The Problem with Alcoholics Anonymous Sponsors
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- Опубліковано 7 лют 2025
- Hello there
A quick reminder that this is fully my opinion based on experience and discussions with others. I genuinely just do not understand how someone could see the positive in such a manipulative and power divided dynamic.
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I spoke to a guy that at one time enjoyed racing RC cars. His sponsor told him it was immature and he needed to give it up. That is not what a sponsor is for. Their only job is to help you work the steps not decide which hobbies to have,
right like who are you to decide what is immature to me?
Exactly! And a sponsor needs to understand, that you can't make a meeting every single day! People work and enjoy it. Real hardcore AA people give you the cold shoulder when you don't show up, go to the AA related events, and call them everyday. omg....
@@leanajo754 @Leana Jo 💗 I agree although I'd say that those people are not actually 'real hardcore AA people'. The AA big book is an easy going enlightened book, not much like those people you mention at all. I would say they have missed the point outlined in the AA big book
Agreed
They think being a Sponsor is equivalent to being a PHd in Psychology, but they're just dumb azzes like any one of us. This one guy at a zoom meeting kept saying every day. "If you do not do the fourth step and read the book you will go out and die, I guarantee it!" I stopped going to that meeting after they told me not to talk about my subject. It was 13 steppers and me being accused of being one. The secretary would yell at me and sometimes I'd just get thrown off the meeting.
I went to my first meeting today, and it was everything i suspected which kept me from going in the past. Old men with condescension, young men with concomittant need for parole notes, grime, bad coffee, cult like discussions about Christianity and MAGA.
I am an accomplished self empowered woman and professional. I wouldn't let my daughter anywhere near this toxicity. It's an enormous red flag. We deserve better options as a sober community
Im in recovery and found a sponsor. We started doing the steps and it was okay at first. I then started noticing this dude start to literally give me orders. Called me all sorts of names too. I started feeling gaslighted and manipulated. Texted him that things weren't working out, got rid of him and blocked him. Best decision ever.
Stumbled across this video by accident and glad that I hung around for it. I was in AA for a long time and saw the absolute WORST people "sponsoring" people. None of these people have any qualifications, they gossip on sponsees, repeat 5th steps etc. Best decision I ever made was to leave AA. I got a whole channel about that "fellowship". Glad to see there are others talking about it. Subscribed.
Hey thanks for listening and sticking around!
I’ll try to get back to posting soon again.
@@SortofSober Awesome, I really wished we could start a trend of youtubers exposing AA for what it is.
Oh wow! That’s horrible 😮
My former sponsor gossiped about sponsees also. It was then that I knew she talked about me behind my back too.
They also lie. My sponsor said i told her i had been a prostitute which absolutely never happened (i dont judge it.. its just not my story) and i worked in a factory the whole time. But when i confronted her she was gaslighting me that going on dates is transactional and i did tell her i had been on dates that ended sexually. Evil woman.
They're so gross and weird.
Sobriety has become a weird competition between people. Who can be the most AA in the room! I am more sober than you! The problem is anyone can lie...the rooms are full of pathological liars.
Imagine! A bunch of drunks and some lie! Who knew!
That is a truth. Thank you for being frank. AA is better than drinking, but it is not the safe space a vulnerable newly sober person often thinks it is.
ABSOLUTELY CORRECT . I USUALLY GO FOR THE FREE ENTERTAINMENT. BUT TO BE FAIR . THESE SHMUCKS OFTEN SAY THINGS THAT CLICK W ME AND MAKE SENSE TO ME ON A DEEP GUT LEVEL......THE SCULLYS MTNG IN PORTLAND OR IS THE ONLY ONE THATS WUITE ROUGH AND TUMBLE BUT THEY TRUELY DONT SHOOT THE WOUNDED... NOT A PERFECT IDEAL GROUP OUT THERE . I GO FOR ME. FOR COMRSDERIE AND U NEVER KNOW WHO YOULL Meet AND WHAT MAGIC MAY TRANSPIRE. I TRY TO KEEP OPEN MIND MIND OPEN BOWELS CLOSED MOUTH UNLESS I HAVE SOMETHING USEFUL And HELPFUL TO EXPRESS
People recover. Some sponsors, and sponsorship all together is temporary, and so are the meetings.
The big book was written by a pathological liar.someone who told himself lies and believed them himself.
My rehab was a nightmare. I almost died. AA was the thing in rehab. I refused to keep going to to AA when I got out because of my experience in rehab and I was absolutely not going to accept a sponsor because I didn’t trust people and didn’t trust AA.
I hope you survive friend. I really hope you do. If you’re tired of suffering, stop with the excuses and come to a meeting.
Recovery is not easy. It sucks sometimes. But it’s worth it.
Sounds like you got a lot of “research” to do, and I hope to God you survive
@ I am sober since 2019. Thanks for asking. If it works for you I’m happy. I fell during detox and herniated two discs in my lower back. It was a hard fall but the disc injury didn’t show until I had an mri. I spent three weeks like that until I made them let me out. The place was a racket. AA was a part of it. The thing is there is more than one way to get sober. If AA works for you then that’s good. And sobriety is worth it, as you said.
@@Revolver1701 Exactly.
6 years sober no relapse. 6 years no AA, go figure. I don't need another ex- drunk to support my sobriety, constantly projecting their own weaknesses on me. That sounds ass backwards to me.
I hear you!
How understanding of you to disparage an organisation that has saved millions of lives. Great your sober but nobody understands an alcoholic like a recovering addict. Not weakness just a fact. I have a relative who makes the programmes for addicts in jails he is high profile and had a drink problem a long time ago, best person for the job, he knows one size doesn't fit all but he would never put a programme like AA in the bin, it works for many and keeps them out of jail. Nobody on here pulling AAdown is being clever, it's putting people off a fighting chance of recovery.
