The “raven was robbed” fantasy is pure delusion(and a clear example of the fandoms racist antics, but that’s besides the point). Y’all may hate him but he ate the girls up plain and simple
James was never even in the bottom while Raven consistently underperformed until right at the end. And sure, James did have immunity but honestly, he probably wouldn't have lip synced even if immunity wasn't there. Snatch Game, Morgan and Kylie were clearly the worst and James got at least a joke in so I think he would've been safe over Juju and then the rock challenge, I still don't think he lip syncs without immunity.
I agree that Tyra was mistreated by the fandom, that she's the rightful winner etc. But also: Be careful what you read into a picture. Do we know for a fact Tyra was all alone while other people were autographing? Or did she just arrive at Drag Con? Until it's corroborated we don't know what happened.
Trya was only 21 when she won. When she was blasted for acting caddy at 21. Raven was in her 30s. Like how amazing is it to win at 21. I think she deserves more credit.
it just makes me side eye raven even more (i never liked her on the show, i liked her in combination with raja on that fashion ruview)... what 30 year old bullies a 20 year old?
Raven literally called Tatiana $hit and lied about it...and people praised it, but then those same people turned around and said Tyra was negative...made no sense.
People didn't praise Raven for calling Tati shit, Tati was also a fan favorite. We just find it funny that production used a clip of her saying exactly what she said she didn't say.
Everything about Raven in All Stars 7 rubbed me the wrong way. Specially, that they had the nerve to air Raven saying she was robbed twice, discrediting not only Tyra's win, but also Chad's. What has Chad ever done to deserve this kind of treatment from WoW? I found that so disrespectful.
....and the fact that Raven is fully a white person. Did you know that? Some people are just now figuring it out; You need to wear the right shade of makeup for your skintone, dear.... otherwise, it could come off a little bit different for people when they see your real face. Yikes
i dont think its on WoW that raven said that and they kept it in. she said something shady so they used it for their reality show, i don't rly think its any deeper than that
Listen, Tyra is absolutely problematic for reasons xyz, but if you're going to cancel her, you also need to hold Sharon accountable and cancel the hell out of her.
@@jumanjilee8069 absolutely! The situations aren’t comparable. But both are not okay. Sharon should never be allowed anywhere near a RPDR/WoW production ever again.
Raven was not robbed - she lost. Lol. Losing is something that we all need to learn to understand in life, especially when it’s losing something we care about. I feel so bad for James. Bullying is never the answer, and I hope his son is okay ❤️❤️
Whatever they say, if you have watched RuPaul's drag race from the beginning, it was no mistake that Tyra was the winner of season 2. I didn't really like Raven, loved Jujubee, but Tyra dominated them all the entire season.
Agreed, i feel like the whole "raven was robbed" thing was an internet snowball moment. i watched it back in 2017, but i didnt have any contact with the show outside of it and could see why Tyra won. Only after i finished season 6 i went looking for content for the show online, was shocked to see ppl didnt believe Tyra deserved to win, or that ppl liked Raven at all lmao
One thing that I remember from that time is that his CHILD was receiving death threats by the fandom at some point. No wonder why he went nuts for all of this.
James also mentioned on HeyQween that apparently problems between him and Tatianna started because Tati was also speaking ill on Tyra’s child. Not sure how true it is but apparently production left that part out.
Watching James spiral is just horrific. Imagine constantly being told your proudest moment is undeserved and having to take it happily. Kylie has it right. James became the monster he is because he was constantly forced into that mold. So when he finally became that person, the fans suddenly acted all surprised about it.
Proudest moment? Their son doesn't live with them anymore... priorities, choices. Yeah it's pretty miserable watching the living embodiment of Alyssa's "the girl I knew they were." Even Jaremi made an effort to refocus their energy to something better, they never even won. Hope the kids ok.
You always have a choice no one forced her down that road she made that decision herself Don't take back her autonomy and hold her accountable for the things she does
@@TheVincident. Im not saying he didn't do anything to warrant those. He did what he did and he was wrong a lot of the times. But we also need to understand that the fans drove a person to be this bad. The management also actively preferred Raven. So if we are asking her to be accountable, then we better also understand that we are accountable for not stopping the hate or perpetuating the hate. It goes both ways. I'm not even a fan of hers but I get how horrible it must be in that position.
@@Sabreeshuh by proudest moment i mean winning her season. She did that and we can't take it from her. Now imagine total strangers saying the bitch that didn't do so well deserved it better. Jaremi had an advantage of not being pitted against a popular queen like Raven with the backing of the management. Just because Jaremi was able to survive doesn't mean James and his suffering is anything less than horrible. Both can exist at the same time.
He behaved like that even before he was a winner, though. Tatiana's "choices" catch phrase was a counter to his instigative behavior back then, bc even then he was blaming others for his own "choices"
The gag is raven hates what they sees in others that is actually how they are.. Calling the winners losers and saying they would never be a star.. It was all projection of the fact they didnt know how to deal with rejection.
Raven is a really rude person. I only watch her and Manila because I like Manila. I never could stand Raven because her attitude is garbage. She didn't win so she tries to knock other people down.
James( Tyra) is truly a special case because they are the only winner that was NEVER celebrated by the fandom. Also I spent years thinking Raven was Latin American when they are fully white( Russian to be exact) 🤨
Yes, fully a white person. Does that NOT count as blackface...? What is the term for when white people wear dark makeup all the time so as to come off as a different race?
Being latina IS being white, or black, or asian. Latina is not an ethnicity, just a location of birth, like being north american. Half of the victoria secret's girls are white latinas.
It was really humble of Kylie to say that about Tyra even though she’s friends with Morgan, Kylie understood the situation Tyra was going through and we need more queens like Kylie honestly😔
Tyra is still one of my top 3 favorite winners along with Bob and Jinx...The way he sucked it up, performed and dominated when everyone was rooting against him was a huge sign of strength and it was great TV...
Jinkx was my all time favorite on season 5 of Rupaul's Drag Race. He was never problematic at all throughout season 5, even when the others were trying to rile him up.
"the fandom made james who he is today" is sucha lame and lazy excuse, he's a GROWN MAN, no one is babysitting him, his own actions is his OWN, racism, death threats, and doxxing people, that's all on him.
@@ShimmySchimeon He was literally harassed for YEARS, and as this video stated season two had many bullies and while Tyra was immature and a jerk, but Raven was praised and her bullying came off as much more personal to Tatiana but Raven somehow got a pass. Also the gay community has a serious racism problem and I’m not talking about dating preference but I live in a big gay city and I know many gay men who are very open about their racism. I remember people making all kinds of mental gymnastics to disqualify Tyra’s dominate win. I was even in a gay bar and heard a dude complaint that RuPaul had a bias to black queens. People like Sharon Needles always been horrible but they actually have support of the community Tyra doesn’t have that she used to be immature and petty but that was normal behavior for a drag queen but when a black queen does it people have a problem and go on attack.
@@TonySomething. Raven never got a pass, people tended to give her as much shit as they gave Tyra. Not justifying the racist gays, but a lot of them have turned racist due to a large population of the black community has been very homophobic towards them, sadly hatred feeds hatred. Anywho, Tyra is a lazy and immature and insane, I do not buy the whole "the fans made her" when she really didn't make most of her win and drag career anyways.
@@ShimmySchimeon Wow. Gay men tend to show their racism to other gays who are minorities and the drag race fandom is a great example of that. Also during that time we still had democrats running around who was openly anti-lgbt this isn’t a black community thing, you’re literally trying to justify racism and then go straight to a stereotype about Tyra being lazy? Well that says a lot about the season 2 queens that Tyra by far had the best record. And something tells me you wasn’t a viewer during that time because all the hate was on Tyra and most gay men are immature and so are many queens who came after Tyra and Tyra had the excuse of being 21. I remember the argument from gays about young queens should pay their dues before going on the show, calls of racism for Tyras win and straight out racial slurs tossed around. Your reality isn’t reality.
@@TonySomething. "this isn't a black community thing" obviously not the only thing, but your comments alone shows how little you know anything about it and how narrative your political sides are.
She's the og fashion queen also, and this is how mental health effects people, miss Latina black poc princess raven has always been bitter hiding under rus shadow using the fracking oil as tanning oil. Envy Peru Bianca and Tyra are some of the best winners from drag race
I've never understood the hype for Raven. She was catty as hell on her season, and although Tyra wasn't my favorite, she legitimately outperformed everyone else.
It's a matter of taste. I like Raven. Season 2 was a million years ago and lots of things have changed. Watching/reading her interviews changed a lot of people's minds. But it's fine since not everyone can like her. I don't mind James, but I do think he messed up. It's sad and upsetting tbh
'Raven was robbed' narrative was created to systematically fuck with James's psych. The whole situation has racism smeared all over it and it makes me sad.
i do genuinely feel awful for James Ross, especially since he was a father and had to face so much aversion. I hope his kid knows that their father was a superstar
The fact that queens who have SA allegations, racists, transphobes, or just disgusting queens that have been on drag race are still celebrated and not talked badly about them compared to James is wild. Ridiculous.
That video of Tyra seated on a corner while answering questions breaks my heart 💔... You can see that people truly HATE her but she incredibly decided to stay for the fans! I completely understand her behavior to this point!
Raven can absolutely go around shouting from the rooftops that she was robbed in Season 2, it is when people like Raja and even the production team of Drag Race start agreeing and encouraging fans to agree that I see the problem. Hell, it can even just be something as simple as "yeah, you did really well, but she did better" or even brushing it off as a joke like "always the bridesmaid, never the bride." When the production company involved sides with Raven, it cements it in the fanbases head that even WoW thinks Raven should have been crowned. It adds a layer of legitimacy.
I can see James's anger at Raja seeing that Raja has discredited his win on many occassions to please his friend Raven and with that indirectly sent their fans to hate on James..
People can be victims of others, while still being instigators themselves in other matters. Very few people are ever a “perfect victim”. He suffered horrible abuse from the fandom, was ignored by production, but also did things to hurt others, “joked” about shooting people and made allusions to a bomb threat, doxxed fellow queens, etc. The abuse he received in undeniably a reason for some of these actions, but in no way an excuse. I definitely feel for him, and feel the fandom definitely matured him into a monster of their own creation.
I disagree. No one gets to dictate how anyone reactions to BLATANT White Supremacy. He didn't owe anyone a smile for what they did to him. I'm disgusted by the people that point out anything except his treatment.
@@kiwisoup So just because James made inappropriate jokes and lashed out at people who already had longstanding grudges against him justifies all the abuse and negativity he's gotten over the last *twelve* years from fans, fellow castmates, _and_ production? I see you. Nobody's making James out to be some sort of fallen angel. He's just guilty for creating his own problems as much as the community he subjected himself to is. But the fact of the matter is James has had *NOBODY* in his corner ever since he became a public figure. Putting aside all the shade and "Raven was robbed" nonsense, fans have mistreated him for years. Production has now capitalized on his failures because it's more profitable to lambast him than support him. And ignoring the racial component to the situation is ignoring the racism that's still present within the LGBTQ+ community. James isn't the only victim: The Vixen, Jaremi Carey, Asia O'Hara, Ra'Jah O'Hara, Widow Von Du, Brita Filter, Nina Bo'nina Brown, Kimora Amour, and countless other queens have had run-ins with racist fans. They've received death threats and slander online. It always seems like whenever a white queen or a favored fails to meet expectations on the show, a queen of color gets the short end of the stick. It just so happens that James wasn't just another black queen getting piled on... she was the first. He's made his bed, but everyone else set it on fire the moment he laid down. And bitch, you're part of the problem.
@@PatrickCervantez It's not that fucking deep. You can be against his behavior while also being against the abuse from fans. Being against one doesn't mean you are for the other and using his treatment as a blatant excuse for why it's "okay" and justified for him to behave like this is such a bullshit take. People have been through worse and not taken the low road. You see me? I'm part of the problem? Sorry that I call it like I see it. You're the one turning a blind eye to bad behavior while also complaining about doing the same thing. Not a good look. You can cry racism all you want... Literally has nothing to do with what I said and I would 100% call out a white queen for the same toxic behavior.
@@jckholmes9194 Using that logic Sharon Needles gets a pass because of homophobia. Or do adults have actual responsibility for their actions?? I'm left handed in a right hand world. Do I have your approval to call in bomb threats to schools? I'm also queer, do I get to call in bomb threats to churches? Justifying shitty actions because it tickles your confirmation bias, is how evangelicals vote Trump.
i want to love raja because of her campiness but they way she’s so two faced is horrible. She’s great when alone but horrible when she’s with someone else or in a group
@@joonlovescrabsliterally. I’ve come to realize she’s a really narcissistic person. Two things can be true at once, she’s a fashionista and an icon, but she’s also really rude for no reason other than selfishness. Like what she said about Michelle on all stars 7? Regardless of what Michelle said, which, again Michelle can be unjustly critical, she had no right to say the reason Michele is on the panel is because she’s best friends with Ru, and had the nerve to tell production they should fire her. Just pure pettiness and diva attitude
@@alexmuniz9286oh please he’s allowed to say what he wants and she’s allowed to feel however she feels. He doesn’t owe her anything while she can sit there and say whatever.
James became a monster due to how the fans treated him. I’ve read this quote saying, “People will notice the change in your attitude towards them, but won’t notice their behavior that made you change.”
That imagine of Tyra sitting alone at her booth is so sad. I don’t like how Raja egged the crowed on to clap for Raven when stating her alleged “robbery”
I wouldn't hold that against James. Try to image what he went through; getting hate everyday and death threats. When you're literally afraid for your life, your reptile brain takes over instead of higher reasoning.... fight or flight. I'm sure most of us can't imagine how it feels to get death threats.
