There's An Underground Pro WarCraft 2 Scene!?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 28 лис 2023
- ► u8t3io3p's UA-cam channel: / @u8t3io3p
► u8t3io3p's Twitch channel: / u8t3io3p
► Buy Our Merch: tastelessthreads.com
► Watch Tasteless live on Twitch: / tastelesstv
► Follow Tasteless on Twitter: / callmetasteless
► Follow Tasteless on Instagram: / nicktastelessplott
► Follow Tasteless on TikTok: www.tiktok.com/@nicktasteless...
► Book Tasteless on Cameo: cameo.com/tasteless
► Join the ASL English Patreon: / aslenglish
► Join Tasteless's Discord channel: / discord
#warcraft #gaming #rts #games #twitch #warcraft2 - Ігри
Good to see some appreciation for this streamer :). He's been doing 20-50 viewers for a long time now. Hopefully more people discover this scene.
I have been watching him for couple of years now. Lack of commentary is a little boring but games are good
I love his games. The content is unending!
@@OpticallEffect U8 is the best, he's playing AOE1 as well. His channel on y-tube is Warcraft 2.
we have been playing warcraft 2 and keeping it alive for years now. i haven't seen many new players join though. my guess is the rest of us that are left are the last
Quotes from tasteless that everyone has already said about SC1:
"I didn't know it could be played this fast!"
"The maps are too big."
"Isn't this just a thing that people played with for a time and then went away?"
"Imagine getting beaten to death by an OGRE-GAMER!!"
"How tedious."
Underrated comment
Hah, add "how tedious".
@@Mithras719 done lmao
Well said
For those wondering, WC2 bloodlust increases damage only. Haste increases attack and move speed
Yep, WC2 bloodlust increases damage only and randomly. That should be fixed by the way
@@Olagfigh its not random its x2 increase
@@Olagfigh Is it random? I thought it doubled both your normal and piercing damage. Since Ogres have, iirc, 8 normal and 8 piercing damage, and have 8 armour which only reduces normal damage, it meant ogres would do 4-8 damage against other ogres/knights, but when that's doubled to 16/16, still with only 8 normal damage reduced, they are now doing 12-24 damage, effectively triple damage even though the spell on paper is only supposed to double it. I believe this was unintended, resulting in bloodlust being by far the most broken spell in the game, ridiculously more powerful than the paladin's healing ability which only recovered 1 hp per 6 mana iirc, meaning even a full 255 mana paladin can't even fully heal their 90 hp, while a bloodlusted ogre goes from needing on average 15 hits to kill an equal knight/ogre to just 5. Or 9, if a full mana perfectly timed heal goes off. Meanwhile paladin still needs 15 hits to kill that ogre. IOW even if you trained openAI to play War2 perfectly with infinite APM and start every fight with full mana, Paladins would still get massacred by any decent player just using bloodlust on their ogres before a fight. RIP humans.
On fastest game speed orcs were borderline unbeatable due to those ogre mages. On slow or normal speed though humans can react with mages and slow spell. On fastest a human player is forced to try to draw out bloodlusts to waste mana and run..or kill the orc player before they can get to ogre magi.
Wow, people still discussing the mechanics of WC2....
Combat mechanic is not explained correct on the internet.
You have basic and piercing damage.
Basic can be reduced by the enemies armor, even to 0.
The left over is added to the piercing and divided by 2.
Rounded upwards.
This is the minimum damage.
Double this for the maximum damage.
The game takes a random number in between with a lot of numbers behind the decimal.
Either way, it is rounded again for the actual damage in 1 hit.
This means that the minimal AND maximum damage happens 0.5 times. While the rest weights 1.
The average damage is 1.5 times that of the rounded minimal damage.
Example:
Grunt does 6 basic and 3 piercing damage according to the game.
Against a knight with 4 armor, this gives 2+3=5
5/2=2.5, rounded upwards gives 3.
The damage goes from 3 to 6.
The die that you roll actually looks like:
344556.
On average, this grunt does 4.5 damage against a knight. And needs 20 hits.
