I don't know if anyone made the connection but the Omphalos theme uses the same motif that plays in the cutscene with the scions at the very end of 5.3. The game likes to use motifs to make these sort of connections, so it could definitely be a possibility.
One thing at 3:00, there is an ast weapon that drops from the Kitsis hyperboreia that has the marks of the twelve on it. It is possible a variation of the twelve did exist prior to the sundering.
It's definitely interesting. The only thing I don't understand about the theory is this: If they are incarnations of the 12, how does that work in the context of us literally meeting 4 of the 12 in person? I guess they could be the phantom version of our physical incarnations? It's a bit unintuitive there.
Louisoix, Moenbryda, Yda, and Papalymo are all technically dead when we meet the first four of the twelve so that *could* solve that issue. The real problem comes in when we meet the rest when the next alliance is released.
I had an interesting theory I've been thinking about recently. I think it could be viable, but only if FFXIV ever gets an actual ending, which would be the basis of this theory. My theory is, that we are not Azem, but rather, Azem is us. At the end of our journey, we, somwhow, become Unsundered, and with our knowledge and power, return back in time to the point where we first appear, possibly becoming a child or infant, and live out our life as an Ancient, eventually learning under Venat, becoming friends with Hythlodeus and Hades, before becoming Azem. Azem seemed to know events that would take place, us falling onto Themis is the Pandæmonium raids being a prime example, but they also had an instinctive hatred of Primals, denouncing the summoning of Zodiark, and not answering Venat when it came to Haedalyn, something the WoL knows that Azem did. We don't know what Azem was doing at the time of the Sundering, but they could've been alone, preparing for it, reminiscing about their time as the WoL, knowing it will happen again soon. Trapped eternally in a time loop, never knowing rest. A sad, but also happy existence, as they'd never remember any of it. What do you think? There could be more evidence to support this somewere, it just needs to be found.
That’s actually some thing I’ve been pondering a lot as well. A part of me thinks at some point we travel back to ancient days and take on the mantle of Azem... Venat’s successor. And here’s an even crazier theory. I don’t think we’re ever going to be fully rejoined. I think sundered Azem is able to work with dynimus much better, and I think that’s going to play a role in events to come. And because I am so crazy with this conspiracy theories, I even think the reason we don’t see as Azem during the final days is because they dipped back to the future so they wouldn’t get sundered even more.
@@tbeshers both you have interesting theories. And technically 14 need not end for the time stuff to work out. Because Azem likely either A. has time based powers, B. can see the future, or C. can do both, but while that's fun to me, not everyone would like that idea. I love time travel stuffs. Although my HCs on Azem have it where "he" (since my WoL isn't a Sundered soul but an ancient's directly reborn and she is Azem's cousin) is Unsundered due to some circumstance involving multiple powers play by the time the Sundering happened, leaving him and his lover and a few friends the only other ones left of their kind, all without Hades ever knowing. If he decided to use time magic then the need was dire in order to save the world in a indirect way using his reincarnated cousin. Something like that. XD
I have a theory that includes this as an element. It would go a LONG way to explaining why Azem refused the Convocation and never answered Venat's call.
There has to be a connection between Azem, Oshon, Deryk and time travelling. Azem is absent so many times, the fact that they’re not responding to Venat, them meddling in weird things like saving an island because of the grapes ( or was it because that island would be crucial to saving the world in the future? ), Oshon not being born from “the whirl” like the other god but instead just showing up one day, Deryk being mentioned as also having the habit of popping up here and there and then being gone again just as sudden… I had this thought about this being Deryk’s final thing he does before going back in time to become unsundered because he knows he has to in order for the WoL and the WoD and all other important reincarnations to be able to be reborn and do all the work they/we have done. So much time spent travelling back and forth, trying to put things in the right place for the correct events to happen. I’m his also makes me think about Omega and that so many of the things we have gone through has felt like one big test. Who knows how many timelines and versions Azem/Oshon/Deryk has gone through to find the one that actually saves the world. A line Hydaelyn said “ our timelines have almost converged “ struck me as being sort of weird. Like there were more than one timeline/story and they all had to come together to form one strong line or point in time. That’s why he seems a bit detached and sad. He realises his journey is almost over. But he also is clearly cheering us on, helping us move forward, towards his final goal. His duty’s end. It makes me really emotional to think about this. So bittersweet and beautiful and tragic. But it may all be completely wrong 🤷🏻♀️
This is something I'll need to think about a bit since I hadn't considered how our companions might line up with the 12, but I'm glad the 12 archons were mentioned because their info in the Encyclopedia stood out to me. It's even more interesting to hear what that one npc in 1.0 had to say. Very interesting.
