I normally depend on riding mates telling me when things 'look wrong' or a quick few selfie videos. 99% of the time it is about seat height whilst pedalling and changing small increments normally sorts this. The other 1% of the time, it tends to be seat angle and then reach and handlebar placement. As more and more brands go DTC this is the sort of service which would be awesome in your LBS - particularly with e-bikes where some of the 'inefficiencies' in fit are counteracted by the support of the motor (and yes I am looking at the riders with seats slammed, legs akimbo riding in boost....)
self fit if you can call it that asked a friend to take pictures of me sideways, had should and arm pain for years never really did anything until i bought a one size smaller ebike M instead of L and then I had to care about it because on the 1st ride got lower back pain for 7 days swapped dropper for a longer one, swapped bar for a 75mm riser which I tought was too much until I learned 155mm cranks were a thing and because ebikes only care about cadence i swapped those too and was glad I had a high handlebar as short cranks require to raise everything, leave level or lower bars for road cycling it's awful on mtb I also now can lift my front wheel going downhill something I couldn't do with regular cockpit and that is a huge problem before a drop (and no more rear end pain btw stiff saddles are ok as long as you sit at the correct coordinates I found out)
to be fair a bike fit has no point outside of cross country aka "real mountain biking" it's to optimize pedaling flat or uphill which dh doesn't care about you're a moving part in DH while bike fitting is assuming a static rider it also depends on your use i have a fox 38 170mm and I still set my ebike like an XC one because I don't have a lift I need to go up before down ;) what I did was swap the dropper so I have more range between optimal pedaling and as low as it can go for dh
@@IdrisFashan i enjoyed the experience. I found it interesting and learnt some stuff. But the bar roll was way too much. My weight was too far forward.
When I collected my current bike when it was new in 2022, I opted for a level 2 Retul bike fit, and that was very helpful. About a month ago I made an appointment for a fitment checkup. Minor adjustments were made based on my rider feedback and rechecking measurements. My bike feels even better now, and I got confirmation that the saddle on the bike is the correct one for my sit bones. Money well spent!
I had a bike fit last year and it definitely improved my on bike comfort. It's money well spent. I wish there was a formula for figuring out the perfect bar width.
Yeah I'm a big believer in a good bike fit - bar width is an interesting one - your bike fitter might be able to help steer you to your optimised width window? Cheers Owen
Thinking about bike fit from many other aspects that have nothing to do with faster, quicker, harder, longer: Less pain, is always better. Less fatigue, is always better. More enjoyable time riding is better. Less physical struggle to ride whatever preferred places and distances one wants to ride, is better. Some people may not be aware that riding a bicycle doesn't have to produce pain in the wrists, in the knees, in the butt, in the shoulders or neck. And best of all, it may not even cost that much to fix it. Your current bicycle might have the adjustability built in, without having to spend money on fancy aftermarket parts.
Yes - being more comfortable on bike is underrated - and yes bike fits don't have cost the earth - the ROI for fun and enjoyment is amazing! Cheers Owen
The problem is the bias of who's doing the fit. Are you setting up a XC, trail, enduro or downhill? You need a different fit for those. Like for me I can't do the large frame with a super short stem, it feels wrong but that's the modern fit.
good info on the cleats on my XC bike I have road shaped shoes like in this video but having bought larger Northwave Enduro Mid 2 shoes something seemed off with the cleat positioning they are awesome but as most reviews say they are hot, fine for pedaling at north european 0°C 32°F probably too hot if you're in Texas
Wanted to get a bike fit, but the only local guys that do it kept asking me about my "power and performance goals" and I wanted "what is my bike size" and "make it, so I don't injure myself pedaling and stuff don't hurt"
Fantastic video. Yes! We need to take the time to fit our bikes to our individual bodies. How else can we become one with our beloved machines that let us conquer the trails?
Bike fit has to do with the seated position. So if you are riding trails with longer climbs and/or flatter trails it comes in handy for comfort and efficiency. I’d also say it helps in slow tech sections. I have bad knees. A general bike fit helped me reduce and elevate knee pain by putting me in a better riding position.
