Since there's been a lot of misunderstanding in the comments, here's a bit of clarification: The original Japanese dialogue is irrelevant to this discussion. This video is about how different translation decisions have consequences when it comes to how the narrative is perceived by English-speaking audiences. It has nothing to do with how Japanese-speaking viewers interpret Japanese-language dialogue. Similarly, while Japanese culture might require Deku to speak in a more subdued way (which I have presented here as "weak" or "uncertain"), that doesn't change the fact that the subbed dialogue is written in English for English-speaking audiences, and that those audiences are going to view that dialogue through a Western cultural lens rather than a Japanese one. In short, this is a video about viewer perception and how translation decisions change the messages of any particular show. It's not about comparing English and Japanese dialogue. That would be a great video to do, and someone else should absolutely do it, but I don't have the qualifications or the motivation to do it myself.
Except you don't need to view it through a western cultural lens, by simply learning about the original culture. Even just surface level knowledge obtained by not going "this is from my culture" and examining it as another culture suffices. Thank you for clarifying that you're explicitly always viewing it from a Western cultural lens at all times, though.
My point is that no, "English-speaking audiences" don't solely view things only through a Western cultural lens. Some of us actually learn aspects of the originating culture so we can understand those references on at least a surface level, not solely view them through the lens of our own culture group without that context.
Addendum, since how I come across might be taken the wrong way: I have no hate for EP at all, and rather enjoy his videos, especially the way he puts them together with visual aids and jokes. That doesn't mean I can't disagree with him, especially on a point that is rather core to myself and my perception of anime, having been part of the leadership for an anime club that was actually given advance copies of anime being brought over, like Blue Seed, to be a test audience for; we actually analyzed the cultural queues and discussed them amongst our group and with others, examining what aspects were inspired from stereotypes, which were inspired from cultural cues, and so on, so we actively learnt to view things from both a Western viewpoint and a Japanese viewpoint- or at least, to understand as best we could the source concepts involved and where and what they originated from, in a Japanese viewpoint.
13:31 One thing you missed here. E-Baby Deku says “I’m gonna be a hero just like him! And J-Baby Deku says “I wanna be a hero like him” This shows that J-Baby Deku thinks this goal is reachable, but sees it more as a fantasy and a possibility. But this also shows that E-Baby Deku sees this as an inevitability, and that he sees it as a goal he will reach no matter what. Just though I’d add this here.
Stormy Ray Waters I feel like there's something to be said about Japan's difference from America in the perception of talent, but I'm not focused enough right now to figure out what it is.
Tyler Johnson japan has a very passive culture in comparison to many western nations. and that's not saying they're weak, that's saying that the basis of their culture isn't centered on staring god in the eye and telling him to fuck off. due to this passive base, japan's culture tends to favour hard work in a very different way to the west. japanese hard work means that you basically drive yourself mad by focusing like a laser on a task until it's done, no matter how long it takes. this leads to japanese work ethic and mass suicide. in the west, "hard work" doesn't mean constant, omnipresent work. it means that you, personally, are exercising your will and ability to do something difficult, right here and in the moment. it means you're being proactive, not just doing busy work for the sake of it. this comes from a more active culture. there's also the simple fact that english sentence structure is not the same as japanese sentence structure, so a lot of changes had to be forced for those reasons as well. what this all amounts to is that j-deku would view becoming a hero as "working at something impossible every second of every day until it kills me". e-deku would view it as "working at something nobody's ever managed before and pioneering a field". simple culture shift combined with a language shift can radically change your outlook on a scenario.
the whole notion that the Japanese people that are working hard are doing so passively while the american who is hardly working is doing so proactively is quiet ridiculous. having actually done test in both countries the difference is that in America if you work hard, even if you are average or below, it is highly likely you will not only get a good grade you might even get a perfect score. on the other hand in a japanese test even you are of above avarege and working really hard a perfect score is going to be elusive.
this is interesting, but the main difference is the languages, Japanese is a lot more vague and less confident than English is as a whole. As an overseas English teacher, that's the crux of the problem with teaching asian people (I myself am a Korean American) English. Confidence is a very western thing, in Japanese, they naturally speak in a more roundabout way, being more passive rather than harsh, I studied Japanese for a few years, it's just a cultural thing. English Deku is written more for the western audiences to enjoy, while Japanese Deku is straight up that, a Japanese Deku lol
Your editing style is a giant clusterfuck on my screen. I have no idea what the hell is going on, and pausing the video to try to figure it out leaves you more confused than if you did nothing. I love it
I was looking through the comments to see if anyone else noticed what seems to be a running gag of just throwing more shit on top of the other shit on the screen
I love the idea of giving up your dream, wanting to suicide and then out of nowhere someone came and gave you a second chance so you start to get serious about wanting to become a hero because someone gave you a chance for you to achieve it ngl E-Deku already had a plan to handle the society with never gives up on his dream which is probably he already had something to do and then there's All might. He then thinks "oh well, I will got a quirk anyways, so being a quirkless superhero doesn't matter anymore" he just straightly gives up on his dream becoming a quirkless superhero
@@IzukuMeijin I’m pretty sure that the English translators had to tone down the original Japanese text because Deku was even more borderline suicidal than he was in the sub, so it still applies
xXiTz NinjazXx Yep, truly High-Quality I look for. Just to say, I'm not hating I like the guy and all. It does feel good being super unorganized for once.
It's actually super tiring and time consuming to put all those pics because u need to edit each one of them and also make memes out of them . Just putting actual anime footage is like no effort compared to this
This video is very interesting to me. Between being a Funimation ADR Director and the voice of Bakugo in My Hero Academia's dub, I spend a lot of time considering the impact adaptation has on the properties, and what the best courses of action are to preserve the intent of the works throughout said adaptation. I also really appreciate how this video truly does never turn into an opinion of whether the dub or sub is superior to the other. Very interesting stuff. I'll be looking forward to your next part of this analysis.
For whatever it's worth: E-Bakugo was the voice that sold me on the dub. Congrats on an excellent performance, and I hope to hear more from you in season 3.
So what I'm earing is that j deku is more reflective of a rigid Japanese society that lives and copes thanks to dreams, while e deku reflects the American ideals of self improvement trough hard work? Have I got it right?
This. This is the anime discussion and analysis that should be done instead of simple 'sub wins always.' There are differences in culture and philosophy unique to that culture. J-Deku's word structure is that of the typical Japanese student that is always trying to keep their emotions down so they do not look out of place of society, even when he is VERY MUCH that in a world of super-humans. E-Deku is the typical down-on-their-luck American kid that feels like he got the bad end of a deal, so he figures there is a way out. The way that we rationalize that you can make it anywhere if given hard enough work. J-Deku is expressing his desire as a fantasy to endure in school. E-Deku is telling himself a dream that he is clearly doing with his notes. Different dubs like this are what give anime their contextualization in every culture. I now wonder what that means if My Hero is different in different nations like say, Germany, Brazil, Sweden, etc. Different values of 'loser becomes great' due to how they talk. What society expects of them against what they believe they are. It's part of what makes anime great art, even for a series like this. Seriously Explanation Point, I went to college dissecting documents apart and wondering what the author's intent was, and this kind of discussion is what I missed most. Engaging, well thought out questions WITH answers that could easily be high grades in a college presentation. You're not just doing entertainment, you are doing hard education for an audience that doesn't know they're getting educated. And now with one of my favorite Shonens in the past decade? This is why I subscribed to you. Stay gold you beautiful punctuation mark.
Now that you mention it, the whole "The nail that stands up gets hammered down" Japanese social philosophy does seem really bizarre in a world where something like 75% of the population is a wildly-varying freak of nature.
But that's the thing, while there are those differences in culture and philosophy, I want to experience those and I want other people to experience those to understand more of other cultures than just their own, not just have it whitewashed and crappily rewritten to shoehorn in an ethos that didn't exist in the original. That's why there's such a venomous HATE-on for so many dubs, because they throw that out almost entirely when they make those changes. It happens with all media, too, not just shows, and when you can see the original and compare it against the changed version rather than taking in the changed version on its own, you see just how much is lost because of it. On top of that, with the changes made to bring it in line with other similar media of that culture, it same-ifies everything into a generic blur of oversaturation, rather than giving a variety of diverse viewpoints and ethos. This is why you get a 'breath of fresh air' every so often when something comes out that actively differentiates itself from the prevailing culture and philosophy (but not antagonistically), but not truly amazing in and of itself otherwise. This is how Attack On Titan was recieved at first, when it was first being released, and then as time went on and it revealed the more shounen elements, it turned people off because of its descent into genericness, rather than, say, becoming the next Berserk.
That moment when the opening explains how this isn't about recommending one versus the other yet the comments are still filled with people arguing about which is better. Oi. Good video, man, cannot wait for more.
Thus video was awesome, this shows that both Dekus is unique in their own way. I love both Dekus. Both is great in their own way. Trying to argue that one is 'superior' is totally missing a point each Deku is trying to show. Each Deku has obstacles to overcome and each deku has different ways of dealing with the situation they're in. Each Deku puts across different emotions in the viewers (e.g. either sympathy, encouragement or just cheering them on). With the different versions of Deku different people can feel related to him. Some people in general would challenge their misfortunes and try and overcome them while some definitely feels at a lost and hopeless and is too afraid to take actions until later on, so I think both sub and dub is great because a lot more people with different personalities can either relate to Deku more or feel different emotions for the show as it goes on developing
E-best girl, because when first commenting on the word deku she makes it a positive comment about his character and not just an observation about how it sounds, so the dub version is much more willing to be unabashedly nice
That's up to you! Who is YOUR best girl, I ask of all of you! There are no right answers! There's only wrong answers. And that wrong answer is a rule 63 of any character. Note: I say ANY character.
I always felt Deku was suicidal in the beginning as well. That being quirkless and told daily he was a waste of space was slowly dragging him down and the only reason why he hadn't gone through with it was it would be a nucince for the people around him. Deku only ever wanted to be helpful. Killing himself would be bothersome for his classmates and his mother so he kept his head down, focused on the one thing that made him happy, and dreamed of being more so he could fill the hole inside of him. When I finally got around to seeing the dub that feeling was gone. The voice work was good and the lines seemed right so I couldn't figure out why I suddenly felt like Deku was different. This explains why! Thank you! Edit: Would this change be because of the culture difference between Japan and America? In Japan being a Square peg surrounded by Round holes is considered a negative and you need to comform. In America it's seen as an opportunity to rise above.
As for you culture difference. It's almost as if the dub changed parts of the voice work to fit more within the American Culture as that's their demographic. To be honest, for me. I'm just happy that the American Dub isn't dreadful.
TheRedAzuki Oh Yes, on the whole the English Dub for BnHA is well done! The only voice I had issues with is Tsu, i feel in Japanese her voice is cuter and in English they double down on the frog a little too hard. That could just be personal preference though lol
OnigiriPuff Funny cause I've been thinking the Japanese voice was doing the frog thimv too much. Although maybe it's by which version you watch first. Mine being the Englich dub.
I love both of these representations so much. They're both so _Deku,_ just different variations of Deku, albeit on a small level. I love E's passion and J's pain. E is so optimistic and touches on a happier side of me, while J feels more tragic and, well... I relate more. To me, I honestly don't prefer one or the other, sub or dub. They're both so great in their own way. I watch both when they come out. Love this anime. First one I really connected to in a long time.
Hope is a drug the weak and poor get high on. Always saying things will change and not actually doing the work to change. Even then at the worst it's what's keeping them alive and moving instead of killing and dying. Something to think about and use lightly.
If I could, I would like to add on something small as to the differences between E-Deku and J-Deku (I'll try to be non-biased, but I am a sub watcher) E-Deku is definitely written to be easier to enjoy as a character by an english audience. He never loses a single bit of hope, no matter what he's faced with, and sees everything that puts him down as a trial to overcome right from the start. This makes it better for an english and mainstream western audience to enjoy his character, while J-Deku seeming hopelessness would be a lot harder to enjoy in the west (for a mainstream audience getting into this anime, or dub-only watchers, this character will work a lot better). J-Deku, however, goes through a mental battle of ideals in these first two episodes that allow him to grow without having had that perserverance at the start. He starts off as a sad realist with an escapist fantasy, and All-Might seemingly shutting down his dreams just further dooms his happiness. But, through his own ideals and want for the fantasy not to fall short, he thrusts himself into trying to save Bakugou, causing All Might to see hope in him. This allows him to go from a sad realist to a hopeful optimist, allowing an obvious change and further new developments for the character in the first season. Sorry for writing a novel, I just wanted to say this
I get that too. But I also feel like the hopelessness is present in the E-version but just expressed by his actions. Like breaking down into tears in disbelief when he understood that he could actually become a hero. You could see how badly he needed to hear that and how close he could of been from breaking. But that could just be me.
Something you probably know already but Japanese has a MAJOR suicide epidemic. I don't know if it's gone down in the time since I checked actual stats but it's one of the worst countries, mainly because there's a sort of apatheticness to it. So your idea of J-Deku being legitimately suicidal isnt too far-fetched.
i think south korea has worse teen suicide rates, but ur right, both those countries are really having a mental health crisis right now, and they are NOT handling it well culturally.
It's mainly because there are a ton of different pressures on people (especially young people) in Japanese society. Bullying is a huge problem in schools, but Japan has a lot of heavily emphasized tests and exams that put stress on young kids. There are entry tests to get into good elementary schools, and entrance exams for middle schools AND high schools, and all those tests are incredibly competitive. The school you get into is heavily emphasized as well, and when you get a job that is going to be THE job you will stay in for your entire life so a ton of pressure is put on the decision made. It isn't culturally acceptable to change jobs/companies in Japan, and if you DO drop out of a company basically no other company will ever hire you again and you'll be stuck at entry-level basic jobs like working the cashier at stores. So yeah, it's just a ton of different pressures put on people, compounded by bullying and ostracizing of people who fail, that really increase suicide rates. It is a deep problem, but unfortunately there's not a simple solution for it.
They have a population issue as well, not of overpopulation but the opposite they are not making enough baby's. Japan's population rate is currently in the negatives so more people are dying them being born and the generation gaps are getting larger and larger to the point that many preschools were shut down due to not being enough kids to justify their costs . This goes back to the overworking and stressed environments Japan goes through, adding a child to the mix would be an nightmare.
