Speaking as a former teacher myself, I honestly have to agree. I'm not for just blindly firing teachers, but as with any job, there are repercussions when you do something egregious. How would any corporate HR department respond when you threaten a coworker with violence? They'd fire you.
Yeah. No politics or religion in the classroom. A very firm rule of mine. Admittedly it is easier for me, as I teach Math, so it allows me to focus on apolitical things
Oh definitely, some courses make it a bit easier for sure. I taught primarily History, but also English, and these kinds of things came up constantly because they were so integral to the curriculum. I still remember covering both the 2016 and 2020 elections in class and explaining how voting, the electoral college, and inaugurations work. The kids had a lot of questions too, but I answered them from a point of educating them about it, not telling them how I felt about it.
I grew up in Southern California. Most of my history teachers definitely hated America and taught the classes that way. Same with most of my English teachers saying things like "Shakespeare is just another dead white guy, and we cover too many dead white authors in the curriculum." Of the 40-ish books that my high school teachers assigned, I think only 10 or so were written by white men, but that was still "too many" according to my English teachers.
Unfortunately, a lot of teachers do that and I never agreed with them on those perspectives. Now, does the curriculum inherently need updates? Oh yeah, especially in History and English, and I taught both courses so I was exposed to all of it. I've noticed that History is prone to teacher outbursts and impartiality which skews student understanding about our past, while English teachers are more likely to push Young Adult novels written by ethnically diverse people on everyone and ignore anything classical because they're both forced to by the state and inherently think they aren't relevant anymore - notions that aren't true. Also, as someone who taught those YA novels since they're so integral to the curriculum in CA now, I would say most of them aren't very good quality and boil life lessons down into incredibly simplistic terms instead of challenging students to think about them. I'm sorry you had to experience that and I was definitely one of those who constantly pushed back against it. Unfortunately, the teachers like me have left the profession due to all of the other issues plaguing the school system, thus leaving us mostly with the ones in this video and those you experienced during your own schooling.
No politics or religion in the classroom. That includes the idiots down in Louisiana that wanna put Christianity in classrooms. I don’t want my kids exposed to that crap. Also, with the kid who had the Trump hat, anything that’s a distraction is against the dress code when I was growing up . Frankly that included all hats at the school I went to. But if it’s a political message it should be enforced across the spectrum. No clothing with political messages in the class room. They could wear it in the hall if it’s not depicting, violence, or curse words but should take it off or cover it in the classroom where the attention should be on the subject matter. The only exception to the no politics is a government , journalism or history course in high school. Where current events may be relevant.
That's generally the policy in most schools. As long as it fits with the dress code, kids can wear whatever they want. Generally teachers don't even bother with enforcing it anymore either since it often creates more problems than it solves - as in this case.
These rants are not okay. That said, it will be hard for history teachers to give ACTUAL trump facts without sounding as though he is a pretty bad guy. Or do we ignore insurrection? Adjudicated Sexual Assault? Defamer? Convicted Felon? These are all true facts, whether you like him or not. How does a history teacher handle talking about trump FACTS.
Oh, excellent question. From a history teacher's perspective, what we would need to do as we cover that is give both the factual evidence, but specifically the context, and let them draw their own conclusions. Let's just use January 6th as an example of how to do this. I would show them video footage of what happened, the details about how people felt there was election fraud (and the subsequent documents that came form investigations pertaining to it), any quotes Trump made on that day both before and after the protestors stormed the capital, and finally have the students decide for themselves from both the primary and secondary sources available to us who was to "blame" for the events of the day. I might use a Socratic Seminar to have students freely discuss their opinions about all of it and then follow that up with writing an essay using the sources and any refutations gained from the class discussion where they take a stance on that point. You'll end up with wildly different responses for people who blame Trump for it, don't blame him and just the protestors, or students who blame both to varying degrees.
