Electrolysis is what happens... (I'm an ASE and state of Michigan, certified Master Automotive Technician and own Reliable Auto Repair of Wayne) In ANY bi-metal engine (i.e aluminum heads, iron block) coolant goes bad and turns acidic... It then combined with a ferrous and non-ferrous metal, makes a battery essentially.... This eats away at any steel or iron components in the cooling system.... i have seen this problem with the impeller dozens of times... You can check it by removing the upper rad hose, and start the engine with the rad hose facing a bucket.... It should pump coolant out very quickly... If it does not, you need a pump...
Until you flush it every 60000, or leave it if it stays red. It's kind of like why flush tranny fluid if it is still red, clear (it hasnt lost it's viscosity in that at any rate)
I had it inside mine for 5 years and definitely less than 60000 kilometers, and now i'm gonna change it since i'm putting a new radiator on (factory one has a very small leak on it). It's still red, but not as clear as the new one.
+g money I was gonna say that cute girl in your profile picture is your girlfriend and that you're a guy but that girl is actually you! :O So a short cute girl is a master tech? Either this generation is really different now or you're lying. :P
@DAQUAN88 Interesting approach. I think the most important clue for this is an overheat on the highway but not at idle, opposite of a bad cooling fan. After eliminating the other usual possibilities I think it's safe to start looking to the water pump or a coolant flow problem for the cause of this type of overheat. Thanks for your comment.
I've had this problem with my car for years with the overheating and the no heat. Car is 97 Protege with 107000 miles on it but it was used by another person for a few months and they drove it more in those few months than I did in years. So yeah water pump failed and this video helped out greatly. UA-cam to the rescue again.
The two times I've had water-pumps fail on me (two different cars, BTW), I've noticed that the heater quits working, or doesn't work as well as it used to. That's the primary indicator (in my mind, anyway) that your water pump is dead or dying.
There's nothing like watching an Eric the Car Guy vid after a long day. I sit the laptop on my, well, lap, grab a glass of cab sav, sit back and enjoy Eric doing his thing. I hope you never stop making auto vids Eric. They are the best.
7 years later, I have just bought a 57 plate Mondeo 1.8 diesel (uk) and driving round small side streets, it was absolutely fine, soon as speed built up, heater went cold and the temp gauge shot up to a dangerous level, shut down and parked up, its now in for belts and water pump, because I watched this video. Many thanks ETCG
Dj J-Doo sorry, yes it did, my mechanic told me the pump looked fine but replaced it anyway I sat at 70 mph for 20 minutes on the motorway with no issues at all
@ElderlyIron Interesting approach however I see air in the system cause intermittent heat issues as well. I think the most important clue to this issue is that it would overheat while driving on the highway but not idling, I think this is an indication of a cooling system efficiency problem as when the vehicle is under load it will increase the heat load. Thanks for your input and your comment.
@EricWaterTruck You are correct that as coolant breaks down it will become acidic and electrically charged. The reason it begins to corrode the system is 2 part, one part because of the acidity but also because it looses it's rust inhibiters. Thanks for the comment.
@Kirayamatoplay That works great on engines where the water pump is accessible but in many cases it's not possible to do that without tearing the engine down. Thanks for the suggestion and comment.
My automotive book says to warm the engine to operating temperature then shut it off and squeeze the upper radiator hose while an assistant starts the engine again. Apparently you should feel a pressure surge in the hose to know if the water pump if forcing coolant through the system. I don't know if it works though because i haven't tried it yet.
If you have a return pipe from the radiator to the reservoir tank i think that if you see the coolant flowing through this pipe into the reservoir once the thermostat opens you have a good pump (at least one that pumps; then if you hear strange noises around it then the bearing is about to give up).
@axenz1 I think the metal is only part of the equation, I think the real culprit is the breakdown of the coolant due to lack of service (it and the H2O pump should have been changed at 60K), coolant is mostly water, when it breaks down it looses it's rust inhibitors and therefore will increase corrosion, it also becomes more acidic and develops an electric charge, all of these things add up to accelerated corrosion so I agree, poor quality coolant. Thanks for the comment.
@kneedown4GOD I don't think that was the case, I think not changing the belt and pump at the service interval of 60K caused it, in fact this was caused by inaction rather than an action. Thanks for your comment.
@finalman82 As for zinc I've never tried it but in theory it should work to help eliminate the corrosion in the cooling system. I think just following the service recommendation on this engine would have eliminated this situation as the coolant and water pump should have been replaced at 60K. Your assessment of the overheat is correct in that when the engine is not under load such as at idle it will not produce as much heat as when cruising or under load. Thanks for the comment.
@hubbleISS You are correct, in fact the heat in this car still isn't great, it probably needs a flush just like you say, I think it's more like sediment rather than "pieces" of the old impeller, I'm sure there is other corrosion in there too. Thanks for the comment.
@chillincruisin Yes it is my own shop. I don't advertise however or solicit work, for the most part people know me and seek me out for repairs and if I have time I record those repairs and post them here. My business is strictly word of mouth and I plan to keep it that way as I spend a great deal of time making these videos and growing ETCG, I don't have much interest in growing the repair side of the business.
@EricTheCarGuy have fun making more videos. It is great to see folks using the internet for productive purpose like this and a place to share knowledge that is benefiting to all. Take care.