@@lesleyhumphreysjones5957 Thank you, very well said. It appears this is just another video by someone who couldn't stay sober and thus blames the program her own failings. AA is not for everyone, it is for those who are willing to go to any lengths to quit drinking. Obviously she has issues and could probably use professional help. Pointing the finger and blaming others is not the solution, working the steps and going to any lengths to stay sober is what works. AA will be there when she is ready to finally quit drinking.
Idk if it's projecting. They believe all alcoholics are the same at the core
I can smell the anger and resentment from here aheesh.
Sober but at what cost? Miserable as hell. Might as well drink. I did not get sober to be miserable. Thank god for desperation.
This needs to be talked about more. When I met my sponsor she was great, over time she because more pushy, overbearing persistent, kept trying to get me to give more & more of my time to this program. We are all on our own recovery journey in which we all take different approaches.
I was teaching this girl how to work a wood lathe, her Dad left her one. She got a sponsor and the sponsor told her to stay away from me, especially romantically. The girl stopped seeing me. I called the sponsor out on that after one year. She told me," LeAnn has been here one year, so you can go get her now." Idiot.
No honey! She was always been that way, lol. Maybe you needed someone pushing you in the beginning. Once you outgrow that stuff, you wake up seeing them for who they really are. Been there!
Mine did the same thing. Sending me AA gifts and trying to guilt me into spending more time in program. It got weird.
?????
Get a new sponsor. Why is this an issue. ??
I had a 12 steps sponsor whom I had to block. So I get this video. I just remember thinking he is not certified and his sense of control really did it for me. Another red flag was calling me " brother " when I really didn't know him. My sense was he was just lonely and caught me at my vulnerable state.
When I started to heal and move on was when he started spreading rumors about me because I had to distance myself after I did talk to him.
Bottom line, go see a therapist. You'll be better off.
Sponsor 2 also offered to be my Sponsor. She had a couple other Sponsees. I didn’t have a desire to drink, but she wanted me to go to meetings daily, attend Zoom Meetings with her and the other Sponsees at random times. I usually wasn’t available. She also wanted me to read stories in the BB and write reports for her. I never did that and she was annoyed. We met on Zoom to read the Big Book, but we never progressed to the 4th Step. She would obsess on all the dates and history of AA. She seemed to expect my life to revolve around her and AA. She seemed to be on some kind of power trip. The final straw was when she wanted me to sign a contract with all her rules! Lol! WTF? 🤬 I thought a Sponsor was supposed to take you through the steps and be there for support! Not take over your life! I told her I wasn’t comfortable with that, and she got mad and cut me off! 😮 Seems like another Narcissist! I left AA and got a therapist. The issue was the childhood trauma. The alcohol was just the latest symptom. I don’t drink, but I don’t identify as an alcoholic.
Totally agree with everything you just said. I chose my own sponsor, and it lasted about a month. Although she was a lovely woman, I didn't feel that I would ever be able to work the steps with her or anyone, I couldn't give anyone that power over me.
I personally really like my sponsor *as a person*. The problem is; she is constantly trying to control my relationship with my husband, which was a very happy marriage until I got sober. Now my sponsor claims my husband is an alcoholic, abusive, controlling, and that I need to make steps to leave him. I’m 38 weeks pregnant mind you, and she has had ZERO successful relationships.
This helps! Did you find you needed to find another sponsor? I need help. I’m having some of the same problems.
My experience with female sponsors. I'm a guy. They are the most controlling bytches I've ever met, they constantly would get between me and "their" sponssee and tell me I can't talk to her. I got a lot of that and they finally succeeded in isolating me from everyone at the meeting. Their gossip and slander was too much so I finally left to join a ZOOM meeting and screw sponsors, they all think they are mini psychologist and they are just recovery damn drunks. They are supposed to be there to make suggestions not dictate your life. Fire her!
Don't listen to her she isn't God or a real licensed counselor
Sounds about right, most women in AA, are anti men, lonely, drunk because they could not meet anyone.
Maybe you should get someone else? Have you asked other ppl in the program what they think about this?
Thanks for this Keisha. I haven't had great experiences with AA. I have huge respect for AA and the Big Book, no doubt it has helped millions. But I can't stand these meetings! Also I had a sponsor who told me I had to go the meetings TWICE a day, and phone her every day. Then I had another sponsor who actually gave up on me when I lapsed, she said how disappointed she was and cried. I managed to get myself out of my lapse before it became a full relapse though, and I haven't had a drink since, and that's six months ago. I won't have a sponsor again, too much trouble. Plenty other ways to get sober.
I am super proud of you for six months! Keep at it, whatever is working for you!
Female sponsors think they are raised to the exalted station of Dick Tater, and that's what they are. I'm a guy, no guys wanted to sponsor me so I had an old female friend I asked to sponsor me. She turned into an a whole in no time at all. Bye Bytch.
Some people in AA seem to be rather lonely, and literally their whole life *IS* AA. They plan their whole life around it, and want every other member to do the same.
If my entire life was two and three meetings every single day for the rest of my life, I would be drinking again.
If you’re an addict or alcoholic, news flash, alcohol is not the isssue. It’s when you put it down.
What’s the point of staying sober if you’re gonna be miserable and obsessing.
If you find another way to stay sober that also grants peace let me know
Brilliant - thank you for bringing up a very controversial subject. My estranged husband told me he was a recovered alcoholic and had been for "years". Not even a month after I moved to a different state to be with him, he started drinking (I don't think he every really did, but that's beside the point). Next thing I know it's up to 1/2 gallons of vodka a day and 3 separate emergency "relapse" therapies at home by way of taking benzos - it was the worst year of my life.
I asked the question often before it got really bad, why he thought it was a good idea to be taking "instructions" from a 30 year old "sponsor" who even made him check in with him every morning to show him photos after he made the bed (one of the sponsor's assignments). I told him that I found it odd that a seemingly mature (he wasn't) 53 year old man found it even remotely appropriate - talk about no boundaries and inability to critically think.