So much of this saga wasn't predetermined that the advent of ANOTHER big change coming and with everything we know now man i'm excited for this channels future lmao
There's a lot of different avenues and points to consider in the theory which always makes for the most fun and rewarding ones regardless of the outcome. I really enjoyed it. Thanks to both of you for putting this together!
Eeeeh, no. There's some similarities, and I can see the connection between Venat's followers and the 12, but there is a pretty heavy handed nod that Azem was the inspiration for Azeyma. Azem also refused to side with Emet and Venat; presumably outright opposing the idea of 'god making' and the sacrifices that come with. So IF the followers of Venat are the Twelve, how does Azem play into it all? Doesn't hold much water, personally. Now Louisoix seeing the future? Sure, I can see it. I never played 1.0, but I assume he had the Echo (correct me if I'm wrong). And as we've seen with Krile, the Echo manifests in different and strange ways.
If they are incarnations, would Hydaelon know it was them? Venat/hydealon could sense the WoL, wouldnt she be able to sense the others? Just a thought.
Not the biggest fan of wild speculation and theory crafting but love your videos nonetheless and I'm glad you got your voice back and seem to be feeling better :)
if the twelve were the people with Venat in Anyder then The WoL couldn't be the incarnation of Azeyma as Azem didn't join them this is known since they refered to them as 'The Deserter" Azem supported neither the plan to summon Zodiark nor the plan to summon Hydaelyn
Well, we still don't know for sure if those ancients are the twelve. I also remember seeing another theory soon after EW launched that Azem didn't actually oppose the Hydaelyn plan. The comment in Anamnesis Anyder was simply that Azem wasn't responding to their requests, not an outright refusal. I'm also pretty sure it was the convocation that labeled Azem a deserter, not Hydaelyn's group, although I don't remember all the dialog of that cutscene. You have to wonder what all Azem at the time knew since they were apparently aware of our existance as shown in the pandaemonium raids where they told Elidibus to expect our arrival. Given all this info though I don't think Azeyma has really anything to do with Azem aside from the similar names, and I honestly feel like us being connected to them would almost feel like a downgrade from what Azem is supposed to represent at this point.
As another comment said, there's a lot of details as of ShB (5.3 onward) and now EW with the alliance raids that just completely tear apart this theory Once upon a time it might've had more to work with, at the very least pitting the WoL as Oschon (funnily enough my main has Oschon as their patron), but now? Nahhh
8:20 Did...I just make it into someone's lore video? haha this segment is from an old vid I posted years ago on my channel. No worries not mad or anything, just pointing it out.
You’re probably right, let me give you proper credit in the description. I tried to find the cutscene in the inn but was struggling. I’m so sorry, I’ll change that ASAP.
I like it...always thought to myself if the ascians are what we get from zodiarks summoning whatever happened to hydalaens summoners...this would be kool
The circumstances of the ascians and hydaelyns summoners is different though. The ascians sacrificed half their civilization, not themselves. Hydaelyn's summoners had to sacrifice themselves directly. In either case the ones sacrificed were completely consumed as fuel for the summoning.
Tbh Louisoix is one of the greatest and most badass characters ever. If anything I support this theory by that reason alone haha. I also really like the incarnation assignment for each character.. the twelve are indeed a great mystery, still. But my take is this one: The twelve are our more original self, everything basically stems from them. The experience of the people and the WoL is a more compact experience with a specific goal in mind. Theory: there was one god/source at the beginning of it all, which split itself into several gods which we know as the twelve (but they are still one, connected). The twelve and their plan is to make even more life. Which eventually lead to the Ancients and later on the fragmented, sundered people. Their ultimate goal is to grant everyone immortality and ascent them to gods as well. Yeah it's pretty crazy, but I love the idea of it.