Troll does 6 piercing and 3 basic.
And results in the exact same damage against the knight.
Upgrades??
Melee gets +2 basic damage per upgrade.
Ranged gets +1 piercing damage per upgrade. The archer also can get another +3 piercing damage.
Bloodlust doubles all damages. Then you still need to subtract armor.
Haste increases movement speed to 13.
Haste only increases the attack speed for the dragon/gryphon. And chopping wood.
WC2 is surprisingly easy to learn and understand. It's a very interesting game from a strategic point of view since everything is clearly laid out in a grid, so unit and building positioning is a key component of the game
to bad that there is essentialy only one faction you ever see. it is a nice watch for a while but after the 9839750 orc vs orc match, it does get boring
What i wouldn't give for a PROPER Warcraft 2 remaster / remake. Game is fun as heck and it still looks great.
Yeah agreed, honestly I prefer this graphical style to war3 and wow
The new HD patch is nice
Does it fix the laggy mouse controls? i remember trying some stuff years ago, and it was unplayable.
Yes a janky mouse has kept me.from the game. The HD patch fixed it.for me
Agreed, I am one of those oddballs who didn't care for WC3 but LOVED WC2.
So proud to see War2 highlighted by the one and only Tasteless! This was my first RTS as well and the one I'm the most nostalgic about by far. Have been watching the War2 pro scene since before the BW one, actually, which is insane to think about since the latter was already big when I was a kid.
I love warcraft 2. And this player, u8, is like a complete wizard. He is incredibly fast, clever and creative.
The Bloodlust sound effect is incredibly nostalgic to me. It's crazy how fast the pros apply it to all their units. I remember the CPU would always auto cast on all Its units and it would take me forever as a kid
If you ever played WC2 you know how impressive this is from both sides. The game is not exactly modern to control.
I think they're not even close to top10 of WC2 players.
This channel is great, its a polish guy streaming w2 all the time. The game is timeless.
THEY SHOULD HAVE PUT THIS ON BLIZZCON MAIN STAGE. Exactly, everyone would cheer, one match of w2 would be lovely to see.
It's funny because the spawn locations appear to greatly impact the build orders. The opponent couldn't do the same DK harass that the POV player could. Even though he was losing all those ogre trades his econ was getting way ahead by killing workers. Way more interesting than I would have guessed from wc2
It also seemed like damage was permanent? So he was constantly chipping damage into the opponents ogres with DK (I'm new this) and small harass groups keeping the opponent busy and eventually overwhelming.
@@JonTietzcorrect, there is no automatic healing. Humans get paladins who can target heal, and orcs get troll throwers who get an upgrade to gain passive health regen. Unfortunately, the heal spell is nowhere near as impactful as the bloodlust spell, hence orc v orc was the meta of the game.
@@DarkScreamGames they could both have built Paladins then? Interesting. The enemy player should have tried to find a way to preserve that. You can really see the beginnings of Starcraft here. This stuff is super captivating.
@@DarkScreamGames never mind, different race. :)
Certainly no Starcraft without this gem.
i played wc2 so much as a kid. it legitimately had a huge impact on me
Oh right on! One of my favorite SC commentators and streamers covering one of my favorite games! Welcome to the world of Warcraft 2!
That eye ball spell was wild lol . I was just like "what it can do that!?". Def strong nastalga and i barely touched the game back in the day since BW and WC3 came out.
the eye can be used to have ships shoot at each other if you fast enough to dodge the cannons.
I love all the sounds from this game. So much nostalgia.
that was fun. pretty sure he won solely on the back of his death knight attacks on the peons.
He was worker harassing and his enemy was not.
I love that streamer, hope he gets more of an audience. Nicely done showcasing him and a still-great game.
You should watch this guy playing 4v4... he is dominating with every unit and strategy.. once mass ogres, once mass demolishers, once mass suicide goblins.. this guy barely loose.
Demos are a warcraft 3 unit.
You mean catapults.
