Thanks to Skillshare for sponsoring today's video -- The first 1000 people who click the link in the description will get 2 free months of Skillshare Premium: skl.sh/eckhartsladder7
@EckhartsLadder the difference between mazers and laser cannons is that while laser cannons fire super heated plasma, mazer fire a mix of projectiles and chemicals. Due to the certain types of chemicals used most mazers fire a blue bolt of energy rather than the usual red or green one.
Eck, Maser = Microwave Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation. So that literally means it's the proper name for a "Microwave Laser". Also if you swap out Microwave with Light you then have the term laser is an acronym for.
There was a funny episode in TNG with a Han Solo like character and small fighter craft attacking the Enterprise D with laser cannons. Shields were staying at 98% and Picard and Riker smirked at the attack.
@James Studholme I mean it wouldn't destroy/sink the whole ship (just like in real life) and the bridge is a tiny target from the front where it's being blasted by hundreds of ion cannons and turbo lasers so ISD for the win?
''Noo, you cant kill heavily trained soldiers just with stupid primitives dwarves!'' ''Haha, Goo ewoks, gooo brrrr'' I mean, tbh the missile Luke Threw shouldnt have impacted if not for the force; it was needed a parable for a missile to go to the reactor. Also maybe it was neccesary for refrigerate such an enourmouscanon. The true stupidity was having the death star (And that hole) undefended with Turbolasers, TIEs and starships...
@@ledanoir1239 The empire seems to be allergic to point defense, which is a problem if your greatest enemy primarily relies on high quality starfighters.
@@ledanoir1239 Ironically both are loosely based on a real story. I mean, skipping an unguided bomb through a maze of barriers just to have it sink to the base of a dam for sufficient effect...makes the trench run look straight forward. And jungle warfare sucks.
the cannons on the invisible hand and Venator class ships have what look like artillery cannons and this is also shown in the clone wars series so basically, some ships like the Venator and some of the cis ships have broadside artillery cannons with autoloaders mounted with them inside the sides of the ship and if you've watched the clone wars movie the republic artillery cannon looks striking-ly similar to the one shown in star wars episode three in the broadside scene and this also includes the cis heavy artillery cannon used during the clone wars seen in the clone wars tv series they look very similar so my guess is they just slapped a bunch of artillery cannons with autoloaders on the sides and bam they have broadside cannons
well the CIS weapons in the TV series were mentioned to be „Proton Canons“ by the tactical droid who was tasked with defending this city on Ryloth and they were used as Ground to Air weapons
@@willemthijssen5497 Do AV cannons seem like flak cannons? Mass Driver weaponry is similar to Porton weaponry, but it's still not the same. Wookiepedia sometimes uses outdated sourcebooks or gets stuff wrong. We know from a few pre disney medias that AV cannons are Artillery cannons, as well as proton firing. And those are for sure AV cannons.
I've always thought that the cannons on Providence in Rots uses these "projectiles" only as a way to store the gas and energy. By that I mean that the canons there doesn't have their own source of gas/energy, so they are cheaper, and instead everything comes in these, let's say cartridges, which can be refild once the battle is over
I agree, it's also a great safety measure. If they are using Tibanna gas to create the plasma, then the question is why not just hook up a hose to the gun so you can feed gas directly into it? But imagine if the gun takes a hit? Any gas that can easily be converted into plasma is highly energetic, meaning that it will probably ignite quite easily if handled wrong. So if the battery is hit, then the fire might just flash right up the hose into the main gas storage area and then BOOM, no more ship just because a single gun emplacement was taken out. By separating the gas into individual canisters that have just enough gas for a single shot each, the risk of a violent chain reaction is dramatically reduced.
I agree with that, because you can clearly see, that the cartridges look the same, on the storage system and also after being ejected by the cannon after the shot. Usually you just see an empty cartridge with a missing projectile, if it would be a projectile based weapon. Same for the cartridges on that Venator.
It could also help alleviate some of the demands on the power generation needed by the ship. If you have two ships built the exact same except for one using this canister based system for the cannons on the ship, and another using directly generator wired cannon systems, than one of these will have a much higher power consumption to the other design as well. Even if you have it that these canisters can be refilled either with power from the generator or gas from a reservoir one ship will have more excess power to use(like for shielding) than the other. I mean I wonder could you stress the power systems of a ship via dumping a lot of fire on the shields causing a power shut down as the power needed to sustain the ship is exceeded by both the demands of the shields an weapons firing during a combat, if so than using canister based feeding system to power the weapons would help to take pressure off the power system of the ship.
Is it just me, or did they evolve and then devolve? At least that’s the way it looked in the thumbnail. Also, best part... 09:55 because I love the outros with the dog lol Also also: Eckhart, looking forward to having you on our podcast!
4000 years before Endor: lasers on wedge shaped ships Battle of Endor: lasers on wedge shaped ships 130 years after Endor: lasers on wedge shaped ships Space warfare technology is really stagnant in SW universe, isn't it
I think those Providence weapons are just a different type of turbolaser. Instead of being directly powered by the ship, they just store the energy/gas/etc. in canisters.
Which in combination with earlier parts of the video implies that the Chiss use what is (probably an improved version of) ancient technology for the majority of the Galaxy. Since Masers have been replaced by "Lasers" and "Turbolasers" (both probably uses lasers to turn the tibanna gas into plasma while the actual weapon fires plasma).
I really like the Venators twin turbo lasers, focusing more on penetration than shear power sounds much better, though I would have made it a quad barrel for better power output
leon fierce though the Imperial turbo laser pairs make a little more sense for multi role purposes as the barrels have less space between each other. This would mean the trajectories of the bolts would be much closer together than on the venator, permitting them to be used for several roles such as their main anti capital ship role and also against star fighters.
#askeck On the level Regret in Halo 2, Cortana says that new structures are built around older ones to protect and honor them. Were these old structures built by humans, or did the Forerunners get better at building ruins?
Hey Ecks, I remember reading somewhere that the plasma weapon shells on the CIS ships actually held the gas used as the projectile, not a solid projectile.
Apparently the Providence Class had batteries based off of J-1 Proton Cannons, which themselves have been inconsistent within Star Wars the Clone wars (During the Ryloth Campaign they were shown to need to be reloaded after every shot, where as during the opening of the second battle of Geonosis, they were seen to fire far faster and without any apparent need to reload). But I always took it as just a slugthrower-style weapon, a solid projectile encased in energy for maximum damage, and stored within Shells.