i think there is some kind of strange thing in fact there is hydaelyn and the 12 archon but that mean thirty and there is 12 deities what if the oppo in the raid quest was the thirtiest that permit to keep the balance in some kind of way or something that isn't the twelve that keep the knowledge of the twelve like a keeper
I love tin foily hat theories, and I have some of my own. Did for example Hephaistos create what is considered in present Eorzea, the voidsent? Or overly darkness aspected creations? If you see the statues at the end of The Weeping City of Mhach, they look very much like Hephaistos. Also, both High voidmage Cessair and Cait Sith are to be observed in Elpis. During the void ark raid series, Cait Sith shares with us the purpose of Dun Scaith, that it was made to protect the ancients against the floods in plural, indicating that the flood of darkness most probably was not the only flood that happened. So this might mean that the void ark was made to protect and ferry the souls of the ancients. And if you look to other FF games for similarities, a very similar story of this is found in FFIX with Garland, the Invincible and his duty to ensure the survival of the souls of Terra. In FFIX, Garland created cloning technology to house Terran's souls, while its known that cloning technology was something Emet-Selch possessed. Garland also mentions a quality of memories that is similar to what Venat told you about memories, aether and the echo. Garland tells you this while traversing Memoria, a place conjured by the planet's memory. "Life is connected, one to another... If you trace the root of all life, there exists one source. The same can be said for memory. All life constitutes an intelligence that holds memory beyond experience." Venat tells you on Elpis: "There are two ways to see the past. The first entails peering through the walls of the soul in the moment a subject is recalling a memory. The second requires no subject, and is instead a process of piecing together an event from ripples left in the ambient aether. As memories are etched upon the aether of the soul, so too are they etched upon the aether of the world. In this way can history be preserved. Such memories are given to fading, however, and can prove challenging to visit".
I'm a bit confused by your timelines with this, are you trying to say that the people of Mhach were ancients, or that they're from the 13th? I'm pretty sure Dun Scaith was made to save the people from the literal flood that was the 4th umbral calamity. The flood of darkness happened on the 13th hundreds or even thousands of years before Mhach even existed. Most voidsent are just regular people from the 13th that were warped by exposure to extreme astral aether, similar to sin eaters on the first.
@@silvinity4939 I don't think all of them are ancients, but a select few. It would be strange of Cait Sith to remember floods then: "This floating marvel I speak of is not a natural occurrence─it was constructed as a haven for refugees of the floods. The tome makes very clear reference to the island's purpose, and describes in detail the voidsent sorcery employed in its creation"
@@DefenderX I mean, he remembers the literal flood that was the 6th (not 4th like I said before) umbral calamity caused by the war of the magi. It was the calamity of water, a worldwide flood.
@@silvinity4939 you are correct. He mentions the floods again in relation to building the void ark after voidmage Cessair foresaw the floods. Most probably, Cessair is a shard of the ancient we observe in Elpis. And that she has the echo ability and can use it to see the future. Similarly to Mikoto from Bozja.
This is surprisingly similar to my own theory, which for some years now is that the Scions are the current incarnations of the Twelve, although I shouldn't be surprised that someone else has reached such similar conclusions. However, in my version, Tataru is Nymeia, the spinner of fate, due to how she has strings attached to everyone and is this grand manipulator / blackmailer behind the scenes. I haven't been able to pin down all of the 12 but this fellow's theory includes characters that I hadn't considered. If anyone is curious, my theory is that currently not all members of the 12 were incarnated, or at least haven't been met, but I like the idea of reaching outside of the Scions for some answers. I also try to keep their original genders and inclinations to their current incarnations. While this is not strictly necessary, the idea here is that they'd stick to what is familiar to them (if they have a choice). My theory is: Nymeia: Tataru Oschon: Thancred Nald'Thal: Obviously the twins. Nophica: Y'shtola? She began as a CNJ Azeyma: WoL Zero: The 13th's incarnation of Azem. Adding from this gent's theory: Thaliak: Louisoix, makes all the sense in the world. Althyk: Graha, also a perfect match. Halone: Y'da, I love it. Rhalgr: Papalymo? Sure, he was a THM after all, and sassy. Why is Graha's soul so dense that he withstood Elidbus' attack? The ascien even expresses his surprise over how thick Graha's soul is. Then there's the ability that he has, able to summon people through time and space. Although he uses the Tower to power the spell like a giant battery, it is most definitely a Convocation spell. Just look at the golden symbols and how they appear when he summons people, it's all very similar to Azem's own summoning ability. Either there is absolutely something going on with this character that most players have completely missed, or this is just some shoddy writing. Which is more likely? I haven't ever trusted Graha as a result of these huge red flags, but tagging him as Althyk makes all the sense. Frankly I'm ashamed that I hadn't thought of it, so kudos to our anonymous theory crafter. Aside: It's Althyk who's invoked to yoink the WoL away "into an atherial rift". A 1.0 character even re-appears via teleportation in a column of light next to Althyk's stone. You can easily visit the location in-game in the Black Shroud.