@thaik56 If you suspect a belt you might start by tightening them all up a little to see if the noise goes away, if the belts are old you might want to replace them altogether. If that's not the issue look to see if your stock air snorkel is fitted properly if it's not it could also cause a noise like that. Good luck and thanks for your comments.
Was loose for a while a owner stretched every day out of it it played rust recipe before it eventually failed belong usage then thats where they decided to change it
@2ub40 Forget the heater core it's really not possible for that to cause an overheat but if you have ANY coolant leaks they should be addressed and if you have overheat problems I recommend you follow the steps in the video that I directed you to.
PS: It's nice to see someone who actually understands methodical, rational diagnosis. Haven't watched all videos, but if you are a shop (which I think you are) you are one of an elite few mechanics customers can trust.
@happy543210 Bleeder valves are not for bleeding air out of a hot cooling system they are there to help fill the system faster by giving the air in the system a place to escape as the incoming coolant displaces it.
@midlantic1 I've had lots of comments about plastic impellers on some pumps including BMW. I haven't seen one myself yet but that sounds even cheeper. Thanks for the comment.
@dseries16 In my experience it's mostly air in the cooling system that causes intermittent heat especially on Hondas. You are correct about coolant draining out of the weep hole under pressure, I covered this in the Diagnosing an Overheat video. Thanks for weighing in.
@happy543210 No, I don't think they did anything to the coolant, I think they didn't do anything at all and the cheep coolant and cheep impeller added up to this failure. Keep in mind that Hyundai puts the belt and pump replacement at 60K so if that was done at that time we wouldn't have this problem on this car.
Car overheats, owner starts putting water in it with little or no anti-freeze, water rusts impeller, and/or winter comes block partially freezes start the car, and shear off pump impellers.
ipissed I think the belt would slip or the ice would brake before the pump will shear off it's fins. Also wouldn't the fins still be in the cooling system? If they didn't corode and they just broke off.
Good video. I had the same thing happen on a 1987 jeep YJ. Cheap punched steel impeller and old coolant that had no anti-corrosion properties left caused the exact same damage you show. I have also seen a few impellers that had odd erosion patterns caused by cavitation.
@4micaman That's a gerat idea but may engine designs to not allow for this type of inspection but on the ones that do this would be a great test, thanks for the comment.
@EvilDemonRain If you pressure test it I'm sure the leak will be visible and remove all doubt. I suggest taking the time to do this since a head gasket is often labor intensive and I rarely see them leak externally.
@j300ex1 Yea those plastic impellers are not long for this world. It is true that as coolant breaks down it does become more acidic. Thanks for your input.
@Moosepiesandwich I'm not so sure about that, as coolant when it heats up expands which would also make the hose feel hard. I think the best clue is that if it overheats on the highway and you have eliminated all the other possibilities listed in the overheat video then it may be time to look into the water pump or some other flow issue. Thanks for your input.
One of the most useful tools used in numerous fields of work I've added to my collection is a thermal imaging camera. Watch in real time parts heat up or not. I use it in HVAC and construction for appliances, walls/windows, water leaks inside walls etc. $250 will get you a FLIR for your phone. Also, for automotive, see cylinder exhaust manifold for dead cylinders, in & out of catalytic converter for clog etc, etc.
@mrexecutive1 Interesting approach however after some thought I think if the symptom is that the overheat occurs on the highway and not while idling is the most important clue as this would indicate a problem with cooling system efficiency. I would first eliminate all other possibilities and then suspect the water pump or a restriction in the system.
@XYtruck25 If you have a gasket DO NOT use RTV as it can actually cause a leak not to mention make a mess that needs to be cleaned up the next time you replace that component, let the gasket do it's work.
@Bushougoma I agree about adding too much tap water. In this case I think the coolant just broke down and lost it's rust inhibitors, couple that with a cheep metal impeller and you have what you see here. I will say however that if they had changed the belt and pump at 60K like it's recommended it probably would have never happened.
@linuxbox11 Well thank you for that. Sometimes I have the time to make a video and sometimes I don't. If I make a video it adds a significant amount of time to a job and sometimes I just need to get it done. Thanks again for your comment.
@thaik56 Probably not. If you have a 'cold air intake' I would look there as I've seen those cause that condition often. The stock intake actually has mufflers to prevent this from happening.
@HGarden27 Couple of ways, you can do the standard drain and refill, personally I do this whenever I do the water pump because the coolant will come out anyway. The second method is with a dedicated machine that does this very thing, it will do the best job. It's very important however that you bleed the air out of the system after you refill it with new coolant, if not you will have cooling system problems.
@AcheLone Sometimes but if it's bad enough to make noise failure is imminent. I would look to other possible causes of the noise before I condemned the water pump however.
@slemy077 I don't think that would work because as the coolant heats up it expands and would make the hose feel hard if the water pump was working or not. Thanks for the input.
@paigen65 I don't think that would work as it really isn't conclusive of anything. Hot coolant exposed to the atmosphere would boil out of the bleeder even if there wasn't any flow because you are allowing atmospheric pressure into a pressurized system thus causing the coolant to boil instantly. Thanks for the input though.
@EvilDemonRain I know Fiat, in fact they own Chrysler now and we should see them here in the states soon. Anyway as to your problem it sounds like you can easily see where that water is going if not you might want to get a pressure tester and pressurize the system to make the leak more apparent, I show this is the Diagnosing an Overheat video if you want a visual. Keep me posted.