I have learned the hard way, you are so right, please keep making this message, I know a lot of people who have even died because of this
Excellent video. My sponsor dismisses my story saying it’s not unique and I’m exaggerating all of my trauma. He means well but he’s controlling. Doing the fourth step he had to tell me my part in things when I didn’t say them. 12 steps can be an amazing tool and with a good sponsor it can be life changing but I finally figured out my sponsor with 22 years sobriety is hurting me.
@rharia I just found this excellent channel and read your old comment, as well as many others.
I hope you've managed to break free from the so-called sponsor you wrote about by now, who doesn't mean well at all, IMHO!
In fact, he's totally invalidating your traumatic experiences, which is abusive and it seems like he needs to do a course, or at least watch videos, on how to deal with those issues.
He probably lacks empathy and compassion though and courses, or videos, won't change him anyway, if that's the case. ❤
I found just as much gratification going to my pastor.
And scripture teaches once an alcoholic always an alcoholic is garbage...
No human power can relive our alcoholism
Perhaps no human....
Idek being forced to detox off of meth and everclear in a central Texas jail cell in a turtle suit was the only motivation I needed to stay sober.
Yeah, you keep telling yourself that.
That probably no human power could have relieved in our alcoholism.
Nowhere in our program(1st 164 pages) does it say you need a sponsor. We work with “other alcoholics” to show them how “We” recovered. End of story.
100% right
I used to work front desk at an Alano Club and sponsors constantly divulged things about their sponsees which I found creepy and inappropriate
I attended AA 24 yrs with very little success. I had to hit bottom. I lived. Then went back to AA and realized I had to put my blinders on in regards to others behaviors. I focused on mine. Went to pro counseling with a person who was in AA. Made progress, breakthroughs, and had epiphanies. Been sober over 8 yrs. No "sponsor" but trusted friends who support me.
I'm in AA and am getting disgusted with their bullshit. I could write a book about the things those people have done to my relationships and just general life in the groups. Gossip is rampant as hell and they won't let me rest. Time has been good to me as I age. I'm 73 now, single and women tell me I'm so handsome. That bothers me but it riles the hell out of everyone because they have pegged me via gossip. I turned a girl down and she can't be stopped with her slandering of me. I've never slept with nor attempted to sleep with any of the girls in the group but last month, in front of 30 people they accused me of being a thirteen stepper. Why! Because a new and very pretty girl sat next to me and as I helped her through the meeting, she thought I was funny and laughed and giggled and we had fun. They still hate me for that. Disgusting people.
keep coming back.
I very much agree.I have also been made to feel ostracised
@@Lizzy514 I found a new place to go. The tension in that place was so high I could feel it and could not wait for the end of the meeting. I almost left early the last time I attended that meeting.
Yep. Single straight good looking men are h8ed in our society. I know (or do believe) your intentions were good, but as one to another, be careful around todays women. I know EXACTLY what you are talking about. A lot of insecure betas out thee that hate, and I mean HATE you
Same thing happened to me. A newcomer sat down beside me and we got chatting. She showed me pictures of her kid and we had a great chat about things only for a couple of females dragged me to one side and told me off for talking to her. Needless to say I told them to f- off
My name is Rodger 🙏🤗!! And AA has done wonders in my life!! I love AA! The people in it! And the meeting s!! AA is the best 🥇🏆#!! 1 # 🤗☝️👊☝️🙏💯☺️🥇🏆🤗🙏☝️
Thank you for this video !! 😎❤️ It is ironic that I can be at 11+ years without a drink, working at a liquor store and find your video about this topic. You are absolutely right about everything said. There is no recourse for bad sponsors and it can be very difficult to get out of dangerous situations. People don't understand this. I appreciate that you are bringing light to this subject. I subscribed !!
Respect to anyone who tackles their drink problem , hope you make it 🙏
I left AA because I had a sponsor who could not regulate her emotions. She had a lot of mental health. We had a simple disagreement and it went into full fledged bullying towards me.
Most of their react like spoilt babies when you disagree with them.
Excellent! I just quit AA after 36 years of trial & (mostly) error lol. I've been listening to 'quackahlics', Monica Richardson, etc. I'm studying tge 'orange papers' archives daily & have signed up with SMART RECOVERY online. You really nailed it on the sponsorship topic. I've got some stories for sure lol. Hope to see more of your podcasts. Good work!
Read as much as you can with an objective skeptical mind as AA/NA tries it's best to erase critical-thinking from it's members. Orange Papers sealed the deal for me regarding that religious cult. I had fear that I was losing my mind & personality while in that cult and it was a healthy fear not "my disease talking" . The fear-induced & pie in the sky brainwashing runs very deep.
Been at aa 2 weeks eyes are already open found orange papers yesterday awesome stuff
@@Fredtarbossoif you keep going to AA you will find that the orange papers are 100% accurate
Thanks for the video.
Having spent close to a decade in 12 step recovery, not just AA. However other fellowships too, CA and NA mostly. In which time I’ve worked through the steps, numerous times with a number of different sponsors, over the years. I have relapsed a number of times along the way. However I’ve also gained significant sobriety time. I’ve sponsored others through the steps. I’ve worked in an addiction rehab centre, for a year, which had a 12 step ethos. Promoting and helping clients, who were mostly new to recovery, to understand the 12 steps and the 12 step program. I’ve also spent 4 months in a fundamental Christian rehab centre. As the early AA pioneers were Christian, AA was founded in the Bible Belt of America and the big book was also written by those same people. I’m not a Christian. However it’s where my journey took me. AA was founded by fundamental Christians in the 1930s. Spending time in the Christian rehab helped me gain a better insight into the thinking and understanding of the thinking that went into the foundings of AA, 12 step recovery and the big book. It’s extremely flawed and outdated logic. One only need to glimpse at the wording of the 12 steps or have a read of the big book. It’s essentially a Christian program with the idea that God, the creator, will relieve people of their addiction if they work the program. I know people will claim “a God of their understanding” or a “higher power”. However this is a contradiction to the language used in the big book. Even the language used in the steps is contradictory if you don’t have God the creator as your higher power. Also the big book was written coming on 100 years ago. At the time they didn’t understand alcoholism or addiction. The reason people recover is through “subconscious reprogramming”. The 12 steps are a way to deal with our thoughts, emotions and behaviour patterns which led us to drink. It’s absolutely nothing to do with God or a higher power. The AA program, as religion tends to do, put God in a position where, if they do exist, doesn’t belong. A person only need understand how the subconscious works to understand addiction and recovery. It’s also not some spiritual disease that only the 12 steps can relieve us of. Alcoholism is learned behaviour, we are powerless over our subconscious therefore become powerless over our alcoholism over time. It’s also more often than not some kind of trauma response. For more on this Gabor Mate, who has spent years working in the field of addiction. Has plenty of work out there.
