Disconnecting 15kw Electric Furnace and Thermostat Talk
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- Опубліковано 5 лис 2021
- THIS IS NOT A HOW -TO VIDEO. DO NOT PERFORM THESE TASKS UNLESS YOU ARE FULLY COMPETENT AND CAPABLE OF WORKING WITH ELECTRICITY. This video is strictly for entertainment and in no way to be considered instructional other than to provide insight to the workings of a residential electric furnace and thermostat control circuit.
Electricity is one thing that's hard to explain and even harder to understand, yet the vast majority of the people that walk this planet utilize electricity every single day of their life. What is it? Where does it come from? How does it do the things it does? Those are all good questions that could possibly come from a fifth grader in any school OR from just about any average adult you meet every day. The thing of it is....I've worked with it for over 50 years and I can't answer a single one of those questions with authority and confidence.
Ah well, we know electricity comes from the power company....and we know how its generated....and we know how it gets to our homes....but really, what IS it ??!! Electrons moving in a wire ? Yeah, right. We can't see them so they must not really exist. But they HAVE to exist because that's what makes our lights work and our motors run and our heaters heat. Ok, we'll go with that and just accept the fact that we really can't fully explain it beyond its theory. It works. But it will also kill you if handled incorrectly. It is nothing to play with and should at all times be treated with the utmost respect. That's why the average Joe Schmoe shouldn't do the things I do in any of the videos where electricity is introduced, whether its disconnecting this furnace or repairing or replacing a blower motor.
With all that having been said....enjoy the video, but don't do the same thing for yourself. You may inadvertently and unintentionally send more business to the local funeral director. - Розваги
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Sir, what you do for all of us is very much appreciated. You are great at everything it takes to make an amazing tutorial video. I thank you buddy!
Well, thank you for the candid and complimentary remark ! I am just tickled that viewers find the videos enjoyable.
Hello Wendell, Great video, I became very well versed in Electrical safety years ago, and not by training! I had followed the "lock out/tag out" procedures while working on an oven. Not only did I lock the breaker off, but I had also removed it from the panel and taped the contacts off for isolation. but while I was testing the oven, someone removed the breaker, and replaced it, and turned it on! this was a lesson on being the only electrician working in a panel/or circuit. needless to say I reported to the foreman what happened, and he was mad, he knew my practices, and that I was a little over the top on safety. but nobody has the authority to remove lockout/tagout devices other then the tech working on the circuit! long story short, the person who removed the breaker from the wires, and re-installed the circuit was dismissed from his position for safety violations ( many more then this) Electricity is nothing to play with if you don't know about it!
Safety tip... never stand in front of a breaker being energized, if right handed use your left hand, and stand to the side of the panel, if the breaker fails then your nondominant hand my be injured, but you will be safer then standing directly in front of the panel, and look away as you power it up!
I've been through OSHA 10 and also OSHA 30 training as well as the MSHA training for mine workers. MSHA is OSHA on steroids !! You were lucky with the other worker re-powering the circuit. You could've had a really bad day for sure.
@@tractorman4461 that is why I constantly recheck my power sources and also now create dead shorts when i safe off panel circuits! Never had the MSHA training, but I have read up on it a few times. OSHA 30 and the 10’s I was required to have each year for all the different trades that I worked in! Automotive engineering and maintenance ( GM service tech) Electrical engineering and service (commercial/ Industrial journeyman ) Construction structural engineering and theory, then again when I worked Auto Body. Even when I was playing on the track OSHA had something to say!needless to say that the 4 instructors for the OSHA courses got tired of seeing me all the time each year because the training certs were too specific to each trade, but each class was almost exactly the same! I was probably had better knowledge on these course then the instructors by the time I quit beating the heck out of myself on the race track! But they said anyone who Ice races motorcycles need more safety classes’😂😅😂😅
insane story .... the things that can possibly happen .... can never be too safe on the job site
Your video made me feel like I was back in Physics class. Explanation very well done.
I wasn't sure I was smart enough for physics classes. All that potential deep thinking and pontification scared a lazy guy like me waaaay too much !! In high school I stuck to gym classes and girl watching.....
@@tractorman4461 i stuck to shop classes and girls forget physics! My senior year was a blast though, after busting my brains in sophomore and junior years I had 4 shop classes 2 lunches and 2 study halls & home room! Then went into the Marines and tech school!
Very good electrical tips....You did very well....no complaints from me, my friend...you did very well by giving people a good warning about electricity....CHEERS
Well Gator, a compliment coming from a professional electrician like yourself means a lot to me my friend !! Thank you very much for the nice words.
Very well put sir, your going to blow their minds when you start explaining sequencers.
I can't wait for the comments on that.
