I like how UA-cam's auto-generated captions list the Corvair's exhaust note as "[Music]". And as for the heating, the first year of the Corvair (1960) came with a gasoline-powered heater, for very brisk (but potentially dangerous) heat output. In 1961 they switched to a more conventional (for an air-cooled engine) but less effective system of using the engine's exhaust to warm the air via heat exchangers.
Lovely review of the best Corvair ever. Beautifully sculpted "Body by Fisher". Franklin Automobiles of Syracuse, New York, designed and produced air-cooled automobiles from 1903 until 1934. Alas, Franklin's were mostly of conventional layout, i.e. front engine, rear wheel drive. The full sized 1948 Tucker Torpedo had a rear mounted 6-cylinder boxer engine converted from air cooling to water cooling..
At one time, I owned five Corvairs. My last one was a 1964 Monza Coupe with a 4-speed manual. An absolute joy to drive, especially on winding roads. I found that the steering/handling was much better with 30lbs. tire pressure all around. The recommended 14 front 27 rear resulted in slow, vague steering - much like front engine, rear drive US cars of the period.
I used to own a '66 Corvair Turbo Coupe, 180 HP, Artesian Turquoise, headrest seats, fold-down rear seat. The '64 and above Corvair's rear wheels did not tuck under, they stayed flat around corners. Just a wonderful car to drive and the sound of a flat-six is amazing!
Gracias', amigo, for a fun and informative video. General Motors / Chevrolet did indeed design a lovely, unique compact. I understand that when GM discovered the car had a bit much oversteer in corners due to the lightweight nose -- rather than providing a sway bar, their solution was to instruct owners to keep front tire pressure at ... 18 pounds! Of course no owners nor mechanics paid much attention. There are aftermarket sway bars nowadays which helps the car handle much better, especially with modern radial tires. Speaking of tires ... some of the Corvairs had the spare tire stuck in the back next to the engine! The owner of this car wisely moved it to the front where its weight can be put to good use.
In 1971, I bought a 1966 Corvair Corsa, the top performance model, powered by a turbocharged version of the flat 6 engine, producing 180 horsepower. It handled great, and was the first car I drove over 100 mph, getting it up to 103 mph on a deserted Los Angeles freeway at around 3 in the morning.......
@@bbrs925 I drive interstate everyday to get to work so hitting 70 is pretty normal and it handles that very well. Anything above that though and I start posting real close attention to everything because it ain't so smooth. Car could really use a fifth gear.
You went over the Wainuiomata Hill, a road I've driven over for many years and as a child in the family's Triumph 2500 and my Fathers very rusty Ford Escort van back in the 1980s 👍 Love the sound of that engine, a very cool car.
Pillar-less roof design !!! How beautiful, neat, and clean lines. That was a typical design feature of American cars from the 50's to the 70's. Nowadays, cars are all 4-door wide-pillar eyesore. HubNut is the only car reviewer I have seen who talks about this exceptional design feature.
What a gorgeous car! If a manufacturer made a car that looked like that with modern mechanicals or electric drivetrain, I reckon they would sell like hot cakes!
I Bought a 1965 CORVAIR new in Februauy 1966 and put over 300,000 miles on it. One thing you missed is that the Gen 2 CORVAIR did not have the swing axle rear suspension there were two universal joints on each axle.so that the camber of the rear wheels was almost completely straight up and down. With a good set of radial tires and proper inflation 15 lbs front and 30 lbs rear the wandering you experienced is greatly reduced. I was living in Nova Scotia when I bought the car and I drove it completely across the North American continent I believe it was 3 round trips as well as having driven it from Victoria BC south to San FrancisoI and back. The car origionally it was a 95 hp 4 speed car with positraction and a 3.23 to 1 rear gear set I later sapped in a 140 hp 4 carburetor engine and the matching 3.55:1 matching rear end.
As an enthusiastic Corvair owner since 1969, automotive journalist since 1977, and Society of Automotive Engineers affiliate since 1985 all I can say is... excellent job! A couple minor quibbles: True, Detroit was slow to adopt disc brakes, but the second-generation Corvair shared its brakes with the heavier GM intermediates, and with considerable weight in the rear the brakes at that end actually played a role in stopping. So in a USA-1960s setting, late Corvair brakes are very good. As for the wipers, they seemed fine in their era, when many contemporary cars had a foot-wide-plus unswept portion of windshield in the upper center. Too many of today's cars sweep an area that nobody looks through and deposit what they've wiped in front of the driver. I don't see that as an improvement. The rear suspension appears to have a kit installed to lower the center attachment points of the lower links. I don't recall the advantage it was supposed to impart, but I never felt the need to mess with the underpinnings of my '65 Corsa convertible. About 15 minutes in, it's possible for the viewer to think this car may have swing axles, like the '64 Monza coupe I currently own. That's the greatest potential for misunderstanding in the review, though you correctly note the rear suspension changed completely for the second generation. For the record, the 1965-69 Corvair did not use swing axles. The wheels installed appear to widen the car's track, which would increase the steering effort required at low speed. Also, I agree sidewalls are part of a car's suspension, need to be there, and today's super-low-profile tires are a scourge. I was recently driving a Renault Kadjar in Ireland and it was tough enough staying to the left with RHD. Nice job of staying to the left in a car with LHD - and thanks for a thoroughly enjoyable video!
I seem to recall some people doubting the safety of disk brakes back in the day. They were different enough in feel and wet weather could catch people out.
It's true the passenger side wiper throws all of its wiped water right in front of the driver if it swings wide, but with a well maintained (cleaned regularly, polished occasionally) windshield that's not really a problem since most of that gust of water sheets right off and whatever is left is almost immediately caught by the downswing of the drivers side wiper. Now that triangle of doom is only a real issue if it's right in front of the driver, which it isn't on most older cars with wide low windscreens (the narrower and/or higher the windshield gets, the closer that triangle of doom moves over to the driver), but the dribble of disappointment is still annoying, which is why I'm not a great fan of claphand wipers either. The "monopost" wiper Mercedes-Benz used to have was probably one of the best designs, such a shame they went the cost-cutting "do what everybody else is doing" route.
Paul Neidermeyer over at CurbsideClassic has written extensively and fairly even-handedly about this car. He's a big fan, but very much acknowledges the handling issues that the early ones had. This car has the later suspension, so the criticisms do not apply. The swing axle ones were also fine, in the hands of capable drivers, but this was a family car, and the typical driver would not know how the rear end could bite you in emergency situations. His view is that GM had effectively blown it with this car before Nader's book came out. Fascinating story and a beautiful car!
I've owned a '65 convertible since 1983. The gas guage most likely has a bad ground. When the belt is adjusted correctly, the belt works well. The Monza is the middle the priced model. Added carpet, trim, bucket seats and a few other things. Two carbs were standard, The top model was the Corsa and had the 4 carbs or turbo. Also more gauges. That is factory original oil filter design. One of the first cars with the "spin on" filters. You don't spin it to remove however. Brakes did work well compared to other American cars of that era. Great video. A Corvair on HubNut is very unexpected. Great times.
As a US citizen I owned.a 66’ Monza. I loved that car. It wasn’t exactly a rocket ship, but would wind out to 115 mph. As far as handing it puts to shame a lot of modern cars. I had a 90* corner into my neighbor that I could whip thru at 50 mph in a nice 4 wheel drift. 50 years later I still wish I had that car.
I had a 66 Monza/140hp (the option between the 110 and the 180turbo) /four carbs/four speed. The four carbs worked VERY well by the way. The rear suspension on the 2nc gen car (65 and later) was actually better than the Corvette of the day. Loved that car. Would like to have it back again. Learned a lot about driving in that car. It made me want to learn more.