Absolutely, the word cycling is speaking of the wheels or crank spinning, and that means sitting and spinning, traditionally. But that's where the power is coming from. Obviously, but it's about the body mechanics as much as the frame sizing and cockpit fit.
I think they closer than you might think If you're un-fit but in a great position you'll make the most of your power and performance and pedal in comfort too - whereas if you're just fit - you might just be wasting watts and be uncomfortable in the un-optimise position. Cheers Owen
It would be a major investment here in the United States whether it's health care or sports medicine as mentioned in this video. If there is an opportunity this country will rob you. So for me a bike fit for me is just get out and ride.thanks Owen for the vid looking forward to more
Some of yall commenting are just funny. Yes, if you are riding mostly downhill, jump and enduro style trails, a bike fit is probably a waste of money. Bike fits benefit the seated position. If you have longer climbs, ride flatter trails, or spend long days in the saddle (besides riding XC) a mtb bike fit can be beneficial. Also a good shop will offer different levels (and pricing) on a bike fitting. Mine does a free basic fit, a mid level fit, and a detailed fit (mostly for road bikes)
It depends on the trainer you use, there are some really high-tech trainers out there. There are 'smart bikes' that you can buy for home use like the Wahoo KICKR Bike, which will have all the adjustments you need. Or you can use your bike attached to a turbo trainer. It's rare that you will find something with full adjustment at the Gym as changing the bike to your fit every time will take too long so they settle for basic adjustments. Hope this helps? 👍
One of the most important points for me was the fore and aft position of the saddle. That's where the accent of the instructor jumbled it up and did not explain the alignment between the knee and the pedal contact point clearly. I'm not sure what part was too close to the handlebar, the knee or the foot point on the pedal. The point to clarify is whether the pedal contact point should be directly under the knee or fore or aft?
Sorry for the lack of clarity on the knee position section. Knee positioning used to focussed on K.O.P.S - Knee over Pedal spindle. The KOPS has pro's and cons and some fitters don't like it - but can be very useful tool to help create a tighter window of fit. Whilst we talk about knee - its a good example of how connect the body is - as we're looking to align the cleats thus the feet and knees - which pulls the hips into place. This where we're using a plum-bob over the knee to hang through a virtual line that sits between the first and last metatarsal - aka toes - this is a way of find the "ball of the foot" The between position has changed over time - and where we did want a mid point many fitters look for a more rewards position for the cleats for us mountain bikers gives a more planted feel - and also can reduce the loading on the calf muscles - so now more and more roadies are using this more reward position too. Happy to chat more about this . Cheers Owen
A "professional " 🙄 mtb fit is UNECESSARY. Outside of setting saddle height, fore-aft, tilt, bar roll, spacer height and control setup, ZERO reasons to go to some self-proclaimed schmo...charging outrageous money to fit a rider on a bike DESIGNED to have the rider constantly moving- around the bike. It's a f vck ing DYNAMIC activity. 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
There are that many variations in the human skeletal and ligament structure, not only from person to person but in one persons structure alone, that this obsessive adjustment and measurement based on the location of a few contact points is frankly....a load of nonsense! I have had several knee dislocations in my younger years I MTB G5s and G6s every other day, always pedal up, average ride length is 15 to 20 km with 1000m of altitude. Never get knee pain. Cycling is less stressful on the body than swimming.
Have you ever had a bike fit? Did it help at all?
I normally depend on riding mates telling me when things 'look wrong' or a quick few selfie videos. 99% of the time it is about seat height whilst pedalling and changing small increments normally sorts this. The other 1% of the time, it tends to be seat angle and then reach and handlebar placement.
As more and more brands go DTC this is the sort of service which would be awesome in your LBS - particularly with e-bikes where some of the 'inefficiencies' in fit are counteracted by the support of the motor (and yes I am looking at the riders with seats slammed, legs akimbo riding in boost....)
self fit if you can call it that asked a friend to take pictures of me sideways, had should and arm pain for years never really did anything until i bought a one size smaller ebike M instead of L and then I had to care about it because on the 1st ride got lower back pain for 7 days swapped dropper for a longer one, swapped bar for a 75mm riser which I tought was too much until I learned 155mm cranks were a thing and because ebikes only care about cadence i swapped those too and was glad I had a high handlebar as short cranks require to raise everything, leave level or lower bars for road cycling it's awful on mtb I also now can lift my front wheel going downhill something I couldn't do with regular cockpit and that is a huge problem before a drop (and no more rear end pain btw stiff saddles are ok as long as you sit at the correct coordinates I found out)
Yes i did. It helped a lot. The best 150€ that i spent.