Seams like your simply arguing for the removal of teacher morality from the classroom. Which I'm not sure I'm for or against. Your argument allows for an open discussion on specifically bad things, like slavery, even the founding of the United states. The taxes levied do have a legal argument, and could be argued as just, making the formation of the country suspect. In addition to this; your opinion on young adult novels, why do you think varied perspective a bad thing, and other than your own bias, what evidence do you have that they are poor teaching material? And to factor in as well you perhaps were teaching in one of the many many states that has absolutely atrocious public School systems; perhaps it's simply an argument of the system, or your training that is poor. At what point does it become less an open ground for formation of ideology and more and a breeding ground for indoctrination to bad things? I'm sure more than one intellectual individual could make arguments that would sway a less intelligent individual to believing something heinous. @@KevinTheID
Okay, there's a lot to unpack in your comment. Let me go through each point one at a time. 1. I'm not arguing for teachers to remove all morality, rather realize that their own morality cannot inherently substitute or supersede that of anyone else's. And yes, I often had class discussions about the founding of the United States from the taxation perspective while going over Colonialism and the Revolutionary War. One such activity is where I would have half the class take on the roles of the Continental Congress and the other half would be the King and Parliament where they would hash out their grievances. That doesn't call the formation of the country into suspect, but rather shows that both sides had valid arguments; not to mention that it clearly represents how multifaceted history is. 2. I'm not sure where you got the idea that I don't want varied perspectives from. My entire argument in this video was advocating against teachers enforcing a singular perspective. I also never said YA novels were poor teaching materials - rather that most inherently have very simplistic themes and thus make having class discussions using them rather difficult. I'm all for using YA novels which are more complex and make students reflect on broader themes, ideologies, and life experiences. 3. Most school systems are in a poor state these days, hence why somewhere 1.5 million teachers have quit the profession in the last 5 years. Also, my training as an educator in CA was higher quality than anywhere else in the country so I'm not sure where this argument is coming from either. Refer to my video on the idea of lowering teacher qualifications for an explanation of my training: ua-cam.com/video/40IQzroZTrg/v-deo.html 4. To your last point: "At what point does it become less an open ground for formation of ideology and more and a breeding ground for indoctrination to bad things? I'm sure more than one intellectual individual could make arguments that would sway a less intelligent individual to believing something heinous." You literally just proved the points I made in this video. A single teacher could make students believe incorrect or subversive things if allowed to spout their political beliefs in class - because most students are comparatively less intelligent (due to still receiving their formative education). By having actual discussions about difficult topics and getting students to research and back up their own opinions using primary and secondary sources, you prevent indoctrination from happening because they will be exposed to competing viewpoints. Indoctrination, by definition, is education of a singular narrative - which doesn't exist if you have multiple narratives being discussed at the same time.
How can you never disclose what you believe or support? I know America is very divided but even then why would it be a problem for a child who supports Harris to know his teacher supports Trump?? You say it would make them dislike the teacher but if that's all it takes they never really liked that teacher to begin with. Also you can still learn kids to think for themselves and let them know what you think or believe. School is like a mini community, they will encounter people there with different believes to their own and learn that can still work together, be a team ect. These kids show more heart then the adults. They still understand it's okay to make a mistake. So sweet of them.
Hmmm, interesting questions. I would say there are things you can express you believe in or support, such as your favorite sports teams, your hobbies, and your goals in life. But expressing your political beliefs shouldn't be one of them since you'll inevitably sway your students in a specific direction, whether that be to reinforce one students' viewpoint or push another farther away from you, thus making them less likely to listen to you since they know you aren't objective. Even if they never liked that teacher to begin with, being impartial makes them respect you to some degree - because liking someone and respecting them are not mutually exclusive. As for making a mistake, that happens and yes, I think most kids can forgive and forget that. In my last year in the classroom I was so overworked, stressed, and frustrated with students screwing around when they were banging on my door I accidentally dropped the F-word in class for the first time ever, and I profusely apologized to the kids for that behavior immediately (also made me realize that maybe I didn't want to be in the classroom anymore). But, going on political rants, cursing out your own students without any remorse like this, and making them feel small for not liking what you like is dictatorial and petty. It has no place in the classroom.
@@KevinTheID Thank you for your reply. I understand and mostly support your position. But I still feel it would be ]difficult to hold once you start talking about different topics in class. And I feel it could break trust if you talk about decisive issues in the classroom and ask your students about their position on them but won't reveal yours if they ask. I think just maybe the kids who protest know better then us people online who saw a short video. I'm happy they don't show these video's on the news here. These are internal issues that need to be resolved within the school.
I think you're getting a little hung up on the idea that kids will distrust teachers for not expressing their views in class - a problem I've never seen or heard them having. Most value our neutrality in those discussions.
All three should be fired. Unprofessional behavior. Full Stop!