"This remarkable American car," your closing assessment, is sincerely appreciated by this Yankee ('67) Corvair Monza 110 "hardtop" owner. With 70,000 original miles and factory air and factory 8-track, my marina-blue beauty is even more amazing! Nadar's 1965 book, "Unsafe at any Speed," only devoted the first chapter to "The Sporty Corvair," and, as you rightly indicated, the suspension upgrades/ improvements (actually introduced in 1964) already had made his analysis obsolete. Nadar's book is really about the "designed-in" aesthetic features of American-made cars that made so many of them death-traps--a legitimate gripe that led to the massive safety recalls we enjoy today, which is a good outcome. Great observations regarding the car's heavy steering with modern (radial) tires; no Corvair ever had factory power steering because all of them had--as you noticed--light front ends. Beautiful test car, but for the incredibly tacky interior seats AND steering wheel. You'd have to see my totally original ones to agree. Oh, my horn's set in the proper place, too--beneath the cool Monza emblem in the center of the steering wheel. Thanks much for the fine review. Text if you want to buy an original 2nd-gen Corvair; mine is up for grabs.
Or more correctly the Firenza and Opel Manta have more than a whiff of 1965 Covair in their styling. The Firenza and Manta being much later GM cars that used many aspects of the landmark Corvair styling. Chronology always important. Still a lovely car and another great review.
Wow! What a car! The body design is jaw on floor beautiful. Completely different to the normal layout but works beautifully and sounds gorgeous. Also the first working screenwash you've used in New Zealand.
These cars are so simple to work on, you can have the engine out in 30-45 minutes. Jack the car up, put an office chair without a back underneath, support the engine with a floor jack, undo 2 bolts at the rear, lower the engine onto the chair, undo the bolts around the bellhousing, lower the chair and slide out the back from underneath. The engine is all aluminum and very light. I loved my 'vairs!
Wow! Its a real looker with gorgeous curves! Nice dash as well I love the recessed dials, they look like they are in a tubes. Shame about the triangle of doom but then we cant have everything.
I want one of these as well, I need a barn, with small living quarters....
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I'd love to have an old factory converted with a couple of 4 post lifts, inspection pit, every conceivable tool and all types of equipment, carpeted throughout and with a man pad in one corner complete with a combined living room/bedroom come kitchenette and a separate shower room... all mod cons of course! If I ever win the lottery it's happening 😄
Please start a campaign: Save The Sidewalls. Nobody wants low profile tyres. Even most of the people who think they want them probably don't want them.
@Aussie Pom I lived near a main street that was under construction for a while, with sharp asphalt/concrete edges to traverse. Always knew when ridiculously low-profile wheels were going by. "Ka-Bang!"
Hey Ian, watching the video now. A couple things to note about the engine packages. In that year model there were four levels. Base 95 HP dual carb 110 HP with dual carbs 140 HP with the 4 singles. 180 HP turbo charged with a single side draft carb The 140 is probably a favorite at the time since people knew how to work on carbs where the turbo was still new tech for the average home shop or indie shop. The 4 carb version did have some science behind it. Basically the intake pulses helped with the fuel distribution and was probably easier to manufacture over six carbs. There are also conversion kits to place a long runner manifold with a single center carb, but they do have some issues with icing over. Though there was a 150 hp turbo, but it was from 1962 through 1964.
S. Gossett The linkage on the 140 was quite something, though. Four carbs daisy-chained together off a single throttle input. It was a pain to get right, particularly as it became worn.
The logic of the 140 was that it basically had a widely-dispersed four-barrel carb. The two secondaries didn’t open until the throttle was pushed pretty far.
S. Gossett I had two turbos and a 110, but I had a spare 140 sitting in the garage as a potential backup. I had to source the parts for that linkage. Glad I never needed to deal with it. :)
@@seaking2290 I would like to own a 140. Right now I have a future project 64 with a XX code replacement 65 110 block that I am hoping to start restoration on this year (fingers crossed).
What a binge I've had, tip top hubnut, I now have enough footage to catch up on over the weekend, thanks keep up the great work, it's just like being there, and not stuck in dismal grey Manchester 😄✌
The entire center of the wheel was a horn button, and there was a very large detachable hub with a badge that either said Monza or Corsa depending on the model you had. The horn ring was simply part of the system that was another way to put enough pressure on the horn "button" to activate it. Really an odd but elegant design, much like the entire automobile!
What an appealing, lovely car! I absolutely adore it! I actually like the modern chrome alloys weirdly, they actually suit the car! Great video Ian! Well worth waiting for
January 2020, summer, coast, nice shirt, on travel in a beautiful country, COVID was something unknown and a nice American quirky car to drive. Amazing times!
Isn’t it amazing, when the department of transportation did testing of first generation corvairs in 1971. They followed GMs guidelines and found none of the issues Nader claimed in his book. Except when the car was operated outside of the recommended parameters (i.e. the tire pressure). Amazing isn’t it how that one played out. Also while I’m here ranting isn’t it also shocking that the Mustang II is a Pinto based vehicle and yet NO ONE mentioned that during the hole “pintos explode” debacle.
My first car, 65 convertible found a note book under seat, entries up to 395 thousand miles, my main regret is I just didn't change out motor and trans. and keep it. Engine quit on a guy who wanted it . They had the most comfortable seats I've ever owned and a blast to drive, always mad at GM for not giving Porche a run for the money.
There is footage of the tests they performed on the Corvair on UA-cam. They tried really, really, really hard to make the car flip; most of the time it didn't. I believe the car could be encouraged to flip by having too-low tyre pressure at the rear. I noticed the test car also used square-shouldered tyres - the worst choice of tyre for a car with swing-axle suspension. I really, really, really like this car. Thank you for the video :-)
@@HubNut Thank you for the reply :-) It would be interesting to compare the two. I've covered many, many miles in RWD Skodas and found the only issue with the swing axle to be the quality of ride over rough ground (very similar feeling to a live axle). My Fiat 126, however, with too much positive camber, proved to be a bit of a handful...
Grenville Phillips He wasn’t completely wrong. The original Corvair was missing a very important, yet cheap piece of suspension to keep it from tucking under. Corvair’s engineers actually suggested it, but it would’ve added another dollar and a half to the price of the cars and GM couldn’t have that.
At idle it burbles like a V8 but when you accelerate it has the unmistakable, lovely gruffness of a boxer engine. Lovely. It also has a slight look of a Vauxhall Magnum.
The four carburetor version had two primary carburetors and two secondary carburetors. It acted like a four barrel carburetor (like the Quadra jet).The primary carbs were used under normal conditions and the secondary carbs kicked in under heavy acceleration. In the later body style, they had a 95hp, a 110hp, the 140hp 4 barrel, and the 180hp turbo version. I believe the 110hp was the most prevalent in the Monza with some cars with the optional 140hp. I think the 95hp was only in the base 500 model. We had a bunch of Corvairs when I was a kid. They were fun to drive and I still like them.
I loved the Corvair! Never was a poor unloved stepchild so meanly treated! The Imports were actually selling enough cars to show up on the sales charts, America seemed to survey more toward European cars, GM knew they could build a better car than Ford's Falcon, and for less. It's a mash of off the shelf parts- the front brakes were optionally disc, pwr required, the fast steering box was an improvement- for a recirculating ball steering box! Ralph Nader was looking for a handy club to beat on our "profit besotted corporate culture" (I think I got that quote pretty close), the first Corvair had done very badly in the developing NHSTA standards- its single u joints at the center caused excessive roll, tire cupping as you described; Ralph trashed the most innovative car design Detroit had produced since Tucker, just as the bugs were working out. FWIW, the VW was a much more likely rollover, but nobody saw a book deal in it!
I drive through that tunnel daily, turning your lights on was the highlight of the video, thank you! I hope you didn't get pipped by the speed camera at the top of Wainuiomata hill.