8:18 -sh Maser= Microwaves Amplified by Stimulated Emission of Radiation Basically it's like shooting someone with the business end of a Microwave oven on crack...it would make them explode messily as their water and fats would boil...but I could be wrong
Somewhat right but also slightly wrong. Masers cam about before lasers (Lasers were originally called Optical Masers but that wasn't popular, so the LASER acronym was made). Sci fi tends to make them radioactive death beams but Masers are actually much lower power than a Laser, especially Gamma Ray or Ultraviolet Lasers. Sadly the Maser is a pretty boring weapon, its actually used in communication much more and is often used as in clocks. That's not to say you can't hurt someone with one that's powerful enough, a Maser at extreme power can blow up fruit (they've done that before) so im guessing at star wars level power they could instantly blind someone and start to melt whatever it is they touch, just know that compared to the actually frightening Gamma Ray Lasers and Ultraviolet Lasers the Maser isn't as frightening or powerful.
@@crashfan6443 Actually a melta (which the 40K lore specifically says work using microwaves), lasguns still use visible light wavelengths. Also masers have famously been used to combat Godzilla (with varying levels of effectiveness).
For my capital ship for me or my main fleet, I would have the ships have weapons based in their size, corvettes would have mainly ball point defense quad lasers for star fighters and missiles for anti capital ship combat From their, bigger ships will have 30 percent quad heavy and medium turbo lasers, 50 percent ball point defense quad lasers, 15 percent ion cannons, and 5 percent missile launchers Instead of shear power, we have flexible, intuitive, and multi role armament for any battlefield
leon fierce Good for a large scale general fleet, however if you were to encounter a fleet that had hyper specialization they would wipe the floor with overwhelming power if your fleet sizes were equivalent. Balance comes in different forms
Mimu Mi what about for star fighter defense, remember, if I can launch fighters to overwhelm you, including droid fighters I could have just crash into the ship to cause damage, then I just need to last long enough for the fighters to do my job, NOW checkmate
Honestly I wouldn't fully know what I would need. However I would like to have my larger capital ships to have modular components if I had the means or resources to do so. Have an as much of varied arsenal as possible which further increases flexibility while still having specialized screening ships and some specialized capital ships to make sure I have enough fire power both offensive and defensively. Mass drivers are still good have as a back up weapon or use when enemy shields are disabled or destroyed and turbo lasers are on a cool down cycle that you can maximize damage output and having missile defensive systems are good at thinning out enemy fighter and bomber formations at longer ranges. As using guided missiles at close range could be hazardous to own defensive fighter screen or smaller screening vessels . But that would make it easier for the flak guns and your own fighters since the enemy strike fighters and bombers would be dispersed and less organized making for easy targets to pick off. And just have one or a few massive Dreadnoughts come built in with a super laser just say don't fuck with me if you do this what I can do you. Keeping them in reserve while still keeping the crew battle ready when called upon. Because unlike the galactic empire I want as few enemies as possible so I am not just gonna go around destroying planets. I would use them deter the enemies that I do have will instilling confidence in my allies that I have their back. While at the same time making every pirate within the sector regret their chosen profession. Now most I could do that with Star destroyer sized ships. But having a few dreadnoughts for just in case scenarios is good have. I know they are expensive and not practical but sometimes it better have something and not need than not having something and needing it. And Like old sheev himself I enjoy having my big toys to even its seen as compensating for a lack of something to but do I care no i like big ships that shoot lasers that instantly delete enemy warships lol.
Guys guys, for this, I’m working on a fixed budget, meaning no specialized weapons like super lasers unless we’re talking about the Venator style one, no heavy missile platforms, and no super weapon style weaponry with that in mind, I chose this because instead of overwhelming firepower, I prefer having flexibility and intuitive vessel since I would be able to use these ships in about any fight, and to save on cost, crew and money, all my ships weapons would be controlled by my ships weapons bridge, which is built into the ship while the main bridge maneuver the ship
It would depend, as Eckhart did say in another vid that the Empire had one of the best special forces units. death troopers are stronger than you give credit for
What about Mon Cala Turbolasers? I've heard somewhere that they are capable of hitting snubfighters because of far superior tracking and targeting ability.
I believe the mon calamari are just known to have more advanced technology when it comes to ship (and ship armament) building compared to the rest of the galaxy
No they are the projectiles being fired. They are described as particle cannons. Sometimes called flak-guns and being mistaken for point defence but being mounted broadside like this, they aren't.
Well, flak cannons are used as an anti- missile defense. In the table top RPG, enough flak firing between ISD will dust their own Ties and cripple any Rebel fighter flying through the flak cloud. Best part is capital ship shield and armor can easily soak up that damage with no problem. In D&D it is called Mimi- Max damage effect.
I can imagine flak cannons being used offensively, a real world historical analogue would be the German 8.8cm FLugAbwehrKanone from which we derive the word flak, these were primarily anti-aircraft guns but proved to be so effective in the anti-tank role that they were fitted on to tanks such as the Tiger. The allies also developed their anti-air guns into tank killers, the US M26 pershing and the m36 tank destroyer used the 90mm gun m3 which was originally an anti aircraft gun.
Ponen Longchar well they were given AP shells for combat so they kinda knew that those things could do some work. I think military history visualized made a video on it
The way I saw the "Invisible Hand" guns where more like "turbo blaster": Each gun needs a shell in it that acts like a blaster magasine, so offers the gaz and energy to shoot, making the weapon less or potentially not dependable on energy from the main ship. At the cost of shells. Probably goes against some explication somewhere, but that was how I analysed it the first time I saw the film.
IIRC the projectile weapon featured on the Providence is supposed to be a flak cannon. It might seem out of place in an era dominated by the use of energy weapons, but flak cannons would still be a good option for anti-starfighter and anti-missile/torpedo defense, since the projectiles explode in mid-flight and release shrapnel, providing a greater hit probability against small fast-moving craft or incoming missiles. The only reason I can think of for why flak guns aren't seen in use more often in the Star Wars universe is that perhaps it isn't considered worth the cost of ammo and the need for space to store it, when you could have laser cannons for defense instead.