If he knew that could explain the thing about him saying he created the God stones where people prayed, but the Gods claiming the stones have always been there. Did he actually claim he made them himself though? Or was that just something people assumed? 🧐
With raha saying time is weird, and the new ten year story beginning soon, nothing is too far fetched or loopy, anything could be true according to possible future in game stories one day
I love Tin Foil Hat Territory so much that I've set up a government there, and I'm applying for statehood. I wonder if I can get representation in Congress (like Puerto Rico). What if Hydaelyn created the “The (benevolent) Twelve” gods after the Source was sundered to give hope to all newly sundered life? Is it possible that she created these gods in the image of her faction of 12 scholars who helped her create Hydaelyn? Kind of like how she created the Watcher on the moon? And a whole freakin’ race of tiny rabbit people (looking at you Lopportis). And could it be possible the Archons of the present are some form of the souls of those gods that came to be after the sundering? And why in the world do NONE of the Archons have the Echo? 5 of them were there in The First when Elidibus “gave” the Echo to almost everyone in the town square, but those five were not effected by that? Is it possible, since the souls of Venat’s faction of 12 were obliterated, the new souls she created had no memories of the final days, thus are not susceptible to the Echo by means of visions of the final days?
I think that while this is interesting theory, i personally don't like it very much. Just sort of the way it suggests everything is connected in a way that i guess rubs me wrong from a writing perspective. However, the stuff the mol grandmother says is clearly a glance beyond the veil so to speak, as she says things no one apart from our friends perhaps should really know, suggesting certain unknowns about the way the world works (or perhaps she too has a version of the echo)
Interesting theory, but the connections are pretty tenuous at best. I'd need a lot more evidence before I was at all convinced. I have a question for you, though. If the twelve we meet in the new raid are the real thing, shouldn't Aglaia be shut for the next couple of weeks?
Another one of my tin foil hat theories now is about the manderville weapons. Godbert mentions the original manderville weapons being made by Godbrand but lost due to bad housekeeping. Going into norse mythology. Godbrand is translated from the old norwegian name Gudbrand, which is derived from the norse name Guð-brandr. Which literally means God Sword. The most famous viking in norse history was called Dale-Gudbrand. This person was a powerful lord in Norway who rallied people against the Christians when they invaded Norway, putting people to the sword if they did not convert. But they were persuaded to convert after their idol was cut down revealing vermin and a lizards in the middle of a sunrise. Which marked the start of christianity in Norway. It would be interesting if the original manderville weapons that Godbrand made were infact the legendary 12 weapons inspired by FFV, and that he got help from the Twelve to create them, to fight against the corrupted religious fanatics in the second umbral or astral era. 🙂
You know, back then it would had been a little far fetched, BUT NOW, with DT coming up, one of the Pre Order bonus is earings.... of Azeyma. Why her? There's 11 others. Why HER specifically?
What no Estinien?! I would say he's more Rhalgr or Halone. Let's not forget Tataru... She's definitely the God of Commerce 💯. It's hard to place the twins, I would say Alphi takes his grandfathers place as Thaliak, after all Asmon does call him the redditor. Aliesae, idk, Llmlaen maybe. Cool video tho.
Spoiler!!!!--do not read if you havent done Euphrosyne I am wondering what you think about the Althyk and Nymeia log line as the same as the ancients on Elpis said the same line Maira and Alkaios saying a similar or the same line (cant remember well) while on the side quest of the concept of Behemoth
Not unless he's tested all twenty-two sectors, noticed the fragments in one direction, and detected the celestial noise.
I don't know if anyone made the connection but the Omphalos theme uses the same motif that plays in the cutscene with the scions at the very end of 5.3. The game likes to use motifs to make these sort of connections, so it could definitely be a possibility.
One thing at 3:00, there is an ast weapon that drops from the Kitsis hyperboreia that has the marks of the twelve on it. It is possible a variation of the twelve did exist prior to the sundering.
I love the use of Legend of Dragoon music. Good stuff. Great vid too man
Thanks friend. I can’t help myself when it comes to ps1 era games, they have some of the most memorable music.
@@StoutHelm legend of dragoon underrated
I knew it!! I thought for a second I was crazy but nope it is Legend of Dragoon music!
I thought this was the music from Legend of Dragoon, particularly the pause/inventory window music! Instantly recognized it
>.>
it's so weird seeing my friends old Miqo'te ( 8:46 ) out of no where like this, especially since they are a Bunny now XD
It's definitely interesting. The only thing I don't understand about the theory is this: If they are incarnations of the 12, how does that work in the context of us literally meeting 4 of the 12 in person? I guess they could be the phantom version of our physical incarnations? It's a bit unintuitive there.