There are many issues with the 12 step program, it’s always had a very low success rate, the big book claims a 50-75 per cent success rate. However they had no way of knowing as this was before the big book was written and it was s word of mouth program. I think the biggest issue with AA is how outdated it all is.
In regards to sponsorship. The main issue is, as you spoke about, you don’t need a degree or any kind of qualification to be a sponsor. All addicts and alcoholics are damaged in some way. Therefore by having another alcoholic or addict sponsoring you. You’re essentially being taken through, what is an addiction therapy program, by a damaged individual with no basis for being any kind of therapist or counsellor. They have their own hangups, life experiences and ego which will effect the whole process. In meetings people will share that “an alcoholic can’t trust their own thinking”, so why would you ask someone that can’t trust their own thinking to help guide your life? Also people in meetings and sponsors will put their own spin on parts of the program. For example I’ve had a few sponsors in the past. Some good some not so good experiences. Most of them attempted to impress onto me things which weren’t in the big book or part of the program. Such as being single for 2 years, before considering a relationship. Which meant finishing things with my partner, which was an established relationship at the time. Or I was to give up the gym as it was getting in the way of my recovery.
One thing, which relates more to the other fellowships than AA is how people can claim to be clean of all mind altering substances. However still be chain smoking thenselves to death. Nicotine being both a mind altering substance and an addiction.
Also in the big book it mentions nothing in regards to sponsorship. However meetings are also never mentioned.
And finally i hear someone speaking my thoughts .. thank you
There are very dangerous people around, there is also a high correlation between antisocial personality disorder and addiction, so one can guess that there is a high chance of running into one of them or some other narcissistic personality out of the cluster Bs. The best to stay healthy or become healthy is to be with healthy people or at least have some trained specialist, who can see downwardspiraling dynamics. What for me is some kind of a red flag is the importance of the narrative. You wouldn't see that in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy.
We stay sober by the steps we take not the meetings we make. A sponsor has one job and that's to take you through the steps. This is about becoming God dependent and not people dependent. If I'm powerless over alcohol and my life is unmanageable then I Must find a power to keep me sober and manage my life.
It was up too ME to put the drink down. Not some spiritual guru or entity. aa is a crock of bs
It’s so interesting that AA cult members find themselves in my little corner of the internet and still feel the need to proselytize. You’re not powerless over alcohol and your life is not unmanageable but a fellowship has convinced you otherwise.
Best of luck in your path towards recovery.
My only sponsor turned out to be a convicted rapist, home invader and general thug. He was only convicted for one rape and did time in Folsom Prison. He is married but got mad as hell because this girl was paying attention to me. While in his truck he would tell me all the things he wanted to do to her. Creepy guy! He fired me over that and good riddance.
Female sponsors are dictators and will break any relationship I've started, and they hate me for no cause. I'm normal and would like to talk to women but these old "former" sluts and barflies, as they call themselves think they know me and will very literally push themselves between me and their sponsee. They are not supposed to be judgmental, jealous, envious, hateful, and disgusting but they are to me. I have searched for alternative recovery groups but it's a small town and far from the cities.
Thanks for doing this video, you helped me vent my spleen.
Okay, I'm sober 24 years. Have never had a sponsor. Didn't need one. Bill W and Dr Bob were and are my sponsors even though they're dead. I had issues with bleeding deacons in AA who thought that I couldn't do that. At first it affected me until I gathered a thick skin by sticking around. Now I say they're my sponsor and I don't care what anyone says.
When I started in AA many years ago I didn’t realise how sick people in AA were, I thought I was the sickest there, it took nearly 20 years to realise that, at local meetings you have very very careful, I always find conventions a lot easier to handle it’s a completely different atmosphere.
Live and let live #!! 🤗🙏🥇🏆☝️👊☺️
I attend aa for the conversation but I’ll be damned if I go ask some random person to lord over me and “ work the steps” it’s a very cultish mentality to act like the only way to stay sober and improve yourself is through a random person that can be a POs who thinks they’re a better person than they are while having a terrible personalitie they think magically disappeared through “working the steps” you can improve yourself on your own and not everyone is a good person end of story😂😂😂
Thanks for the comment! I appreciate that someone agrees out there
I agree 100% with what this woman is saying. That being said I am a sponsor. I think there’s a misunderstanding of the role of a sponsor not only from new members but also from long time members of AA. I am not a life coach, not a therapist and not a doctor. I’m not a money manager, an occupational mentor and not a realtor. What I am is a teacher of the 12 steps. I read never give answers. I never pretend to know what people’s course of action should be. I never tell people to not get in a relationship. The only thing I do is show how to ask the questions the 12 steps present in order to come to the answer. If a sponsee doesn’t believe something? I’m not here to convince you. Find your truth. Don’t pay lip service to the process. If you don’t believe something? Question question question. My long winded point is I’m sorry that the fellowship did you a disservice and I hope that any AA’s here find it in themselves to be better and do better.
