This is so rich and stimulating in so many ways, Mark. It's leading me to ask a bunch more questions about my own emotional underdevelopment and speculating about why people at large are doing this. I think one major factor may be that we're overwhelmed such that reaching for pat stances makes it easier to find our place in the chaos. This has massive negative consequences that we're observing but I for one am reaching for more understanding and compassion. I'm willing to let go of easy answers in favor of curiosity.
"we're overwhelmed such that reaching for pat stances makes it easier to find our place in the chaos" ~ Makes total sense! I feel that for myself as well.
🙏 I have been experiencing the same for years, everything political has become so insane and few seem capable of nuanced thinking anymore. Your point about how we're being infantilized is so true! I have thought about this often before, never heard anyone say it yet. Especially with and since Covid it has really stood out. Really great points you raised, thank you!
Yeah, lots of folks out there suffering from "arrested development." And interacting with them really is exhausting. It’s feeling that you must guard your speech at all times. And that does wear you down - mentally and emotionally. Well said, Mark.
Totally agree. To understand life after a crazy childhood, I have a very wide range of interests that may seem contradictory but it works for me, I'm a maverick. I've unsubscribed to many UA-cam channels because I didn't fit in with the ethos of the channel and its hardcore unspoken rules, surprisingly by supposedly open minded people. I have a mental list of never talk about topics with specific groups.Sometimes leaving inoffensive comments is like being in the wrong therapy group, after openly chatting away, you are either ignored or there is a pile on of insults, like the hive attacking an intruder.
Oh I can relate, it's impossible to penetrate a stuck idea in somebody's head. You go "look at these statistics", and they go "you hate science!" And looking at both sides is challenging, I'll admit it, but why all the aggression?
Thanks for sharing this Mark. My go to safe-place when confronted with avoidance, evasion and intolerable transference is to consider the subject is Splitting. It gets me through the day far better than Beer ever once did.
@markvicente7 , My son and I watch every video you put out. Your mild use of explicit language is very effective at engaging his attention while still passing the "mom-dar". Thank you, and please keep them coming ❤
Dear Mark, thanks for being a sane and heartfelt voice in a violent environment. As a liberal Israeli watching my society crumble as a result of a long period of hatful and culty speech I am all the more aware of how dangerous this seemingly inevitable human tendency is. Keep your important work up, I appreciate you ❤
i think this is why your experience and personal story is/are so salient right now. a little less than half of the population is in a cult…or entered into cult-like behavior and cult-like reasoning, which is to say “unreasoning” and irrationality.
let me add…this is my tribe too and i worked in “progressive organizations” for almost a decade after having a 20+yr career as a creative director. the cult didn’t just emerge out of thin air. a LOT of $$ and effort went into training ppl to create this cult which wriggled out of its chrysalis after the 2016 election. if you’re unfamiliar you might find the story of Bret Weinstein and Evergreen College interesting and instructive. That blew up in 2017 and the tactics students used to take over the college are tactics we taught (after being flown all over hell and back to trainings in which we learned the tactics in order that we’d teach them). It’s no accident. It took a lot of time and effort for Raneire to assemble his harem. Same with progressivism. It wasn’t always this way and it took time/effort to get ppl to surrender their reason and self-respect in order to get to where we are today.
Haven't been sleeping well either. "I See Fire" - ED SHEERAN cover (The Hobbit: The Desolation Of Smaug) | Dan Vasc "The Last Goodbye" (From THE HOBBIT: THE BATTLE OF THE FIVE ARMIES) - Billy Boyd cover | Dan Vasc
It's been 30 years since I left my cult and I still to this day have nightmares 😢 so it must be a normal side effect of leaving a cult. But I agree with you 100% about the political cults that have taken over many at this time. That's another side effect of leaving a cult, being able to see the cult-type behavior all around you.