@founditnow54 I agree, I think both the impeller and the coolant were not of good quality and this is the result. In Hyundai's defense however they do recommend changing out the belt and pump at 60K.
@ptlraven It could be a restriction in the system somewhere or the radiator is not working as well as it should, the only way to really test for this is to take the temperature at different points on the radiator and look for inconsistencies. You might also check for debris in front of the radiator. Good luck.
@TeDuaMalakie I don't think this coolant was ever changed and as a result caused this failure. The interval for replacing the water pump on this car is 60K, had they done that along with a coolant change I don't think this would have happened.
@shak11uk You still haven't mentioned the type of car but I can say right off that 'thinking' something is working is not often good enough especially with electrical diagnosis. Don't forget to check for air in the system because if the sensor is getting bad information it won't turn the fans on properly.
How to check water pump function: Take the radiator cap off, start the cold car. Watch the coolant and raise the rpm's by stepping on the gas. If the water goes down, your pump works. If the water stays stationary, it doesn't work. When the engine is cold, the thermostat is closed. So when you step on the gas, the pump will suck in water from the radiator and the water level will look like it's going down a bit. This trick works on older cars. You can see this in action when you're bleeding your coolant system.
Ford M Garage Problem is im not sure this works in closed systems where the only cap is on the reservoir... Im having this iisue roght now on a 2009 Pontiac Wave G3 Coolant level is full, thermostat was changed in past few months, but the temp guage stays super low no matter how long you drive the vehicle and the heater doesnt pump out very hot anymore... But this also was the symptoms we had before changing the thermostat... very worked for awhile now this again... 2 new thermostats in 1.5 yrs and its doing it again, but this time it almost smells like when you burn a pot full of water on the stove... I suspect water pump, but who knows... comfuses my that temp gauge barely reads anything...
@snowbrdr200 I would say that Honda coolant and impeller materials are of a higher quality, thats why they lasted the way they did. I will also say that had the owner of this car changed the water pump and coolant at 60K as recommended this wouldn't have happened.
@Danny211897ike Well done, you found a bad water pump. The shaft should not have any movement in it, if it does it would indicate the bushing is worn out and it needs to be replaced. Good luck.
@elihurodriguez I got a very interesting email this morning about checking the vent temperatures of the heater that seemed very promising, I think I'm going to try that method next time I suspect a problem like this. Thanks for your input and comment.
@ibanez9228 This is not a common problem you might want to watch the video I did on Diagnosing An Overheat first and go through those steps, might save you some time and money if the water pump is not the problem. Good luck and thanks for the comment.
Exactly this has happened to my mother's Peugeot 307. Water pump failed, engine overheated and headgasket blew pushing oil in the coolant system. So in other words. I noticed the oil in the water reservoir. That meant taking the head off the engine. And as soon as I started to replace the timing belt and water pump, I found the original overheating problem.
I really enjoy these videos. I'm a newbie, as in never done this at all, and can still pretty much follow it. No money to pay someone, but one of my cheaper hobbies anyway. I have a 1995 Honda Accord LX Wagon. I've replaced the starter, distributor cap, alternator, and fuel filter. The guy who first diagnosed it pointed toward accessory belts, timing belt, and water pump. Found out where my coolant was leaking from, but think I had already toasted the head gasket. I only paid $1350, so just practicing is cheaper than a class or mechanic. Keep up the good work!
@jaklvm12 Thanks for the tip but honestly I think during your second attempt you were able to get the air out of the cooling system which probably also helped the issue. Thanks for the update.
Just. For example you can check a no flow problem by putting your coolant pressure tester on your radiator pump up to 5 psi push throttle to 2000 rpms the reading should drop on standard systems or rise on reverse flow system if it don't move your pump is shot
A lot of newer cars went to composite or plastic impellers, which have to tendency to fail as well. For testing bad water pump fine, is it possible to put a PSI gauge on the radiator to see if it build pressure? I know it will build some pressure just from heating up, but one would figure it would be minimal when the engine is cold, thoughts?
On my 2005 Chrysler T&C the water pump impeller came loose from the shaft and caused a sudden overheating problem. No leaking water or other symptoms, just pow. When the car started to overheat I turned the heater on high and noticed very hot air came out, but within 15 seconds it was blowing just warm air. This seemed odd and my first thought was that I had blown a hose and was low on coolent, but that was not the case. It seems when the water pump impeller fails and stops pumping the common "red flag" is no heat from the heater even though the coolent level is fine. Symptoms of no flow are similar to a thermostat stuck shut, but with a stuck thermostat the heater will work great. The water pump in this video likely deteriorated over time as the impeller corroded/rusted away and symptoms worsened. In my case the impeller was plastic, and they seem to either have an blade break off and cause the others to disintegrate or the entire impeller spins on the shaft.
I am wondering if my 2004 Dodge Durango may have a similar issue with it's water pump. I have had overheating issues for a while and thought I fixed it two weeks ago with a brand new radiator. Now it's doing the same thing again. I can drive it short distances with no problems but as soon as I get ready to park or if I try to take it on a long trip and a lot of traffic it will start trying to overheat. I changed the radiator, hoses, thermostat, temperature sensor , and before the radiator I flushed the entire system then put new coolant in new radiator. The last thing I did was install a brand new radiator cap. I have absolutely no leaks and I'm not losing coolant. The reserve jug stays between the minimum and full mark. There is no clog in the reserve jug tube going to the filler neck. The upper hose gets hot and the lower hose stays cool and the clutch fan seems to be operating okay. Absolutely no leaks under the car. I am wondering if the plastic blades are deteriorating or if the impeller is loose on the shaft like yours.
