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No Power on a Cordless DRILL - Tea Break Fix
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- Опубліковано 11 чер 2021
- Hi, in this longest ever 'Tea Break Fix' video I look at a drill sent in by Mike. It was working fine one day and nothing the next day.
I now have a PO box here in the UK, so if you would like to send something in that MAY be featured in a repair video, then here is the address. No items will be returned, so only send it in if it is of no value to yourself.
PO Box 2597
Watford
WD18 1HT
UK
I don't think couriers send to PO boxes so in the UK it would need to sent via Royal Mail.
Remember that this is just for entertainment and I am not an expert in these repairs. The processes in the video may not be the best way, the correct way or the safest way to fix these things. I do love fault finding and trying to fix broken things, so I hope that comes across in this 'Trying to FIX' series. Many thanks, Vince.
Initially, when connecting the power supply, you got a small arc. So, this faulty switch shorted the input when not depressed. For the rest, it seemed to work properly. When the battery was connected it gone into short protection.
When you connected the Li-ion cells straight to the drill's input, the short got burned up and the spring got heat-damaged. So, probably the spring caused the initial problem. Maybe it bent out of shape and shorted some conductors next to it. Dissect the old switch and look for evidence of arcing and heat damage.
So, initially, the battery was in the overcurrent protection state: the MOSFETs disconnect the load. The BMS was still passing a small current, for checking if the short would be still present. That small current is only enough to light the LED.
Usually, the BMS resets itself to normal operation after a while, unless the short circuit is still detected. Or maybe your shorting action caused a reset.
Since you replaced the switch, I think, this device is now safe to use.
But you should still test if the BMS's safeties are still working properly:
If battery is almost empty, it should stop working abruptly. If you can still 'use' this drill until the motor slows down to a crawl without load, the protection circuit is broken and the battery should be discarded. Don't try to fix, the cells are probably internally damaged at this point and can get dangerous if you try to recharge them.
Short protection: connect some car headlight bulbs up in a way that you have 4 filaments in parallel. Connect that to the output of the battery. The filaments should not light up. Or, just short the battery's terminals using an unfused/cheap 20A multimeter, and see if it cuts the current. While doing this, have snips handy, so you can quickly cut the wire between the cells and the BMS in case this goes very wrong.
Another thing to do, to increase battery longevity and net capacity: manually balance the cells. This BMS seems to be not doing any balancing: it just stops charging all cells if one reaches 4.2 volts. In order to balance the cells, you should fully charge this battery with the included charger. Then, with your multimeter, measure all cells individually. Then, with your power supply set at 4.20V, 0.5A, you bring the voltage of the lower cells up to the voltage of the highest. This might take a while, per cell. Don't speed it up by increasing the voltage or current limiter. Be extra careful with the polarity: the 4V of a charged 18650 will win over the reversed 4V of your power supply with ease and you'll be doing a 'trying to fix' on your power supply.
What an interesting post... Vince has a great community
I love the fact you show all the mishaps as well as the final outcomes. Thanks Vince
Haha! Nice impromptu spot welder! Didn't expect that!
Its because the protection circuit on the negative side of the battery was faulty and when you arking/sparkle and weld the wire, you burn it out completely and now you just have negative short and you measure straight 20V from the battery, but the charging control on the positive side is OK so it charges normally, but no short protection on BMS PCB (that is what the monitoring PCB is called and that is why it is connected to every single battery junction). Then that arking/sparkling (that event acts like oscillator and may generate thousents of volts in this unstable condition) burn out the transistor (or Triac/Thyristor) in switch. When battery is loaded, the current may peak up to 15 Amps or more depending on drill load, so voltage will drop to 18V and even less (Ohms law), that is why the switch was rated at 20A. Maybe there was also primary fault in the switch. Any other questions? :D
I tend to agree with you on this one. I wouldn't trust the BMS now either as there is a potential for further arking and a catastrophic fire occurring. The BMS should be replaced.
@@rdp8545 Because BMS now does not have max load protection, huge load on the batteries can set the whole drill on fire, there is nothing to "unhook the power" when critical condition is acheived. I edited a bit my previous post so now is more accurate.
@@ErrorMessageNotFound Now this is nonsense, or should I say insufficient knowledge. I am sure that you are not familiar with bad consequences for MOSfets or bipolar transistors under arking conditions, also you need to consider capacitive charges, peak currents and voltages, when sparkling occurs there are dozens of bad anomalies that happens. That board is not meant to be a welding inverter, if it was, all conditions would be well calculated for that purpose. That protection is not made for strong arking rather than overcurrent conditions. Nobody will invest in industrial well calculated power supply on cheap drill so it will last longer, consider this too.
