This was a rare occasion where he seemed to really go for a record, I think because he'd seen Marree take his record earlier in the season by a small amount and felt a bit miffed about it.Capable of 3:28 at probably any time between 77-81 in my opinion, this is him at full stretch in 83.The crystal palace clash between Cram and Ovett in 83 is one of the all time great mile races. Ovett had a bad day tactically at the 83 worlds, as did most of them frankly!
I agree with almost everything you say. The conditions that day were apparently very windy. So with still conditions he may well have broken 3:30, and yes, he was past his peak in '83. Having said that, he was good enough to win the World Champs and finished the fastest. I'm not sure about 3:28 between 77 and 81, for the reason you mentioned yourself; he didn't enjoy running from the front, which is exactly what he'd have had to do to run 3:28. Having said that, transport a peak Ovett to some of those ridiculously fast paced races in the late 90's and I think he could have run 3:28. And it would have been clean.
People get carried away. If he'd pushed himself, I think he would have run 3:29 by the end of 1980. He would have run 3:26/3:27 in the modern era. Maybe faster.
When you watch his races, I don't think he didn't enjoy running at the front, he just wasn't interested in world records and fast times in the first half of his career. In one of his 1980 world records, he was leading from 500m from the finish. I think he could have done that more often, if he'd pushed for fast times. Winning was his main goal up to 1980. I think after 1980, he starting going for world records more. In his mile WR in 1981, he leads from about 460m from the finish. In one or his English Cross Country championship wins in the last 1970's, he won with a lead of allegedly about 80 meters.
I recently read Ovett's 1984 autobigraphy. He claims to have been in the best shape of his life before the '84 Olympics. It's a shame we never got a chance to see a true rematch of Coe and Ovett in LA.
@distance88 I'm sure he could go much faster too. In his bio he said he was capable of 3:27s for 1500m. I believe he could have held the world 800m record pre- Coe's 142.33 had he trained and raced for it in 1977-78. Awesome runner that he was, I don't believe Peter Elliot was more naturally gifted and he ran 1:42.9s at his peak.
Последний мировой рекорд великого бегуна,Особое уважение вызывает тот факт,что часть своих рекордов он установил выступая в советской майке.Он был очень независим и горд.Риети-кузница рекордов.В 1992 году Морсели пробежал здесь 328.86.Очень хотелось бы увидеть этот ролик.
Thankyou so much for posting - Ovett must have spent alot of time reflecting on this race when his career slid into ignominy (apart from 5000m at Commonwealth Games 1986) in later years. This must be his last world class performance.
Never seen this before, awesome very sad that this was the last hurrah of Steve Ovett,when you consider In my opinion, he was past his prime here, what would he have ran say from 1978 to 1981.Also a word for Seb Coe, when you consider he ran 3.29 when he was approaching the age when most atheletes are on the slide, what would he have ran say 1979 to 1981, before his illness troubles.
Hi Deano, I've just seen this. Great video. Very good narrative you've provided here too. Steve was a great athlete, a legend, and this proves it. I beleive this is a season or two after he injured himself while out training when he either ran into a railing or tripped on a drink can, I can't remember exactly. But he was never quite the same again after that one event. Nonetheless, to come back and run this fast was quite outstanding. [cotd]...
I don’t think he ever recovered from the collision with the railings and the chest infection he picked up in LA in 84 did for him, he was never the same again, aside from his 5000m in 86 at the Commonwealth in 86
@seanofafrica Elliott was at his absolute limit with 1:42.98. He was primarily an 800m runner for most of his career, whereas for Ovett it was always his 2nd event after 1976. After that time though, Ovett's basic 400 speed didn't improve. He was likely a 47 high 400 flat runner from 77 to 81, and then it dropped further. I'd say Elliott must have been around 47 high ability in 90. If Ovett had a few serious attempts at the 800 in 78-80 I think he could have run 1:43 low.
deano27671 he never attempted any type of record at 800. I think he could’ve broken 1.43. I loved to watch this guy run, he was so loose and (like Coe) he had that effortless high finish to each stride. Personally feel that if they’d raced each other (Ovett/Coe) over 1500 more regularly at their peak between 79-83 whoever was in front and kicked first between 120-150 metres out would be the winner. Ovett never quite got his consistency back after the railing injury. Knew a lad from the North East that trained in that area who seemed quite credible and knew a few of Cram’s entourage. They felt that Ovett eventually succumbed to an obsession with too much endurance training and his body kept falling apart after the ‘82 lay-off. Also, heard tell that Cram felt that he never truly ran the kick out of Ovett in that famous mile in ‘83...just that he kicked first. But he definitely felt he could out run Seb by kicking very early. Sad that Ovett never seemed to recover from ‘84. He looked wonderful in the Edinburgh 5,000 only to blow up in the Europeans that same year due to the heat. I was looking forward to two-three years of Ovett brilliance in 5,000 but it wasn’t to be.