U know a show is really good when it doesn’t matter how you listen to it, each is just as good, all languages are in perfect sink. Or the English people can just read off the subtitles
That's what j was thinking. Both is great in their own way. Trying to argue that one is 'superior' is totally missing a point each Deku is trying to show. Each Deku has obstacles to overcome and each deku has different ways of dealing the situation they're in. Each Deku puts across different emotions in the viewers (e.g. either sympathy, encouragement or just cheering them on). With the different versions of Deku different people can feel related to him. Some people in general would challenge their misfortunes and try and overcome them while some definitely feels at a lost and hopeless, so I think both sub and dub is great because a lot more people with different personalities can either relate to Deku more or feel different emotions for the show as it goes on developing
If you think the sub version isn't superior, you just must not have watched it. The enthusiasm in the voices are completely different. In many cases completely missing. One needs only watch the Deku vs Bakugo fight. There's NO contest.
@@Google_Censored_Commenter when one refers to one's self as one, one shows they are an elitist prick who feels intellectually superior by bragging about how they watch a superhero anime on the internet. one tends to get one's self beat up at school this way.
@@allan526alec428 I was not refering to myself. Is the best criticism you have of my comment a single word I used, and not the actual content of what I said? Please, feel free to use any episode, any line, any voice actor where the english version is superior. I will wait.
No Google, I don't want to use my real name. Yeah, I don’t speak Japanese, and I struggle learning foreign languages so I’m probably not going to learn Japanese. This video, and others on this channel talking about dubs are not comparing them to the original Japanese, it’s comparing the SUBTITLES that ARE WORDS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE SCREEN to the DUBBED ENGLISH VOICE OVER, I do not understand Japanese inflection, I can hear how loud they are yelling but other than that anything is lost, could I learn all the intricacies of Japanese speech? Maybe if I spent 20+ years trying to, but 1. I’m not going to do that and 2. If I did I wouldn’t need the sub or the dub, so this is not comparing the dub to the original Japanese, because if you are watching with the sub, you probably don’t speak fluent Japanese and also can’t understand all the “enthusiasm in the voices”, and if you want an instance where the dub’s word choice is better than the sub specifically, there are many in his video titled “the defense of dubs” shows examples from hero aca specifically, but there are also many times that the dub fails because of poor word choice or having to fit the lip flaps. So is the original Japanese better than the dub? I don’t know, I’m commenting under an English video as an English speaking person in an English speaking country, so I will never know, listening to the Japanese voices knowing no Japanese adds nothing for me, maybe you know more than I do about Japanese, but just because you watch something differently than I do doesn’t mean that you’re better than anyone who enjoys something the other way, and it doesn’t make other people inferior because they enjoy something differently than you do.
FlaredFist9 ultimately they don't, since there is always an option to watch either sub or dub it kinda becomes fruitless to argument over which is superior
I like this kind of assessment towards dubs. Usually all I hear people complain about is how performances are drastically different dubs and not the script (unless your name is DBZ, where there's a never-ending flame war between the fans of Kai and the OG Funimation dub about what certain characters would've said), which makes this a far more interesting subject than "OMG the actors in this dub ain't shit compared to the original subbed version" and vice-versa. Looking forward to more of these, +Explanation Point!
Yeah. It gets really annoying when people just go "LOL, dub sucks" without actually trying to analyze what makes that dub different from the original, and just shitting on it (not that there AREN'T bad dubs, but all I ever hear is people making fun of dubs for the sake of them being dubs).
I still don't like the way that Illda sounds like he's speaking normally with a microphone in the exam room in the dub, as in the sub he sounds like he's actually shouting so that people can hear him (and I think it eccentuates his personality more).
IMO what makes a good dub is entirely dependent on 3 things, expressiveness, translation of ideas, and literary wit. Expressiveness - Often characters in Anime or over the top or extremely dramatic, yet for a while dubbing companies didn't care about finding the right fit and left characters being boring, hollow, shells of themselves. Translation of Ideas - Different cultures different perspectives, a good dub will analyze those differences and seek to create a translation that maintains the spirit and message of the original, but also adapt it to fit the culture. Literary Wit - The act of changing and improving the script, a bad one will attempt a one to one translation to a fault, the good one adapt. A good example of this is in Death Note in which Light's "girlfriend" says "I can't imagine a world without Light!" and L sarcastically responds, "Yes that would be dark." Including a joke that wasn't in the original at all, yet because of it the dialogue feels more natural. Having said all of that I feel like MHA does a good job at most of these. Not all the voice actors fit perfectly, yet there was a genuine effort. This video details a good example of a change to better suit a different culture in the way they presented Deku, and even though some lines had to be butchered, looking at you best grill's "cute line," most still are very well thought out. 9/10 Dub for me.
"Hope is not useless, even when it is." This seems to be a popular quote here in the comment section. And I have to agree with the three points of Anime success from one culture to another you mentioned. It can be analyzed to make sense yet it's off. A better ending... " Hope is not useless. Even when it feels so." Something as one sentence can change the tempo and emotions intended to be conveyed. It's why in writing Essays the teacher is such a dictator, every.. piece.. of the, writing! Can make a major difference to the reader, whether they connect or think its average. Did you learn your formula from some teacher or sensi? Did you create it yourself from your own observation?
My own observations. After this video I took some time to break down in my head, "What dubs that I watch are good? What makes them good?" After some thought I quickly came to this conclusion. It was fun for me cause I'm a bit of a literary nut, so finding the differences in ideas and how they are communicated was engaging.
I feel like the expressiveness part is something that REALLY annoys me about Japanese dialogue. Oftentimes the Japanese voices are SUPER over-the-top especially in their inflection and I find it really obnoxious to listen to. Sometimes I can say the same about dubbed shows but normally it's not as bad.
I always found the difference between what Deku says during the fight against the sludge monster interesting. In the dub, the final dramatic line is "My legs moved on their own", while in the sub it's "You looked like you were asking for help". To me, the E-Deku's heroism is subconscious, he doesn't really know why he acted, and he doesn't reflect on it enough to know why at that moment. J-Deku also mentions his legs moved on his own, but the preceding moment when all the things in his life that told him to give up his dream flash into his mind, it tells the audience exactly WHY he dreams of being a hero. He can't stand to see someone in trouble, someone in need. It's like the moment the audience finally hear's why, after all those setbacks, Deku still can't give up his dream of heroism. E-Deku's motivations seem to have less substance to me, it's just what he wants to do, while this moment solidifies J-Deku's motivations without him having to outright state "This is my motivation for being a hero". But, that's just my opinion :) Great video btw!
swguygardner I might agree with that assessment, except in the English dub we do hear why he ran in, "I just couldn't stand there and watch you die." Since we got his statement about his legs moving on his own, before his life of bullying flashes before his eyes, this statement tells us the same thing as the Japanese version albeit a bit more specifically. I will agree with your statement about E-Deku having motivation that is more subconscious than J-Deku, but depending on taste I don't think that's a bad thing. What results is J-Deku going on a journey to realize how much more practical he has to be since his motivation was a fantasy that has the potential to make the lives of many people better that lacked guidance. In contrast, E-Deku goes on a journey to realize how to actually realize and utilize his desires because he selflessly wanted to help others but had no realistic way of achieving that in a world where everyone is more powerful than him. It's definitely a pick your preference situation.
Same. Dub Izuku feels really flat like many other shounen protagonist, while Sub Izuku actually feels like a someone more realistic and like you said, that is my opinion :D
You also have to think how that relates to All Might. In both J and E All Might says Deku's actions are what made him believe he can become a Hero. So between E-Deku's subconscious heroism and J-Deku's protective heroism, which is truly superior? I believe it can be taken in different ways. In both J and E, Deku's actions go against All Might's at that moment. Whether Deku either moved on purpose to save someone or moved on instinct to save someone, he still moved. Meanwhile All Might did not. All Might in both J and E sees at this moment that Deku as in heroism, is even stronger then he is. So while Deku's method and reason for his heroism may differ, the act of heroism and it's contrast with All Might is still the same.
Honestly I don't see a meaningful difference here. When Deku was having those flashbacks I saw that as Deku acknowledging all the reasons why he shouldn't risk himself to save Bakugo. Let's be honest here, he has every reason to look the other way at this point. This is the same kid who mocked him at every turn, who made his life hell at every opportunity and who even went so far as to DARE Deku to kill himself. In that moment where he's having those flashbacks, it's like Deku is asking "Why am I doing this? I don't even have any power. I'm dead if I go out there. Why am I just naturally risking my life to save him of all people?" The answer he comes up with in the end is, of course, because Bakugo needs help. That's all the reason Deku needs to act. It doesn't matter to him in the end how terrible their personal history might be. Bakugo needed someone to save him and Deku moved to answer the call because his instincts told him it was the right thing to do. "You looked like you were asking for help." and "I couldn't just stand there and watch you die." are just two ways of saying pretty much the same thing with different words. Deku simply isn't the kind of person who can turn his back on someone who needs help. He's just not capable of it. I think that's really all there is to it in both versions.
swguygardner What? Deku's actual dub line was "Kacchan, I couldn't just stand there and watch you die." To me the line "you looked like you were asking for help" comes off as selfish. E-Deku's line sounded like he had to help, even though he knew he couldn't, while J-Deku's line was more like he legit thought he had a chance.
Manga is better. In all seriousness, MHA both are good. You can basically never go wrong with subs (unless poorly subed) and the dub has very good voice acting and voices that match their respective characters.
Low-key made me want to cry, but it's fine.......Deku being suicidal never really hit me with the same impact as right flipping now, but I guess it's a thing that is happening, wow. Okay. That got really heavy really fast, but I love it, it's great.
OMG its a video on the nuances of the english language and how moving a few words around changes the meaning and connotations entirely. I LOVE THIS SHIT!!
A lot of the time, I see watching sub over dub as elitist bs. The dub is, most of the time, pretty decent and I'll only watch sub if there isn't a dub or it's *really* bad.
Hating a dub is a very very snobbish, but its also such an old timer thing to do. Back when dubs were rushed, poorly done trash, i understand. But dubs are really great now: the studios put a lot of time money and effort into translations and voice actors and make a quailty product. Now when i see people who hate dub they just seem like uneducated brats holong onto the past and the stereotypes of dubs... Those people just seem so dumb to me
Lol "uneducated brats". I'll just let your own wording sink in and let you see for yourself how hypocritical you're being, and how much you are projecting.
Personally, I pick subs over dubs simply for the jokes. I feel like the jokes fall pretty flat in a dub because humor in Japanese is different than humor in English. Japanese just _doesn't_ have sarcasm, so the jokes tend to be a bit more slapstick, which comes across as a bit cringy in English. Like in this very video, at 2:25 , in the sub All Might is talking in English and the delivery is what makes it hilarious. I don't know why the Dub team felt the need to change it to add more dynamic. The joke is All Might's extremely simple reaction to a very impressive feat, the dub lost the joke by making his reaction as impressive as the feat. Also somethings only make sense in Japanese rather than in English. Like for example, Midoriya choosing "Deku" as his hero name. That was a BIG ASS DEAL because of it's meaning in Japanese. It was an insulting term used by Bakugo to describe Midoriya's weakness as a quirkless boy, but then Uraraka changed the meaning of it in a way that can really only be understood in Japanese. Then there's simple things like the dog-head Police Chief in Hosu who spoke like a dog. I don't know what they turned into in the Dub, but as far as subbing goes it was still translated a bit off because the chief put the "woof" sound at the end of certain words and not just at the end of his sentence which is what made it funny. I have nothing against people who like watching dubs, like I don't get why people who like subs turn into fucking Bakugo when someone says they prefer dubs, but it's more just that the deeper meanings, complex word play, and jokes often don't translate when they cross languages.
@@NinjaKittkatt Well, sometimes jokes fall really flat when they're translated. It's not just a matter of taste; the comedic timing can be completely ruined by the difference in grammar between two languages, especially Japanese and English, because the punchline tends to be moved at the beginning of the sentence in translation. Check out A Defense of Dubs (on the same channel) for more details on that. There's also a lot of jokes that translate alright, but they don't make sense to a Western audience. For example, if a character is shown with a cat on their head as a piece of visual comedy, that won't make sense to most people. That's because "wearing a cat on your head" is a completely Japanese expression meaning that someone is hiding their true personality behind apparent friendliness. If you don't already know that saying, seeing a cat on someone's head is just going to be weird for you, and it's not going to be explained in a translator's not, especially if said cat isn't mentioned in the dialogue. Anyway what I'm getting at is that while there is merit in the way jokes are delivered in Japanese, it doesn't always translate well, so the dub can often have more comedic value than the sub for most people.
Oh wow that’s FASCINATING! I mean, I read the manga and watch the dubbed anime, and I never thought of these difference in such a way...! It’s an interesting look into how these two translations say somewhat different things when you really look at them! I am impressed by your analysis and your editing is hilarious and I’m also honestly super glad you didn’t say stuff like “this is why the sub is better” or “this is why the dub is better.” They’re both great in my opinion, and I think this analysis kinda gives a good reason as to why both are perfectly valid...! -also ive been lambasted for loving the dub before so its great that this video doesnt so that- Also, your conclusion at the end the video about what both translations ultimately teach kinda made me cry..........
Speaking of superhero stories like this, Worm is a great story about one such as Deku. One in five people will obtain superpowers from some kind of trauma, and the world is mostly full of villains because of it. To get powers, you have to experience the worst thing that will ever happen to you. Taylor Hebert is somewhat of a superhero fangirl who was bullied pretty severely. Pushing her down stairs, telling her she's the reason her mom died, stuff like that. One day, during a particularly nasty bullying instance that left her in the hospital, she gained the power to control bugs, a rather unconventional power, and with this she begins her journey in an effort to become a superhero, but she learns that it's not quite that simple. The world is full of heroic villains and villainous heroes and she begins to experience that firsthand. Worm has such an interesting take on powers it's kind of insane. I highly recommend you read it.
I want to give Worm a try, but I mentally and emotionally cannot. A guy I associated with long ago ran a Worm inspired Mutants & Masterminds tabletop campaign, and he ended up being such a shithead, and the game ended up being such cancer, that it kind of turned me off hardcore. I might recover from it some day, but I can't get into it now. Goes to show, be careful who you interact with.