Hahahaha...might have to do a troubleshooting video on the next one that's not working. I wish I'd have kept some of the old rotating sequencers with the 24v motor and real slow gear reduction that closed the switches sequentially from one end to the other. Those were unique. How about the Honeywell W7100 discharge air temperature control..? For controlling stages of cooling and the economizer as well as stages of heat, usually in commercial VAV systems. Or the old Barber Coleman 8161 series of programmable controllers... Hahahaha..those were the good old days of hvac. They probably still make fancy new versions of those yet today. Thanks Tom for making me take a short walk down memory lane....LOL
........ Respect ............ is like common sense ........... get'n harder to find these days......... Thx 44
Hahahahaha...methinks, BubbaG that you said a mouthful !! LOL
Another great video thanks
Well, its not shiny sheet metal OR a rusty tractor....but its what I did that day. Thanks Tony for watching !!
Morning T! Class is in session :)) Thanks - very well explained and understood. Always learn something after watching Tractorman44. One thing I have not learned is where I can buy one of those Classic Tractorman44 T-shirts?
Hahahaha...that's funny GP. LOL At least the orange would go pretty good with the Kubota !! Keep an eye out for an email in a day or two. Thank you for stopping in for a visit my friend.
Good stuff Wendell!
Thanks Matt...this furnace is for sale....LOL
@@tractorman4461 😂👍
I had a Snap On multimeter that I used for years working on aircraft and building wiring but I hadn't used it in about 10 years. I was doing some light switch wiring when the meter said 16 volts ac so I put it on a known 120 vac outlet and it said 20 volts so I ditched "old reliable" and used my friends meter that gave good readings, so even good meters can go bad. (And yes I put a new battery in the Snap On Meter)
Dang it Rick, I forgot to mention in the video to double check your meter against a known power supply first to make sure it's doing its thing the way its supposed to. I too have had good meters fail. It must be noted that just because it says "FLUKE" or "Snap On" doesn't mean it's going to work forever. See...?? You can tell I'm getting a bit rusty and maybe even forgetful in my old age !! Thanks for bringing it up. Good point my friend.
Yes in deed Sir electricity can be very dangerous !!! Hand wet snow holding a sparkplug in front of open cylinder to attempt to dry out the piston of the fuel and puling at the same pulling the starting cord cause my human rear check valve come full open and my leg's fall down into the snow bank electrically chock,,,, My winter underwear became a diaper !!! LOL Great informative video mon ami !! Did you ever try to have your magnify lenses on the upper side of your working glasses ? so you do not have the bent your neck as much ? Cheers !!!
HAHAHAHAHA ....Dave, your precise and descriptive reaction to obtaining an unexpected high voltage shock leaves me crying with laughter !! You're killin' me Dave !! So funny..... But I got the picture loud and clear !!! Messy, but loud and clear....LOL
@@tractorman4461 LOL, What about having your reading lenses on the up part of your glasses ?
@@RCAFpolarexpress Actually Dave, I do have the reading prescription on the top as well as on the bottom of my lenses. I've been doing that for at least 15 or 20 years. It really helps a LOT. I requested that because of all the control troubleshooting on roof top hvac equipment. The sun was always in my eyes with them only on the bottom !!
@@tractorman4461 For me it was easier to work under CF 188 fighters engine. Tank you for your service Sir Cheers !!!
44 I want to ask the dumbest question, that system you work on is a furnace which says it provides heat to the house but did it have a condenser in the system that can cool down the house in summer? I hear you talk about cooling but do not understand where cold air come from. We use conventional air conditioners in our homes, not that type, thanks for a great video
Jan If he has cooling for air conditioning, it would have a condenser unit(with the compressor) on the outside and a set of evaporator coils in the air handling plenum to take the heat from the air on the inside to dump outside through the condenser. There would be a small diameter copper line and a larger diameter copper line connecting the condenser to the evaporator. For cooling, the small diameter line will be for liquid Freon and the larger diameter line will be for gas Freon.
A window air conditioner has the evaporator and the condenser in a box that fits in a window or other opening. There is also a fan that blows the air across the evaporator coils which are taking the heat from the air, boiling the Freon, and in turn the air blowing into the room is cold or cooler than that being drawn into the unit. Look up A/C or the cooling cycle of A/C systems in Wikipedia.
Jan, Roy gave a good explanation in his reply. Over here we have a multitude of choices for HVAC (Heating Ventilating Air Conditioning) selection. This one here is probably one of the most basic. It DOES in fact have a condensor sitting remotely and piped in like Roy describes. This is called a 'Split System' because of the remote condensor. If it were all together, it would be called either a 'Package System' or a 'Self Contained' System. In small capacities, those would be referred to as window air conditioners with added heat.
