kind of whatever to me, it’s the fact that it feels like the special is a pretty-looking glitch 90% of the time
i think they should give you the ability to jump off at any point in the special with splashdown's height while still retaining the i-frames you'd get if you ended the special normally
I always thought the two specials had exact opposite design. Splashdown for some weapons you combo it AFTER using another attack, like a burst bombs into splashdown for vshot, a roller vertical into splashdown, and a torpedo into splashdown for clear dapples. For reefslider, you combo the reefslider damage BEFORE comboing with another attack, like how tetras dodge after activiting reef, some main weapons combo on their own, and undercover supposedly opens up its shield. Unfortunately, this doesnt apply for all weapons, and just some examples no more than the ones i listed.
And yet, Splashdown and Reefslider are some of my favorites specials
I like reefslider not splashdown
Get well soon
@@Bodoque-yt3px heh?
@@coffee_2234 fair enough
I remember when i was scared of reef slider in the direct presentation and not scare at all about Vac what a world
I think what would be cool is if slider worked like the flipper floppers from salmon run with the ability to dive in and out of the ground. Give it 2-3 jumps with the final being an explosion. (Obviously don't give it the floppers area to paint over). It would provide agency with directional jumps, and would be less predictable.
3:00 patchouli knowledge jumpscare
thank you prochara for inking the turf
Id like it if you could send out the shark by itself without having to ride by holding down the special button or you can ride it by just pressing the stick
I hate panic buttons that are cheap so I’m glad it’s bad
Honestly as a super casual player who really hated facing Splashdown in 2 and died to it all the time, I genuinely see no problem with them letting reefslider actually live after the explosion. As long as there is startup time where if someone panic uses it mid fight you can still kill them, it should defo be allowed to actually live when it uses it from a safe location to get in, being an entry tool is what it should be!
Splashdown is at least useful in S2 Salmon Run while Reefslider is just straight up pathetic
the ultimate buff for reefslider: first of all no eng-lag, and a command that let you stay there after the explosion and with no lag and with the invencibility frames or a recall jump back to the start point, even a cancel option for the recall jumpo would be interesting so imagine in mid air you could start shooting or dodge roll in mid air with dualies, would make this special less garbage
We are about to see the battle of Garbage vs Garbage on Dec 1
Reeflsider should get a way so you can slightly turn it
Fun fact: Undercover meshes decently well with Reefslider. The massive hitbox gives a decent combo if you have good aim, and and the ability to shield yourself after the explosion is nice. The problem is that it’s Undercover: by the time you shoot, you’re dead.
Well well well...
I wonder if part of the reason why we got such cramped maps was to accommodate something like Reefslider. In general it's definitely the worst special, but it can be good when your team is already winning or you have enemies pinned down.
But that's about it. Nobody wants their special weapon to be only occasionally useful.
Splat 4: Reefdown
The flaw: it dies while the explosion
In my opinion:
1. Strip its invincibility and make it launch the player in a direction of their choosing when it explodes, about the length of one squelcher dulie slide
2. Add an option for the player to bail with the reefslider still exploding at the end of its path
3. Add a small amount of steering, allowing the player to end up as much as one squelcher dulie slide to the right or left of the path
This would give the player options without a frustrating i-frame issue. The bail option is essentially like throwing stamp, allowing the special to have an effect somewhere other than your player. The launching if you do stay on allows the player to escape bombs while still allowing for counterplay if the opponent knows where you are going. The steering allows the player to target moving players and escape potentially dangerous scenarios like a stamp, crab, or vacuum camping your launch or bail.
Easy fix for them: make it so Reefslider can turn and be directed, not on a linear line.
Make it so splashdown instead rises up, and you can direct the splashdown in a limited radius. Also make it so both have better armour, which means give reef some armour.
These specials are satisfying when used right, but they really are only good for single player stuff.
I think after it explodes you should instantly superjump back to where you activated it
Sorry Chara I didn't listen, I was too busy vibing to Rush Hour
I think it would be cool if you had the option to sacrifice the ability to control where the reef slider stops in exchange for being able to jump off and it propel itself
why the fuck is booyah bomb a better panic button than reefslider
I always thought it would be cool if you could curve your reefslider pathway and bounce off of walls. That would make for some crazy geometry kills
speakin of splashdown
Inner Agent 3 taught me that Splashdown wasn't good, unless you can superjump and use it three times in a row lol
Maybe slowing it down a bit and giving you a quasi instant recall ? That would change its use a lot, maybe focusing more on the paint than the splating, having it also paint along the slide, not just the explosion ?
The weirdest part to me is that splashdown in the splatoon 3 single player can't even splashdown from a superjump.
You used to be able to do it from launch pads in splatoon 2 and in this game it's been nerfed despite the fact it's never gonna be in multiplayer
lol
lmao even
A hat in time ost WOOOOO
I can tell he played A hat in time right before making this vid
Imagine if you could choose to jump out of the slider and then it explodes so you can react and get the explosion off for the combos
I remember being so excited to use splashdown in the single-player campaigns. Sadly, even the AI can easily shoot you out of the air. How the devs didn't see this as a problem right out of the gate I don't know.
It just needs some endlag shaved off and it’ll be a menace
What if they made reefslider paint like booyah bomb so it didn’t cheese zones as hard and then gave it another range buff?
nice to gear a hat in time music being used 🔥
I think Reefslider should be able to jump so it can clear small gaps and tiny walls. The ZL button could be used for that. Pressing and holding ZL causes the slider to submerge (indicator that it will jump) and releasing ZL makes you jump out of the ink and explode on impact.
Looking at Splashdown, if it's SUPPOSED to be a panic button, _It should function as a panic button,_ and the opponent's counterplay should result in "okay I'm not dead," likely by being "get out of the way." Reefslider doesn't really seem like it's supposed to be a panic button, though. Some ability to move but not shoot after it ends might reduce it's predictability, like jumping off of it in some kind of roll instead of just standing around after the explosion.
I think the player should leap off the reefslider at some point in the process. Not even necessarily in a recall way, make it more freeform and turn reef into a movement and utlility tool as well as an offensive one. This also allows you to leap forward rather than just backwards or away.
When we didn’t know that you could shoot down splashdown in the air that thing was broken
There was a time as well where netcode meant it couldn’t be shot down either too. Sadly that all ended in like 5.0
It wasn't just that people didn't know about it
Originally splashdown could sometimes not be canceled depending on the user's connection