Seeing lots of replies like, "It's just an innocuous cute doll. Why so much outrage?" Please be careful not to escalate things unnecessarily. Criticism is not the same as outrage and I admitted in the video that outrage was inappropriate here. But that said, it's not just a cute doll. It's a branding exercise and branding is what I do for a living. Corporations spend millions of dollars on branding because of how effective it is as a means of communicating much with little. To mistake the "little" in that equation as insignificant is to be willfully naive. Branding is meant to identify and unite through subtle impressions and associations. If some branding component repels a good portion of your audience, then it's a categorical failure. Whatever else you might say about this, it's divisive - which should at least be concerning to everyone on all sides of the debate. We don't need further division in the Church. The fact that everyone has been talking about it, the fact that every second Catholic Memes and Catholic Reddit post are about it, shows that it isn't just some "cute doll". It's a powerful symbol that is clearly affecting people. I have no issue with it existing or people liking it - that's great. The thesis of my video is that the Vatican's people said that they were drawing inspiration from pop culture and that the purpose of pop culture (its telos if you will) is moving consumer products. That's the primary motive behind pop culture. True culture, of which the Church has much to say in her tradition, has human flourishing as its purpose. Those two are incompatible. I don't really care that much if some people like anime or think its a cute symbol. I care about the Church conflating pop culture with authentic culture. That's the thesis of my video and I welcome feedback about that. Also sorry about the bad audio. This is a different setup for unscripted content that I will keep working on.
@@arashikagehayabusa2910 No, of course not. It was a work of authentic culture by a believing Catholic with no concern for its profitability. The movie industry (notice the word industry there) saw some profit potential in it and appropriated it for that purpose - but every time they refashion it for another run at the box office (first the Hobbit, now the Rings of Power) they dilute it of it's original substance and turn it into something that is appropriately called "pop culture".
@@BrianHoldsworth Interesting, thank you for replying. I see you said it's industrialized in your video now, though from a business point of view, a sole proprietorship could be considered to still be in an industry in the case of JRR Tolkien I'd think since he was a private writer. Unless you're using a non-business structured type definition for "industrialized?" Do you have a source for your assertion that JRR Tolkien had no concern for its profitability?
The anime to Catholicism pipeline is real. Tons of anime set in feudal european times often showing churches in a good light, meanwhile western media is constantly demonizing the Church and european civilization.
I remember watching an old episode of the series Macross, in which a futuristic fighter pilot does the sign of the Cross after his wingman is killed in battle. That's when you realize the unlikely hero of the saga is Catholic!
@@carterstanton3540 There's a lot of genres of anime so I don't know what you like. If you want a wholesome sports anime, Haikyuu is good. Anything from Studi Ghibli is safe to recommend. There's a lot of trash anime out there, I won't lie, probably a majority tbh. But I think Hollywood is pure evil at this point.
say what you will about Luce, as a 17 year old in high school I've seen people who wouldn't even consider being religious let alone Catholicism become slightly interested in the faith because of this. being traditional does not mean we have to hate fun, it's reaching my generation and touching their hearts.
There's another layer to this. The Vatican will be participating in the 2025 Osaka World Expo in Japan, where characters like this are common, even in advertisement. Lookup Yuru-kyara. Additionally, the Vatican is also showing one of Carvaggio's paintings in the expo, so they still are evangelizing through the method we know. In my opinion, its a great character for the context its needed and outrage about this is absurd.
I actually think the context makes it worse. I'm not outraged, but I do think it's a mistake. I don't think the Church should be "of the world" in this way. I think, as we've seen socially in other categories, when you begin to compromise your own values and culture to appease/appeal to another it just doesn't work and in fact has the opposite effect. There are obviously a lot of layers to this that can be discussed but, taking a step back, is compromising the dignity of God (as some would easily argue) in the form of an anime mascot going to realistically draw people to the church? I just don't think so.
@@b00g3rs21 You would make the same argument against many of the classical works today. At the time they went against traditional biblical depictions, and instead relied on classical pagan motifs. The same crowd who decries Luce, would be the same ones to decry most works of art throughout history. Its really not that deep.
@@Tttb95 that's a wild assumption on your part and, while the purpose behind Luce may be comparable to these other pieces from the past, I think it's clear to anyone being honest that they're categorically disconnected. And, to be clear, I'm not decrying anything, I defer to the church in all things. That doesn't mean I don't have a brain and can't have an opinion or express skepticism.
'Luce' the vaticans mascot, is literally holding a Stang, a sorcerer’s ritual staff used in modern-day witchcraft (Wicca). I'm not wrong! There is absolutely no mistake about it. It's the same witchess stang given to the Pope at the Youth Synod, which he used instead of the papal ferula!
Fun fact: Luce the blue haired adrogyne is carrying a witch's Stang. A Stang is a witch/warlock’s ceremonial staff. It is always forked, and typically has an iron nail driven through it. It stands in for the Devil himself, holding his power and his dual nature.
@@rettaroo5972 Created and designed by an LGBTQ+ artist, who seems to be fond of rainbow unicorns and the phrase “Love is Love”. Nothing to see here, I’m sure.
“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will recognize them by their fruits” (Matthew 7:15-20).
The mascot is also for the Holy See’s Panel at the 2025 world expo in Osaka, Japan. With Christianity actually slowly being on the rise there I think this is actually a nice attempt by the church.
By making a mascot in the style that has become the obsession of most of their youth and driven them away from real relationships? The church is supposed to call people out of their current state and to itself. Not dangle things in front of them that they already know but with a cross drawn on
It's a cute doll for a Japanese event and a commemorative year, and it's full of Catholic symbolism. It's being celebrated like crazy on social media. Older generations will always act like their art was better. Classical paintings and music are beautiful now, but you do absolutely know it wasn't always like that. Polyphony was considered profane and not allowed in Mass. The Eastern Orthodox still look at our beautiful Renaissance inspired sacred art with disdain for its "mundane" quality. Let's use our "rage" against the actual problems in the Church.
@@orangemanbad I get you but to be fair, this is made to resonate to the people who find this appealing. I mean like I do kinda agree with you, but then you're preaching to the converted
@ I agree with your point except for one thing. This is the design for the Jubilee as I understand it. Do you really think this little cheaply produced anime figure will make unbelievers look at it and see “gee. Maybe Christ really is God”? I would highly, highly doubt it. Whereas baroque Catholic art did just that for many centuries. That’s my argument. I don’t really care that they made this goofy little cartoon. But it seems to be odd this will be the symbol of the major jubilee of Christ ….
@@orangemanbad @orangemanbad Yeah, I do concur on it being odd as opposed to say just sponsoring it or endorsing it or something. However, I do sense some spark in this. Who would you think this appeals to best? It would be those who are fans of this type of art and then especially those who are young to say the least. I hope they make proper shows and other forms of media of this little character and her friends while promoting the fundaments of Christianity. I feel that especially for children and young minds, it would be great to instill in them the virtues of being a proper upright Christian from something they'd be more likely to watch or interact with. It wouldn't speak to me that Christ is God but it would share Christ's good teachings to young people. Anyhow, I definitely still agree that attaching this character officially to the Church's image is... odd to say the least.
The main issue is Francis has lost our trust we don’t believe he is a faithful steward of the church. So everything like this just add flames as this doesn’t bring us closer to Christ or uplift humanity.
@@orangemanbadso your hatred for pope francis is so great you would deny a doll made for children? Especially those who might One day wish to embark on a pilgrimage? Yeah buddy, great example as a follower of christ.
@@Alainmontpellier1000 then explain to me how he is better then me, not saying i am tho, im just really curious in hearing your verdict, especially from a non-cristian. ( I apologize for my terrible writing)
And that's why the Vatican is bringing an original Caravaggio painting to Japan as well. Stop making a competition between them (that's what kids do in the playground)
Let’s turn this on its head: are the traditional art styles of Japan acceptable? This does somewhat derive from that. The Latin, Baroque culture we all love is not the sum of the Church Aesthetics. What about “colorful” imagery of Jesus in Children’s Catholic books?
@@DartmoorAR At the Benedictine monastery in Mount Angel, Oregon there is a small museum in the basement. It’s basically a random collection of things the brothers gathered on their trips around. There are a bunch of paintings and icons of Christ and Mary from all over the world. The Japanese images were wildly different from even the Chinese ones. But they ALL depicted Our Lord and Lady. We hold fast to that which is good in the world and culture. It’s hard to put into words but I’m seeing a strange tendency among those more trad minded and yearn for the solemn. It’s a shying away from the world and trying to make an insulated Catholic atmosphere. There is the world which God made and filled with people and is good, and there is “the world” which is the culture of the peoples around the world that tends to decay and ruin. We shouldn’t conflate the two. It seems like a semi-gnostic tendency to be so closed off to the world. How can the Church save the world if she’s all locked up? Christ didn’t dine with sinners in the temple. He wasn’t holed up in the temple. He performed miracles on the Sabbath. The Church should be to the world as Christ is to the Church. The world is not our enemy but the hostage the Church intends on saving from “the world, the flesh and the devil”.
I won’t be decorating my home with these images the way I decorate with my traditional icons, but I don’t see why people are so up in arms about this. They’re cute images of little pilgrims. I’ll show them to my kids during our bible study and see what they think. They are 12 and 14, so they’ll probably be indifferent, but if it appeals to someone out there and it inspires them to go on pilgrimages or whatever, then great! I like them well enough and might make myself some little bookmarks to remind myself of my pilgrimage aspirations.
Why does it bother you that others dislike the image? It seems that suddenly you are very very interested in in making sure that others are discredited for having a reaction different than yours. The reason is that their correct response to wicked symbols shows that your response is wrong, and that exposes your failure. If you really were as indifferent as you pretend then you'd also be indifferent to the response of those who recognize the evil function of the image as a mechanism to attract children to the Ape Church. But you're not indifferent; you have a vested interest in the symbol.
Okay but what does that have to do with it being appropriate for the representation of a jubilee year? My understanding is that it's not meant for us it's meant for God I'm talking about the art of a jubilee year.
@@stevedoetsch what bothers me isn’t people disliking it really. It’s what people are trying to read into it. I’ve read comments about how people are saying her name is too close to Lucifer. But don’t we also have Saint Lucy? Her name means light too. People can dislike whatever they want. I just find people clutching their pearls over an innocent cartoon is a little ridiculous.
Anime is still riddled with paganism, pornography, degeneracy. Christianizing it might be as difficult as christianizing obelisks, the sun and the calendar
I don’t understand all the hate that this anime mascot has been getting. As a younger convert,(26), I thought it was a wonderful idea! I’ve asked friends who aren’t Catholic about it and they’ve loved the idea. I don’t even watch anime, but I thought it was cool! A lot of the people I’ve seen who don’t like it are older and I think a little out of touch. The west complains how the church is shrinking and when presented an opportunity to appeal to the youth they freak out! How is the younger generation expected to pick up the reigns, when we feel the older community is against things that we like.
