And so, the Germans had finally created something that was simple. However, they then realized that they were in fact Germans, and in order to narrowly avoid total national embarrassment, paired it with a magazine system that was twice as complicated as itself. Order was swiftly, and thoroughly, restored.
A couple of years ago a bank was robbed at gunpoint in my city (Santiago, Chile) with a "Machinegun". The culprit was caught, and so its gun, which was an MP18, which was donated to a museum.
@@spyridon3089 I was actually amazed someone recognized what it was and decided to save it. Standard procedure here is to destroy the gun after the paperwork is done.
I feel sorry for the guy to have his sub stolen from him. It couldn't have been the original owner robbing people. He would have known he could have sold the damn gun and make a a lot of money. Either way he was a dumb ass if he was or not the original owner. Selling his antique was a lot better than robbing. incompetent.
@@pelao824 Picture the guy in the police evidence room happening to be a historical gun buff. "We got the perp's gun." "Yeah yeah, put it over there--HOLY SHIT" (except in Spanish, of course)
C&Rsenal: MP18 is good at close range, but weak and inaccurate at long range. 1917 Enfield is good at long range, but slow at short range. BAR is able to do both, but 30-06 is a bit much at full auto. It’s almost like someone should make a cartridge that’s somewhere between pistol caliber and full power rifle caliber, and then fire it out of a select fire rifle. I wonder if that will ever catch on?🤔
Hit all 4 targets at least twice at 100 meters in a single mag dump. That's actually quite impressive. Well done Mae and goes to show how controllable it is.
Yep. There is barely a logical word that would fit for the thing to be an "I" except maybe Infanterie. So I am quite sure it's a roman 1. Or it's a "I" for some other marking and isn't short for a word
I had an uncle (by marriage) whose father was an infantry sergeant in WW1 and he said that in one battle he and his men were ordered to advance on the Germans just behind the artillery walking barrage. They HAD to walk at a designated pace or get hit by their own artillery. THAT was discipline my friends, discipline.
I would like to see a comparison between the MP18.I and the original Thompson sub machine gun with the 50rd drum. Both weapons were designed to be “trench brooms”; it would be very interesting to recreate a WWI trench and incorporate it into the test.
For those speculating on what the ",I" stands for, here's some gasoline to throw on the fire: the improved version of the M.P. 18,I - with a stick magazine - was named the "M.P. 28,II."
C&Rsenal : I am german. A longer time ago in a german arms magazin there was an article about the MP 18. The authors of this article had to admit, that they do not know, what the ,I' means. They thought, it has something to do with the document file system of the german military administration.
@@brittakriep2938 i am a german gunsmith who learned in Suhl. When it comes to marking our weapons there are a lot Information you have to stamp on. And one thing is the date of manufacturing which can also be coded with letters. A= 0, B = 1, C = 2, D = 3, E = 4, F = 5, G = 6, H = 7, *I = 8, K = 9 It could be that it was simply a code to say that this is the 1918 version and not the 1919 one. *Note that you would mean the letter "I" but stamp the letter "J" . Nowadays you would stamp the last two digits of the year and the month in either numbers or letters. But it could be that 100 years ago it was handled different or that it was a change for the manufacturer only so they have an easy overview themself.
Fun fact about the "Kugelspritz" nickname, in swedish it translates to "Kulspruta" which is still to this day the swedish military nomenclature for machinegun.
I love how happy may looks after shooting the cool guns in this show. I can't understand why it took the poms until dunkirk to realise how good SMGs are.
Those were Gangster Guns. No, self respecting soldier would Never sully the kings own with a basterds weapon... oh shite, we actually Really Need those gangster guns Now!
The British army was always tough on what they perceived as ammo wastage. That's why there was a cutoff built into the SMLE. I don't believe any other nation had such a feature built into a rifle.
I always wonder how many designers regardless of industry have that happen. You make a great design so perfect for the role and then your boss tells you it needs something added that messes it up and all you can do is hang your head.
tenofprime I'm in software development and that kind of stuff happens a lot. You get asked to develop a solution to do something specific. You develop it perfectly to do that, and the manager then casually adds "oh, also btw please add functionality to do this completely unrelated other thing", which would have mandated a completely different approach from the start to do well, but you can't start again or do a separate thing anymore due to delivery times, hours allocated etc - so the end result sucks.
Britain: “Lol, SMGs are pointless xD”. Also Britain: designs probably the simplest SMG of all time, makes a gazillion of them and drops them all over Europe.
Or in slightly different wording. Britain: "Lol, SMGs are pointless xD". Also Britain, at Versailles: "We don't want their army to have ANY of these...and any planes...and any tanks! Lol all them's so pointless xD".