I know there's a comment already addressing the point many must have made before me about cultural differences skewing the way dialog portrays a character, but I have to throw another on top of that pile. I come from an English speaking country, my default culture is heavily Americanised western, and from watching a lot of subbed anime I understood the cultural context enough that when I watched BNHA in Japanese with subs the impression I formed of Deku's character was pretty much what this video shows as your impression of English dub Deku. I didn't even consider such a drastically different take on his character could logically be formed until your read on J-Deku blind sided me. I don't have anything against English subbed anime, I'm really thankful that its such a widely available thing, and I found it really interesting to see a possible read, through a western lens that I've long lost when watching anime. I'm just confused about the purpose of this video in context... If it's purely about the interesting ways the show differs between the sub and the dub then it may help you to note that the tone, as it is, comes across as very passionately against the Japanese depiction of Deku using an assessment based solely on meeting American social and cultural norms. To stay away from the murky waters around coming across as ignorantly lampooning his original Japanese version because it doesn't meet your cultural expectations, you could take a moment to say that this is an analysis based on an American perspective, and while the cultural implications are different your goal is to compare how the two struck you as viewed through your own culture and experiences. Implying that this is an objective way to compare the two, that other western viewers will see this the same way just because they speak English, or that cultural differences don't have a huge part to play in the content you're comparing comes across as narrow-minded, and while I hope the previous comments that caused the need for you to post an explanation comment weren't attacking you for those oversights, I do believe criticism is relevant and could help inform a tone for your videos less likely to draw fire from people who understand and love the nuances and cultural influence in subbed anime. People who like to watch their anime tweaked for an English speaking audience have the choice to watch the dub, but there are a lot of people who prefer the sub for various reasons. Crunchyroll having the English subs up for the English-speaking fans who want to watch them doesn't force Japanese cultural nuance on unsuspecting English speakers, ruining their interpretations of the characters and messages of the show, and I'm sure I'm not the only English speaker who would be very disappointed if subs started being written with altered scripts in an attempt to appeal to American social conventions. I suggest to you that the changes in dialog between the two don't change the messages at all, they simply frame the messages in words that are going to portray the same ideas to people of a different background with different standards on what kinds of behaviors and attitudes read in certain ways. Deku is the same character, expressing the same things, using different words based on how each language and the cultures that use them express those ideas. English-speaking viewers understand and appreciate one version or the other better simply out of their own preference, and don't necessarily line up along language divisions.
Unfortunately, the words you use DO mean something, especially in the context of a young boy who has to become as eloquent or well versed in the world as other people. E-deku is using different words, phrases, syntax, overall a different FEELING and connotation to his spoken word than j-deku is. So while the character is meant to be the same, the way each dub portrays this young boy is very clearly different. If there were a japanese sub of the english deku speaking, I'm sure that the words would come across much differently and he would almost seem a bit belligerent to those watching. After watching both, you can't help but get a different feeling from each deku, which means that you do end up building a preference for one over the other. Not to say anyone is wrong, but that they very clearly ARE saying different things about the same topic. Sorta like a glass half empty vs. half full approach to the character.
The Japanese play on "Deku" probably should've been translated to something like "Try Hard" or "Trayhard" or some other corruption of that if they wanted to maintain the running theme of him being an effort focused hero. Bakugo could've called him a "quirkless try hard" and Midoriya could've transformed it to literally "someone who tries hard to accomplish their goals." The device stays alive there. It would've required a very historically unpopular tactic that the dub industry tends to avoid nowadays: changing Japanese names to English versions (looking at you Pokemon, Sailor Moon and Megaman) but it does work from time to time. Megaman, Pokemon and Street Fighter are good examples. Midoriya could've been "Deku" in the East and "Tryhard" in the West. Anyway, that's my two cents.
I've been watching the sub mainly but also watching the dub in my spare time since it's coming out slower and yeah, it's such a weird contrast between Deku's huh? I find the sub is a lot more blunt in its wording and All Might is a lot more playful when he's in his super form too. J-Deku is a little more 'depressive' than E-Deku who seems to be in denial but deep down knows that it's probably useless to keep going. E-Deku has the 'they may be right but I'll still try my best' attitude while J-Deku has a 'I'm on the verge of giving up hope but I'll keep trying' with J-Deku sounding more on the verge of suicide if his plans on having his application to UA accepted are instead rejected officially.
This video is so interesting and well-made. I subscribed! In fact, the differences you pointed out were not even jumps-I think anyone who watched both the dub and sub would have sensed that something seemed different. Hearing you break it down, analyze the connotations, and ultimately tie it into a meaningful message and a great conclusion, this video makes me think "ah, so this is what English class was trying to teach me to do". It results in two different stories. In the Japanese version, Izuku had a pipe dream that was simply a fantasy, but he was blessed with a miracle that allowed his dream to come true. He has an external locus of control, and is content with simply waiting and hoping his time comes. On the other hand, English Izuku might see One For All as a natural progression toward his dream. If the anime was made by the English writers, they probably would have shown Izuku learning martial arts or going through training in middle school, taking the initiative to build useful skills that demonstrate his internal locus of control. May I suggest a video topic? Can you analyze how Izuku's character grows after gaining One For All? In one of the BNHA Radio clips, we hear Bakugou's voice actor saying that he actually thinks Deku is dislikable, because from Bakugou's perspective Deku is looking down on him. Then Deku's voice actor says it's because Kacchan doesn't hear his internal monologue, but he really acknowledges Kacchan (and Mineta's voice actor laughs that even saying that like is looking down on him). Izuku knows that in the end he's guaranteed to become the Number One hero because of One For All, so he always feels that he's in the right. It was something I never thought about before, and it might make a cool character study.
I definitely prefer English Deku. When you point the differences, it becomes clear that English Deku is far more grounded and aware of what he has to overcome, rather than going in blind. He seems like someone who actually wants something, rather than just escaping to something. Though, this was like the third time I related to a character, and I know others will relate to Japanese Deku more, but to each their own.
I would think it's best to prioritize what the author of the source material actually intended for the character over what one might prefer in terms of having an 'inspiring personality' or what one might find more relatable, personally.
What he intended is in the manga. In japanese. The base translation to English Manga, or even Japanese Anime, is more than enough for that to be warped. I enjoy one more, so Im going to view that version. Thats all there is to it.
@@themadmystic1688 i agree. I wonder if the translators picked up on it and made that slight change for English audiences... Its certainly a more American message; Makes it more relatable.
For Japanese Deku, his goal of becoming a hero, is shut down over the simple fact that he is quirkless. And becoming a hero is just that, a fantasy. Deku's mother burst into tears when she saw how heart broken he was over his life dream being crushed. From that point on, he still didnt give up, using everything he could to work his way towards becoming a hero like his idol. But again, no matter how much work he put in, no matter how hard he tried, he would never have a quirk. Because of the hope his fantasy gave him, he held onto that, despite the doubt being thrown in his face. That shows the importance of his dream.
Another fantastic video. This sort of analysis is the stuff I would never have thought of, so seeing you going into depth in an informative and unique way is just so fantastic. Seriously. You are the UA-camr that no one asked for, but we needed all along. Keep it up. (See what I did there? Playing homage to your ending sentence? Eh? Eh? Nevermind.)
Same old story, Japan must love the story of a pandered victim getting there Escapist fantasy come true. While on the other hand Americans love a Underdog that doesn't quit under adversity. It makes you think what if all might never found Deku. J Deku would've either kill himself or live the rest of his life miserably. E Deku would have driven himself mad trying to become Batman or succeed becoming Batman.
“Having a dream, no matter how crazy it may be, will make you a better person... hope is not foolish, even when it is” is going on my wall, I hope you know! Very well done and I love the whiteboard style editing you did here! Keep up the great work!
It is rough knowing that there are 2 episodes I could be watching right now, but I treat it like the manga, which I'm not reading. If I wanted to know what's coming, I would, but I enjoy my english VAs too much to watch it any other way at this point. (and yes, I have heard the japanese VAs and they are totally good, too, I mean Kyuubi/Kurama as Allmight is such a good casting, but like DBZ, I have to have my Sabat)
Almighty Roadkill Lololololol that freaking girl... I guess it's that I want the story to happen for me while hearing the people I connect to those characters. To go through it with them.
Sub vs dub? I usually end up preffering the thing i end up watching first, weird. I know, but that's just how it is for me. When i first watched BNHA it was the subbed version, and i loved it. I watched till season 2 (waiting for all the season 3 episodes are released so i don't have to be stressed for the next ep). But that in mind, i never really bothered watching the dubbed version till recently, and boy was i suprised. The dubbed version was actually for my little sister, who was watching the series for the first time so i watched along. And let me tell you, the delivery and emotions in BNHA eng dubbed was something else. This is very personal opinion but i liked the american Deku a lot more, his character felt alot more hopeful and clear about his dreams and overall a lot more determined, and all it took was 1 episode for me to end up crying. I connected so well with his character, and usually NEVER cry over anime.
Where’s a good website to watch dubbed? I watched all of subbed on Crunchyroll but they don’t have the dub on there and my brother can’t read subtitles fast enough
Your increased emotional reaction to the dub might also be because you're going to catch the vocal cues and intonations more easily in a language that you speak, and you're going to catch them at the same moment that you're going to ge the visual that goes with them. You're going to hear the actor's voice crack at the same time that you're going to see the first tear pooling up in a character's eye, instead of having a delay between what you hear, what you read, and what you see. In a dub, it all hits you at the same time, which tends to make a stronger impact.
S. Evelynn Pratt I completely agree with you but in Bakugo vs Deku part 2 when Bakugo was crying the sub hit me more in the feels then the dub even though I enjoy more the dub then the sub
I watched Hero Aca with Eng Dub from the getgo and I have to say that how you described E-Deku really is how I saw him. I did think he seemed a bit depressed at times, but he did feel just like a huge dorky nerd with a dream, not like a maybe suicidal boy with a fantasy that keeps him going. A really great video! I love to see the differences made in translation!
Love the video. I appreciate you trying to layer the sub and dub in the same scene to save time, but personally it got confusing to follow trying to read and listen at the same time, and then apply both to an analysis. I would suggest split them up to make clearer more defined points. But I've been loving your videos from day one so keep up the great work!
Man, I'm glad you're making it into a series, I study translation and the subs vs dubs debate has always been pretty heated, I can ensure arguments like these would give most people a run for their money, so keep the good work!
15:08 there are so many great choices of images throughout your videos, but I find it particularly funny that you would use My Brother, My Brother and Me to represent 'Advice'.
My clear argument on why MHA English dub is the proper way to do dubbing is based on how well the writing is, even in English. My biggest case and point is season 3 episode 11. When endeavor is talking, in the japanese dub he says “What’s with that pitiful back” as he means that he’s always been staring at All Might’s back in trying to be the best hero. In the dub, he says something similar, but it’s changed when he shouts out “Stand up and show them why you’re better”. The same can be said about Bakugou and Deku shout to All Might, the English is has more emotion because it isn’t just both of them saying the same thing, it’s Deku saying “win this” and Bakugou saying “beat him”, and then saying the same thing “Come on, All Might”. That works better because each phrase said by either character fits their personality. Deku just wants All Might to win the fight, Bakugou wants All Might to win by beating All For One.
It's interesting how the Dub people basically changed the character, in my opinion probably for the better. Still prefer the subs but after it's finished I might go back and watch the dub :D Great video as always and SUPER sexy audio quality
JoeThePro you should give the dub a shot if you ever have some spare time, considering that horikoshi based this entirely off of western comics and while written he was at a low point in his life and wrote it out of complete optimism, the tonal value of the Dub just fits the show very well, and all though some people might not like his voice at first you get use to dekus voice very fast and my god when the emotional scenes hit with him they hit hard, Also Chris sabbat all might is amazing, he really encapsulates a super man esque attitude tones that horikoshi was going for. Overall I think this dub is right up there as one of the best shounen dubs along side full metal alchemist and dragon ball z. I also understand how some people enjoy the sun better and that's fine. I really appreciate both and have watched both, but just fell the values of the dub for the story overall better especially with dekus character progression
I may just be looking at the wrong places on youtube, but this is an awesome idea for a series, and I've never seen anyone do something like this before. It may just be me but I'm excited to see the differences and your interpretation of them.
Holy crap how come I haven't seen your stuff before? I know this video is older and I gotta check out your newer stuff too, but your eye for subtle nuances blows me away. I want THAT quirk lmao!
And I prefer dubs... but then there are scenes like "holy ... stinking .... supercrap!" and I'm all like "Why the hell did they change that!? Oh my... Oh my ... GOODNESS was already in english!!!" I can understand change for cultural reasons, I can understand change for the sake of lip sync ... But this had no reason to be changed .... much less changed for the worse ...
+Devid Kerber "Why the hell did they change that!?" Easy. They changed "oh my GOODNESS" because in the Japanese version, it's an Engrish joke. A lot of anime, especially MHA, use Engrish jokes as a source as a form of humor. Why else do you think so many people find it funny when they hear Japanese people say English words/sentences in thick Asian accents? Because it sounds silly to us, and to a Japanese audience, it sounds not only silly, but exotic and unique to them, and emphasizes All Might's American-inspired character archetype. A lot of American-stereotyped anime characters speak in Engrish or bad Japanese to show they speak English. When people like Present Mic speak Engrish in the sub, in contrast to characters like All Might, it's more for the sake of a gag or a comedic expression than anything else. Japanese also uses a lot of borrowed words from English and other languages (ex: there's no Japanese word for 'hot dog' so they just say 'hotto doggu' by pronouncing it in their tongue). Anime characters also just say English words to try to sound educated or unique; since everyone speaks Japanese, it shows they're bilingual or it makes them stand out from the characters that only speak Japanese. It sets a unique tone speaking a foreign language than what's primarily spoken. We don't get that same effect in the English dub. Why speak Engrish or use the simple or incorrect English phrases the sub uses when everyone is already speaking English? The shock value and silliness of All Might saying "oh my GOODNESS" would be gone if it was in the dub, because he isn't speaking Japanese in every other instance to contrast this moment. Having him say "oh my GOODNESS" just wouldn't work as well in English because it just sounds so plain when All Might's declaration of surprise is meant to the silly. So to try to keep the silliness the Japanese version intended with that phrase, the dub tried to replicate it with a silly English phrase instead. "Holy stinking SUPER CRAP" works well enough to me; it's not only a silly phrase, but it also emphasizes the exaggerated stereotypical American superhero stereotype that the dub has to play out a *lot* more than the sub in order to nail what All Might's character is supposed to be. In Japanese, all they needed to do to get the point across that All Might's a stereotypical American superhero is to set in his heroic tone of voice and have him speak Engrish. In English, they have to put a bit more work into it; they can easily nail the stereotypical cheesy superhero tone in English, too, but rather than have him speak Engrish or some other language, they have All Might speak in super-exaggerated superhero lingo and use made-up/exemplified English words to have the same effect as his Engrish in the Japanese version. *That's* why it was changed. Sorry for the long comment, though! Hope that helps.
to be fair, the japanese translation for when ochako is explaining dekus name is much worse than the english explanation, they both have their weak points
Weirdly enough I usually have Subtitles every time I watch a DVD or something on TV but while watching Subbed Anime I usually tend to fall asleep Is that strange??
this is a really good analysis and draws a lot of interesting lines between the tone set by the sub and the tone set by the dub, and i also really appreciate the pinned comment you have reiterating that it's not about how it's LITERALLY translated, but how this character is translated CULTURALLY. we subbed to your channel because we also watched your video on doki doki literature club, and you've got a great way of keeping things straightforward without being overly clinical or overly bland about it. looking forward to watching more!!!