@Lillie1986 Not always so easy in my experience especially if the thermostat isn't open. Normally you eliminate all other overheat possibilities before you look to the water pump however it's become more common since some manufacturers use plastic impellers that can be damaged easily.
1998 ford Taurus never over heated but had no heat, the water pump looked same as that. Nasty rusty coolant. Keep that coolant changed regularly. the heater core was plugged up also.
In my 93 Honda Civic 1.6l I've had a few symptoms like the one you stated before, a loud yelling noise from the engine bay and really bad leaking from the timing belt area of the engine
@eleeter Yea I think it was factory coolant and I don't think it was that great to start with, I also think that is the reason they wanted the water pump changed out at 60K.
@SanFranWay A couple of people have mentioned plastic impellers and the issues with them. It's a shame because for the most part BMW makes a pretty good car.
@GMENALLDAWAY81 The heater core is there for YOUR comfort it has nothing to do with the cooling of the engine, you could remove it or bypass it and the engine cooling would not be effected one bit. If you wish to challenge my master tech status fine but don't expect me to continue to try and help you especially if you refuse my advice.
@chicks123 I would say that is not an accurate test. The best thing to do is rule everything else out as this would be at the bottom of my list of things that would cause an overheat.
@shyameetu To me it sounds like air in the cooling system, if you did not bleed the air from the system after your repairs this is the most likely cause. I recommend you watch the video that I did on dealing with Cooling System Overheat issues as I cover that and some other suggestions you might benefit from.
I have a Mini Cooper that was overheating a few years back. I was 15 yo, loved the car, it was nearly abandoned, as my father was not inclined to spend more money on it, having changed the head gasket, radiator, pipes, thermostat, and everything else BUT the water pump, as it was not leaking. I took the water pump out (which is not easy in a Mini, as the fan is actually bolted to the water pump, so it's necessary to take the radiator out of its housing, take the fan, and the the pump) and two of the impeller's blades were broken, stopping the water flow. So yes, it happens! :P
Hey Eric what takes place between to dissimilar metals ? electrolysis maybe ? You add that to the lack of any PM maintenance and you get what they got . nice Video .....
@aeligos As for removing hoses that would work I suppose but it would probably make a mess no matter what you do, I like your check of the impeller better, if it doesn't move and the blades are good then the pump is good.
Supposedly BMW coolant contains additives which prevent corrosion and rust, but those additives become less effective over time. If the coolant in this car was similar, then the lack of coolant changes could have been a primary cause of the blades rusting off.
I really appreciate your videos because you explain what could have happened what has happened and what usually does happen and that really helps me learn. I doubt my 79 el camino has ever had the pump changed lol im the second owner. It just overheated today, and I remembered my heat never worked. (Im level 2 out of 10 mechanic skill Lvl)
Eric takes all automotive questions at his forum now. Anyway, I wouldn't worry about it. Every once in a while, a drop or two of coolant will get past that seal. You don't have to worry unless your coolant level drops.
@foleygac There are a few American cars with plastic impellers as well that hold up about as good. I guess manufacturers are seeing how cheep they can make things and still get away with it these days.
@spelunkerd I only put sealant on bolts that go into a water jacket, if they don't go into a water jacket leave them alone. I actually just read Bushougoma's comment and I agree with everything he posted.
Electrolysis is what happens... (I'm an ASE and state of Michigan, certified Master Automotive Technician and own Reliable Auto Repair of Wayne) In ANY bi-metal engine (i.e aluminum heads, iron block) coolant goes bad and turns acidic... It then combined with a ferrous and non-ferrous metal, makes a battery essentially.... This eats away at any steel or iron components in the cooling system.... i have seen this problem with the impeller dozens of times... You can check it by removing the upper rad hose, and start the engine with the rad hose facing a bucket.... It should pump coolant out very quickly... If it does not, you need a pump...
I've heard that G12 (the red coolant) is rated lifetime.
Until you flush it every 60000, or leave it if it stays red.
It's kind of like why flush tranny fluid if it is still red, clear (it hasnt lost it's viscosity in that at any rate)
So,m then there must be an additive that can prevent this.....water-to-glycol mix change?
I had it inside mine for 5 years and definitely less than 60000 kilometers, and now i'm gonna change it since i'm putting a new radiator on (factory one has a very small leak on it). It's still red, but not as clear as the new one.
+g money I was gonna say that cute girl in your profile picture is your girlfriend and that you're a guy but that girl is actually you! :O
So a short cute girl is a master tech? Either this generation is really different now or you're lying. :P
@DAQUAN88 Interesting approach. I think the most important clue for this is an overheat on the highway but not at idle, opposite of a bad cooling fan. After eliminating the other usual possibilities I think it's safe to start looking to the water pump or a coolant flow problem for the cause of this type of overheat. Thanks for your comment.