@Satday’s yeah, maybe because Sharonne isn't this person that is currently being portrayed as? Like I don't know these people personally, i also don't want to make bold assumptions over anyone but this "through the grapevine" rumors about how Sharonne is super racist and super problematic somehow don't add up in my mind, mostly because how much support she's still receiving from her peers (including poc queens and other queens whom we would consider very racially and socially aware), even after becoming somewhat irrelevant compared to other queens. Why are many queens still actively supporting and befriending Sharonne if she is really that nasty? I'm sure she's not holding any sort of real power over their careers
@@daanleguijt8763 It's a meme of a Pakistani fan wanting his team fumble at a cricket game. The bad play happens and the camera cuts to him. I love it everytime I see these videos because it's just such a mood. *watching
The picture of Tyra at her booth with no fans really makes me so sad. I would LIVE to see her at her booth if i ever went to drag con. She was so fierce on her season and I really do believe that it’s further evidence of racial bias within the fandom. I find Tyra to be a very pretty and fishy queen but I almost think there’s a racist preconceived notion in many Americans’ minds that black people, drag queen or otherwise, are inherently more masculine, including black women. White women are more dainty and feminine and while this is changing in a more positive way imo every season, I think that Tyra suffered being the target for a lot of the early toxic fandom.
I completely agree, the only reason I would even be intimidated by her would be how tall she is compared to me. Like if I met her standing up she would be like 2 feet taller than me (I'm a 5'6" woman) in those high heels and a glowing, stunning, fierce goddess. She's very feminine and likes dark colors. It feels like while people like black in fashion and feel like everyone needs a little black dress, as soon as you wear it as lipstick you are no longer feminine. But that's just my take on it lol
Even rupaul knew wot James was doing ...!!! When he super glued that white stuff to his leg during the wedding dress challenge was magic... and rupaul said so ...James did everything 4 effect... he played the game extremely well...he had to win!!!!
I'm an older fan, and I watched Season 2 when it first aired. Raven was an underwhelming queen. I don't remember much about her. I actually like Tatianna and Jujubee, but that's another conversation. All I can say is that Tyra Sanchez did great in the challenges, and, for a long time, was the youngest winner. I understood shade and reading is part of the subculture of drag, so I didn't read too much into any of the goings-on with the show.
Same! Tatiana and Jujubee were so enjoyable that season. Tyra had stank face most of the time and Raven was arrogant. It was obvious that RuPaul loved Tyra and it was no surprise she won. This was the second season, and the second example, of RuPaul having a favorite who won over the fan favorite. The third season sealed it. Raja and her Heathers were mean girls and Raja winning felt like another example of Rigga Morris. That was the end of that format, with fans voting on social media to help determine the winner for season 4. Social media is a cesspool and drag queens receive and create a lot of negativity there. At this point, it doesn’t matter who wins. Take that opportunity to build a fan base and keep your drama to a minimum. The queens with the best overall package of personality and talent will go farthest.
I personally got into drag race pretty late because it wasn't airing in my country (until Netflix brought it around season 11 I think) but when I learned such a show exists (right before season 9 started) i found a pirate link and started from season 1. I had no contact with the fandom at the time, nor any info on any BTS, but i remember thinking how much raven grew on me during the course of season 2, and how I felt like she should've won over Tyra and somehow the true queen wasn't chosen. What I'm trying to say is when I watched this season I was pretty much unaware of everything about the rhetoric around the show, the queens themselves or their relationships, yet it seems that i still had the same thoughts and feelings as many other fans. This to me shows either there really is some basis as to why people thought raven is robbed, or (more likely) the show was edited in a way to make us feel a certain type of way. Just some thoughts
Raven is extremely overrated. He struggled in many challenges on S2, lacks heart. Jujubee should have won, hands down, but could not with the clothes she have had :D I hope RPDR does now med checks on the contestants, with focus on mental health, why Tyra definitely is not healthy.
all i can say is i hope james gets some happiness and peace and time with his son. this is one of the darkest stories to come out of drag race and i’m glad this video put some more nuanced light on him
Great assessment of the situation GreenGay. It was very fair, and I'm so glad you brought up how nasty Raven was on season 2. Her fat shaming of Mystique was woeful. No one ever brings that up. Truth is reality tv feeds off all the off-air drama, where the queens are purposely pitted against each other. Some young queens are too immature or have no experience in how to deal with social media and the public. In the days before social media, a reality tv star would often be forgotten after airing. Sometimes it seems that regular season winners are overlooked, because they don't get a second go at winning new fans on All Stars. Of course this was before All Stars 7. Queens are so reliant on the Drag Race franchise to make a good career from their art, that it has too much power over them. If only more queens don't have to rely on the franchise to make it.
Both Raven and raja were bullies on their seasons but they are not black so get a pass. Black characters on ru will always be demonized if they even show a tiny bit of bitchiness as the white fandom will paint them as monsters.
Could you make a video talking about the racism in the drag race community? I think it would really enlighten a lot of people about the micro aggressions made towards queens of color.
This is a 40 minute video and your comment is 4 minutes old. Watch the video and if you want to make your own, do it. You’re pushing a narrative that everyone hates drag queens because of their skin color and in reality, there are other reasons. Bomb threats, sexual assault, and using drugs around minors aren’t exclusive to a race or profession.
especially after allstars 7, the way the fandom acted as if every black winner basically didn't deserve to be there, and then how the producers edited them out of their own lipsyncs for a fixed win. the entire system is broken tbh, but the producers have always been a table of white people
@@georged366 some I’ve seen are ones like undermining queens of color, and only giving queens of color their flowers when it comes at the expense of another queen of color.
I can’t remember where, but I once saw someone comment that Raven is lucky she has a newer generation of fans who probably haven’t seen her on Season 2. If we look at Raven and James only during their season, I think Raven was far worse; James was loud, bratty, and annoyed a lot of people, but what did he do that was hurtful to others? Raven on the other hand was incredibly hurtful. She was fatphobic towards Mystique and was extremely nasty towards Tati on numerous occasions. And let’s not forget how she would often dismiss the talent of others just because she was bitter she didn’t win the challenge. I’m sure Raven is a much nicer person now, but I’ll never call myself a fan of hers.
Raven was awful and totally ignorant and a bully for NO REASON BUT JEALOUSY towards Tatianna. She was so HATED thereafter she cancelled all her social media!
I agree 100% Bear in mind I like Raven a lot more now but her behaviour was worst than Tyra’s/James by a mile. That group Raven, kylie/ sonnique, Morgan all used to be bitches
Everyone was very catty in season 2 but Raven was the worst out of all of them! You'd think Tati murdered Raven's family prior to the show with how Raven treated her
Are people not allowed to just not like either of them? Why does it seem we are forced to like one or the other but not both or neither? It seems the second you say you don't like Tyra, you are automatically put in the pro Raven box.
I cannot imagine the sheer amount of vitriol that James received after their win over Raven in season 2. I hope people realize James is also a person and he deserved grace and compassion when he was sharing his experience with the fandom post drag race.
Raven was robbed was pushed by Michelle Visage. In her interviews she was saying if she was a judge on season 2 she wouldve pushed her to win. Thats also when raven and juju would be pushed in front of everyone. Terrible.
That picture of him being at the booth with no fans is heartbreaking. He has done some bad things and there is no excuse for them but its also sad how the fans have treated him. Really hope he gets a second chance (if he wants it) and he can be involved in the franchise again.
@@Blazingredfire13 Non of her comment imply a bomb threat, she never used the word bomb, she never told people that their lives were at risk. Yup she came for some bitches who talked shit about her, and so what, aren't you allowed to defend yourself when you have been systematically targeted by everyone ? Did she actually attack anyone physically, did anything exploded, did anyone go to the ER, NO. So where is the vilolence ? Verbal ? Are you really so freaking thin skinned that you can't get over a tweet. Welcome to the 21st century, if you can't take the heat, get off the internet !
I had the chance to meet up with James 10 years ago multiple times he's a very calm and quiet guy very polite I saw how other drags treated him very unfair and rude multiple times Is so unfair.
i mean. tyra ended up being right about raven's racial stuff 100%. now everyone jokes about raven's blackfishing for example, but not everyone was prepared to acknowledge it back then
i have been seeing more and more fans and queens (like bob) wanting to see James redeem themselves on an All Winners Season. which in all reality would be an amazing comeback/reintroduction to fans as Tyra Sanchez on why she won season 2 (look what it did for Raja and Jinkx). having bob on the same season as Tyra as that support system would be an amazing storyline too
I think that would be an amazing idea. She would be competing with other winning alumni who have been consistently working and traveling perfecting their drag to levels it has never been before, and with that experience has come huge financial gains for most of them in one way or another. To be invited to an all winners season she would seriously need to have already stepped her "pussy" up and come with THE drag war chest to compete with the rest of them on every challenge since nobody's goes home.
Omg 😮 I’d love them to both compete on the same All winners season especially as BOB has been very vocal about his love and admiration of Tyra and also Bebe.
Raven is one of the least likeable queens on the show. Better for her to stay behind the scenes doing Ru's makeup. I feel bad for James. Yes the "fandom" were brutal but until watching this video, I didn't realize how much Rupaul's Drag Race poured gas on the dumpster fire. The show did James dirty. It would have been nice to see Tyra more after the win than having Raven and Jujube shoved down our throats.
Tyra never really got to enjoy her reign as the queen because Raven kept saying she was robbed of the crown but then simultaneously robbing James of a happy reign by putting herself at the center of attention EVERY SINGLE TIME! Yea she may have been a more likeable character for the production but James definitely deserved the win and is getting faded out because of shady people and James never backing down from a fight. That’s the love/hate thing about James that I have. Some things are not worth the fight but James does it anyway! But anyway. I’m still team Tyra Sanchez/ King Tyra/ James Ross! She’s the only queen I haven’t seen as much after their season and it’s sad and heartbreaking. I hope for a better future for James.
No ones talking about how much raven HATED not being the star... Her vitriol was an ever present thread that to my mind actually made raven the villain.. that last moment when raven essentially cursed tyra "youll never be a star" was particularly disgusting to me and really sealed her role as the evil queen to tyras (immature) snow white .. i knew them the fandom was racist.
it will for ever be one of the most iconic moments in television. Just what we all wanted to happen, did. That and "shoot for the moon because you will never be a star" or whatever horrid thing raven wrote in that mirror lol
James’ story is an example of how racism kills the spirit of Black people. As a fan from day I will always root for Tyra/James and give her the respect she deserves.
How ppl legitimately think that Raven should’ve won completely baffles me. James did very well during the season and was the first winner to never lip sync followed by Bianca four seasons later and she beat Raven within the first few seconds of the song, while Raven STRUGGLED in the first half of the season and had already lip synced twice
I think (beside fandom racism) it's because of some of his behaviour. On my first watch I hated him, found him so annoying so I was blind to his talent. When I re-watched S2 the talent was undeniable, completely changed the runway game and did better in challenges.
I did back in the day. You have to remember this was season 2 not 14. I defiantly thought that Tyra was a "complete bitch" and shouldn't be a representative for a community. They even had the entire cast say it on stage too. Of course, as time goes on you can see that the show isn't a representation of a community. It's a reality show that uses and abuses its contestants like every other reality show does. I was rooting for Juju because, of the 3, I thought she would be the best representative for the community as a winner. Raven was also funny mean while Tyra was bitchy mean. It's easier to market funny mean than it is bitchy mean so it's easier to understand why they went toward Raven after.
i think the problem with a lot of fans shouldn't be with Tyra on season 2 but the format of the season. the fact people got immunity made it unsatisfying when a queen who did badly got a free pass, and in the end, had 0 bottom placements even if they were deserved.
Did James win s2? Undoubtedly. Is the fandom opinionated, toxic, unfair, and racist? Definitely. Has, however, James made some very VERY poor decisions on how to deal with that? Absolutely. Does James deserve a second chance? Welp, we ALL deserve a second chance when we fuck up, but James has a LOT of work to do and a LOT of REAL apologizing to do first, like it or not. Second chances are earned, people, let's not forget that, and tbh he doesn't really seem interested in a comeback.
I agree. As much as is saddens me that James has had to deal with unfair outlashes, I have only seen him come back with vitriol and violence. The times when James was handed an olive branch, he chose to set it on fire instead of accepting it and trying to mend relationships. Any one of those times James could have been graceful, but no, there were many choices that James made, which were highly public, and it just painted a picture of high toxicity and that ended up painting over the picture of who we thought Tyra was, and that, to me, was the ultimate downfall.
I agree with all that you’re saying but to extend to your ending point I think the whole reason he doesn’t wanna come back because he feels that there is nothing for him to come back to he never had love from the fandom so it’s kind of like asking yourself why would you go back into a toxic relationship once you’re out of it and on that same analogy I don’t feel like he should apologize until some official apology from the show or other queens come out first acknowledging the harassment that they helped create in the fandom towards her asking her to apologize for the way she reacted to the racist fandom is almost like the vixen situation with Eureka. Like why is it that even the black queen that everyone seems to agree that has had the unfair treatment faster than make an apology to even have a conversation like she has to humble herself to the toxic fandom in order to even be heard that part doesn’t sit right with me
@@robbyrodriguez7099 First, thanks for your well-thought-out reply to my comment. As to why James should offer an apology first, I can only respond that whereas it is true that other queens and even the show did a fair bit to promote the whole angry-black-queen/Raven-was-robbed scenario, James was the one sending threats to other queens and causing Morgan's family stress and upset, and needlessly scaring a lot of fans with what wasn't a real bomb threat. I mean, ppl take their KIDS to DragCon and all James' warnings followed by the cryptic BOOM post, were far from amusing, assuming it was all just a gag/stunt. Which James, as a parent, should've understood. Like, we ALL pop off in the comments section sometimes, but I think threats of violence cross a line that production, and other queens, didn't cross. As to your other point about "why even bother", I actually agree with you there---I don't honestly see the point of mending fences at this point. Not only has the damage been done, but all this is looooong in the past, and imo best left there.