Again, thank you for sharing your wisdom technixbul. I knew the viewers like yourself would have all the answers 👍👍👍
@@Mymatevince Well i don't know all answers, but it happens to know those and a lot more answers. I am sure you'll agree that many things you can't find on google, but your and of the people around you experience will give you those priceless hidden answers.
Battery was in over current protection mode. When you welded the leads to the drill, the dead short caused a voltage drop low enough to reset the protection mode. You could just disconnect battery leads from charging PCB to reset.
The reason the battery was in protection mode is because the mosfet in the trigger had failed. It cooked the spring when you shorted it, because you bypassed the protection circuit.
I agree
Having read most of the comments, this appears to be the most plausible.
If not MOSFET then maybe the spring displaced and shorted.
But if something was broken with the trigger, why did it work properly with bench power supply?
@@Mobin92 it wasn't working properly with the PSU. Vince noticed the speed was 'ramping up", that was the first sign. Also the brake wasn't working. If Vince looked at the voltage of the PSU while running the drill he would have noticed the voltage drop would have been too high. Because his PSU limited the current to 1.6amps it didn't blow, but when he wired the drill directly to the battery pack it had full correct available and then it blew.
Totally awesome job in getting it fixed, I have no ideas but I am just here to cheer you on every video. Can't wait for more.
You don't often have me grinding my teeth in terror Vince. As a vaper and having seen what happens when these batteries go ballistic when shorted, this video made me uneasy. You've got balls of steel old bean.
From what I've heard the difference between 18v and 20v are mainly marketing - no real technical difference. Here in the US we mainly see 18v/20v as the standard for most consumer brands found at big box stores - I've built decks around my large backyard shed all with an 18v Ryobi cordless drill screwing 2 1/2 inch deck screws for hours on end - of course I had to rotate through batteries but with about 3 being charged and in use you could go pretty much all day. Glad to see you gave it some new life Vince - as always really enjoy the content.
Great video Vince, I love it how you shorted it back to life some how.
More TBF like this !!! Many thanks for great content dear Vince.
I don't usually take 30 minutes for tea, but when Vince says it's a tea break, there's no arguing!
Bloody he'll I just about jumped out of my skin with those sparks. I remember my mum was trying to fix a broken power cord on an old hoover junior. She cut through the cord when it was still plugged into the mains. She was nearly blown to kingdom come lol 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Very useful. I've got one of those drills that appears to have a faulty switch. It actually failed the first time I used it, but I never got round to returning it and it's out of guarantee now, so one day I'll take it apart now I know what to expect! I've also got a 12v Aldi drill, which has been massively overworked because this one is faulty, but it's taken all the DIY work I've thrown at it without complaint. It's only got one battery, but has a fast charger so is ready for use again after a tea break! I bought the 18v one because it wasn't much more expensive than buying a second battery for the 12v one, and it came with two batteries!
What a powerful little drill. And you saved it from the pile. Well, after a sparkling event😂 It was very interesting.
Very nice video. The button was shorted. The BMS stops the current in case of a short circuit and recovers when the battery is connected to the charger. After the short circuit disappeared, the battery operated normally. After replacing the defective button, the drilling machine is in perfect working condition.
I love your persistence and interest and your dedicating time to repair. If only more people would do this we might have a cleaner world rather than always dumping stuff that doesnt work any more. Of course problem is to charge a fee for such repairs means an expensive fix and particularly if you need to risk buying a sub part and expecting it really will fix the root cause eg pcb repairs at component level. . But great fun for the hobbyist repairer person and a great way to learn and improve. I do similar myself.
I LOVE the son calling on the phone from upstairs LOLOLOL that was hilarious, Sir Vince of the Castle
i found it rather sad, is this how lazy kids are nowadays? i was shocked but im old so meh !
Ooh another drill fix you have so got this vince
Crackin fix and video, mate! Cheers
i cant of been the only person thinking you was going to drill in to the porch again :) i remember seeing those drills in aldi
nice one vince ... partially fix a drill and teach us to weld .im a long time viewer and fan of your work . keep it up .
A solar eclipse at night? sounds like fun Vince.Good video.
excellent video vince my guess is you gave the drill a good looking over and when you mentioned the my mate vince massive the drill got a shock and started working lol :) crazy
loved that comment about your son calling from upstairs as if you were living in a castle 🤣🤣
Nice One Vince, enjoyable video
I think the charging and protection controller got reset because of the short/overload. The short/overload made the voltage supplied to it drop to zero, so it lost its memory. Just guessing.
i was thinking that also
Yeah had xbox 360 charge and play kit not holding a good charge sparked the positive and negative and it worked better than it was though not really 100% but close enough anyway. Did that to an old Nokia battery too wasn't working, worked after shorting for less than 5 seconds!