A "microwave laser" would be a Maser (which is a technology that actually predates the laser in the real world). The "l" in laser stands for (optical) light...Though today we also talk about lasers when they are in the UV or higher frequency range (e.g. xray laser)
I wonder if the shell based weapons on the CIS flagship were perhaps a bit of a wildcard choice? Like, they know nearly all ships have their defences based around energy weapons so how about for our best ship we throw a wrench in the works and build shells so whatever engages it isn't ready for it? Or, possibly more likely, those shells are some kind of single use battery for an energy weapon, designed to reduce strain on the reactor. They could be charged up in advance of a battle gradually, then fired off at a higher rate than you could if you had to re-charge the gun each shot. Or you could fire more at once than the ship's reactor could allow.
I always took the broadside weapons that are shown on the Providence and venator to be a form of power cell weapon, essentially the clip we see is loading capacitor rounds into the blaster cannons, that way there is no charge up time and it's a constant power per shot, obviously there would also be a tgas component, but that's how I took them to work
Sorta mini theory/idea, I think in the battle of corasuant they were using some sort of projectile that penetrated the republic ships and killed crew, kinda like tank AP rounds with HE caps
Turbo lasers are as folks have said below basically a plasma weapon, and that ties into your vid about why combats done at fairly short range. Plasma would rapidly loose heat to space, meaning that at long ranges its not going to do that much. Conversely the DS's super laser is a laser.
The "ammo canisters" that the Providence cannons are seen using are likely sealed tibanna gas containers used to "charge" the turbolaser between shots.
You're showing the providence broadside weapons as an example for projectile weapons - I've always wondered about those. I know, this scene is just made to look cool. But the main weapons of capital ships always seem to be pivotable turbolasers. We never see where the heck those giant shielded bays for cannons would located on the ships (eg. on a venator), or what their intended use would be, except of the highly unlikely event of capital ships actually passing each other at point blank range. I have that Ep. 3 cross-sections book and I cannot recall finding anything about those on the venator page.
In regards to Lhiam Dunne's question, I've noticed that there seems to be some discrepancy, or perhaps some sort of Quantum Observation differences in Pseudo-motion. Particularly in observing a ship leaving into and more recently arriving from Hyperspace, versus what is seen from within a ship in the same moment. My example is, whenever we've seen any ship making the the jump, the passengers see the stars (or some have suggested it was hydrogen atoms) turning to streaks, and then the POV cuts to exterior and "pew!" the ship is gone. Upon arrival, the swirling blue/white Doctor Who tunnel fades, the streaks return now shortening, and recently we've been shown the ship "wep!" suddenly there. ONCE, just once that I know of, and for all I know, the Disney/ILMers have changed this, we see Lando and Nien Nunb bring the Falcon out of Hyperspace, and we can clearly see out the cockpit windows that they have not completely decelerated because Endor and the DSII are swiftly zooming into view. Now, even as a kid, I was very science minded, and always assumed that it was some kind of Relativity/Time-Dilation thing. The way they keep changing stuff now though, I dunno any more.
They should’ve included technology utilized in hyperspace travel in the creation of their torpedo/missiles, and turbo laser cannons. It could be used to accelerate the projectile faster, or even bypass shielding that is impossible to break through otherwise. It would also allow for the ability to fire turbo lasers and proton torpedos in hyperspace travel.
I think that cannon on the Provedence is just a turbolaser. They load the gas canister, it fires the contents and ejects the empty canister out the back.
About the last part about the peovidence using a projectile. I think there is soem sort of energy stored in a special casting to revenit it from escaping, probably some sort of plasma (idk), but I don't think is a projectile.
I always assumed that the weapons on the Providence were in-fact turbolasers. But instead of generating the plasma from massive tibanna gas stores, they use single-use canisters. This is operating under the assumption that all blaster-type weapons are just electromagnetically accelerated tibanna plasma. This is why we see similar CIS guns also fire flak shells--its basically just a coil gun. It can hurl flak or plasma, as needed. Not really a design that makes much sense for the primary guns on a capital ship, but for secondaries it offers much more flexibility (easy to remove or add new guns, change shell types, etc)
The providence used proton canons as an added weapon for close support. And the at-te tanks used a mass driver canon as there primary weapon, but they shot laser blasts or mortar rounds.
8:55 these don't fire projectiles, rather the "round" casting being ejected from the aft of the cannons is just a battery that fuels plasma ejection from the barrel. i don't know why this method of supplying power to an energy weapon is used in this scene, but they're definitely not projectiles.
The Providence doesn’t use projectile weapons in the clip you showed. Those “shells” that the weapons are ejecting out the back are gas canisters. The separatists also use those weapons for ground artillery, you can see them in the Clone Wars episode “Innocents of Ryloth”
Another reason I hear they're still called lasers is because a laser is what's used to energize the tibanna gas to turn it into a plasma before being fired out a barrel
With the providence, I've always just assumed that it used tibanna gas canisters. Upon the shot being fired the empty canister is discarded and another loaded.
so it's like ww2 ship armament: on the one hand you have fast-firing, low power machine guns and autocannons (laser cannons in star wars) for light craft; on the other hand you have slow-firing, high power naval guns for capital ship combat (turbolasers). both operate by the explosives-behind-metal-death-ball-in-steel-tube mechanism but vary by size power and mobility.
Could you make a video about the evolution of star wars ground combat, from the earliest accounts of legends to modern star wars? I would like to see the evolution of common weapons, military vehicles, and tactics pls. Btw love your video
Great video. I would say in Legends the use of kinetic energy weapons began much earlier, with the pre-Republic Hutt planechanga. I know using some assumptions and common sense, but I would think devastating rail guns and say high yield missile or torpedo weapons maybe using baradium started their use much earlier as well. I know planetary shielding comes into play with the Kumauri battleships in 10,000 BBY, but I just think tech like would have been possible in a pre-Republic era as well, but just my opinion there.
The Providence has proton cannons, also in the game Star Wars Republic Heroes the Juma 9 space station has similar weapons, maybe its weird but when 2 ships are in CQB and showing broadside they must be very useful
I'm reasonably certain that the Kumauri design was more of a weapon used against planets rather than other capital ships, with the development of planetary shields c.9000 BBY rendering them essentially obsolete for that role, at least on most civilized worlds
A Maser is basically a microwave laser. Where Lasers (Light Amplification via Stimulated Emission of Radiation), uses visible wavelengths of light, Masers, (Microwave Amplification via Stimulated Emission of Radiation), use much higher frequencies of electromagnetic radiation. They are basically the same technologies working in slightly different ways.