Louisoix, Moenbryda, Yda, and Papalymo are all technically dead when we meet the first four of the twelve so that *could* solve that issue. The real problem comes in when we meet the rest when the next alliance is released.
My theory is they are just unsundred ancients from Elpis who are using auracite to become Lucavi.
He at least knew the Warrior of Light would carry on in his stead
I had an interesting theory I've been thinking about recently. I think it could be viable, but only if FFXIV ever gets an actual ending, which would be the basis of this theory.
My theory is, that we are not Azem, but rather, Azem is us. At the end of our journey, we, somwhow, become Unsundered, and with our knowledge and power, return back in time to the point where we first appear, possibly becoming a child or infant, and live out our life as an Ancient, eventually learning under Venat, becoming friends with Hythlodeus and Hades, before becoming Azem. Azem seemed to know events that would take place, us falling onto Themis is the Pandæmonium raids being a prime example, but they also had an instinctive hatred of Primals, denouncing the summoning of Zodiark, and not answering Venat when it came to Haedalyn, something the WoL knows that Azem did. We don't know what Azem was doing at the time of the Sundering, but they could've been alone, preparing for it, reminiscing about their time as the WoL, knowing it will happen again soon. Trapped eternally in a time loop, never knowing rest. A sad, but also happy existence, as they'd never remember any of it.
What do you think? There could be more evidence to support this somewere, it just needs to be found.
That’s actually some thing I’ve been pondering a lot as well. A part of me thinks at some point we travel back to ancient days and take on the mantle of Azem... Venat’s successor. And here’s an even crazier theory. I don’t think we’re ever going to be fully rejoined. I think sundered Azem is able to work with dynimus much better, and I think that’s going to play a role in events to come. And because I am so crazy with this conspiracy theories, I even think the reason we don’t see as Azem during the final days is because they dipped back to the future so they wouldn’t get sundered even more.
@@tbeshers both you have interesting theories. And technically 14 need not end for the time stuff to work out. Because Azem likely either A. has time based powers, B. can see the future, or C. can do both, but while that's fun to me, not everyone would like that idea. I love time travel stuffs.
Although my HCs on Azem have it where "he" (since my WoL isn't a Sundered soul but an ancient's directly reborn and she is Azem's cousin) is Unsundered due to some circumstance involving multiple powers play by the time the Sundering happened, leaving him and his lover and a few friends the only other ones left of their kind, all without Hades ever knowing. If he decided to use time magic then the need was dire in order to save the world in a indirect way using his reincarnated cousin.
Something like that. XD
@@kaleajadesilver8918 I love it!
I have a theory that includes this as an element. It would go a LONG way to explaining why Azem refused the Convocation and never answered Venat's call.
There has to be a connection between Azem, Oshon, Deryk and time travelling.
Azem is absent so many times, the fact that they’re not responding to Venat, them meddling in weird things like saving an island because of the grapes ( or was it because that island would be crucial to saving the world in the future? ), Oshon not being born from “the whirl” like the other god but instead just showing up one day, Deryk being mentioned as also having the habit of popping up here and there and then being gone again just as sudden…
I had this thought about this being Deryk’s final thing he does before going back in time to become unsundered because he knows he has to in order for the WoL and the WoD and all other important reincarnations to be able to be reborn and do all the work they/we have done.
So much time spent travelling back and forth, trying to put things in the right place for the correct events to happen. I’m his also makes me think about Omega and that so many of the things we have gone through has felt like one big test. Who knows how many timelines and versions Azem/Oshon/Deryk has gone through to find the one that actually saves the world.
A line Hydaelyn said “ our timelines have almost converged “ struck me as being sort of weird. Like there were more than one timeline/story and they all had to come together to form one strong line or point in time.
That’s why he seems a bit detached and sad. He realises his journey is almost over. But he also is clearly cheering us on, helping us move forward, towards his final goal. His duty’s end.
It makes me really emotional to think about this. So bittersweet and beautiful and tragic.
But it may all be completely wrong 🤷🏻♀️
This is something I'll need to think about a bit since I hadn't considered how our companions might line up with the 12, but I'm glad the 12 archons were mentioned because their info in the Encyclopedia stood out to me. It's even more interesting to hear what that one npc in 1.0 had to say. Very interesting.
Papa Louie saw Allie kicking ass and smiled
I was very confused for a moment when I was hearing legend of dragoon music. Great video
Sometimes I get a wild hair to reach way back in terms of background music. Glad you enjoyed it!
@@StoutHelm Awesome choice and an excellent game.