It is a great idea, and it has alot of positive reaction, especially on the demographics they want to reach. These other people complaining on the other hand, often have a funnel vision and forget that the Church is universal and it's mission is to bring the Gospel to everyone, on every culture. That is literally the case with many Marian aparitions like Guadalupe and Coromoto, in their context, were also evangelization reaching the "pop culture" of those populations. Imagine if the Holy Virgin Mary tried to reach to aborigins with a huge bell or a michelangelo's... LOL. Pop culture, japanese culture, chinese culture they're ALL TRUE cultures too, simply because they exist, and the misionary role of everyone in the church is to reach them, not saying "mine is the true culture", when the truth is that the Church, the Gospel, Christ transceds any culture.
At least you're honest that you don't understand. Of course unbelievers would love it. But how many of them will repent of their sins, do penance, and change their lives? Few their are who find the Truth. Will this help?
@@johnf2023You think an image can make someone instantly become a believer or something? How will it help? In many many ways, here is an example you might understand: "Oh look, a cute figure, I wonder what the thing on its neck is" *learns about what the thing is* *From knowing maybe nothing about catholicism now knows amt least something and has a positive emotion towards something connected to it.*
Okay as a doll for children to play with. But as a representation of our faith and our giving glory and worship to God? To represent what does jubilee year is about which honestly I don't know. And this cute little doll confuses me even more. But hey yeah it's a cute little doll for a child to play with maybe even an adult but that's as far as it goes.
I feel like my students will like Luce, I think they are at public school and if they have a folder with Luce and Friends on it, or on a sticker or pencil, they are expressing themselves as Catholic while out in the worldly world. They can wear a crucifix or miraculous medal yes, but also having something else to remind them of who they are, Catholics, on a daily basis doesn’t seem to be a bad thing. There are many animated, cartoon versions of Saints for children. How is Luce different? She and her friends are wearing rosaries and muddy boots with a staff as pilgrims on their journey through life. They’re not dressed to demean God or Church in anyway. As a child out in the world with so many negative messages coming at them, it seems this is a positive one.
Brian, I agree that culture is important, but I disagree with your entire thesis here. This is, first of all, not in any way a debasement of the Church or Her mission. This is, under the guise of what many rigid Catholics might call a blemish, and under that same guise, what many liberal Catholics or worldly types might see as a relevancy attempt, you said - is in fact neither of these things. This is a Trojan Horse against Satan. This is the Petrine mission, becoming the lowliest of culturally-respected forms, as it were, to invade the worldly culture and, maybe putting too bluntly, impreganting the culture with an infant's image to draw those who would be otherwise deaf to the Church's call, to pay attention to the Divine Infant, Whose call for the Church to go out into the whole world and to preach the Gospel, must include the invasion of all aspects of life. The Church's Marian posture is of receiving. Certain minds in the Church have conceivbed no doubt with prayer, images of a mascot who represents an infant pilgrim. The Church's Patrine posture, of evangelizing, has now placed the seed of this image into the world. This is to draw the eyes of the unfaithful to the Truth, Whose Infancy is recalled by many only in Christmas cards and popular Christian images which they are opposed to. Let them, therefore, receive a Trojan Horse which will carry those hearts who follow the Lord, into their lives and spark the engagement of conversation about the Lord to those unwilling to hear His message through any other means. GK Chesterton once said that in his own time, people opposed to the box organ - a portable version of the organ, the traditionally religious instrument, which could be brought into the street and, using a wheel crank, play a simple song - were carrying the same spirit of the Pharisees who demanded the Lord to stop his disciples from praising Him as He entered Jerusalem. Would it be the same with you, sir? or with you, madam, who may read this? Would you not be opposed to the barrel organ (as it was also known as), saying that it devalues the Church? I cannot say, but exmine yourself! Would the Lord's reply of, "If these would be silent, the very stones would cry out!", scandalize you if you learned of the box organ? Let the Church fulfill Her mission. Let the Lord invade the current popular culture that He may conquer it from the inside. This is otherwise known as the Baptizing of the Pagan culture, the same way that the Church gave us Christmas trees and the depiction of halos around the Saints and the Lord. This is Our Lady of Guadalupe showing in Her image, those popular cultural themes which the Aztecs knew. Do not be a sterile Church. Do not be a Church unwilling to impregate the culture with the Lord by His mysterious means. If this image were not made, if the Church did not make attempts as this to bring to the Lord, minds and hearts made captive by this, She would be failing and sterile in Her mission.
The fact that Nicholas's comment does not have more likes is troublesome .The mentality of many comments is trivial if not outright out of a manuscript of what not to say and say from Rome. Dolls can be sold at shops. You have them at Lourdes, magazines, etc. Luce is simply a manifestation of a sickness that is deep within the church. Some comment allude to the 2025 Osaka World Expo in Japan where the Vatican will be participating. Yeah, a mascot to help commemorate Catholicism in that country. If only the Japanese martyrs had such a mascot to make their persecution that more palpable. They missed out. At least with the coming persecution that JPII mentioned, I'll have Luce to help me uphold my faith, to help carry me through the tempestuous see. I feel so blessed.
No, its just gay. This whole initiative is just super gay. More men (20s-30s) than women are converting/returning, and in spite of Francis’s efforts. This is the key demo to go after, particularly ones who are losing faith in modern pop culture. Using this anime girl funkopop knock off is not appealing to men of this caliber. The only ones who this could appeal to (and the ones they’re probably going after) are secular anime coomers
@@skierbinky Just to be clear, Tokidoki made it's first toy figure in 2008, while the first four Funko pops came out in 2010 at San Diego Comic Con. So I would say it's unclear who copied who, if at all, considering they came out around the same time. Source - The Toy Pool tokidoki database, and Arodie What was the first Funko Pop made
"To the weak I became weak, that I might gain the weak; I have become all things to all people, so that I may by all means save some." you can view St. Paul's words cynically, and accuse him of bowing to the culture around him, or you can show charity and realize that sometimes you have to meet people where they are at. That can mean appealing to aesthetics that are popular in the secular world
Not "cynically", but realistically. He would never compromise in order to do so. The artist who created Luce, has other art which is contrary. It's quite possible that for the few she may inspire to the Faith, she'll be for many more a gateway to the unfortunate plethora of porn within the medium.
I think it's kind of cute - and if the character has a personality that leads/encourages young kids to the Church at an earlier age, I'm all for it. I'm a senior - and I think it makes more sense than a bell. :-)
I will say this - my 9 year old loves it. And it draws that faucet of childhood towards the Church. As we get older we forget the sentimentality of children for what seems trivial to us.
If you don't meet the youth where they are at, which is online and into anime, you might not be able to evangelize effectively. It may not age well but it will speak about this generation.
As a Protestant looking to be formally welcomed into the Catholic faith in 2025, this seems to cheapen my conversion experience and trivialize what I am converting to.
Don’t have much opinions on the character, but as someone who was once non denominational if you want and wish to seek the pov and position claims of ancient Christianity, look into Eastern Orthodoxy, otherwise God bless you
As someone who isn't taken in by "anime" as a whole and in general doesnt like the terminally online sphere, i think Luce was a good choice overall. It is an appealing design that is already succeeding in softening the hearts of non-Catholics through the mere design alone, and already I see it being used as a means to evangelize among my friends. Yes, having a masterwork of art and craftsmanship would be a better commemoration. But would it actually reach people in this day and age? What exactly does a bell inspire in people? Why should someone care about an anthem for a religion's sovereign territory if they are not Catholic? I think thats a question people dont want to ask. The main reason I dont have a problem with this is because it is a cute and wholesome design in a culture that screams out for it. That people on Twitter who are more concerned with policing minor differences of opinion than showing love are expressing hate towards this is more of a sign to me that people have been so deep in despair that they cannot see simple joy anymore in anything but the most grandiose and solemn displays. Mark my words, Luce actually tapping into the small joys people want to have and see and her being a joyful example of a pilgrim will be more useful and in the end more effective than the vat majority of other similar displays we could have.
I can't imagine how a doll could be more inspiring. Honestly it may be attractive to non-Catholics consume but as a superficial figure it soon loses connection with faith, just like gospel music. In short, she is an entertainment figure.
@zuarbrincar769 I am seeing her inspiring joy and artists are looking at her design to see the influence. This one figurine is more than just an entertainment product, I am seeing it actively soften the hearts of the people and bring joy to their lives.
@@RedOblivion7 Thank you for saying at least figurine rather than doll. Dolls are generally stuffed and soft, and like most Tokidoki work, Luce at least appears to be fully plastic.
Hope this is sarcasm. Modern music is not solemn enough for the Mass and should never be used in it. Also, the Church is supposed to be serious and solemn, a message definitively not passed by this childish art style
The New World Church needs a mascot directed at children. Meanwhile the normies have zero critical thinking capacity to understand how this wicked tool will be used to attract children to the Ape Church.
I see Luce as capable of fitting into that mission of the Church of bringing Christ to the world. I can’t speak for what the Cardinal spoke about with pop culture, but this is simply a style of art that comes from the East, and as such is meant to reach out primarily to those in that area where roots of the Church are quite weak. It also so happens that many here in the West have appreciated the works from the East on fiction lately given the powerful and universal storytelling that has maintained there whilst our own myths become increasingly seeped in secular ideals, and as such this style is popular with many today. I understand the reaction of not being impressed with this presentation, but I want to see what else happens during the jubilee year. I wouldn’t be surprised if we get more art and beauty on display.
I see a lot of potential with this character. She could be the Catholic equivalent to Hello Kitty. Put her on stickers and children's school supplies. Put out shorts on the Internet that depict her and her friends visiting pilgrimage sites as documentaries for children. Have them on signs pointing out obscure pilgrim sites in Rome and other locations. I think it has some real potential. My concern is that it will come up then be abandoned and just be another, "hey fellow kids" moment.
A fascinating video. Thanks. I'm , as I've admitted, a Protestant pastor. And I found your joke at the beginning, demonstrates a generic downgrading of Culture, and Christianity. We're simplifying the faith !! We're all doing the same thing. Sigh.
exactly, my little nieces would love this. my nieces ask about the faith sometimes, when they see stuff, and tell my older brother they should be getting into the faith. its one more thing i could get them to help them bring it up with their parents and get them into it. even if their parents never do.
Luce looks like a cartoon rather than an anime character. Though I would say that this is somewhere along the lines of pop Protestantism. Making, not good art and not good worship.