@@philpie2998 human variation of goblin sappers = demo
Love it! So much nostalgia. Playing first time Warcraft 1 on my friends PC was the reason I went for IT school instead of biology. :) I still can remember how excited I was to see the peons just executing my commands. Since then I talked my parents to buy me a computer for the studies. Yeap, now I am 18 years working in IT and pretty happy. Always thankful to Blizzard :D
I used to do Kali tournaments in War2. There was a competitive scene way back in the day, I'm glad to see one still exists!! I've always favored Warcraft RTS over Starcraft...but that's because I'm not as good at the macro game. Early SC2 was a blast for me because I was just rushing nonstop microing the cheese units like reapers, void rays, roaches etc. as random. In the Warcraft RTS the macro is a lot smaller, less workers less bases.
Its been forever since i've heard Kali. Now memories come flooding back. Used to play war2 on there religiously, just forgot the name of the program.
@@DanielMoore3d Yea, it's been forever since Kali and... can you explain me please who is "Kali"? :D
20 years ago I had an old CD with "Kali Puds" map package for Warcraft 2 and that's all I know about Kali.
That's very true. I recently saw Grubby playing WC3 and I never knew how micro intensive the game is compared to SC. Makes it a lot more fun to watch imo.
This video randomly came up recommended, mega nostalgia. I use to play this when I was a kid. All those sounds were cool to hear again. Thanks!!🙏🏼
Hey, thanks 😊, if someone is looking for some gameplay from multiplayer/mods for warcraft 1/2 you can find them on my channel, also you can play with us!
edit 2: I get banned at twitch, so if you want watch w2 only at youtube
Knew it was your stream
Post this shit for the guys
So what happened was that indeed the first player lost most ogre fight exchanges, and the other player got an ogre deathball up. But as you might've noticed, the first player repeatedly did hefty eco damage while the other barely touched the first's income. So the moment the first player managed to kill the deathball, it was over. He was incredibly ahead in income.
Used to use Kali95 back in the day to play WC2 since it was an IPX and not TCP/IP game. Games back then were very competitive. Lots of custom & well balanced maps (map editor). Farms we’re generally used as walls.
One of the Kali95 user created maps had two chunks of land, separated by water, with a narrow causeway joining them. Seemed to be a very popular map.
I did have a bit of a binge on that warcraft 2 channel but the lack of talking and people usually only going Orc kinda pulled me out of it. But it was still awesome to see what level it reached. Makes you wonder what would have happened if it got big.
I have the firm believe that ideas that sounded good but turned out to be horrible (like tasteless using sappers to try to kill goldmines) teach you more about the game then things that worked out. A success just confirms what you already knew, but a horrible idea can teach you a better understanding of why some ideas won´t work and a deeper understanding of the units you used and failed with and how not to use them and why.
I think at the end he was broke and lost all of his army, then had his last workers killed by the deathknight.
love that tasteless is covering this! I got into wc2 for a while, and it's a pretty cool scene. Do you Populous the Beginning, tasteless?
I have played with those dudes, they even have a server where everyone is welcomed to just join and play some 3v3 or 4v4 in classic maps like GoW, PoS or some others. I might install the game again after watching this.
Look at the plays!
Look at the moves!
WHAT WAS THAT
This was awesome. The nostalgia is real!
Love seeing old games being revived like TMNT or Sailor Moon snes fighting games. Wish the snes got a Urusei Yatsura fighter.
"Work work"
"jobs done"
"yes mee lawd"
"FOR THE KINGGGGG"
So glad to see him getting recognition! I've been watching him for a long time and the nostalgia is appreciated!
The 1st game that i ever truly got addicted to. I got this game for my 7th birthday. Still remember that day clearly.
i enjoyed this, thank you for the change of pace.
While orcs are the stronger of two races competitively humans aren't so far behind that they're unplayable, they tend to focus more on abusing mages since paladins can't really stand toe to toe with bloodlusted ogres directly. u8 has a lot of replays on his channel where he plays humans and has success with them in ladder matches so it can be pretty entertaining just to see some asymmetrical gameplay going on if you want to show more Warcraft 2 content.