So much of this saga wasn't predetermined that the advent of ANOTHER big change coming and with everything we know now man i'm excited for this channels future lmao
There's a lot of different avenues and points to consider in the theory which always makes for the most fun and rewarding ones regardless of the outcome. I really enjoyed it. Thanks to both of you for putting this together!
Eeeeh, no. There's some similarities, and I can see the connection between Venat's followers and the 12, but there is a pretty heavy handed nod that Azem was the inspiration for Azeyma. Azem also refused to side with Emet and Venat; presumably outright opposing the idea of 'god making' and the sacrifices that come with. So IF the followers of Venat are the Twelve, how does Azem play into it all? Doesn't hold much water, personally.
Now Louisoix seeing the future? Sure, I can see it. I never played 1.0, but I assume he had the Echo (correct me if I'm wrong). And as we've seen with Krile, the Echo manifests in different and strange ways.
If they are incarnations, would Hydaelon know it was them? Venat/hydealon could sense the WoL, wouldnt she be able to sense the others? Just a thought.
Not the biggest fan of wild speculation and theory crafting but love your videos nonetheless and I'm glad you got your voice back and seem to be feeling better :)
Voice is back now, I recorded this prior! Next video won’t be a theory based one.
if the twelve were the people with Venat in Anyder then The WoL couldn't be the incarnation of Azeyma as Azem didn't join them this is known since they refered to them as 'The Deserter" Azem supported neither the plan to summon Zodiark nor the plan to summon Hydaelyn
Well, we still don't know for sure if those ancients are the twelve. I also remember seeing another theory soon after EW launched that Azem didn't actually oppose the Hydaelyn plan. The comment in Anamnesis Anyder was simply that Azem wasn't responding to their requests, not an outright refusal. I'm also pretty sure it was the convocation that labeled Azem a deserter, not Hydaelyn's group, although I don't remember all the dialog of that cutscene. You have to wonder what all Azem at the time knew since they were apparently aware of our existance as shown in the pandaemonium raids where they told Elidibus to expect our arrival. Given all this info though I don't think Azeyma has really anything to do with Azem aside from the similar names, and I honestly feel like us being connected to them would almost feel like a downgrade from what Azem is supposed to represent at this point.
As another comment said, there's a lot of details as of ShB (5.3 onward) and now EW with the alliance raids that just completely tear apart this theory
Once upon a time it might've had more to work with, at the very least pitting the WoL as Oschon (funnily enough my main has Oschon as their patron), but now? Nahhh
8:20 Did...I just make it into someone's lore video? haha this segment is from an old vid I posted years ago on my channel. No worries not mad or anything, just pointing it out.
You’re probably right, let me give you proper credit in the description. I tried to find the cutscene in the inn but was struggling. I’m so sorry, I’ll change that ASAP.
@@StoutHelm Oh thank you! No harm done. I'm more flattered than anything else.
I always assumed Godbert was Byregot which would explain a good chunk of Hildebrand, but also he wields hammer.
Kinda wish they do a gameplay remake of the 1.0 story, not as a distraction to future expansions but maybe when the game is at it's end
I like it...always thought to myself if the ascians are what we get from zodiarks summoning whatever happened to hydalaens summoners...this would be kool
The circumstances of the ascians and hydaelyns summoners is different though. The ascians sacrificed half their civilization, not themselves. Hydaelyn's summoners had to sacrifice themselves directly. In either case the ones sacrificed were completely consumed as fuel for the summoning.
Tbh Louisoix is one of the greatest and most badass characters ever. If anything I support this theory by that reason alone haha. I also really like the incarnation assignment for each character.. the twelve are indeed a great mystery, still. But my take is this one: The twelve are our more original self, everything basically stems from them. The experience of the people and the WoL is a more compact experience with a specific goal in mind. Theory: there was one god/source at the beginning of it all, which split itself into several gods which we know as the twelve (but they are still one, connected). The twelve and their plan is to make even more life. Which eventually lead to the Ancients and later on the fragmented, sundered people. Their ultimate goal is to grant everyone immortality and ascent them to gods as well. Yeah it's pretty crazy, but I love the idea of it.
This a very well made video. Respect.
i think there is some kind of strange thing in fact there is hydaelyn and the 12 archon but that mean thirty and there is 12 deities what if the oppo in the raid quest was the thirtiest that permit to keep the balance in some kind of way or something that isn't the twelve that keep the knowledge of the twelve like a keeper
I mean the unnamed 13th atm is implied to be the watcher
legend of dragoon menu music is a banger B3
Hell yeah it is
I like the music, played this game a lot, waiting for a dragoon remake
Bro I wish. I’m waiting too
I love tin foily hat theories, and I have some of my own.