One thing I find mildly amusing is how many of Luce's cheerleaders aren't actual children but maladjusted Zoomer men who are treating it as an elaborate inside joke Notice how on Twitter/X, it's all coming from the same guys who incessantly keep spamming "Pope Francis is the most based pope" and "Common Francis W"
In my italian catholic elementary school run by nuns Chiara "Luce" Badano was very much remembered, we watched documentaries on her... and now she's BACK AS AN ANIME MASCOT damn
@@BrianHoldsworthit sounds like in this video you are feeling in your heart that something is not quite right with this mascot, more so simply than it just being contemporary and modern compared to the works of complex and great art of the past. The artist, Simone Legno, commissioned by the Vatican for this piece draws x rated and lgbt content. Is this a great scandal? Perhaps you could cover this topic in another video.
It's hard to take outrage over something like this seriously when people have swallowed stuff like cherubim as chubby babies and God the Father as an old guy with a beard as trad. At least we're not going to start putting Luce in sacred spaces.
Yes, let’s go back to Fat Butt-naked Little Angels Flittering All About and Other Works of Art. 😂 Unbelievable how people are going to demonize this mascot thing and not recognize the beam in their own eyes.
I think Luce is a exactly what needed to facilitate this conversation. It shows a lot of Matt Walsh type Catholics lacking any sense joy or childlike whimsicalness, you may not like anime or pop art and better appreciate the classical stuff fine, but the seething and frankly quite schizoid posting about how this is demonic is quite pathetic. So Catholics claiming how mature they are, I only do insert ("serious" TM thing, like black coffee and whisky) and hate insert (zoomer things, like video game/anime) types, need to take a chill pill. As for Luce herself as a mascot, I think it's great and there is a place for this sort of art. The sculptures and paintings you mentioned are great too, their strength is their timelessness and depth, but consequently they are just as hard to digest if you aren't to well verse in the classical arts and the depths is lost on your. Luce here is pretty straight forward and simple, but if gets you think about deeper themes great. Plus now that we have the internet, I've see tons of fan art from both secular and Christian from this is mascot. There's merit to this that can't be easily achieved with previous forms of art (and it's not like you can't do both either). Having people come together and make more art from this is great, if it gets them to think about the deeper mystery when they make or look at the fan art, that's a lot better than them ignoring the deeper classical art altogether. If all form pop art is as vacuous as our serious Catholic like to claim, then people who like this sort art will seek out something more fulling. I do this all the time, I watch movie I like but I'm not satisfied I go read the books and then I read the things that inspired the books and so on.
AND it also uncovers those types if Catholics that aren't alert at all. Deception is everywhere these days, if You hadn't known that. Accept little of pop-cult.
People in the "valley of the shadow of death" become religious BECAUSE of mental illnesses. The religious archetypes come forth from collective unconscious to not disintegrate the psyche.
Vatican: Here's our cool little anime mascot for an upcoming trip to Japan. Nobody: Karen: Why it have blue hair. That's not Michelangelo. Look how far we fallen. Luce sounds like Lucifer. Pop culture bad. Anime gay. It's a witch
@echotapout183 They haven't changed. They're an active promoter of LGBTQ. Not to mention some evil products they've helped design I won't even type out.
True, but the same could be said about pretty much any piece of art in all of history. Not that it doesn't matter, and I really hope they choose a better artist in the future, but it's not so big of a deal that the hate for a fictional little girl has been deserved.
Pop culture is more than just culture, it is also communication. "A picture is worth a thousand words," and this "mascot" is an attempt to prophesize to the masses more effectively. In response to the reference of pandering to the masses, that is exactly what the early church did as it incorporated Easter Bunnies end eggs and the Christmas tree. These were regional cultural icons when the church expanded into these areas. Little Luce is really going "back to the basics" that brought success to the early Church. It is about being relevant to the population, to non-believers, to the godless. Lil' Luce isn't for those who are already Catholic, but for those yet to be.
Both are good. In fact, I can even draw my favorite Catholic saints in the anime art style. If you think about it, our saints are also like mascots in certain Catholic organizations like in schools and charities.
Pipo-kun, a cute fuzzy yellow mouse-like mascot with a small light dangling off a blue hat, is the mascot character for the Tokyo Metropolitan Police force... who are people you don't want to mess with. Pipo-kun was designed to give a softer image of the police and help make the the police seem more approachable. Maybe someone looked at Pipo-kun and decided it would be easier to talk to people with Luce than with fire-and -brimstone, or the placard I saw recently, "THE WAGES OF SIN IS DEATH!" (which, although true, doesn't win friends..)
Nailed it Brian. 👍 Appealing to Pop Culture will not end well. The church is meant to uplift, to inspire. To be the one constant in an ever-changing world.
I don't think Anime in Japan is pop culture. Its been around for over 100 years now. It might be pop culture to the rest of the world but it is as ingrained in Japanese culture as quinceaneras are for the Mexicans.
@@AmericanImperium2112 its cute, it makes me smile, and i can see how a cute little pilgrimage guide character to take with you, that makes you happy, could help you or your children through a tough part of your pilgrimage.
While my first response to Luce was befuddlement, I think there might actually be a place for harmless pop cuteness in a time where many find true beauty threatening. Cuteness, like beauty, is attractive; unlike beauty, it doesn't leave one feeling unable to measure up. Falling back on cuteness is certainly an improvement on the alternate strategy of dealing with modern alienation from beauty, namely, making things ugly and attracting no one. Obviously, it would be ridiculous for the Church to switch entirely to cute anime art. But Luce's not a bad starting point to begin a conversation with someone who has no idea how to engage with real beauty.
Because nothing says "harmless pop cuteness" like a blue-haired, non-binary, anime-faced, stang-wielding mascot, designed by an artist affiliated with gay p@rn.
I'm a Christian (not Catholic tho) and an artist in my mid 20s and I don't get the hate for Luce in the western side of Christianity -- maybe because I'm from Southeast Asia so Anime here isn't a wild concept even for older people since they grew up with Voltes V and Astroboy. It's a cute concept, not blasphemous nor mocking, and not exactly worldly or sexual. It's just an art style that is perhaps foreign to the west. Christianity in Japan is on the rise and in Japan it is very normal to have mascots even for government agencies and social advocacies, so I understand where the Vatican is coming from since they are also going to be participating in an Anime con from what I've read. In fact, when I was a teenager, I fell in love with a Manga series adaptation of the Bible I had borrowed from a friend, and the attention to cultural and historical detail and accuracy to the Scriptures was insanely top notch, better than storybooks I had as a child that were imported from the West. The new testament volume of it is still one of my most prized possessions, and I can't wait to complete the whole series when I save enough money. I don't know about ya'll old folks, but this is just throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
Specifically speaking to your understanding of the Western view, specifically for America, they see anime as just another version of cartoons. And cartoons to Americans historically have been targeted to children only. So Americans tend to view those who like anime as being childish, people that need to grow up past childish cartoons. This is not strictly a religious view by the way, something I wanted to mention since this is a religious channel we're on, and many comments here echo this understanding that anime is childish.
I would also like to add that the art of anime is considered slop in the West. This is partly because when it was first introduced to America when got a lot of trash that was cheap to licence or material that was very scandalous for similar reasons. And, as a Christian I have to admit that some anime became a point of infection for bad ideas, especially in regards to human sexuality.
@@arashikagehayabusa2910 it IS a religious view tho 1 Corinthians 13:11 KJV [11] When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
@@Hello-bi1pm and that also begs the question of what is considered childish and why? Also, that view may well have come from religion, but it seems to be widely held by atheists as well. It's not exclusively a religious view that we have to put away everything that may be considered childish.
Lord have mercy. Everyone have a different path to unite with Christ. But if you think that Catholic church once again moving away from apostolic tradition, just know that you are always welcome home in the Orthodox Church.
Idk man, catholicism expressing itself through different artforms doesnt take away from the solemn ways of artistic expression, as long as the other "mundaner" expressions dont take overhand.
My biggest beef is that Luce at worst looks like it was AI generated and at best is another slackjawed wide-appeal nothing-burger that like everything else in Neo-Catholicism was made by a tasteless and senseless committee. The fact it came with a handy chart to explain the the visual elements is proof in the pudding because I and a lot of other people were like "what's with the raincoat and weird half cross walking stick he's holding?". The Olympic Committee somehow has better mascots circa Beijing 2008 and Vancouver 2010.
Well, that's just like, your opinion bro. Most poeople love the design. Oh yeah, if you explain symbolisim to people who might not instantly get it proves its bad because people usually toootaly get every single sybolic element in an image. 😂
Anime is used by some to represent gender. Some may be ASD and find comfort in using it as a representation. I understand that. What I find interesting is the Vatican chooses this as a mascot in context of their other writings and publications. I wonder if this mascot was suggested by lobby group representatives who attended the synod. Just like their Marxist based ideas that sound so wonderful but are laden with a dark and violent history. This mascot design was a carefully thought out choice after the Synod. As someone who has worked with many youth and used to be in full support of the L movement, I quickly watched it transform over the years into the dangerous disaster it is today and perpetuated the harm it has done to youth. It began with increments of changes that seemed positive and loving and ended up being a Trojan horse for a billion dollar industry and a medical horror show. I’m as left as it gets. I’ve nothing against marginalized T. I’ve worked and cared for many. But this has gone off the rails. “When Sons Become Daughters, Part V: The Links Between Trans Identity, Gifted Minds, Categorical Thinking-And Anime”
A witch's stang is a wooden staff with a forked top that is used in witchcraft rituals. The stang can be used for a variety of purposes, including: Representing the Horned God: In some traditions, the stang symbolizes the Horned God. Directing energy: The stang can be used to direct energy. Spirit journeying: The stang can help with spirit journeying. Opening the third eye: Some believe that using a stang can open the third eye, which allows the user to see the past, present, and future. Witches Stang. The stang is often topped with a naturally occurring fork or antlers. The bottom of the stang is shod with an iron shoe to protect it and ground it. Robert Cochrane is thought to have popularized the term "stang" through his use of the ritual item.
Thank you for bringing up the bizarre correlation between anime and chronically online people in the right-wing sphere. I don't understand how that got started or why- ironically, they are often the most rabidly "protect masculinity" types out there.
Buddy, the church have alot mascots for events or celebration days. Luce is only the newest. As far children mascot goes, she is pretty well made. Man you are pushing it
You're wrong on this, Luce is awesome. It's like a new "Pepe the Frog", it's a Catholic character that people can use to represent a faithful Catholic in their memes. It's an avenue for Catholicism to enter meme culture in a way that is way more accessible than before.
When I initially saw it, and especially in the days that followed, I couldn't help but think that surely, someone involved in the design process KNEW that the character would create these kinds of reactions, and KNEW it would meme itself into "algorithmic relevancy".
This is stupid. The people stanning it and the people hating on it. It's just not important. There is absolutely not a single thing the Church can now do without people having toddler level temper tantrums online. It's stupid. Responding to it is stupid. Giving any of these people the time of day is stupid. The only thing this mascot warrants is a "huh, okay" and move on. Both sides of this just look like that one painting of the heckler teasing the dogs.