I love your videos Mr.Ex point. For a pretty new youtuber I think u do really well with the way u edit your videos and the way u explain it with both pictures and scenes from whatever you are talking about. I don't know if u will see this comment but know a lot of people get a lot of insight and look at things a bit differently after u talk about something in a video. I hope u continue ur streak of entertaining but still informative videos.
while I love your analysis and think you're right on the money on some things, I think one point you're missing is the contextual differences between Japanese and English language and the cultures they're in. Case in point, translating with exact language can change the intensity, or even the entire MEANING of a statement; someone saying "I like you" to a crush in English either sounds like an immature kid or like an entry into the "Friend Zone", but saying "I like you" to a crush in Japanese is a really big deal because "love" (aishiteru) is considered extremely strong language. In this case, you said that E-Deku speaks about his bullying with stronger language, stating affirmatively that he won't be a vicitim and blaming his classmates rather than himself. You also mention that he says things like "maybe that's why" which makes him sound weak-willed. However, Japanese language is baked in a cultural trope called "enryo", which creates a strong taboo against A) talking strongly about yourself or your feelings and B) badmouthing other people. Deku is characterized as being a fine, upstanding young man, so his language is coded to reflect his good-natured heart despite his sad backstory. Having J-Deku speak with language similar to E-Deku would be like E-Deku saying "Fuck those posers. I'm gonna prove they're pieces of shit." or, in summation, it would make him sound extremely rude and bratty. In future sub vs dub videos, I hope you take the differences in how language affects the cultures before you come to a conclusion. Even with perfect translations, trying to apply same meaning in English as you do in Japanese is flawed. As I said, I largely agree with your points, but I think you're missing that important piece.
That being said this video was supposed to be about English subs vs English dubs. What you are suggesting that he do is make japanese dubs vs English dubs. That would require him to know japanese to make the video and his viewers to know japanese to enjoy it fully (at least in my case).
He's not analyzing the differences in culture/language, he's analyzing the two stories being told one through writing and the other through voice. He's talking about how a person in the West would experience the two sets of dialogue.
Óhamingju you are right but he still has to understand why the wording in subs is the way it is, because it changes the way subs are meant. He needed to at least voice this so maybe Western viewers that don't know this can learn a little. But the op original point and just how bad the dub voices are is why I watch subs.
I wasn't making a quality statement about the sub vs the dub. I agree with him that that dub version comes closer to how we in the English world would speak rather than someone in the Japanese world. The dub does a pretty good job of "Americanizing" Deku. However, what I disagree with is how he characterizes J-Deku. J-Deku is not at all like the way he describes him, when viewed within the context of Japanese culture and language. Although I understand how an English-speaker reading the sub would get that impression.
Robert Hall that might be true, but the sub is just as much a translation as the dub. They could have both had near identical scripts, but they don't, and so here we are.
Absolutely stellar video, Mr. Point! If I may make a little comment on something I find interesting and maybe would be worth noting in the second video; notice the difference in sentence length and structure of E vs J Deku's comments. J Deku is cut and dry and to the point, that first line "all men are not created equal," we are shown that he is not going to sugar coat his words, he is making a statement. E Deku on the other hand precedes that statement with, "here's the sad truth," which, while seemingly simple, adds (especially and importantly for it is THE first line of the show) his point of view and filters it through that to the audience. The idea of not everyone being created equal is, for E Deku, something imposed more through his views while for J Deku it is a pure and simple statement about the world. And I notice this occur other times throughout your examples. J Deku is sparser, even if not by much, by enough to show that he knows if he keeps going with his thought process he knows he'll end up dead ending and so leaves less said so as to not face it (that trailing "but" he uses), but I also find that makes him kinda a mores realistic individual, the fact that his sentences aren't running around because he knows where they will lead. Whereas with E Deku he puts a lot more into his sentences and starts to trail and use more semantic particles to just try and keep the thought train going so he doesn't have to face the emptiness of not saying something. It seems like E Deku needs to keep trying to say something, to keep saying he can, as though to almost block and not give another the chance to say, "kid, you can't do it." Just some semantic, linguistic thoughts thrown your way. I find this shit fascinating and love seeing someone do videos on it. Can't wait for the next one :)
I don't have anything against the dub, but the sub is a lot more true to the manga, which means that Deku was meant to view becoming a hero as an unattainable pipe dream until All Might gave him the opportunity to make it a reality. The dub takes what Horikoshi originally wrote and tweaks it a bit to better fit their American audience by making Deku at least somewhat optimistic about becoming a hero.
But he does know that it's unattainable. In the second episode he admits after being lectured by All Might that he always knew deep down that what All Might said was the truth. He never really believed he had a shot. He was just lying to himself because facing that reality head on would absolutely crush him and he couldn't take that.
Justin v - considering the fact that the manga is completely based of western comics (horikoshi has admitted this many times, i.e. Deku is suppose to be an embodiment of Spider-Man and what not) the tone of the English dub fits the show more smoothly, don't get me wrong I love the sub and the dub, but the dubs tonal points fit everything better you know since it is based off American comics, and horikoshi has been stated saying he really enjoys the dub and the direction the characters are going, so idk why everyone is complaining. Just watch it however you want to watch it and don't try to ruin it for other people
Justin V Honestly for me, I wouldn’t be able to watch the sub in the first few episodes just because of how pessimistic he is. I’m a pretty optimistic guy myself so I attract more to E-Deku than J-Deku because he’s more optimistic and driven (not that J-Deku isn’t driven, it’s just in these first few episodes he’s very depressing and it gets worse once All Might tells him the hard cold truth). The story also just flows better imo in the dub because of course a hero fanboy is going to want to be a hero and that’s why he should be much more driven. And that amount of drive is what makes All Might’s truth even more devastating
Haise Sasaki That means literally nothing at all. So in your opinion, if you watch sub, you aren't actually watching, simply because you're reading text on a screen? Thats not how it works. They're talking about the difference between dialogue and character portrayals, not reading vs. watching.
I just recently found your channel, and I listen to your videos in the background of college homework, which helps me focus, and then gives me something to listen to afterward. I'm surprised you've only been on here for a few months and have this many subs, so you deserve the praise and subs you have man. Keep up your good work! Love the channel
Sapphire Savage the only reason this argument is happening is because fucks like you call Anyone who likes the sub because OPINIONS are apparently a thing a bunch of fucking weebs and then then they go hate on the dub because u kept hating on the sub
I prefer J deku as opposed to E deku as the mentality of "hard work will get you anywhere is just a false ideal". While E dekus an idealist, J dekus a dissapointed one. Much more fitting to his struggle and makes the pay off of him finally becoming a hero that much more sweet.
This definitely was not what I was expecting, but I am so glad that it wasn't. It was so interesting getting to hear your analysis of the subbed and dubbed version of season one. Keep up the great content!
I feel like you could perform a very good Deku impression. I remember watching the scene where Deku was looking at the monitor crying, but feeling for it way more when I watched it again so many months later in Japanese. In some scenes, I really was impressed with J-Deku. E-Deku had his moments too, of course. I watched it dubbed first, but that one scene in the Japanese genuinely made me sad and feel for him.
“This is the ultimate message of hero aca: that having a dream no matter how crazy it may be, will make you a better person. That hope is not foolish, even when it is” I just really needed to quote that because god damn that is one hell of a moral. I’ve seen many sides of mha (trust me on this I’ve seen the depths of Ao3) but very rarely do I find a moral so strong and held close to its heart. Gives me an entire new perspective to work through :)
You have to understand, the sub is also a translation (though it can be more accurate since it doesn't have to match mouth flaps). I really feel like the suicide thing is kinda stretching. Just as an example, I for some reason remember the exact Japanese wording of the doctor to Deku. He says 諦めた方がいいね。 The subs say it's probably better if you give it up. But if you wanted to be super literal about it (which you should never do in translation), then it's like telling him that it would have been good if he chose to give it up (it being his dream). Of notice, he doesn't say it would be good if you give it up, but uses the past form, indicating that it would be better if he had already given up that dream. Nothing wrong with the translation, Crunchyroll subs are consistently high quality, but just don't try to take translation wording as super exact is my point. It is usually more exact than a dub, though, of course.
But he wasn't looking at the Japanese dialogue, he was looking at the English subtitles. He's talking about how a primarily English speaking audience would experience the series, so he only talks about the English Dub and the English Subtitles. Maybe the subtitles give off the wrong impression, but that's his point, that different localisations of the show will result in people inferring different things.
Also sometimes they change the translation like,"oh my goddess" line. Keep in mind that they have to make the syllabus match the "mouth flaps" (as the VAs say it)
I think another reason was actually to preserve the the comedic tone. What makes it funny in the Japanese is simy that he's speaking english, but in the dub they try to give it a similar punch by making it am actual exaggerated phrase.
This is one of my favorite videos, and it bugs me that most the comments are just arguing about what one is better, when that isn't the point it's about how they're different just from how the sentences are phrased. I guess I shouldn't be surprised since the series name is Subs v Dubs that this video would get that kind of response.
![Subs vs. Dubs: My Hero Academia Season 1 [Part 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/E3yuCmvajYo/mqdefault.jpg)
![Subs vs. Dubs: My Hero Academia Season 1 [Part 2]](/img/tr.png)
Since there's been a lot of misunderstanding in the comments, here's a bit of clarification: The original Japanese dialogue is irrelevant to this discussion. This video is about how different translation decisions have consequences when it comes to how the narrative is perceived by English-speaking audiences. It has nothing to do with how Japanese-speaking viewers interpret Japanese-language dialogue. Similarly, while Japanese culture might require Deku to speak in a more subdued way (which I have presented here as "weak" or "uncertain"), that doesn't change the fact that the subbed dialogue is written in English for English-speaking audiences, and that those audiences are going to view that dialogue through a Western cultural lens rather than a Japanese one. In short, this is a video about viewer perception and how translation decisions change the messages of any particular show. It's not about comparing English and Japanese dialogue. That would be a great video to do, and someone else should absolutely do it, but I don't have the qualifications or the motivation to do it myself.
Except you don't need to view it through a western cultural lens, by simply learning about the original culture. Even just surface level knowledge obtained by not going "this is from my culture" and examining it as another culture suffices. Thank you for clarifying that you're explicitly always viewing it from a Western cultural lens at all times, though.
True, but in the same way it would be another video with another topic. Which is not what the EP wants.
My point is that no, "English-speaking audiences" don't solely view things only through a Western cultural lens. Some of us actually learn aspects of the originating culture so we can understand those references on at least a surface level, not solely view them through the lens of our own culture group without that context.
"Spike Headed Freak"
Good God, you've got some major hate for that guy.
Addendum, since how I come across might be taken the wrong way: I have no hate for EP at all, and rather enjoy his videos, especially the way he puts them together with visual aids and jokes. That doesn't mean I can't disagree with him, especially on a point that is rather core to myself and my perception of anime, having been part of the leadership for an anime club that was actually given advance copies of anime being brought over, like Blue Seed, to be a test audience for; we actually analyzed the cultural queues and discussed them amongst our group and with others, examining what aspects were inspired from stereotypes, which were inspired from cultural cues, and so on, so we actively learnt to view things from both a Western viewpoint and a Japanese viewpoint- or at least, to understand as best we could the source concepts involved and where and what they originated from, in a Japanese viewpoint.
13:31
One thing you missed here.
E-Baby Deku says “I’m gonna be a hero just like him! And J-Baby Deku says “I wanna be a hero like him” This shows that J-Baby Deku thinks this goal is reachable, but sees it more as a fantasy and a possibility. But this also shows that E-Baby Deku sees this as an inevitability, and that he sees it as a goal he will reach no matter what.
Just though I’d add this here.
So, without All-Might, E-Deku would become Batman and J-Deku would be dead.
Tyler Johnson That's how I feel.
Pretty much
Stormy Ray Waters I feel like there's something to be said about Japan's difference from America in the perception of talent, but I'm not focused enough right now to figure out what it is.
Tyler Johnson japan has a very passive culture in comparison to many western nations. and that's not saying they're weak, that's saying that the basis of their culture isn't centered on staring god in the eye and telling him to fuck off.
due to this passive base, japan's culture tends to favour hard work in a very different way to the west. japanese hard work means that you basically drive yourself mad by focusing like a laser on a task until it's done, no matter how long it takes. this leads to japanese work ethic and mass suicide. in the west, "hard work" doesn't mean constant, omnipresent work. it means that you, personally, are exercising your will and ability to do something difficult, right here and in the moment. it means you're being proactive, not just doing busy work for the sake of it. this comes from a more active culture.
there's also the simple fact that english sentence structure is not the same as japanese sentence structure, so a lot of changes had to be forced for those reasons as well.
what this all amounts to is that j-deku would view becoming a hero as "working at something impossible every second of every day until it kills me". e-deku would view it as "working at something nobody's ever managed before and pioneering a field". simple culture shift combined with a language shift can radically change your outlook on a scenario.
the whole notion that the Japanese people that are working hard are doing so passively while the american who is hardly working is doing so proactively is quiet ridiculous. having actually done test in both countries the difference is that in America if you work hard, even if you are average or below, it is highly likely you will not only get a good grade you might even get a perfect score. on the other hand in a japanese test even you are of above avarege and working really hard a perfect score is going to be elusive.
this is interesting, but the main difference is the languages, Japanese is a lot more vague and less confident than English is as a whole. As an overseas English teacher, that's the crux of the problem with teaching asian people (I myself am a Korean American) English. Confidence is a very western thing, in Japanese, they naturally speak in a more roundabout way, being more passive rather than harsh, I studied Japanese for a few years, it's just a cultural thing. English Deku is written more for the western audiences to enjoy, while Japanese Deku is straight up that, a Japanese Deku lol
THANK YOU this is my exact point. being as confident as e-deku would make j-deku sound rude and weirdly belligerent. it just would be weird!