Generally cars that are lampooned by history tend to be lovley, this is no exeption, although in defence of mr nader I have a copy of unsafe at any speed and he does have a point on the over arching safety of cars of the era (pointy hard dashboards etc). unfortunatly people picked up on the corvair totally ignoring the most popular import to the us (vw) had a very similar problem if driven in a silly manner! Factoid! apparently the corvair engine was designed to rotate the opposite direction to a vw engine to discourage anyone considering a six cyl beetle or bus. So crown eng in cali made a kit to convert the engine direction, crazy! Top work mr hubnut!
Part of Corvair's problem that the Beetle didn't have, was the Corvair's engine was very very heavy. Way overweight relative to the original plan. This severely exacerbated the tendency to snap-oversteer. Famously, a beloved TV comedian, Ernie Kovacs, was killed at the height of his career when his Corvair wiped out and struck a pole. This sort-of presaged Nader's book. Corvair was only one chapter in Nader's book.
@@boggy7665 I've heard that GM was hoping to use the silicon doping technique that worked eventually in the Vega engine for the Corvair and the 3.5 L Buick-Olds---Rover V8, but it wasn't quite up to snuff, so they had to use iron sleeves. Ed Cole was left holding the bag for both the Corvair safety issues and the undersized cooling system that ruined the otherwise sound design of the Vega engine. When the rotary engine effort failed to deliver in 1973, that was the last straw for his career.
@@boggy7665 I have never seen, heard nor read where a Corvair engine fully dressed at 350lbs was too heavy in a 2300lb Corvair. It is about 100lbs heavier than a VW 1600 but the Vair is also a heavier car running 6 cylinders instead of VW's 4. The issue with the snap oversteer was fixed in 64 (band aid) and re-engineered for good on the 1965 and later. The original Vair used the same axle set up as the VW (swing axle) and GM knew of the tendency to snap. They could have fixed this from the factory at $25 per car with a sway bar, instead they opted to spec the front tire air pressures very low as this would induce understeer well before snap oversteer could ever be attained. Problem with that was grease moneys all over the US paid no attention thus airing the front tires like all other cars...and the result was problematic for sure. I own a 66 Monza 140 4 speed. At 60/40 rear/front weight distribution the car is a joy to drive and handles very nicely.
@@randsonic I think I read it in John Delorean's 'On A Clear Day' book. Maybe not. The Vega engine had silicon-impregnated aluminum cylinders (as Corvair was supposed to have), but they didn't quite get it right for that, either. It's a new one on me that the Vega cooling system was at fault. Modern aluminum engines have that & it clearly works well.
As others have noted, GM's biggest sin was failing to account for their audience. While the Beetle (and also several Porsches and Mercedes) shared the swing axle and its inherent flaws, they also sold to a more iconoclastic crowd who were more prepared to handle something that drove a little differently, and were serviced by people who understood them better (again as noted, the Corvair required something like 18 PSI in the front tires and 25 in the rear, to induce understeer, many got aired up to 30 all around). Not only that, the Corvair had roughly 3 times the power of a Beetle, so again, more able to get itself in trouble if not respected. And, even then, the Nader issue gets blown out of proportion. He acknowledged that by the time Unsafe At Any Speed was published, GM had already started to fix things, just that they dragged their heels on it, and that it was merely emblematic of Detroit's safety problems (another chapter calls out the Mustang for poor handling as well). Furthermore, if GM hadn't engaged in some underhanded actions in trying to discredit Nader, it would have remained an obscure, dry, academic book instead of the myth it is today.
Installing a mid-engine Chevy small block, turns this Corvair into a racing and a street killer. I read a Corvair mid-engine and Porsche 9-14 require an experienced driver. Bad News Mister. Corvair is a trouble free wonderful automobile. My Wife drove a 1965 Corvair Monza automatic red and white convertible for many years and never broke down and never got stuck. Terrific. TD Atlanta
Has to be in the list of the most beautiful cars ever built. I always found it ironic that that health and safety chap chose the most technically advanced, sophisticated American motor to have a go at. Even early ones with swing axles at least had an independent suspension compared to most of its home grown siblings on 200 year old cart springs. Unlike the Herald this has the weight over the rear end and as such I guess harder to break away...though of course when it does it will be harder to catch. Great drive, though it seemed like you had to think about steering the thing? Ha ha I just saw the comment from Max Owers, that is a brilliant observation, 'swole Hillman imp'. And that is just what I remember thinking when the Imp was common, you couldn't help it.
You right, Chevrolet Tahoe just accomplished rear end independent suspension now in 2020 and i do understand it wasn't too necessary to have it in truck based suv, but they had some nice ideas 40 years ago...same goes for Dodge Interceptor with 440hp turbo 4cylinder unfortunately never released to public, because it seems back then there was no demand for small turbo engines which were probably also more expansive to built
@@stephendavidbailey2743 I'm envious Sean..Have you got one now? I have had quite a few Herald based cars..And I can tell you I have had many handling problems and scary moments...Brakes were OK though..
@@martinda7446 Alas no. My last one was destroyed in a storm. But I if I could find someone to maintain it, would love to have another. I am elderly now, and simply haven't the ability to handle the complex maintenance that a Corvair requires for daily driving, which is how I used mine. I had early, late, 3- and 4-speed, automatic, but never a turbo. I had a 1969, built three weeks from the last, a coupe' with a short shift heavy duty 3-speed and quick steering. The factory built the last ones trying to use up leftover parts. My favorite was my 1964 4-speed Monza coupe', but I liked my 1965 automatic Monza coupe' as well. The late model pilarless models are very nice to drive with all the windows down. Currently, I run a 2002 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP and a 1995 Oldsmobile 98.
I loved the first model and admire the second generation shown here even more, what’s not to like (apart from the obvious Naderism) rear mounted flat six, and a design that influenced a generation of cars design world -wide from NSU, BMW, Roots Group, FIAT, actually every manufacturer in existence. Corsair nuts in the US do all sorts to both generation models and there are a fair few with V8s, sacrilege! The Renault R8 mentioned I recall had rear suspension that had negative camber to compensate for the geometry and when loaded with 5 people the gap between the inside edge of the top of the rear wheels seemed about 2 feet shorter than at the road. My Dad’s R8 1100 never fell off the road despite very brisk driving all over the country and regular trans-continental holidays. Surprisingly it didn’t eat rear tyres over much.
@18.40... Look at that..a Nissan Maxima with a rear wiper. Woaar..!! Only you can say that, and it makes me enjoy your reviews even more Ian!! Terrific car. Good content 👍
The sound of this engine is much deeper than the factory version. Back in the day, you always knew when a Corvair was coming by--it sounded like a giant, high powered box fan.
Well...I read "unsafe at any speed" pretty well as soon as it appeared in the UK when I was a very young car geek teenager. I thought Nader had a point, even if the Naders Raiders reputation did his credibility some damage latterly. It was a bad idea to connect a large rear engine to an independent swing axle. The only swing axle that worked was the low CofG type as used by Mercedes, and don't forget they eventually lowered thd CofG on the Triumph Spitfire rear end late on in its life for very good reasons.We already knew about swing axles tendency to sudden oversteer, so it was cost cutting that led to its adoption on the Corvair. In 1958 my dad bought a Borgward Isabella TS....with independent swing axle, then we had two Triumph Heralds in a row for mum, and I learned to drive on the 12/50 so I got to learn about swing axles at the sharp end as it were.....and they certainly could behave treacherously if you lifted off mid corner. My judgement on the Corvair is that it was an exciting lost opportunity. It was imaginative and good looking and could have been a runaway success worldwide. A Porsche anyone could have afforded maybe ?
Driven both, Corvairs and Heralds. The herald rear end is LETHAL. Manys the driver who got caught out on rainy day in the herald. But Corvairs ,even with the popular Chev V8 conversion are a great drive on a winding road.