I believe that the charge controller was keeping things "safe" based on the differences in the cells half a volt difference may have been enough to be a "no go" between the charge controller contacts and the tool. Lots of videos out on UA-cam on how to charge cells individually by bypassing the charge controller - that could be dangerous if it's done and there is a low cell - I think that when the tool shorted something on the controller circuit or when you attempted to bypass the charge controller directly to the tool it brought other cells down to a similar voltage and that allowed them to be charged successfully.
You are the best mate !
Nice fix 👍🏻
hahaha Nice Vince. A half hour Tea Break Fix video, I was thinking you might blow it up after your email and when you decided to try welding it i thought i was right :D
By the way Vince, when me and the wife watched the other drill test on the 4" block of wood I told her that my Aldi drill would do it no problems at all and have just been vindicated lol.
It was a great tool and it made an interesting video ;)
Thanks Mike, it looks like there have been plenty of answers to the questions in the video. Thanks for sending it in. Apologies that I couldn't get it fixed properly but at least we had a bit of unintentional welding🤣🤣
@@Mymatevince The important thing is that it made an interesting video :)
Most likely it was a faulty trigger with a short accross it when not pressed in, when you powered it off your bench psu it would have gone into CC mode until you pressed the trigger then it ran, this short would have caused the bms in the battery to shut down explaining the low voltage, when you directly connected the batterys to the drill that dead short would pulled the batterys voltage down so much the bms would have very little voltage across it causing it to reset.
Just a thought but if the spring is part of the circuit it could be the over current heated it up so much it make it contract and affected the speed control. With the sparking, you may have shorted out the current limiting features of the circuit, causing an overload and going back to point one. Id suggest the new switch will be fine, as to why its now working as suggsted below the sudden surge may have equalized the batteries.
great work
Nice video keep it up 👍👍👍👍👍
Hi Vince, love your videos and have watched for a long time. If you wouldn’t mind could you explain why you check for certain voltages, amps and continuity?
Hi bud l love this vid very entertaining lol more pls 💗
Hi Vince, thank you for this interesting video! Maybe you could start a battery series. There are many E-Bikes with Battery issues. One new Battery is often more than 500 Euro. There are companies that repair this. But it would be great to learn how to fix this problems - to reduce waste and also money...
NO Worries about the "Tea Brake", I just Added a little _Special_ to spice it up ; ) lol
I have NO Idea What you were doing on the Battery Board. Very Btave, i must say. _but, what do i know?_ Would Love to understand - perhaps a Jolt is All i need. ? haha
The BMS is dead. That's why it sparked and burnt out the trigger. You are bypassing the BMS so the drill no longer has protection.
The BMS would have been limiting the amps from the battery to lets say 10amps. As you're connected directly to the negative now you are most likely drawing the max amps from those cells which is why the drill is so powerful now. I don't expect it to last long.
Normally, if the volts from the BMS is lower than the battery then the BMS has detected a fault.
Could be the BMS was wired up wrong, the BMS is damaged, or the batteries are no longer the same voltage.
Thank you for the detailed explanation 👍👍👍
Workzone tools are sold by Aldi in in the UK. i have a couple of them and they are really good tools for the money specially for DIY folk
Vince made an Electroboom moment! The welded wire went so hot it melted the solder. The new switch has a upside down HP logo on it… Chinese knockoff still amazes me
That's a neat piece testing Equipment
Totalmente excelente 👍🏻
Regarding the issue with the LED not coming on in the center posistion. When you shaved the inner sides of the plastic part to allow the thicker pin to slide in it, you had to also cut into the bottom of the slot to allow for a bit more movement so the LED switch would activate.
As for how you made the battery suddenly work, I can only offer a theory. You might have shorted out or glitched the protection circuit that prevented it from working if the battery pack was not properly balanced, as one cell was measurably out of spec.
By the way, the battery level indicator was lighting when you had it open and was testing it.
I had a broken battery in a Workzone cordless drill hammer from a member of the family. Somehow one Transistor burnt close to the power plug. It is a Sot23 thingy, nothing readable after the burning… I just removed it, and it seems to be just the switch to change the led from red to green when the battery is full… It works now to reload the battery. One device saved from the landfill. It was so cheap that it wouldn’t have been worth to buy a new battery…
I was interested in those two black components in the battery you were measuring 20 volts on them.