First Ruptnick's ugly art and now this doll. Yeah, its cute but it sure isn't an inspiration. Its laughable. Vatican doesn't want to be taken seriously that's for sure.
“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will recognize them by their fruits” (Matthew 7:15-20).
Every age had an art style to express the faith. Trying to ignore it and keep sacred art in 1500's humanism won't do it either. 100 years from now they'll say Luce is exactly what you'd expect from this generation of Catholics. Like it or not art reflects culture, denying it, hiding from it, helps no one. My hope is young people will use this art form to speak to truths about the faith. No one will see it coming. Alice Cooper's music has hidden Christian messages, anime should do the same. Just look at the Basilica of La Sagrada Familia, imagine if the architect was stifled by traditional ideas of what a cathedral should look like. I pray we have a new explosion of creatives doing big things for the faith. No more ugly art, no more post modern nihilism, no more narcissism, but a simple aim to meet the faithful where they are at and bring them closer to Christ.
People who don’t see anything wrong with this mascot (at least the childishness of it) only prove how the average person has been brainwashed by pop culture and lacks the acquired taste to discern good art from bad.
@@Uwhwvwgwh Beauty is not subjective. If you want to better understand this stance you should watch "Why beauty matters" documentary by Roger Scruton. Maybe you find it interesting.
@@rvatina thank you I am going to read it but just to make it clear I don't agree with the concept it's arrogant and biased the only thing subjective about art is the effort that was put into making it .
@@Uwhwvwgwh i understand your point of view. it's okay to disagree, not trying to proselytize. i'm just suggesting something that will explain my position much better than i ever could.
I don't think there's enough attention given here to how overwhelmingly influential anime is in the younger generations. Young people respond to it pretty well. And as a younger person, there's a goofy and whimsical aspect to Luce, but there's a clear message: Catholicism isn't a thing of the past. It's a thing of the now, and can exist in any medium that isn't inherently sinful. If we can plunder the egyptians, we can surely plunder the Japanese too 😂
I view Luce as an example of many of the bishops having no good idea on how to attract people to the Catholic Church and they just throw stuff at the the wall to see what sticks - and every idea they come up with is just ugh.
i spent money on cute military garb anime girls for my gun on call of duty, undoubtedly will spend money on this as it relates to the faith. is it really SO BAD they made a cute pilgrim mascot to debut in a culturally relevant place, thats gonna have mass appeal? the Japanese anime subculture is popular worldwide and could draw people to ask questions about the faith. japan could use the faith, especially for their sexual teachings atm, their birthrate is horrid.
I have no love of this mascot, partially because sometimes anime sexualizes minors and this mascot reminds me of that, and I love the chibi style in both manga/anime and things like the Precious Moments series, the latter of which often depicts religious figures and events. At this point I just don't trust the Vatican to have good intentions with these things. However, I disagree with you about Michael Angelo's piece. He was a very talented artist, a true master of his craft, but these nude figures have no place in the church. The church was wrong to embrace the Renaissance the way it did, that was the beginning of the end, and many priests, trad and novus alike, agree with me on this. At best this piece demonstrates the church's embrace of humanism, since it depicts Christ as a mere mortal whereas medieval art depicted Him as Divine and extra dimensional. At worst it sexualizes Our Lord. To me, this piece marks a sad trend of decadence in the Catholic Church and I believe it should be taken down and replaced with a more dignified depiction which follows medieval conventions that were invented explicatly by the church for church art. I know I defended the chibi style in paragraph 1, but I believe the time and place for it is absolutely not on the walls of a church, but in a children's Bible, missal or prayer book, in a children's Bible-based or lives of saints-based cartoon, and in a children's nativity set.
I’ve learnt, little by little to obey and accept the church. Over 2000 years, the church its always been right, maybe this is wrong, but for the most part it has been. I will not criticize, but pray for the pope and the church. God bless.
This is not timeless art. I own many, many manga and anime series and books. This is not what I want to represent Catholicism. The young converts I know want authentic, historical Christianity. They want ancient hymns and chant, not pop music or Haugen/Haas or OCP. We want reverence and to be Holy, set apart, for Christ. We want Mass to look like heaven. We do not want Mass to look like the world or Protestantism. Do better Vatican. Do better.
It's a mascot for an event in Japan next year. This is meant to only gain publicity for the event. The Vatican will be bringing an original Caravaggio painting to Japan as well. These people know what they're doing
I cannot conceive of a single situation in which anyone is going to be brought closer to Christ because of some cringe "hello fellow youths" chibi anime mascot. So bad and so out of touch.
Imagine not be disturbed by the Vatican hiring a guy who creates devil inspired art work for vibrators creating children charters for Catholics.........are we really that pathetic?
I see it as a positive. The more positive light Catholicism gets, the more inclined people will be to join. It doesn’t violate any doctrines and it not irreverent. It’s not like people are making any Luce icons or anything.
As a young person who occasionally enjoys some anime. This is incredibly unattractive to me and even more so my secular peers. The only people I see really liking this are terminally online Twitter catholics who are obsessed with anime girls
@@divebombexpert2619 commenting for 5 minutes on a brian Holdsworth video is the same as obsessing over anime girls on twitter. so true! what are you even arguing for?
According to an Italian catholic news article the author of the mascot has had some different customers previously which aren't exactly aligned with Church teaching: pride and the porn industry specifically. So I would say that it's not just about what the Church decides to do with popular culture, it's also who they involve in doing it. It speaks volumes about how misguided this kind of decision is.
I agree with you Brian, despite there being a loud majority in the comment section. I don't see how Catholics who are aware of the current state of the Church look at something like this and at the very least scratch their head and say "that's the best we could do?!" If this isn't trying to reach out to the world by using the mechanisms of the world, than I don't know what is. This is on par with changing liturgical music to match 70's music to be "hip." The Church has a responsibility to use the arts to elevate the thoughts of sinners to heavenly things, not to employ cheap signification. This "mascot" has no transcendence, permanence, and evangelizes poorly. It looks silly now and will continue to grow in silliness as time progresses. I say all of this as a Catholic artist and woodcarver trying to find places where my labor can be put to help make sanctuaries beautiful again. There is a abdication by much of the church to make "good" art.
A few things I’d like to chime in here. First, I’m a bit late to the conversation, but your view on this is spot on. Calling for deeper discussion about it is very much needed. And synodal as well. Second, this earnest desire for being relevant is what I see in many settings involving the youth and general public at large: this kind of “cultural” approach is counterproductive precisely because instead of drawing from our deep treasures, it speaks of truths as if they were nothing important enough to challenge pop expectations. And, finally, while your reflection is great as usual, this time your audio is not as clear as we are accustomed.
To be honest, I never heard of the mascot before clicking on this video. I was fully expecting to hate it, but I actually kind of like it😅 i love that it's wearing a rosary. I agree with Brian that the Church needs to embrace what sets it apart from the world (beauty, tradition, sacrifice) rather than try to conform itself to current trends, but really the mascot is not so bad! For the segment of Catholics who enjoy anime and Japanese culture, they will cherish it. It sort of reminds me of Matt Fradd's Catholic lofi videos, which are much beloved. I like Luce, and I'm not afraid to say it 😂
The problem is these old bishops in the Vatican have no clue what they are dealing with since they know 0% of the internet. They're probably be able to give some of the best homilies you might ever hear but definitely not anything pop-culture. Anime is notorious for many practices and fantasies that are considered heretical in Christianity. This could become problematic in the future when these old bishops and cardinals die and the newer yet less traditionally Catholic generation takes over. I believe Luce could be one of the many salt flakes being dropped into the wound of the Catholic Church as it continues to accept things that has been seen as problematic throughout its history. The world really needs to tackle the issue of Anime culture taking over everything. I myself am Gen Z and it upsetting to see what direction the Church is going.
I don't think there is anything wrong with the mascot, it cute and adorable, the problem is the generational gap and the identity most people associate with pop culture, if we were to attribute let's say why most people fancy themselves heroes, in D&D style, games its because they have belief and faith in the Greeko Roman Christian virtues that, and that is nothing wrong, the problem is people make fun of it, thinking its lame, for example, I used to help old people cross the street and lift there bags, hell an old lady gave 5$ for that, Materialism is not the problem its the lack of humanity in it, that we associate with the physical world,
Imagine being a "Trad" and questioning the church. Many forget the church is not a democracy. The Pope is basically a King, and hence he doesn't need anyone's opinion in the matter. God is in control, wether you like it or not, and He will reach the youth however He sees fit. Just like Guadalupe had symbols that natives understood.
Anime is Japanese animation. Like Naruto, Dragon Ball and etc. In America there's some adult cartoon which are like anime but isn't truly anime but anime-like.
Seeing lots of replies like, "It's just an innocuous cute doll. Why so much outrage?"
Please be careful not to escalate things unnecessarily. Criticism is not the same as outrage and I admitted in the video that outrage was inappropriate here. But that said, it's not just a cute doll. It's a branding exercise and branding is what I do for a living. Corporations spend millions of dollars on branding because of how effective it is as a means of communicating much with little. To mistake the "little" in that equation as insignificant is to be willfully naive. Branding is meant to identify and unite through subtle impressions and associations. If some branding component repels a good portion of your audience, then it's a categorical failure. Whatever else you might say about this, it's divisive - which should at least be concerning to everyone on all sides of the debate. We don't need further division in the Church.
The fact that everyone has been talking about it, the fact that every second Catholic Memes and Catholic Reddit post are about it, shows that it isn't just some "cute doll". It's a powerful symbol that is clearly affecting people. I have no issue with it existing or people liking it - that's great. The thesis of my video is that the Vatican's people said that they were drawing inspiration from pop culture and that the purpose of pop culture (its telos if you will) is moving consumer products. That's the primary motive behind pop culture. True culture, of which the Church has much to say in her tradition, has human flourishing as its purpose. Those two are incompatible. I don't really care that much if some people like anime or think its a cute symbol. I care about the Church conflating pop culture with authentic culture. That's the thesis of my video and I welcome feedback about that.
Also sorry about the bad audio. This is a different setup for unscripted content that I will keep working on.
As you get further and further into animal, it becomes less and less holy...into the radical zone ...its not like a chatty cathy doll.
Hi Mr. Holdsworth, do you consider The Lord of the Rings to be pop culture?
@@arashikagehayabusa2910 No, of course not. It was a work of authentic culture by a believing Catholic with no concern for its profitability. The movie industry (notice the word industry there) saw some profit potential in it and appropriated it for that purpose - but every time they refashion it for another run at the box office (first the Hobbit, now the Rings of Power) they dilute it of it's original substance and turn it into something that is appropriately called "pop culture".
Is there nothing of value to be found in pop culture?
@@BrianHoldsworth Interesting, thank you for replying. I see you said it's industrialized in your video now, though from a business point of view, a sole proprietorship could be considered to still be in an industry in the case of JRR Tolkien I'd think since he was a private writer. Unless you're using a non-business structured type definition for "industrialized?"