Also when I relapsed after 16 years, she called and said heard u got a drunk in public ha ha. Wish I had had your critical thinking skills.
Don’t need a sponsor to work the steps. I tell people to read the book and follow directions.
What I’ve learned more than anything is discernment in 12 step programs. If you don’t have critical thinking skills, it can be very dangerous, yes, but so is life any way you slice it. Take what you need and leave the rest. No program works for everyone. Controlling people who tell you what to think are everywhere, and your experience is your own. 🙏
All my sponsor does is give me suggestion and gets me through the 12 steps. He makes it very clear he’s not my therapist.
The 1st time i left the hospital, I had a sponsor. This was a long time ago but i remembered he was very nice, not overbearing, not preachy, not intrusive, but caring , willing to listen, very helpful in dealing with my anxiety, addiction, etc..the group rehab was a different story. One guy there was rude, impatient, and never had anything nice to say to me. Im glad he was fired, or quit. Suddenly 1 day he wasnt there. Anyway i dont drink anymore. Havent in at least 2 years. Thoughts do come and go but dont want to test it
I've been sober for over 30 years. I've never had a perfect sponsor but I've always had one and we are all still sober. Life is good. I've been through some tough stuff. Best wishes with your sobriety.
Ever notice when you quit drinking AA and sponsors want all the credit. But, if you relapse, you get all the blame? Talk about a double standard.
I didn't find that in my church. I did find that in AA.
I'm a sponser and take no credit for a sponsees sobriety. I know I don't have the power to get someone sober.
@@mattcavender995 Over a decade in meetings. Every time someone picks up a medallion or coin, by route, they blabber about GOD, THE STEPS and GOOD SPONSORS is what got them there. (Which is a lie, people quit drinking, like myself, when we are tired of it, and the cult religion of AA is more than happy to step in and claim credit)
If someone relapses, it was "You didn't work the steps, you didn't have a sponsor, you weren't completely honest, you left something out of your inventory, you didn't turn it over, you didn't go to enough meetings, you looked for differences and not similarities, you must have had a resentment, you must have let up on your spirituality. Blah blah blah.
Everything is your fault if you fail, and everything is AA AND GOD if you stay sober.
@@quackaholicsanonymous7210 AA is a toxic, unhealthy & petty environment to find oneself in.
As in bearing children there is no qualifications, very few truly recover, they just don't drink, Bill Wilson understood that alcohol was only a symptom
There are no sponsors in the program. I do not think I know better, but I do know the program. It's in the book. The steps work. You work the steps how you work them. Step 5 does not need to be telling a sponsor all your dirt. If that works great, but we own our steps, our lives and our recovery. Even the Big Book suggests taking step 5 in a confessional. Obviously that is a Christian thing, but it tells you that you can do this how you do this. Step 5 can be taken by a stranger. A spouse. A friend. Heck, send an anonymous letter to a random address on the other side of the planet.
Thank you for this. I tried so hard to brainwash myself into the group think, but after some time, I started to become aware of just how negative so much of the reinforcement is within the rhetoric. Not to mention the behaviour of so many the long standing members. I came to understand that I absolutely do NOT want what those long-standing members have. That I am not powerless over alcohol. The rooms i was in were so sick that I ended up feeling crazier than I did when I first started going in.
Naltrexone has been the only thing that has made sense for me. I can't recommend it enough for people experiencing alcohol use disorder.
That's not how it was when i came into the program in the 80's. Rehab now a days a business it is all about the Benjamins.
Oh and had to get a sponsor because keeping my job depended on it 😮
Yes do not trust anyone that have extensive professional. 6:00 training in eg psychology. Even there if they have little emotional maturity, are bullies or narcissists ( please do your research into this) then do NOT engage with them.Their ego is very high.Frankly I would recommend not sharing , do not do step 4 .Do not use AA as a place to hookup.
This lady is absolutely wrong!😮☝️#!; shes just making excuses because she couldn't understand the program and not do the program as suggested!😮. This lady saw and heard what she wanted to see and hear 🙉. And when you're in a negative fear- based thought system! This is the kind of play back you get!! But she is so wrong 👎! About everything she just said!! Not 🚫 true#;! ☝️☺️🙏
I can respect your experience and remain objective concerning your overall opinion. The reality is there is always a dappled apple found in the bushel. I toss the spoiled fruit and keep the best.
Fruit that has a spoiled one in the bunch is likely far past it’s prime. It’s just that the “good” apples haven’t shown their signs of spoilage on the outside yet.
Remember young lady #!; ego/ edging god out #!!😮☝️
This is an old video but thank you! ❤
I have recently experienced all of what you’ve spoken about. I used to be a daily drinker and it was escalating, however I cut that out for a year - now struggle with bingeing occasionally to the point of black out (maybe once a month when I go out). I have NO problem with saying my drinking is problematic when I was blacking out and doing crazy things… so I wanted to go sober for a period of time and potentially learn to moderate again in future (maybe, or just stay sober!)
However, I just don’t actually need the every day meetings (they take up 3 hours or more with travel as well as dinner after), get expensive because of dinner after also lol, but there’s no time to rebuild your life and focus on healthy friendships and exercise and healthy food etc.
I also don’t need a daily check in with a sponsor as I’m not struggling to not drink every day… it just seems like a lot, and I’m looked down on for saying this like I’m in denial or something
AA sponsors are not accountable, they have zero training in dealing with people struggling with real life problems,they are dangerous and harmful more often than not.Very well done on this topic,and people do need to be aware of this.
There's no requirement to have a sponsor. I had one, it was useful, but now don't have one. I've sponsored blokes too; it's not a life-long commitment. Most sponsor/sponsee relationships trend towards friendships.
There's also no requirement to work the steps. There's no requirement to do anything in AA (apart from have a desire to stop drinking). Don't have to believe in God, don't have to drink coffee, you don't have to have a sponsee or do the steps.
Get real.