A good reason to hate the brits. >lol, pistolguns are pointless. >disarm Germany at Versailles, "no smgs for you, Jerry old chap" >get massacred 20 years later because, surprise, the Germans are back! And they actually put effort into developing their military, quel shock ! >Quickly copy their smg-design from the last war, maybe simplify that. >Then build craptons of them to the point that your cheap copy becomes what people think about when they hear "submachine gun".
@@KonradSeverinHilstad I never really considered it, but when I think "submachine gun" I don't think of any gun in particular, certainly not the sten, but I do think of an open-bolt simple blow-back tube receiver gun. But no specific model.
@@ReptilianLepton That'll be a fast declaration and an even faster capitulation. Militia-folk know a lot of things - lot of useful things - but waging a successful insurgency ain't one of them. The only way to thoroughly study asymmetrical and irregular warfare means also eventually studying Marxist-Leninist insurgencies and revolutionary theory - which I'm willing to be most of them will avoid like they'll catch the pinko from just touching the material.
In quite a lot of languages smg's are referred as "machine pistols". To be honest, i think the term "machine pistol" is used even more around the world than variations of "sub machine gun".
@@durhamdavesbg4948 Possibly. No one knows for sure what the "I" in "MP 18, I" stands for, but my guess is that it simply signifies that it;s Hugo Schmeisser's first submachine design (the MP 28, II being the second model and the prototype MP36, III ending up as the third, one that ended up being combined with the Erma EMP 36 to form the MP38).
Jesper Juul Keller : I am a german man, only using my girlfriends account. A longer time ago i read an article about the MP 18 in a german arms magazine. The authors of this artcle had to admit, that they did not know what the ,I' means. They thought, it has something to do with the document filing system of the german military administration. The documents necessary for this new weapon had been ,stored' under administration point ,I' because this new weapon was given to soldiers without using the traditional adoption system.
I've been waiting for this specific gun to be featured for a damn long time, and I'm very happy to say it's better than I could have ever imagined. 18/18 this gun makes me nut
Regarding designation: In German there are the words "Maschinengewehr" and "Maschinenpistole" meaning machine-rifle and -pistol. There isnt a wide used word that includes both like the English word "Machinegun". Of course we have our versions of "automatic weapon" and words like that but "Maschinengewehr" and "Maschinenpistole" are the ones that are mainly used when talking about full auto small arms.
Mae usually looks happy at the end of the shooting segment, but she looked positively giddy at the end of this one, I'd say that's a pretty ringing endorsement. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all of you at C&Rsenal!
A few points: * The MP 18,I was always intended to feed from a Trommelmagazin from the beginning. The idea to utilize box magazines didn't come until the MP 18,III (see below). * The ",I" suffix is indeed a numeral, there were four variants developed (MP 18,I ,II ,III & ,IV) for the Kriegsministerium. The latter two fed from Mauser box magazines and showed great promise but were not adopted before the end of the war. * The first guns to reach the front were delivered for field trials to the 119 Infanterie-Division in July 1918 and first saw combat at Amiens in August. No guns were delivered in time for the Spring Offensive despite many sources claiming this. A full rollout did not commence until October. * There is, to my knowledge, no documentary evidence that the MP 18,I was ever banned by the terms of the Treaty of Versailles. It never comes up in the regulation tables in the treaty itself, and bulletins issued by the Reichswehr High Command during the several months after the treaty came into effect confirm that it was still in active issue for a while until being retired later on, along with the Lange Pistole (which itself was not banned either). I haven't been able to find any contemporary reference to its supposed illegality in military service. Unless some concrete evidence of this claim can be found, I'm inclined to believe it's just a myth. * The Italian OVP was in service before the MP 18,I but was issued predominantly as a PDW for aviators, not an infantry weapon. Only 500 were delivered. * The Beretta gun you refer to was the Revelli-Beretta model which was indeed a conversion of the Villar Perosa but was not an SMG as it was semi-automatic only. It was also not adopted until September 1918, a few months after the MP 18,I, and less than 2,000 were delivered before the end of the war. * RE production, French reports indicate that a total of 50,000 guns were made during the war (look out for a future issue of Armax for confirmation of this). However the vast majority of these never left the factory, as the Kriegsministerium reported only 17,000 delivered by October 1918. No production took place after 1919 as the Bergmann factory closed that year.