I had a bike fit. The guy set my enduro bike like a cross country bike. I had changed all his adjustments he did before i even left the carpark.
to be fair a bike fit has no point outside of cross country aka "real mountain biking" it's to optimize pedaling flat or uphill which dh doesn't care about you're a moving part in DH while bike fitting is assuming a static rider it also depends on your use i have a fox 38 170mm and I still set my ebike like an XC one because I don't have a lift I need to go up before down ;) what I did was swap the dropper so I have more range between optimal pedaling and as low as it can go for dh
That sounds more like a you problem than a fit problem. 😅
@ not really, he pushed the bars so far forward, i was endanger of going OTB in the carpark lol
@ oh snap. That’s pretty ugly!
Admittedly, doing everything on a stationary system those first couple kms are key.
@@IdrisFashan i enjoyed the experience. I found it interesting and learnt some stuff. But the bar roll was way too much. My weight was too far forward.
When I collected my current bike when it was new in 2022, I opted for a level 2 Retul bike fit, and that was very helpful. About a month ago I made an appointment for a fitment checkup. Minor adjustments were made based on my rider feedback and rechecking measurements. My bike feels even better now, and I got confirmation that the saddle on the bike is the correct one for my sit bones. Money well spent!
Great to hear!
I had a bike fit last year and it definitely improved my on bike comfort. It's money well spent. I wish there was a formula for figuring out the perfect bar width.
Yeah I'm a big believer in a good bike fit - bar width is an interesting one - your bike fitter might be able to help steer you to your optimised width window?
Cheers
Owen
Thinking about bike fit from many other aspects that have nothing to do with faster, quicker, harder, longer:
Less pain, is always better.
Less fatigue, is always better.
More enjoyable time riding is better.
Less physical struggle to ride whatever preferred places and distances one wants to ride, is better.
Some people may not be aware that riding a bicycle doesn't have to produce pain in the wrists, in the knees, in the butt, in the shoulders or neck.
And best of all, it may not even cost that much to fix it. Your current bicycle might have the adjustability built in, without having to spend money on fancy aftermarket parts.
Yes - being more comfortable on bike is underrated - and yes bike fits don't have cost the earth - the ROI for fun and enjoyment is amazing!
Cheers
Owen
I love that youre part of GAMBN Tech team, you make the videos so entertaining.
The problem is the bias of who's doing the fit. Are you setting up a XC, trail, enduro or downhill? You need a different fit for those.
Like for me I can't do the large frame with a super short stem, it feels wrong but that's the modern fit.
good info on the cleats on my XC bike I have road shaped shoes like in this video but having bought larger Northwave Enduro Mid 2 shoes something seemed off with the cleat positioning
they are awesome but as most reviews say they are hot, fine for pedaling at north european 0°C 32°F probably too hot if you're in Texas
Wanted to get a bike fit, but the only local guys that do it kept asking me about my "power and performance goals" and I wanted "what is my bike size" and "make it, so I don't injure myself pedaling and stuff don't hurt"
Fantastic video. Yes! We need to take the time to fit our bikes to our individual bodies. How else can we become one with our beloved machines that let us conquer the trails?
I can’t see how a bike fit is compatible with a dropper post and flat pedals…. I move my body around to suit the terrain
Bike fit has to do with the seated position. So if you are riding trails with longer climbs and/or flatter trails it comes in handy for comfort and efficiency. I’d also say it helps in slow tech sections. I have bad knees. A general bike fit helped me reduce and elevate knee pain by putting me in a better riding position.
Absolutely, the word cycling is speaking of the wheels or crank spinning, and that means sitting and spinning, traditionally. But that's where the power is coming from. Obviously, but it's about the body mechanics as much as the frame sizing and cockpit fit.