One thing i would say is, she had apologized a lot of times but never received one, she was always surrendering and then kicked more, we can sit here talk about her horrible life decisions but we could never understand the pain we gave her
He has apologized to a lot of the people who were at the event in which he threatened to bomb, the toxicity and racist hate towards him and his son for years took a toll on his mental health and stability along with the problems he had going on, he has been on a road to recovery since. He probably won’t be on drag race but I wish him the best and I’m glad he’s doing better
you should do a full video on davina de campo. i love her and i didn’t realize there was all of the bitterness behind the loss so i’d love to see a full video on her!
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Tyra should participate in the next all winners all stars and win the whole thing. She is one of my fave Queens of all time. She's always been misunderstood.
I’m so glad this comment section is kind and trying to understand his pov. I saw him live recently with a group of others and he was amazing. He gave me extra attention and honestly made my day! Truly I’m glad that he is happy enough to do drag again because he has had a rough life.
In terms of how Season 2 played out, James did legitimately win, but it was his behavior AFTER the show that damaged him. After all there are plenty of Queens of color that faced the same racism in the drag race fandom that still managed to spin straw into gold and didn't make threats or leak people's numbers or make false claims that someone was dead when they were alive Ultimately the person responsible for James Ross's downfall is James Ross himself.
Yes, exactly. Coming to your comment 1 year late 😂 but you cannot just threaten to b*mb an event, lay people out and doxx people like...lol he deserves respect, deserved his WIN. but c'mon now
As a "white passing" poc the racism that I hear on the regular from gay white people is right up there with Trump cultists. If they suspect I'm not white then I get fetishized, which is just as bad. I didn't get two advanced degrees to give anyone dick for cash. Nope.
Racist and ableist She was clearly have mental health issues in response to the harassment from fans, and people just took that and used it as evidence of why she's so horrible. Not "this person is anxious and scared because they were continuously bullied and harassed because of their race, and it's making them defensive and unstable." Just "this person is defensive and unstable," plus all of the related name calling and slurs (crazy, psycho, etc.). I have seen other queens say the same kind of things about The Vixen or Tamisha Iman Diamond. Mental health conditions are a reasonable response to systematic prejudice and discrimination. Obviously we can't allow people having a mental health crisis to say and do whatever they want (like make possible bomb threats) because they could hurt themselves or someone else. But we have to stop judging, shaming, and dogpiling on people who can be saved with understanding and the right help.
How is it racist? How? For saying you don’t like someone for how you perceived them based on what you got from a tv show?? Tyra always came off as cold hearted and rude, and maybe she’s not. Maybe it’s editing and over production but you can’t fault people for basing an opinion on what they have to go by. I only know how I see James act on tv and interact with people online and she seems pretty rude and nasty to me…..and that has nothing to do with her being a black queen. There’s a lot of queens thru the years that I don’t like based on attitude alone.
Raven was the negative one being a 30 year old queen she acted Tyra’s age. Tyra was 21 yrs old can anyone remember what being that age was like. Even Princess Diana couldn’t handle what she was going through at that age. Tyra was the real deal the epitome of a gorgeous queen. You are loved and hope your son Is doing well❤️
What The Vixen once said applied directly to many of the behavior towards James/Tyra: people wants to tell her how to react, but nobody tell Raven and fans how to act.
Honestly, if James was treated with respect and was actually validated by the fandom (and other queens) for his win in season 2, then he wouldn't have done or said many of those things he did in the future. I think we can agree that being told you're undeserving of something you worked your ass of to achieve, especially for years on end, that you would eventually break and say things that you don't mean after being provoked and have it constantly thrown in your face for years. By all means, were some of the things James said and did were terrible and he shouldn't have done it, but with receiving so much hate and racism over the years, and having to deal with Raven's "robbed" barrage as a popular drag queen, I can't imagine what James was going through for all these years having to deal with all of that. It's been over 10 years since season 2 and Raven needs to grow tf up and just accept that she lost (TWICE!) and stop throwing shade at James.
Exactly! These new girls obviously don’t know what was being said back then. I saw it with my own eyes. There are plenty (and I mean plenty) of celebrities who have said questionable and terrible things when social media wasn’t as huge, and as sensitive as it is now. People act like others don’t reach breaking points and say things out of pure anger. I’m sure Tyra regrets things she’s said but we cannot and will not ignore that she was treated like pure garbage after literally winning RPDR. It’s sad.
You can’t let others make you do or say bad things. He had a choice, and he choose wrong. His nasty actions has consequences, he made his bed, now lay on it… We can’t say oh is cuz of the fandom, we all have a choose and his action were not right
@@Simbaninogaming so what do you have to say about Sharon Needles? Like you say all that but your silence on other queens' that have actually done damage is loud and clear. There is a reason why Drag Race has some of the most racist fans, what are you doing when faced with that?
@@pugdad2555 he silent bc he’s just an ignorant bigot. Theee ppl hide behinds comments that are clearly one sided. They bash one for being edgy whole praising another for doing the same. Never align yourself with a racist (Raven)
@@pugdad2555 not to defend the person you're replying to, but you don't know them. You don't really know if they called out Sharon or not, so you can't say as though it were fact that they're silent about Sharon's behavior. Because, honestly, I'm on the same boat with them when it comes to Tyra's behavior and I have shat on Sharon more than I have ever hated Tyra. Let's not make speculations, yeah?
I think the fandom needs to re evaluate how we receive queens and not have ill will towards our non personal favs. We also need to be acutely aware of how we project racism on a queen’s behavior (bomb threats and personal threats of violence aside). Would love to see James return and I think the fandom should be given a second chance - NOT James - to show him proper love and respect for earning the title Next Drag Superstar. Also do not forget that Michelle Visage breathed life into the “Raven was robbed” movement when she got on board in Season 3 and said she would have tried to influence Ru to pick Raven as the winner - and not Tyra. It’s one thing when a fellow contestant wishes she won, and it’s far different when a judge discredits your win. Mad respect and love for King James. Forever royalty, and Season 2 is still my all time favorite.
Tyra will always be one of the strongest Winner of the franchise. It is very unfortunate that so many incidents have happened and so many of them could have been avoided. I really look forward to the day she will be able to come back and nail the competition once again. She has so much to offer.
You do an excellent job of showing the bad behavior some of these more controversial queens partake in while also showing the abuse they went through at the hands of the fandom that very well likely pushed them to these dark places. Of course bomb threats are never ok. Period. That's a sentence. But it's absolutely wild to me people can't just get the hell over whoever wins this dumb show. Drag is so much more than RPDR, it literally does not matter to go after people like this. So petty, so ugly. Who is to blame? Everyone to be honest.
I'd lean on James going way overboard. He lashed out at people who were actively trying to help (like Nina), and hurt Shea because... reasons? Because he was jealous? He was racist towards Raja - and you can say anything about Raja supporting Raven, call her out on it sure. Do not call her a monkey. Experiencing racism isn't a free pass to pay that shit forward. James got a cascade of nastiness from fans, yes, and he took it, weaponised it, and used it against his fellow queens. As if they have remote controls that tell the fans how to behave... Not only that but he went as far as threats of violence and worse - again even towards some queens. All because those queens had the *audacity* to be more popular and successful. Being abused is not carte blanche to become an abuser. We all have the power to stop the cycle of abuse, no matter what shape it takes.
@@beckstheimpatient4135 I don't disagree with you, James did some fucked up shit. As has the Vixen. As has Nina. But it does no one any good to just write them off as people and not critique and observe our own roles and the larger societal issues at hand in the grander scheme of things. That's not handwaving responsibility away. That's realizing these things don't occur in a vacuum. James definitely was a person who got way into his feelings too much and did some bullshit (I say was because he appears to have grown and is not someone I keep tabs on so I don't feel comfortable speaking on who he is in the present tense), and he was also the victim of a lot of ugliness and systematic hate that has a negative impact on people and their psyches, especially over periods of time. Brushing what he went through under the rug of 'other queens had the audacity to be more popular' is the kind of narrow vision I'm not into partaking in. Do you, but that's not me. I can have nuance in my life.
@@beckstheimpatient4135 I blame y’all! The fans who pushed someone to the brink with hateful comments and racism bc you felt a mediocre performer should have won. It’s obvious what caused James to act out, and blaming the victim will never fly with me!
@@beckstheimpatient4135 how come you see James "weaponizing" hate he got while justifying or seeing no problem with other queens or even people? isn't even more tragic how he received a lot of hate and threats that he failed to recognize the support and the light which is VERY human and relatable. We don't one take everything and everyone processes things differently just like you.
@@babyboi3 at some point you have to take personal responsibility or just step back all together, blame is never 100% on one party. That’s just weird to say
It's clear he DOES condone violence. The attitude and threats cross so many lines. It almost seems as if she has to whine about not winning, yet gaslight and almost invalidate those who do. Tyra, you're considered a star no matter what. ACT LIKE IT.
@@jamescartier8728 the video says it clear, Raven has two bottom placements and two wins, James had three wins and No bottom placements, it was clear that James is And will always be the rightful winner of season 2, has some of the shit Hes done gone too Far? Yeah! Some of the stuff James has said is not ok, but it’s undeniable that people like you try to invalidate him and paint James amd Tyra in a negative way
This just reaffirmed my dislike for Raven's attitude during and after her time on RDR. I was one of the fans who rooted for Tyra and she never deserved the vitriol she received
You don't get to harass someone for years and then chastise them for not making all of the right choices in how they respond to your harassment. People love approaching things from their calm, undisturbed state and say what is and isn't appropriate. However, those very same people who are portending themselves to be logical and rational in how people should respond in the face of adversity would suddenly realize they're just as capable of making irrational, illogical choices when they've found themselves alone in a fight for their life and sanity.
Maybe off topic, but I once saw Tyra perform on NYE in Orlando with all the other winners at that time. She did a Banks song and absolutely KILLED it. It was clear that most people weren’t familiar with Banks, regardless, people were lined up 20-30 deep to tip her on both sides of the stage and she WOULD NOT accept anyone’s tip. By the end of the song the MC was urging Tyra to grab her tips and she just shook her head and waved and refused. It was incredibly awkward and everyone in the theater was kind of looking around in confusion. The way she went about it was quite odd and I think it offended a lot of people.
Again, the thing with Tyra was never a matter of talent but of attitude and perception. As a fan of thr show since season one, I could see she was good but I just couldn't like her somehow. Always rooted for Juju and even Raven. When anyone tells Chad she robbed her crown, shw just goes "well sure, it was about time I got something" or something along those lines. But Chad's always been beloved. Tyra never really built that in the show or afterwards...
i don’t think it reflects badly on her that she did not want to accept her fans money. she isn’t trying to profit off her fans, at least in that moment
@@starseer73 that's not how you show humility and gratitude in the drag world lol. They're 1 dollar bills, take them. It's how people show their appreciation for a queen. In this context it almost sounds like Tyra didn't care for their appreciation. Maybe that's not the truth but definitely how it would have come across.
A very unfortunate story. Nothing can excuse James' behavior, but he really was dragged through the mood too. What's interesting is that it's usually just the fans who attack a rpdr queen. In this case it's largely fellow drag queens he had beef with.
James did great on season 2 and deserved the win. I never realized how badly world of wonder, Raven and the fandom discredited his win. And I think what Kylie Sonique said is really true: if you get a lot of hate, and you feel hurt and get no help, at some point you'd want to make other people know your pain and hurt them too. I don't want to excuse James' behavior and the mistakes he has made, he did do things that hurt people, however, (it's been commented before but) this is a clear example of how badly black queens from drag race, and actually all people of color, are treated (by the fandom) and dont get the appreciation for their art that they deserve. I think the video offers many good examples for that. One is that even tho Raven was catty and mean too, she did never get as much hate as James did. What's more, white folk have profited off of black culture for a very long time, like profiting off of black music like rocknroll, blues or soul music.; other example, Raven being very tan, enjoying the benefits for her darker skin look and at the same time having white privilege. And Sharon Needles not getting into trouble for such a long time for the things she's done. White ppl more often get away with the things they'd done compared to black people who cannot afford making mistakes without getting hate, being hurt or be wrongly accused and arrested. When it comes to blackfishing, Loni Love once said: "Everybody wants our rhythm but they don't want our blues". (Quote source): ua-cam.com/video/VMQ2wUS41TQ/v-deo.html I am not saying all white people are bad, ofc not, there are many allies too. We should just be aware of the white privilege. Idk man I just wish all of this racism would stop, but that will take a few hundred more years.
The fandom 100 percent has fault for many things that happened with Tyra, that is without question. No winner should be taunted and shamed for winning and no contestant, win or lose, should be getting death threats, harassed or have racial slurs thrown their way. That is inexcusable in any context. I will say though, that what Tyra has done and the way she acted BEFORE and after winning are all things that she needs to hold herself accountable for. Did Tyra deserve to win? Absolutely. Was Tyra an awful person on and off the show. Absolutely. Tyra was never going to be adored as a winner and maybe she thought she deserved that? She doesn’t, but she did deserve respect and that she did not receive in most cases. There are definitely a lot of people at blame for what happened with Tyra’s story, but Tyra is the one most a fault. I’m all here for her to come back, I’m all here to see Tyra grace that stage again, like the winner she is, but she has a lot of work to do before that can happen.