Speaking as a former teacher myself, I honestly have to agree. I'm not for just blindly firing teachers, but as with any job, there are repercussions when you do something egregious.
How would any corporate HR department respond when you threaten a coworker with violence? They'd fire you.
Yeah. No politics or religion in the classroom. A very firm rule of mine. Admittedly it is easier for me, as I teach Math, so it allows me to focus on apolitical things
Oh definitely, some courses make it a bit easier for sure. I taught primarily History, but also English, and these kinds of things came up constantly because they were so integral to the curriculum.
I still remember covering both the 2016 and 2020 elections in class and explaining how voting, the electoral college, and inaugurations work. The kids had a lot of questions too, but I answered them from a point of educating them about it, not telling them how I felt about it.
I grew up in Southern California. Most of my history teachers definitely hated America and taught the classes that way. Same with most of my English teachers saying things like "Shakespeare is just another dead white guy, and we cover too many dead white authors in the curriculum."
Of the 40-ish books that my high school teachers assigned, I think only 10 or so were written by white men, but that was still "too many" according to my English teachers.
Unfortunately, a lot of teachers do that and I never agreed with them on those perspectives. Now, does the curriculum inherently need updates? Oh yeah, especially in History and English, and I taught both courses so I was exposed to all of it. I've noticed that History is prone to teacher outbursts and impartiality which skews student understanding about our past, while English teachers are more likely to push Young Adult novels written by ethnically diverse people on everyone and ignore anything classical because they're both forced to by the state and inherently think they aren't relevant anymore - notions that aren't true. Also, as someone who taught those YA novels since they're so integral to the curriculum in CA now, I would say most of them aren't very good quality and boil life lessons down into incredibly simplistic terms instead of challenging students to think about them.
I'm sorry you had to experience that and I was definitely one of those who constantly pushed back against it. Unfortunately, the teachers like me have left the profession due to all of the other issues plaguing the school system, thus leaving us mostly with the ones in this video and those you experienced during your own schooling.
No politics or religion in the classroom. That includes the idiots down in Louisiana that wanna put Christianity in classrooms. I don’t want my kids exposed to that crap.
Also, with the kid who had the Trump hat, anything that’s a distraction is against the dress code when I was growing up . Frankly that included all hats at the school I went to. But if it’s a political message it should be enforced across the spectrum. No clothing with political messages in the class room. They could wear it in the hall if it’s not depicting, violence, or curse words but should take it off or cover it in the classroom where the attention should be on the subject matter. The only exception to the no politics is a government , journalism or history course in high school. Where current events may be relevant.
That's generally the policy in most schools. As long as it fits with the dress code, kids can wear whatever they want. Generally teachers don't even bother with enforcing it anymore either since it often creates more problems than it solves - as in this case.
These rants are not okay. That said, it will be hard for history teachers to give ACTUAL trump facts without sounding as though he is a pretty bad guy. Or do we ignore insurrection? Adjudicated Sexual Assault? Defamer? Convicted Felon? These are all true facts, whether you like him or not. How does a history teacher handle talking about trump FACTS.
Oh, excellent question. From a history teacher's perspective, what we would need to do as we cover that is give both the factual evidence, but specifically the context, and let them draw their own conclusions.
Let's just use January 6th as an example of how to do this. I would show them video footage of what happened, the details about how people felt there was election fraud (and the subsequent documents that came form investigations pertaining to it), any quotes Trump made on that day both before and after the protestors stormed the capital, and finally have the students decide for themselves from both the primary and secondary sources available to us who was to "blame" for the events of the day.
I might use a Socratic Seminar to have students freely discuss their opinions about all of it and then follow that up with writing an essay using the sources and any refutations gained from the class discussion where they take a stance on that point.
You'll end up with wildly different responses for people who blame Trump for it, don't blame him and just the protestors, or students who blame both to varying degrees.
Seams like your simply arguing for the removal of teacher morality from the classroom. Which I'm not sure I'm for or against. Your argument allows for an open discussion on specifically bad things, like slavery, even the founding of the United states. The taxes levied do have a legal argument, and could be argued as just, making the formation of the country suspect. In addition to this; your opinion on young adult novels, why do you think varied perspective a bad thing, and other than your own bias, what evidence do you have that they are poor teaching material? And to factor in as well you perhaps were teaching in one of the many many states that has absolutely atrocious public School systems; perhaps it's simply an argument of the system, or your training that is poor. At what point does it become less an open ground for formation of ideology and more and a breeding ground for indoctrination to bad things? I'm sure more than one intellectual individual could make arguments that would sway a less intelligent individual to believing something heinous. @@KevinTheID
Okay, there's a lot to unpack in your comment. Let me go through each point one at a time.