As far as I'm aware, Star Wars has tried to have a lot of it's technology explained over the years using real world physics. It's in the books, more relating to starship breakdown etc. All laser cannons and blasters in Star Wars are plasma weapons. They use focused light (a Laser) to ionise Tibanna Gas. This creates a burst of visible plasma. This also explains the visible movement as it impacts organic species as dense gas at a high velocity would result in kinetic energy depending on the mass of the target it hits. On the other hand Wookie Bow Caster's are all supposed to be railguns. It's why they hit so hard
A mazer is like a laser that uses microwaves instead of visible light. So those early microwave lasers they used before turbolasers are actually masers too. Unless they spell it Mazer in which case it could be a completely different chiss weapon.
I never thought of those canons on the Providence as projectile weapons. To me it seems like those canisters are just fuel sources that get depleted and expunged, not “shell” casings in the traditional sense
That last bit of your video about the providence ship using projectiles. Those are not like cannon shells. Each of those shells is basically a sealed canister of tabana gas in a kind of big auto loading system. So their broadside guns are all just belt fed turbolaser cannons.
One question I’ve had for an awhile is why don’t bigger ships like ssds have bigger guns? Seems like the size maxes out in the heavy turbo laser category. Instead of bigger guns they just add more of the same size. Ww2 battleships followed the pattern of bigger ships bigger guns. Guns started at 12 or 14 inch main batteries and went up to 18 inch on the Yamato class. I guess more smaller guns can engage more targets? But why use concentrated fire on large targets when you can one or two shot. Power generator limitations ? I know this is an older video but that’s one thing the sequel trilogy got right with the giant cannons on the mega ssd.
Do you remember what part of Ep III the clip at 1:29 and 1:34 is from? I was trying to find it earlier for reference to show somebody when talking to someone else but couldn't find it :/
8:55 I don't think it's a projectile shell casing but a tabanah gas canister instead of building the ship with pipes to provide the gas from a central holding tank thy put it in canisters and let the Droids supply them to the Canons
Wait isn't the Provenance using proton bomb cannons..... In Rebels when looking for proton Bombs they find CIS droids with some but were unable to use them because they lacked any cannons and they looked similar to the ones in the screen grab from the movie.
Im kind of surprised that flak projectiles arent used as anti-starfighter weapons. Capital ship grade flak batteries could probably devastate swarms of small unshielded fighters like TIEs with high velocity shrapnel
Thanks to Skillshare for sponsoring today's video -- The first 1000 people who click the link in the description will get 2 free months of Skillshare Premium: skl.sh/eckhartsladder7
Eckhart you should do what if palpatine won the battle of exegol
Boi
I think those shells the providnce uses were proton Bombs/shells)
@EckhartsLadder the difference between mazers and laser cannons is that while laser cannons fire super heated plasma, mazer fire a mix of projectiles and chemicals. Due to the certain types of chemicals used most mazers fire a blue bolt of energy rather than the usual red or green one.
Eck, Maser = Microwave Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation. So that literally means it's the proper name for a "Microwave Laser". Also if you swap out Microwave with Light you then have the term laser is an acronym for.
"hope you guys have a great day"
*Sith gets beheaded in the background*
WELCOME HOME!!
Worf: The destroyer is aiming lasers at us...
Riker: lasers??
Worf: yes sir?
Picard: Don't be absurd Mr Worf, those are clearly plasma weapons!
I think you mean... Phasma weapons... 😂
Captain Phasma no... pls stop this
Picard: No matter ,bridge to O'Brien beam 2 photon torpedoes onto their bridge.
There was a funny episode in TNG with a Han Solo like character and small fighter craft attacking the Enterprise D with laser cannons. Shields were staying at 98% and Picard and Riker smirked at the attack.
@James Studholme
I mean it wouldn't destroy/sink the whole ship (just like in real life) and the bridge is a tiny target from the front where it's being blasted by hundreds of ion cannons and turbo lasers so ISD for the win?
Everyone: The Death Star is unkillable
Luke: Hahaha proton missile go whoosh
Some people like to point out ridiculous, improbable events in the sequel trilogy. I like to one-up them with this.
''Noo, you cant kill heavily trained soldiers just with stupid primitives dwarves!''
''Haha, Goo ewoks, gooo brrrr''
I mean, tbh the missile Luke Threw shouldnt have impacted if not for the force; it was needed a parable for a missile to go to the reactor. Also maybe it was neccesary for refrigerate such an enourmouscanon. The true stupidity was having the death star (And that hole) undefended with Turbolasers, TIEs and starships...
@@ledanoir1239 The empire seems to be allergic to point defense, which is a problem if your greatest enemy primarily relies on high quality starfighters.
@@ledanoir1239 Ironically both are loosely based on a real story. I mean, skipping an unguided bomb through a maze of barriers just to have it sink to the base of a dam for sufficient effect...makes the trench run look straight forward. And jungle warfare sucks.
Haha
When the technology gets more advance as you go further into the past:
*Wait that’s illegal*
The technology is evolving, just backwards
Not in Warhammer 40K.
That is what happens when you write a story backwards @George Lucas
@@phelps6205 Because in charge of planning, Yoda was!
The imperium of man would like to know your location
I am a simple man: I see something about capital ships in Star Wars, I like.
your not simple
Trevor Belmont, Castlevania reference, might it be?.
Same
If you're a man...?
@@RealAugustusAutumn haha not anymore...
Death Star: NOOOOO YOU CANT JUST DODGE MY HIGHLY ACCURATE SUPERLASERS!!!
Luke Skwalker: Haha X-Wing go brr brr
Haha force go whoosh
Brrr brrrr whoosh
Haha plot armor go brrrrrrr
the cannons on the invisible hand and Venator class ships have what look like artillery cannons and this is also shown in the clone wars series so basically, some ships like the Venator and some of the cis ships have broadside artillery cannons with autoloaders mounted with them inside the sides of the ship and if you've watched the clone wars movie the republic artillery cannon looks striking-ly similar to the one shown in star wars episode three in the broadside scene and this also includes the cis heavy artillery cannon used during the clone wars seen in the clone wars tv series they look very similar so my guess is they just slapped a bunch of artillery cannons with autoloaders on the sides and bam they have broadside cannons
Technically, those were used for Point Defense, like the cannons on the ISD, but you got a point
Larger guns use canisters of tibana. It wasn't conventional ammunition.
well the CIS weapons in the TV series were mentioned to be „Proton Canons“ by the tactical droid who was tasked with defending this city on Ryloth and they were used as Ground to Air weapons
On wookieepedia these cannons are stated to be flak/mass driver cannons though.