Do you have a source for your assertion that JRR Tolkien had no concern for its profitability?
The anime to Catholicism pipeline is real. Tons of anime set in feudal european times often showing churches in a good light, meanwhile western media is constantly demonizing the Church and european civilization.
I would love a recommendation!!!
I remember watching an old episode of the series Macross, in which a futuristic fighter pilot does the sign of the Cross after his wingman is killed in battle. That's when you realize the unlikely hero of the saga is Catholic!
The carrier of Lucy is Lucifer
And even when it’s not shown in a good light, it can still inspire and ultimately be part of a journey towards. Bloodborne did that for me.
@@carterstanton3540 There's a lot of genres of anime so I don't know what you like. If you want a wholesome sports anime, Haikyuu is good. Anything from Studi Ghibli is safe to recommend.
There's a lot of trash anime out there, I won't lie, probably a majority tbh. But I think Hollywood is pure evil at this point.
say what you will about Luce, as a 17 year old in high school I've seen people who wouldn't even consider being religious let alone Catholicism become slightly interested in the faith because of this. being traditional does not mean we have to hate fun, it's reaching my generation and touching their hearts.
ik its so frustrating. Our generation loves it. Let alone imagine how Japan feels right now.
This sounds like you want to be of the world. Do you know who created what you claim is "fun"? Sin is fun that's why it's hard to be a Christian
I'm sorry, but this is the church.
@@pasalasaga pardon?
@@christvault4038 It was an "is" not an "isn't", the damn autocorrector.
There's another layer to this. The Vatican will be participating in the 2025 Osaka World Expo in Japan, where characters like this are common, even in advertisement. Lookup Yuru-kyara. Additionally, the Vatican is also showing one of Carvaggio's paintings in the expo, so they still are evangelizing through the method we know.
In my opinion, its a great character for the context its needed and outrage about this is absurd.
Don't expect content creators and reactionaries to take context into consideration
I actually think the context makes it worse. I'm not outraged, but I do think it's a mistake. I don't think the Church should be "of the world" in this way. I think, as we've seen socially in other categories, when you begin to compromise your own values and culture to appease/appeal to another it just doesn't work and in fact has the opposite effect. There are obviously a lot of layers to this that can be discussed but, taking a step back, is compromising the dignity of God (as some would easily argue) in the form of an anime mascot going to realistically draw people to the church? I just don't think so.
Exactly
@@b00g3rs21 You would make the same argument against many of the classical works today. At the time they went against traditional biblical depictions, and instead relied on classical pagan motifs. The same crowd who decries Luce, would be the same ones to decry most works of art throughout history.
Its really not that deep.
@@Tttb95 that's a wild assumption on your part and, while the purpose behind Luce may be comparable to these other pieces from the past, I think it's clear to anyone being honest that they're categorically disconnected.
And, to be clear, I'm not decrying anything, I defer to the church in all things. That doesn't mean I don't have a brain and can't have an opinion or express skepticism.
Fun fact. Luce was revealed on the birthday of Blessed Chiara (Luce) Bodano.
A modern teenager.
'Luce' the vaticans mascot, is literally holding a Stang, a sorcerer’s ritual staff used in modern-day witchcraft (Wicca). I'm not wrong! There is absolutely no mistake about it. It's the same witchess stang given to the Pope at the Youth Synod, which he used instead of the papal ferula!
Fun fact: Luce the blue haired adrogyne is carrying a witch's Stang. A Stang is a witch/warlock’s ceremonial staff. It is always forked, and typically has an iron nail driven through it. It stands in for the Devil himself, holding his power and his dual nature.
@@georgistarkov717Yes and his yellow rain jacket is reminiscent of victimized children in horror movies such as IT.
@@rettaroo5972 Created and designed by an LGBTQ+ artist, who seems to be fond of rainbow unicorns and the phrase “Love is Love”. Nothing to see here, I’m sure.
@@rettaroo5972 Look up some of the artist work by TokiDoki. The creator of this thing.
> _Literally the cutest most harmless thing ever_
"This is the fall of Christianity actually"
The ANNIE CHRIST
_Literally_ not at all close to anything I said in the video.
“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will recognize them by their fruits” (Matthew 7:15-20).
No it's not and I don't think you understand the Japanese mindset at all promote her. Thanks to Luce,敗率は爆上がりだぜ
Christianity in Japan will explode from
It's gay af lmao. Adding another reason for us Orthodox to laugh at you.
The mascot is also for the Holy See’s Panel at the 2025 world expo in Osaka, Japan. With Christianity actually slowly being on the rise there I think this is actually a nice attempt by the church.
No! It’s not!!! Blue haired doll is a demon !!!!
By making a mascot in the style that has become the obsession of most of their youth and driven them away from real relationships? The church is supposed to call people out of their current state and to itself. Not dangle things in front of them that they already know but with a cross drawn on
@mariimichelle that's a really poor take. There are many legitimate criticisms of this. But "IT'S A DEMON!!!" isn't one of them
@@mariimichelleTake your meds you schizoposter
@@MikeyJMJthis also isn't helpful. In what world is calling him schizo going to help him see calling everything demonic is wrong? Be charitable
Many youth seek the church as an alternative to pop culture. The church values sanctity & beauty in a world that increasingly does not.
And they still can.
100%. The Church needs to embrace its roots and traditions, not mold herself to modern trends.
Christianity isn't about "escaping rotten world" its about making a Kingdom of God here on earth
@@karolo0-12 yes. BUT THEREFORE, not embrace the kingdom of the evil one which he is building here
@@friedawells6860 26 yo here. Been attracted to TLM since like 15. Pretty much a trad. Hating this worldly stuff...
It's a cute doll for a Japanese event and a commemorative year, and it's full of Catholic symbolism. It's being celebrated like crazy on social media. Older generations will always act like their art was better. Classical paintings and music are beautiful now, but you do absolutely know it wasn't always like that. Polyphony was considered profane and not allowed in Mass. The Eastern Orthodox still look at our beautiful Renaissance inspired sacred art with disdain for its "mundane" quality. Let's use our "rage" against the actual problems in the Church.
Well the old baroque catholic art is objectively much superior to this cartoon
@@orangemanbad I get you but to be fair, this is made to resonate to the people who find this appealing. I mean like I do kinda agree with you, but then you're preaching to the converted
@ I agree with your point except for one thing. This is the design for the Jubilee as I understand it. Do you really think this little cheaply produced anime figure will make unbelievers look at it and see “gee. Maybe Christ really is God”? I would highly, highly doubt it. Whereas baroque Catholic art did just that for many centuries. That’s my argument. I don’t really care that they made this goofy little cartoon. But it seems to be odd this will be the symbol of the major jubilee of Christ ….
*Felipe* ----- 'Polyphony' ---------- Thanks - you reminded me -------------- I have to feed my parrots 🦜🦜🦜
@@orangemanbad @orangemanbad Yeah, I do concur on it being odd as opposed to say just sponsoring it or endorsing it or something. However, I do sense some spark in this. Who would you think this appeals to best? It would be those who are fans of this type of art and then especially those who are young to say the least. I hope they make proper shows and other forms of media of this little character and her friends while promoting the fundaments of Christianity. I feel that especially for children and young minds, it would be great to instill in them the virtues of being a proper upright Christian from something they'd be more likely to watch or interact with. It wouldn't speak to me that Christ is God but it would share Christ's good teachings to young people. Anyhow, I definitely still agree that attaching this character officially to the Church's image is... odd to say the least.
“In Catholicism, the Pepe, the Luce, and the Cross fit together”
-G.K. Chesterton
Something tells me that the Pepe is his favorite part.
@@SirBlackReeds G.K. Chesterton was a huge Pepe fan
@@SuperSaiyanScandinavian That's canon
Nah can't understand people hating. The mascot is cute just let people have some fun. And im saying this as an SSPX "radtrad"
The main issue is Francis has lost our trust we don’t believe he is a faithful steward of the church. So everything like this just add flames as this doesn’t bring us closer to Christ or uplift humanity.
@@orangemanbadso your hatred for pope francis is so great you would deny a doll made for children? Especially those who might One day wish to embark on a pilgrimage?
Yeah buddy, great example as a follower of christ.
@@chadano1611 Probably a better example as a follower of Christ than you, and I say that as a non Catholic.
@@Alainmontpellier1000 then explain to me how he is better then me, not saying i am tho, im just really curious in hearing your verdict, especially from a non-cristian.
( I apologize for my terrible writing)
Non-catholic* sorry ( read that wrong)
This religion has access to the most beautiful art and music ever made by humans.
There is a reason most fantasy anime and video games take inspiration from the Catholic church.
And that's why the Vatican is bringing an original Caravaggio painting to Japan as well. Stop making a competition between them (that's what kids do in the playground)
@ My comment was value neutral. I think you may have read something more into it.
Let’s turn this on its head: are the traditional art styles of Japan acceptable? This does somewhat derive from that. The Latin, Baroque culture we all love is not the sum of the Church Aesthetics.
What about “colorful” imagery of Jesus in Children’s Catholic books?
@@DartmoorAR At the Benedictine monastery in Mount Angel, Oregon there is a small museum in the basement. It’s basically a random collection of things the brothers gathered on their trips around. There are a bunch of paintings and icons of Christ and Mary from all over the world. The Japanese images were wildly different from even the Chinese ones. But they ALL depicted Our Lord and Lady. We hold fast to that which is good in the world and culture.
It’s hard to put into words but I’m seeing a strange tendency among those more trad minded and yearn for the solemn. It’s a shying away from the world and trying to make an insulated Catholic atmosphere. There is the world which God made and filled with people and is good, and there is “the world” which is the culture of the peoples around the world that tends to decay and ruin. We shouldn’t conflate the two. It seems like a semi-gnostic tendency to be so closed off to the world. How can the Church save the world if she’s all locked up? Christ didn’t dine with sinners in the temple. He wasn’t holed up in the temple. He performed miracles on the Sabbath. The Church should be to the world as Christ is to the Church. The world is not our enemy but the hostage the Church intends on saving from “the world, the flesh and the devil”.
I won’t be decorating my home with these images the way I decorate with my traditional icons, but I don’t see why people are so up in arms about this. They’re cute images of little pilgrims. I’ll show them to my kids during our bible study and see what they think. They are 12 and 14, so they’ll probably be indifferent, but if it appeals to someone out there and it inspires them to go on pilgrimages or whatever, then great! I like them well enough and might make myself some little bookmarks to remind myself of my pilgrimage aspirations.
Why does it bother you that others dislike the image? It seems that suddenly you are very very interested in in making sure that others are discredited for having a reaction different than yours. The reason is that their correct response to wicked symbols shows that your response is wrong, and that exposes your failure.
If you really were as indifferent as you pretend then you'd also be indifferent to the response of those who recognize the evil function of the image as a mechanism to attract children to the Ape Church. But you're not indifferent; you have a vested interest in the symbol.