@@michaelanderson9140 You can find information on these points here: Deutsches Maschinengewehre: Entwicklung, Taktik, & Einsatz von 1892 - 1918 (Frank Buchholz & Thomas Brüggen) Bergmann MP 18,I - the "first" submachine gun (firearms.96.lt) Hugo Schmeisser's Bergmann Sub-machine Guns (Hans-Christian Vortisch)
The pistol grip on the L2A3 stabilises the side magazine by converting the twist from the offset magazine into the palm of the right hand and the barrel shroud does not get too hot for a left hand fore grip. Holding magazine will run the real risk of it engaging with the magazine release, which is not a good thing in action, but also bends a stick magazine and loads the feed lips which are the most vulnerable necessary part. As does opening bottle with them......
I've certainly seen at least one photo of a German soldier gripping it by the magwell. Two soldiers next to each other, in fact. But they were kneeling with their left legs forward and their left elbows on their left knees. I think it had a label that said that was how you were supposed to fire if, and only if, you were kneeling. Also now that I think about it there is a 50% chance they were police officers. But I have no idea how I would go about finding that photo again anyway, so take that with a large grain of salt.
Video, @ 38:19 right after Othias lists that post-Versailles German Police were authorized to have the MP18. Still photo of uniformed shooter supporting weapon using the magwell.
I find it interesting that it appears to be a "constant recoil" design. The footage of Mae's shooting shows that the bolt never hits the back of the receiver. That probably improves the recoil considerably. Interesting, because constant recoil is supposed to be the hot new thing in light machine guns.
i just wanted to see how the rounds transition from the drum up the angle and into the feed tower so smoothly to actually work, that alone was worth the watch...that Mae as Hugo bit was great too
As soon as she lifted it up with the second magazine, it was "Hell yeah, full auto baby!". Great video, it's soo easy to forget this isn't a WW2 weapon.
@@fuckinantipope5511 it can use 9mm luger mag, but obv not all of them did as it was rare sight. But i have read somewhere that some used it as a backup, will try to find the source
I think we need to keep in mind the tactics this weapon was designed to function best in... Shock-troops, sudden massed-fire (imagine a 3-gun squad of these to mass fire on an objective), disrupting enemy tactics, force the enemy to stop firing and seek cover, deny areas of the battle space... It helps to shape the German tactics of WW2, basing platoons and tactics around the use of machine guns, both heavy guns and individual weapons. Had they more time, I would guess we would have seen an improved balanced version and dedicated magazines and better ergonomics. Revolutionary. Thanks for a great channel!!! P.S. I LOVE to see how much Mae enjoys shooting each weapon. :) Wish I had your job...
A simple THANK YOU from me. You brought the first SMG, which saw actually service, to the table. Yeah, it had it`s corks, but man is this thing impressive for the first attempt to the subject. And you are not shy to present it at was it is.
The interwar improved mp18-s did use stick mags successfully. When it comes to the luger, we know from hignsight making it bouble stacked and changing almost nothin else can work. While a glock mag like sollution for both is probably possible, it would probably be a single feed mag, terrible for reliability.
On the name of it, machine carbine is exactly what the British called them through WWII and into the cold war. And that idea hangs around as "pistol caliber carbine". But "submachine gun" sounded cool and Thompson was good at marketing so that is what we got.
That episode was a blast indeed! Thanks to vbbsmyt that now I actually understood how that drum magazine worked! Also, the rewinding gimmick to switch to different POV during shooting segments is a nice touch!
Ehrmagherd this is one of my top three for sure. Maybe top 5. OK, maybe top 114 of your 114 that you have covered. I love the work you all are doing for history. The MP18 in my hands, with a 1911 on my hip, and a trench gun on my back, would be a trifecta of awesome WW1 firearms!
In German, submachine guns are still commonly called Maschienenpistolen. This affects weapons like the Uzi or Skorpion, as well as weapons like the Mp40, "tommy gun" or MP4.
Okay. You hate the Snail Mag. We get it. I'll buy it from you since you trash talk it to its face like that. I have 14 dollars and coupons to Hardee's. That fourteen dollars will go a long way with coupons. I'll give that mag a nice home inside a stocked P08 Artillery where it belongs.
@@hailexiao2770 The Irish declared war on the British during WW1, and after independence were Nazi collaborators during WW2. Clandestine, but clearly documented.
And so, the Germans had finally created something that was simple. However, they then realized that they were in fact Germans, and in order to narrowly avoid total national embarrassment, paired it with a magazine system that was twice as complicated as itself. Order was swiftly, and thoroughly, restored.
Perfectly balanced, as all things should be
German over engineering, the world is in order
Oh that had me chuckling. Such is the German way. 😂🤣
@@cannonfodder4376 same dude
The story of twentieth century Germany in a nutshell.