Yeah this is an awesome video. I don't think much doubt that the late 70's Steve Ovett had some outrageous performance in him - something well under 3.30 for 1500m and sub 3.47 for the mile. This is also a cool vid because if you have ever read his autobiography he obviously mentions this race and how windy it was "tall trees bending over under the force of the wind" - I would have to say though checking out this vid and in particular the walk back round to the 1500m start after the race, not sure that wind was exactly howling ;)
all round. He couldn't run a 55.6 for the last lap in 1980 or 81 when he was beating the mile record up (he was running 58s). If he had, he would have run a 3:45 mile. So Ovett's bests could have been 3:28 for 1500 and 3:45 for the mile. I reckon Coe's bests could also have been about the same. This video tells another interesting parallel. Ovett and Coe's PBs for the 1500 were set on the same Rieti track! Ovett here in '83, 3:30.77; Coe, in '86, in 3:29.77 - 1.00 sec faster!
Funny how Coe & Ovett both recorded their best ever 1500 times at Rieti, seems to be a choice of distance athletes over the years with Morceli (1500, mile), Rudisha (800), Komen (3000), hell even Powell ran a 100 record there a few years back.
He ran into the railings in December 1981,Sam labourer a 2 18 marthron runner was with him, he had an operation on it ,is debatable how much that injury effected him,I think he was capable of going faster than the 3 30 he did in Diego 1983
Ooooooooooh my......... at EXACTLY 2:28 an athlete narrowly avoids catastrophic proportions!!!!!! By what??? A second...after all these years and I only just noticed...WOW!!!!!!!! THIS stupid move could have cost history vastly.....THE FANTASTIC STEVE OVETT!!!!!!!!
completely agree-his running style is just not the same and yet he gets a world record. the 83 world champs he was coming off injuries/not confident and yet the race was still his to take but he was all over the place running off the track and yet still 4th not far behind,awful tactically.the ovett-the cram race-ovett had some strange thoughts sometimes-to take cram on after those races in x amount of days was bonkers-but its still my favourite race,cram won fair and square but two winners that day for sure.ovett could/should really have gone 3:28 which would have wound coe up no end-and then who knows where the record might have ended up-im going to stick my neck out here and say coe or ovett would still be world record holder today
Steve Ovett, one of my all-time sport heroes! I love the personality of this man. Would realy like to know what he could have achieved on the clock from 800m to 5000m. Maybe at 800m he was close to his capabilities, but in the other events I`m sure he could have done faster than he has. Deano: Ingelheim is in Germany, not Norway...
That DAY in Moscow with a 50'5 last lap ovett was capable of 1:42 !!!!!! DEFINITELY!!!!!!! AFTER 40 YEARS STILL THE FASTEST LAST LAP IN INTERNATIONAL COMPETITION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 4O YEARS???????
@@keinKlarname 40 years ago the WORLD RECORD was 1.41.7. Ovett had only run 1:44'0 COES 800m time averaged 50.8_50'9 @ OVETTS on average would have been 52_52 @ to go from a 55 first lap to 50.5 40 YEARS ago is some serious exellaration...we all know rudishas splits from 2012 !!!!!!! The fact that ovett sped up so quickly over the last 4oom and hasn't been beaten 40years means he was capable of alot faster than his 1:44 from 1978 and beating sebastian Coe by 3metres PROVED that ..not definitely "_DEFINITELY !!!!!!! SEB COE WAS OVER A SECOND AND A HALF FASTER THAN ANYONE ELSE IN THE WORLD AT THAT STAGE ALBERTO JUANTORENA 1:43'40 IF DAVID RUDISHAS HAD RUN A SECOND AND A HALF QUICKER THAN THE NEXT BEST..HIS OWN 1:41'01 HE WOULD HAVE RUN 1:39,2 THAT'S HOW FAR AHEAD COE WAS RUDISHAS TIME IS PHENOMENAL....... BUT HOW FAR AHEAD OF WILSON KIPKETER WAS HE IN THE END ????THREE TENTHS OF A SECOND (WILSON RAN 1:41'2) COMPARED TO SEBS 1.7 SECONDS@
@@keinKlarname not definitely DEFINITELY SEBASTIAN C0E AND STEVE OVETT 40 YEARS AGO WERE THE MODULE OF MECHANICAL ENGINEERING EFFICIENCY definitely.......................................
@@simonedwards5564 The WR was 1:42.3 Ovett has run 1:44.1 Coe was not over 1.5 seconds faster than anyone else at that stage (1.1 seconds) Ovett was capable of running faster than he did in Moscow (1:45.40) How fast? Pure specualtion. Rudisha was not 3 tenths faster than Rudisha.