Clipless and Ergon saddles ftw
More important than a better bike fit is being more fit for the bike!
I think they closer than you might think
If you're un-fit but in a great position you'll make the most of your power and performance and pedal in comfort too - whereas if you're just fit - you might just be wasting watts and be uncomfortable in the un-optimise position.
Cheers
Owen
It would be a major investment here in the United States whether it's health care or sports medicine as mentioned in this video. If there is an opportunity this country will rob you. So for me a bike fit for me is just get out and ride.thanks Owen for the vid looking forward to more
Some of yall commenting are just funny. Yes, if you are riding mostly downhill, jump and enduro style trails, a bike fit is probably a waste of money. Bike fits benefit the seated position. If you have longer climbs, ride flatter trails, or spend long days in the saddle (besides riding XC) a mtb bike fit can be beneficial. Also a good shop will offer different levels (and pricing) on a bike fitting. Mine does a free basic fit, a mid level fit, and a detailed fit (mostly for road bikes)
Well said, with riding downhill and jumps a bike fit is much less important. But you still need a bike that fits 🤘
About 30 years of riding has been my bike fit...doesn't mean it's right.
How does this transfer over to bike trainers vs the stationary bikes at a gym
It depends on the trainer you use, there are some really high-tech trainers out there. There are 'smart bikes' that you can buy for home use like the Wahoo KICKR Bike, which will have all the adjustments you need. Or you can use your bike attached to a turbo trainer. It's rare that you will find something with full adjustment at the Gym as changing the bike to your fit every time will take too long so they settle for basic adjustments. Hope this helps? 👍
One of the most important points for me was the fore and aft position of the saddle.
That's where the accent of the instructor jumbled it up and did not explain the alignment between the knee and the pedal contact point clearly. I'm not sure what part was too close to the handlebar, the knee or the foot point on the pedal.
The point to clarify is whether the pedal contact point should be directly under the knee or fore or aft?
Sorry for the lack of clarity on the knee position section.
Knee positioning used to focussed on K.O.P.S - Knee over Pedal spindle.
The KOPS has pro's and cons and some fitters don't like it - but can be very useful tool to help create a tighter window of fit.
Whilst we talk about knee - its a good example of how connect the body is - as we're looking to align the cleats thus the feet and knees - which pulls the hips into place.
This where we're using a plum-bob over the knee to hang through a virtual line that sits between the first and last metatarsal - aka toes - this is a way of find the "ball of the foot"
The between position has changed over time - and where we did want a mid point many fitters look for a more rewards position for the cleats for us mountain bikers gives a more planted feel - and also can reduce the loading on the calf muscles - so now more and more roadies are using this more reward position too.
Happy to chat more about this .
Cheers
Owen
@@OwenBikeNerdThank you for the excellent explanation 👍
@@maldridge7630 Very Happy to help - great to help out!
Cheers
Owen
Have to think that was a cross-country bike fit. Didn't see anything about proper stem length determination.
Beware! Research the bike fitter before you spend your hard earned money!
1:48 ".... a bare experience". See how ridiculous it sounds when you don't pronounce "t's" ?
A "professional " 🙄 mtb fit is UNECESSARY. Outside of setting saddle height, fore-aft, tilt, bar roll, spacer height and control setup, ZERO reasons to go to some self-proclaimed schmo...charging outrageous money to fit a rider on a bike DESIGNED to have the rider constantly moving- around the bike. It's a f vck ing DYNAMIC activity. 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
Unlike roadie robots... road biking is a mostly static activity. Semi dynamic at best. 🙄
There are that many variations in the human skeletal and ligament structure, not only from person to person but in one persons structure alone, that this obsessive adjustment and measurement based on the location of a few contact points is frankly....a load of nonsense!
I have had several knee dislocations in my younger years I MTB G5s and G6s every other day, always pedal up, average ride length is 15 to 20 km with 1000m of altitude.
Never get knee pain.
Cycling is less stressful on the body than swimming.
That formula inseam in mm X 0.883 is nowhere close for me.....and did have a bike fit, but later on when from 165 mm cranks to 135 mm.
First🎉