A couple of years ago a bank was robbed at gunpoint in my city (Santiago, Chile) with a "Machinegun". The culprit was caught, and so its gun, which was an MP18, which was donated to a museum.
And they lived happily ever after
@@spyridon3089 I was actually amazed someone recognized what it was and decided to save it. Standard procedure here is to destroy the gun after the paperwork is done.
I 100% would've guessed the gun would've been destroyed after being used in a crime. Amazing that it was sent to a museum
I feel sorry for the guy to have his sub stolen from him. It couldn't have been the original owner robbing people. He would have known he could have sold the damn gun and make a a lot of money. Either way he was a dumb ass if he was or not the original owner. Selling his antique was a lot better than robbing. incompetent.
@@pelao824 Picture the guy in the police evidence room happening to be a historical gun buff. "We got the perp's gun." "Yeah yeah, put it over there--HOLY SHIT"
(except in Spanish, of course)
Kevin the Grenadier is now a obligatory NPC in every game I run from this point onward.
RIP Kevin. He died far too young.
:)
@@Roflcopter4b Agreed, at the age of 84. Of pulmonary edema. Godspeed, sweet prince.
Is he friends with Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner?
cptreech he’s less a friend, more a drinking buddy.
C&Rsenal:
MP18 is good at close range, but weak and inaccurate at long range.
1917 Enfield is good at long range, but slow at short range.
BAR is able to do both, but 30-06 is a bit much at full auto.
It’s almost like someone should make a cartridge that’s somewhere between pistol caliber and full power rifle caliber, and then fire it out of a select fire rifle.
I wonder if that will ever catch on?🤔
🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
Somewhere in UA-cam, Ian and Karl are smiling.
Othais didn't say it either but it also had to be German designed. Man I'm not sure anything like that could ever exist🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
Sounds like it would be great for assaults.
@@OtterTreySSArmy Hugo Schmeisser:
:)
M2 Carbine came close.
I would've loved if the intro was, "Hi! I'm Othias, and war were declared."
Wonder what other wartime weapons are left that can be described as that.
If he were going to do that with anything, it would've been the MP18
And at a minute and a half, that's practically what we got.
We wouldnt see those blitzkrieg tactics coming
Hi I'm War, and Othais were declared.
The original angry pipe
High quality angry pipe
@Charles Yuditsky Yes
Hit all 4 targets at least twice at 100 meters in a single mag dump. That's actually quite impressive. Well done Mae and goes to show how controllable it is.
Once it gets going, you just lean into it. Had a lot of fun at this shoot.
@@maewinchester2030 If war were declared anytime soon ... I'd want to be on your side. Just saying.
Love your grin after firing, Mae.
@@thomastheisman1751 Who couldn't grin after firing?! That was way too much fun!
If not for her ears the smile would have vent all around her head!
I wasn’t prepared for such an early WWD! My monocle nearly fell out!
I had to fish mine out of my cognac. The audacity!
>December
>month of Christmas
>Othias has a machine gun now
Ho ho ho
Die Hard: War Were Declared
[In theaters this summer.]
Ian is gun jesus and Othias is gun santa.
The lore has expanded
"Hugo Sad" I laughed so damn hard
You release this near Christmas, and didn’t go “Ho Ho Ho now I have a (sub) machine gun” when you went into the breakdown? Missed opoutunity
Mae's big 'ol grin after those 32 round full-auto mag dumps says it all.
I saw the problem from the start, problem is, it doesn't take Glock mags. Love the channel.
No the problem is the Glock doesn’t take MP18 magazines...
Wait a minute. My left eye hadn't even started to close when War Were Declared. This should be one heck of an episode
Why just the left eye?
My favorite Primer episode! Dialogue between Othais and Mae is classic!
Being a German teacher, the German word for "improved" is "verbessert"
Yep. There is barely a logical word that would fit for the thing to be an "I" except maybe Infanterie.
So I am quite sure it's a roman 1.
Or it's a "I" for some other marking and isn't short for a word
Finally! The legendary and mother of the all smg has a rise!!!!
Excuse me, do you own any 32 french longue?
@cody sonnet Because Gun Jesus requires an offering.
I had an uncle (by marriage) whose father was an infantry sergeant in WW1 and he said that in one battle he and his men were ordered to advance on the Germans just behind the artillery walking barrage. They HAD to walk at a designated pace or get hit by their own artillery. THAT was discipline my friends, discipline.
They would do what's called a creeping barrage where the shelling would cover the infantry as they advanced I'm guessing he was told to do that lol
Good marriage advice, creep in, arterilly out in front, flank the rear if she let's you
@@abstractapproach634 hahahaha.