Now for some comparisons, when Coe ran his 3:31.95 in Cologne in 1981, he had a terrible hare who took him out in 54.3 and 1:49.8 ish to 800. By 1200, Coe on his own got there in 2:49.13, almost exactly the same time as Ovett here. So Ovett screamed round the last lap here, while Coe was treading water, over two seconds slower! For Coe, it was always claimed he had the poorer pace makers, and true some were really bad, but he did not do himseld any favours. Ovett was much, much stronger [cotd].
Does anyone recall how new of this Rieti run was first announced in the UK? I think David Icke was hosting snooker and they cut away from the snooker and showed a picture of Ovett. There was, I believe no video - or maybe there was.
Yes, that is correct, the photo they showed was at least a colour one of Overtt in these racing colours, although it may have been taken at an earlier date. I think it was a Sunday afternoon Grandstand or equivalent show. Ovett's technique is so good to watch here
That in itself cost him c2.5sec. Coe hit 800 in 1:49.1(not 1:49.8) which is suicidal & meant there was no way the WR could be broken. He hit 1200 in 2:48.32, 0.8 faster than Ovett in Rieti. I'm not quite sure what you mean by,"Coe did himself no favours"? It wasn't his fault he had such diabolical pacing. The fact that Coe still managed to be within 0.6 of the then WR (Ovett's 3:31.36) at the end of that Stockholm race shows what incredible endurance he had. It was basically a solo training run.
@fitzieo1 Yes, I wrote almost exactly what you've just said on LetsRun yesterday. I posed the question why he declined so rapidly after 84. Was it the LA respiratory problems, was it psychological or did he not care anymore? All very sad. I remember him being routinely beaten by younger UK runners of modest ability from 85 onwards and thinking how unfair it was. He would have slaughtered them in his prime. I think many took Ovett & Coe for granted, thinking we'd have lots more!
@@rogerfederer8117 Facts suggest otherwise. Coe was ranked #1 in UK for both 800 and 1500m in 89, ran the second fastest 800m in the world that year and won a silver after being marginally beaten by the reigning world Champion (and impeded by him) in the World Cup 1500m. In 88 he was faster than Elliott over 800m, only 0.03 behind the silver medalist, Cruz, and had beaten the Olympic Champ (Ereng) twice in Europe prior to the Olympics. He ran faster over 1500m in 88 than the Olympic Champ, Rono, and beat him the following summer. There is enough evidence there to strongly suggest Coe, with 7 more weeks of training from the trials to the Olympics, would have been in shape to contest for medals in both events, as he had done in Moscow, LA and Stuttgart.
@@rogerfederer8117 "but he sure as hell was not competitive with the world's best." More nonsense. Coe trounced both Kiprotich and Libet in Berne, both of whom had run 1:43's that year and both of whom were in the World's top 10 rankings. Kiprotich had also beaten Ereng twice in 88 and finished 0.01 behind Ereng 3 days before being thrashed by Coe. So, he was certainly still mixing with and beaten the top guys.
While 0.2 diff looks negligible as a stand alone stat, it takes on more significance when you consider Cram had an uncluttered run on the rails running just 400m. Ovett however, ran wide on the penultimate bend after bell, had to navigate through traffic & even had to run a section of the back straight on the infield. He probably covered c404m, meaning it was equivalent to c 51.4 on rails. That's 0.7 quicker than Cram. Conclusion, had Ovett been on Cram's shoulder at bell, he would have won.
The other attempt was in Zurich 84, when the 1st lap was perfect, 55.1 for Coe, but then the rabbit (Robinson, again!) dropped the pace to 60.8 on the 2nd lap. Finally in Rieti 86, Coe's 1st lap was too fast, 54.0, then he was isolated (no drafting) on 2nd lap, but he managed to up pace on 3rd, 56.1, & despite running wide on penultimate bend, missed the WR by 0.3!
I feel sad watching this - was it really Ovett's last notable performance at 1500m? He said he was in good shape for LA - did he have any pre or post olympic runs? Does this Rieti run suggest Ovett could and should have won in Helsinki. Looking at that race he does not seem to be significantly closing on Cram in the last 100M.
@AlanBurtonSinger Yes, it's a good read. The fact he could run a 1:44 with all the health troubles he had goes to show he must have been in v. good shape. We'd certainly have got a 1,2,3 in the 1500m.
I think Ovett was not confident of his fitness going into Helsinki, reading his autobio he had loads of injury setbacks in races leading up to the WC's
Thanks for your messages. You got a few of the stats wrong, I'm afraid. Coe's 3:31.95 was in Stockholm not Cologne. He didn't go through 400 there in 54.3 (which is still a bit fast), he went past in 52.4! which is WR pace for 1000m. The hare went through in 51.5. By 200m the rabbit, Robinson, was already 4m ahead of Coe, and by 400 it was 8m. This means that Coe was in a vacuum, with no drafting whatsoever, from 200m to the end.