At the top level, Humans are unplayable if you actually want to win. They don't have Lust, and the Pali heal spell doesn't heal enough. Their cats have a big delay on their shot and can even misfire. The only benefit of playing Humans is that Blizzard does slightly more damage than DnD. That's literally it. If you go watch u8's stream, he will only play Orc when he's playing against people that are about as good as he is. He just plays random for fun.
@@itranscendencei7964 Arguably I think slow is a bit better than haste iirc and invisibility is pretty good for mage harass? But yeah in any case orcs can do everything humans can do as well or nearly as well, while ogre mages are just 2.5 better than paladins, it really isn't even close to fair if the player skill levels are close.
Huh, how about that. Back in the day (before SC1 came out) I just assumed Humans would be the better race in any competitive environment simply because of their Healing abilities. Turns out I was completely wrong.
@@itranscendencei7964 the issue is playing it on fastest speed. With slower game speed humans can win vs orcs using mages and slow. But you aren't gonna be able to cast slow on all the ogre mages in time on fastest game speed..it's part of why they introduced autocast in Warcraft3 and slowed down the gameplay on fastest. A big part of fastest being popular for War2 was that whole starting with 1 worker thing. That was also fixed by the time SC1 came around let alone War3. Ideally you kill the orc player with a rush as humans before they can get ogre mages out but against an equally skilled opponent that's probably not gonna happen..especially on a huge map like GoW.
@@Ziegfried82 People don't play on Fastest speed unless they play chop. The game in this video was played on Even Faster, which is the next step down. That's the slowest speed anyone would ever play on, and Humans are not going to win against someone who knows what they are doing and playing Orc. Again, if you go actually watch the streams of top level players, not a single one of them plays Humans when they are actually trying. Even if you do rush them, the Orc player can easily hold with cats because Human cats have a delay with their shots. People only really play Humans when they are just playing for fun. As far as War3, I couldn't care less about that game. They had it right with War2, and then completely ruined it.
We used to get LAN games of this going in computer class when we were supposed to be working on something else.
There was essentially no protection from kids just installing whatever they wanted on the school computers, and 1 CD was enough for 8 people to play
Great find! Who knew about this? Really fun to watch. It would be nice to have someone who knows the game go commentate.
I know all
What u want
Trogallart commentates games time to time
I'd love to see you cover really obscure and not well known eSports. Stuff like Dawn of War and GeoGuesser
I still remember the only pvp wc2 match i ever played back in high school. It was an island map and even though we both had 4 pirate ships, my friend manually targeted one of my pirate ships while i let my ships auto target. That was the beginning of the end. He later ice storm dropped one of my mining bases. Needless to say i lost.
would love to see a few more games of wc2, what a nice nostalgic throwback
Nobody knew in chat that Bloodlust = triple damage in WC2.
Type “disco” in game to hear amazing music in Warcraft 2.
I spend so many hours playing this game with my friend in middle school. Amazing times
Our hero in this match was floating thousands of gold. They prolly shoulda built some additional production buildings to crank out more ogres. But attacking the enemy economy was too powerful as it is.
Also haste on your own peons was incredible 😂
YOOO u8 featured on Tasteless' channel?! AWESOME
Hi Tasteless!
I'm happy to see War2 videos! I was heavily into War2BNE until everyone jumped ship (naturally) when War3 came out.
A couple of things:
-I THINK food cap is 200 but it takes a long while to get there!
-Blood Lust is OP on the fastest and 2nd fastest game speeds
I personally like going Random in any RTS and actually like Humans and their spells a little bit better (IE: Heal and Blizzard) but if you're not Orc on those speeds then you're at a disadvantage! That didn't stop me from trying though! Hell, I even got called a hacker 'cause I got pretty good at healing with my Paladins! I also, WON against a hacker (Orc vs. Orc) and I'll never forget that! Level 1 DK casting Death and Decay with just a Great Hall? C'mon man...