Yes, exactly :)
So E-Deku would basically sound like Bakugo but cries more often
Yh kinda.
@@lordjub-jub5254 love this comment haha
Your editing style is a giant clusterfuck on my screen. I have no idea what the hell is going on, and pausing the video to try to figure it out leaves you more confused than if you did nothing.
I love it
same, honest to god
palo i know it reminds me of monogatari lol
I was looking through the comments to see if anyone else noticed what seems to be a running gag of just throwing more shit on top of the other shit on the screen
Funny thing, as I was reading this comment I scrolled back up and the vid was at 0:47 lmao
I'll be first to politely *disagree, it's given me a headache!*
I love the idea of giving up your dream, wanting to suicide and then out of nowhere someone came and gave you a second chance so you start to get serious about wanting to become a hero because someone gave you a chance for you to achieve it ngl
E-Deku already had a plan to handle the society with never gives up on his dream which is probably he already had something to do and then there's All might. He then thinks "oh well, I will got a quirk anyways, so being a quirkless superhero doesn't matter anymore" he just straightly gives up on his dream becoming a quirkless superhero
E-Deku: Without Almight , I might just become Batman.
J-Deku: I wanna die.
Manga Deku: Now I can find a more realistic future
@@IzukuMeijin I’m pretty sure that the English translators had to tone down the original Japanese text because Deku was even more borderline suicidal than he was in the sub, so it still applies
I like the editing style of just heaping images on top of each other
xXiTz NinjazXx It's simple and effective
xXiTz NinjazXx i hope je keeps it not like some other yters i know *caugh game theory caugh*
xXiTz NinjazXx
Yep, truly High-Quality I look for.
Just to say, I'm not hating I like the guy and all. It does feel good being super unorganized for once.
I don't, it looks like a mess
It's actually super tiring and time consuming to put all those pics because u need to edit each one of them and also make memes out of them . Just putting actual anime footage is like no effort compared to this
This video is very interesting to me. Between being a Funimation ADR Director and the voice of Bakugo in My Hero Academia's dub, I spend a lot of time considering the impact adaptation has on the properties, and what the best courses of action are to preserve the intent of the works throughout said adaptation. I also really appreciate how this video truly does never turn into an opinion of whether the dub or sub is superior to the other. Very interesting stuff. I'll be looking forward to your next part of this analysis.
For whatever it's worth: E-Bakugo was the voice that sold me on the dub. Congrats on an excellent performance, and I hope to hear more from you in season 3.
Well done, "you damn nerd" has been stuck in my head for weeks.
Wow, great job. I love Bakugo and his angsty voice!
Congrats on dubbing Bakugo! He's awesome!
You're Bakugo's English voice actor? You're a god.
I cried when you said "Hope is not foolish even when it is."
I don't know why, but I think you just told me I can be a hero too!
sorry but you're quirkless....so good luck with that.
@@esther1900 ... Well yea... weirdo >_>
@@DeidarasLilStudent I'm not weird T^T
Why does he sound like Edeku?
ReditGem3581 jotaro
ReditGem3581
Ikr? At first I thought it actually was the VO and thought “wow that’s kind of biased” until I realized it wasn’t.
"hope is not foolish, even when it is"
....thank you. so much.
So what I'm earing is that j deku is more reflective of a rigid Japanese society that lives and copes thanks to dreams, while e deku reflects the American ideals of self improvement trough hard work? Have I got it right?
Pretty much.
Kind of, but it's through, not trough. Also earing is hearing.
1:04
Well, I'd think I'd at least have to take Deku out to dinner first...
Yhoooo
WHY ARE YOU EVERYWHERE?
Just Some Guy with a Mustache *GASP* IT'S YOU... SO SEXY.
Just Some Guy with a Mustache when there is a phony copying you on jojo vids
You have more subscribers than most people who actually make videos
I can’t tell whether I feel smarter or I lost about 20 minutes of my life
I think the latter
Why not both?
Before this video I thought Deku was Deku. Now, I can’t think of each Deku as the same person so now I refer to them as E and J Deku lol
This. This is the anime discussion and analysis that should be done instead of simple 'sub wins always.' There are differences in culture and philosophy unique to that culture. J-Deku's word structure is that of the typical Japanese student that is always trying to keep their emotions down so they do not look out of place of society, even when he is VERY MUCH that in a world of super-humans. E-Deku is the typical down-on-their-luck American kid that feels like he got the bad end of a deal, so he figures there is a way out. The way that we rationalize that you can make it anywhere if given hard enough work. J-Deku is expressing his desire as a fantasy to endure in school. E-Deku is telling himself a dream that he is clearly doing with his notes. Different dubs like this are what give anime their contextualization in every culture.
I now wonder what that means if My Hero is different in different nations like say, Germany, Brazil, Sweden, etc. Different values of 'loser becomes great' due to how they talk. What society expects of them against what they believe they are. It's part of what makes anime great art, even for a series like this.
Seriously Explanation Point, I went to college dissecting documents apart and wondering what the author's intent was, and this kind of discussion is what I missed most. Engaging, well thought out questions WITH answers that could easily be high grades in a college presentation. You're not just doing entertainment, you are doing hard education for an audience that doesn't know they're getting educated. And now with one of my favorite Shonens in the past decade? This is why I subscribed to you. Stay gold you beautiful punctuation mark.
+Rikine Is it black and blue or white and gold?
The *Curious Hero*, Question Mark! Did an excellent summary of the vid lmao
Now that you mention it, the whole "The nail that stands up gets hammered down" Japanese social philosophy does seem really bizarre in a world where something like 75% of the population is a wildly-varying freak of nature.
Curious Hero i
But that's the thing, while there are those differences in culture and philosophy, I want to experience those and I want other people to experience those to understand more of other cultures than just their own, not just have it whitewashed and crappily rewritten to shoehorn in an ethos that didn't exist in the original. That's why there's such a venomous HATE-on for so many dubs, because they throw that out almost entirely when they make those changes. It happens with all media, too, not just shows, and when you can see the original and compare it against the changed version rather than taking in the changed version on its own, you see just how much is lost because of it.
On top of that, with the changes made to bring it in line with other similar media of that culture, it same-ifies everything into a generic blur of oversaturation, rather than giving a variety of diverse viewpoints and ethos. This is why you get a 'breath of fresh air' every so often when something comes out that actively differentiates itself from the prevailing culture and philosophy (but not antagonistically), but not truly amazing in and of itself otherwise. This is how Attack On Titan was recieved at first, when it was first being released, and then as time went on and it revealed the more shounen elements, it turned people off because of its descent into genericness, rather than, say, becoming the next Berserk.
"it's an escapist fantasy....."
show SAO
perfect edit do existe
C Vox yese
7:08
That moment when the opening explains how this isn't about recommending one versus the other yet the comments are still filled with people arguing about which is better. Oi. Good video, man, cannot wait for more.
On the bright side, there are about as many people mocking the debate.
Thus video was awesome, this shows that both Dekus is unique in their own way.
I love both Dekus. Both is great in their own way. Trying to argue that one is 'superior' is totally missing a point each Deku is trying to show. Each Deku has obstacles to overcome and each deku has different ways of dealing with the situation they're in. Each Deku puts across different emotions in the viewers (e.g. either sympathy, encouragement or just cheering them on).
With the different versions of Deku different people can feel related to him. Some people in general would challenge their misfortunes and try and overcome them while some definitely feels at a lost and hopeless and is too afraid to take actions until later on, so I think both sub and dub is great because a lot more people with different personalities can either relate to Deku more or feel different emotions for the show as it goes on developing
does anyone else feel like he could be a deku voice actor
Debora Mercer yea
Debora Mercer not me lol
Debora Mercer Deku nut
Debora Mercer I was actually thinking that the second I clicked onto the video
If he’s a bit more depressed then yeah.
The E- J- designation gives rise to another important question. Who's best girl, E-best girl or J-best girl
E-best girl, because when first commenting on the word deku she makes it a positive comment about his character and not just an observation about how it sounds, so the dub version is much more willing to be unabashedly nice
Rhys Clark Film & Media plus I can understand E-best girl without subtitles
That's up to you! Who is YOUR best girl, I ask of all of you! There are no right answers!
There's only wrong answers. And that wrong answer is a rule 63 of any character. Note: I say ANY character.
Yeah e-tsuyu vs j-tsuyu
Deadly Pool E- Tsuyu because I can understand her without subtitles
Hey that's some mic quality
A UA-cam Commenter TBH I thought this was the voice actor for deku cuz it sound just like him
rip ears
I always felt Deku was suicidal in the beginning as well. That being quirkless and told daily he was a waste of space was slowly dragging him down and the only reason why he hadn't gone through with it was it would be a nucince for the people around him. Deku only ever wanted to be helpful. Killing himself would be bothersome for his classmates and his mother so he kept his head down, focused on the one thing that made him happy, and dreamed of being more so he could fill the hole inside of him.
When I finally got around to seeing the dub that feeling was gone. The voice work was good and the lines seemed right so I couldn't figure out why I suddenly felt like Deku was different. This explains why! Thank you!
Edit: Would this change be because of the culture difference between Japan and America? In Japan being a Square peg surrounded by Round holes is considered a negative and you need to comform. In America it's seen as an opportunity to rise above.
As for you culture difference. It's almost as if the dub changed parts of the voice work to fit more within the American Culture as that's their demographic. To be honest, for me. I'm just happy that the American Dub isn't dreadful.
I'll say this much about my home country: we're a stubborn and persistent bunch.
TheRedAzuki Oh Yes, on the whole the English Dub for BnHA is well done! The only voice I had issues with is Tsu, i feel in Japanese her voice is cuter and in English they double down on the frog a little too hard. That could just be personal preference though lol
OnigiriPuff Funny cause I've been thinking the Japanese voice was doing the frog thimv too much. Although maybe it's by which version you watch first. Mine being the Englich dub.
"dreamed of being more so he could *fill the hole* inside of him."
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
lmao this dude just called Almight "Muscle Jesus" oh my lord
I love both of these representations so much. They're both so _Deku,_ just different variations of Deku, albeit on a small level. I love E's passion and J's pain. E is so optimistic and touches on a happier side of me, while J feels more tragic and, well... I relate more.
To me, I honestly don't prefer one or the other, sub or dub. They're both so great in their own way. I watch both when they come out. Love this anime. First one I really connected to in a long time.
"Hope is not foolish, even when it is" T T
this is actually...not untrue, believe it or not.
fucking love your name bro
Hope is a drug the weak and poor get high on. Always saying things will change and not actually doing the work to change. Even then at the worst it's what's keeping them alive and moving instead of killing and dying. Something to think about and use lightly.
Dude I see u everywhere
Smartix hehe thanks!
If I could, I would like to add on something small as to the differences between E-Deku and J-Deku (I'll try to be non-biased, but I am a sub watcher)
E-Deku is definitely written to be easier to enjoy as a character by an english audience. He never loses a single bit of hope, no matter what he's faced with, and sees everything that puts him down as a trial to overcome right from the start. This makes it better for an english and mainstream western audience to enjoy his character, while J-Deku seeming hopelessness would be a lot harder to enjoy in the west (for a mainstream audience getting into this anime, or dub-only watchers, this character will work a lot better).
J-Deku, however, goes through a mental battle of ideals in these first two episodes that allow him to grow without having had that perserverance at the start. He starts off as a sad realist with an escapist fantasy, and All-Might seemingly shutting down his dreams just further dooms his happiness. But, through his own ideals and want for the fantasy not to fall short, he thrusts himself into trying to save Bakugou, causing All Might to see hope in him. This allows him to go from a sad realist to a hopeful optimist, allowing an obvious change and further new developments for the character in the first season.
Sorry for writing a novel, I just wanted to say this
I get that too.
But I also feel like the hopelessness is present in the E-version but just expressed by his actions. Like breaking down into tears in disbelief when he understood that he could actually become a hero. You could see how badly he needed to hear that and how close he could of been from breaking. But that could just be me.
Something you probably know already but Japanese has a MAJOR suicide epidemic. I don't know if it's gone down in the time since I checked actual stats but it's one of the worst countries, mainly because there's a sort of apatheticness to it. So your idea of J-Deku being legitimately suicidal isnt too far-fetched.
i think south korea has worse teen suicide rates, but ur right, both those countries are really having a mental health crisis right now, and they are NOT handling it well culturally.
It's mainly because there are a ton of different pressures on people (especially young people) in Japanese society. Bullying is a huge problem in schools, but Japan has a lot of heavily emphasized tests and exams that put stress on young kids.
There are entry tests to get into good elementary schools, and entrance exams for middle schools AND high schools, and all those tests are incredibly competitive. The school you get into is heavily emphasized as well, and when you get a job that is going to be THE job you will stay in for your entire life so a ton of pressure is put on the decision made. It isn't culturally acceptable to change jobs/companies in Japan, and if you DO drop out of a company basically no other company will ever hire you again and you'll be stuck at entry-level basic jobs like working the cashier at stores.
So yeah, it's just a ton of different pressures put on people, compounded by bullying and ostracizing of people who fail, that really increase suicide rates. It is a deep problem, but unfortunately there's not a simple solution for it.
They have a population issue as well, not of overpopulation but the opposite they are not making enough baby's. Japan's population rate is currently in the negatives so more people are dying them being born and the generation gaps are getting larger and larger to the point that many preschools were shut down due to not being enough kids to justify their costs . This goes back to the overworking and stressed environments Japan goes through, adding a child to the mix would be an nightmare.
U know a show is really good when it doesn’t matter how you listen to it, each is just as good, all languages are in perfect sink. Or the English people can just read off the subtitles
That's what j was thinking. Both is great in their own way. Trying to argue that one is 'superior' is totally missing a point each Deku is trying to show. Each Deku has obstacles to overcome and each deku has different ways of dealing the situation they're in. Each Deku puts across different emotions in the viewers (e.g. either sympathy, encouragement or just cheering them on).
With the different versions of Deku different people can feel related to him. Some people in general would challenge their misfortunes and try and overcome them while some definitely feels at a lost and hopeless, so I think both sub and dub is great because a lot more people with different personalities can either relate to Deku more or feel different emotions for the show as it goes on developing
If you think the sub version isn't superior, you just must not have watched it. The enthusiasm in the voices are completely different. In many cases completely missing. One needs only watch the Deku vs Bakugo fight. There's NO contest.
@@Google_Censored_Commenter when one refers to one's self as one, one shows they are an elitist prick who feels intellectually superior by bragging about how they watch a superhero anime on the internet. one tends to get one's self beat up at school this way.