Just to re-iterate. Coe was "on his own" from 200 onwards. The pace maker (51.5, 1:47.4!) was too far ahead after 200m to be of any benefit in terms of drafting. If you even out Coe's splits in Stockholm for economic pacing & take into account that drafting to the bell (which is what most record runs receive) is worth 0.5sec per lap, one can claim that Coe's performance there was worth around 3:28.3. It is by far the best 1500 or Mile performance from anyone in the 1980's.
@@djc0108 I got it a bit wrong.; He is the most prolific WR holder at 1500m and 1 mile, since WW2: 3 at 1500m and 2 at 1 mile.. 5 in all. someone else set 6: 3 at 1500m and 3 at 1 mile.
Francis Hooton I didn’t think that he had a current world record, but there’s no denying how great he was, with advancements in diet, training, track, etc...he would have been a force in any era. Amazing talent and I loved watching all his races !! 👍
@@djc0108 I had thought he was the most prolifiv 1500m and mile world recorder holder in history. He is 2nd rank. 5 in all. I agree with you. ,He could have beaten everyone now.. Harder better training. better diet. better medical back up. i think he could have beaten the current 1500m and mile WR holder HeG all the time. I think Ovett had more weapons. He could kick(sprint) off any pace, whether form 100 to go or 500 m to go. I n 2 of his WRs, he kicks of world record pace, with 100m to go and wins.
Francis Hooton I think he could have gone close on El-G’s records but am not sure if he would have broken them. I do think Ovett would have beaten today’s athletes with the improvements listed. El-G was incredibly talented but I also strongly suspect his world records were helped by the use of epo....it was prevalent around that time and El-G mysteriously decided to quit athletics at the peak of his career when more stringent epo testing came in. Coupled with the fact that his records haven’t been broken in many years despite advancements, the fact that he was hardly ever out of breath at the end of his races (could probably have gone faster himself) and other athletes from Morocco at the time using EPO, HGH etc (Eg. Said Aouita), it’s more than likely that El-G’s Records weren’t clean.....he also said in one of his interviews that he had to win at all costs - read into that how you like. I am still a fan of El-G but not naive enough to think all of his records were done clean. I don’t think there was any suspicion that Ovett doped.
Yes, he should have won in Helsinki, but he chose that race to run his worst tactical performance ever. It was as bad as Coe's awful tactics in the moscow 800 and the European 1500 in 86. No, Ovett didn't really close on Cram in the last 100, but that's because by then he'd used up all his finish in the previous 300 trying to get back in touch. Ovett's last 400 split was the fastest of the field's, 51.9, compared to Cram's 52.1.
All of Coe's WR attempts at 1500 were poorly paced. He had 4 serious attempts, including the Stockholm race. The first, where he broke the WR in 79, was too fast in early stages, with Coe running first 200 in 25.9 & 400 in 54.3. The 2nd lap was 58.9. That's a 4.6 sec difference! He then had to run around the pace maker with 800 to go, so received no help or drafting on the 3rd lap.
Hopefully, the new "pace light system" will see better organised attempts in the future...and maybe by a Brit. There are some very promising athletes out there.
You can't claim Ovett was stronger because he ran a 55.6 last lap on a 3:30.77 compared to Coe's 58.6 in a 3:31.95. They were totally different races in terms of pace distribution. It's no surprise Coe only managed 58 in that race. Ovett would have been slower. In Coe's 3:29.77 (which also had less favourable pacing than Ovett's 3:30.77) Coe ran 54.0 for 1st lap then 58.0 for 2nd. His last 400 was 55.2, faster than Ovett's last lap off a pace 1 sec slower & with better distribution of pace.
Aveva una tecnica di corsa piu' di forza rispetto a Coe e Cram,decisamente piu' eleganti e piu' belli da vedere. Bei tempi,quelli.Altro che gli scimmioni dopati di oggi..........
This was a rare occasion where he seemed to really go for a record, I think because he'd seen Marree take his record earlier in the season by a small amount and felt a bit miffed about it.Capable of 3:28 at probably any time between 77-81 in my opinion, this is him at full stretch in 83.The crystal palace clash between Cram and Ovett in 83 is one of the all time great mile races. Ovett had a bad day tactically at the 83 worlds, as did most of them frankly!
I agree with almost everything you say. The conditions that day were apparently very windy. So with still conditions he may well have broken 3:30, and yes, he was past his peak in '83. Having said that, he was good enough to win the World Champs and finished the fastest. I'm not sure about 3:28 between 77 and 81, for the reason you mentioned yourself; he didn't enjoy running from the front, which is exactly what he'd have had to do to run 3:28. Having said that, transport a peak Ovett to some of those ridiculously fast paced races in the late 90's and I think he could have run 3:28. And it would have been clean.
People get carried away. If he'd pushed himself, I think he would have run 3:29 by the end of 1980. He would have run 3:26/3:27 in the modern era. Maybe faster.
Agree, but I also think the same can be said of Coe.
I agree.