Ladder and Iron Man Ladder speeds slowed it down to make it fair and that's where they shined!
I would LOVE to see WarCraft 2 get a remaster but no one else talks about it except me it seems haha. I don't know how to fix the Blood Lust vs. Heal problem but it definitely needs to be addressed. Maybe a splash heal? I donno. Auto-casting would just be lazy and dumb and too close to War3.
That was a masterpiece. Thanks for finding this
Ive been watching this dude for a few years. Its a crazy meta. lol. And there isnt many maps. But its pretty fun looking
So this was the first rts I ever played when I was like...young.
I thought when the peon went into the "cave", they came out with a club. I made armies of gold wielding peons for a few games until I knew something was odd.
Thanks for bringing us this content, makes me want to try it again
Yeah man this was great. Love for you to take a spin playing it. They never remastered, just Bnet edition. Tho! There is a fan remaster called Chronicles of the Second War.
The original War2 website from the 90s is still up and active, and includes descriptions of units, spells, and strategies to deal, with each m/u.
Appreciate the 3rd strike music at the ending there
WC2 was the first game i played online when we got internet. I was litterally shaking excited when going onlines for the first time. 23 years later and im still addicted to vids.
The music and sounds man. Holy shit it’s been decades
i loved this i was thinking how good is war craft 2 pro games glad to see it and want to see more of it
Such nostalgia, love it!
I love this content Tasteless, MORE!
I tried getting in to warcraft II competitive as well. Thought to myself, this is gonna be easy, probably only noobs play this.
It's SO difficult. One thing you didn't mention, or maybe you didn't know; you cannot queue up production on any buildings. You make your ogres one at a god damn time.
The macro in this is so difficult. The micro is super difficult and punishing. It's truly a game for gamers..
There's a great "custom gamemode", where everyone starts with one peon like normal, but everyone is trapped by trees. So you gotta axe yourself out first. Sounds dumb, but it's actually a lot of fun.
Cool to see War2. I was way more in to 2 than 3 becuse I did not like the heroes in War 3
Love to see it here! The Warcraft 2 community has custom servers and client mods, it’s doing alright for such an old game!
Man, those sound effects took me back to my childhood. Wow.
Used to love this game and been wanting to play it again for the longest.
Warcraft 2 came out when I was in middle school. I started out playing war craft 1 competitively with a friend from school over our modem connections. When wc2 came out, there was still no battle net, but I talked my mom into getting something called Kali for me. It was $10/month. You could connect to it, and it was a chatroom where you could connect with people all over and play wc2 over the internet.
Low resources was what "good" people played on. I still remember the build order: farm, farm, farm, barracks, farm, Smith, farm, barracks. Then you sent your grunts out to kick the other guys ass. Smith upgrades were super fast. They'd finish in close to the same amount of time it took to make a grunt, so you had to get those upgrades going. Expanding, especially more than once, was some super advanced stuff. Workers are just so vulnerable in that game. You can stick like 30 peons in a goldmine, and they'll all mine efficiently, but one catapult shot, death and decay, or even a bloodlusted ogre near your gold mine, and you'd be screwed in a couple seconds.
Oh yea, and there was a ladder. It was manually up kept on separate websites. You joined one of the big 2 leagues and manually reported your wins and losses to a website, lol.
i was looking for a speed run with commentary but could nto find one. stumbled here and this was great. i miss this game. used to play it in the computer lab in 7th grade on macintosh. 40 kids there all running lan games
On bw are also big maps for 8 players but I do not see playing them. Even islands could be interesting to see how pro will do them.
This is a blast from the past!
That nostalgia was the hardest trip of my life
This was a lot of fun to watch, would love to see more War2 content... even general retro RTS... Command & Conquer... Shattered Galaxy...
My greatest gaming achievement was beating your brother in a WC3 tournament at the Olathe mall
That was crazy. The guys move so fast, and everything dies so quickly.
Fastest on War2 was absurd. But it was the speed of choice on Kali or whatever internet competition platform you were playing on due to how slow the early game was.