@@allan526alec428 I was not refering to myself. Is the best criticism you have of my comment a single word I used, and not the actual content of what I said? Please, feel free to use any episode, any line, any voice actor where the english version is superior. I will wait.
No Google, I don't want to use my real name. Yeah, I don’t speak Japanese, and I struggle learning foreign languages so I’m probably not going to learn Japanese. This video, and others on this channel talking about dubs are not comparing them to the original Japanese, it’s comparing the SUBTITLES that ARE WORDS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE SCREEN to the DUBBED ENGLISH VOICE OVER, I do not understand Japanese inflection, I can hear how loud they are yelling but other than that anything is lost, could I learn all the intricacies of Japanese speech? Maybe if I spent 20+ years trying to, but 1. I’m not going to do that and 2. If I did I wouldn’t need the sub or the dub, so this is not comparing the dub to the original Japanese, because if you are watching with the sub, you probably don’t speak fluent Japanese and also can’t understand all the “enthusiasm in the voices”, and if you want an instance where the dub’s word choice is better than the sub specifically, there are many in his video titled “the defense of dubs” shows examples from hero aca specifically, but there are also many times that the dub fails because of poor word choice or having to fit the lip flaps. So is the original Japanese better than the dub? I don’t know, I’m commenting under an English video as an English speaking person in an English speaking country, so I will never know, listening to the Japanese voices knowing no Japanese adds nothing for me, maybe you know more than I do about Japanese, but just because you watch something differently than I do doesn’t mean that you’re better than anyone who enjoys something the other way, and it doesn’t make other people inferior because they enjoy something differently than you do.
E-Deku is just pure merican
Bryan Cardenas
Exactly and more uplifting
@@LeaLeaA7 Hell no
@@benjiggz well I meant it in a bad way lol
@@LeaLeaA7 Oh lol 😂
No matter what you say there will be dub haters who will tell you that you're wrong.
I still think it's one of the stupidest arguments in the anime community, if not any online community.
Just a Robot Yeah, I don’t get why they just don’t watch dubs. If you don’t like dubs, don’t watch them. Simple.
there will also be people that give legitimate arguments against dub and for sub, but, those don't matter do they?
FlaredFist9 ultimately they don't, since there is always an option to watch either sub or dub it kinda becomes fruitless to argument over which is superior
Oh shit! Whatup JAR!
I like this kind of assessment towards dubs. Usually all I hear people complain about is how performances are drastically different dubs and not the script (unless your name is DBZ, where there's a never-ending flame war between the fans of Kai and the OG Funimation dub about what certain characters would've said), which makes this a far more interesting subject than "OMG the actors in this dub ain't shit compared to the original subbed version" and vice-versa. Looking forward to more of these, +Explanation Point!
Noah Schneider A very good breath of fresh air, isn't it?
Yeah. It gets really annoying when people just go "LOL, dub sucks" without actually trying to analyze what makes that dub different from the original, and just shitting on it (not that there AREN'T bad dubs, but all I ever hear is people making fun of dubs for the sake of them being dubs).
Noah Schneider Right, it prevents actual constructive criticism
Noah Schneider
As a dragon ball fan I can say that the flame war will last til the end of time. Especially if you're a fan of the Japanese version.
I still don't like the way that Illda sounds like he's speaking normally with a microphone in the exam room in the dub, as in the sub he sounds like he's actually shouting so that people can hear him (and I think it eccentuates his personality more).
IMO what makes a good dub is entirely dependent on 3 things, expressiveness, translation of ideas, and literary wit.
Expressiveness - Often characters in Anime or over the top or extremely dramatic, yet for a while dubbing companies didn't care about finding the right fit and left characters being boring, hollow, shells of themselves.
Translation of Ideas - Different cultures different perspectives, a good dub will analyze those differences and seek to create a translation that maintains the spirit and message of the original, but also adapt it to fit the culture.
Literary Wit - The act of changing and improving the script, a bad one will attempt a one to one translation to a fault, the good one adapt. A good example of this is in Death Note in which Light's "girlfriend" says "I can't imagine a world without Light!" and L sarcastically responds, "Yes that would be dark." Including a joke that wasn't in the original at all, yet because of it the dialogue feels more natural.
Having said all of that I feel like MHA does a good job at most of these. Not all the voice actors fit perfectly, yet there was a genuine effort. This video details a good example of a change to better suit a different culture in the way they presented Deku, and even though some lines had to be butchered, looking at you best grill's "cute line," most still are very well thought out. 9/10 Dub for me.
"Hope is not useless, even when it is."
This seems to be a popular quote here in the comment section. And I have to agree with the three points of Anime success from one culture to another you mentioned. It can be analyzed to make sense yet it's off. A better ending... " Hope is not useless. Even when it feels so." Something as one sentence can change the tempo and emotions intended to be conveyed. It's why in writing Essays the teacher is such a dictator, every.. piece.. of the, writing! Can make a major difference to the reader, whether they connect or think its average.
Did you learn your formula from some teacher or sensi? Did you create it yourself from your own observation?
My own observations. After this video I took some time to break down in my head, "What dubs that I watch are good? What makes them good?" After some thought I quickly came to this conclusion. It was fun for me cause I'm a bit of a literary nut, so finding the differences in ideas and how they are communicated was engaging.
I feel like the expressiveness part is something that REALLY annoys me about Japanese dialogue. Oftentimes the Japanese voices are SUPER over-the-top especially in their inflection and I find it really obnoxious to listen to. Sometimes I can say the same about dubbed shows but normally it's not as bad.
Yeah I'm gonna watch the dub version because I like how he is in that version.
I'm ngl, at least at the beginning of the series I was like 80 percent sure that Deku had depression
I always found the difference between what Deku says during the fight against the sludge monster interesting. In the dub, the final dramatic line is "My legs moved on their own", while in the sub it's "You looked like you were asking for help". To me, the E-Deku's heroism is subconscious, he doesn't really know why he acted, and he doesn't reflect on it enough to know why at that moment. J-Deku also mentions his legs moved on his own, but the preceding moment when all the things in his life that told him to give up his dream flash into his mind, it tells the audience exactly WHY he dreams of being a hero. He can't stand to see someone in trouble, someone in need. It's like the moment the audience finally hear's why, after all those setbacks, Deku still can't give up his dream of heroism. E-Deku's motivations seem to have less substance to me, it's just what he wants to do, while this moment solidifies J-Deku's motivations without him having to outright state "This is my motivation for being a hero". But, that's just my opinion :)
Great video btw!
swguygardner I might agree with that assessment, except in the English dub we do hear why he ran in, "I just couldn't stand there and watch you die." Since we got his statement about his legs moving on his own, before his life of bullying flashes before his eyes, this statement tells us the same thing as the Japanese version albeit a bit more specifically. I will agree with your statement about E-Deku having motivation that is more subconscious than J-Deku, but depending on taste I don't think that's a bad thing. What results is J-Deku going on a journey to realize how much more practical he has to be since his motivation was a fantasy that has the potential to make the lives of many people better that lacked guidance. In contrast, E-Deku goes on a journey to realize how to actually realize and utilize his desires because he selflessly wanted to help others but had no realistic way of achieving that in a world where everyone is more powerful than him. It's definitely a pick your preference situation.
Same. Dub Izuku feels really flat like many other shounen protagonist, while Sub Izuku actually feels like a someone more realistic and like you said, that is my opinion :D
You also have to think how that relates to All Might. In both J and E All Might says Deku's actions are what made him believe he can become a Hero. So between E-Deku's subconscious heroism and J-Deku's protective heroism, which is truly superior? I believe it can be taken in different ways. In both J and E, Deku's actions go against All Might's at that moment. Whether Deku either moved on purpose to save someone or moved on instinct to save someone, he still moved. Meanwhile All Might did not. All Might in both J and E sees at this moment that Deku as in heroism, is even stronger then he is. So while Deku's method and reason for his heroism may differ, the act of heroism and it's contrast with All Might is still the same.
Honestly I don't see a meaningful difference here. When Deku was having those flashbacks I saw that as Deku acknowledging all the reasons why he shouldn't risk himself to save Bakugo. Let's be honest here, he has every reason to look the other way at this point. This is the same kid who mocked him at every turn, who made his life hell at every opportunity and who even went so far as to DARE Deku to kill himself. In that moment where he's having those flashbacks, it's like Deku is asking "Why am I doing this? I don't even have any power. I'm dead if I go out there. Why am I just naturally risking my life to save him of all people?" The answer he comes up with in the end is, of course, because Bakugo needs help. That's all the reason Deku needs to act. It doesn't matter to him in the end how terrible their personal history might be. Bakugo needed someone to save him and Deku moved to answer the call because his instincts told him it was the right thing to do. "You looked like you were asking for help." and "I couldn't just stand there and watch you die." are just two ways of saying pretty much the same thing with different words. Deku simply isn't the kind of person who can turn his back on someone who needs help. He's just not capable of it. I think that's really all there is to it in both versions.
swguygardner
What? Deku's actual dub line was "Kacchan, I couldn't just stand there and watch you die." To me the line "you looked like you were asking for help" comes off as selfish. E-Deku's line sounded like he had to help, even though he knew he couldn't, while J-Deku's line was more like he legit thought he had a chance.
Sub or dub I don't care. It really depends on the anime. Like ghost stories, you need to watch it in in the dub. You can't debate that fact.
agree
Lol now that is one dub I can wholeheartedly agree is the definitive version.
It’s a crime against humanity to watch it subbed
You can say the same for Panty Stocking w/Garterbelt
Manga is better.
In all seriousness, MHA both are good. You can basically never go wrong with subs (unless poorly subed) and the dub has very good voice acting and voices that match their respective characters.
I think your logo would look better if it was an exclamation point with lower case "e" instead of the dot. don't ask me why I had a dream.
Unpronouncable That’s a cool idea and probably a cool dream
Why?
But then there's no point, literally. Giving the main line teeth so it resembles a vertically stretched E would be better.
E!
Ahahahh that's so random
Low-key made me want to cry, but it's fine.......Deku being suicidal never really hit me with the same impact as right flipping now, but I guess it's a thing that is happening, wow. Okay. That got really heavy really fast, but I love it, it's great.
OMG its a video on the nuances of the english language and how moving a few words around changes the meaning and connotations entirely. I LOVE THIS SHIT!!
A lot of the time, I see watching sub over dub as elitist bs. The dub is, most of the time, pretty decent and I'll only watch sub if there isn't a dub or it's *really* bad.
Hating a dub is a very very snobbish, but its also such an old timer thing to do. Back when dubs were rushed, poorly done trash, i understand. But dubs are really great now: the studios put a lot of time money and effort into translations and voice actors and make a quailty product. Now when i see people who hate dub they just seem like uneducated brats holong onto the past and the stereotypes of dubs... Those people just seem so dumb to me
Lol "uneducated brats". I'll just let your own wording sink in and let you see for yourself how hypocritical you're being, and how much you are projecting.
Personally, I pick subs over dubs simply for the jokes. I feel like the jokes fall pretty flat in a dub because humor in Japanese is different than humor in English. Japanese just _doesn't_ have sarcasm, so the jokes tend to be a bit more slapstick, which comes across as a bit cringy in English.
Like in this very video, at 2:25 , in the sub All Might is talking in English and the delivery is what makes it hilarious. I don't know why the Dub team felt the need to change it to add more dynamic. The joke is All Might's extremely simple reaction to a very impressive feat, the dub lost the joke by making his reaction as impressive as the feat.
Also somethings only make sense in Japanese rather than in English. Like for example, Midoriya choosing "Deku" as his hero name. That was a BIG ASS DEAL because of it's meaning in Japanese. It was an insulting term used by Bakugo to describe Midoriya's weakness as a quirkless boy, but then Uraraka changed the meaning of it in a way that can really only be understood in Japanese.
Then there's simple things like the dog-head Police Chief in Hosu who spoke like a dog. I don't know what they turned into in the Dub, but as far as subbing goes it was still translated a bit off because the chief put the "woof" sound at the end of certain words and not just at the end of his sentence which is what made it funny.
I have nothing against people who like watching dubs, like I don't get why people who like subs turn into fucking Bakugo when someone says they prefer dubs, but it's more just that the deeper meanings, complex word play, and jokes often don't translate when they cross languages.
@@NinjaKittkatt Well, sometimes jokes fall really flat when they're translated. It's not just a matter of taste; the comedic timing can be completely ruined by the difference in grammar between two languages, especially Japanese and English, because the punchline tends to be moved at the beginning of the sentence in translation. Check out A Defense of Dubs (on the same channel) for more details on that. There's also a lot of jokes that translate alright, but they don't make sense to a Western audience. For example, if a character is shown with a cat on their head as a piece of visual comedy, that won't make sense to most people. That's because "wearing a cat on your head" is a completely Japanese expression meaning that someone is hiding their true personality behind apparent friendliness. If you don't already know that saying, seeing a cat on someone's head is just going to be weird for you, and it's not going to be explained in a translator's not, especially if said cat isn't mentioned in the dialogue.
Anyway what I'm getting at is that while there is merit in the way jokes are delivered in Japanese, it doesn't always translate well, so the dub can often have more comedic value than the sub for most people.
@@NinjaKittkatt The second example you said is the exact same thing as in the dub
"J-best girl" *shows uraraka-chan*
Your not wrong there
Oh wow that’s FASCINATING! I mean, I read the manga and watch the dubbed anime, and I never thought of these difference in such a way...! It’s an interesting look into how these two translations say somewhat different things when you really look at them! I am impressed by your analysis and your editing is hilarious and I’m also honestly super glad you didn’t say stuff like “this is why the sub is better” or “this is why the dub is better.” They’re both great in my opinion, and I think this analysis kinda gives a good reason as to why both are perfectly valid...!
-also ive been lambasted for loving the dub before so its great that this video doesnt so that-
Also, your conclusion at the end the video about what both translations ultimately teach kinda made me cry..........
your *Explanation* was on *Point* .
christopher crafte Booooooooooo!
this needs a pin
I prefer dub but sub is also truer to the manga but I feel like can connect more with the dub
moto moto dub MHA dub is the best dub
But I like other anime sub
@@WingerWind Yeah not many westerners know japanese probably because japan is on another continent? *_mIghT bE WrONg thOUgH._*
Victor Sundström, i thought japan was a state? are you implying there's actually other countries besides america?