WOW's racism really shines in James' story and the way they just left him to the dogs after his season two win. I get frustrated with the fandom and production when they talk about him like "oh well it's really a shame he made the decisions he did and chose to act like that" like he was the one to abandon the show/franchise and not the other way around. His actions make total sense seeing as how he's been threatened and harassed by racist fans for over a decade now and has received no support from the show except for when they want to profit off of him AFTER not giving a shit about his situation.
While I agree with the WOW thing, James has had many opportunities to act differently, and yet he constantly decided to act out of anger and hurt instead of trying to learn and grow
don't know how it is racism when at the same time they were promoting other black queens. maybe they just didn't like james because he had a shit attitude.
They most likely saw the fan backlash and just wanted to sweep the season under the rug and started paying a lot more attention to how queens would be received by fans before crowning a winner.
They called her satan's baby and she played the character really well, Raven is racist and does black face and people eat her up, Sharon needles says racial slurs, wear nazi imagery for shock value and has assault allegations against her yet it's still successful so there really is a racial issue when it comes to the stereotype of angry black woman and the fandom plays into it, granted James is chaotic, but we can't just sit and judge someone's response to constant trauma, he clearly wants a redemption and world of wonder favoring Raven have taken that oportunity from him time and time again, when people get constantly rejected they resort to rejecting back as a defense mechanism, people expect victims to remain perfect and graceful because when they react and hit back siddenlt they diserve it and that's fucked up victim blaming.
The thing with Morgan was that the gig she was scheduled at and Tyra was going to attend was in honor of Morgan's birthday. So it would have been weird if Morgan herself cancelled.
Being reminded of stories like this just makes me not want to have any parts of this franchise. The racist, antagonistic nature of the RPDR fandom is just mind numbing. James f*cked up MANY TIMES but he was treated so poorly, from the beginning, that no one can ever claim he did it to himself. And Raven needs to stop this bull. She is a fashion queen, not a comedy queen, not an actor, not an innovator. She just doesn’t have enough tools in her toolkit to win the show. Sorry. And that old grindr profile is more than enough for me to pay her dust in perpetuity.
I love supporting the queens and witnessing their passion and talent but the fans of this show are downright toxic. Yes, I'm generalizing because there are lovely people as well but it just seems like such a majority of the vibe you get from the audience. Like it's such a telling thing that to lift a queen up, they have to bash another (usually to a poc queen which is unbelivably scummy and disgusting). I have moments when I want to stop watching altogether, especially when I see a "robbed" queen being perpetuated as a winner. All of these girls won whether they were the most 'deserving' in the fandom's opinion or not, in RuPaul's eyes they were the winner and that's an ABSOLUTE fact.
Thank god someone said this… this comment section FR was scaring me. His actions were terrible, posting a queens number, saying she’s dead, threatening the queens, etc. NO mental health issues can excuse his behavior
All the strange things James/Tyra has done through the years aside, it's not crazy to say that the fans' hatred and disregard for her (along with WOW and her castmates doing pretty much nothing to help) led her to that dark place. Kylie's words were spot-on: we created the monster. Imagine winning a competition on national television and having basically the entire fandom say you didn't deserve it? That would emotionally and mentally break even the most level-headed of people.
I completey 100% agree hence that's why i dont blame james for acting out i just dont agree with the WAY they went about certain things e.g treating shea like that or the death and violence threats most people wouldnt do those things however I don't blame them I just personally dont condone that no matter what however I agree Kylie is one hundered percen correct and so are you the way the fandom treated her was very uncalled for so I can't say I'm surprised james acted out i just wish they didn't do it in a way that damaged their personal connections further AND their career cuz who knows if they didnt they may have been able to come back for AS7 and had a rudemption from the fans just like the fandom was awful to Ra'Jah and then a lot of them realised their mistakes when the show actually showed Ra'Jah for who she is and not the villain archetype they put her in on s11.
He behaved horrible on the series. It’s all on him. Sure he deserved it, but his actions have consequences. Look at Phi Phi O’hara, the most disliked queen but she ain’t threatning drag con or being a fool.
This person is deeply unwell. It is actually quite sad to watch. That being said, you can't say you don't care about something, threaten to bomb an event and still be celebrated as an icon of said thing/event.
I find it interesting that the die hard "Raven was robbed" believers direct their hatred towards Tyra/James and not Chad Michaels at all. If Raven was "robbed twice", wouldn't you want to criticize the person who more recently robbed her? I don't defend any of James' actions, but I can definitely see how constant hatred and racism from a community that's supposed to be supportive for members of the LGBTQA+ community can damage his mental health and lead to lapses in judgement.
Because AS1 seemed to be nothing but a vehicle to give Chad the crown. Not to say that Chad didn't earn it, but Willam's "It's All Story Lines" song can apply to AS1 just as much as it does AS2.
@@belinus7180 That might be true, but the point I was trying to make was how both Tyra and Chad performed better than Raven on their respective seasons. And the queen having her win questioned by the fandom happens to be the queen of color.
I wanted Raven to win season 2 but I think James completely earned it. However, I do think she should have won all stars and there was clear favoritism for Chad. But either way, Chad and James don't deserve hate.
@@imascene20 I genuinely don't think it was due to James' colour, but more about the 'edit'. James got the 'bitch' edit, Chad didn't. Thats the root of the problem. The narrative was already set, which would fuel the hate train for James. Not to say that racists wouldn't jump on the bandwagon and treat James poorly, because we know that a portion of the fandom are really problematic and hateful, but Chad's edits have twice been positive. For this reason Chad got no hate.
I’m so sick of Raven. Didn’t like her in season 2, didn’t like her in Allstars 1, didn’t like her in DragU, and I definitely didn’t like her when she was freaking out at GRETA THUNBERG of all people. (Yeah that actually happened). She has some serious issues people have ignored for years because she’s just SO “iconic”. It’s really unfortunate that Tyra has gotten the brunt of the hate from season 2, when she was way less toxic than a lot of the other queens there (Morgan McMichaels and Raven in particular). It just goes to show that as long as you have a YT series where you say funny things about bad outfits fans will justify any of your past actions without asking for so much as an apology. YET shun another person for the SAME EXACT THINGS the “iconic” one would do. I’m really happy SOME PEOPLE are finally seeing her for what she really is at the very least. Bitter.
Tyra is one of the most beautiful queens I've ever seen. She went for the show for a reason, gave her all and brought the prize home for his kid. The fandom made her lose her absolute shit and it's very, very sad seeing a queen reaching those limits and we not even bringing it up anymore, specially with those disgusting 5 minutes Raven appeared on the All Stars 7 premiere just to say "I was robbed twice!" and "I won an Emmy!".
Can you imagine how bad she must have felt reading all the negative comments during S2. She probably left that show so excited that her life was gonna change for the better, just to be met with so much nastiness from fellow LGBT people none the less. Honestly fuck Raven she was 10X worse on the show and her continuous poking at Tyra isn't fucking cute when she knows damn well how badly the "fans" treat her
I don't think we can blame the terrible fandom fuly for her actions. It's clear she was a very rude person, throwing stuff at waiters, constantly threatening people with violence. I felt bad for her at first, but she's sounding terrible and disgusting. The way you react to hardships shows your true character. She's reacting with so much evil.
The “raven was robbed” fantasy is pure delusion(and a clear example of the fandoms racist antics, but that’s besides the point). Y’all may hate him but he ate the girls up plain and simple
it's literally the equivalent of "Katya was robbed" like, no she was not
Tyra really decimated the competition. Raven's fine, but like... Like her or hate her, Tyra did the damn thing.
Hellure!!!! Thank you!!!!!
This. She’s unlikable but she ate
James was never even in the bottom while Raven consistently underperformed until right at the end. And sure, James did have immunity but honestly, he probably wouldn't have lip synced even if immunity wasn't there. Snatch Game, Morgan and Kylie were clearly the worst and James got at least a joke in so I think he would've been safe over Juju and then the rock challenge, I still don't think he lip syncs without immunity.
That picture of her standing alone in her booth is truly heartbreaking. I can only imagine how awful she felt..
I agree that Tyra was mistreated by the fandom, that she's the rightful winner etc.
But also:
Be careful what you read into a picture. Do we know for a fact Tyra was all alone while other people were autographing?
Or did she just arrive at Drag Con?
Until it's corroborated we don't know what happened.
I know I wish I went that year because I definitely would’ve went to their both
@@dante6985 Great, well thought out comment. Couldn’t agree with you more!
@@scarlettroger1508 Thank you!!!
It's her own fault. She has made very aggressive and violent comments to other queens. Threats and violent behaviour should never be accepted. Ever!
Trya was only 21 when she won. When she was blasted for acting caddy at 21. Raven was in her 30s. Like how amazing is it to win at 21. I think she deserves more credit.
“Catty.”
@@pussycatbot Cady Heron
@@serebii666 caตตy
So was Tatianna!!
it just makes me side eye raven even more (i never liked her on the show, i liked her in combination with raja on that fashion ruview)... what 30 year old bullies a 20 year old?
Raven literally called Tatiana $hit and lied about it...and people praised it, but then those same people turned around and said Tyra was negative...made no sense.
People didn't praise Raven for calling Tati shit, Tati was also a fan favorite. We just find it funny that production used a clip of her saying exactly what she said she didn't say.
@@hgfhjhgcvjj6476yup . correlation is not equal to causation... take note gays
Everything about Raven in All Stars 7 rubbed me the wrong way. Specially, that they had the nerve to air Raven saying she was robbed twice, discrediting not only Tyra's win, but also Chad's. What has Chad ever done to deserve this kind of treatment from WoW? I found that so disrespectful.
....and the fact that Raven is fully a white person. Did you know that? Some people are just now figuring it out;
You need to wear the right shade of makeup for your skintone, dear.... otherwise, it could come off a little bit different for people when they see your real face.
Yikes
It's a drag show! Have you actually seen a drag show at 1am on a Saturday night?
i dont think its on WoW that raven said that and they kept it in. she said something shady so they used it for their reality show, i don't rly think its any deeper than that
@@JustTheWarningonly fellow white people think she’s anything other than a tanned white women. You guys just want to be outraged.
@@Undrconstshes just giving kourtney kardashian
Can we also acknowledge that Raven saying she was robbed twice is also disrespectful to CHAD MICHAELS winning All Stars 1.
She is so delusional
literally. there were six episodes that season and she was in the bottom for three of them. doesn’t sound robbed to me ☠️
@@gagatrondra8 lol I've not seen that season but that is hilarious
Literally. Raven over Chad Michaels? I can't see it.
@@gagatrondra8 her track record was fucking high low btm 2 btm 2 btm 2 and then the final 😭in what world
Listen, Tyra is absolutely problematic for reasons xyz, but if you're going to cancel her, you also need to hold Sharon accountable and cancel the hell out of her.
It’s actually insane how little Sharon’s problematic behavior is talked about.
@@jumanjilee8069 absolutely! The situations aren’t comparable. But both are not okay. Sharon should never be allowed anywhere near a RPDR/WoW production ever again.
Tyra is only a problem to those who are a problem themselves. Stop judging if you haven’t walked in those stiletto heels.
@@JohnPDern omg why??? What did Sharon do I’m not aware of?
@@FairchildV sharon has multiple abuse allegations + used the N word frequently + generally racist and shitty unfortunately
Raven was not robbed - she lost. Lol. Losing is something that we all need to learn to understand in life, especially when it’s losing something we care about. I feel so bad for James. Bullying is never the answer, and I hope his son is okay ❤️❤️
Whatever they say, if you have watched RuPaul's drag race from the beginning, it was no mistake that Tyra was the winner of season 2. I didn't really like Raven, loved Jujubee, but Tyra dominated them all the entire season.
PERIOD!! TYRA ATE THE GIRLS UP.
im shocked to find out ppl disagree. Tyra was just THAT queen. Raven isn’t a winner no matter what season you put him in.
Agreed, i feel like the whole "raven was robbed" thing was an internet snowball moment. i watched it back in 2017, but i didnt have any contact with the show outside of it and could see why Tyra won. Only after i finished season 6 i went looking for content for the show online, was shocked to see ppl didnt believe Tyra deserved to win, or that ppl liked Raven at all lmao
Yeah she ate, and the other behaviour? Reasons? Gurl, she's so full of hate
Sorry but do you think she was winning the challenges fairly? Because sorry, no.
One thing that I remember from that time is that his CHILD was receiving death threats by the fandom at some point. No wonder why he went nuts for all of this.
Wow. The fandom people doing that needs to be exterminated off the face of this planet. That is so evil... I get it why Tyra was the way she was.
Bro what did his kid do 💀💀💀 Fandoms make no sense sometimes.
Holy fuck
That's horrible!!
James also mentioned on HeyQween that apparently problems between him and Tatianna started because Tati was also speaking ill on Tyra’s child. Not sure how true it is but apparently production left that part out.
Watching James spiral is just horrific. Imagine constantly being told your proudest moment is undeserved and having to take it happily. Kylie has it right. James became the monster he is because he was constantly forced into that mold. So when he finally became that person, the fans suddenly acted all surprised about it.
Proudest moment? Their son doesn't live with them anymore... priorities, choices. Yeah it's pretty miserable watching the living embodiment of Alyssa's "the girl I knew they were." Even Jaremi made an effort to refocus their energy to something better, they never even won. Hope the kids ok.
You always have a choice no one forced her down that road she made that decision herself
Don't take back her autonomy and hold her accountable for the things she does
@@TheVincident. Im not saying he didn't do anything to warrant those. He did what he did and he was wrong a lot of the times. But we also need to understand that the fans drove a person to be this bad. The management also actively preferred Raven.