When you watch his races, I don't think he didn't enjoy running at the front, he just wasn't interested in world records and fast times in the first half of his career. In one of his 1980 world records, he was leading from 500m from the finish. I think he could have done that more often, if he'd pushed for fast times. Winning was his main goal up to 1980. I think after 1980, he starting going for world records more. In his mile WR in 1981, he leads from about 460m from the finish. In one or his English Cross Country championship wins in the last 1970's, he won with a lead of allegedly about 80 meters.
wow i waited 28 years to see this., thanks
I recently read Ovett's 1984 autobigraphy. He claims to have been in the best shape of his life before the '84 Olympics. It's a shame we never got a chance to see a true rematch of Coe and Ovett in LA.
Glorious days....... very proud to have run in the same race as him and got suitably slaughtered
@distance88 I'm sure he could go much faster too. In his bio he said he was capable of 3:27s for 1500m. I believe he could have held the world 800m record pre- Coe's 142.33 had he trained and raced for it in 1977-78. Awesome runner that he was, I don't believe Peter Elliot was more naturally gifted and he ran 1:42.9s at his peak.
Последний мировой рекорд великого бегуна,Особое уважение вызывает тот факт,что часть своих рекордов он установил выступая в советской майке.Он был очень независим и горд.Риети-кузница рекордов.В 1992 году Морсели пробежал здесь 328.86.Очень хотелось бы увидеть этот ролик.
Thankyou so much for posting - Ovett must have spent alot of time reflecting on this race when his career slid into ignominy (apart from 5000m at Commonwealth Games 1986) in later years. This must be his last world class performance.
Ignominy???? Nothing shameful or dishonourable about his later career.
@@MrGranfield yep,,,what a bizarre phrase to use !
If only Steve Ovett could have run like that in Helsinki and LA!?!
Never seen this before, awesome very sad that this was the last hurrah of Steve Ovett,when you consider In my opinion, he was past his prime here, what would he have ran say from 1978 to 1981.Also a word for Seb Coe, when you consider he ran 3.29 when he was approaching the age when most atheletes are on the slide, what would he have ran say 1979 to 1981, before his illness troubles.
And that railing in Brighton....
Hi Deano, I've just seen this. Great video. Very good narrative you've provided here too. Steve was a great athlete, a legend, and this proves it. I beleive this is a season or two after he injured himself while out training when he either ran into a railing or tripped on a drink can, I can't remember exactly. But he was never quite the same again after that one event. Nonetheless, to come back and run this fast was quite outstanding. [cotd]...
Coke can was Cram. Railings was Ovett!
I don’t think he ever recovered from the collision with the railings and the chest infection he picked up in LA in 84 did for him, he was never the same again, aside from his 5000m in 86 at the Commonwealth in 86
Very true.
@seanofafrica Elliott was at his absolute limit with 1:42.98. He was primarily an 800m runner for most of his career, whereas for Ovett it was always his 2nd event after 1976. After that time though, Ovett's basic 400 speed didn't improve. He was likely a 47 high 400 flat runner from 77 to 81, and then it dropped further. I'd say Elliott must have been around 47 high ability in 90. If Ovett had a few serious attempts at the 800 in 78-80 I think he could have run 1:43 low.
deano27671 he never attempted any type of record at 800. I think he could’ve broken 1.43. I loved to watch this guy run, he was so loose and (like Coe) he had that effortless high finish to each stride. Personally feel that if they’d raced each other (Ovett/Coe) over 1500 more regularly at their peak between 79-83 whoever was in front and kicked first between 120-150 metres out would be the winner. Ovett never quite got his consistency back after the railing injury. Knew a lad from the North East that trained in that area who seemed quite credible and knew a few of Cram’s entourage. They felt that Ovett eventually succumbed to an obsession with too much endurance training and his body kept falling apart after the ‘82 lay-off. Also, heard tell that Cram felt that he never truly ran the kick out of Ovett in that famous mile in ‘83...just that he kicked first. But he definitely felt he could out run Seb by kicking very early. Sad that Ovett never seemed to recover from ‘84. He looked wonderful in the Edinburgh 5,000 only to blow up in the Europeans that same year due to the heat. I was looking forward to two-three years of Ovett brilliance in 5,000 but it wasn’t to be.
Ovett ran a 21.7 200m.... I think he'd do 45.8 400M...
One wonders what Ovett could have achieved between 1978 and 80. Sub 3:30 for sure.
Glorious stride had Ovett
Yeah this is an awesome video. I don't think much doubt that the late 70's Steve Ovett had some outrageous performance in him - something well under 3.30 for 1500m and sub 3.47 for the mile. This is also a cool vid because if you have ever read his autobiography he obviously mentions this race and how windy it was "tall trees bending over under the force of the wind" - I would have to say though checking out this vid and in particular the walk back round to the 1500m start after the race, not sure that wind was exactly howling ;)
I just looked at Ovett winning at Bislett over 1500M in 1984 - he doesn't look to me like the Ovett of 80/81.