@@Mercmad I agree about Herald rear suspension (I spun one and hit a barrier, and, sadly, wrote it off). Mechanically, the Herald is virtually the same as a Spitfire. The Spitfire MkIV model had a pivoting leaf spring, which eliminated roll stiffness at the rear. The front suspension got a much stiffer anti-roll bar to compensate, and the overall handling was good. The Mercedes version of swing-axles was low-pivot, not low CoG. The low pivot hugely reduced the jacking effect, but did not eliminate it. The Gullwing 300SL had this suspension, and was prone to spinning and other misbehaviour - the least good aspect of a car which was very technically advanced for its day.
@Jody Owen You didn't mention that the Herald and Spitfire had superb front suspension and steering - all the Lotus cars of the '60s to mid '70s (the 7 and all Elan derivatives, but not the Europa) used Triumph front suspension and steering parts. The Caterham 7 still does... and the electrical control stalks behind the wheel were advanced. So it wasn't all junk..... Oh, and in '64 and '65, Triumph competed at Le Mans with mildly modified Spitfires, and did very well indeed. Winning your class is 'doing well'. They also did well in rallying, such as the '65 Alpine Rally. With hotted up road cars against Porsche 904 and the like.... Not bad for a 'junk' car
@@paulstandeven8572 I had a MK3 Spitfire which could be pretty hairy round corners.Then I got a MK4 which was safer but not so much fun to drive.Loved the ease of access to the motor on both.
I have been looking forward to this video. Superb video & a really good hubnut roadtest. Has to be one of my favourite american cars. Shame about the triangle of doom. Exhaust sounds fantastic.
What a beautiful car! Ralph Nader's main complaints about the Corvair were the swing axles, and the solid steering shaft with the steering box mounted above and in front of the steering gear. The rear suspension, as Ian says, gives interesting handling at the limit, and the steering shaft would push the wheel back and up in a front end crash, with no engine to absorb some of the impact. That said, in the early 60s safety was not a consideration amongst the Corvair's competitors either (although the Valiant did have a collapsible steering column), so he could have picked on many American cars, live rear axle, cart springs and all. So, while your Corvair was going backwards off the road, your Falcon would be plowing straight ahead into the tree... (They had fixed that by the time they made Betty)
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From some angles it puts me in mind a Manta A... especially the front quarter on view. Beautiful cars 😊
You were just down the road where I live. A good spot Seaview for driving around a beautiful car. They do drag races down there (legal that is!). Hope you are enjoying Wellington Ian. Sorry I would of liked to catch up with you but unfortunately I have a young family. Enjoy your last couple of days in NZ until you go to Aussie. I from NI originally and lived here 12 years and I done the same thing as you only I stayed here!!!
I can't help but see the fan on top of that engine and imagine a Briggs & Stratton flat twin on a riding lawn mower, just looks somewhat, well, hilarious!!! :D
Thank you, I like this car too. I had a 1966 VW Fastback, n I too was really pleasantly surprised how hot the heater from rear mounted engine could get. I always had to crack my windows everything I used the defogger 🙂
They were fine after 1963 (they changed the suspension before they changed the bodies), but by then the damage had been done. Chevrolet came out with the totally conventional Chevy II (aka the Nova) for the compact market, and it was a better seller than the Corvair, so they phased the Corvair out.
@@seed_drill7135 I don't know the full story but I get the impression that Ralph Nader wanted to make a point about car safety at the time (fair enough) but he unfairly went for the jugular with the Corvair. It had its faults but then so did the 911, that could be a scary car at times with the oversteer but that never got the excessive bad press that the Corvair did. Ralph made a name for himself at the cost of the Corvair and IMO I think its a decent car.....just drive it properly.
@@graemew7001 The original owners manual of the Corvair mandated different PSI for different tires to "correct" the handling issues that Chevrolet was aware of when they released the car to the public, but that fact was not adequately emphasized to the buying public. Also, it was an economy car. With sports cars, it's generally assumed higher driver's skills and caveat emptor. There is also lag time between the research and publication of any book like Unsafe At Any Speed. The Corvair came out in late 1959, as a 1960 model. By the time the book came out in 1965 the handling issues had been addressed by abandoning the swing arm suspension.
Aesthetically pleasing automobile. Probably one of the sleekest american designs of the era
I like how UA-cam's auto-generated captions list the Corvair's exhaust note as "[Music]". And as for the heating, the first year of the Corvair (1960) came with a gasoline-powered heater, for very brisk (but potentially dangerous) heat output. In 1961 they switched to a more conventional (for an air-cooled engine) but less effective system of using the engine's exhaust to warm the air via heat exchangers.
VW used exhaust heat exchangers. Corvair used heat from cylinders, heads, and exhaust manifolds.
GM knew how to style cars. My word!!! The Chevrolets of the time had such sharp lines; sharper than most modern cars.
What an extraordinary car. Such beautiful lines, never to see again I'm afraid...
This Corvair is bloody beautiful. I can see similar lines of the Holden HQ Monaro 2 door.
Yes, I drove a 63 Corvair for several years back in the 70,s. Power glide with shift on the dash. It was very drivable!
My dad owned a 1965 Corvair. Corvairs are the reason I love Chevy.😀
Lovely review of the best Corvair ever. Beautifully sculpted "Body by Fisher". Franklin Automobiles of Syracuse, New York, designed and produced air-cooled automobiles from 1903 until 1934.
Alas, Franklin's were mostly of conventional layout, i.e. front engine, rear wheel drive. The full sized 1948 Tucker Torpedo had a rear mounted 6-cylinder boxer engine converted from air cooling to water cooling..
At one time, I owned five Corvairs. My last one was a 1964 Monza Coupe with a 4-speed manual. An absolute joy to drive, especially on winding roads. I found that the steering/handling was much better with 30lbs. tire pressure all around. The recommended 14 front 27 rear resulted in slow, vague steering - much like front engine, rear drive US cars of the period.
I used to own a '66 Corvair Turbo Coupe, 180 HP, Artesian Turquoise, headrest seats, fold-down rear seat. The '64 and above Corvair's rear wheels did not tuck under, they stayed flat around corners. Just a wonderful car to drive and the sound of a flat-six is amazing!
Gracias', amigo, for a fun and informative video. General Motors / Chevrolet did indeed design a lovely, unique compact. I understand that when GM discovered the car had a bit much oversteer in corners due to the lightweight nose -- rather than providing a sway bar, their solution was to instruct owners to keep front tire pressure at ... 18 pounds! Of course no owners nor mechanics paid much attention. There are aftermarket sway bars nowadays which helps the car handle much better, especially with modern radial tires. Speaking of tires ... some of the Corvairs had the spare tire stuck in the back next to the engine! The owner of this car wisely moved it to the front where its weight can be put to good use.
It's a beautiful car.
In 1971, I bought a 1966 Corvair Corsa, the top performance model, powered by a turbocharged version of the flat 6 engine, producing 180 horsepower. It handled great, and was the first car I drove over 100 mph, getting it up to 103 mph on a deserted Los Angeles freeway at around 3 in the morning.......
Also....I picked up the Corvair for the outrageous sum of $750.......
My goodness, hitting 100 in a Corvair could be a might dicey 😆
I haven't gone above 85 yet, but I'd give it a try if I get the chance.
@@ShrockWPSI haven’t gone above 40 in mine haha! Although I do live in a choked up city.
@@bbrs925
I drive interstate everyday to get to work so hitting 70 is pretty normal and it handles that very well.
Anything above that though and I start posting real close attention to everything because it ain't so smooth.
Car could really use a fifth gear.
What a sweet looking little mill .
I loved my 65 Monza.
You went over the Wainuiomata Hill, a road I've driven over for many years and as a child in the family's Triumph 2500 and my Fathers very rusty Ford Escort van back in the 1980s 👍 Love the sound of that engine, a very cool car.