So if we are asking her to be accountable, then we better also understand that we are accountable for not stopping the hate or perpetuating the hate. It goes both ways.
I'm not even a fan of hers but I get how horrible it must be in that position.
@@Sabreeshuh by proudest moment i mean winning her season. She did that and we can't take it from her. Now imagine total strangers saying the bitch that didn't do so well deserved it better.
Jaremi had an advantage of not being pitted against a popular queen like Raven with the backing of the management.
Just because Jaremi was able to survive doesn't mean James and his suffering is anything less than horrible. Both can exist at the same time.
He behaved like that even before he was a winner, though. Tatiana's "choices" catch phrase was a counter to his instigative behavior back then, bc even then he was blaming others for his own "choices"
Finally someone that aknowledge that Raven is a deeply narcissic toxic person!
The gag is raven hates what they sees in others that is actually how they are.. Calling the winners losers and saying they would never be a star.. It was all projection of the fact they didnt know how to deal with rejection.
Can't stand raven
Raven is a really rude person. I only watch her and Manila because I like Manila. I never could stand Raven because her attitude is garbage. She didn't win so she tries to knock other people down.
@@kkibelaplease just say he or she. They is confusing when its referring to one person
@@nando9195It's not confusing at all. You'll get it eventually, sport!
James( Tyra) is truly a special case because they are the only winner that was NEVER celebrated by the fandom.
Also I spent years thinking Raven was Latin American when they are fully white( Russian to be exact) 🤨
Yes, fully a white person. Does that NOT count as blackface...?
What is the term for when white people wear dark makeup all the time so as to come off as a different race?
@@JustTheWarningblackfishing
Omg I also didn't think Raven was white
Being latina IS being white, or black, or asian. Latina is not an ethnicity, just a location of birth, like being north american. Half of the victoria secret's girls are white latinas.
@@freakyfurkyshe is obviously white. White is melanin, not location of birth. If it was, nobody in america would be white as well.
It was really humble of Kylie to say that about Tyra even though she’s friends with Morgan, Kylie understood the situation Tyra was going through and we need more queens like Kylie honestly😔
i think that's just how Kylie is. congenial and compassionate, literally an angel
Nah Kylie is just a coward
@@Momofan69 wym?
@@Momofan69 you’re a fool
Kylie is the best, I adore her ❤️
Tyra is still one of my top 3 favorite winners along with Bob and Jinx...The way he sucked it up, performed and dominated when everyone was rooting against him was a huge sign of strength and it was great TV...
DOMINATED two looks every runway
Jinkx was my all time favorite on season 5 of Rupaul's Drag Race. He was never problematic at all throughout season 5, even when the others were trying to rile him up.
@@eileenmaclean3819 just a quick note, I'm pretty sure Jinx uses They/Them out of drag. No shade meant, just wanted to note that
Taste. Although I’d add Bianca Del Rio & Krystal Versace form the U.K. (I’m still obsessed with her) 😆
I’ll always say that the fandom made James who he is today. He ate season 2 up and was miles ahead of anyone else in that season
"the fandom made james who he is today" is sucha lame and lazy excuse, he's a GROWN MAN, no one is babysitting him, his own actions is his OWN, racism, death threats, and doxxing people, that's all on him.
@@ShimmySchimeon He was literally harassed for YEARS, and as this video stated season two had many bullies and while Tyra was immature and a jerk, but Raven was praised and her bullying came off as much more personal to Tatiana but Raven somehow got a pass.
Also the gay community has a serious racism problem and I’m not talking about dating preference but I live in a big gay city and I know many gay men who are very open about their racism.
I remember people making all kinds of mental gymnastics to disqualify Tyra’s dominate win. I was even in a gay bar and heard a dude complaint that RuPaul had a bias to black queens.
People like Sharon Needles always been horrible but they actually have support of the community Tyra doesn’t have that she used to be immature and petty but that was normal behavior for a drag queen but when a black queen does it people have a problem and go on attack.
@@TonySomething. Raven never got a pass, people tended to give her as much shit as they gave Tyra.
Not justifying the racist gays, but a lot of them have turned racist due to a large population of the black community has been very homophobic towards them, sadly hatred feeds hatred.
Anywho, Tyra is a lazy and immature and insane, I do not buy the whole "the fans made her" when she really didn't make most of her win and drag career anyways.
@@ShimmySchimeon Wow. Gay men tend to show their racism to other gays who are minorities and the drag race fandom is a great example of that.
Also during that time we still had democrats running around who was openly anti-lgbt this isn’t a black community thing, you’re literally trying to justify racism and then go straight to a stereotype about Tyra being lazy? Well that says a lot about the season 2 queens that Tyra by far had the best record.
And something tells me you wasn’t a viewer during that time because all the hate was on Tyra and most gay men are immature and so are many queens who came after Tyra and Tyra had the excuse of being 21.
I remember the argument from gays about young queens should pay their dues before going on the show, calls of racism for Tyras win and straight out racial slurs tossed around.
Your reality isn’t reality.
@@TonySomething. "this isn't a black community thing" obviously not the only thing, but your comments alone shows how little you know anything about it and how narrative your political sides are.
Fun fact; James/Tyra has the 5th best track record of any drag race winner of all time, so the whole "raven was robbed" is complete BS
She's the og fashion queen also, and this is how mental health effects people, miss Latina black poc princess raven has always been bitter hiding under rus shadow using the fracking oil as tanning oil. Envy Peru Bianca and Tyra are some of the best winners from drag race
@@onelove1446 OMG THIS READ
I've never understood the hype for Raven. She was catty as hell on her season, and although Tyra wasn't my favorite, she legitimately outperformed everyone else.
Never liked her either. She can paint, but that’s about the only nice thing I can say about her.
It's a matter of taste. I like Raven. Season 2 was a million years ago and lots of things have changed. Watching/reading her interviews changed a lot of people's minds. But it's fine since not everyone can like her. I don't mind James, but I do think he messed up. It's sad and upsetting tbh
Raven and raja are so overrated. They did fashion review so became fan faves and staples of the franchise- it’s just because of that.
@@r3drift uh huh right…are u 5?
@@zsazsagaborslap1020 no. Are you delusional?
'Raven was robbed' narrative was created to systematically fuck with James's psych. The whole situation has racism smeared all over it and it makes me sad.
I mean no it was not created specifically to hurt James, but people didn't stop even after finding out it hurt him.
i do genuinely feel awful for James Ross, especially since he was a father and had to face so much aversion. I hope his kid knows that their father was a superstar
The fact that queens who have SA allegations, racists, transphobes, or just disgusting queens that have been on drag race are still celebrated and not talked badly about them compared to James is wild. Ridiculous.
Its not wild! Its blatant racism that goes intentionally unaddressed on every level
Welcome to the fandom 🤷🏽♂️
So Sharon needles lmao
Who?
@@leonardoripalda4484 sharon needles
What they did with Tayra in that dragcon is humillianting, no one person have to feel that.
Ex👏act👏ly!👏
i dont understand it at all, if i saw tyra sanchez, one of the OG's of drag race, i would for sure go talk to her
That video of Tyra seated on a corner while answering questions breaks my heart 💔... You can see that people truly HATE her but she incredibly decided to stay for the fans! I completely understand her behavior to this point!
Idk exactly what happened but I was told tyra was banned from dragcon idk why but.
@@Mysticmoon62 She called in a bomb threat.
Raven can absolutely go around shouting from the rooftops that she was robbed in Season 2, it is when people like Raja and even the production team of Drag Race start agreeing and encouraging fans to agree that I see the problem. Hell, it can even just be something as simple as "yeah, you did really well, but she did better" or even brushing it off as a joke like "always the bridesmaid, never the bride."
When the production company involved sides with Raven, it cements it in the fanbases head that even WoW thinks Raven should have been crowned. It adds a layer of legitimacy.
I watched James' recent interview and it made me really sad. This is literally like watching bullying happen on such a mass scale. Terrifying.
I can see James's anger at Raja seeing that Raja has discredited his win on many occassions to please his friend Raven and with that indirectly sent their fans to hate on James..
It made me dislike raja for ages but I seperate her from raven now.
And, raja and Tyra filmed together, as former winners 🏆 when the season 4, final three girls, filmed a meet and greet, before their final competition.
People can be victims of others, while still being instigators themselves in other matters. Very few people are ever a “perfect victim”. He suffered horrible abuse from the fandom, was ignored by production, but also did things to hurt others, “joked” about shooting people and made allusions to a bomb threat, doxxed fellow queens, etc. The abuse he received in undeniably a reason for some of these actions, but in no way an excuse. I definitely feel for him, and feel the fandom definitely matured him into a monster of their own creation.
I disagree. No one gets to dictate how anyone reactions to BLATANT White Supremacy. He didn't owe anyone a smile for what they did to him. I'm disgusted by the people that point out anything except his treatment.
@@jckholmes9194 so threats of bombing, physical violence, and murder are totally ok with you? Got it 👍
@@kiwisoup So just because James made inappropriate jokes and lashed out at people who already had longstanding grudges against him justifies all the abuse and negativity he's gotten over the last *twelve* years from fans, fellow castmates, _and_ production? I see you.
Nobody's making James out to be some sort of fallen angel. He's just guilty for creating his own problems as much as the community he subjected himself to is. But the fact of the matter is James has had *NOBODY* in his corner ever since he became a public figure. Putting aside all the shade and "Raven was robbed" nonsense, fans have mistreated him for years. Production has now capitalized on his failures because it's more profitable to lambast him than support him.
And ignoring the racial component to the situation is ignoring the racism that's still present within the LGBTQ+ community. James isn't the only victim: The Vixen, Jaremi Carey, Asia O'Hara, Ra'Jah O'Hara, Widow Von Du, Brita Filter, Nina Bo'nina Brown, Kimora Amour, and countless other queens have had run-ins with racist fans. They've received death threats and slander online. It always seems like whenever a white queen or a favored fails to meet expectations on the show, a queen of color gets the short end of the stick. It just so happens that James wasn't just another black queen getting piled on... she was the first.
He's made his bed, but everyone else set it on fire the moment he laid down. And bitch, you're part of the problem.
@@PatrickCervantez It's not that fucking deep. You can be against his behavior while also being against the abuse from fans. Being against one doesn't mean you are for the other and using his treatment as a blatant excuse for why it's "okay" and justified for him to behave like this is such a bullshit take. People have been through worse and not taken the low road. You see me? I'm part of the problem? Sorry that I call it like I see it. You're the one turning a blind eye to bad behavior while also complaining about doing the same thing. Not a good look. You can cry racism all you want... Literally has nothing to do with what I said and I would 100% call out a white queen for the same toxic behavior.
@@jckholmes9194 Using that logic Sharon Needles gets a pass because of homophobia. Or do adults have actual responsibility for their actions??
I'm left handed in a right hand world. Do I have your approval to call in bomb threats to schools? I'm also queer, do I get to call in bomb threats to churches? Justifying shitty actions because it tickles your confirmation bias, is how evangelicals vote Trump.
it’s so obvious that james actually made a mistake when he didn’t know sasha, raja and raven are just so petty together and it’s so toxic
i want to love raja because of her campiness but they way she’s so two faced is horrible. She’s great when alone but horrible when she’s with someone else or in a group
@@joonlovescrabsliterally. I’ve come to realize she’s a really narcissistic person. Two things can be true at once, she’s a fashionista and an icon, but she’s also really rude for no reason other than selfishness. Like what she said about Michelle on all stars 7? Regardless of what Michelle said, which, again Michelle can be unjustly critical, she had no right to say the reason Michele is on the panel is because she’s best friends with Ru, and had the nerve to tell production they should fire her. Just pure pettiness and diva attitude
@@alexmuniz9286oh please he’s allowed to say what he wants and she’s allowed to feel however she feels. He doesn’t owe her anything while she can sit there and say whatever.
James became a monster due to how the fans treated him. I’ve read this quote saying, “People will notice the change in your attitude towards them, but won’t notice their behavior that made you change.”
That imagine of Tyra sitting alone at her booth is so sad. I don’t like how Raja egged the crowed on to clap for Raven when stating her alleged “robbery”
It was sad but you only get fans if people like you, and come on, she wasn’t very liked and her behavior didn’t helped…
She stole from the only fans she had like what
it is easy to see why.. if you show hatred .. why would you be popular?
i think it was just raja supporting her bestie.. we would've all done that if it was our friend saying they were robbed
I clapped!!! 👏🏼 let James burn. She’s sick.
Kylie is right, this is the culmination of years of abuse from fans. Doxxing someone is cringe, however.
I wouldn't hold that against James. Try to image what he went through; getting hate everyday and death threats. When you're literally afraid for your life, your reptile brain takes over instead of higher reasoning.... fight or flight. I'm sure most of us can't imagine how it feels to get death threats.
11:16 You saying "the bitterness" when the jumpscare of close-up-blue-eye-Raven appeared was way too funny to me
😂
I don’t understand how Tyra got all the flack for season 2 and Raven became the fan favorite
Sharron Needles has really gotten away with being problematic , I think a video is long over due.
Yes we need to sort this out cause there's so many receipts
Yep I have missed most of it so I hope they make a video. I wanna see the full extent of it and also so the fanbase could see it.
@Satday’s she has ties to WOW and they don't wanna lose gigs
@Satday’s she's just one of the popular queen's who do tours and shows for them.