Surrender to win! Surrender to God 🙏#!; AA
Good post, although I would say: if people actually read the AA program in the book (and 12 steps 12 traditions) they'd see that sharing (step five) is explicitly to be done with someone of your own choosing, and may be partly with one person, partly another etc, including with a stranger, psychologist, doctor, minister, trusted friend etc. At no point does AA literature say you have to share everything with a sponsor. You categorically don't have to have a sponsor, not matter what anyone tells you. It is often a good idea when you are new so you have someone to talk to and don't get lost in the crowd, as long as you also read the AA books yourself to see what they actually say, and don't rely on word of mouth things from one person who you don't actually know that well. I used to talk to mine and then go and read the books to see what the actually program and ethos is, which is easy going and enlightened
Stu, once I got rid of my sponsor and stopped going to Big Book studies, I actually managed to sit down and read the Big Book. 😁
@@VAMR-vc7xg Yes, sitting and reading it objectively without any cajouling and influence worked better for me too. I personally found that after my sponsor passed on I started talking to a wide array of people and became much more open, and life blossomed - going by the big book as my guide rather than 'what my sponsor says'
Saw people sponsoring loads after just 3 months of them not drinking😂…
Hate AA now…
Sick and twisted program with very sick people
Yea ive seen 10 or 15 people who had the same sponsor
Sounds like she had a bad experience. My sponsor took part in saving my life. And I sponsor others. People are fallible. Take everything people say with a grain of salt. Watch what people do, not what they say.
I’m glad you had a good experience with the program. Also just because you disagree with something doesn’t make it disinformation. But I’m glad you felt it was important enough to comment and contribute! AA worked for you. It does not work for everyone. Just like people, programs are fallible.
Same here matt
Same here Matt 😊
I’ve been in AA for 28 yrs it was a total waist of time.
Were you sober without AA? Genuine question.
Yea, I did almost 15 years in 12 Step, after I picked up my 10 year coin I never went back. That was 11 years ago and I'm still sober.
You’re dry drunk
@@egoebbjust remember when you came in there were people there who helped you who stayed , what you got for free , must be given back or else the newcomer is left with the 20 years sober three meeting a day types 😅
@@citrix123🤣
"call me anytime!" the would-be sponsor said. never picked up his phone, never returned calls but still upset when I said he didn't seem like a good fit. wtf.
Just seen your video. I hated being in AA.... the CA fellowship and my sponser saved my life i just do as suggested ,gratitude daily been taken through my steps now i live in my steps. Im 5 months clean and sober today and now sponsering and helping ppl in recovery. I do understand wot ya saying about some sponsers im nothing like them i keep it simple and pass the message on how this was shown to me. If its not drink and drug related ya must seek outside help coz we not counclers or doctors we have the solution to recovery thats it! And i love it seeing my sponsees get well feels better then any drink and drugs could do for me. Hope ya staying strong aswell and i learned alot ftom this video sk thank you so much x
The point of AA is that all other measures you tried have failed and that you are willing to do anything to get sober. Now, there are bad people out there still, sadly, that pose as sponsors. You should ask others about the person you want to choose and get an idea of the individual. Most of all, if any of your boundaries are crossed, you can fire a sponsor if you are not comfortable with them. Please don't let 1 bad experience ruin getting help!
great job I'm glad I found your Channel
'never had an even one official sponser, but let me complain all about it with almost no knowledge. Hard pass.
And sponsors relapse too. I had 4 that did! They wonder why I have trust issues.
The main aa big book and AA boom twelve steps twelve traditions goes out of its way to say we should be dependent on god /higher power rather than on any particular person. Like you, I was wary of trusting a sponsor. It would be mad to trust one 100%, and out of line with the aa book ethos. I always made a point of reading the AA books myself. The program and ethos is all written down and can be read directly. Read it a few times yourself and don't wait for someone else to try and tell you what it says. It's a simple book. The books go out of their way to say we think carefully on who to share things with, and that this may be someone outside of AA, or that we may wish to share different parts of our story with different people. Anyway, that's my two penny's worth. ☀️
Then you find out that the word sponsor doesn’t even appear in the book. If getting a sponsor is so critical, it would be a step, wouldn’t it? Good points
There is a big book dictionary. A sponsor is a spiritual advisor during a specific period of instruction. That’s it!
AA is 1#🎉☝️🙏🤗💯🏆🥇👊☺️
Your relation should speak from your own experience with sponsorship. It’s not appropriate to make blanket statements about sponsorship. It’s not all the same. The sponsor sponsor incorrectly. They are helping another person apply the 12 step principles to their situation.
I find this quiet damaging to AA as a whole. AA saved my life. Rather than a UA-cam video which goes against the traditions maybe you could have spoken to a family member or a trusted friend. AA has saved millions of lives. If you are reading this and you have a problem with addiction, please try the fellowship for yourselves. It is very rare that details in above opinion happen. happen h
UA-cam is an open space for everyone to share their views and far more effective than just talking to my family, who also by the way experienced trauma in AlAnon which is just an offshoot cult of AA.
This channels PURPOSE is to be damaging to AA - a program that itself is damaging to thousands of people.
AA is not a recovery program. It’s a “fellowship” otherwise known as a cult. It’s extremely common to see the problems I discussed, which is the conversations I’ve been having with multiple ex members. It’s not based in recovery and it’s not helpful.
If you find it otherwise, enjoy your experience. But why search out a negative opinion just to comment more AA propaganda ? Doesn’t make sense to me.
This is intelligent, well organized and well spoken! Thank you very much for your honesty. I think all of these issues are consistent with the fact that there is near to a zero context about sponsorship in AA's initial literature. The first 100, perhaps even 1000 AAs relied on the ethics of their Faith in the issues so well presented here, and even then, there were problems just like the current ones, in the concept of sponsorship. AA is imperfect to say the very least, I suppose. I treat my sponsorship role with the greatest care that I can muster, and I am grateful for the clear reminders in this video about how this can all go horribly wrong. Having said, and meant all of that, I would offer that there is little evidence that most trained addiction counselors and therapists are not prone to some of these identical issues. There is a context of (imperfect also) accountability, in the professions and their training and licensing, granted.