A reminder of what a fabulous car the Corvair was. Thank you!
Intriguing bit of American automotive kit...enjoyed your "hill climb"...like a champ, Ian.
Pillar-less roof design !!! How beautiful, neat, and clean lines.
That was a typical design feature of American cars from the 50's to the 70's. Nowadays, cars are all 4-door wide-pillar eyesore. HubNut is the only car reviewer I have seen who talks about this exceptional design feature.
Magnum p.i wants his shirt back 😉
I know what you're thinking, and you're probably right.
What a gorgeous car! If a manufacturer made a car that looked like that with modern mechanicals or electric drivetrain, I reckon they would sell like hot cakes!
I Bought a 1965 CORVAIR new in Februauy 1966 and put over 300,000 miles on it. One thing you missed is that the Gen 2 CORVAIR did not have the swing axle rear suspension there were two universal joints on each axle.so that the camber of the rear wheels was almost completely straight up and down. With a good set of radial tires and proper inflation 15 lbs front and 30 lbs rear the wandering you experienced is greatly reduced. I was living in Nova Scotia when I bought the car and I drove it completely across the North American continent I believe it was 3 round trips as well as having driven it from Victoria BC south to San FrancisoI and back. The car origionally it was a 95 hp 4 speed car with positraction and a 3.23 to 1 rear gear set I later sapped in a 140 hp 4 carburetor engine and the matching 3.55:1 matching rear end.
As an enthusiastic Corvair owner since 1969, automotive journalist since 1977, and Society of Automotive Engineers affiliate since 1985 all I can say is... excellent job!
A couple minor quibbles: True, Detroit was slow to adopt disc brakes, but the second-generation Corvair shared its brakes with the heavier GM intermediates, and with considerable weight in the rear the brakes at that end actually played a role in stopping. So in a USA-1960s setting, late Corvair brakes are very good. As for the wipers, they seemed fine in their era, when many contemporary cars had a foot-wide-plus unswept portion of windshield in the upper center. Too many of today's cars sweep an area that nobody looks through and deposit what they've wiped in front of the driver. I don't see that as an improvement.
The rear suspension appears to have a kit installed to lower the center attachment points of the lower links. I don't recall the advantage it was supposed to impart, but I never felt the need to mess with the underpinnings of my '65 Corsa convertible.
About 15 minutes in, it's possible for the viewer to think this car may have swing axles, like the '64 Monza coupe I currently own. That's the greatest potential for misunderstanding in the review, though you correctly note the rear suspension changed completely for the second generation. For the record, the 1965-69 Corvair did not use swing axles.
The wheels installed appear to widen the car's track, which would increase the steering effort required at low speed. Also, I agree sidewalls are part of a car's suspension, need to be there, and today's super-low-profile tires are a scourge. I was recently driving a Renault Kadjar in Ireland and it was tough enough staying to the left with RHD. Nice job of staying to the left in a car with LHD - and thanks for a thoroughly enjoyable video!
I seem to recall some people doubting the safety of disk brakes back in the day. They were different enough in feel and wet weather could catch people out.
It's true the passenger side wiper throws all of its wiped water right in front of the driver if it swings wide, but with a well maintained (cleaned regularly, polished occasionally) windshield that's not really a problem since most of that gust of water sheets right off and whatever is left is almost immediately caught by the downswing of the drivers side wiper.
Now that triangle of doom is only a real issue if it's right in front of the driver, which it isn't on most older cars with wide low windscreens (the narrower and/or higher the windshield gets, the closer that triangle of doom moves over to the driver), but the dribble of disappointment is still annoying, which is why I'm not a great fan of claphand wipers either.
The "monopost" wiper Mercedes-Benz used to have was probably one of the best designs, such a shame they went the cost-cutting "do what everybody else is doing" route.
Paul Neidermeyer over at CurbsideClassic has written extensively and fairly even-handedly about this car. He's a big fan, but very much acknowledges the handling issues that the early ones had. This car has the later suspension, so the criticisms do not apply. The swing axle ones were also fine, in the hands of capable drivers, but this was a family car, and the typical driver would not know how the rear end could bite you in emergency situations. His view is that GM had effectively blown it with this car before Nader's book came out. Fascinating story and a beautiful car!
Wow. Super rare. Very very cool car.
That's a fantastic looking car.
Ian it's one of the most beautiful things I've seen in a long time
I've owned a '65 convertible since 1983. The gas guage most likely has a bad ground. When the belt is adjusted correctly, the belt works well. The Monza is the middle the priced model. Added carpet, trim, bucket seats and a few other things. Two carbs were standard, The top model was the Corsa and had the 4 carbs or turbo. Also more gauges. That is factory original oil filter design. One of the first cars with the "spin on" filters. You don't spin it to remove however. Brakes did work well compared to other American cars of that era. Great video. A Corvair on HubNut is very unexpected. Great times.
The Sound is lovely
As a US citizen I owned.a 66’ Monza. I loved that car. It wasn’t exactly a rocket ship, but would wind out to 115 mph. As far as handing it puts to shame a lot of modern cars. I had a 90* corner into my neighbor that I could whip thru at 50 mph in a nice 4 wheel drift. 50 years later I still wish I had that car.
Corvair was always a great car, fun to drive, beautiful to look at and the flat six air cooled engine has a sexy sound. What's not to love about it.
The 57 possible places for the engine to leak oil when it ages...
I had a 66 Monza/140hp (the option between the 110 and the 180turbo) /four carbs/four speed. The four carbs worked VERY well by the way. The rear suspension on the 2nc gen car (65 and later) was actually better than the Corvette of the day. Loved that car. Would like to have it back again. Learned a lot about driving in that car. It made me want to learn more.
I just saw a Corvair sedan yesterday, same vintage. Black. Surprised, haven't seen one in decades! I like GM vehicles.
I have always loved the Corvair . Beautiful and interesting
Beautiful styling i think. It looks good from every angle.
This video keeps me coming for another watch over and over again. I love this gorgeous car, with its unusual mechanicals and great soundtrack. Pete 🇬🇧
"This remarkable American car," your closing assessment, is sincerely appreciated by this Yankee ('67) Corvair Monza 110 "hardtop" owner. With 70,000 original miles and factory air and factory 8-track, my marina-blue beauty is even more amazing! Nadar's 1965 book, "Unsafe at any Speed," only devoted the first chapter to "The Sporty Corvair," and, as you rightly indicated, the suspension upgrades/ improvements (actually introduced in 1964) already had made his analysis obsolete. Nadar's book is really about the "designed-in" aesthetic features of American-made cars that made so many of them death-traps--a legitimate gripe that led to the massive safety recalls we enjoy today, which is a good outcome. Great observations regarding the car's heavy steering with modern (radial) tires; no Corvair ever had factory power steering because all of them had--as you noticed--light front ends.
Beautiful test car, but for the incredibly tacky interior seats AND steering wheel. You'd have to see my totally original ones to agree. Oh, my horn's set in the proper place, too--beneath the cool Monza emblem in the center of the steering wheel. Thanks much for the fine review. Text if you want to buy an original 2nd-gen Corvair; mine is up for grabs.
When it comes right down to it no matter what car it is it all boils down to the nut that holds the wheel. That car is a real classic
HubNut translation service: referring to the bend in the tunnel: "It's a bit too sharp for nailing it".
I was wondering if that was it. I think 'nailing her' even. Which is... Odd.
to "nail it" to open the throttle as far as possible giving the impression the peddle has been "nailed to the floor of the car".
Stunning car. One for the dream garage. Another great video- thanks HN!
Series 2 Corvair Monza, what an amazing looking car!
There’s a whiff of Firenza in the side profile, I reckon
That’s a lovely car and another great review 👍
Or Opel Manta.....