@Satday’s yeah, maybe because Sharonne isn't this person that is currently being portrayed as? Like I don't know these people personally, i also don't want to make bold assumptions over anyone but this "through the grapevine" rumors about how Sharonne is super racist and super problematic somehow don't add up in my mind, mostly because how much support she's still receiving from her peers (including poc queens and other queens whom we would consider very racially and socially aware), even after becoming somewhat irrelevant compared to other queens. Why are many queens still actively supporting and befriending Sharonne if she is really that nasty? I'm sure she's not holding any sort of real power over their careers
The cartoon character you use for the fans never gets old.
Iconic
Where is it from? Its like I know it but then I don't
@@daanleguijt8763 It's a meme of a Pakistani fan wanting his team fumble at a cricket game. The bad play happens and the camera cuts to him. I love it everytime I see these videos because it's just such a mood.
*watching
i thought that that guy was also supposed to be him. like he had two avatars for himself TT
@@daanleguijt8763 ua-cam.com/video/LGtPkmEbiYA/v-deo.html
The picture of Tyra at her booth with no fans really makes me so sad. I would LIVE to see her at her booth if i ever went to drag con. She was so fierce on her season and I really do believe that it’s further evidence of racial bias within the fandom. I find Tyra to be a very pretty and fishy queen but I almost think there’s a racist preconceived notion in many Americans’ minds that black people, drag queen or otherwise, are inherently more masculine, including black women. White women are more dainty and feminine and while this is changing in a more positive way imo every season, I think that Tyra suffered being the target for a lot of the early toxic fandom.
I completely agree, the only reason I would even be intimidated by her would be how tall she is compared to me. Like if I met her standing up she would be like 2 feet taller than me (I'm a 5'6" woman) in those high heels and a glowing, stunning, fierce goddess. She's very feminine and likes dark colors. It feels like while people like black in fashion and feel like everyone needs a little black dress, as soon as you wear it as lipstick you are no longer feminine. But that's just my take on it lol
Even rupaul knew wot James was doing ...!!! When he super glued that white stuff to his leg during the wedding dress challenge was magic... and rupaul said so ...James did everything 4 effect... he played the game extremely well...he had to win!!!!
I'm an older fan, and I watched Season 2 when it first aired. Raven was an underwhelming queen. I don't remember much about her. I actually like Tatianna and Jujubee, but that's another conversation.
All I can say is that Tyra Sanchez did great in the challenges, and, for a long time, was the youngest winner. I understood shade and reading is part of the subculture of drag, so I didn't read too much into any of the goings-on with the show.
Same! Tatiana and Jujubee were so enjoyable that season. Tyra had stank face most of the time and Raven was arrogant. It was obvious that RuPaul loved Tyra and it was no surprise she won. This was the second season, and the second example, of RuPaul having a favorite who won over the fan favorite. The third season sealed it. Raja and her Heathers were mean girls and Raja winning felt like another example of Rigga Morris. That was the end of that format, with fans voting on social media to help determine the winner for season 4.
Social media is a cesspool and drag queens receive and create a lot of negativity there. At this point, it doesn’t matter who wins. Take that opportunity to build a fan base and keep your drama to a minimum. The queens with the best overall package of personality and talent will go farthest.
I personally got into drag race pretty late because it wasn't airing in my country (until Netflix brought it around season 11 I think) but when I learned such a show exists (right before season 9 started) i found a pirate link and started from season 1. I had no contact with the fandom at the time, nor any info on any BTS, but i remember thinking how much raven grew on me during the course of season 2, and how I felt like she should've won over Tyra and somehow the true queen wasn't chosen. What I'm trying to say is when I watched this season I was pretty much unaware of everything about the rhetoric around the show, the queens themselves or their relationships, yet it seems that i still had the same thoughts and feelings as many other fans. This to me shows either there really is some basis as to why people thought raven is robbed, or (more likely) the show was edited in a way to make us feel a certain type of way. Just some thoughts
Same. Like Raven was ok I guess. But if I think of S2 it's the Jujube show.
Lol you’re the problem . In what world did Tatiana do better than Tyra? You’re a joke !
Raven is extremely overrated. He struggled in many challenges on S2, lacks heart. Jujubee should have won, hands down, but could not with the clothes she have had :D
I hope RPDR does now med checks on the contestants, with focus on mental health, why Tyra definitely is not healthy.
Oh yes, I know this one is going to do well
Its always nice to see you 💚💚
My kings supporting each other 💚
top 10 anime crossovers.
number one:
King
all i can say is i hope james gets some happiness and peace and time with his son. this is one of the darkest stories to come out of drag race and i’m glad this video put some more nuanced light on him
Great assessment of the situation GreenGay. It was very fair, and I'm so glad you brought up how nasty Raven was on season 2. Her fat shaming of Mystique was woeful. No one ever brings that up. Truth is reality tv feeds off all the off-air drama, where the queens are purposely pitted against each other. Some young queens are too immature or have no experience in how to deal with social media and the public. In the days before social media, a reality tv star would often be forgotten after airing. Sometimes it seems that regular season winners are overlooked, because they don't get a second go at winning new fans on All Stars. Of course this was before All Stars 7. Queens are so reliant on the Drag Race franchise to make a good career from their art, that it has too much power over them. If only more queens don't have to rely on the franchise to make it.
Both Raven and raja were bullies on their seasons but they are not black so get a pass. Black characters on ru will always be demonized if they even show a tiny bit of bitchiness as the white fandom will paint them as monsters.
Could you make a video talking about the racism in the drag race community? I think it would really enlighten a lot of people about the micro aggressions made towards queens of color.
Yes please, I would love this. Racism is so widespread in the drag race fandom and people act like it isn’t. I hope we can bring more light to this.
This is a 40 minute video and your comment is 4 minutes old. Watch the video and if you want to make your own, do it. You’re pushing a narrative that everyone hates drag queens because of their skin color and in reality, there are other reasons. Bomb threats, sexual assault, and using drugs around minors aren’t exclusive to a race or profession.
Yes definitely! I’d also love to know about those micro-aggressions and if there are any I may be unknowingly perpetuating so I can avoid that.
especially after allstars 7, the way the fandom acted as if every black winner basically didn't deserve to be there, and then how the producers edited them out of their own lipsyncs for a fixed win. the entire system is broken tbh, but the producers have always been a table of white people
@@georged366 some I’ve seen are ones like undermining queens of color, and only giving queens of color their flowers when it comes at the expense of another queen of color.
I can’t remember where, but I once saw someone comment that Raven is lucky she has a newer generation of fans who probably haven’t seen her on Season 2.
If we look at Raven and James only during their season, I think Raven was far worse;
James was loud, bratty, and annoyed a lot of people, but what did he do that was hurtful to others?
Raven on the other hand was incredibly hurtful. She was fatphobic towards Mystique and was extremely nasty towards Tati on numerous occasions. And let’s not forget how she would often dismiss the talent of others just because she was bitter she didn’t win the challenge.
I’m sure Raven is a much nicer person now, but I’ll never call myself a fan of hers.
Raven was awful and totally ignorant and a bully for NO REASON BUT JEALOUSY towards Tatianna. She was so HATED thereafter she cancelled all her social media!
I agree 100%
Bear in mind I like Raven a lot more now but her behaviour was worst than Tyra’s/James by a mile. That group Raven, kylie/ sonnique, Morgan all used to be bitches
Everyone was very catty in season 2 but Raven was the worst out of all of them! You'd think Tati murdered Raven's family prior to the show with how Raven treated her
Are people not allowed to just not like either of them? Why does it seem we are forced to like one or the other but not both or neither? It seems the second you say you don't like Tyra, you are automatically put in the pro Raven box.
Also how she treated Nicole Paige Brooks
I cannot imagine the sheer amount of vitriol that James received after their win over Raven in season 2. I hope people realize James is also a person and he deserved grace and compassion when he was sharing his experience with the fandom post drag race.
Raven was robbed was pushed by Michelle Visage. In her interviews she was saying if she was a judge on season 2 she wouldve pushed her to win. Thats also when raven and juju would be pushed in front of everyone. Terrible.
I love how shea texted him privately unlike others
Tati texted him too. Then he leaked her number.
@@hgfhjhgcvjj6476like hello, people tend to forget!
That picture of him being at the booth with no fans is heartbreaking. He has done some bad things and there is no excuse for them but its also sad how the fans have treated him. Really hope he gets a second chance (if he wants it) and he can be involved in the franchise again.
Sitting alone in the VIP only make it depressing
@@beandrag9019 Sad story all around.
Bad things, what bad things has he done ?
@@kachi2782 Bomb threat? Threatening violence on other people? Did you watch the video?
@@Blazingredfire13 Non of her comment imply a bomb threat, she never used the word bomb, she never told people that their lives were at risk. Yup she came for some bitches who talked shit about her, and so what, aren't you allowed to defend yourself when you have been systematically targeted by everyone ? Did she actually attack anyone physically, did anything exploded, did anyone go to the ER, NO. So where is the vilolence ? Verbal ?
Are you really so freaking thin skinned that you can't get over a tweet.
Welcome to the 21st century, if you can't take the heat, get off the internet !
I had the chance to meet up with James 10 years ago multiple times he's a very calm and quiet guy very polite I saw how other drags treated him very unfair and rude multiple times Is so unfair.
i mean. tyra ended up being right about raven's racial stuff 100%. now everyone jokes about raven's blackfishing for example, but not everyone was prepared to acknowledge it back then
"Nobody was killed?" makes me love Derrick more every time I hear it
Wilam calling it out asap without batting a lash is what gets me🤣🤣🤣
i have been seeing more and more fans and queens (like bob) wanting to see James redeem themselves on an All Winners Season. which in all reality would be an amazing comeback/reintroduction to fans as Tyra Sanchez on why she won season 2 (look what it did for Raja and Jinkx). having bob on the same season as Tyra as that support system would be an amazing storyline too
I feel like of course that would spur hatred from some fans but maybe in the end they will realize how that could work out
I think that would be an amazing idea. She would be competing with other winning alumni who have been consistently working and traveling perfecting their drag to levels it has never been before, and with that experience has come huge financial gains for most of them in one way or another. To be invited to an all winners season she would seriously need to have already stepped her "pussy" up and come with THE drag war chest to compete with the rest of them on every challenge since nobody's goes home.
Wouldn't that be something!? To have James return on All Stars All winners 2 and win???
the bitch retired and is happy with his own family, living his life, under his own terms, give the man a rest.
Omg 😮 I’d love them to both compete on the same All winners season especially as BOB has been very vocal about his love and admiration of Tyra and also Bebe.
Raven is one of the least likeable queens on the show. Better for her to stay behind the scenes doing Ru's makeup. I feel bad for James. Yes the "fandom" were brutal but until watching this video, I didn't realize how much Rupaul's Drag Race poured gas on the dumpster fire. The show did James dirty. It would have been nice to see Tyra more after the win than having Raven and Jujube shoved down our throats.
Tyra never really got to enjoy her reign as the queen because Raven kept saying she was robbed of the crown but then simultaneously robbing James of a happy reign by putting herself at the center of attention EVERY SINGLE TIME! Yea she may have been a more likeable character for the production but James definitely deserved the win and is getting faded out because of shady people and James never backing down from a fight. That’s the love/hate thing about James that I have. Some things are not worth the fight but James does it anyway! But anyway. I’m still team Tyra Sanchez/ King Tyra/ James Ross! She’s the only queen I haven’t seen as much after their season and it’s sad and heartbreaking. I hope for a better future for James.
To this day I will ALWAYS defend James as the winner of season 2! Raven was NOT robbed she was just outshined 💁🏼♂️
No ones talking about how much raven HATED not being the star... Her vitriol was an ever present thread that to my mind actually made raven the villain.. that last moment when raven essentially cursed tyra "youll never be a star" was particularly disgusting to me and really sealed her role as the evil queen to tyras (immature) snow white .. i knew them the fandom was racist.
"I don't think you're seeing that Tyra is a complete bitch." God bless Tatiana for that iconic quote.
Pretty sure all the girls said that about Tyra the entirety of season 2.
@@MegaKromatik Not Raven. Morgan actually said it, remember? Tyra was paid full for the cancelled performance too.
it will for ever be one of the most iconic moments in television. Just what we all wanted to happen, did. That and "shoot for the moon because you will never be a star" or whatever horrid thing raven wrote in that mirror lol
Tyras scheme against Shea is so fucking funny and genius. Like a years-long plot to destroy this person because of a tweet they made? Camp.
its honestly hilarious, i respect that
James’ story is an example of how racism kills the spirit of Black people. As a fan from day I will always root for Tyra/James and give her the respect she deserves.
How ppl legitimately think that Raven should’ve won completely baffles me.
James did very well during the season and was the first winner to never lip sync followed by Bianca four seasons later and she beat Raven within the first few seconds of the song, while Raven STRUGGLED in the first half of the season and had already lip synced twice
I think (beside fandom racism) it's because of some of his behaviour. On my first watch I hated him, found him so annoying so I was blind to his talent. When I re-watched S2 the talent was undeniable, completely changed the runway game and did better in challenges.
Because track record doesn't always matter. It's Rupauls decision
@@twelvezeros till the switch to the lipsync smackdown format (s9) the competition was always won by the queen with the best trackrecord
I did back in the day. You have to remember this was season 2 not 14. I defiantly thought that Tyra was a "complete bitch" and shouldn't be a representative for a community. They even had the entire cast say it on stage too. Of course, as time goes on you can see that the show isn't a representation of a community. It's a reality show that uses and abuses its contestants like every other reality show does. I was rooting for Juju because, of the 3, I thought she would be the best representative for the community as a winner. Raven was also funny mean while Tyra was bitchy mean. It's easier to market funny mean than it is bitchy mean so it's easier to understand why they went toward Raven after.
i think the problem with a lot of fans shouldn't be with Tyra on season 2 but the format of the season. the fact people got immunity made it unsatisfying when a queen who did badly got a free pass, and in the end, had 0 bottom placements even if they were deserved.