I raise my hand high❤! Mark we are surrounded by people who have never grown up. Children on playgrounds setting there rules for click groups. They can only exist within a group. No original thoughts are allowed. This behavior persists their entire lives. Fortunately for them in the modern world we don’t judge people based on their beliefs. We judge people based on their actions. But the behavior you’re describing stinks of middle age tribal mentality. Yes we are always trying to wake people up. Fascinating. What did Jesus or the Buddha find when they tried to wake people up? Love the children where they are.
we are living during times of jenn oh side. some things do not deserve nuance. for someone saying "read history read history read history," but then speaking as a white man in a rich country making a comparison of you being uncomfortale in conversations - to tip toeing through landmines while tens of thousands of actual people are being b*mbed every hour with billions of dollars of US funding- is dense and insenstitive. you are not walking through landmines with prickly people, youre feeling discomfort in conversation.get over yourself. you sound like the folks youre attempting to condemn. consider spending less time talking about your dreams and more time reading the history of Pa/est1ne. you cant make a video like this at a time like this and pretend it's some hot or reasonable take. drawing the line at jennyzide is indeed a worthwhile boundary to hold. ugh
‘ I think, therefore I am", René Descartes.” The cult you were in policed your thoughts, your actions, your relationships. You gave away your mind to another person. Perhaps the dreams you have represent the hooks people had into you. I have a recurring dream where I am back somehow at university, anxious because there’s an exam I failed to take, or being told my degree is fake and I need to tell people I don’t have one. Raniere is gone, he will leave jail in a body bag.
for all the issues with christianity, my life was so much more beautiful as a christian than after i abandoned the belief system. one of the worst choices i ever made.
I hope you will meet open minded religious people too. There was a time traveled a lot south Portugal and people say it way more relaxed down there. Anyway I hope you will get also positive and warm experiences. May God give you Peace and Tranquility and touch you with His Love through the Lovers of God ❤️
That is a complete contradiction of terms. There are zero open minded religious people. That is completely ridiculous and utterly impossible. And of course they are so closed minded that they think they’re not. But thank you I needed that laugh today 🤗
I feel like I know you, but would never own you. You get to be you, and have your opinions and believe your truth. I don’t have to agree with you on everything in order to think you are a very ethical person,in order to respect you. Like you said, it’s not all or nothing, black or white, simple and static. Humility trumps self righteousness always.
1 or 2 years old? Where were you for your entire childhood? Kids at 8 or 10 are group thinkers. Teenagers are group thinkers. It was When I was a construction electrician in my late 20s, i was done School, and had my journeyman's license , and I had foremen who were in their 40s and 50s, and I realized that essentially the dynamics were all just Junior high clique level mentality. Belonging... Bullying... Gossiping, backstabbing... To believe that it should be over by nursery school is profoundly naive
There's plenty of room for you over here if you move left of the progressives:) Us anarchists don't fuck with authoritarianism. Love your work and your sincerity and your vulnerability:)
Native People have asked over and over for white people to stop saying tribe. rather than viewing this feedback as authoritarian delusion, default to listening to the lived experiences of oppressed People, which you are not
This bedtime story made a timely appearance: THE MACHINE STOPS, The Classic Science Fiction Story That Predicted Our Future by E M Forster | neuralsurfer Take care everyone. Fundamentalism: Putin’s Brain 2: Traditionalism, Fundamentalism, end-times, and Kali Yuga | Joseph Szimhart
I admire how you always seem calm and measured. Rare these days when talking about these topics
That's because I try to vent before I talk! ;-)
It’s a shame we can’t have nuanced opposing views and open discussion without being called an ‘ist’. I really appreciate your thoughts on this topic!
Great podcast
Thanks for listening!
Mark, you are one in a million. You are a free thinker, not a sycophant. Keep your heart and mind free always. Blessings to you and yours. ❤
This is so rich and stimulating in so many ways, Mark. It's leading me to ask a bunch more questions about my own emotional underdevelopment and speculating about why people at large are doing this. I think one major factor may be that we're overwhelmed such that reaching for pat stances makes it easier to find our place in the chaos. This has massive negative consequences that we're observing but I for one am reaching for more understanding and compassion. I'm willing to let go of easy answers in favor of curiosity.