@@willemthijssen5497
Do AV cannons seem like flak cannons? Mass Driver weaponry is similar to Porton weaponry, but it's still not the same. Wookiepedia sometimes uses outdated sourcebooks or gets stuff wrong. We know from a few pre disney medias that AV cannons are Artillery cannons, as well as proton firing. And those are for sure AV cannons.
New republic: viscounts shields are impenetrable
Eclipse: haha superlaser go boom
I've always thought that the cannons on Providence in Rots uses these "projectiles" only as a way to store the gas and energy. By that I mean that the canons there doesn't have their own source of gas/energy, so they are cheaper, and instead everything comes in these, let's say cartridges, which can be refild once the battle is over
I agree, it's also a great safety measure. If they are using Tibanna gas to create the plasma, then the question is why not just hook up a hose to the gun so you can feed gas directly into it? But imagine if the gun takes a hit? Any gas that can easily be converted into plasma is highly energetic, meaning that it will probably ignite quite easily if handled wrong. So if the battery is hit, then the fire might just flash right up the hose into the main gas storage area and then BOOM, no more ship just because a single gun emplacement was taken out. By separating the gas into individual canisters that have just enough gas for a single shot each, the risk of a violent chain reaction is dramatically reduced.
You spelled "cannon" wrong
I agree with that, because you can clearly see, that the cartridges look the same, on the storage system and also after being ejected by the cannon after the shot. Usually you just see an empty cartridge with a missing projectile, if it would be a projectile based weapon. Same for the cartridges on that Venator.
@@Suthriel the fact they look the same was probably an oversight
It could also help alleviate some of the demands on the power generation needed by the ship. If you have two ships built the exact same except for one using this canister based system for the cannons on the ship, and another using directly generator wired cannon systems, than one of these will have a much higher power consumption to the other design as well. Even if you have it that these canisters can be refilled either with power from the generator or gas from a reservoir one ship will have more excess power to use(like for shielding) than the other. I mean I wonder could you stress the power systems of a ship via dumping a lot of fire on the shields causing a power shut down as the power needed to sustain the ship is exceeded by both the demands of the shields an weapons firing during a combat, if so than using canister based feeding system to power the weapons would help to take pressure off the power system of the ship.
Is it just me, or did they evolve and then devolve? At least that’s the way it looked in the thumbnail.
Also, best part... 09:55 because I love the outros with the dog lol
Also also: Eckhart, looking forward to having you on our podcast!
The Empire was really cheap you can tell from tie fighters vs arc 170s
yeah! the podcast! Like we know what your talking about...
Arcanum he’s plugging his own podcast, like he thinks eck wants to go on it
Rusher Ranker7 DEFF STAHRRRRR
Not really devolve but more of it looks like crap but can take and give a crapton in a fight
The Rebellion is actually masterminded by Darth Plagueis to get revenge. Change my mind.
To lazy to do so
Darth Plagueis died bruh. Palpatine was there for the experiments, so he would've made sure.
Hey. No one's ever really gone, right? Sidious possessing Rey is just the beginning!
@Rusher Ranker7 Not Sith. Vong are actually canon.
@@Unknown-hb3id It was actually common Sith practice.
4000 years before Endor: lasers on wedge shaped ships
Battle of Endor: lasers on wedge shaped ships
130 years after Endor: lasers on wedge shaped ships
Space warfare technology is really stagnant in SW universe, isn't it
That’s due to artists trying copy a lot of original trilogy styles in order to keep it “Star Wars”
Not how weapon tech works
While Stargate and Halo advance further down the road
If something ain’t broke...
It’s a technological plateau.
I think those Providence weapons are just a different type of turbolaser. Instead of being directly powered by the ship, they just store the energy/gas/etc. in canisters.
8:10 a "maser" is a "microwave laser" in real life. Though they're probably not the same thing in the star wars universe
That's not _quite_ right. Mostly because MASERs were first, and therefore LASERs are light-frequency MASERs rather than the other way 'round.
The M in MASER means Microwave. Just replace the L in LASER which stood for light.
thank you I forgot that
@Kage Tsukino beat me to it!
Which in combination with earlier parts of the video implies that the Chiss use what is (probably an improved version of) ancient technology for the majority of the Galaxy. Since Masers have been replaced by "Lasers" and "Turbolasers" (both probably uses lasers to turn the tibanna gas into plasma while the actual weapon fires plasma).
I really like the Venators twin turbo lasers, focusing more on penetration than shear power sounds much better, though I would have made it a quad barrel for better power output
leon fierce though the Imperial turbo laser pairs make a little more sense for multi role purposes as the barrels have less space between each other. This would mean the trajectories of the bolts would be much closer together than on the venator, permitting them to be used for several roles such as their main anti capital ship role and also against star fighters.
"focusing more on penetration than sheer power"
Well then.
@@marcus4403 oof
Another reason why the Venator is my favorite star destroyer.
#askeck
On the level Regret in Halo 2, Cortana says that new structures are built around older ones to protect and honor them. Were these old structures built by humans, or did the Forerunners get better at building ruins?
Hey Ecks, I remember reading somewhere that the plasma weapon shells on the CIS ships actually held the gas used as the projectile, not a solid projectile.
Apparently the Providence Class had batteries based off of J-1 Proton Cannons, which themselves have been inconsistent within Star Wars the Clone wars (During the Ryloth Campaign they were shown to need to be reloaded after every shot, where as during the opening of the second battle of Geonosis, they were seen to fire far faster and without any apparent need to reload). But I always took it as just a slugthrower-style weapon, a solid projectile encased in energy for maximum damage, and stored within Shells.
8:18 -sh Maser= Microwaves Amplified by Stimulated Emission of Radiation Basically it's like shooting someone with the business end of a Microwave oven on crack...it would make them explode messily as their water and fats would boil...but I could be wrong
No, no - you're 100% right.
Remember, don't put metal into the microwave. Or metal ship hulls in the firing lane of a sufficiently large maser.