Did James win s2? Undoubtedly.
Is the fandom opinionated, toxic, unfair, and racist? Definitely.
Has, however, James made some very VERY poor decisions on how to deal with that? Absolutely.
Does James deserve a second chance? Welp, we ALL deserve a second chance when we fuck up, but James has a LOT of work to do and a LOT of REAL apologizing to do first, like it or not. Second chances are earned, people, let's not forget that, and tbh he doesn't really seem interested in a comeback.
I agree. As much as is saddens me that James has had to deal with unfair outlashes, I have only seen him come back with vitriol and violence. The times when James was handed an olive branch, he chose to set it on fire instead of accepting it and trying to mend relationships. Any one of those times James could have been graceful, but no, there were many choices that James made, which were highly public, and it just painted a picture of high toxicity and that ended up painting over the picture of who we thought Tyra was, and that, to me, was the ultimate downfall.
I agree with all that you’re saying but to extend to your ending point I think the whole reason he doesn’t wanna come back because he feels that there is nothing for him to come back to he never had love from the fandom so it’s kind of like asking yourself why would you go back into a toxic relationship once you’re out of it and on that same analogy I don’t feel like he should apologize until some official apology from the show or other queens come out first acknowledging the harassment that they helped create in the fandom towards her asking her to apologize for the way she reacted to the racist fandom is almost like the vixen situation with Eureka. Like why is it that even the black queen that everyone seems to agree that has had the unfair treatment faster than make an apology to even have a conversation like she has to humble herself to the toxic fandom in order to even be heard that part doesn’t sit right with me
@@robbyrodriguez7099 First, thanks for your well-thought-out reply to my comment. As to why James should offer an apology first, I can only respond that whereas it is true that other queens and even the show did a fair bit to promote the whole angry-black-queen/Raven-was-robbed scenario, James was the one sending threats to other queens and causing Morgan's family stress and upset, and needlessly scaring a lot of fans with what wasn't a real bomb threat. I mean, ppl take their KIDS to DragCon and all James' warnings followed by the cryptic BOOM post, were far from amusing, assuming it was all just a gag/stunt. Which James, as a parent, should've understood. Like, we ALL pop off in the comments section sometimes, but I think threats of violence cross a line that production, and other queens, didn't cross. As to your other point about "why even bother", I actually agree with you there---I don't honestly see the point of mending fences at this point. Not only has the damage been done, but all this is looooong in the past, and imo best left there.
One thing i would say is, she had apologized a lot of times but never received one, she was always surrendering and then kicked more, we can sit here talk about her horrible life decisions but we could never understand the pain we gave her
He has apologized to a lot of the people who were at the event in which he threatened to bomb, the toxicity and racist hate towards him and his son for years took a toll on his mental health and stability along with the problems he had going on, he has been on a road to recovery since. He probably won’t be on drag race but I wish him the best and I’m glad he’s doing better
you should do a full video on davina de campo. i love her and i didn’t realize there was all of the bitterness behind the loss so i’d love to see a full video on her!
Tyra should participate in the next all winners all stars and win the whole thing. She is one of my fave Queens of all time. She's always been misunderstood.
I think James retired his drag after so much disrespect.
To quote the legend Shara Davenport "The bitch turned it" and nobody can take that away.
you give us the best drag race content.
I couldn’t agree more!
Ty! Although I love my fellow dragrace content creators as well, support all of us! Except for butterfraud 😉
@@GreenGayYT you, Bucy, Jackfed, Joseph Sheppherd, Mera Mangle, and Drag Detective keep me fed.
So damn detailed WITH receipts 🧾 love it
I’m so glad this comment section is kind and trying to understand his pov. I saw him live recently with a group of others and he was amazing. He gave me extra attention and honestly made my day! Truly I’m glad that he is happy enough to do drag again because he has had a rough life.
In terms of how Season 2 played out, James did legitimately win, but it was his behavior AFTER the show that damaged him. After all there are plenty of Queens of color that faced the same racism in the drag race fandom that still managed to spin straw into gold and didn't make threats or leak people's numbers or make false claims that someone was dead when they were alive
Ultimately the person responsible for James Ross's downfall is James Ross himself.
YAS
Agreed
Yes, exactly. Coming to your comment 1 year late 😂 but you cannot just threaten to b*mb an event, lay people out and doxx people like...lol he deserves respect, deserved his WIN. but c'mon now
Tyra Sanchez was the first example of how racist and delusional the fandom is.
As a "white passing" poc the racism that I hear on the regular from gay white people is right up there with Trump cultists. If they suspect I'm not white then I get fetishized, which is just as bad. I didn't get two advanced degrees to give anyone dick for cash. Nope.
Truth tea sis 😌
Racist and ableist
She was clearly have mental health issues in response to the harassment from fans, and people just took that and used it as evidence of why she's so horrible.
Not "this person is anxious and scared because they were continuously bullied and harassed because of their race, and it's making them defensive and unstable."
Just "this person is defensive and unstable," plus all of the related name calling and slurs (crazy, psycho, etc.).
I have seen other queens say the same kind of things about The Vixen or Tamisha Iman Diamond.
Mental health conditions are a reasonable response to systematic prejudice and discrimination.
Obviously we can't allow people having a mental health crisis to say and do whatever they want (like make possible bomb threats) because they could hurt themselves or someone else.
But we have to stop judging, shaming, and dogpiling on people who can be saved with understanding and the right help.
@@janeeyre1990 I love your analySIS
How is it racist? How? For saying you don’t like someone for how you perceived them based on what you got from a tv show?? Tyra always came off as cold hearted and rude, and maybe she’s not. Maybe it’s editing and over production but you can’t fault people for basing an opinion on what they have to go by. I only know how I see James act on tv and interact with people online and she seems pretty rude and nasty to me…..and that has nothing to do with her being a black queen. There’s a lot of queens thru the years that I don’t like based on attitude alone.
RAJA is a very friendly and approachable queen, she knows how to professionally interact with her fans in public. Raven on the other hand hmmmm.
raven is a rude white heffer, thats her brand
I've met Raven three times since her season and she has been so sweet and lovely every single time.
Raven is blessed to have Raja as a friend.
I have no doubt in my mind she's why raven had mellowed out over the years
@@pt5137 LMFAO 🤣
@@olivertwist69 In the words of the immortal Coco Montrese, “I’M NOT JOKING, BITCH!!!”
Raven was the negative one being a 30 year old queen she acted Tyra’s age. Tyra was 21 yrs old can anyone remember what being that age was like. Even Princess Diana couldn’t handle what she was going through at that age. Tyra was the real deal the epitome of a gorgeous queen. You are loved and hope your son Is doing well❤️
What The Vixen once said applied directly to many of the behavior towards James/Tyra: people wants to tell her how to react, but nobody tell Raven and fans how to act.
Honestly, if James was treated with respect and was actually validated by the fandom (and other queens) for his win in season 2, then he wouldn't have done or said many of those things he did in the future. I think we can agree that being told you're undeserving of something you worked your ass of to achieve, especially for years on end, that you would eventually break and say things that you don't mean after being provoked and have it constantly thrown in your face for years. By all means, were some of the things James said and did were terrible and he shouldn't have done it, but with receiving so much hate and racism over the years, and having to deal with Raven's "robbed" barrage as a popular drag queen, I can't imagine what James was going through for all these years having to deal with all of that. It's been over 10 years since season 2 and Raven needs to grow tf up and just accept that she lost (TWICE!) and stop throwing shade at James.
Exactly! These new girls obviously don’t know what was being said back then. I saw it with my own eyes. There are plenty (and I mean plenty) of celebrities who have said questionable and terrible things when social media wasn’t as huge, and as sensitive as it is now. People act like others don’t reach breaking points and say things out of pure anger. I’m sure Tyra regrets things she’s said but we cannot and will not ignore that she was treated like pure garbage after literally winning RPDR. It’s sad.
You can’t let others make you do or say bad things. He had a choice, and he choose wrong. His nasty actions has consequences, he made his bed, now lay on it…
We can’t say oh is cuz of the fandom, we all have a choose and his action were not right
@@Simbaninogaming so what do you have to say about Sharon Needles? Like you say all that but your silence on other queens' that have actually done damage is loud and clear. There is a reason why Drag Race has some of the most racist fans, what are you doing when faced with that?
@@pugdad2555 he silent bc he’s just an ignorant bigot. Theee ppl hide behinds comments that are clearly one sided. They bash one for being edgy whole praising another for doing the same. Never align yourself with a racist (Raven)
@@pugdad2555 not to defend the person you're replying to, but you don't know them. You don't really know if they called out Sharon or not, so you can't say as though it were fact that they're silent about Sharon's behavior. Because, honestly, I'm on the same boat with them when it comes to Tyra's behavior and I have shat on Sharon more than I have ever hated Tyra. Let's not make speculations, yeah?
You putting Serena Cha Cha in here when talking about some Rugirl's not getting fans at their dragcon booth was so SHADY 💀😭
IKR i laughed about 35 minutes lmaooo
Y’all are nasty
I think the fandom needs to re evaluate how we receive queens and not have ill will towards our non personal favs. We also need to be acutely aware of how we project racism on a queen’s behavior (bomb threats and personal threats of violence aside). Would love to see James return and I think the fandom should be given a second chance - NOT James - to show him proper love and respect for earning the title Next Drag Superstar.
Also do not forget that Michelle Visage breathed life into the “Raven was robbed” movement when she got on board in Season 3 and said she would have tried to influence Ru to pick Raven as the winner - and not Tyra. It’s one thing when a fellow contestant wishes she won, and it’s far different when a judge discredits your win. Mad respect and love for King James. Forever royalty, and Season 2 is still my all time favorite.
Tyra will always be one of the strongest Winner of the franchise. It is very unfortunate that so many incidents have happened and so many of them could have been avoided. I really look forward to the day she will be able to come back and nail the competition once again. She has so much to offer.
Love Morgan’s logic that saying Raven rightfully lost twice is disrespectful but saying that James didn’t deserve to win Season 2 isn’t.
You do an excellent job of showing the bad behavior some of these more controversial queens partake in while also showing the abuse they went through at the hands of the fandom that very well likely pushed them to these dark places. Of course bomb threats are never ok. Period. That's a sentence. But it's absolutely wild to me people can't just get the hell over whoever wins this dumb show. Drag is so much more than RPDR, it literally does not matter to go after people like this. So petty, so ugly.
Who is to blame? Everyone to be honest.
I'd lean on James going way overboard. He lashed out at people who were actively trying to help (like Nina), and hurt Shea because... reasons? Because he was jealous? He was racist towards Raja - and you can say anything about Raja supporting Raven, call her out on it sure. Do not call her a monkey. Experiencing racism isn't a free pass to pay that shit forward.
James got a cascade of nastiness from fans, yes, and he took it, weaponised it, and used it against his fellow queens. As if they have remote controls that tell the fans how to behave... Not only that but he went as far as threats of violence and worse - again even towards some queens. All because those queens had the *audacity* to be more popular and successful.
Being abused is not carte blanche to become an abuser. We all have the power to stop the cycle of abuse, no matter what shape it takes.
@@beckstheimpatient4135 I don't disagree with you, James did some fucked up shit. As has the Vixen. As has Nina. But it does no one any good to just write them off as people and not critique and observe our own roles and the larger societal issues at hand in the grander scheme of things. That's not handwaving responsibility away. That's realizing these things don't occur in a vacuum. James definitely was a person who got way into his feelings too much and did some bullshit (I say was because he appears to have grown and is not someone I keep tabs on so I don't feel comfortable speaking on who he is in the present tense), and he was also the victim of a lot of ugliness and systematic hate that has a negative impact on people and their psyches, especially over periods of time.
Brushing what he went through under the rug of 'other queens had the audacity to be more popular' is the kind of narrow vision I'm not into partaking in. Do you, but that's not me. I can have nuance in my life.
@@beckstheimpatient4135 I blame y’all! The fans who pushed someone to the brink with hateful comments and racism bc you felt a mediocre performer should have won. It’s obvious what caused James to act out, and blaming the victim will never fly with me!
@@beckstheimpatient4135 how come you see James "weaponizing" hate he got while justifying or seeing no problem with other queens or even people? isn't even more tragic how he received a lot of hate and threats that he failed to recognize the support and the light which is VERY human and relatable. We don't one take everything and everyone processes things differently just like you.
@@babyboi3 at some point you have to take personal responsibility or just step back all together, blame is never 100% on one party. That’s just weird to say
i hope everyone sees this and James gets the redemption he deserves
Idk about redemption or "deserves" at this point... The fan backlash he definitely didn't deserve but he just made everything worse.
It's clear he DOES condone violence. The attitude and threats cross so many lines. It almost seems as if she has to whine about not winning, yet gaslight and almost invalidate those who do. Tyra, you're considered a star no matter what. ACT LIKE IT.
1:00
Whoever thinks Raven was robbed is DELUSIONAL. James has one of the best track records ever.
Track record of what, anger and terrorism?
There’s a lot of delusion in the fandom and micro aggressions looking at you,@@jamescartier8728.
@@jamescartier8728 Delusion, convince yourself.