"we're overwhelmed such that reaching for pat stances makes it easier to find our place in the chaos" ~ Makes total sense! I feel that for myself as well.
Don’t bother with BS - you’re a terrific thinker, vulnerably in your flexibility and open mindedness!😊
🙏 I have been experiencing the same for years, everything political has become so insane and few seem capable of nuanced thinking anymore.
Your point about how we're being infantilized is so true! I have thought about this often before, never heard anyone say it yet. Especially with and since Covid it has really stood out.
Really great points you raised, thank you!
"Don't be a narrow minded asshole. Stay curious." Is now and forevermore my mission statement.
😂👍🏼
You are so right Mark! It’s like no one can agree to disagree, you have to accept there view all or nothing
Yeah, lots of folks out there suffering from "arrested development." And interacting with them really is exhausting. It’s feeling that you must guard your speech at all times. And that does wear you down - mentally and emotionally. Well said, Mark.
❤ 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 I always remember the quote "who you are speaks so loudly I can't hear what you are saying"
Totally agree. To understand life after a crazy childhood, I have a very wide range of interests that may seem contradictory but it works for me, I'm a maverick. I've unsubscribed to many UA-cam channels because I didn't fit in with the ethos of the channel and its hardcore unspoken rules, surprisingly by supposedly open minded people. I have a mental list of never talk about topics with specific groups.Sometimes leaving inoffensive comments is like being in the wrong therapy group, after openly chatting away, you are either ignored or there is a pile on of insults, like the hive attacking an intruder.
Oh I can relate, it's impossible to penetrate a stuck idea in somebody's head. You go "look at these statistics", and they go "you hate science!" And looking at both sides is challenging, I'll admit it, but why all the aggression?
Thanks for sharing this Mark. My go to safe-place when confronted with avoidance, evasion and intolerable transference is to consider the subject is Splitting. It gets me through the day far better than Beer ever once did.
@markvicente7 , My son and I watch every video you put out. Your mild use of explicit language is very effective at engaging his attention while still passing the "mom-dar".
Thank you, and please keep them coming ❤
Dear Mark, thanks for being a sane and heartfelt voice in a violent environment. As a liberal Israeli watching my society crumble as a result of a long period of hatful and culty speech I am all the more aware of how dangerous this seemingly inevitable human tendency is. Keep your important work up, I appreciate you ❤
Bravo!!!
i think this is why your experience and personal story is/are so salient right now. a little less than half of the population is in a cult…or entered into cult-like behavior and cult-like reasoning, which is to say “unreasoning” and irrationality.
let me add…this is my tribe too and i worked in “progressive organizations” for almost a decade after having a 20+yr career as a creative director. the cult didn’t just emerge out of thin air. a LOT of $$ and effort went into training ppl to create this cult which wriggled out of its chrysalis after the 2016 election.
if you’re unfamiliar you might find the story of Bret Weinstein and Evergreen College interesting and instructive. That blew up in 2017 and the tactics students used to take over the college are tactics we taught (after being flown all over hell and back to trainings in which we learned the tactics in order that we’d teach them). It’s no accident. It took a lot of time and effort for Raneire to assemble his harem. Same with progressivism. It wasn’t always this way and it took time/effort to get ppl to surrender their reason and self-respect in order to get to where we are today.
Haven't been sleeping well either.
"I See Fire" - ED SHEERAN cover (The Hobbit: The Desolation Of Smaug) | Dan Vasc
"The Last Goodbye" (From THE HOBBIT: THE BATTLE OF THE FIVE ARMIES) - Billy Boyd cover | Dan Vasc
It's been 30 years since I left my cult and I still to this day have nightmares 😢 so it must be a normal side effect of leaving a cult. But I agree with you 100% about the political cults that have taken over many at this time. That's another side effect of leaving a cult, being able to see the cult-type behavior all around you.