Okay but what does that have to do with it being appropriate for the representation of a jubilee year? My understanding is that it's not meant for us it's meant for God I'm talking about the art of a jubilee year.
@@stevedoetsch what bothers me isn’t people disliking it really. It’s what people are trying to read into it. I’ve read comments about how people are saying her name is too close to Lucifer. But don’t we also have Saint Lucy? Her name means light too. People can dislike whatever they want. I just find people clutching their pearls over an innocent cartoon is a little ridiculous.
@@KMF3 Ok sure, but why wouldn’t God like it? Is it just the style that’s the problem?
@@SewHealthyWithDiane because it is trivial and mundane. I liked what Brian said about Pop culture being about a consumer product.
We Christianized everything from Egyptian obelisks, to the Sun and the calendar. Why shouldn't we Christianize anime? We love Luce 💛
so why a blue haired Greta like icon? Why not Megaman?
@@nancyreyes5677 Or something like Castlevania or The Penitent from Blasphemous.
Anime is still riddled with paganism, pornography, degeneracy. Christianizing it might be as difficult as christianizing obelisks, the sun and the calendar
@@ivancarmo878 then we try, try, and eventually succeed.
@@ivancarmo878it's a drawing like ancient people probably draw porn too in ancient art style
I don’t understand all the hate that this anime mascot has been getting. As a younger convert,(26), I thought it was a wonderful idea! I’ve asked friends who aren’t Catholic about it and they’ve loved the idea. I don’t even watch anime, but I thought it was cool! A lot of the people I’ve seen who don’t like it are older and I think a little out of touch. The west complains how the church is shrinking and when presented an opportunity to appeal to the youth they freak out! How is the younger generation expected to pick up the reigns, when we feel the older community is against things that we like.
It is a great idea, and it has alot of positive reaction, especially on the demographics they want to reach. These other people complaining on the other hand, often have a funnel vision and forget that the Church is universal and it's mission is to bring the Gospel to everyone, on every culture. That is literally the case with many Marian aparitions like Guadalupe and Coromoto, in their context, were also evangelization reaching the "pop culture" of those populations. Imagine if the Holy Virgin Mary tried to reach to aborigins with a huge bell or a michelangelo's... LOL.
Pop culture, japanese culture, chinese culture they're ALL TRUE cultures too, simply because they exist, and the misionary role of everyone in the church is to reach them, not saying "mine is the true culture", when the truth is that the Church, the Gospel, Christ transceds any culture.
It’s primarily because Francis and his administration have lost the trust of Catholics and we don’t trust any Avenue he goes down at this point.
At least you're honest that you don't understand. Of course unbelievers would love it. But how many of them will repent of their sins, do penance, and change their lives? Few their are who find the Truth. Will this help?
@ it can help bring up the conversation? I’ve had people who haven’t even thought about the church bring this up to me.
@@johnf2023You think an image can make someone instantly become a believer or something?
How will it help? In many many ways, here is an example you might understand:
"Oh look, a cute figure, I wonder what the thing on its neck is"
*learns about what the thing is*
*From knowing maybe nothing about catholicism now knows amt least something and has a positive emotion towards something connected to it.*
I love Luce
Okay as a doll for children to play with. But as a representation of our faith and our giving glory and worship to God? To represent what does jubilee year is about which honestly I don't know. And this cute little doll confuses me even more. But hey yeah it's a cute little doll for a child to play with maybe even an adult but that's as far as it goes.
The boomers do not understand, Luce will be our sign of victory
What victory?
Victory of what? How does this anime girl bring someone closer to Christ?
How?
The replies do not understand how influential she could be
Whose victory may be the better question.
I feel like my students will like Luce, I think they are at public school and if they have a folder with Luce and Friends on it, or on a sticker or pencil, they are expressing themselves as Catholic while out in the worldly world. They can wear a crucifix or miraculous medal yes, but also having something else to remind them of who they are, Catholics, on a daily basis doesn’t seem to be a bad thing. There are many animated, cartoon versions of Saints for children. How is Luce different? She and her friends are wearing rosaries and muddy boots with a staff as pilgrims on their journey through life. They’re not dressed to demean God or Church in anyway. As a child out in the world with so many negative messages coming at them, it seems this is a positive one.
The Vatican playing -4D- 2D chess. Luce will bring about Japan's second golden age of Catholicism.
We can only hope so 😅
2D chess? They're playing checkers!
Yes, a giant Luce float paraded through the streets of Tokyo by nuns and Franciscans.
😂😂😂😂😂
Brian,
I agree that culture is important, but I disagree with your entire thesis here. This is, first of all, not in any way a debasement of the Church or Her mission. This is, under the guise of what many rigid Catholics might call a blemish, and under that same guise, what many liberal Catholics or worldly types might see as a relevancy attempt, you said - is in fact neither of these things. This is a Trojan Horse against Satan.
This is the Petrine mission, becoming the lowliest of culturally-respected forms, as it were, to invade the worldly culture and, maybe putting too bluntly, impreganting the culture with an infant's image to draw those who would be otherwise deaf to the Church's call, to pay attention to the Divine Infant, Whose call for the Church to go out into the whole world and to preach the Gospel, must include the invasion of all aspects of life.
The Church's Marian posture is of receiving. Certain minds in the Church have conceivbed no doubt with prayer, images of a mascot who represents an infant pilgrim. The Church's Patrine posture, of evangelizing, has now placed the seed of this image into the world. This is to draw the eyes of the unfaithful to the Truth, Whose Infancy is recalled by many only in Christmas cards and popular Christian images which they are opposed to. Let them, therefore, receive a Trojan Horse which will carry those hearts who follow the Lord, into their lives and spark the engagement of conversation about the Lord to those unwilling to hear His message through any other means.
GK Chesterton once said that in his own time, people opposed to the box organ - a portable version of the organ, the traditionally religious instrument, which could be brought into the street and, using a wheel crank, play a simple song - were carrying the same spirit of the Pharisees who demanded the Lord to stop his disciples from praising Him as He entered Jerusalem. Would it be the same with you, sir? or with you, madam, who may read this? Would you not be opposed to the barrel organ (as it was also known as), saying that it devalues the Church? I cannot say, but exmine yourself! Would the Lord's reply of, "If these would be silent, the very stones would cry out!", scandalize you if you learned of the box organ?
Let the Church fulfill Her mission. Let the Lord invade the current popular culture that He may conquer it from the inside. This is otherwise known as the Baptizing of the Pagan culture, the same way that the Church gave us Christmas trees and the depiction of halos around the Saints and the Lord. This is Our Lady of Guadalupe showing in Her image, those popular cultural themes which the Aztecs knew.
Do not be a sterile Church. Do not be a Church unwilling to impregate the culture with the Lord by His mysterious means. If this image were not made, if the Church did not make attempts as this to bring to the Lord, minds and hearts made captive by this, She would be failing and sterile in Her mission.
Por favor
Beautiful
The fact that Nicholas's comment does not have more likes is troublesome .The mentality of many comments is trivial if not outright out of a manuscript of what not to say and say from Rome. Dolls can be sold at shops. You have them at Lourdes, magazines, etc. Luce is simply a manifestation of a sickness that is deep within the church. Some comment allude to the 2025 Osaka World Expo in Japan where the Vatican will be participating. Yeah, a mascot to help commemorate Catholicism in that country. If only the Japanese martyrs had such a mascot to make their persecution that more palpable. They missed out. At least with the coming persecution that JPII mentioned, I'll have Luce to help me uphold my faith, to help carry me through the tempestuous see. I feel so blessed.
No, its just gay. This whole initiative is just super gay. More men (20s-30s) than women are converting/returning, and in spite of Francis’s efforts. This is the key demo to go after, particularly ones who are losing faith in modern pop culture. Using this anime girl funkopop knock off is not appealing to men of this caliber. The only ones who this could appeal to (and the ones they’re probably going after) are secular anime coomers
@@skierbinky Just to be clear, Tokidoki made it's first toy figure in 2008, while the first four Funko pops came out in 2010 at San Diego Comic Con. So I would say it's unclear who copied who, if at all, considering they came out around the same time.
Source - The Toy Pool tokidoki database, and Arodie What was the first Funko Pop made
"To the weak I became weak, that I might gain the weak; I have become all things to all people, so that I may by all means save some."
you can view St. Paul's words cynically, and accuse him of bowing to the culture around him, or you can show charity and realize that sometimes you have to meet people where they are at. That can mean appealing to aesthetics that are popular in the secular world
Not "cynically", but realistically. He would never compromise in order to do so. The artist who created Luce, has other art which is contrary. It's quite possible that for the few she may inspire to the Faith, she'll be for many more a gateway to the unfortunate plethora of porn within the medium.
great comment!
Well said
I think it's kind of cute - and if the character has a personality that leads/encourages young kids to the Church at an earlier age, I'm all for it. I'm a senior - and I think it makes more sense than a bell. :-)
I will say this - my 9 year old loves it. And it draws that faucet of childhood towards the Church. As we get older we forget the sentimentality of children for what seems trivial to us.
Thanks!
If you don't meet the youth where they are at, which is online and into anime, you might not be able to evangelize effectively. It may not age well but it will speak about this generation.
Spot on takes. Pop culture is inherently disordered and opposed to real culture
As a Protestant looking to be formally welcomed into the Catholic faith in 2025, this seems to cheapen my conversion experience and trivialize what I am converting to.
Nobody is forcing you to join the catholic church
Don’t have much opinions on the character, but as someone who was once non denominational if you want and wish to seek the pov and position claims of ancient Christianity, look into Eastern Orthodoxy, otherwise God bless you
As someone who isn't taken in by "anime" as a whole and in general doesnt like the terminally online sphere, i think Luce was a good choice overall. It is an appealing design that is already succeeding in softening the hearts of non-Catholics through the mere design alone, and already I see it being used as a means to evangelize among my friends.
Yes, having a masterwork of art and craftsmanship would be a better commemoration. But would it actually reach people in this day and age? What exactly does a bell inspire in people? Why should someone care about an anthem for a religion's sovereign territory if they are not Catholic? I think thats a question people dont want to ask.
The main reason I dont have a problem with this is because it is a cute and wholesome design in a culture that screams out for it. That people on Twitter who are more concerned with policing minor differences of opinion than showing love are expressing hate towards this is more of a sign to me that people have been so deep in despair that they cannot see simple joy anymore in anything but the most grandiose and solemn displays.
Mark my words, Luce actually tapping into the small joys people want to have and see and her being a joyful example of a pilgrim will be more useful and in the end more effective than the vat majority of other similar displays we could have.
I can't imagine how a doll could be more inspiring. Honestly it may be attractive to non-Catholics consume but as a superficial figure it soon loses connection with faith, just like gospel music. In short, she is an entertainment figure.