And just a hint of Consul capri
Or more correctly the Firenza and Opel Manta have more than a whiff of 1965 Covair in their styling. The Firenza and Manta being much later GM cars that used many aspects of the landmark Corvair styling. Chronology always important.
Still a lovely car and another great review.
I can see a lot of GM lineage too, grille and headlights very reminicent of Cresta / Viscount. Even the edition name carried on in the Opel Monza.
More like a miniture version of the 1965 IMPALA.
Wow! What a car! The body design is jaw on floor beautiful. Completely different to the normal layout but works beautifully and sounds gorgeous. Also the first working screenwash you've used in New Zealand.
First working screen wash though sadly massive triangle of doom.
Thanks for risking your life to make this video.
Amen, Brother. I risked my life just yesterday for more than 100 miles driving my Monza my most pleasant death-wish!
drive cam is the best angle i've seen so far.
Laughed at the auto generated subtitles which appropriately after your explanation of the swing axle, transcribed "Triumph Herald" as "trying peril"
What a great car, thanks for letting us enjoy it with you 😁
These cars are so simple to work on, you can have the engine out in 30-45 minutes. Jack the car up, put an office chair without a back underneath, support the engine with a floor jack, undo 2 bolts at the rear, lower the engine onto the chair, undo the bolts around the bellhousing, lower the chair and slide out the back from underneath. The engine is all aluminum and very light. I loved my 'vairs!
The 2nd gen Corvair is beautiful from any angle. Thanks for making this video.
That engine sounds fabulous- Im completely in love, that tunnel was like... phwoaaaarr
Wow! Its a real looker with gorgeous curves! Nice dash as well I love the recessed dials, they look like they are in a tubes.
Shame about the triangle of doom but then we cant have everything.
It looked as if wipers of the next size up would have cleared the moldings and shrunk that triangle a bit.
I want one of these as well, I need a barn, with small living quarters....
I'd love to have an old factory converted with a couple of 4 post lifts, inspection pit, every conceivable tool and all types of equipment, carpeted throughout and with a man pad in one corner complete with a combined living room/bedroom come kitchenette and a separate shower room... all mod cons of course!
If I ever win the lottery it's happening 😄
Always loved these, up there with NSU Ro80 for me. As always a real review, balanced. Very much enjoyed it!
I remember seeing these later models of Corvairs loaded up on transport trains...all new cars from the factory in the late 1960s.
Please start a campaign: Save The Sidewalls.
Nobody wants low profile tyres. Even most of the people who think they want them probably don't want them.
@Aussie Pom I lived near a main street that was under construction for a while, with sharp asphalt/concrete edges to traverse. Always knew when ridiculously low-profile wheels were going by. "Ka-Bang!"
@Aussie Pom The real kicker is they are heavier. So you increase the unsprung weight rather than reduce it.
save the sidewalls!!!!
Rubbish. Low profile tires enhance handling because they don't flex and bounce as much.
@@gamewizard1760 yes but how often do you drive on a track? :-)
Hey Ian, watching the video now. A couple things to note about the engine packages. In that year model there were four levels.
Base 95 HP dual carb
110 HP with dual carbs
140 HP with the 4 singles.
180 HP turbo charged with a single side draft carb
The 140 is probably a favorite at the time since people knew how to work on carbs where the turbo was still new tech for the average home shop or indie shop.
The 4 carb version did have some science behind it. Basically the intake pulses helped with the fuel distribution and was probably easier to manufacture over six carbs. There are also conversion kits to place a long runner manifold with a single center carb, but they do have some issues with icing over.
Though there was a 150 hp turbo, but it was from 1962 through 1964.
S. Gossett The linkage on the 140 was quite something, though. Four carbs daisy-chained together off a single throttle input. It was a pain to get right, particularly as it became worn.
The logic of the 140 was that it basically had a widely-dispersed four-barrel carb. The two secondaries didn’t open until the throttle was pushed pretty far.
@@seaking2290 that is interesting. I've owned the dual carb models and the turbo, but I've never had my hands on a 140.
S. Gossett I had two turbos and a 110, but I had a spare 140 sitting in the garage as a potential backup. I had to source the parts for that linkage. Glad I never needed to deal with it. :)
@@seaking2290 I would like to own a 140. Right now I have a future project 64 with a XX code replacement 65 110 block that I am hoping to start restoration on this year (fingers crossed).
What a beauty!!!! Awesome car!
Bit of BMW 3.0Csi in the looks department. Glorious :)
It sounds great .. the dual headlights and dash remind me of the Vauxhall Ventora , love the almost charger like side view with the windows down.
Like the early Pontiac GTOs
What a binge I've had, tip top hubnut, I now have enough footage to catch up on over the weekend, thanks keep up the great work, it's just like being there, and not stuck in dismal grey Manchester 😄✌
Ahhh yes. The swole Hillman Imp. I've always liked these!
The Hillman Imp came out AFTER the Corvair and stole it's styling. So did the NSU Prinz 4.
@@gamewizard1760 Hillman stole the styling? I'm laughing my socks off! Have you actually seen an Imp? Which bits of the design did they 'steal'? 🙄
FYI: The original steering wheel would have had a horn ring. Which is why with the aftermarket wheel, the horn has been moved to a button on the dash.
I think a couple of my dad's cars had horn rings. Trying to remember which ones - maybe the '61 Hillman Minx (but it's a long time ago).
But that wheel had a centre horn push - that should have been used !
@@millomweb Agreed, not sure why they didnt. Maybe the slip ring was different?
The entire center of the wheel was a horn button, and there was a very large detachable hub with a badge that either said Monza or Corsa depending on the model you had. The horn ring was simply part of the system that was another way to put enough pressure on the horn "button" to activate it. Really an odd but elegant design, much like the entire automobile!
If got the “Corsa” model, you got a more elaborate dashboard with more gauges.
Great review and lovely car! Years ago I had a 1970 Vauxhall VX4/90 FD. looks like the same committee approved the front end styling.
Thanks Ian, never been for a ride in a Corvair before, enjoyed it very much.
What an appealing, lovely car! I absolutely adore it! I actually like the modern chrome alloys weirdly, they actually suit the car! Great video Ian! Well worth waiting for
January 2020, summer, coast, nice shirt, on travel in a beautiful country, COVID was something unknown and a nice American quirky car to drive. Amazing times!
What a handsome car. I can see where the FD Victor got its inspiration from.
Isn’t it amazing, when the department of transportation did testing of first generation corvairs in 1971. They followed GMs guidelines and found none of the issues Nader claimed in his book. Except when the car was operated outside of the recommended parameters (i.e. the tire pressure). Amazing isn’t it how that one played out.
Also while I’m here ranting isn’t it also shocking that the Mustang II is a Pinto based vehicle and yet NO ONE mentioned that during the hole “pintos explode” debacle.
Sounds like a WW2 Spitfire when you get it up to speed on the dual carriageway.... superb.
I thought that, definitely a whiff of Merlin sometimes, geat looking and sounding car.
My first car, 65 convertible found a note book under seat, entries up to 395 thousand miles, my main regret is I just didn't change out motor and trans. and keep it. Engine quit on a guy who wanted it . They had the most comfortable seats I've ever owned and a blast to drive, always mad at GM for not giving Porche a run for the money.
There is footage of the tests they performed on the Corvair on UA-cam. They tried really, really, really hard to make the car flip; most of the time it didn't. I believe the car could be encouraged to flip by having too-low tyre pressure at the rear. I noticed the test car also used square-shouldered tyres - the worst choice of tyre for a car with swing-axle suspension.
I really, really, really like this car. Thank you for the video :-)
Thankfully the second generation doesn't have swing-axle suspension.