Did for example Hephaistos create what is considered in present Eorzea, the voidsent? Or overly darkness aspected creations?
If you see the statues at the end of The Weeping City of Mhach, they look very much like Hephaistos. Also, both High voidmage Cessair and Cait Sith are to be observed in Elpis.
During the void ark raid series, Cait Sith shares with us the purpose of Dun Scaith, that it was made to protect the ancients against the floods in plural, indicating that the flood of darkness most probably was not the only flood that happened.
So this might mean that the void ark was made to protect and ferry the souls of the ancients.
And if you look to other FF games for similarities, a very similar story of this is found in FFIX with Garland, the Invincible and his duty to ensure the survival of the souls of Terra.
In FFIX, Garland created cloning technology to house Terran's souls, while its known that cloning technology was something Emet-Selch possessed.
Garland also mentions a quality of memories that is similar to what Venat told you about memories, aether and the echo.
Garland tells you this while traversing Memoria, a place conjured by the planet's memory.
"Life is connected, one to another... If you trace the root of all life, there exists one source. The same can be said for memory. All life constitutes an intelligence that holds memory beyond experience."
Venat tells you on Elpis:
"There are two ways to see the past.
The first entails peering through the walls of the soul in the moment a subject is recalling a memory.
The second requires no subject, and is instead a process of piecing together an event from ripples left in the ambient aether.
As memories are etched upon the aether of the soul, so too are they etched upon the aether of the world. In this way can history be preserved.
Such memories are given to fading, however, and can prove challenging to visit".
I'm a bit confused by your timelines with this, are you trying to say that the people of Mhach were ancients, or that they're from the 13th? I'm pretty sure Dun Scaith was made to save the people from the literal flood that was the 4th umbral calamity. The flood of darkness happened on the 13th hundreds or even thousands of years before Mhach even existed. Most voidsent are just regular people from the 13th that were warped by exposure to extreme astral aether, similar to sin eaters on the first.
@@silvinity4939 I don't think all of them are ancients, but a select few. It would be strange of Cait Sith to remember floods then:
"This floating marvel I speak of is not a natural occurrence─it was constructed as a haven for refugees of the floods. The tome makes very clear reference to the island's purpose, and describes in detail the voidsent sorcery employed in its creation"
@@DefenderX I mean, he remembers the literal flood that was the 6th (not 4th like I said before) umbral calamity caused by the war of the magi. It was the calamity of water, a worldwide flood.
@@silvinity4939 you are correct. He mentions the floods again in relation to building the void ark after voidmage Cessair foresaw the floods.
Most probably, Cessair is a shard of the ancient we observe in Elpis. And that she has the echo ability and can use it to see the future. Similarly to Mikoto from Bozja.
II love this video. I hope you’ll do the Variant Dungeon next.
This is surprisingly similar to my own theory, which for some years now is that the Scions are the current incarnations of the Twelve, although I shouldn't be surprised that someone else has reached such similar conclusions.
However, in my version, Tataru is Nymeia, the spinner of fate, due to how she has strings attached to everyone and is this grand manipulator / blackmailer behind the scenes. I haven't been able to pin down all of the 12 but this fellow's theory includes characters that I hadn't considered.
If anyone is curious, my theory is that currently not all members of the 12 were incarnated, or at least haven't been met, but I like the idea of reaching outside of the Scions for some answers. I also try to keep their original genders and inclinations to their current incarnations. While this is not strictly necessary, the idea here is that they'd stick to what is familiar to them (if they have a choice).
My theory is:
Nymeia: Tataru
Oschon: Thancred
Nald'Thal: Obviously the twins.
Nophica: Y'shtola? She began as a CNJ
Azeyma: WoL
Zero: The 13th's incarnation of Azem.
Adding from this gent's theory:
Thaliak: Louisoix, makes all the sense in the world.
Althyk: Graha, also a perfect match.
Halone: Y'da, I love it.
Rhalgr: Papalymo? Sure, he was a THM after all, and sassy.
Why is Graha's soul so dense that he withstood Elidbus' attack? The ascien even expresses his surprise over how thick Graha's soul is. Then there's the ability that he has, able to summon people through time and space. Although he uses the Tower to power the spell like a giant battery, it is most definitely a Convocation spell. Just look at the golden symbols and how they appear when he summons people, it's all very similar to Azem's own summoning ability.