I would like to see a comparison between the MP18.I and the original Thompson sub machine gun with the 50rd drum. Both weapons were designed to be “trench brooms”; it would be very interesting to recreate a WWI trench and incorporate it into the test.
Hugo sad t-shirt or patch when?
For those speculating on what the ",I" stands for, here's some gasoline to throw on the fire: the improved version of the M.P. 18,I - with a stick magazine - was named the "M.P. 28,II."
Which does have a full rear sight... but also a stick mag...
@@Candrsenal And of course, there never was an MP 28,I...
And then the mp41 only used the wooden body and had the upper of an mp40
C&Rsenal : I am german. A longer time ago in a german arms magazin there was an article about the MP 18. The authors of this article had to admit, that they do not know, what the ,I' means. They thought, it has something to do with the document file system of the german military administration.
@@brittakriep2938 i am a german gunsmith who learned in Suhl.
When it comes to marking our weapons there are a lot Information you have to stamp on. And one thing is the date of manufacturing which can also be coded with letters.
A= 0, B = 1, C = 2, D = 3, E = 4, F = 5, G = 6, H = 7, *I = 8, K = 9
It could be that it was simply a code to say that this is the 1918 version and not the 1919 one.
*Note that you would mean the letter "I" but stamp the letter "J" .
Nowadays you would stamp the last two digits of the year and the month in either numbers or letters. But it could be that 100 years ago it was handled different or that it was a change for the manufacturer only so they have an easy overview themself.
Fun fact about the "Kugelspritz" nickname, in swedish it translates to "Kulspruta" which is still to this day the swedish military nomenclature for machinegun.
Пулемёт
I love how happy may looks after shooting the cool guns in this show. I can't understand why it took the poms until dunkirk to realise how good SMGs are.
Those were Gangster Guns. No, self respecting soldier would Never sully the kings own with a basterds weapon... oh shite, we actually Really Need those gangster guns Now!
@cody sonnet moron.
@cody sonnet neither world war was started by the brits. They just were part of them quite early
The British army was always tough on what they perceived as ammo wastage. That's why there was a cutoff built into the SMLE. I don't believe any other nation had such a feature built into a rifle.
1903 Springfield had a magazine cutoff, not sure about Krag or 1917 Enfield.
Love it. The bolt comes out and I go STEN then the Stirling which I carried as a weapon. Great stuff Othais and Mae :-)
46:00 Recovered footage of GPK instructing Hugo Schmeisser to use the snail drum mag for MP-18.
epic.
"Hugo sad" flat out broke me 😄
I always wonder how many designers regardless of industry have that happen. You make a great design so perfect for the role and then your boss tells you it needs something added that messes it up and all you can do is hang your head.
tenofprime I bet it happens a lot. Actually, I know it does.
tenofprime I'm in software development and that kind of stuff happens a lot. You get asked to develop a solution to do something specific. You develop it perfectly to do that, and the manager then casually adds "oh, also btw please add functionality to do this completely unrelated other thing", which would have mandated a completely different approach from the start to do well, but you can't start again or do a separate thing anymore due to delivery times, hours allocated etc - so the end result sucks.
Britain: “Lol, SMGs are pointless xD”.
Also Britain: designs probably the simplest SMG of all time, makes a gazillion of them and drops them all over Europe.
Or in slightly different wording. Britain: "Lol, SMGs are pointless xD".
Also Britain, at Versailles: "We don't want their army to have ANY of these...and any planes...and any tanks! Lol all them's so pointless xD".
Don't forget the third volume of the series "the krauts are at it again? Blasted, better copy the MP28!"
They pretty much copied the MP28 and stripped it down to bare minimum parts, so yeah they did not care much for smg designs.
A good reason to hate the brits.
>lol, pistolguns are pointless.
>disarm Germany at Versailles, "no smgs for you, Jerry old chap"
>get massacred 20 years later because, surprise, the Germans are back! And they actually put effort into developing their military, quel shock !
>Quickly copy their smg-design from the last war, maybe simplify that.
>Then build craptons of them to the point that your cheap copy becomes what people think about when they hear "submachine gun".
@@KonradSeverinHilstad I never really considered it, but when I think "submachine gun" I don't think of any gun in particular, certainly not the sten, but I do think of an open-bolt simple blow-back tube receiver gun. But no specific model.
"But does it use Luger magazines?"
Yes Hans! It does!
Fastest "War were declared" east of the Mississippi
@@ReptilianLepton That'll be a fast declaration and an even faster capitulation. Militia-folk know a lot of things - lot of useful things - but waging a successful insurgency ain't one of them. The only way to thoroughly study asymmetrical and irregular warfare means also eventually studying Marxist-Leninist insurgencies and revolutionary theory - which I'm willing to be most of them will avoid like they'll catch the pinko from just touching the material.