@@HubNut Thank you for the reply :-) It would be interesting to compare the two. I've covered many, many miles in RWD Skodas and found the only issue with the swing axle to be the quality of ride over rough ground (very similar feeling to a live axle). My Fiat 126, however, with too much positive camber, proved to be a bit of a handful...
Excellent video , always wanted to know how the Corvair drives in reality . Nice shirt btw, now you actually look like you're on holiday 😎👍
A truly beautiful car. It is gratifying to learn that Nader should be added to the long list of alarmists of that era.
Grenville Phillips He wasn’t completely wrong. The original Corvair was missing a very important, yet cheap piece of suspension to keep it from tucking under. Corvair’s engineers actually suggested it, but it would’ve added another dollar and a half to the price of the cars and GM couldn’t have that.
At idle it burbles like a V8 but when you accelerate it has the unmistakable, lovely gruffness of a boxer engine. Lovely.
It also has a slight look of a Vauxhall Magnum.
The four carburetor version had two primary carburetors and two secondary carburetors. It acted like a four barrel carburetor (like the Quadra jet).The primary carbs were used under normal conditions and the secondary carbs kicked in under heavy acceleration. In the later body style, they had a 95hp, a 110hp, the 140hp 4 barrel, and the 180hp turbo version. I believe the 110hp was the most prevalent in the Monza with some cars with the optional 140hp. I think the 95hp was only in the base 500 model. We had a bunch of Corvairs when I was a kid. They were fun to drive and I still like them.
I loved the Corvair! Never was a poor unloved stepchild so meanly treated! The Imports were actually selling enough cars to show up on the sales charts, America seemed to survey more toward European cars, GM knew they could build a better car than Ford's Falcon, and for less. It's a mash of off the shelf parts- the front brakes were optionally disc, pwr required, the fast steering box was an improvement- for a recirculating ball steering box! Ralph Nader was looking for a handy club to beat on our "profit besotted corporate culture" (I think I got that quote pretty close), the first Corvair had done very badly in the developing NHSTA standards- its single u joints at the center caused excessive roll, tire cupping as you described; Ralph trashed the most innovative car design Detroit had produced since Tucker, just as the bugs were working out. FWIW, the VW was a much more likely rollover, but nobody saw a book deal in it!
Thank you for this lovely looking and sounding car. Nice colour too. Cheers.
Been wondering in the back of my mind what these are like. Very sweet motor.
The plate should read U.S 911.
Sounds just like one!
Nowadays there are ways that plate could be misinterpreted, though...
Oh yes!!
I drive through that tunnel daily, turning your lights on was the highlight of the video, thank you! I hope you didn't get pipped by the speed camera at the top of Wainuiomata hill.
Generally cars that are lampooned by history tend to be lovley, this is no exeption, although in defence of mr nader I have a copy of unsafe at any speed and he does have a point on the over arching safety of cars of the era (pointy hard dashboards etc). unfortunatly people picked up on the corvair totally ignoring the most popular import to the us (vw) had a very similar problem if driven in a silly manner! Factoid! apparently the corvair engine was designed to rotate the opposite direction to a vw engine to discourage anyone considering a six cyl beetle or bus. So crown eng in cali made a kit to convert the engine direction, crazy!
Top work mr hubnut!
Part of Corvair's problem that the Beetle didn't have, was the Corvair's engine was very very heavy. Way overweight relative to the original plan. This severely exacerbated the tendency to snap-oversteer. Famously, a beloved TV comedian, Ernie Kovacs, was killed at the height of his career when his Corvair wiped out and struck a pole. This sort-of presaged Nader's book. Corvair was only one chapter in Nader's book.
@@boggy7665 I've heard that GM was hoping to use the silicon doping technique that worked eventually in the Vega engine for the Corvair and the 3.5 L Buick-Olds---Rover V8, but it wasn't quite up to snuff, so they had to use iron sleeves. Ed Cole was left holding the bag for both the Corvair safety issues and the undersized cooling system that ruined the otherwise sound design of the Vega engine. When the rotary engine effort failed to deliver in 1973, that was the last straw for his career.
@@boggy7665 I have never seen, heard nor read where a Corvair engine fully dressed at 350lbs was too heavy in a 2300lb Corvair. It is about 100lbs heavier than a VW 1600 but the Vair is also a heavier car running 6 cylinders instead of VW's 4. The issue with the snap oversteer was fixed in 64 (band aid) and re-engineered for good on the 1965 and later. The original Vair used the same axle set up as the VW (swing axle) and GM knew of the tendency to snap. They could have fixed this from the factory at $25 per car with a sway bar, instead they opted to spec the front tire air pressures very low as this would induce understeer well before snap oversteer could ever be attained. Problem with that was grease moneys all over the US paid no attention thus airing the front tires like all other cars...and the result was problematic for sure. I own a 66 Monza 140 4 speed. At 60/40 rear/front weight distribution the car is a joy to drive and handles very nicely.
@@randsonic I think I read it in John Delorean's 'On A Clear Day' book. Maybe not. The Vega engine had silicon-impregnated aluminum cylinders (as Corvair was supposed to have), but they didn't quite get it right for that, either. It's a new one on me that the Vega cooling system was at fault. Modern aluminum engines have that & it clearly works well.
As others have noted, GM's biggest sin was failing to account for their audience. While the Beetle (and also several Porsches and Mercedes) shared the swing axle and its inherent flaws, they also sold to a more iconoclastic crowd who were more prepared to handle something that drove a little differently, and were serviced by people who understood them better (again as noted, the Corvair required something like 18 PSI in the front tires and 25 in the rear, to induce understeer, many got aired up to 30 all around). Not only that, the Corvair had roughly 3 times the power of a Beetle, so again, more able to get itself in trouble if not respected.
And, even then, the Nader issue gets blown out of proportion. He acknowledged that by the time Unsafe At Any Speed was published, GM had already started to fix things, just that they dragged their heels on it, and that it was merely emblematic of Detroit's safety problems (another chapter calls out the Mustang for poor handling as well). Furthermore, if GM hadn't engaged in some underhanded actions in trying to discredit Nader, it would have remained an obscure, dry, academic book instead of the myth it is today.
What a beautiful classic car 😁👍
Installing a mid-engine Chevy small block, turns this Corvair into a racing and a street killer. I read a Corvair mid-engine and Porsche 9-14 require an experienced driver. Bad News Mister. Corvair is a trouble free wonderful automobile. My Wife drove a 1965 Corvair Monza automatic red and white convertible for many years and never broke down and never got stuck. Terrific. TD Atlanta
Has to be in the list of the most beautiful cars ever built.
I always found it ironic that that health and safety chap chose the most technically advanced, sophisticated American motor to have a go at. Even early ones with swing axles at least had an independent suspension compared to most of its home grown siblings on 200 year old cart springs. Unlike the Herald this has the weight over the rear end and as such I guess harder to break away...though of course when it does it will be harder to catch.
Great drive, though it seemed like you had to think about steering the thing?
Ha ha I just saw the comment from Max Owers, that is a brilliant observation, 'swole Hillman imp'. And that is just what I remember thinking when the Imp was common, you couldn't help it.
You right, Chevrolet Tahoe just accomplished rear end independent suspension now in 2020 and i do understand it wasn't too necessary to have it in truck based suv, but they had some nice ideas 40 years ago...same goes for Dodge Interceptor with 440hp turbo 4cylinder unfortunately never released to public, because it seems back then there was no demand for small turbo engines which were probably also more expansive to built
@@tallll70 Wow it took them a 120 years to get all four wheels to bounce on their own!
I owned many Corvairs. Never, ever had a handling problem, scary moment or inadequate brakes.
@@stephendavidbailey2743 I'm envious Sean..Have you got one now?
I have had quite a few Herald based cars..And I can tell you I have had many handling problems and scary moments...Brakes were OK though..