I've had this problem with my car for years with the overheating and the no heat. Car is 97 Protege with 107000 miles on it but it was used by another person for a few months and they drove it more in those few months than I did in years. So yeah water pump failed and this video helped out greatly. UA-cam to the rescue again.
The two times I've had water-pumps fail on me (two different cars, BTW), I've noticed that the heater quits working, or doesn't work as well as it used to. That's the primary indicator (in my mind, anyway) that your water pump is dead or dying.
There's nothing like watching an Eric the Car Guy vid after a long day. I sit the laptop on my, well, lap, grab a glass of cab sav, sit back and enjoy Eric doing his thing. I hope you never stop making auto vids Eric. They are the best.
Bro straight up lol, here I am straight out of work, having my late night lunch while watching , such a great guy , very informative.
7 years later, I have just bought a 57 plate Mondeo 1.8 diesel (uk) and driving round small side streets, it was absolutely fine, soon as speed built up, heater went cold and the temp gauge shot up to a dangerous level, shut down and parked up, its now in for belts and water pump, because I watched this video. Many thanks ETCG
Tim Wilkie Did that fix the problem?
Dj J-Doo sorry, yes it did, my mechanic told me the pump looked fine but replaced it anyway I sat at 70 mph for 20 minutes on the motorway with no issues at all
Tim Wilkie nice!
@ElderlyIron Interesting approach however I see air in the system cause intermittent heat issues as well. I think the most important clue to this issue is that it would overheat while driving on the highway but not idling, I think this is an indication of a cooling system efficiency problem as when the vehicle is under load it will increase the heat load. Thanks for your input and your comment.
@EricWaterTruck You are correct that as coolant breaks down it will become acidic and electrically charged. The reason it begins to corrode the system is 2 part, one part because of the acidity but also because it looses it's rust inhibiters. Thanks for the comment.
@Kirayamatoplay That works great on engines where the water pump is accessible but in many cases it's not possible to do that without tearing the engine down. Thanks for the suggestion and comment.
11 Years later ... The video is still good as new.!
@Standingwithfeast Thanks for that great comment, I really appreciate it.
My automotive book says to warm the engine to operating temperature then shut it off and squeeze the upper radiator hose while an assistant starts the engine again. Apparently you should feel a pressure surge in the hose to know if the water pump if forcing coolant through the system. I don't know if it works though because i haven't tried it yet.
If you have a return pipe from the radiator to the reservoir tank i think that if you see the coolant flowing through this pipe into the reservoir once the thermostat opens you have a good pump (at least one that pumps; then if you hear strange noises around it then the bearing is about to give up).
Can you share with me what the title of your book is?
@infinity3jif It's not actually a bearing but a bushing and it does wear out and can make a heck of a racket when it does. Thanks for the comment.
@axenz1 I think the metal is only part of the equation, I think the real culprit is the breakdown of the coolant due to lack of service (it and the H2O pump should have been changed at 60K), coolant is mostly water, when it breaks down it looses it's rust inhibitors and therefore will increase corrosion, it also becomes more acidic and develops an electric charge, all of these things add up to accelerated corrosion so I agree, poor quality coolant. Thanks for the comment.
@kneedown4GOD I don't think that was the case, I think not changing the belt and pump at the service interval of 60K caused it, in fact this was caused by inaction rather than an action. Thanks for your comment.
@finalman82 As for zinc I've never tried it but in theory it should work to help eliminate the corrosion in the cooling system. I think just following the service recommendation on this engine would have eliminated this situation as the coolant and water pump should have been replaced at 60K. Your assessment of the overheat is correct in that when the engine is not under load such as at idle it will not produce as much heat as when cruising or under load. Thanks for the comment.
@hubbleISS You are correct, in fact the heat in this car still isn't great, it probably needs a flush just like you say, I think it's more like sediment rather than "pieces" of the old impeller, I'm sure there is other corrosion in there too. Thanks for the comment.
@chillincruisin Yes it is my own shop. I don't advertise however or solicit work, for the most part people know me and seek me out for repairs and if I have time I record those repairs and post them here. My business is strictly word of mouth and I plan to keep it that way as I spend a great deal of time making these videos and growing ETCG, I don't have much interest in growing the repair side of the business.
@EricTheCarGuy have fun making more videos. It is great to see folks using the internet for productive purpose like this and a place to share knowledge that is benefiting to all. Take care.
@thaik56 If you suspect a belt you might start by tightening them all up a little to see if the noise goes away, if the belts are old you might want to replace them altogether. If that's not the issue look to see if your stock air snorkel is fitted properly if it's not it could also cause a noise like that. Good luck and thanks for your comments.
I've never seen an impeller waste away to that degree. Great information on the cooling system in general. Nice vid.
Was loose for a while a owner stretched every day out of it it played rust recipe before it eventually failed belong usage then thats where they decided to change it
@2ub40 Forget the heater core it's really not possible for that to cause an overheat but if you have ANY coolant leaks they should be addressed and if you have overheat problems I recommend you follow the steps in the video that I directed you to.
PS: It's nice to see someone who actually understands methodical, rational diagnosis. Haven't watched all videos, but if you are a shop (which I think you are) you are one of an elite few mechanics customers can trust.
@happy543210 Bleeder valves are not for bleeding air out of a hot cooling system they are there to help fill the system faster by giving the air in the system a place to escape as the incoming coolant displaces it.