Somewhat right but also slightly wrong. Masers cam about before lasers (Lasers were originally called Optical Masers but that wasn't popular, so the LASER acronym was made). Sci fi tends to make them radioactive death beams but Masers are actually much lower power than a Laser, especially Gamma Ray or Ultraviolet Lasers. Sadly the Maser is a pretty boring weapon, its actually used in communication much more and is often used as in clocks.
That's not to say you can't hurt someone with one that's powerful enough, a Maser at extreme power can blow up fruit (they've done that before) so im guessing at star wars level power they could instantly blind someone and start to melt whatever it is they touch, just know that compared to the actually frightening Gamma Ray Lasers and Ultraviolet Lasers the Maser isn't as frightening or powerful.
So a lasgun?
@@crashfan6443 Actually a melta (which the 40K lore specifically says work using microwaves), lasguns still use visible light wavelengths. Also masers have famously been used to combat Godzilla (with varying levels of effectiveness).
For my capital ship for me or my main fleet, I would have the ships have weapons based in their size, corvettes would have mainly ball point defense quad lasers for star fighters and missiles for anti capital ship combat
From their, bigger ships will have 30 percent quad heavy and medium turbo lasers, 50 percent ball point defense quad lasers, 15 percent ion cannons, and 5 percent missile launchers
Instead of shear power, we have flexible, intuitive, and multi role armament for any battlefield
leon fierce Good for a large scale general fleet, however if you were to encounter a fleet that had hyper specialization they would wipe the floor with overwhelming power if your fleet sizes were equivalent. Balance comes in different forms
Christian Holt true, but I’m thinking on the lines of, star fighter superiority with droid fighters to cause more damage than my capital ships
Mimu Mi what about for star fighter defense, remember, if I can launch fighters to overwhelm you, including droid fighters I could have just crash into the ship to cause damage, then I just need to last long enough for the fighters to do my job, NOW checkmate
Honestly I wouldn't fully know what I would need. However I would like to have my larger capital ships to have modular components if I had the means or resources to do so. Have an as much of varied arsenal as possible which further increases flexibility while still having specialized screening ships and some specialized capital ships to make sure I have enough fire power both offensive and defensively.
Mass drivers are still good have as a back up weapon or use when enemy shields are disabled or destroyed and turbo lasers are on a cool down cycle that you can maximize damage output and having missile defensive systems are good at thinning out enemy fighter and bomber formations at longer ranges. As using guided missiles at close range could be hazardous to own defensive fighter screen or smaller screening vessels . But that would make it easier for the flak guns and your own fighters since the enemy strike fighters and bombers would be dispersed and less organized making for easy targets to pick off.
And just have one or a few massive Dreadnoughts come built in with a super laser just say don't fuck with me if you do this what I can do you. Keeping them in reserve while still keeping the crew battle ready when called upon. Because unlike the galactic empire I want as few enemies as possible so I am not just gonna go around destroying planets. I would use them deter the enemies that I do have will instilling confidence in my allies that I have their back. While at the same time making every pirate within the sector regret their chosen profession. Now most I could do that with Star destroyer sized ships. But having a few dreadnoughts for just in case scenarios is good have.
I know they are expensive and not practical but sometimes it better have something and not need than not having something and needing it. And Like old sheev himself I enjoy having my big toys to even its seen as compensating for a lack of something to but do I care no i like big ships that shoot lasers that instantly delete enemy warships lol.
Guys guys, for this, I’m working on a fixed budget, meaning no specialized weapons like super lasers unless we’re talking about the Venator style one, no heavy missile platforms, and no super weapon style weaponry
with that in mind, I chose this because instead of overwhelming firepower, I prefer having flexibility and intuitive vessel since I would be able to use these ships in about any fight, and to save on cost, crew and money, all my ships weapons would be controlled by my ships weapons bridge, which is built into the ship while the main bridge maneuver the ship
8:55 i always thought of those cannons as a torpedo launcher than really a turbolaser.
First joke, hah ha, but nice video regardless, makes me think of the massive turbos in battle of the dreadnaughts' viscount
Not to mention the Eclipse too
#AskEck
Who would win between Republic Clone Commandos and Death Troopers?
Clone commandos would destroy death troopers
Commandos. Wouldn’t even be a fight
It would depend, as Eckhart did say in another vid that the Empire had one of the best special forces units. death troopers are stronger than you give credit for
I suppose it all would depend on the situation. The outcome would be rather intriguing, that’s for sure.
It depends could it could be a squad of commandos then 60 death troopers depends on the situation
What about Mon Cala Turbolasers?
I've heard somewhere that they are capable of hitting snubfighters because of far superior tracking and targeting ability.
I believe the mon calamari are just known to have more advanced technology when it comes to ship (and ship armament) building compared to the rest of the galaxy
These videos do not deserve dislikes
those guns always interesting me. maybe those 'shells' are batteries? 8:58
I always believe that it was the gas and the power needed for the shot. But it could just be rule of cool.
@@earnestbrown6524 That was also my interpretation, as balsters also use gas cartridges as "ammo".
@@earnestbrown6524 They're flak guns.
Well hold on. Do you batteries as in the gun or do you mean as in D-cell or AA
No they are the projectiles being fired. They are described as particle cannons. Sometimes called flak-guns and being mistaken for point defence but being mounted broadside like this, they aren't.
"Flak Cannon were primarily use defensively" imagine using it offensively😂
Well, flak cannons are used as an anti- missile defense.
In the table top RPG, enough flak firing between ISD will dust their own Ties and cripple any Rebel fighter flying through the flak cloud. Best part is capital ship shield and armor can easily soak up that damage with no problem.
In D&D it is called Mimi- Max damage effect.
I can imagine flak cannons being used offensively, a real world historical analogue would be the German 8.8cm FLugAbwehrKanone from which we derive the word flak, these were primarily anti-aircraft guns but proved to be so effective in the anti-tank role that they were fitted on to tanks such as the Tiger. The allies also developed their anti-air guns into tank killers, the US M26 pershing and the m36 tank destroyer used the 90mm gun m3 which was originally an anti aircraft gun.
Ponen Longchar well they were given AP shells for combat so they kinda knew that those things could do some work. I think military history visualized made a video on it
Yeah...imagine if they used them like the Flak 88 was.