Most electric air handlers are purchased as nothing but a box with a blower and evaporator coil inside, usually at the bottom and underneath the blower. You select the capacity of heat to be added in the field but with limitations due to blower capacity. You also have the opportunity to install a standard air conditioning condensor OR a heat pump outdoor unit. At that point what's called the 'evaporator' in a central air unit simply becomes an 'indoor coil' on a heat pump because it's job reverses depending on whether the outdoor unit is in 'heat' mode or 'cool' mode.
So yes, there IS a condensor, but it wasn't included in this video for electrically disconnecting the furnace. This is a generalized bit of information to hopefully answer your question Jan. There's tons of specifics not included and some of the generalizations are just that...generalizations. Thank you for watching and for your thought provoking question.
@@royreynolds108 Good explanation Roy. Thanks for helping Jan understand the systems we have in America.
👍👍👍
We'lll get back to some cool stuff one of these days....LOL. Lots of sheet metal AND trailer building coming down the pike !!
Nicely explained. Thank yiou. Can you pls tel us what was the house wire rating for the supply high voltage line 4/3 AWG 6/3 AWG?
Typically #6 is good for 55 amps for copper wire. #4 is typically rated for 70 amps for copper wire. Aluminum wire is rated lower, but its not used to a great extent any more other than in service entrances. Of course temperature has an effect on the rating, but for residential use, it should not exceed the temp required to lower the ratings appreciably. Does that help answer your question..??
@@tractorman4461 yes thank you this is very helpful. As a add on question. What type of wire would you use THHN, which seems to only come as single conductor. Or is NM-B okay.
@@mdavis3370 THHN requires conduit, and is just fine to use, but the installation of the conduit creates an issue with most people. Both #6 and #4 come in Romex and is generally the most used residentially. NM is the normal abbreviation for Non-Metallic Romex wire. I'm unsure of the 'B' designation.
@@tractorman4461 Your response perfectly addresses these points. It's an skill you have both in helping share your knowledge with others and making things simple.for all to understand and remain safe. Thank you so much.
@@mdavis3370 Well, thank you for such a considerate reply. Good luck with your endeavor and remember if you are not comfortable with it, just don't do it. I never really recommend homeowners to tackle electrical issues anyway. There's a LOT that can hurt you and even worse !!
question, is the air handler disconnected also ? or was that only the heat strip ?
The whole air handler and heat package as well are disconnected. The blower is powered off of the main incoming power via factory supplied molex plugs that are connected into the heat package during original installation. The control transformer that controls both the air-handler/heater package AND the a/c or heat pump is also powered off the main incoming power as well. Make sense..?? There are some variations with older equipment, but in general this is the way it is.
Some first generation a/c's contained their own control transformer, which is why still today, thermostats come with and 'Rc' AND 'Rh' terminal. The 'Rc' terminal was for the old systems that had the second transformer in the outdoor unit. That kept the two transformers from fighting against themselves with a single R terminal. And also is why the Rc and Rh terminals must have a jumper installed with the single control transformer control systems of today.
gotcha, so the molex plug was powering the air handler .... and this molex plug received power from one of those two breakers that you disconnected in the video ? am I saying that correctly ?@@tractorman4461
Do you have to use both heat strips…meaning what if 15 kw is to much and I have two breakers in the AHU and only one will do the job
Thanks
No, you don't have to use all 15kw of the furnaces capacity, but you have to turn off the correct one for it to work. There is usually a 60 amp and a 30 amp breaker. The 60amp should power the first two elements AND the control transformer. Without power to the control transformer, nothing will work. The 30 amp should power the third 5kw bank. Many times back in the day, we would take the last set of elements that aren't usually required unless it is really cold outside, and wire an adjustable out- door thermostat in series withe the control circuit and set it to close below that setting. Then only when the outdoor temp was extremely cold (below the setpoint) would the last set of elements come on at full capacity, and wired in series it would only energize through the thermostat AND the low outdoor temp. Make sense Michael..?
Hello, could I ask you what gauge of cable an air handle unit has? I bought one at home depot of 15 kw and it has two circuit breakers of 50 and 35 amp, my unit does not have cold air, it is only heating
@@josefigueroa-bz5sl The name plate should give the actual 'ampacities' of circuit A and circuity B. But a dual circuit 15kw furnace USUALLY require a #6 for circuit A and #10 for circuit B. The a/c unit when added will usually be an additional and separate 30 amp or #10 wire circuit if its 2 1/2 ton or smaller. Manufacturers do have similar requirements though, so they may not all be as I suggested. That's where you have to refer to the actual nameplate for the heater package.
man you talk to much😮
Well dang, then I'm sorry you had to suffer through it. Next time I'll do a silent video when I want to talk about a project or theory...... Stay tuned !!