@midlantic1 I've had lots of comments about plastic impellers on some pumps including BMW. I haven't seen one myself yet but that sounds even cheeper. Thanks for the comment.
@dseries16 In my experience it's mostly air in the cooling system that causes intermittent heat especially on Hondas. You are correct about coolant draining out of the weep hole under pressure, I covered this in the Diagnosing an Overheat video. Thanks for weighing in.
@happy543210 No, I don't think they did anything to the coolant, I think they didn't do anything at all and the cheep coolant and cheep impeller added up to this failure. Keep in mind that Hyundai puts the belt and pump replacement at 60K so if that was done at that time we wouldn't have this problem on this car.
I just want to let you know that I enjoy watching your videos. It's not boring and I learn something new each time. Thanks.
Car overheats, owner starts putting water in it with little or no anti-freeze, water rusts impeller, and/or winter comes block partially freezes start the car, and shear off pump impellers.
ipissed I think the belt would slip or the ice would brake before the pump will shear off it's fins.
Also wouldn't the fins still be in the cooling system? If they didn't corode and they just broke off.
@@12101DyM how bout they were corroded so broke easily.
Good video. I had the same thing happen on a 1987 jeep YJ. Cheap punched steel impeller and old coolant that had no anti-corrosion properties left caused the exact same damage you show. I have also seen a few impellers that had odd erosion patterns caused by cavitation.
@4micaman That's a gerat idea but may engine designs to not allow for this type of inspection but on the ones that do this would be a great test, thanks for the comment.
thank you and your viewers, without you guys i wouldn't have been able to fix my car. the impellers on my water pump were completely gone. thank you
@EvilDemonRain If you pressure test it I'm sure the leak will be visible and remove all doubt. I suggest taking the time to do this since a head gasket is often labor intensive and I rarely see them leak externally.
@j300ex1 Yea those plastic impellers are not long for this world. It is true that as coolant breaks down it does become more acidic. Thanks for your input.
@Moosepiesandwich I'm not so sure about that, as coolant when it heats up expands which would also make the hose feel hard. I think the best clue is that if it overheats on the highway and you have eliminated all the other possibilities listed in the overheat video then it may be time to look into the water pump or some other flow issue. Thanks for your input.
@mystiqueman366 I'm really not sure of the logic of using plastic impellers as it just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. Thanks for the comment.
One of the most useful tools used in numerous fields of work I've added to my collection is a thermal imaging camera. Watch in real time parts heat up or not. I use it in HVAC and construction for appliances, walls/windows, water leaks inside walls etc. $250 will get you a FLIR for your phone. Also, for automotive, see cylinder exhaust manifold for dead cylinders, in & out of catalytic converter for clog etc, etc.
@siemenstraffic I do believe that is the reason for this failure and testament to your statement. Thanks for the comment.
@mrexecutive1 Interesting approach however after some thought I think if the symptom is that the overheat occurs on the highway and not while idling is the most important clue as this would indicate a problem with cooling system efficiency. I would first eliminate all other possibilities and then suspect the water pump or a restriction in the system.
@XYtruck25 If you have a gasket DO NOT use RTV as it can actually cause a leak not to mention make a mess that needs to be cleaned up the next time you replace that component, let the gasket do it's work.
@cipmars Indeed it would. Thanks for the comment.
@OptimusOne Thanks for the comment, good luck with the overheat.
@cov01crew Cool, glad you were able to find that as it's not an easy diagnosis. Thanks for the comment.
@Bushougoma I agree about adding too much tap water. In this case I think the coolant just broke down and lost it's rust inhibitors, couple that with a cheep metal impeller and you have what you see here. I will say however that if they had changed the belt and pump at 60K like it's recommended it probably would have never happened.
@Nztimr33 A few people have mentioned the plastic impellers, not a good idea in my opinion. Thanks for the comment.
@journeyquest1 For me I don't see this often so normally I would exhaust all other possibilities before I looked to the pump. Thanks for the comment.
@linuxbox11 Well thank you for that. Sometimes I have the time to make a video and sometimes I don't. If I make a video it adds a significant amount of time to a job and sometimes I just need to get it done. Thanks again for your comment.
@Jafromobile Excellent! I could not have put it better myself. Thanks for weighing in I really appreciate it.
Thanks Eric. I've never seen a water pump with an impeller that has corroded away like that. Very informative.
@thaik56 Probably not. If you have a 'cold air intake' I would look there as I've seen those cause that condition often. The stock intake actually has mufflers to prevent this from happening.
@HGarden27 Couple of ways, you can do the standard drain and refill, personally I do this whenever I do the water pump because the coolant will come out anyway. The second method is with a dedicated machine that does this very thing, it will do the best job. It's very important however that you bleed the air out of the system after you refill it with new coolant, if not you will have cooling system problems.
@AcheLone Sometimes but if it's bad enough to make noise failure is imminent. I would look to other possible causes of the noise before I condemned the water pump however.
@slemy077 I don't think that would work because as the coolant heats up it expands and would make the hose feel hard if the water pump was working or not. Thanks for the input.
@paigen65 I don't think that would work as it really isn't conclusive of anything. Hot coolant exposed to the atmosphere would boil out of the bleeder even if there wasn't any flow because you are allowing atmospheric pressure into a pressurized system thus causing the coolant to boil instantly. Thanks for the input though.