Maybe they were faulty mosfets for power switching and the accident with the battery and drill could have blowen one to a full short through?
The drill switch was damaged, not sure how that happened.
Anyway it works :-D
That was an interesting one... the one and maby only time that 2 massive sparks did the trick
worxzone guild and worx all share the same battery,
I actually have a guild one, which the brake stopped working with little use, but then started braking again on its own.
Good to know the switch can be replaced if needed.
thanks.
An issue the Samsung galaxy s3 had was faulty charge ports, I used a battery to short the wires together to make a spark, I would put it to the charge port and spark it a couple of times and it started working again, you might’ve jump started a component in the motherboard
I would investigate the DC jack on the battery pack. These sometimes have a switch in the negative side (which closes when the jack is removed) and any poor contact / corrosion may have resulted in the power dipping when the drill was connected.
There may be current control / limiting in the battery pack. Applying 20V to the drill (when it should have been 18V) without any form of limit (which may also be related to the DC jack) resulted in the ‘welding effect’. This may explain why everything was ok when you used your 18V ‘current limited’ bench power supply.
I did ask a colleague that design medical equipment, what could be way it was behaved like it did.
His explanation was dust in the switch, when you disabled the over current protection and put the hole load in to the machine you burned the dust of in the switch.
Way did it work when you had the benchpowersuplly, it was because you were bringing the dust but not high enough to burn the dust away.
Do not fully understand his answer but maby you do.
Thank you brilliant video.
Good video
Tea Break FIX? More like a Toilet Break FIX, or a Trying to FIX video, as you've originally suggested haha 😜
With my experience with reparing broken USB ports on Powerbanks, it's always that if the output voltage is not coming as expected, disconnecting and reconnecting the batteries to charge-dischargr circuit, it resets the power charge controller IC. That would start working normally.
I had one of those drills and used it as a semi profesional builder, it was surprisingly strong, but didn't last long
Hello Vince.
I got similiar problem with a battery from Aldi. The voltage was there in the cells, but the output voltage of the board was very low. I found out that the temperature sensor cable was loose so it limited the output voltage. (Or I believe it is for the temperature. The thin wire which is glued on the side of the batteries.) When I resoldered it immediately came back to life. I would be intrested to see if you wiggle the sensor cable will the output voltage drop on the battery.
Keep it up, great videos :)
Nice one. Missed the eclipse 🤦 😂
Nice ur the best
You should be able to find the max discharge current of the 18650 cells. This will tell you if the switch is rated high enough.
⚡whoa that was a big spark....
Let's try that again 🤣
Hi vince i have ps vita that i bought faulty no power i try to find the fault but could not find any.. replaced battery still nothing.. can i send over to u trying to fix it. Love From singapore
Damn Vince becareful!
Good fix & just a tip the bit slips because it's not the right one for the screw each screw head is slightly different because of manufacturering process that's why there are many different bits
Similar problem to a RC car I had but it measured the correct voltage but I didn't have enough power to move the motors for long
Does Mike have a UA-cam channel? I'd really like to see him repairing brass musical instruments! That'd be fascinating.
When drilling into something, you need to pull the drill bit out every so often to clear the flutes, else you'll get the drill bit jammed in the hole and stuck.
I have this drill and just bodged in a switch to bypass the circuit. I suspected the switching transistors.
Maybe the bypass reset something. The spring may have been super heated while you were welding and its spring memory removed
I'm in the US and I wanted to send some headphones but my wife said it would cost too much and threw them all out. Do I need this grief? Whaja think NY to Watford would run me? I could look it up but this is more fun.
The mosfet in the trigger failed short circuit. When the battery was plugged in it went into protection mode, and when you bypassed the bms you fried the short in the trigger. In the process it got hot enough to anneal the spring. The mosfet is responsible for speed control, so without that it's now all or nothing
18v batteries are actually 20 volts but under load the 20 drops to 18. Some companies say 20 or 18 but they are all the same
make sure u use the right bit for ph123 or pz123 screws and the right bits put screws in better
Is the camming out during driving a bit mismatch between Phillips (PH) and Pozidrive (PZ)?
Ya spark balanced the batteries out of sync works sometimes when battery died goes to low for balancing
Might be a bad solder joint and the short created arcing that welded the solder joint together?
Hi. Can i ask where you got the bench power supply from and how much please?
DC = Negative = power into the device, Positive = power out of a device. the reason for the spark was you had negative connected first rather than last, hence the sparks, DC current is reversed polarity to the way you think current would flow. you will get sparks every time negative is connected first when playing with DC voltage. same with a car battery. the reason why you don't get sparks off a 1.5 volt battery is because the amperage is too low to make much of a difference. the reason for the spark was because of the circuit being completed via the light drawing current.