@@jamescartier8728 oh shut the hell up. It’s been 13 years. Get over it. Your fave lost twice
@@jamescartier8728 the video says it clear, Raven has two bottom placements and two wins, James had three wins and No bottom placements, it was clear that James is And will always be the rightful winner of season 2, has some of the shit Hes done gone too Far? Yeah! Some of the stuff James has said is not ok, but it’s undeniable that people like you try to invalidate him and paint James amd Tyra in a negative way
This just reaffirmed my dislike for Raven's attitude during and after her time on RDR. I was one of the fans who rooted for Tyra and she never deserved the vitriol she received
Still live for Tyra in 2023.... Still a star and would be all star, they don't want none
You don't get to harass someone for years and then chastise them for not making all of the right choices in how they respond to your harassment. People love approaching things from their calm, undisturbed state and say what is and isn't appropriate. However, those very same people who are portending themselves to be logical and rational in how people should respond in the face of adversity would suddenly realize they're just as capable of making irrational, illogical choices when they've found themselves alone in a fight for their life and sanity.
Maybe off topic, but I once saw Tyra perform on NYE in Orlando with all the other winners at that time. She did a Banks song and absolutely KILLED it. It was clear that most people weren’t familiar with Banks, regardless, people were lined up 20-30 deep to tip her on both sides of the stage and she WOULD NOT accept anyone’s tip. By the end of the song the MC was urging Tyra to grab her tips and she just shook her head and waved and refused. It was incredibly awkward and everyone in the theater was kind of looking around in confusion. The way she went about it was quite odd and I think it offended a lot of people.
Again, the thing with Tyra was never a matter of talent but of attitude and perception.
As a fan of thr show since season one, I could see she was good but I just couldn't like her somehow. Always rooted for Juju and even Raven.
When anyone tells Chad she robbed her crown, shw just goes "well sure, it was about time I got something" or something along those lines. But Chad's always been beloved. Tyra never really built that in the show or afterwards...
@@OzyEdoTorrealba agree 100%
i don’t think it reflects badly on her that she did not want to accept her fans money. she isn’t trying to profit off her fans, at least in that moment
@@starseer73 that's not how you show humility and gratitude in the drag world lol. They're 1 dollar bills, take them. It's how people show their appreciation for a queen. In this context it almost sounds like Tyra didn't care for their appreciation. Maybe that's not the truth but definitely how it would have come across.
A very unfortunate story. Nothing can excuse James' behavior, but he really was dragged through the mood too. What's interesting is that it's usually just the fans who attack a rpdr queen. In this case it's largely fellow drag queens he had beef with.
James did great on season 2 and deserved the win. I never realized how badly world of wonder, Raven and the fandom discredited his win. And I think what Kylie Sonique said is really true: if you get a lot of hate, and you feel hurt and get no help, at some point you'd want to make other people know your pain and hurt them too.
I don't want to excuse James' behavior and the mistakes he has made, he did do things that hurt people, however, (it's been commented before but) this is a clear example of how badly black queens from drag race, and actually all people of color, are treated (by the fandom) and dont get the appreciation for their art that they deserve. I think the video offers many good examples for that.
One is that even tho Raven was catty and mean too, she did never get as much hate as James did.
What's more, white folk have profited off of black culture for a very long time, like profiting off of black music like rocknroll, blues or soul music.; other example, Raven being very tan, enjoying the benefits for her darker skin look and at the same time having white privilege.
And Sharon Needles not getting into trouble for such a long time for the things she's done.
White ppl more often get away with the things they'd done compared to black people who cannot afford making mistakes without getting hate, being hurt or be wrongly accused and arrested.
When it comes to blackfishing, Loni Love once said: "Everybody wants our rhythm but they don't want our blues".
(Quote source): ua-cam.com/video/VMQ2wUS41TQ/v-deo.html
I am not saying all white people are bad, ofc not, there are many allies too. We should just be aware of the white privilege. Idk man I just wish all of this racism would stop, but that will take a few hundred more years.
Violet and James both get so much hate because of the way that they were portrayed on the show. It’s sad.
The fandom 100 percent has fault for many things that happened with Tyra, that is without question. No winner should be taunted and shamed for winning and no contestant, win or lose, should be getting death threats, harassed or have racial slurs thrown their way. That is inexcusable in any context.
I will say though, that what Tyra has done and the way she acted BEFORE and after winning are all things that she needs to hold herself accountable for. Did Tyra deserve to win? Absolutely. Was Tyra an awful person on and off the show. Absolutely. Tyra was never going to be adored as a winner and maybe she thought she deserved that? She doesn’t, but she did deserve respect and that she did not receive in most cases.
There are definitely a lot of people at blame for what happened with Tyra’s story, but Tyra is the one most a fault. I’m all here for her to come back, I’m all here to see Tyra grace that stage again, like the winner she is, but she has a lot of work to do before that can happen.
WOW's racism really shines in James' story and the way they just left him to the dogs after his season two win. I get frustrated with the fandom and production when they talk about him like "oh well it's really a shame he made the decisions he did and chose to act like that" like he was the one to abandon the show/franchise and not the other way around. His actions make total sense seeing as how he's been threatened and harassed by racist fans for over a decade now and has received no support from the show except for when they want to profit off of him AFTER not giving a shit about his situation.
Well said
While I agree with the WOW thing, James has had many opportunities to act differently, and yet he constantly decided to act out of anger and hurt instead of trying to learn and grow
don't know how it is racism when at the same time they were promoting other black queens. maybe they just didn't like james because he had a shit attitude.
They most likely saw the fan backlash and just wanted to sweep the season under the rug and started paying a lot more attention to how queens would be received by fans before crowning a winner.
They called her satan's baby and she played the character really well, Raven is racist and does black face and people eat her up, Sharon needles says racial slurs, wear nazi imagery for shock value and has assault allegations against her yet it's still successful so there really is a racial issue when it comes to the stereotype of angry black woman and the fandom plays into it, granted James is chaotic, but we can't just sit and judge someone's response to constant trauma, he clearly wants a redemption and world of wonder favoring Raven have taken that oportunity from him time and time again, when people get constantly rejected they resort to rejecting back as a defense mechanism, people expect victims to remain perfect and graceful because when they react and hit back siddenlt they diserve it and that's fucked up victim blaming.
The thing with Morgan was that the gig she was scheduled at and Tyra was going to attend was in honor of Morgan's birthday. So it would have been weird if Morgan herself cancelled.
While James’ actions cannot be excused, it’s also sad that he has been mistreated by the fandom to the point he quit drag.
Quit*
Can't wait for violet to do this
@@Cashcash08 can you but with life bih
@@babyboi3 huh?
@@Cashcash08 What will happen to Violet?
Being reminded of stories like this just makes me not want to have any parts of this franchise. The racist, antagonistic nature of the RPDR fandom is just mind numbing. James f*cked up MANY TIMES but he was treated so poorly, from the beginning, that no one can ever claim he did it to himself. And Raven needs to stop this bull. She is a fashion queen, not a comedy queen, not an actor, not an innovator. She just doesn’t have enough tools in her toolkit to win the show. Sorry. And that old grindr profile is more than enough for me to pay her dust in perpetuity.
Yup…That profile was particularly interesting
I love supporting the queens and witnessing their passion and talent but the fans of this show are downright toxic. Yes, I'm generalizing because there are lovely people as well but it just seems like such a majority of the vibe you get from the audience. Like it's such a telling thing that to lift a queen up, they have to bash another (usually to a poc queen which is unbelivably scummy and disgusting). I have moments when I want to stop watching altogether, especially when I see a "robbed" queen being perpetuated as a winner. All of these girls won whether they were the most 'deserving' in the fandom's opinion or not, in RuPaul's eyes they were the winner and that's an ABSOLUTE fact.
Bold claim that raven is a fashion queen😂
@@beandrag9019 literally 😭 tyra ATE the season 2 runway, her looks still hold up even by todays much more extravagant standards
Was the profile bad?
her alone in the dragcon booth got me in tears 😭
I SUPPORT him and always been(all winners included). James deserve another chance, who are we that cannot allow that and give even that to him.
You can feel bad for James and show him empathy and compassion. But at the end of the days, James' actions are just that... James' actions.
Period!🗣
Thank god someone said this… this comment section FR was scaring me. His actions were terrible, posting a queens number, saying she’s dead, threatening the queens, etc. NO mental health issues can excuse his behavior
fr! people justifying literal bomb threats are weirdos
All the strange things James/Tyra has done through the years aside, it's not crazy to say that the fans' hatred and disregard for her (along with WOW and her castmates doing pretty much nothing to help) led her to that dark place. Kylie's words were spot-on: we created the monster. Imagine winning a competition on national television and having basically the entire fandom say you didn't deserve it? That would emotionally and mentally break even the most level-headed of people.
I completey 100% agree hence that's why i dont blame james for acting out i just dont agree with the WAY they went about certain things e.g treating shea like that or the death and violence threats most people wouldnt do those things however I don't blame them I just personally dont condone that no matter what however I agree Kylie is one hundered percen correct and so are you the way the fandom treated her was very uncalled for so I can't say I'm surprised james acted out i just wish they didn't do it in a way that damaged their personal connections further AND their career cuz who knows if they didnt they may have been able to come back for AS7 and had a rudemption from the fans just like the fandom was awful to Ra'Jah and then a lot of them realised their mistakes when the show actually showed Ra'Jah for who she is and not the villain archetype they put her in on s11.
@@ASJattar I agree with your comment and also read it really fast without any pauses. 😅
Happened to trixie, viv and sasha and they didnt go insane. It was all on james
He behaved horrible on the series. It’s all on him. Sure he deserved it, but his actions have consequences. Look at Phi Phi O’hara, the most disliked queen but she ain’t threatning drag con or being a fool.
This person is deeply unwell. It is actually quite sad to watch. That being said, you can't say you don't care about something, threaten to bomb an event and still be celebrated as an icon of said thing/event.
Raven wasn’t robbed. Her track record wasn’t as good as people like to think. Ditto Jujubee (on every season she competed in).
I find it interesting that the die hard "Raven was robbed" believers direct their hatred towards Tyra/James and not Chad Michaels at all. If Raven was "robbed twice", wouldn't you want to criticize the person who more recently robbed her? I don't defend any of James' actions, but I can definitely see how constant hatred and racism from a community that's supposed to be supportive for members of the LGBTQA+ community can damage his mental health and lead to lapses in judgement.
Because AS1 seemed to be nothing but a vehicle to give Chad the crown. Not to say that Chad didn't earn it, but Willam's "It's All Story Lines" song can apply to AS1 just as much as it does AS2.
@@belinus7180 That might be true, but the point I was trying to make was how both Tyra and Chad performed better than Raven on their respective seasons. And the queen having her win questioned by the fandom happens to be the queen of color.
I wanted Raven to win season 2 but I think James completely earned it. However, I do think she should have won all stars and there was clear favoritism for Chad. But either way, Chad and James don't deserve hate.
@@imascene20 I genuinely don't think it was due to James' colour, but more about the 'edit'. James got the 'bitch' edit, Chad didn't. Thats the root of the problem. The narrative was already set, which would fuel the hate train for James. Not to say that racists wouldn't jump on the bandwagon and treat James poorly, because we know that a portion of the fandom are really problematic and hateful, but Chad's edits have twice been positive. For this reason Chad got no hate.
In my... untrained eye observation of the LGBTQA+ community.. racism is as big an issue as it is for the rest of America...
32:18
The fact that Raven is the same color as James, a person who is black is ridiculous. It just shows what Tyra said is true
She’s just such a shady person too, I don’t like how many opportunities she gets for as problematic as she is
Oh yeah, her at the start of Season 7 All Stars made me do a double take. It feels wrong.
@@bib4eto656 exactly. W.O.W knew exactly what they were doing by doing that.
How did Raven develop a darker complexion? No shade just curious how it occurred sun tanning? Makeup?
@@stephenpmurphy591 probably both
I’m so sick of Raven.
Didn’t like her in season 2, didn’t like her in Allstars 1, didn’t like her in DragU, and I definitely didn’t like her when she was freaking out at GRETA THUNBERG of all people. (Yeah that actually happened).
She has some serious issues people have ignored for years because she’s just SO “iconic”.
It’s really unfortunate that Tyra has gotten the brunt of the hate from season 2, when she was way less toxic than a lot of the other queens there (Morgan McMichaels and Raven in particular).
It just goes to show that as long as you have a YT series where you say funny things about bad outfits fans will justify any of your past actions without asking for so much as an apology. YET shun another person for the SAME EXACT THINGS the “iconic” one would do.
I’m really happy SOME PEOPLE are finally seeing her for what she really is at the very least. Bitter.
Tyra is one of the most beautiful queens I've ever seen. She went for the show for a reason, gave her all and brought the prize home for his kid. The fandom made her lose her absolute shit and it's very, very sad seeing a queen reaching those limits and we not even bringing it up anymore, specially with those disgusting 5 minutes Raven appeared on the All Stars 7 premiere just to say "I was robbed twice!" and "I won an Emmy!".
Can you imagine how bad she must have felt reading all the negative comments during S2. She probably left that show so excited that her life was gonna change for the better, just to be met with so much nastiness from fellow LGBT people none the less. Honestly fuck Raven she was 10X worse on the show and her continuous poking at Tyra isn't fucking cute when she knows damn well how badly the "fans" treat her
Raven has an emmy. Sheesh. Stop trying to promote James .. who said he hated being on drag race.
@@twoboysmom7423 You lost the entire point of the video + I have a right to have and verbalize my opinion. PERIOD.
@@twoboysmom7423 go away and stop hating on POC
I don't think we can blame the terrible fandom fuly for her actions. It's clear she was a very rude person, throwing stuff at waiters, constantly threatening people with violence. I felt bad for her at first, but she's sounding terrible and disgusting. The way you react to hardships shows your true character. She's reacting with so much evil.