@EvilDemonRain I know Fiat, in fact they own Chrysler now and we should see them here in the states soon. Anyway as to your problem it sounds like you can easily see where that water is going if not you might want to get a pressure tester and pressurize the system to make the leak more apparent, I show this is the Diagnosing an Overheat video if you want a visual. Keep me posted.
Eric,
I used to work for Hyundai and this is a pretty common problem with the V/6 engines. Great informative video. Thanks for sharing.
@founditnow54 I agree, I think both the impeller and the coolant were not of good quality and this is the result. In Hyundai's defense however they do recommend changing out the belt and pump at 60K.
@ptlraven It could be a restriction in the system somewhere or the radiator is not working as well as it should, the only way to really test for this is to take the temperature at different points on the radiator and look for inconsistencies. You might also check for debris in front of the radiator. Good luck.
@TeDuaMalakie I don't think this coolant was ever changed and as a result caused this failure. The interval for replacing the water pump on this car is 60K, had they done that along with a coolant change I don't think this would have happened.
@groutaone Thanks for the comment, good to see you.
@shak11uk You still haven't mentioned the type of car but I can say right off that 'thinking' something is working is not often good enough especially with electrical diagnosis. Don't forget to check for air in the system because if the sensor is getting bad information it won't turn the fans on properly.
How to check water pump function:
Take the radiator cap off, start the cold car. Watch the coolant and raise the rpm's by stepping on the gas.
If the water goes down, your pump works. If the water stays stationary, it doesn't work.
When the engine is cold, the thermostat is closed. So when you step on the gas, the pump will suck in water from the radiator and the water level will look like it's going down a bit.
This trick works on older cars. You can see this in action when you're bleeding your coolant system.
Ford M Garage
Problem is im not sure this works in closed systems where the only cap is on the reservoir...
Im having this iisue roght now on a 2009 Pontiac Wave G3
Coolant level is full, thermostat was changed in past few months, but the temp guage stays super low no matter how long you drive the vehicle and the heater doesnt pump out very hot anymore...
But this also was the symptoms we had before changing the thermostat... very worked for awhile now this again...
2 new thermostats in 1.5 yrs and its doing it again, but this time it almost smells like when you burn a pot full of water on the stove...
I suspect water pump, but who knows... comfuses my that temp gauge barely reads anything...
@snowbrdr200 I would say that Honda coolant and impeller materials are of a higher quality, thats why they lasted the way they did. I will also say that had the owner of this car changed the water pump and coolant at 60K as recommended this wouldn't have happened.
@Danny211897ike Well done, you found a bad water pump. The shaft should not have any movement in it, if it does it would indicate the bushing is worn out and it needs to be replaced. Good luck.
@seniorjohnl A few people have mentioned that technique but I've never had any luck with it. Thanks for the comment.
@2ub40 I wouldn't go that far but if I read you correctly it's just leaking at a hose, why not replace the hose and see what happens then?
@elihurodriguez I got a very interesting email this morning about checking the vent temperatures of the heater that seemed very promising, I think I'm going to try that method next time I suspect a problem like this. Thanks for your input and comment.
@ibanez9228 This is not a common problem you might want to watch the video I did on Diagnosing An Overheat first and go through those steps, might save you some time and money if the water pump is not the problem. Good luck and thanks for the comment.
@kenman1717 Not at all as they pretty much turned to dust, they didn't just break off so much as rotted away.
Exactly this has happened to my mother's Peugeot 307. Water pump failed, engine overheated and headgasket blew pushing oil in the coolant system. So in other words. I noticed the oil in the water reservoir. That meant taking the head off the engine. And as soon as I started to replace the timing belt and water pump, I found the original overheating problem.
I really enjoy these videos. I'm a newbie, as in never done this at all, and can still pretty much follow it. No money to pay someone, but one of my cheaper hobbies anyway. I have a 1995 Honda Accord LX Wagon. I've replaced the starter, distributor cap, alternator, and fuel filter. The guy who first diagnosed it pointed toward accessory belts, timing belt, and water pump. Found out where my coolant was leaking from, but think I had already toasted the head gasket. I only paid $1350, so just practicing is cheaper than a class or mechanic. Keep up the good work!
@testbooster I don't have one of those yet but the next time I get one in I hope to make a video.
@jaklvm12 Thanks for the tip but honestly I think during your second attempt you were able to get the air out of the cooling system which probably also helped the issue. Thanks for the update.
Just. For example you can check a no flow problem by putting your coolant pressure tester on your radiator pump up to 5 psi push throttle to 2000 rpms the reading should drop on standard systems or rise on reverse flow system if it don't move your pump is shot
@Michiganborn1969 No, the lesson here is to maintain your vehicle. BTW this is the same car as in the Looking into the Horses Mouth video.
@daddybraz Thanks for the comment and good luck with whatever you decide.
A lot of newer cars went to composite or plastic impellers, which have to tendency to fail as well. For testing bad water pump fine, is it possible to put a PSI gauge on the radiator to see if it build pressure? I know it will build some pressure just from heating up, but one would figure it would be minimal when the engine is cold, thoughts?
@pabllosee I think Honda also uses a better coolant than Hyundai that doesn't break down like this one did.