Ponen Longchar thank you came to drop some knowledge on this emoji using dude but you beat me to it thank you keep up the good work
The way I saw the "Invisible Hand" guns where more like "turbo blaster": Each gun needs a shell in it that acts like a blaster magasine, so offers the gaz and energy to shoot, making the weapon less or potentially not dependable on energy from the main ship. At the cost of shells. Probably goes against some explication somewhere, but that was how I analysed it the first time I saw the film.
I still cant get over how serious this channel is, but doge lives on
IIRC the projectile weapon featured on the Providence is supposed to be a flak cannon. It might seem out of place in an era dominated by the use of energy weapons, but flak cannons would still be a good option for anti-starfighter and anti-missile/torpedo defense, since the projectiles explode in mid-flight and release shrapnel, providing a greater hit probability against small fast-moving craft or incoming missiles. The only reason I can think of for why flak guns aren't seen in use more often in the Star Wars universe is that perhaps it isn't considered worth the cost of ammo and the need for space to store it, when you could have laser cannons for defense instead.
A "microwave laser" would be a Maser (which is a technology that actually predates the laser in the real world). The "l" in laser stands for (optical) light...Though today we also talk about lasers when they are in the UV or higher frequency range (e.g. xray laser)
I wonder if the shell based weapons on the CIS flagship were perhaps a bit of a wildcard choice? Like, they know nearly all ships have their defences based around energy weapons so how about for our best ship we throw a wrench in the works and build shells so whatever engages it isn't ready for it? Or, possibly more likely, those shells are some kind of single use battery for an energy weapon, designed to reduce strain on the reactor. They could be charged up in advance of a battle gradually, then fired off at a higher rate than you could if you had to re-charge the gun each shot. Or you could fire more at once than the ship's reactor could allow.
They're flak guns. They were used to intercept missiles or fighter craft.
@@jamesleduke873 actually they are high caliber mass drivers based off the flak gun design firing AP shells using the flak shell casing.
Proton torpedo I chose you.
I always took the broadside weapons that are shown on the Providence and venator to be a form of power cell weapon, essentially the clip we see is loading capacitor rounds into the blaster cannons, that way there is no charge up time and it's a constant power per shot, obviously there would also be a tgas component, but that's how I took them to work
Sorta mini theory/idea, I think in the battle of corasuant they were using some sort of projectile that penetrated the republic ships and killed crew, kinda like tank AP rounds with HE caps
Turbo lasers are as folks have said below basically a plasma weapon, and that ties into your vid about why combats done at fairly short range. Plasma would rapidly loose heat to space, meaning that at long ranges its not going to do that much. Conversely the DS's super laser is a laser.
Nice vid man
Hey Eck, could you make another SCP video, or that one horror thing about the moon?
A very extremely great video as always EckhartsLadder.
Executor: You Can just Dodge my 5,000 Laser,Turbolaser and Ion Cannon
Rebel: haha A-Wing go boom boom
fukkin' YT notifs.
why would I NOT want to be notified of an EckhartsLadder vid, let alone a vid on one of my favorite aspects of any series.
The "ammo canisters" that the Providence cannons are seen using are likely sealed tibanna gas containers used to "charge" the turbolaser between shots.
I can just imagine microwaves shooting lasers out of them
I always thought that the reason for seemingly consistent technology in star wars over thousands of years is just technological stagnation
HellO tHerE
I love your channel! Keep going man!
You're showing the providence broadside weapons as an example for projectile weapons - I've always wondered about those. I know, this scene is just made to look cool. But the main weapons of capital ships always seem to be pivotable turbolasers. We never see where the heck those giant shielded bays for cannons would located on the ships (eg. on a venator), or what their intended use would be, except of the highly unlikely event of capital ships actually passing each other at point blank range. I have that Ep. 3 cross-sections book and I cannot recall finding anything about those on the venator page.
In regards to Lhiam Dunne's question, I've noticed that there seems to be some discrepancy, or perhaps some sort of Quantum Observation differences in Pseudo-motion. Particularly in observing a ship leaving into and more recently arriving from Hyperspace, versus what is seen from within a ship in the same moment.
My example is, whenever we've seen any ship making the the jump, the passengers see the stars (or some have suggested it was hydrogen atoms) turning to streaks, and then the POV cuts to exterior and "pew!" the ship is gone. Upon arrival, the swirling blue/white Doctor Who tunnel fades, the streaks return now shortening, and recently we've been shown the ship "wep!" suddenly there.
ONCE, just once that I know of, and for all I know, the Disney/ILMers have changed this, we see Lando and Nien Nunb bring the Falcon out of Hyperspace, and we can clearly see out the cockpit windows that they have not completely decelerated because Endor and the DSII are swiftly zooming into view.
Now, even as a kid, I was very science minded, and always assumed that it was some kind of Relativity/Time-Dilation thing. The way they keep changing stuff now though, I dunno any more.
They should’ve included technology utilized in hyperspace travel in the creation of their torpedo/missiles, and turbo laser cannons. It could be used to accelerate the projectile faster, or even bypass shielding that is impossible to break through otherwise. It would also allow for the ability to fire turbo lasers and proton torpedos in hyperspace travel.
Your awsome eck may the force be with you
I think that cannon on the Provedence is just a turbolaser. They load the gas canister, it fires the contents and ejects the empty canister out the back.
About the last part about the peovidence using a projectile. I think there is soem sort of energy stored in a special casting to revenit it from escaping, probably some sort of plasma (idk), but I don't think is a projectile.
I always assumed that the weapons on the Providence were in-fact turbolasers. But instead of generating the plasma from massive tibanna gas stores, they use single-use canisters.
This is operating under the assumption that all blaster-type weapons are just electromagnetically accelerated tibanna plasma.
This is why we see similar CIS guns also fire flak shells--its basically just a coil gun. It can hurl flak or plasma, as needed.
Not really a design that makes much sense for the primary guns on a capital ship, but for secondaries it offers much more flexibility (easy to remove or add new guns, change shell types, etc)
The providence used proton canons as an added weapon for close support. And the at-te tanks used a mass driver canon as there primary weapon, but they shot laser blasts or mortar rounds.
8:55 these don't fire projectiles, rather the "round" casting being ejected from the aft of the cannons is just a battery that fuels plasma ejection from the barrel. i don't know why this method of supplying power to an energy weapon is used in this scene, but they're definitely not projectiles.