Were there also world class track meets at Sestriere in the Italian Alps during the mid to late 80s & early 90s??
all round. He couldn't run a 55.6 for the last lap in 1980 or 81 when he was beating the mile record up (he was running 58s). If he had, he would have run a 3:45 mile. So Ovett's bests could have been 3:28 for 1500 and 3:45 for the mile. I reckon Coe's bests could also have been about the same. This video tells another interesting parallel. Ovett and Coe's PBs for the 1500 were set on the same Rieti track! Ovett here in '83, 3:30.77; Coe, in '86, in 3:29.77 - 1.00 sec faster!
Funny how Coe & Ovett both recorded their best ever 1500 times at Rieti, seems to be a choice of distance athletes over the years with Morceli (1500, mile), Rudisha (800), Komen (3000), hell even Powell ran a 100 record there a few years back.
Ovett's last great run.
He ran into the railings in December 1981,Sam labourer a 2 18 marthron runner was with him, he had an operation on it ,is debatable how much that injury effected him,I think he was capable of going faster than the 3 30 he did in Diego 1983
Ooooooooooh my......... at EXACTLY 2:28 an athlete narrowly avoids catastrophic proportions!!!!!! By what??? A second...after all these years and I only just noticed...WOW!!!!!!!! THIS stupid move could have cost history vastly.....THE FANTASTIC STEVE OVETT!!!!!!!!
completely agree-his running style is just not the same and yet he gets a world record. the 83 world champs he was coming off injuries/not confident and yet the race was still his to take but he was all over the place running off the track and yet still 4th not far behind,awful tactically.the ovett-the cram race-ovett had some strange thoughts sometimes-to take cram on after those races in x amount of days was bonkers-but its still my favourite race,cram won fair and square but two winners that day for sure.ovett could/should really have gone 3:28 which would have wound coe up no end-and then who knows where the record might have ended up-im going to stick my neck out here and say coe or ovett would still be world record holder today
Steve Ovett, one of my all-time sport heroes! I love the personality of this man.
Would realy like to know what he could have achieved on the clock from 800m to 5000m. Maybe at 800m he was close to his capabilities, but in the other events I`m sure he could have done faster than he has.
Deano: Ingelheim is in Germany, not Norway...
That DAY in Moscow with a 50'5 last lap ovett was capable of 1:42 !!!!!! DEFINITELY!!!!!!! AFTER 40 YEARS STILL THE FASTEST LAST LAP IN INTERNATIONAL COMPETITION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 4O YEARS???????
@@simonedwards5564 Rudisha has averaged faster over two laps.
No, not definitely. DEFINITELY.
@@keinKlarname 40 years ago the WORLD RECORD was 1.41.7. Ovett had only run 1:44'0 COES 800m time averaged 50.8_50'9 @ OVETTS on average would have been 52_52 @ to go from a 55 first lap to 50.5 40 YEARS ago is some serious exellaration...we all know rudishas splits from 2012 !!!!!!! The fact that ovett sped up so quickly over the last 4oom and hasn't been beaten 40years means he was capable of alot faster than his 1:44 from 1978 and beating sebastian Coe by 3metres PROVED that
..not definitely "_DEFINITELY !!!!!!! SEB COE WAS OVER A SECOND AND A HALF FASTER THAN ANYONE ELSE IN THE WORLD AT THAT STAGE ALBERTO JUANTORENA 1:43'40 IF DAVID RUDISHAS HAD RUN A SECOND AND A HALF QUICKER THAN THE NEXT BEST..HIS OWN 1:41'01 HE WOULD HAVE RUN 1:39,2 THAT'S HOW FAR AHEAD COE WAS RUDISHAS TIME IS PHENOMENAL....... BUT HOW FAR AHEAD OF WILSON KIPKETER WAS HE IN THE END ????THREE TENTHS OF A SECOND (WILSON RAN 1:41'2) COMPARED TO SEBS 1.7 SECONDS@
@@keinKlarname not definitely DEFINITELY SEBASTIAN C0E AND STEVE OVETT 40 YEARS AGO WERE THE MODULE OF MECHANICAL ENGINEERING EFFICIENCY definitely.......................................
@@simonedwards5564
The WR was 1:42.3
Ovett has run 1:44.1
Coe was not over 1.5 seconds faster than anyone else at that stage (1.1 seconds)
Ovett was capable of running faster than he did in Moscow (1:45.40)
How fast? Pure specualtion.
Rudisha was not 3 tenths faster than Rudisha.
Now for some comparisons, when Coe ran his 3:31.95 in Cologne in 1981, he had a terrible hare who took him out in 54.3 and 1:49.8 ish to 800. By 1200, Coe on his own got there in 2:49.13, almost exactly the same time as Ovett here. So Ovett screamed round the last lap here, while Coe was treading water, over two seconds slower! For Coe, it was always claimed he had the poorer pace makers, and true some were really bad, but he did not do himseld any favours. Ovett was much, much stronger [cotd].