@zuarbrincar769 I am seeing her inspiring joy and artists are looking at her design to see the influence. This one figurine is more than just an entertainment product, I am seeing it actively soften the hearts of the people and bring joy to their lives.
@@RedOblivion7 Thank you for saying at least figurine rather than doll. Dolls are generally stuffed and soft, and like most Tokidoki work, Luce at least appears to be fully plastic.
Its only a Jubilee Mascot, just chill.
We accepted influence of music, technology and internet in our liturgy unopposed. just look at the poistive.
Hope this is sarcasm. Modern music is not solemn enough for the Mass and should never be used in it. Also, the Church is supposed to be serious and solemn, a message definitively not passed by this childish art style
Ummm i must ask. Are you Catholic…?
@@igorlopes7589
Just because the Church wants to appeal to more young children, doesn’t make them any less serious.
@@Karma-ml4tt Childish art is not solemn and doesn't dispose people towards reverence, this goes without comment
@@Karma-ml4ttwhy does it have to be serious? you don't even know the impact of anime in pop culture
I don't need a mascot, The Cross of Our Lord is good enough.
The New World Church needs a mascot directed at children. Meanwhile the normies have zero critical thinking capacity to understand how this wicked tool will be used to attract children to the Ape Church.
I don't understand why there needs to be a mascot. Jesus is the one we look to in the church.
Luce is not the hero we wanted but the hero we deserve
They aren't mutually exclusive though
We can say the same to any other image in the church. Also, its a mascot for kids.
I see Luce as capable of fitting into that mission of the Church of bringing Christ to the world.
I can’t speak for what the Cardinal spoke about with pop culture, but this is simply a style of art that comes from the East, and as such is meant to reach out primarily to those in that area where roots of the Church are quite weak. It also so happens that many here in the West have appreciated the works from the East on fiction lately given the powerful and universal storytelling that has maintained there whilst our own myths become increasingly seeped in secular ideals, and as such this style is popular with many today.
I understand the reaction of not being impressed with this presentation, but I want to see what else happens during the jubilee year. I wouldn’t be surprised if we get more art and beauty on display.
I see a lot of potential with this character. She could be the Catholic equivalent to Hello Kitty. Put her on stickers and children's school supplies. Put out shorts on the Internet that depict her and her friends visiting pilgrimage sites as documentaries for children. Have them on signs pointing out obscure pilgrim sites in Rome and other locations. I think it has some real potential. My concern is that it will come up then be abandoned and just be another, "hey fellow kids" moment.
I think with how much people are loving her, she may not just poof away
Literally my whole group chat in Singapore loved this aha
A fascinating video. Thanks. I'm , as I've admitted, a Protestant pastor. And I found your joke at the beginning, demonstrates a generic downgrading of Culture, and Christianity. We're simplifying the faith !! We're all doing the same thing. Sigh.
Empezaron ustedes
I’m not against it. I would have had a more adult “mascot” along side it but I can’t wait to buy these dolls for all the kids in my life.
exactly, my little nieces would love this. my nieces ask about the faith sometimes, when they see stuff, and tell my older brother they should be getting into the faith. its one more thing i could get them to help them bring it up with their parents and get them into it. even if their parents never do.
Luce looks like a cartoon rather than an anime character. Though I would say that this is somewhere along the lines of pop Protestantism. Making, not good art and not good worship.
One thing I find mildly amusing is how many of Luce's cheerleaders aren't actual children but maladjusted Zoomer men who are treating it as an elaborate inside joke
Notice how on Twitter/X, it's all coming from the same guys who incessantly keep spamming "Pope Francis is the most based pope" and "Common Francis W"
In my italian catholic elementary school run by nuns Chiara "Luce" Badano was very much remembered, we watched documentaries on her... and now she's BACK AS AN ANIME MASCOT damn
Sorry about the audio. I didn't have time to test this setup, but I'll keep working on it for next time.
Sounded fine on my side. 👌🏻
It sounds like you have phasing which is usually due to having 2 mic sources. Ensuring only one mic is active should fix the issue.
Many Christians & Catholics are completely unaware of what a stang is. Luce is 100% holding one. It is a witches staff used in rituals.
@@BrianHoldsworthit sounds like in this video you are feeling in your heart that something is not quite right with this mascot, more so simply than it just being contemporary and modern compared to the works of complex and great art of the past. The artist, Simone Legno, commissioned by the Vatican for this piece draws x rated and lgbt content. Is this a great scandal? Perhaps you could cover this topic in another video.
your normal audio setup has always been great. Why the change?
It's hard to take outrage over something like this seriously when people have swallowed stuff like cherubim as chubby babies and God the Father as an old guy with a beard as trad. At least we're not going to start putting Luce in sacred spaces.
Well said
Yes, let’s go back to Fat Butt-naked Little Angels Flittering All About and Other Works of Art. 😂
Unbelievable how people are going to demonize this mascot thing and not recognize the beam in their own eyes.
You guys are more offended.
@@Alainmontpellier1000 yeah, let people enjoy cute things. cute isnt bad, and neither is it making people smile.
Really they're not going to put it in sacred spaces? What makes you say that? Of course they're going to. Why wouldn't they?
I think Luce is a exactly what needed to facilitate this conversation. It shows a lot of Matt Walsh type Catholics lacking any sense joy or childlike whimsicalness, you may not like anime or pop art and better appreciate the classical stuff fine, but the seething and frankly quite schizoid posting about how this is demonic is quite pathetic. So Catholics claiming how mature they are, I only do insert ("serious" TM thing, like black coffee and whisky) and hate insert (zoomer things, like video game/anime) types, need to take a chill pill.
As for Luce herself as a mascot, I think it's great and there is a place for this sort of art. The sculptures and paintings you mentioned are great too, their strength is their timelessness and depth, but consequently they are just as hard to digest if you aren't to well verse in the classical arts and the depths is lost on your. Luce here is pretty straight forward and simple, but if gets you think about deeper themes great. Plus now that we have the internet, I've see tons of fan art from both secular and Christian from this is mascot. There's merit to this that can't be easily achieved with previous forms of art (and it's not like you can't do both either). Having people come together and make more art from this is great, if it gets them to think about the deeper mystery when they make or look at the fan art, that's a lot better than them ignoring the deeper classical art altogether. If all form pop art is as vacuous as our serious Catholic like to claim, then people who like this sort art will seek out something more fulling. I do this all the time, I watch movie I like but I'm not satisfied I go read the books and then I read the things that inspired the books and so on.
AND it also uncovers those types if Catholics that aren't alert at all.
Deception is everywhere these days, if You hadn't known that. Accept little of pop-cult.
People in the "valley of the shadow of death" become religious BECAUSE of mental illnesses. The religious archetypes come forth from collective unconscious to not disintegrate the psyche.
"Don't mess with me, i have the power of anime and god on my side!"
- luce
It's specifically said to be for kids. What's the problem? Adults have nothing better to do I guess.
Vatican: Here's our cool little anime mascot for an upcoming trip to Japan.
Nobody:
Karen: Why it have blue hair. That's not Michelangelo. Look how far we fallen. Luce sounds like Lucifer. Pop culture bad. Anime gay. It's a witch
I agree with the "Karen".
Now, you might try to actually engage with the arguments I make in the video instead of resorting to lazy epithets like "Karen".
My issue is the artist who created it. Look it up.
For everyone has sinned people can change with following god
@echotapout183 They haven't changed. They're an active promoter of LGBTQ. Not to mention some evil products they've helped design I won't even type out.
True, but the same could be said about pretty much any piece of art in all of history.
Not that it doesn't matter, and I really hope they choose a better artist in the future, but it's not so big of a deal that the hate for a fictional little girl has been deserved.
Pop culture is more than just culture, it is also communication. "A picture is worth a thousand words," and this "mascot" is an attempt to prophesize to the masses more effectively.
In response to the reference of pandering to the masses, that is exactly what the early church did as it incorporated Easter Bunnies end eggs and the Christmas tree. These were regional cultural icons when the church expanded into these areas. Little Luce is really going "back to the basics" that brought success to the early Church. It is about being relevant to the population, to non-believers, to the godless. Lil' Luce isn't for those who are already Catholic, but for those yet to be.
We do not need mascots. We need true images of God: saints.
Both is good
Amen ❤
Both are good. In fact, I can even draw my favorite Catholic saints in the anime art style. If you think about it, our saints are also like mascots in certain Catholic organizations like in schools and charities.
Luce is designed after a saint
Not very obviously drawn after a saint
Pipo-kun, a cute fuzzy yellow mouse-like mascot with a small light dangling off a blue hat, is the mascot character for the Tokyo Metropolitan Police force... who are people you don't want to mess with. Pipo-kun was designed to give a softer image of the police and help make the the police seem more approachable.
Maybe someone looked at Pipo-kun and decided it would be easier to talk to people with Luce than with fire-and -brimstone, or the placard I saw recently, "THE WAGES OF SIN IS DEATH!" (which, although true, doesn't win friends..)
Nailed it Brian. 👍 Appealing to Pop Culture will not end well. The church is meant to uplift, to inspire. To be the one constant in an ever-changing world.
I don't think Anime in Japan is pop culture. Its been around for over 100 years now. It might be pop culture to the rest of the world but it is as ingrained in Japanese culture as quinceaneras are for the Mexicans.
The cute little character uplifts and inspires me. Now what?
@@Zilch129 I just think this character comes of as childish and trying too hard to appeal to another culture.
@@AmericanImperium2112 its cute, it makes me smile, and i can see how a cute little pilgrimage guide character to take with you, that makes you happy, could help you or your children through a tough part of your pilgrimage.
@@doctoreggman21 LOADS of the devil's stuff do that too.
But You as The Lord's one must choose the Church and its stuff to do that.
This sounds like one of those stories to rally about when there weren't many other stories to bring up that week.
While my first response to Luce was befuddlement, I think there might actually be a place for harmless pop cuteness in a time where many find true beauty threatening.
Cuteness, like beauty, is attractive; unlike beauty, it doesn't leave one feeling unable to measure up. Falling back on cuteness is certainly an improvement on the alternate strategy of dealing with modern alienation from beauty, namely, making things ugly and attracting no one.
Obviously, it would be ridiculous for the Church to switch entirely to cute anime art. But Luce's not a bad starting point to begin a conversation with someone who has no idea how to engage with real beauty.
Because nothing says "harmless pop cuteness" like a blue-haired, non-binary, anime-faced, stang-wielding mascot, designed by an artist affiliated with gay p@rn.
lol I find it hiralous to think the church would ever do a 180 like that
What a profound comment. I think there's a lot of truth to that. Thank you for this!
I'm a Christian (not Catholic tho) and an artist in my mid 20s and I don't get the hate for Luce in the western side of Christianity -- maybe because I'm from Southeast Asia so Anime here isn't a wild concept even for older people since they grew up with Voltes V and Astroboy.