1:11:45
I think the german nomenclature is pretty clear:
Rifle caliber -> Maschinengewehr = machine rifle
Pistol calibre -> Maschinenpistole = machine pistol
And a Maschinenkarabiner would need to fire rifle rounds, as a Karabiner is a short(end) rifle.
In quite a lot of languages smg's are referred as "machine pistols".
To be honest, i think the term "machine pistol" is used even more around the world than variations of "sub machine gun".
Great video Othais! My thanks to you and Mae.
Best wishes to you all from an Englishman living in France.
Rich.
Maybe the "I" stands for "Infanterie"?
Possibly, given the lineage reaching back into air and artillery issued weapons.
@@durhamdavesbg4948 Perhaps, but Hugo Schmeisser's second gun, the MP 28, carried the "II" suffix.
@@FireflyActual Oh, thanks for that little note, so more likely one more first for the MP18.
@@durhamdavesbg4948 Possibly. No one knows for sure what the "I" in "MP 18, I" stands for, but my guess is that it simply signifies that it;s Hugo Schmeisser's first submachine design (the MP 28, II being the second model and the prototype MP36, III ending up as the third, one that ended up being combined with the Erma EMP 36 to form the MP38).
Jesper Juul Keller : I am a german man, only using my girlfriends account. A longer time ago i read an article about the MP 18 in a german arms magazine. The authors of this artcle had to admit, that they did not know what the ,I' means. They thought, it has something to do with the document filing system of the german military administration. The documents necessary for this new weapon had been ,stored' under administration point ,I' because this new weapon was given to soldiers without using the traditional adoption system.
Good. Very.....good. Even with a wobbly magazine, feed is good; a testament to Mark's tenacity. Well done, everyone!
I've been waiting for this specific gun to be featured for a damn long time, and I'm very happy to say it's better than I could have ever imagined.
18/18 this gun makes me nut
Regarding designation: In German there are the words "Maschinengewehr" and "Maschinenpistole" meaning machine-rifle and -pistol. There isnt a wide used word that includes both like the English word "Machinegun". Of course we have our versions of "automatic weapon" and words like that but "Maschinengewehr" and "Maschinenpistole" are the ones that are mainly used when talking about full auto small arms.
Great show as always. Thanks to all that allowed the MP-18 to come alive and for its story to be told and shared.
Seems like all my favorite channels are rolling out the extra special good stuff for Crimbo. Happy holidays!
Mae usually looks happy at the end of the shooting segment, but she looked positively giddy at the end of this one, I'd say that's a pretty ringing endorsement. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all of you at C&Rsenal!
Thanks Team. Have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
A few points:
* The MP 18,I was always intended to feed from a Trommelmagazin from the beginning. The idea to utilize box magazines didn't come until the MP 18,III (see below).
* The ",I" suffix is indeed a numeral, there were four variants developed (MP 18,I ,II ,III & ,IV) for the Kriegsministerium. The latter two fed from Mauser box magazines and showed great promise but were not adopted before the end of the war.
* The first guns to reach the front were delivered for field trials to the 119 Infanterie-Division in July 1918 and first saw combat at Amiens in August. No guns were delivered in time for the Spring Offensive despite many sources claiming this. A full rollout did not commence until October.
* There is, to my knowledge, no documentary evidence that the MP 18,I was ever banned by the terms of the Treaty of Versailles. It never comes up in the regulation tables in the treaty itself, and bulletins issued by the Reichswehr High Command during the several months after the treaty came into effect confirm that it was still in active issue for a while until being retired later on, along with the Lange Pistole (which itself was not banned either). I haven't been able to find any contemporary reference to its supposed illegality in military service. Unless some concrete evidence of this claim can be found, I'm inclined to believe it's just a myth.
* The Italian OVP was in service before the MP 18,I but was issued predominantly as a PDW for aviators, not an infantry weapon. Only 500 were delivered.
* The Beretta gun you refer to was the Revelli-Beretta model which was indeed a conversion of the Villar Perosa but was not an SMG as it was semi-automatic only. It was also not adopted until September 1918, a few months after the MP 18,I, and less than 2,000 were delivered before the end of the war.
* RE production, French reports indicate that a total of 50,000 guns were made during the war (look out for a future issue of Armax for confirmation of this). However the vast majority of these never left the factory, as the Kriegsministerium reported only 17,000 delivered by October 1918. No production took place after 1919 as the Bergmann factory closed that year.
sources?