Does anyone recall how new of this Rieti run was first announced in the UK? I think David Icke was hosting snooker and they cut away from the snooker and showed a picture of Ovett. There was, I believe no video - or maybe there was.
Yes, that is correct, the photo they showed was at least a colour one of Overtt in these racing colours, although it may have been taken at an earlier date. I think it was a Sunday afternoon Grandstand or equivalent show. Ovett's technique is so good to watch here
Last 400m in 55.1
Last 300m in 41.63
Last 100m in 13.3
That in itself cost him c2.5sec. Coe hit 800 in 1:49.1(not 1:49.8) which is suicidal & meant there was no way the WR could be broken. He hit 1200 in 2:48.32, 0.8 faster than Ovett in Rieti. I'm not quite sure what you mean by,"Coe did himself no favours"? It wasn't his fault he had such diabolical pacing. The fact that Coe still managed to be within 0.6 of the then WR (Ovett's 3:31.36) at the end of that Stockholm race shows what incredible endurance he had. It was basically a solo training run.
@fitzieo1 Yes, I wrote almost exactly what you've just said on LetsRun yesterday. I posed the question why he declined so rapidly after 84. Was it the LA respiratory problems, was it psychological or did he not care anymore? All very sad. I remember him being routinely beaten by younger UK runners of modest ability from 85 onwards and thinking how unfair it was. He would have slaughtered them in his prime. I think many took Ovett & Coe for granted, thinking we'd have lots more!
@@rogerfederer8117 Facts suggest otherwise. Coe was ranked #1 in UK for both 800 and 1500m in 89, ran the second fastest 800m in the world that year and won a silver after being marginally beaten by the reigning world Champion (and impeded by him) in the World Cup 1500m. In 88 he was faster than Elliott over 800m, only 0.03 behind the silver medalist, Cruz, and had beaten the Olympic Champ (Ereng) twice in Europe prior to the Olympics. He ran faster over 1500m in 88 than the Olympic Champ, Rono, and beat him the following summer. There is enough evidence there to strongly suggest Coe, with 7 more weeks of training from the trials to the Olympics, would have been in shape to contest for medals in both events, as he had done in Moscow, LA and Stuttgart.
@@rogerfederer8117 "but he sure as hell was not competitive with the world's best." More nonsense. Coe trounced both Kiprotich and Libet in Berne, both of whom had run 1:43's that year and both of whom were in the World's top 10 rankings. Kiprotich had also beaten Ereng twice in 88 and finished 0.01 behind Ereng 3 days before being thrashed by Coe. So, he was certainly still mixing with and beaten the top guys.
It was towards the end of Sunday Grandstand. I don't think they showed the full race, just the last lap.
While 0.2 diff looks negligible as a stand alone stat, it takes on more significance when you consider Cram had an uncluttered run on the rails running just 400m. Ovett however, ran wide on the penultimate bend after bell, had to navigate through traffic & even had to run a section of the back straight on the infield. He probably covered c404m, meaning it was equivalent to c 51.4 on rails. That's 0.7 quicker than Cram. Conclusion, had Ovett been on Cram's shoulder at bell, he would have won.
The other attempt was in Zurich 84, when the 1st lap was perfect, 55.1 for Coe, but then the rabbit (Robinson, again!) dropped the pace to 60.8 on the 2nd lap. Finally in Rieti 86, Coe's 1st lap was too fast, 54.0, then he was isolated (no drafting) on 2nd lap, but he managed to up pace on 3rd, 56.1, & despite running wide on penultimate bend, missed the WR by 0.3!
I remember seeing coe time on the news.and I was shocked and disappointed he missed the record by a 10 also,i think he was surprised by that time
I feel sad watching this - was it really Ovett's last notable performance at 1500m? He said he was in good shape for LA - did he have any pre or post olympic runs? Does this Rieti run suggest Ovett could and should have won in Helsinki. Looking at that race he does not seem to be significantly closing on Cram in the last 100M.
Quite possibly, especially coming in the wake of the church railings incident at the end of 81 and being out for most of 82 as well.
Ovett injured his knee in 1981 well before the world record here
@AlanBurtonSinger Yes, it's a good read. The fact he could run a 1:44 with all the health troubles he had goes to show he must have been in v. good shape. We'd certainly have got a 1,2,3 in the 1500m.
I think Ovett was not confident of his fitness going into Helsinki, reading his autobio he had loads of injury setbacks in races leading up to the WC's
Thanks for your messages. You got a few of the stats wrong, I'm afraid. Coe's 3:31.95 was in Stockholm not Cologne. He didn't go through 400 there in 54.3 (which is still a bit fast), he went past in 52.4! which is WR pace for 1000m. The hare went through in 51.5. By 200m the rabbit, Robinson, was already 4m ahead of Coe, and by 400 it was 8m. This means that Coe was in a vacuum, with no drafting whatsoever, from 200m to the end.