AA is absolutely beautiful #!! ☝️🙏🤗🙏🥇🏆💯
Thanks for the insight. I can definitely agree with alot of this based on stories I hear in meetings. I have a great sponsor personally. He’s been sober almost 20 years, he’s a blue collar Irish guy like me and we bond on that. I call him once a day to check in and shoot the shit and that’s it. He’s not pushy, he’s not judgmental. I text him once a day what time works for a call, he gives me a time and when I see him in meetings i learn a lot about his addiction also when he shares. He’s also been through the steps where I haven’t yet and I think a good sponsor should be a guy who has worked the steps before. I’m fortunate I guess
A sponsor is someone who has a working knowledge of the steps and the big book, and is willing to go through the steps and book with you. There are no official qualifications to sponsor
I love bright colours. My room is full of colourful glass, Knitted multicolour throws and bright "hippy" rugs. My sponsor 12 years ago gave me instruction to get rid of it all and be more "beige" 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Like, why?? What purpose does that serve your recovery??? Wild
Gosh almost every word for word in this video hit me in good way. I respect AA but like you said the whole pushing 90 meetings in 90 days or your recovery won't work or sponsors walking into there sponsees apartment and making coffee and feeling like they have some authority into how to work a program really caught my attention in this video. There is just something about introducing your self in those places and saying I'm alcoholic right after that just doesn't sit right with me. I have in the past had temporary sponsors and yeah you're right working that 4th step but not knowing their 4rth step like a lot of red flags I caught way early in the program. Yeah connection is healthy and the art of supporting each other in this day an age does feel lost at times but it's not like that with everyone and everywhere. I also like that you had mentioned were sponsors and having to check in twice a day and breaking down your ego and blah blah blah I felt that 100%. You don't need a place like AA (home group) or a sponsor to have a spiritual awakening. Some people are there for court or really do need help and have no sense of direction and really have to start over. But for the most part it really comes down to just being honest with your self and whatever harm, trauma you have been through to form new healthy behavior patterns and overcoming certain obstacles in ones life. You don't need to be involved with AA or have a sponsor to change as a person for the better. Thank you so much for making this video. Truly was a breath of fresh air hearing that come from someone else other than my two sense. I have a right to feel and think for my self. I watched another juicy video right before this one so it's nice seen people I can relate to on how they feel about AA and sponsors. You're the best you made my night! I'm coming up onto two months not drinking but I have been learning so much about my self and fighting those demons and changing certain parts about me that I don't like. Some people just buy into the AA thinking it's that way or the high way when in reality there are so many other ways to bettering your self as a human. Gym, College, beach, yoga, jogging, swimming, traveling around the world making new connections there are so many positive outlets out there.Thank you again. Longest comment I've ever written ☺
AA/ you have no idea how AA works! Because you never worked the steps with a sponsor!! So you're not 🚫 talking from your actual experience s! Only from gossip from what other's said! And from your own mis-guided perception s!😮! L 🙏 for you though ok. Please 🙏 get over your fears and resentment s#!!! 😮☝️👊
I agree 100%!
Hey all , if you are in the rooms , focus on what poeples actions are in the rooms and their lives , not what people are saying , its a program of action and not saying , so glad i had someone who pointed this out to me and the right people brought me through steps , and now 6years sober clean and gamble free and homeless to getting married next week..❤🎉😊
People are people no matter where you go.
There are a a lot messed up people in AA. One can not engage in such destructive behavior as excessive drinking and drugging and think they see the world clearly. Been sober 18 years. One of the first things my sponsor told me is." It's just a AA meeting and don't forget where you meet us at. I've sponsored many people and realize I don't get people sober nor to I get them drunk. The only thing I can do for them, is walk through the first 164 pages .and let the make the decisions that maybe AA will work for them. A very disturbing trend I've witnessed in the past five years is many people are coming in to AA and want to discuss all the psychobabble they've learned in treatment centers .and when their told that's a outside issue their put off. That's not the fault of AA. Many of they addicted want a quick fix.( their in a lot of pain), I know I was. But entail I could get honest about what my addiction did to my life I continued to deflect that I had every other problem. My sponsor helped be get honest with myself about my addiction and helped be take he responsibility for by recovery.
Thanks for the comment and engagement. I understand that faith based fellowships work for a lot of people! It doesn’t really alter the points I was making in the video. Best of luck in your recovery!
Great job 👍
Good points. I don't agree totally but that's ok. More opinions on this are good
I have decided that my life had become unmanageable , that alcohol was destroying my life, step 1, that means there is nothing or no one that will change my decisions. That's just me, the point is that I understand that alcoholics will blame someone or something else to drink over. Sponsor or no sponsor. I started with 1 sponsor who after 7 years is a distant friend, that I still contact and share thoughts, in closing, I have decided to stop drinking , nobody can change my decision.
Oh. 1 weeks sober already had an old timer texting me. Got my # through a group chat. 😂
Thank you . I don't like anything about it. My experience was a kid who did not ever find myself. This was the worst thing for me. No recovery.