This is even faster, Fastest is "hungry hungry hippo" warp speed, popular on custom maps@@Ziegfried82
Hey, that's neat. War2ru is a great little server and I appreciate all the work they'd put into it. Sadly, unless you're in EU your ping will be too high to be competitive whatsoever. ** One thing I never see ANYONE mention is AOL Engage. Real OGs remember the WarCraft 2 forums on there. I remember when the Warchief of Splintered Orcs Clan (SoC) first started the clan and he was something like 15 years old. God damn time flies.
I use to play competitive war2 back in the day on Kali
the vision is small because it's designed to be played in 640x480 like starcraft,
more war2 content plz!
playing warcraft 1 was a nightmare! you should make a video about that!
It's pretty fun, actually. Just played through the campaigns 2 months ago. Much easier than War2.
insane that this turned into wow. pre 2008 bliz goated. rip
Used to love this game as a teen. I'VE GOT A FLYING MACHINE!
You guys should play warcraft 1, with mouse mod. Havent played it multiplayer yet but story mode i enjoyed far more than warcraft 2s. Wc1 have more delicate economy och micro (the capapult lol). WC: Orcs and Humans is the brood war of the warcraft rts series!
havent heard of an underground scene though, maybe i should start one myself....
I really love WarCraft 1, glad someone agrees with me that the original is akin to Brood war in a lot ways.
The art style was cooler too.
Yes! those donut huts! its darker and grittier@@KaiserMattTygore927
That was surprisingly sick 😅
This the way it was played on kali with cases ladder in the 90s
I'll be honest I've never even opened this game or owned it so this was brand new and interesting, thanks! I had no idea what this even looked like. It would have come right before my introduction to video games and RTS which was Starcraft 64 😅. Loved it and bought it on PC. I was 10.
I'm not sure if this is a rabbit hole I want to go down but if Tasteless tries it I will!
Nick mentioned the ridiculous lack of vision.
The original AOE was also like that. You could have the enemy right next to your camp and not know it. They improved it with the Rise of Rome expansion and again with AOE2.
Crazy how much people still love and play these old RTS games.
I remember only a few years ago I found out the original AoE game still had a competitive scene in Vietnam. Bit of a surprise
Love the Warcraft 2 content!!!
Bro, I have been watching @warcraft 2 channel on UA-cam. Very fun to watch!
how about the WarCraft III scene, OH Mighty Tasles
funny to see a younger streamer come in and rediscover a game i played as a kid
There are many games that the competitive goes strong ( red alert 2, lord of rings, Cossack 2, planetary annihilation ( and kingdoms too! ) despite the main producer either abandoned or died.
I just hope some games could get similar love and passion, there alot of still great Rts that could revived with our current level of rts understanding.
The sound effects where so fucking good in this game
I think i still have my copy of the original disc somewhere.
Definitely one of my favorite worker voiceovers. along with the GLA worker from C&C Generals. lol, if you know - you know. (That poor restless soul)
edit: for those curious, here is the GLA worker's voiceover: ua-cam.com/video/M4vIlLj-hiw/v-deo.html - I suggest going to a minute and 20 seconds in exactly, as that's where it gets to where you just feel sorry for the guy. :( Just get em' some shoes, Boss! Who knows? Maybe he gets those slippers after all...
I used to play this back in 2009-2010 and its very hard
What an interesting video :> for the first time i enjoy one of your solo videos because you have a good personality and you can be a face of warcraft 2 ^^.
Great stuff!
Now we need Tasteless to talk about Cosmonarchy Broodwar
neat blast from the past
Keep grindin Tassels
wow I have not seen WC2 gameplay since I played it when I was like 5 lol this is nuts
this rules. brought back a very specific memory from when i was playing this heavily around...12? 13? years old playing on bnet grinding the ladder with the freaks that played back then. always checked in and saw the game being kept alive thru russian servers n such. i'm in a discord thats still super active for it and regularly holds tournaments for like $100. would love for you to cast more haha
sc1 player discovers there are life beyond sc1