@yellcarreon You're welcome. I think I have Ovett's Commonwealth 5k. I'll get round to it soon.
Just to re-iterate. Coe was "on his own" from 200 onwards. The pace maker (51.5, 1:47.4!) was too far ahead after 200m to be of any benefit in terms of drafting. If you even out Coe's splits in Stockholm for economic pacing & take into account that drafting to the bell (which is what most record runs receive) is worth 0.5sec per lap, one can claim that Coe's performance there was worth around 3:28.3. It is by far the best 1500 or Mile performance from anyone in the 1980's.
I challenge you to run 3:28 for a 1500m, rather than just speculating.
I'd say 3:28.8 -3:29.5 in ideal conditions.
it isn't windy barely. the flag barely flutters at 4.05
He still holds a world record in 2018
Francis Hooton What’s the world record ?
@@djc0108 I got it a bit wrong.; He is the most prolific WR holder at 1500m and 1 mile, since WW2: 3 at 1500m and 2 at 1 mile.. 5 in all. someone else set 6: 3 at 1500m and 3 at 1 mile.
Francis Hooton I didn’t think that he had a current world record, but there’s no denying how great he was, with advancements in diet, training, track, etc...he would have been a force in any era.
Amazing talent and I loved watching all his races !! 👍
@@djc0108 I had thought he was the most prolifiv 1500m and mile world recorder holder in history. He is 2nd rank. 5 in all. I agree with you. ,He could have beaten everyone now.. Harder better training. better diet. better medical back up. i think he could have beaten the current 1500m and mile WR holder HeG all the time. I think Ovett had more weapons. He could kick(sprint) off any pace, whether form 100 to go or 500 m to go. I n 2 of his WRs, he kicks of world record pace, with 100m to go and wins.
Francis Hooton I think he could have gone close on El-G’s records but am not sure if he would have broken them.
I do think Ovett would have beaten today’s athletes with the improvements listed.
El-G was incredibly talented but I also strongly suspect his world records were helped by the use of epo....it was prevalent around that time and El-G mysteriously decided to quit athletics at the peak of his career when more stringent epo testing came in.
Coupled with the fact that his records haven’t been broken in many years despite advancements, the fact that he was hardly ever out of breath at the end of his races (could probably have gone faster himself) and other athletes from Morocco at the time using EPO, HGH etc (Eg. Said Aouita), it’s more than likely that El-G’s Records weren’t clean.....he also said in one of his interviews that he had to win at all costs - read into that how you like.
I am still a fan of El-G but not naive enough to think all of his records were done clean.
I don’t think there was any suspicion that Ovett doped.
@Philcher69 This is actually my comment. I was logged on with a friend's profile at the time by mistake. Sorry!
Yes, he should have won in Helsinki, but he chose that race to run his worst tactical performance ever. It was as bad as Coe's awful tactics in the moscow 800 and the European 1500 in 86. No, Ovett didn't really close on Cram in the last 100, but that's because by then he'd used up all his finish in the previous 300 trying to get back in touch. Ovett's last 400 split was the fastest of the field's, 51.9, compared to Cram's 52.1.
@yellcarreon I've now uploaded the entire 5000m from the 86 Commonwealths on here.
All of Coe's WR attempts at 1500 were poorly paced. He had 4 serious attempts, including the Stockholm race. The first, where he broke the WR in 79, was too fast in early stages, with Coe running first 200 in 25.9 & 400 in 54.3. The 2nd lap was 58.9. That's a 4.6 sec difference! He then had to run around the pace maker with 800 to go, so received no help or drafting on the 3rd lap.
Hopefully, the new "pace light system" will see better organised attempts in the future...and maybe by a Brit. There are some very promising athletes out there.
@roger3594 I've just uploaded Ovett's 1500m win in the 81 World Cup. Not sure the nationality of the commentators, but its all there!
You can't claim Ovett was stronger because he ran a 55.6 last lap on a 3:30.77 compared to Coe's 58.6 in a 3:31.95. They were totally different races in terms of pace distribution. It's no surprise Coe only managed 58 in that race. Ovett would have been slower.
In Coe's 3:29.77 (which also had less favourable pacing than Ovett's 3:30.77) Coe ran 54.0 for 1st lap then 58.0 for 2nd. His last 400 was 55.2, faster than Ovett's last lap off a pace 1 sec slower & with better distribution of pace.
Aveva una tecnica di corsa piu' di forza rispetto a Coe e Cram,decisamente piu' eleganti e piu' belli da vedere.
Bei tempi,quelli.Altro che gli scimmioni dopati di oggi..........
He hit some church railings while out training in December 81.