100% 👍🏼
“Fuckin’ staggering” - made me laugh - so perfectly placed
😂😂😂
Steven hassan is doing a weekly live on UA-cam about what you're talking about
Steven may help us wake up. Happy Thanksgiving Week!
37th comment here. I heard every word. It is indeed time to grow up!
Jesus-this is scary. The world is a cult. But I understand the feeling.
I raise my hand high❤!
Mark we are surrounded by people who have never grown up. Children on playgrounds setting there rules for click groups. They can only exist within a group. No original thoughts are allowed. This behavior persists their entire lives.
Fortunately for them in the modern world we don’t judge people based on their beliefs. We judge people based on their actions. But the behavior you’re describing stinks of middle age tribal mentality.
Yes we are always trying to wake people up. Fascinating.
What did Jesus or the Buddha find when they tried to wake people up? Love the children where they are.
we are living during times of jenn oh side. some things do not deserve nuance. for someone saying "read history read history read history," but then speaking as a white man in a rich country making a comparison of you being uncomfortale in conversations - to tip toeing through landmines while tens of thousands of actual people are being b*mbed every hour with billions of dollars of US funding- is dense and insenstitive. you are not walking through landmines with prickly people, youre feeling discomfort in conversation.get over yourself. you sound like the folks youre attempting to condemn.
consider spending less time talking about your dreams and more time reading the history of Pa/est1ne. you cant make a video like this at a time like this and pretend it's some hot or reasonable take. drawing the line at jennyzide is indeed a worthwhile boundary to hold. ugh
‘ I think, therefore I am", René Descartes.” The cult you were in policed your thoughts, your actions, your relationships. You gave away your mind to another person. Perhaps the dreams you have represent the hooks people had into you. I have a recurring dream where I am back somehow at university, anxious because there’s an exam I failed to take, or being told my degree is fake and I need to tell people I don’t have one. Raniere is gone, he will leave jail in a body bag.
for all the issues with christianity, my life was so much more beautiful as a christian than after i abandoned the belief system. one of the worst choices i ever made.
I hope you will meet open minded religious people too. There was a time traveled a lot south Portugal and people say it way more relaxed down there. Anyway I hope you will get also positive and warm experiences. May God give you Peace and Tranquility and touch you with His Love through the Lovers of God ❤️
That is a complete contradiction of terms. There are zero open minded religious people. That is completely ridiculous and utterly impossible. And of course they are so closed minded that they think they’re not. But thank you I needed that laugh today 🤗
Do you think John lamb lash is the zodiac killer?
Most do think they are their thoughts
Sounds a lot like our political landscape
I feel like I know you, but would never own you. You get to be you, and have your opinions and believe your truth. I don’t have to agree with you on everything in order to think you are a very ethical person,in order to respect you. Like you said, it’s not all or nothing, black or white, simple and static. Humility trumps self righteousness always.
1 or 2 years old?
Where were you for your entire childhood?
Kids at 8 or 10 are group thinkers.
Teenagers are group thinkers.
It was When I was a construction electrician in my late 20s, i was done School, and had my journeyman's license , and I had foremen who were in their 40s and 50s, and I realized that essentially the dynamics were all just Junior high clique level mentality. Belonging... Bullying... Gossiping, backstabbing...
To believe that it should be over by nursery school is profoundly naive
There's plenty of room for you over here if you move left of the progressives:) Us anarchists don't fuck with authoritarianism.
Love your work and your sincerity and your vulnerability:)
Native People have asked over and over for white people to stop saying tribe. rather than viewing this feedback as authoritarian delusion, default to listening to the lived experiences of oppressed People, which you are not
This bedtime story made a timely appearance: THE MACHINE STOPS, The Classic Science Fiction Story That Predicted Our Future by E M Forster | neuralsurfer Take care everyone.
Fundamentalism: Putin’s Brain 2: Traditionalism, Fundamentalism, end-times, and Kali Yuga | Joseph Szimhart