Am i the only one triggered with Vince not using the right bit for the screw? PH bit for a PZ screw...
But may I say congratulations on over 700k subs, I started following around 150k subs 👍
At 3:55 I saw a spark comming from the red postive lead but that’s because of 18v going through the leads
Pass, good repair
i always use the hammerdrill setting to drive in screws
And always pick the correct driver bit for the type of screw,it avoids the skipping you get on the screw head.
Hammer drill? I know drill drivers are good for screws, but they’re not hammering up and down like a hammer drill does. They instead apply torque in pulses which works better than continuous force. Hammer drill is supposed to be for smashing tiny pieces off masonry when you drill into brick, mortar or concrete.
I'm surprised passing current to the drill unregulated fixed whatever was shorted. I'm also surprised that short didn't manifest when you connected the drill directly to the bench power supply and the power draw seemed normal. I guess shorting the battery worked out in your favor as you may not have noticed the faulty trigger otherwise. Definitely a "do not try this at home" moment though.
Vince builds a spot welder would be a better title
it has been a faulty switch, perhaps the spring has worked its way through the switch and short-circuited the electronics in the switch. it is not normal that you can turn on the light when the switch is locked (when the right and left are in the middle), it must lock the switch so that you cannot use the switch for anything (it is a security when you have the screwdriver lying in your tool bag, for sides it is not in the middle, things in the bag can make the screwdriver run around and therefore use the battery / heat up the screwdriver so that it eventually short-circuits (gets hot). so all in all it has been a faulty switch😊there is a safety device in the battery (electronics) which switches off when there is a short circuit in the screwdriver, so that the battery does not explode. you bypassed the electronics when you soldered the two wires on, that's why it got stuck when you put it to the screwdriver😂😂 I have repaired many screw machines / battery drills (I have worked as a tool maker)😊normally the screwdriver must stop 100% when you release the switch, it brakes the engine 100% just like when you step hard on your brake in the car😊 that's why the engine makes sparks when you release the switch
Would you be up to having laptop sent to you from out of country.
I'm sure he would, i think he has had quite a lot of stuff that has been sent from Europe and the US before
I think i know what is going on now since some of the batteries are under 4v all the cells together go over 20v probably there is some circuit that brings that voltage down to 18v to power the drill since some cells are 3.8v the battery voltage is too low one one cell it isn't making enough voltage so instead your getting 15v instead of 18v at the output that's why the charger is over 20v because all together the cells are over 20v but because one cell is 3.8v instead of it being like 21 22v it's 20v so the circuit that brings the voltage down is only giving 15v instead of 18v that's probably why when you give it 20v it doesn't like it but 18v it works fine i hope you understand i tried to explain as good as i can in the comments I'm only half way through the video so i guess we'll see if my theory is correct or not
Again I'm not sure I'm just guessing
trying to find charger for my aldi workzone 14.4v cordless drill it is 2 years old
tea everywhere ... must be! (",) lol
I think you shorted something when you had that incident not the charging circuit but something else that's why it showed 20v you shorted it and bypassed whatever circuitry was making it 15v this is just a guess and I'm not 100% sure
There is a wire come on soldered somewhere between the battery out and the terminals find it and fix it
do you accept items from the US for a repair video? i dont expect the items back i just have a few things i think would make for a nice video and i feel like you may be the one to get these items working again..
that screw at the end looked more like a 2 and half inch screw
I think the cells needed balancing, they were too far spread out in charge.
Yeah, and that short-circuit incident (li-ion cells can provide a lot of current) probably served to jolt the cells back into balance.
Funny thing about fixing an electronic device that u are new too or with no diagram...most of the time...the symptoms don't point to the initial fault at first...lol
I overheated the spring in my bikes horn circuit by adding an air horn.
Says anyone would just buy a new battery -> proceeds to fix it
Breaks the springy thing -> proceeds to buy a new one.
Was texting my wife from the basement while watching this.
Huh so how do you know some of these are tea break fixes? Do you record the speech afterwards or are you a time traveler
Well this case makes it quite obvious. It’s an educated guess beforehand. Sometimes it goes wrong... Usually the speech is not a voice over.
I Have A Ryobi Battery the
Light Lights Up When Charging
But When I Press The Yellow
Test Button it Don't Light Up
ooooh... Let's try that again...
Not sure what to tell you (you have rly strong nerves to test battery like that, given what they can do... guess the ignorance is a bliss), but it was very interesting :)