Fma brotherhood is the best dub fam
@@opnode9962 nah. Code Geass is the best dub ever
Speaking of superhero stories like this, Worm is a great story about one such as Deku. One in five people will obtain superpowers from some kind of trauma, and the world is mostly full of villains because of it. To get powers, you have to experience the worst thing that will ever happen to you. Taylor Hebert is somewhat of a superhero fangirl who was bullied pretty severely. Pushing her down stairs, telling her she's the reason her mom died, stuff like that. One day, during a particularly nasty bullying instance that left her in the hospital, she gained the power to control bugs, a rather unconventional power, and with this she begins her journey in an effort to become a superhero, but she learns that it's not quite that simple. The world is full of heroic villains and villainous heroes and she begins to experience that firsthand. Worm has such an interesting take on powers it's kind of insane. I highly recommend you read it.
Been listening to the audiobook for a few months while editing videos.
The audiobook is good but reading it to me really amps the immersion up, which is IMO essential to the narrative of Worm.
Brakmek11823 holy shit i love worm! wasnt expecting to see it in this thread. I havent finished it just yet but its amazing
I want to give Worm a try, but I mentally and emotionally cannot. A guy I associated with long ago ran a Worm inspired Mutants & Masterminds tabletop campaign, and he ended up being such a shithead, and the game ended up being such cancer, that it kind of turned me off hardcore. I might recover from it some day, but I can't get into it now. Goes to show, be careful who you interact with.
its like we're talking about 2 seperate shows (E-BNHA J-BNHA)
You MEAN E-MHA
So basically, MHA vs BNHA
I know there's a comment already addressing the point many must have made before me about cultural differences skewing the way dialog portrays a character, but I have to throw another on top of that pile.
I come from an English speaking country, my default culture is heavily Americanised western, and from watching a lot of subbed anime I understood the cultural context enough that when I watched BNHA in Japanese with subs the impression I formed of Deku's character was pretty much what this video shows as your impression of English dub Deku. I didn't even consider such a drastically different take on his character could logically be formed until your read on J-Deku blind sided me.
I don't have anything against English subbed anime, I'm really thankful that its such a widely available thing, and I found it really interesting to see a possible read, through a western lens that I've long lost when watching anime. I'm just confused about the purpose of this video in context...
If it's purely about the interesting ways the show differs between the sub and the dub then it may help you to note that the tone, as it is, comes across as very passionately against the Japanese depiction of Deku using an assessment based solely on meeting American social and cultural norms. To stay away from the murky waters around coming across as ignorantly lampooning his original Japanese version because it doesn't meet your cultural expectations, you could take a moment to say that this is an analysis based on an American perspective, and while the cultural implications are different your goal is to compare how the two struck you as viewed through your own culture and experiences.
Implying that this is an objective way to compare the two, that other western viewers will see this the same way just because they speak English, or that cultural differences don't have a huge part to play in the content you're comparing comes across as narrow-minded, and while I hope the previous comments that caused the need for you to post an explanation comment weren't attacking you for those oversights, I do believe criticism is relevant and could help inform a tone for your videos less likely to draw fire from people who understand and love the nuances and cultural influence in subbed anime.
People who like to watch their anime tweaked for an English speaking audience have the choice to watch the dub, but there are a lot of people who prefer the sub for various reasons. Crunchyroll having the English subs up for the English-speaking fans who want to watch them doesn't force Japanese cultural nuance on unsuspecting English speakers, ruining their interpretations of the characters and messages of the show, and I'm sure I'm not the only English speaker who would be very disappointed if subs started being written with altered scripts in an attempt to appeal to American social conventions.
I suggest to you that the changes in dialog between the two don't change the messages at all, they simply frame the messages in words that are going to portray the same ideas to people of a different background with different standards on what kinds of behaviors and attitudes read in certain ways. Deku is the same character, expressing the same things, using different words based on how each language and the cultures that use them express those ideas. English-speaking viewers understand and appreciate one version or the other better simply out of their own preference, and don't necessarily line up along language divisions.
i couldn’t of said it better, thank you for this comment
Exactly this. Well said
Unfortunately, the words you use DO mean something, especially in the context of a young boy who has to become as eloquent or well versed in the world as other people. E-deku is using different words, phrases, syntax, overall a different FEELING and connotation to his spoken word than j-deku is. So while the character is meant to be the same, the way each dub portrays this young boy is very clearly different. If there were a japanese sub of the english deku speaking, I'm sure that the words would come across much differently and he would almost seem a bit belligerent to those watching. After watching both, you can't help but get a different feeling from each deku, which means that you do end up building a preference for one over the other. Not to say anyone is wrong, but that they very clearly ARE saying different things about the same topic. Sorta like a glass half empty vs. half full approach to the character.
The Japanese play on "Deku" probably should've been translated to something like "Try Hard" or "Trayhard" or some other corruption of that if they wanted to maintain the running theme of him being an effort focused hero.
Bakugo could've called him a "quirkless try hard" and Midoriya could've transformed it to literally "someone who tries hard to accomplish their goals." The device stays alive there. It would've required a very historically unpopular tactic that the dub industry tends to avoid nowadays: changing Japanese names to English versions (looking at you Pokemon, Sailor Moon and Megaman) but it does work from time to time. Megaman, Pokemon and Street Fighter are good examples. Midoriya could've been "Deku" in the East and "Tryhard" in the West.
Anyway, that's my two cents.
That's kinda cute, I like it
Hope is not foolish, even when it is. Very well said friend. I love Hero Aca because I can really get behind that message
I've been watching the sub mainly but also watching the dub in my spare time since it's coming out slower and yeah, it's such a weird contrast between Deku's huh? I find the sub is a lot more blunt in its wording and All Might is a lot more playful when he's in his super form too. J-Deku is a little more 'depressive' than E-Deku who seems to be in denial but deep down knows that it's probably useless to keep going. E-Deku has the 'they may be right but I'll still try my best' attitude while J-Deku has a 'I'm on the verge of giving up hope but I'll keep trying' with J-Deku sounding more on the verge of suicide if his plans on having his application to UA accepted are instead rejected officially.
This video is so interesting and well-made. I subscribed! In fact, the differences you pointed out were not even jumps-I think anyone who watched both the dub and sub would have sensed that something seemed different. Hearing you break it down, analyze the connotations, and ultimately tie it into a meaningful message and a great conclusion, this video makes me think "ah, so this is what English class was trying to teach me to do".
It results in two different stories. In the Japanese version, Izuku had a pipe dream that was simply a fantasy, but he was blessed with a miracle that allowed his dream to come true. He has an external locus of control, and is content with simply waiting and hoping his time comes. On the other hand, English Izuku might see One For All as a natural progression toward his dream. If the anime was made by the English writers, they probably would have shown Izuku learning martial arts or going through training in middle school, taking the initiative to build useful skills that demonstrate his internal locus of control.
May I suggest a video topic? Can you analyze how Izuku's character grows after gaining One For All? In one of the BNHA Radio clips, we hear Bakugou's voice actor saying that he actually thinks Deku is dislikable, because from Bakugou's perspective Deku is looking down on him. Then Deku's voice actor says it's because Kacchan doesn't hear his internal monologue, but he really acknowledges Kacchan (and Mineta's voice actor laughs that even saying that like is looking down on him). Izuku knows that in the end he's guaranteed to become the Number One hero because of One For All, so he always feels that he's in the right. It was something I never thought about before, and it might make a cool character study.
I definitely prefer English Deku. When you point the differences, it becomes clear that English Deku is far more grounded and aware of what he has to overcome, rather than going in blind. He seems like someone who actually wants something, rather than just escaping to something.
Though, this was like the third time I related to a character, and I know others will relate to Japanese Deku more, but to each their own.
I would think it's best to prioritize what the author of the source material actually intended for the character over what one might prefer in terms of having an 'inspiring personality' or what one might find more relatable, personally.
What he intended is in the manga. In japanese. The base translation to English Manga, or even Japanese Anime, is more than enough for that to be warped. I enjoy one more, so Im going to view that version. Thats all there is to it.
SuperAinsleyVitality
My god that sounded snobby.
@@themadmystic1688 i agree. I wonder if the translators picked up on it and made that slight change for English audiences... Its certainly a more American message; Makes it more relatable.
For Japanese Deku, his goal of becoming a hero, is shut down over the simple fact that he is quirkless. And becoming a hero is just that, a fantasy. Deku's mother burst into tears when she saw how heart broken he was over his life dream being crushed. From that point on, he still didnt give up, using everything he could to work his way towards becoming a hero like his idol. But again, no matter how much work he put in, no matter how hard he tried, he would never have a quirk. Because of the hope his fantasy gave him, he held onto that, despite the doubt being thrown in his face. That shows the importance of his dream.
Holy stinking super-crap, this is a detailed analysis. If only most sub/dub arguments were this good. Or, you know, not stupid.
Another fantastic video. This sort of analysis is the stuff I would never have thought of, so seeing you going into depth in an informative and unique way is just so fantastic. Seriously. You are the UA-camr that no one asked for, but we needed all along.
Keep it up.
(See what I did there? Playing homage to your ending sentence? Eh? Eh? Nevermind.)
Same old story, Japan must love the story of a pandered victim getting there Escapist fantasy come true. While on the other hand Americans love a Underdog that doesn't quit under adversity. It makes you think what if all might never found Deku.
J Deku would've either kill himself or live the rest of his life miserably.
E Deku would have driven himself mad trying to become Batman or succeed becoming Batman.
Real people are boring, I see real people everyday.
Also I've never seen a real person almost rip their body apart just to get somebody to stop being stubborn.
Becoming Batman and driving yourself mad to become Batman are not mutually exclusive options.
Yeah, just like Colonel Japan!
e-deku doesnt exist while j-deku is an actual person.
“Having a dream, no matter how crazy it may be, will make you a better person... hope is not foolish, even when it is” is going on my wall, I hope you know! Very well done and I love the whiteboard style editing you did here! Keep up the great work!
I love seeing how the simple phrasing of certain lines can change a story and its characters so much! ^-^
I watch the series subbed. Why? Because I'm too impatient to wait for dub.
That's basically my only reason as well
Well they came out at the same hour throughout the sports festival...they're two weeks different now, but that's a pretty impressive feat for dubbing
It is rough knowing that there are 2 episodes I could be watching right now, but I treat it like the manga, which I'm not reading. If I wanted to know what's coming, I would, but I enjoy my english VAs too much to watch it any other way at this point. (and yes, I have heard the japanese VAs and they are totally good, too, I mean Kyuubi/Kurama as Allmight is such a good casting, but like DBZ, I have to have my Sabat)
Why not both? *Mexican music plays*
Almighty Roadkill Lololololol that freaking girl... I guess it's that I want the story to happen for me while hearing the people I connect to those characters. To go through it with them.
Sub vs dub? I usually end up preffering the thing i end up watching first, weird. I know, but that's just how it is for me. When i first watched BNHA it was the subbed version, and i loved it. I watched till season 2 (waiting for all the season 3 episodes are released so i don't have to be stressed for the next ep). But that in mind, i never really bothered watching the dubbed version till recently, and boy was i suprised. The dubbed version was actually for my little sister, who was watching the series for the first time so i watched along. And let me tell you, the delivery and emotions in BNHA eng dubbed was something else. This is very personal opinion but i liked the american Deku a lot more, his character felt alot more hopeful and clear about his dreams and overall a lot more determined, and all it took was 1 episode for me to end up crying. I connected so well with his character, and usually NEVER cry over anime.
That's almost everbody lol
Where’s a good website to watch dubbed? I watched all of subbed on Crunchyroll but they don’t have the dub on there and my brother can’t read subtitles fast enough
@@sarahenglerstone2814 go on gogoanime is preety gud
Your increased emotional reaction to the dub might also be because you're going to catch the vocal cues and intonations more easily in a language that you speak, and you're going to catch them at the same moment that you're going to ge the visual that goes with them. You're going to hear the actor's voice crack at the same time that you're going to see the first tear pooling up in a character's eye, instead of having a delay between what you hear, what you read, and what you see. In a dub, it all hits you at the same time, which tends to make a stronger impact.
S. Evelynn Pratt I completely agree with you but in Bakugo vs Deku part 2 when Bakugo was crying the sub hit me more in the feels then the dub even though I enjoy more the dub then the sub
I honestly love how the dub handled the characters, especially Bakugou.
I need more video like this (Subs Vs. Dubs).
I really love the editing that you are doing in this channel.
I watched Hero Aca with Eng Dub from the getgo and I have to say that how you described E-Deku really is how I saw him. I did think he seemed a bit depressed at times, but he did feel just like a huge dorky nerd with a dream, not like a maybe suicidal boy with a fantasy that keeps him going.
A really great video! I love to see the differences made in translation!
Love the video. I appreciate you trying to layer the sub and dub in the same scene to save time, but personally it got confusing to follow trying to read and listen at the same time, and then apply both to an analysis. I would suggest split them up to make clearer more defined points. But I've been loving your videos from day one so keep up the great work!
Man, I'm glad you're making it into a series, I study translation and the subs vs dubs debate has always been pretty heated, I can ensure arguments like these would give most people a run for their money, so keep the good work!
Had this on my watchlist for 3 years And now there’s five seasons of my hero how time flies by
15:08 there are so many great choices of images throughout your videos, but I find it particularly funny that you would use My Brother, My Brother and Me to represent 'Advice'.
My clear argument on why MHA English dub is the proper way to do dubbing is based on how well the writing is, even in English. My biggest case and point is season 3 episode 11. When endeavor is talking, in the japanese dub he says “What’s with that pitiful back” as he means that he’s always been staring at All Might’s back in trying to be the best hero. In the dub, he says something similar, but it’s changed when he shouts out “Stand up and show them why you’re better”. The same can be said about Bakugou and Deku shout to All Might, the English is has more emotion because it isn’t just both of them saying the same thing, it’s Deku saying “win this” and Bakugou saying “beat him”, and then saying the same thing “Come on, All Might”. That works better because each phrase said by either character fits their personality. Deku just wants All Might to win the fight, Bakugou wants All Might to win by beating All For One.
It's interesting how the Dub people basically changed the character, in my opinion probably for the better. Still prefer the subs but after it's finished I might go back and watch the dub :D Great video as always and SUPER sexy audio quality
JoeThePro you should give the dub a shot if you ever have some spare time, considering that horikoshi based this entirely off of western comics and while written he was at a low point in his life and wrote it out of complete optimism, the tonal value of the Dub just fits the show very well, and all though some people might not like his voice at first you get use to dekus voice very fast and my god when the emotional scenes hit with him they hit hard, Also Chris sabbat all might is amazing, he really encapsulates a super man esque attitude tones that horikoshi was going for. Overall I think this dub is right up there as one of the best shounen dubs along side full metal alchemist and dragon ball z. I also understand how some people enjoy the sun better and that's fine. I really appreciate both and have watched both, but just fell the values of the dub for the story overall better especially with dekus character progression
I may just be looking at the wrong places on youtube, but this is an awesome idea for a series, and I've never seen anyone do something like this before. It may just be me but I'm excited to see the differences and your interpretation of them.