Either there is absolutely something going on with this character that most players have completely missed, or this is just some shoddy writing. Which is more likely? I haven't ever trusted Graha as a result of these huge red flags, but tagging him as Althyk makes all the sense. Frankly I'm ashamed that I hadn't thought of it, so kudos to our anonymous theory crafter.
Aside: It's Althyk who's invoked to yoink the WoL away "into an atherial rift". A 1.0 character even re-appears via teleportation in a column of light next to Althyk's stone. You can easily visit the location in-game in the Black Shroud.
I should add that it's long been believed that Emet is Nald'Thal and I still think that makes sense, but this is a complicated twist if so.
LoD fan! Much respect
If he knew that could explain the thing about him saying he created the God stones where people prayed, but the Gods claiming the stones have always been there.
Did he actually claim he made them himself though? Or was that just something people assumed? 🧐
That I'm not super sure of. 1.0 lore is my weak spot.
With raha saying time is weird, and the new ten year story beginning soon, nothing is too far fetched or loopy, anything could be true according to possible future in game stories one day
I love Tin Foil Hat Territory so much that I've set up a government there, and I'm applying for statehood. I wonder if I can get representation in Congress (like Puerto Rico).
What if Hydaelyn created the “The (benevolent) Twelve” gods after the Source was sundered to give hope to all newly sundered life? Is it possible that she created these gods in the image of her faction of 12 scholars who helped her create Hydaelyn? Kind of like how she created the Watcher on the moon? And a whole freakin’ race of tiny rabbit people (looking at you Lopportis). And could it be possible the Archons of the present are some form of the souls of those gods that came to be after the sundering?
And why in the world do NONE of the Archons have the Echo? 5 of them were there in The First when Elidibus “gave” the Echo to almost everyone in the town square, but those five were not effected by that? Is it possible, since the souls of Venat’s faction of 12 were obliterated, the new souls she created had no memories of the final days, thus are not susceptible to the Echo by means of visions of the final days?
Not entirely true on the Archons. Krile has the echo. Though she’s mostly kept from the action.
@@StoutHelm You’re right! I forgot about Krile!
I still hold to my theory - the Tweleve are tied to Azem's plans.
Can they really be incarnation if we are meeting the twelve in the raid?
Honestly? Probably not.
I think that while this is interesting theory, i personally don't like it very much. Just sort of the way it suggests everything is connected in a way that i guess rubs me wrong from a writing perspective. However, the stuff the mol grandmother says is clearly a glance beyond the veil so to speak, as she says things no one apart from our friends perhaps should really know, suggesting certain unknowns about the way the world works (or perhaps she too has a version of the echo)
Interesting theory, but the connections are pretty tenuous at best. I'd need a lot more evidence before I was at all convinced.
I have a question for you, though. If the twelve we meet in the new raid are the real thing, shouldn't Aglaia be shut for the next couple of weeks?
Very interesting theory! 😀
Another one of my tin foil hat theories now is about the manderville weapons.
Godbert mentions the original manderville weapons being made by Godbrand but lost due to bad housekeeping.
Going into norse mythology. Godbrand is translated from the old norwegian name Gudbrand, which is derived from the norse name Guð-brandr. Which literally means God Sword.
The most famous viking in norse history was called Dale-Gudbrand.
This person was a powerful lord in Norway who rallied people against the Christians when they invaded Norway, putting people to the sword if they did not convert. But they were persuaded to convert after their idol was cut down revealing vermin and a lizards in the middle of a sunrise. Which marked the start of christianity in Norway.
It would be interesting if the original manderville weapons that Godbrand made were infact the legendary 12 weapons inspired by FFV, and that he got help from the Twelve to create them, to fight against the corrupted religious fanatics in the second umbral or astral era. 🙂
You know, back then it would had been a little far fetched, BUT NOW, with DT coming up, one of the Pre Order bonus is earings.... of Azeyma.
Why her? There's 11 others. Why HER specifically?
Ayy a face reveal nice beard beardo
What no Estinien?! I would say he's more Rhalgr or Halone. Let's not forget Tataru... She's definitely the God of Commerce 💯. It's hard to place the twins, I would say Alphi takes his grandfathers place as Thaliak, after all Asmon does call him the redditor. Aliesae, idk, Llmlaen maybe. Cool video tho.
Spoiler!!!!--do not read if you havent done Euphrosyne
I am wondering what you think about the Althyk and Nymeia log line as the same as the ancients on Elpis said the same line Maira and Alkaios saying a similar or the same line (cant remember well) while on the side quest of the concept of Behemoth
LoD menu music, you devil!
o.o