The Providence doesn’t use projectile weapons in the clip you showed. Those “shells” that the weapons are ejecting out the back are gas canisters. The separatists also use those weapons for ground artillery, you can see them in the Clone Wars episode “Innocents of Ryloth”
The weapons used by the Invisible Hand at Coruscant are proton cannons essentially firing unguided proton bombs at close range.
Would SuperchargerLasers be better than Turbolasers?
I think more videos on older tech would be neat. I had no idea about a lot of this early Star wars stuff.
Were the CIS guns proton cannons? The shells where referred to as proton bombs in rebels an I'm pretty sure they where in the Clone Wars too
8:12 What is this from?? this looks like a movie!
Another reason I hear they're still called lasers is because a laser is what's used to energize the tibanna gas to turn it into a plasma before being fired out a barrel
We need this man to get 1 million subs NOW!
With the providence, I've always just assumed that it used tibanna gas canisters. Upon the shot being fired the empty canister is discarded and another loaded.
so it's like ww2 ship armament: on the one hand you have fast-firing, low power machine guns and autocannons (laser cannons in star wars) for light craft; on the other hand you have slow-firing, high power naval guns for capital ship combat (turbolasers). both operate by the explosives-behind-metal-death-ball-in-steel-tube mechanism but vary by size power and mobility.
Now the next development in weapons: hyperspace ram missiles
@FangABXY FangABXY hoping they dont ever use this get out of jail free card again
Could you make a video about the evolution of star wars ground combat, from the earliest accounts of legends to modern star wars? I would like to see the evolution of common weapons, military vehicles, and tactics pls. Btw love your video
Great video. I would say in Legends the use of kinetic energy weapons began much earlier, with the pre-Republic Hutt planechanga. I know using some assumptions and common sense, but I would think devastating rail guns and say high yield missile or torpedo weapons maybe using baradium started their use much earlier as well. I know planetary shielding comes into play with the Kumauri battleships in 10,000 BBY, but I just think tech like would have been possible in a pre-Republic era as well, but just my opinion there.
The Providence has proton cannons, also in the game Star Wars Republic Heroes the Juma 9 space station has similar weapons, maybe its weird but when 2 ships are in CQB and showing broadside they must be very useful
So, they added an extra cannon?
I'm reasonably certain that the Kumauri design was more of a weapon used against planets rather than other capital ships, with the development of planetary shields c.9000 BBY rendering them essentially obsolete for that role, at least on most civilized worlds
Love the "Post Jedi Retcon".
Thanks for making a video we asked for
A Maser is basically a microwave laser. Where Lasers (Light Amplification via Stimulated Emission of Radiation), uses visible wavelengths of light, Masers, (Microwave Amplification via Stimulated Emission of Radiation), use much higher frequencies of electromagnetic radiation. They are basically the same technologies working in slightly different ways.
Another GREAT interesting vid I've really liked and enjoyed watching.
As far as I'm aware, Star Wars has tried to have a lot of it's technology explained over the years using real world physics. It's in the books, more relating to starship breakdown etc. All laser cannons and blasters in Star Wars are plasma weapons. They use focused light (a Laser) to ionise Tibanna Gas. This creates a burst of visible plasma. This also explains the visible movement as it impacts organic species as dense gas at a high velocity would result in kinetic energy depending on the mass of the target it hits.
On the other hand Wookie Bow Caster's are all supposed to be railguns. It's why they hit so hard
EckhartsLadder is the smartest Star Wars Doge.
A mazer is like a laser that uses microwaves instead of visible light. So those early microwave lasers they used before turbolasers are actually masers too. Unless they spell it Mazer in which case it could be a completely different chiss weapon.
I never thought of those canons on the Providence as projectile weapons. To me it seems like those canisters are just fuel sources that get depleted and expunged, not “shell” casings in the traditional sense
I think Xyston class Star Destroyers and their landmark weapons are highly underrated
Finally some legends the superior lore
That ship battle you have in the background where the ship has a super laser.
Where is it from?
eckkie: most of you know skill share
us who watched so many sponsors: sad violin plays lmao
That last bit of your video about the providence ship using projectiles. Those are not like cannon shells. Each of those shells is basically a sealed canister of tabana gas in a kind of big auto loading system. So their broadside guns are all just belt fed turbolaser cannons.
No, those are cannon shells. That gun is a mass driver based flak gun.
starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Separatist_flagship_deck_cannon
One question I’ve had for an awhile is why don’t bigger ships like ssds have bigger guns? Seems like the size maxes out in the heavy turbo laser category. Instead of bigger guns they just add more of the same size. Ww2 battleships followed the pattern of bigger ships bigger guns. Guns started at 12 or 14 inch main batteries and went up to 18 inch on the Yamato class. I guess more smaller guns can engage more targets? But why use concentrated fire on large targets when you can one or two shot. Power generator limitations ? I know this is an older video but that’s one thing the sequel trilogy got right with the giant cannons on the mega ssd.
Do you remember what part of Ep III the clip at 1:29 and 1:34 is from? I was trying to find it earlier for reference to show somebody when talking to someone else but couldn't find it :/
Should be after the killing of Count Dooku when Anakin, Palpatine and Obi Wan try to escape.
5:17 nebulon b super frigate vs executor super star destroyer
Chiss masers combine energy with projectiles iirc. So basically like, projectile weapons with a packet of energy around the projectiles
Wait... are those launchers in the Providence all those listed proton torpedo launchers?
What is the video of the capital ships in space that he uses as a background all the time? I'm curious to watch the whole thing.
The projectile weapon seen on the Providence in RotS was in fact, its flak guns.
aren't there mass driver cannons on venators
8:55 I don't think it's a projectile shell casing but a tabanah gas canister instead of building the ship with pipes to provide the gas from a central holding tank thy put it in canisters and let the Droids supply them to the Canons
It took them 3000 years for the galaxy to fit 2 firing canons on 1 block. Nice.
Wait isn't the Provenance using proton bomb cannons..... In Rebels when looking for proton Bombs they find CIS droids with some but were unable to use them because they lacked any cannons and they looked similar to the ones in the screen grab from the movie.
those things back a mean push
2:38 plasma to be exact.
What was the clip with the ship with the tiny Death Star laser from?
Im kind of surprised that flak projectiles arent used as anti-starfighter weapons. Capital ship grade flak batteries could probably devastate swarms of small unshielded fighters like TIEs with high velocity shrapnel