@@martinda7446 Alas no. My last one was destroyed in a storm. But I if I could find someone to maintain it, would love to have another. I am elderly now, and simply haven't the ability to handle the complex maintenance that a Corvair requires for daily driving, which is how I used mine. I had early, late, 3- and 4-speed, automatic, but never a turbo. I had a 1969, built three weeks from the last, a coupe' with a short shift heavy duty 3-speed and quick steering. The factory built the last ones trying to use up leftover parts. My favorite was my 1964 4-speed Monza coupe', but I liked my 1965 automatic Monza coupe' as well. The late model pilarless models are very nice to drive with all the windows down. Currently, I run a 2002 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP and a 1995 Oldsmobile 98.
I loved the first model and admire the second generation shown here even more, what’s not to like (apart from the obvious Naderism) rear mounted flat six, and a design that influenced a generation of cars design world -wide from NSU, BMW, Roots Group, FIAT, actually every manufacturer in existence.
Corsair nuts in the US do all sorts to both generation models and there are a fair few with V8s, sacrilege!
The Renault R8 mentioned I recall had rear suspension that had negative camber to compensate for the geometry and when loaded with 5 people the gap between the inside edge of the top of the rear wheels seemed about 2 feet shorter than at the road. My Dad’s R8 1100 never fell off the road despite very brisk driving all over the country and regular trans-continental holidays. Surprisingly it didn’t eat rear tyres over much.
@18.40... Look at that..a Nissan Maxima with a rear wiper. Woaar..!! Only you can say that, and it makes me enjoy your reviews even more Ian!! Terrific car. Good content 👍
The sound of this engine is much deeper than the factory version. Back in the day, you always knew when a Corvair was coming by--it sounded like a giant, high powered box fan.
Well...I read "unsafe at any speed" pretty well as soon as it appeared in the UK when I was a very young car geek teenager. I thought Nader had a point, even if the Naders Raiders reputation did his credibility some damage latterly. It was a bad idea to connect a large rear engine to an independent swing axle. The only swing axle that worked was the low CofG type as used by Mercedes, and don't forget they eventually lowered thd CofG on the Triumph Spitfire rear end late on in its life for very good reasons.We already knew about swing axles tendency to sudden oversteer, so it was cost cutting that led to its adoption on the Corvair.
In 1958 my dad bought a Borgward Isabella TS....with independent swing axle, then we had two Triumph Heralds in a row for mum, and I learned to drive on the 12/50 so I got to learn about swing axles at the sharp end as it were.....and they certainly could behave treacherously if you lifted off mid corner. My judgement on the Corvair is that it was an exciting lost opportunity. It was imaginative and good looking and could have been a runaway success worldwide. A Porsche anyone could have afforded maybe ?
Driven both, Corvairs and Heralds. The herald rear end is LETHAL. Manys the driver who got caught out on rainy day in the herald. But Corvairs ,even with the popular Chev V8 conversion are a great drive on a winding road.
@@Mercmad I agree about Herald rear suspension (I spun one and hit a barrier, and, sadly, wrote it off). Mechanically, the Herald is virtually the same as a Spitfire. The Spitfire MkIV model had a pivoting leaf spring, which eliminated roll stiffness at the rear. The front suspension got a much stiffer anti-roll bar to compensate, and the overall handling was good.
The Mercedes version of swing-axles was low-pivot, not low CoG. The low pivot hugely reduced the jacking effect, but did not eliminate it. The Gullwing 300SL had this suspension, and was prone to spinning and other misbehaviour - the least good aspect of a car which was very technically advanced for its day.
@Jody Owen You didn't mention that the Herald and Spitfire had superb front suspension and steering - all the Lotus cars of the '60s to mid '70s (the 7 and all Elan derivatives, but not the Europa) used Triumph front suspension and steering parts. The Caterham 7 still does... and the electrical control stalks behind the wheel were advanced. So it wasn't all junk.....
Oh, and in '64 and '65, Triumph competed at Le Mans with mildly modified Spitfires, and did very well indeed. Winning your class is 'doing well'. They also did well in rallying, such as the '65 Alpine Rally. With hotted up road cars against Porsche 904 and the like.... Not bad for a 'junk' car
@@paulstandeven8572 I had a MK3 Spitfire which could be pretty hairy round corners.Then I got a MK4 which was safer but not so much fun to drive.Loved the ease of access to the motor on both.
Enjoyed that, nice car, nice warmth from the scenery too
I have been looking forward to this video. Superb video & a really good hubnut roadtest. Has to be one of my favourite american cars. Shame about the triangle of doom. Exhaust sounds fantastic.
I must admit, I bloody love that car, they are rare as here in Denmark... lovely review.
What a beautiful car! Ralph Nader's main complaints about the Corvair were the swing axles, and the solid steering shaft with the steering box mounted above and in front of the steering gear. The rear suspension, as Ian says, gives interesting handling at the limit, and the steering shaft would push the wheel back and up in a front end crash, with no engine to absorb some of the impact. That said, in the early 60s safety was not a consideration amongst the Corvair's competitors either (although the Valiant did have a collapsible steering column), so he could have picked on many American cars, live rear axle, cart springs and all. So, while your Corvair was going backwards off the road, your Falcon would be plowing straight ahead into the tree... (They had fixed that by the time they made Betty)
From some angles it puts me in mind a Manta A... especially the front quarter on view.
Beautiful cars 😊
You were just down the road where I live. A good spot Seaview for driving around a beautiful car. They do drag races down there (legal that is!). Hope you are enjoying Wellington Ian. Sorry I would of liked to catch up with you but unfortunately I have a young family. Enjoy your last couple of days in NZ until you go to Aussie. I from NI originally and lived here 12 years and I done the same thing as you only I stayed here!!!
Funny coincidence : I just bought an MX5 from over there.[Gough Rd]
A joyous drive. Love the photography in this video. It sets the Corvair off nicely. When cars had proper steering wheels Indeed. Thanks!
Beautiful looking car, and I love the t shirt too, makes me feel like summer which we need back home Ian
I can't help but see the fan on top of that engine and imagine a Briggs & Stratton flat twin on a riding lawn mower, just looks somewhat, well, hilarious!!! :D
Thank you, I like this car too.
I had a 1966 VW Fastback, n I too was really pleasantly surprised how hot the heater
from rear mounted engine could get. I always had to crack my windows everything I used the defogger 🙂
If a car has a bad reputation then give it to Ian, he'll tell you the unbiased truth about it. Thats a nice car, looks very relaxing to drive.
They were fine after 1963 (they changed the suspension before they changed the bodies), but by then the damage had been done. Chevrolet came out with the totally conventional Chevy II (aka the Nova) for the compact market, and it was a better seller than the Corvair, so they phased the Corvair out.
@@seed_drill7135 I don't know the full story but I get the impression that Ralph Nader wanted to make a point about car safety at the time (fair enough) but he unfairly went for the jugular with the Corvair. It had its faults but then so did the 911, that could be a scary car at times with the oversteer but that never got the excessive bad press that the Corvair did. Ralph made a name for himself at the cost of the Corvair and IMO I think its a decent car.....just drive it properly.
@@graemew7001 The original owners manual of the Corvair mandated different PSI for different tires to "correct" the handling issues that Chevrolet was aware of when they released the car to the public, but that fact was not adequately emphasized to the buying public. Also, it was an economy car. With sports cars, it's generally assumed higher driver's skills and caveat emptor.
There is also lag time between the research and publication of any book like Unsafe At Any Speed. The Corvair came out in late 1959, as a 1960 model. By the time the book came out in 1965 the handling issues had been addressed by abandoning the swing arm suspension.
@@seed_drill7135 Thank you for giving me an understanding of the whole Corvair story and the timeline of it, now it all makes sense to me.
The prettiest Chevrolet ever Made. The pillars are not unlike 60's Mazdas