I was an IV drug addict for 5.5 years. Homeless, in and out of jail and rehab and AA. I’m sober almost 5 years, I went to rehab/detox 1/10/2020, and I was there for 10 months on the dot. I got out and went to sober living where they brought meetings into the house, and they required you to have some sort of foot inside one of the fellowships. When I lived there, I started going every day. I got a sponsor and worked the steps, I did service, helped new comers, and I checked all the boxes. What I noticed was first of all, I was told by my sponsor to take suggestions from people who had a lot of time, and I had an issue taking certain suggestions from people who hit rock bottom from alcohol in their brickell (rich neighborhood in Miami) condo that their parents were paying for while they attended UM…someone like that has zero clue what it’s like to walk in my shoes. My sponsor said that’s my disease talking…also I noticed they would always emphasize not sleeping with new comers, yet the same people who spoke against it were doing it themselves. At one time I was talking to a girl and my sponsor told me I would likely relapse if i pursued a relationship…they pretty much told me everything I did was wrong. And on top of that, there was a man who turned into a woman one day, and when I refused to use his “pronouns” they demonized me…like aren’t we supposed to be facing the truth? If you’re a man, you’re a man,sorry. There were so many people contradicting themselves and I felt like everyone just was competing to be the best AA person in the world. I left AA in October 2021 after almost a year. I am still sober, though I have almost no contact from anyone in the fellowship and I’m honestly so much happier. One day I showed up to a meeting after not going for a year, and a new comer who I knew from being homeless was there and a lot of the people I knew were trying to pull him away from me and snoop on our conversation, and then when I said I stopped doing AA a year ago and my life was going really well, this guy who was just awkwardly standing next to us, as though he was part of our conversation, pulled him away and said I should leave if I’m going to spread that message. 😂. He reached out to me on Facebook and said they were all telling him not to take anything I say at face value because I’m probably “getting high”…a completely baseless allegation. So at that point I said fuck this, I left. I only talk to like 2 people who I knew from AA. Ahh idk a lot of fake people in AA. If you been through enough shit in your addiction and you’re scared enough you won’t go back to using or drinking. That’s my philosophy.
Wrong! 🤡 Don’t listen to this unqualified person. Everything she says is her own issues. 🤪🤪🤪🤪 Use your own judgment. 🙏
I was told the length of recovery time didn't matter, as long as the sponsor had completed the steps. It's becoming common for people in their first year of recovery to start sponsoring. There are also definite abuses of power & people sponsoring for their own gratification.
Some people in AA teach me how I want to be
Others teach me how I don’t want to be
(I learn from everyone)
You don’t have to have a sponsor and you don’t have to be one either. I’m 17 years sober and I’ve never sponsored anyone, I don’t want that responsibility. My biggest contribution is being a secretary and I’ve done that for 15 years
Wow I’m 32 years sober and don’t have the same experience. Aa saved my life, i would walk away from the people your talking about. AA works if you work it.
I had 2 sponsors one i could never get ahold of and relapsed on heroin an one had like 5 kids by different women i saw some really bad sponsors it was hard to find anyone who was more sober than me and sometimes they were just creeping on the new girls
Hi. Ty for having the courage to speak your mind. I needed critical thinking skills too. One member male called me to ask to have sex for money. I needed mental health. One sponsor and myself accepted weird offering me methodone which I took. It crossed all boundaries. So...all u say was true fo me. I was so anxious I didn't know how to confront. She gave me menial jobs at her home. I earned a bachelor degree in English But was so sick that I planted her plants , washed her car amd cleamed her house. Ty friend
Check out the movie “the 13th step” it’s free here on UA-cam.
I think some sponsors do it for show. They have no intention of helping anyone. They just want to look good and have perceived power. They may even still be in active addiction. I never say anything in meetings. I watch and listen and I don’t see good people. Just people who want to virtue signal to each other. It’s very disappointing.
Im not powerless. The last couple days i fought off cravings. How is that powerless? But i didn't hit an AA meeting in years so i guess its jails institution and death soon. However if i did go back to a meeting id see the same miserable old timers saying rude things like " did it get any better out there?" Or "it could have been worse it could have been me" or " did you successfully drink and drug out there?" Or blah blah blah. I didn't realize how hopeless and godless AA was until i found God. The closer one gets to the real loving God Jesus, the farther you grow away from AAs people
Did you know your sponsor doesn’t have to be your confidante and who you tell. Like you could pick any trusted person and your sponsor just guides you in how to work the step but that in know way obligated you to trust them with precious secrets.
Yep. It happens. My new tiny town is a judgmental culture and what's more they really promote themselves for their work in the jails. I often feel like the group conscience is that of a corrections officer. Instead of taking the message into the jails they bring their jail-power persona to the AA meetings. I tried two sponsors and both were malignant. I love this video. Best experiences were in Palm Beach County, FL because there is a high probability that you can find a sponsor that also works for a treatment center. I was blessed my first 20 months in Delray Beach AA community. I am taking a break from AA. I am reading Carl Jung, Marie Louise Von Franz, and all I can get my hands on about alchemical active imagination. Carl Jung worked with Ebby who worked with Bill W. The Big Book is definitely alchemical literature...it's obvious..."The Solution". Working in solutions is one form of alchemy.
I had some awesome sponsors. I love AA. The unity, the recovery and the service is what has worked for me. To thy own self be true.
Awesome for you. Not sure how or why you landed on this page then!
Brilliant comment , I've had same experience , always guided myself towards the people that were doing the right things in life not just sayin the right things in meetings 😊, however any comment supporting AA this woman doing the video seems to struggle with feedback , seen it before
@@citrix123 it’s not struggling with feedback. It’s setting boundaries that my page isn’t for AA cult members. I have no interest in listening to the repetitive psychobabble y’all have been brainwashed into spouting. There’s thousands of places on the internet to evangelize the twelve steps; here it isn’t welcome. But never the less you all feel the need to insert yourselves with commentary about how “amazing” this program is without ever critically examining it.
You sound like a typical and total AA robot who’s probably been “sober” (but still smoking cigarettes and using anti depressants)for three years,
On and off……..Yes or YES?
A sponsor is someone to use as a guide to sustain your sobriety. They're not your spiritual advisor, financial advisor, marriage counselor, or your moral compass. Very few or any have had any formal training in addiction therapy. Although there are members who are competent to be an asset for your sobriety. But many others who want to be a sponsor who couldn't run a self service gas station. And should be sued for malpractice for being a sponsor. Boys should always have boy sponsors and girls have girl sponsors