On my 2005 Chrysler T&C the water pump impeller came loose from the shaft and caused a sudden overheating problem. No leaking water or other symptoms, just pow. When the car started to overheat I turned the heater on high and noticed very hot air came out, but within 15 seconds it was blowing just warm air. This seemed odd and my first thought was that I had blown a hose and was low on coolent, but that was not the case. It seems when the water pump impeller fails and stops pumping the common "red flag" is no heat from the heater even though the coolent level is fine. Symptoms of no flow are similar to a thermostat stuck shut, but with a stuck thermostat the heater will work great.
The water pump in this video likely deteriorated over time as the impeller corroded/rusted away and symptoms worsened. In my case the impeller was plastic, and they seem to either have an blade break off and cause the others to disintegrate or the entire impeller spins on the shaft.
I am wondering if my 2004 Dodge Durango may have a similar issue with it's water pump. I have had overheating issues for a while and thought I fixed it two weeks ago with a brand new radiator. Now it's doing the same thing again. I can drive it short distances with no problems but as soon as I get ready to park or if I try to take it on a long trip and a lot of traffic it will start trying to overheat. I changed the radiator, hoses, thermostat, temperature sensor , and before the radiator I flushed the entire system then put new coolant in new radiator. The last thing I did was install a brand new radiator cap. I have absolutely no leaks and I'm not losing coolant. The reserve jug stays between the minimum and full mark. There is no clog in the reserve jug tube going to the filler neck. The upper hose gets hot and the lower hose stays cool and the clutch fan seems to be operating okay. Absolutely no leaks under the car. I am wondering if the plastic blades are deteriorating or if the impeller is loose on the shaft like yours.
@Lillie1986 Not always so easy in my experience especially if the thermostat isn't open. Normally you eliminate all other overheat possibilities before you look to the water pump however it's become more common since some manufacturers use plastic impellers that can be damaged easily.
@CRISTIAN123JOSE That would be the ideal but it's not available to everyone. Thanks for weighing in.
1998 ford Taurus never over heated but had no heat, the water pump looked same as that. Nasty rusty coolant. Keep that coolant changed regularly. the heater core was plugged up also.
@RamblinAround Yea, that was cool. Thanks for the comment.
In my 93 Honda Civic 1.6l I've had a few symptoms like the one you stated before, a loud yelling noise from the engine bay and really bad leaking from the timing belt area of the engine
@eleeter Yea I think it was factory coolant and I don't think it was that great to start with, I also think that is the reason they wanted the water pump changed out at 60K.
@davelowe1977 I don't think that would be conclusive as it does not account for a restriction in the system or a sticking thermostat.
@SanFranWay A couple of people have mentioned plastic impellers and the issues with them. It's a shame because for the most part BMW makes a pretty good car.
@GMENALLDAWAY81 The heater core is there for YOUR comfort it has nothing to do with the cooling of the engine, you could remove it or bypass it and the engine cooling would not be effected one bit. If you wish to challenge my master tech status fine but don't expect me to continue to try and help you especially if you refuse my advice.
@chicks123 I would say that is not an accurate test. The best thing to do is rule everything else out as this would be at the bottom of my list of things that would cause an overheat.
@shyameetu To me it sounds like air in the cooling system, if you did not bleed the air from the system after your repairs this is the most likely cause. I recommend you watch the video that I did on dealing with Cooling System Overheat issues as I cover that and some other suggestions you might benefit from.
I have a Mini Cooper that was overheating a few years back.
I was 15 yo, loved the car, it was nearly abandoned, as my father was not inclined to spend more money on it, having changed the head gasket, radiator, pipes, thermostat, and everything else BUT the water pump, as it was not leaking.
I took the water pump out (which is not easy in a Mini, as the fan is actually bolted to the water pump, so it's necessary to take the radiator out of its housing, take the fan, and the the pump) and two of the impeller's blades were broken, stopping the water flow.
So yes, it happens! :P
Hey Eric what takes place between to dissimilar metals ? electrolysis maybe ? You add that to the lack of any PM maintenance and you get what they got . nice Video .....
@aeligos As for removing hoses that would work I suppose but it would probably make a mess no matter what you do, I like your check of the impeller better, if it doesn't move and the blades are good then the pump is good.
@idioticinc By your description it sounds like your going to need to replace the water pump and recheck the system for leaks when you are done.
@CASHGRILLO Honestly that sounds a bit complicated to be accurate and seems to rely a lot on 'feel'. Thanks for the suggestion.
Supposedly BMW coolant contains additives which prevent corrosion and rust, but those additives become less effective over time. If the coolant in this car was similar, then the lack of coolant changes could have been a primary cause of the blades rusting off.
I really appreciate your videos because you explain what could have happened what has happened and what usually does happen and that really helps me learn. I doubt my 79 el camino has ever had the pump changed lol im the second owner. It just overheated today, and I remembered my heat never worked. (Im level 2 out of 10 mechanic skill Lvl)
Eric takes all automotive questions at his forum now.
Anyway, I wouldn't worry about it. Every once in a while, a drop or two of coolant will get past that seal. You don't have to worry unless your coolant level drops.
@foleygac There are a few American cars with plastic impellers as well that hold up about as good. I guess manufacturers are seeing how cheep they can make things and still get away with it these days.
@spelunkerd I only put sealant on bolts that go into a water jacket, if they don't go into a water jacket leave them alone. I actually just read Bushougoma's comment and I agree with everything he posted.