What makes this better is that you kinda sound like eng dub Deku. XD
Holy crap how come I haven't seen your stuff before? I know this video is older and I gotta check out your newer stuff too, but your eye for subtle nuances blows me away. I want THAT quirk lmao!
Am I the only one who think he sounds like Deku in the English dub?
I agree.
Wait till he says smash
AYO i thought that was just me 😅
no not really, it sounds weirf
I prefer subs but dubs can be amazing
And I prefer dubs... but then there are scenes like "holy ... stinking .... supercrap!"
and I'm all like "Why the hell did they change that!? Oh my... Oh my ... GOODNESS was already in english!!!"
I can understand change for cultural reasons, I can understand change for the sake of lip sync ...
But this had no reason to be changed .... much less changed for the worse ...
+Devid Kerber
"Why the hell did they change that!?"
Easy. They changed "oh my GOODNESS" because in the Japanese version, it's an Engrish joke. A lot of anime, especially MHA, use Engrish jokes as a source as a form of humor. Why else do you think so many people find it funny when they hear Japanese people say English words/sentences in thick Asian accents? Because it sounds silly to us, and to a Japanese audience, it sounds not only silly, but exotic and unique to them, and emphasizes All Might's American-inspired character archetype. A lot of American-stereotyped anime characters speak in Engrish or bad Japanese to show they speak English.
When people like Present Mic speak Engrish in the sub, in contrast to characters like All Might, it's more for the sake of a gag or a comedic expression than anything else. Japanese also uses a lot of borrowed words from English and other languages (ex: there's no Japanese word for 'hot dog' so they just say 'hotto doggu' by pronouncing it in their tongue). Anime characters also just say English words to try to sound educated or unique; since everyone speaks Japanese, it shows they're bilingual or it makes them stand out from the characters that only speak Japanese. It sets a unique tone speaking a foreign language than what's primarily spoken.
We don't get that same effect in the English dub. Why speak Engrish or use the simple or incorrect English phrases the sub uses when everyone is already speaking English? The shock value and silliness of All Might saying "oh my GOODNESS" would be gone if it was in the dub, because he isn't speaking Japanese in every other instance to contrast this moment. Having him say "oh my GOODNESS" just wouldn't work as well in English because it just sounds so plain when All Might's declaration of surprise is meant to the silly.
So to try to keep the silliness the Japanese version intended with that phrase, the dub tried to replicate it with a silly English phrase instead. "Holy stinking SUPER CRAP" works well enough to me; it's not only a silly phrase, but it also emphasizes the exaggerated stereotypical American superhero stereotype that the dub has to play out a *lot* more than the sub in order to nail what All Might's character is supposed to be.
In Japanese, all they needed to do to get the point across that All Might's a stereotypical American superhero is to set in his heroic tone of voice and have him speak Engrish.
In English, they have to put a bit more work into it; they can easily nail the stereotypical cheesy superhero tone in English, too, but rather than have him speak Engrish or some other language, they have All Might speak in super-exaggerated superhero lingo and use made-up/exemplified English words to have the same effect as his Engrish in the Japanese version.
*That's* why it was changed. Sorry for the long comment, though! Hope that helps.
to be fair, the japanese translation for when ochako is explaining dekus name is much worse than the english explanation, they both have their weak points
Ghost Stories
Weirdly enough I usually have Subtitles every time I watch a DVD or something on TV but while watching Subbed Anime I usually tend to fall asleep
Is that strange??
this is a really good analysis and draws a lot of interesting lines between the tone set by the sub and the tone set by the dub, and i also really appreciate the pinned comment you have reiterating that it's not about how it's LITERALLY translated, but how this character is translated CULTURALLY.
we subbed to your channel because we also watched your video on doki doki literature club, and you've got a great way of keeping things straightforward without being overly clinical or overly bland about it. looking forward to watching more!!!
I love your videos Mr.Ex point. For a pretty new youtuber I think u do really well with the way u edit your videos and the way u explain it with both pictures and scenes from whatever you are talking about. I don't know if u will see this comment but know a lot of people get a lot of insight and look at things a bit differently after u talk about something in a video. I hope u continue ur streak of entertaining but still informative videos.
"That's right mom, now I can disappoint you full time"
Instant like
I just love the convoluted crampacked screens
while I love your analysis and think you're right on the money on some things, I think one point you're missing is the contextual differences between Japanese and English language and the cultures they're in. Case in point, translating with exact language can change the intensity, or even the entire MEANING of a statement; someone saying "I like you" to a crush in English either sounds like an immature kid or like an entry into the "Friend Zone", but saying "I like you" to a crush in Japanese is a really big deal because "love" (aishiteru) is considered extremely strong language.
In this case, you said that E-Deku speaks about his bullying with stronger language, stating affirmatively that he won't be a vicitim and blaming his classmates rather than himself. You also mention that he says things like "maybe that's why" which makes him sound weak-willed. However, Japanese language is baked in a cultural trope called "enryo", which creates a strong taboo against A) talking strongly about yourself or your feelings and B) badmouthing other people. Deku is characterized as being a fine, upstanding young man, so his language is coded to reflect his good-natured heart despite his sad backstory. Having J-Deku speak with language similar to E-Deku would be like E-Deku saying "Fuck those posers. I'm gonna prove they're pieces of shit." or, in summation, it would make him sound extremely rude and bratty.
In future sub vs dub videos, I hope you take the differences in how language affects the cultures before you come to a conclusion. Even with perfect translations, trying to apply same meaning in English as you do in Japanese is flawed. As I said, I largely agree with your points, but I think you're missing that important piece.
That being said this video was supposed to be about English subs vs English dubs. What you are suggesting that he do is make japanese dubs vs English dubs. That would require him to know japanese to make the video and his viewers to know japanese to enjoy it fully (at least in my case).
He's not analyzing the differences in culture/language, he's analyzing the two stories being told one through writing and the other through voice. He's talking about how a person in the West would experience the two sets of dialogue.
Óhamingju you are right but he still has to understand why the wording in subs is the way it is, because it changes the way subs are meant. He needed to at least voice this so maybe Western viewers that don't know this can learn a little. But the op original point and just how bad the dub voices are is why I watch subs.
I wasn't making a quality statement about the sub vs the dub. I agree with him that that dub version comes closer to how we in the English world would speak rather than someone in the Japanese world. The dub does a pretty good job of "Americanizing" Deku.
However, what I disagree with is how he characterizes J-Deku. J-Deku is not at all like the way he describes him, when viewed within the context of Japanese culture and language. Although I understand how an English-speaker reading the sub would get that impression.
Robert Hall that might be true, but the sub is just as much a translation as the dub. They could have both had near identical scripts, but they don't, and so here we are.
Absolutely stellar video, Mr. Point!
If I may make a little comment on something I find interesting and maybe would be worth noting in the second video; notice the difference in sentence length and structure of E vs J Deku's comments. J Deku is cut and dry and to the point, that first line "all men are not created equal," we are shown that he is not going to sugar coat his words, he is making a statement. E Deku on the other hand precedes that statement with, "here's the sad truth," which, while seemingly simple, adds (especially and importantly for it is THE first line of the show) his point of view and filters it through that to the audience. The idea of not everyone being created equal is, for E Deku, something imposed more through his views while for J Deku it is a pure and simple statement about the world. And I notice this occur other times throughout your examples. J Deku is sparser, even if not by much, by enough to show that he knows if he keeps going with his thought process he knows he'll end up dead ending and so leaves less said so as to not face it (that trailing "but" he uses), but I also find that makes him kinda a mores realistic individual, the fact that his sentences aren't running around because he knows where they will lead. Whereas with E Deku he puts a lot more into his sentences and starts to trail and use more semantic particles to just try and keep the thought train going so he doesn't have to face the emptiness of not saying something. It seems like E Deku needs to keep trying to say something, to keep saying he can, as though to almost block and not give another the chance to say, "kid, you can't do it."
Just some semantic, linguistic thoughts thrown your way. I find this shit fascinating and love seeing someone do videos on it. Can't wait for the next one :)
I don't have anything against the dub, but the sub is a lot more true to the manga, which means that Deku was meant to view becoming a hero as an unattainable pipe dream until All Might gave him the opportunity to make it a reality. The dub takes what Horikoshi originally wrote and tweaks it a bit to better fit their American audience by making Deku at least somewhat optimistic about becoming a hero.
But he does know that it's unattainable. In the second episode he admits after being lectured by All Might that he always knew deep down that what All Might said was the truth. He never really believed he had a shot. He was just lying to himself because facing that reality head on would absolutely crush him and he couldn't take that.
Justin v - considering the fact that the manga is completely based of western comics (horikoshi has admitted this many times, i.e. Deku is suppose to be an embodiment of Spider-Man and what not) the tone of the English dub fits the show more smoothly, don't get me wrong I love the sub and the dub, but the dubs tonal points fit everything better you know since it is based off American comics, and horikoshi has been stated saying he really enjoys the dub and the direction the characters are going, so idk why everyone is complaining. Just watch it however you want to watch it and don't try to ruin it for other people
Justin V Honestly for me, I wouldn’t be able to watch the sub in the first few episodes just because of how pessimistic he is. I’m a pretty optimistic guy myself so I attract more to E-Deku than J-Deku because he’s more optimistic and driven (not that J-Deku isn’t driven, it’s just in these first few episodes he’s very depressing and it gets worse once All Might tells him the hard cold truth). The story also just flows better imo in the dub because of course a hero fanboy is going to want to be a hero and that’s why he should be much more driven. And that amount of drive is what makes All Might’s truth even more devastating
Dub is for lazy people sub is for people who care about the story
Haise Sasaki That means literally nothing at all. So in your opinion, if you watch sub, you aren't actually watching, simply because you're reading text on a screen? Thats not how it works. They're talking about the difference between dialogue and character portrayals, not reading vs. watching.
Watched the new movie in Sub and Dub, and one highlight of Dub is that Midoriya sounded less cringe.
I just recently found your channel, and I listen to your videos in the background of college homework, which helps me focus, and then gives me something to listen to afterward. I'm surprised you've only been on here for a few months and have this many subs, so you deserve the praise and subs you have man. Keep up your good work! Love the channel
THE DUB IS GOOD WTF WHY WEEBS BE MAD
Lol, "weebs". By the way, the dub is trash.
LilJbm1 i like the dub better only stupid weebs that think Japanese is a language of gods are the one that say dubs are trash
Sapphire Savage the only reason this argument is happening is because fucks like you call Anyone who likes the sub because OPINIONS are apparently a thing a bunch of fucking weebs and then then they go hate on the dub because u kept hating on the sub
Also I don’t think the dub is trash I just like the sub alot more
___ X ___ this is facts
Unpopular opinion: I like the dub more for hero academia
Airnicco I agree with this unpopular opinion
I nominate this opinion for most popular unpopular opinion
Airnicco I second this opinion :)
Airnicco It's not an unpopular opinion, though. Just scrolling through this comment section there are far more people who prefer dubs.
TheFluidSquid see my earlier comment lol
I prefer J deku as opposed to E deku as the mentality of "hard work will get you anywhere is just a false ideal". While E dekus an idealist, J dekus a dissapointed one. Much more fitting to his struggle and makes the pay off of him finally becoming a hero that much more sweet.
This definitely was not what I was expecting, but I am so glad that it wasn't. It was so interesting getting to hear your analysis of the subbed and dubbed version of season one. Keep up the great content!
I feel like you could perform a very good Deku impression.
I remember watching the scene where Deku was looking at the monitor crying, but feeling for it way more when I watched it again so many months later in Japanese. In some scenes, I really was impressed with J-Deku. E-Deku had his moments too, of course. I watched it dubbed first, but that one scene in the Japanese genuinely made me sad and feel for him.
BUT BAKUGO *IS* SMART
I absolutely teared up at Deku's big smile towards the end. I love my son and I haven't even watched this show.
Have you watched it yet?
When you dig the anime so much you watch both versions just to have an excuse to rewatch the series.
all the hard work you put into it, the editing explains it well
“This is the ultimate message of hero aca: that having a dream no matter how crazy it may be, will make you a better person.
That hope is not foolish, even when it is”
I just really needed to quote that because god damn that is one hell of a moral. I’ve seen many sides of mha (trust me on this I’ve seen the depths of Ao3) but very rarely do I find a moral so strong and held close to its heart. Gives me an entire new perspective to work through :)
You have to understand, the sub is also a translation (though it can be more accurate since it doesn't have to match mouth flaps).
I really feel like the suicide thing is kinda stretching.
Just as an example, I for some reason remember the exact Japanese wording of the doctor to Deku. He says 諦めた方がいいね。
The subs say it's probably better if you give it up.
But if you wanted to be super literal about it (which you should never do in translation), then it's like telling him that it would have been good if he chose to give it up (it being his dream). Of notice, he doesn't say it would be good if you give it up, but uses the past form, indicating that it would be better if he had already given up that dream.
Nothing wrong with the translation, Crunchyroll subs are consistently high quality, but just don't try to take translation wording as super exact is my point. It is usually more exact than a dub, though, of course.
But he wasn't looking at the Japanese dialogue, he was looking at the English subtitles. He's talking about how a primarily English speaking audience would experience the series, so he only talks about the English Dub and the English Subtitles. Maybe the subtitles give off the wrong impression, but that's his point, that different localisations of the show will result in people inferring different things.
6:05 While speaking to muscle Jesus had me dead 😂
Also sometimes they change the translation like,"oh my goddess" line. Keep in mind that they have to make the syllabus match the "mouth flaps" (as the VAs say it)
I think another reason was actually to preserve the the comedic tone. What makes it funny in the Japanese is simy that he's speaking english, but in the dub they try to give it a similar punch by making it am actual exaggerated phrase.
Your visuals are amazing and suprisingly smooth flowing, at least to me
This is one of my favorite videos, and it bugs me that most the comments are just arguing about what one is better, when that isn't the point it's about how they're different just from how the sentences are phrased. I guess I shouldn't be surprised since the series name is Subs v Dubs that this video would get that kind of response.