@@michaelanderson9140 You can find information on these points here:
Deutsches Maschinengewehre: Entwicklung, Taktik, & Einsatz von 1892 - 1918 (Frank Buchholz & Thomas Brüggen)
Bergmann MP 18,I - the "first" submachine gun (firearms.96.lt)
Hugo Schmeisser's Bergmann Sub-machine Guns (Hans-Christian Vortisch)
The pistol grip on the L2A3 stabilises the side magazine by converting the twist from the offset magazine into the palm of the right hand and the barrel shroud does not get too hot for a left hand fore grip. Holding magazine will run the real risk of it engaging with the magazine release, which is not a good thing in action, but also bends a stick magazine and loads the feed lips which are the most vulnerable necessary part. As does opening bottle with them......
1:21 in "War were declared" well that escalated quickly.
You absolutely MUST release a 'Hugo is Sad' T-shirt!
“Hugo sad.”
Best ep ever! Animation was incredible.
We still call it a Maschinenpistole. Hence the MP5 being the MP5.
He's done it, the absolute madman has done it.
That first rewind caught me off guard and I thought my phone spazzed out haha
Oh my God, the impromptu Hugo role play was brilliant!!
I've certainly seen at least one photo of a German soldier gripping it by the magwell. Two soldiers next to each other, in fact. But they were kneeling with their left legs forward and their left elbows on their left knees. I think it had a label that said that was how you were supposed to fire if, and only if, you were kneeling. Also now that I think about it there is a 50% chance they were police officers. But I have no idea how I would go about finding that photo again anyway, so take that with a large grain of salt.
Video, @ 38:19 right after Othias lists that post-Versailles German Police were authorized to have the MP18. Still photo of uniformed shooter supporting weapon using the magwell.
I find it interesting that it appears to be a "constant recoil" design. The footage of Mae's shooting shows that the bolt never hits the back of the receiver. That probably improves the recoil considerably. Interesting, because constant recoil is supposed to be the hot new thing in light machine guns.
Nothing is new under the sun
Best winter holiday gift guys thankyou!
I did not know how much I needed Mae Schmeisser.
Beautiful episode on one of the most iconic and historically significant firearms. Well done!
The look on May's face after the mag dump is priceless!!!
The episode we have all been waiting for. Thank you!
the interaction about the mag was so good i was imagining it in german in my head i laughed so hard please do more episodes i love them
Another great material about the WW1 guns.🤩
Thanks for it💕
i just wanted to see how the rounds transition from the drum up the angle and into the feed tower so smoothly to actually work, that alone was worth the watch...that Mae as Hugo bit was great too
No freakin way! This is incredible!
As soon as she lifted it up with the second magazine, it was "Hell yeah, full auto baby!". Great video, it's soo easy to forget this isn't a WW2 weapon.
I mean you can tell the difference, mp28 had stick mag and mp18 had also stick mag in the early of war but after few years they made a snail drum
@@Bunny-zn7ke the MP18 had a drum mag from the start. It never used a stick mag during the war
@@fuckinantipope5511 what i meant to say is, that they used em as backup
@@Bunny-zn7ke no they didn't? The MP18 did not have stick mags. They also didn't use the Lugers 8 round mag
@@fuckinantipope5511 it can use 9mm luger mag, but obv not all of them did as it was rare sight. But i have read somewhere that some used it as a backup, will try to find the source
I think we need to keep in mind the tactics this weapon was designed to function best in... Shock-troops, sudden massed-fire (imagine a 3-gun squad of these to mass fire on an objective), disrupting enemy tactics, force the enemy to stop firing and seek cover, deny areas of the battle space... It helps to shape the German tactics of WW2, basing platoons and tactics around the use of machine guns, both heavy guns and individual weapons. Had they more time, I would guess we would have seen an improved balanced version and dedicated magazines and better ergonomics. Revolutionary.
Thanks for a great channel!!!
P.S. I LOVE to see how much Mae enjoys shooting each weapon. :) Wish I had your job...
I love to see how happy May always gets when talking and specially shooting. XD
Excellent programme again.
In Sweden, those kind of weapons are called "kulsprutepistol". It litterarly means bullet spray pistol. A machinegun is "kulspruta" = bullet sprayer.
A simple THANK YOU from me. You brought the first SMG, which saw actually service, to the table. Yeah, it had it`s corks, but man is this thing impressive for the first attempt to the subject. And you are not shy to present it at was it is.
*quirks
I honestly wonder if a longer ~20 round single stack stick magazine would have been a functional solution for both this and the LP08 Lugers.
Would have definitely been a better option and much more reliable.
But that is like an appropriate amount of engineering this is Germany we have to over engineer it
The interwar improved mp18-s did use stick mags successfully. When it comes to the luger, we know from hignsight making it bouble stacked and changing almost nothin else can work.