1. I'm not arguing for teachers to remove all morality, rather realize that their own morality cannot inherently substitute or supersede that of anyone else's. And yes, I often had class discussions about the founding of the United States from the taxation perspective while going over Colonialism and the Revolutionary War. One such activity is where I would have half the class take on the roles of the Continental Congress and the other half would be the King and Parliament where they would hash out their grievances. That doesn't call the formation of the country into suspect, but rather shows that both sides had valid arguments; not to mention that it clearly represents how multifaceted history is.
2. I'm not sure where you got the idea that I don't want varied perspectives from. My entire argument in this video was advocating against teachers enforcing a singular perspective. I also never said YA novels were poor teaching materials - rather that most inherently have very simplistic themes and thus make having class discussions using them rather difficult. I'm all for using YA novels which are more complex and make students reflect on broader themes, ideologies, and life experiences.
3. Most school systems are in a poor state these days, hence why somewhere 1.5 million teachers have quit the profession in the last 5 years. Also, my training as an educator in CA was higher quality than anywhere else in the country so I'm not sure where this argument is coming from either. Refer to my video on the idea of lowering teacher qualifications for an explanation of my training: ua-cam.com/video/40IQzroZTrg/v-deo.html
4. To your last point: "At what point does it become less an open ground for formation of ideology and more and a breeding ground for indoctrination to bad things? I'm sure more than one intellectual individual could make arguments that would sway a less intelligent individual to believing something heinous."
You literally just proved the points I made in this video. A single teacher could make students believe incorrect or subversive things if allowed to spout their political beliefs in class - because most students are comparatively less intelligent (due to still receiving their formative education). By having actual discussions about difficult topics and getting students to research and back up their own opinions using primary and secondary sources, you prevent indoctrination from happening because they will be exposed to competing viewpoints. Indoctrination, by definition, is education of a singular narrative - which doesn't exist if you have multiple narratives being discussed at the same time.
How can you never disclose what you believe or support? I know America is very divided but even then why would it be a problem for a child who supports Harris to know his teacher supports Trump?? You say it would make them dislike the teacher but if that's all it takes they never really liked that teacher to begin with. Also you can still learn kids to think for themselves and let them know what you think or believe.
School is like a mini community, they will encounter people there with different believes to their own and learn that can still work together, be a team ect.
These kids show more heart then the adults. They still understand it's okay to make a mistake. So sweet of them.
Hmmm, interesting questions.
I would say there are things you can express you believe in or support, such as your favorite sports teams, your hobbies, and your goals in life. But expressing your political beliefs shouldn't be one of them since you'll inevitably sway your students in a specific direction, whether that be to reinforce one students' viewpoint or push another farther away from you, thus making them less likely to listen to you since they know you aren't objective. Even if they never liked that teacher to begin with, being impartial makes them respect you to some degree - because liking someone and respecting them are not mutually exclusive.
As for making a mistake, that happens and yes, I think most kids can forgive and forget that. In my last year in the classroom I was so overworked, stressed, and frustrated with students screwing around when they were banging on my door I accidentally dropped the F-word in class for the first time ever, and I profusely apologized to the kids for that behavior immediately (also made me realize that maybe I didn't want to be in the classroom anymore). But, going on political rants, cursing out your own students without any remorse like this, and making them feel small for not liking what you like is dictatorial and petty. It has no place in the classroom.
@@KevinTheID Thank you for your reply. I understand and mostly support your position. But I still feel it would be ]difficult to hold once you start talking about different topics in class. And I feel it could break trust if you talk about decisive issues in the classroom and ask your students about their position on them but won't reveal yours if they ask.
I think just maybe the kids who protest know better then us people online who saw a short video.
I'm happy they don't show these video's on the news here. These are internal issues that need to be resolved within the school.
I think you're getting a little hung up on the idea that kids will distrust teachers for not expressing their views in class - a problem I've never seen or heard them having. Most value our neutrality in those discussions.