While a glock mag like sollution for both is probably possible, it would probably be a single feed mag, terrible for reliability.
"So if you're gonna be stuck with it, you might as well be stuck with _a lot_ of it." Words to live by. :)
On the name of it, machine carbine is exactly what the British called them through WWII and into the cold war. And that idea hangs around as "pistol caliber carbine".
But "submachine gun" sounded cool and Thompson was good at marketing so that is what we got.
A forward vertical grip might have helped.AND my shirt and patches arrived the other day..YAAAA
It would have required a lot of machining to do that which would increase production time
@@seanmac1793 2 wooden screws and a peace of bent metal belt... :)
@@ldkbudda4176 you see you sat that but the Germans never slove something the simple way.
It must be frigging christmas when all of my favorite content creators upload all in the same week. XD
That looked like it was a lot of fun.
Thanks for sharing 👍
Dang, Mae hit each of those targets multiple times during her full auto sweep. That's an effective little weapon!
Would be interesting to see this put through the tests that you put the LMGs through during project lightening.
Looking forward to see the Villar Perosa in this show ;) . You guys rules, sheers from France !
That episode was a blast indeed! Thanks to vbbsmyt that now I actually understood how that drum magazine worked! Also, the rewinding gimmick to switch to different POV during shooting segments is a nice touch!
Amazing that you not only got your hands on one of these things, but actually got to shoot it
if i could own of these, i would in a heartbeat. everything about them is so cool!
Ehrmagherd this is one of my top three for sure. Maybe top 5. OK, maybe top 114 of your 114 that you have covered.
I love the work you all are doing for history. The MP18 in my hands, with a 1911 on my hip, and a trench gun on my back, would be a trifecta of awesome WW1 firearms!
The gun anyone ever focuses on these days, as if trying to morph WW1 into one of their favoured modern shooter games.
"Sad Hugo!" Mae Dec 2019.
Why does this video have so few views? This is the most important gun to come out of WW1!
I just started playing BF1 again, then this vid uploaded. Awesome.
In German, submachine guns are still commonly called Maschienenpistolen. This affects weapons like the Uzi or Skorpion, as well as weapons like the Mp40, "tommy gun" or MP4.
Okay. You hate the Snail Mag. We get it. I'll buy it from you since you trash talk it to its face like that. I have 14 dollars and coupons to Hardee's. That fourteen dollars will go a long way with coupons.
I'll give that mag a nice home inside a stocked P08 Artillery where it belongs.
46:46 "I'm not a gangster" That made me chuckle a bit too much.
"Hugo sad" :( Poor Hugo.
I'm now looking forward to your World War II assessment of the MP35.
I liked Mae's little chuckle after emptying magazines. She obviously enjoys her work.
The size of the grin on my face when Mae switched from her 2 shot bursts into full automatic fire is honestly frightening 🤣
I was spooked by the video rewinding while shooting. I was not expecting that.
Omg that "Hugo's sad" line was so freaking adorable
The best of all these videos is the huge smile on Mae's face after a mag dump! \m/
I’ve waited so long for this episode
Hugo Sad! best C&Rsenal ever. More dramatic re-enactments please.
Watching a second time, it just hit me how dark the footage at 6:07 is.
They ain't reenacting for the news reels...
The Irish army had 44 MP18's in inventory in the 30's for some strange reason
Either the germans sent them guns to fight the British or the british gave them surplus german war reparation guns to outfit the new irish army.
Let's be honest, 18 MP44s in the '30s would've been stranger. :)
@@johnalan6067 You're clearly not British. The Irish were the enemy, supporting the Nazis. The guns came from Germany somehow.
@@billdyke9745 Wrong war
@@hailexiao2770 The Irish declared war on the British during WW1, and after independence were Nazi collaborators during WW2. Clandestine, but clearly documented.
"I'm not a gangster" lol.
One of the coolest animations ever. Simple, yet that trommel mag is freaking sweet! Germans sure had some amazing engineering.
And that's why they lost two world wars.
@@vitkriklan2633 they did have some good ideas in machinery, they’re tactics for war were not good. But their leader was crazy…
@@vitkriklan2633 USA lost in Vietnam and Avganistan-Taliban!
@@ldkbudda4176 What does it have to do with the topic? We are not talking about US at all...
They took too much time engineering, too much time assaulting, and no time protecting their homeland. @@vitkriklan2633
I’ve been waiting for this episode since we got a peek at it over on Anvil!
Just discovered your videos!,,,,How great you cover these guns....Thank you.(KCR)...(bh)