It's a cute concept, not blasphemous nor mocking, and not exactly worldly or sexual. It's just an art style that is perhaps foreign to the west. Christianity in Japan is on the rise and in Japan it is very normal to have mascots even for government agencies and social advocacies, so I understand where the Vatican is coming from since they are also going to be participating in an Anime con from what I've read.
In fact, when I was a teenager, I fell in love with a Manga series adaptation of the Bible I had borrowed from a friend, and the attention to cultural and historical detail and accuracy to the Scriptures was insanely top notch, better than storybooks I had as a child that were imported from the West. The new testament volume of it is still one of my most prized possessions, and I can't wait to complete the whole series when I save enough money.
I don't know about ya'll old folks, but this is just throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
Specifically speaking to your understanding of the Western view, specifically for America, they see anime as just another version of cartoons. And cartoons to Americans historically have been targeted to children only.
So Americans tend to view those who like anime as being childish, people that need to grow up past childish cartoons. This is not strictly a religious view by the way, something I wanted to mention since this is a religious channel we're on, and many comments here echo this understanding that anime is childish.
I would also like to add that the art of anime is considered slop in the West. This is partly because when it was first introduced to America when got a lot of trash that was cheap to licence or material that was very scandalous for similar reasons. And, as a Christian I have to admit that some anime became a point of infection for bad ideas, especially in regards to human sexuality.
@@arashikagehayabusa2910 it IS a religious view tho
1 Corinthians 13:11 KJV
[11] When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
@@Hello-bi1pm and that also begs the question of what is considered childish and why?
Also, that view may well have come from religion, but it seems to be widely held by atheists as well. It's not exclusively a religious view that we have to put away everything that may be considered childish.
@@peterwallis4288 it could be that atheists just internalized it anyway, culturally, forgetting the origin
St. Most Holy Teletubby
Absurditas.
Lord have mercy. Everyone have a different path to unite with Christ. But if you think that Catholic church once again moving away from apostolic tradition, just know that you are always welcome home in the Orthodox Church.
Idk man, catholicism expressing itself through different artforms doesnt take away from the solemn ways of artistic expression, as long as the other "mundaner" expressions dont take overhand.
My biggest beef is that Luce at worst looks like it was AI generated and at best is another slackjawed wide-appeal nothing-burger that like everything else in Neo-Catholicism was made by a tasteless and senseless committee.
The fact it came with a handy chart to explain the the visual elements is proof in the pudding because I and a lot of other people were like "what's with the raincoat and weird half cross walking stick he's holding?".
The Olympic Committee somehow has better mascots circa Beijing 2008 and Vancouver 2010.
A picture is worth a thousand words. When symbolic art needs a written explanation it fails as symbolic art. It’s just a creepy doll.
Well, that's just like, your opinion bro.
Most poeople love the design.
Oh yeah, if you explain symbolisim to people who might not instantly get it proves its bad because people usually toootaly get every single sybolic element in an image. 😂
What worse is that the creator of the mascot is involved with art that's contrary to the Church's teachings.
@@Lee-zt9vl This is an odd statement... what's the point of art history classes if not to explain the symbolism for the uninitiated?
@ I assume the point of art history classes is to talk about the history of art.
Anime is used by some to represent gender. Some may be ASD and find comfort in using it as a representation. I understand that. What I find interesting is the Vatican chooses this as a mascot in context of their other writings and publications. I wonder if this mascot was suggested by lobby group representatives who attended the synod. Just like their Marxist based ideas that sound so wonderful but are laden with a dark and violent history. This mascot design was a carefully thought out choice after the Synod. As someone who has worked with many youth and used to be in full support of the L movement, I quickly watched it transform over the years into the dangerous disaster it is today and perpetuated the harm it has done to youth. It began with increments of changes that seemed positive and loving and ended up being a Trojan horse for a billion dollar industry and a medical horror show. I’m as left as it gets. I’ve nothing against marginalized T. I’ve worked and cared for many. But this has gone off the rails. “When Sons Become Daughters, Part V: The Links Between Trans Identity, Gifted Minds, Categorical Thinking-And Anime”
Japaneese people?
A witch's stang is a wooden staff with a forked top that is used in witchcraft rituals. The stang can be used for a variety of purposes, including:
Representing the Horned God: In some traditions, the stang symbolizes the Horned God.
Directing energy: The stang can be used to direct energy.
Spirit journeying: The stang can help with spirit journeying.
Opening the third eye: Some believe that using a stang can open the third eye, which allows the user to see the past, present, and future.
Witches Stang.
The stang is often topped with a naturally occurring fork or antlers. The bottom of the stang is shod with an iron shoe to protect it and ground it.
Robert Cochrane is thought to have popularized the term "stang" through his use of the ritual item.
Thank you for bringing up the bizarre correlation between anime and chronically online people in the right-wing sphere. I don't understand how that got started or why- ironically, they are often the most rabidly "protect masculinity" types out there.
Video games and p*rn is my guess.
You seem to be hinting that Luce will not be making an appearance upon the books behind you during the Jubilee year?!
Maybe she should. Lol.
Buddy, the church have alot mascots for events or celebration days. Luce is only the newest. As far children mascot goes, she is pretty well made.
Man you are pushing it
You're wrong on this, Luce is awesome. It's like a new "Pepe the Frog", it's a Catholic character that people can use to represent a faithful Catholic in their memes. It's an avenue for Catholicism to enter meme culture in a way that is way more accessible than before.
@@piface3016 memes on pilgrimage. Deus vult.
When I initially saw it, and especially in the days that followed, I couldn't help but think that surely, someone involved in the design process KNEW that the character would create these kinds of reactions, and KNEW it would meme itself into "algorithmic relevancy".
This is stupid. The people stanning it and the people hating on it. It's just not important. There is absolutely not a single thing the Church can now do without people having toddler level temper tantrums online. It's stupid. Responding to it is stupid. Giving any of these people the time of day is stupid. The only thing this mascot warrants is a "huh, okay" and move on. Both sides of this just look like that one painting of the heckler teasing the dogs.
Well..this is your opinion. Other people have their opinions. The fact you are commenting here shows your reaction was not just "huh, and move on"
"He who breaks a thing to discover what it is has left the path of wisdom."
J. R. R. Tolkien
Luce is an opportunity to open a dialogue with another culture. I welcome Luce to the Church.
Measured, thoughtful, considered, and substantial opinion. Keep up the amazing work! This style will definitely stand the test of time! Great take!
First Ruptnick's ugly art and now this doll. Yeah, its cute but it sure isn't an inspiration. Its laughable. Vatican doesn't want to be taken seriously that's for sure.
Mic quality is off on this episode. Not sure if this was an editing mistake
“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will recognize them by their fruits” (Matthew 7:15-20).
Every age had an art style to express the faith. Trying to ignore it and keep sacred art in 1500's humanism won't do it either. 100 years from now they'll say Luce is exactly what you'd expect from this generation of Catholics. Like it or not art reflects culture, denying it, hiding from it, helps no one. My hope is young people will use this art form to speak to truths about the faith. No one will see it coming. Alice Cooper's music has hidden Christian messages, anime should do the same. Just look at the Basilica of La Sagrada Familia, imagine if the architect was stifled by traditional ideas of what a cathedral should look like. I pray we have a new explosion of creatives doing big things for the faith. No more ugly art, no more post modern nihilism, no more narcissism, but a simple aim to meet the faithful where they are at and bring them closer to Christ.
The Luce thing is an idol and the positive comments show it is an attempt to replace sober Christ with a new fun religion.
What is an idol?
Isn't an idol something to be worshipped? Do you honestly think Luce is intended to be worshipped? Luce is not a god.
People who don’t see anything wrong with this mascot (at least the childishness of it) only prove how the average person has been brainwashed by pop culture and lacks the acquired taste to discern good art from bad.
Let me stop you there buddy did you ever in your life picked a pen to draw and do you know you're opinion is just a preference?
@@Uwhwvwgwh Beauty is not subjective. If you want to better understand this stance you should watch "Why beauty matters" documentary by Roger Scruton. Maybe you find it interesting.
@@rvatina thank you I am going to read it but just to make it clear I don't agree with the concept it's arrogant and biased the only thing subjective about art is the effort that was put into making it .
@@Uwhwvwgwh i understand your point of view. it's okay to disagree, not trying to proselytize. i'm just suggesting something that will explain my position much better than i ever could.
@@rvatina I respect you ,to be fair it doesn't mean much from random person in the Internet but you're great .
Luce is a great way for evangelization with young people today.
OMGosh, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. The enemy within.
I don't think there's enough attention given here to how overwhelmingly influential anime is in the younger generations. Young people respond to it pretty well. And as a younger person, there's a goofy and whimsical aspect to Luce, but there's a clear message: Catholicism isn't a thing of the past. It's a thing of the now, and can exist in any medium that isn't inherently sinful. If we can plunder the egyptians, we can surely plunder the Japanese too 😂
I view Luce as an example of many of the bishops having no good idea on how to attract people to the Catholic Church and they just throw stuff at the the wall to see what sticks - and every idea they come up with is just ugh.
i spent money on cute military garb anime girls for my gun on call of duty, undoubtedly will spend money on this as it relates to the faith. is it really SO BAD they made a cute pilgrim mascot to debut in a culturally relevant place, thats gonna have mass appeal? the Japanese anime subculture is popular worldwide and could draw people to ask questions about the faith. japan could use the faith, especially for their sexual teachings atm, their birthrate is horrid.
Yes, part of the episcopacy is rotten
As an Catholic artist, maybe I should make a fanart of Luce soon....
pls
I have no love of this mascot, partially because sometimes anime sexualizes minors and this mascot reminds me of that, and I love the chibi style in both manga/anime and things like the Precious Moments series, the latter of which often depicts religious figures and events. At this point I just don't trust the Vatican to have good intentions with these things.
However, I disagree with you about Michael Angelo's piece. He was a very talented artist, a true master of his craft, but these nude figures have no place in the church. The church was wrong to embrace the Renaissance the way it did, that was the beginning of the end, and many priests, trad and novus alike, agree with me on this. At best this piece demonstrates the church's embrace of humanism, since it depicts Christ as a mere mortal whereas medieval art depicted Him as Divine and extra dimensional. At worst it sexualizes Our Lord. To me, this piece marks a sad trend of decadence in the Catholic Church and I believe it should be taken down and replaced with a more dignified depiction which follows medieval conventions that were invented explicatly by the church for church art.
I know I defended the chibi style in paragraph 1, but I believe the time and place for it is absolutely not on the walls of a church, but in a children's Bible, missal or prayer book, in a children's Bible-based or lives of saints-based cartoon, and in a children's nativity set.
I’ve learnt, little by little to obey and accept the church.
Over 2000 years, the church its always been right, maybe this is wrong, but for the most part it has been.
I will not criticize, but pray for the pope and the church.
God bless.
This is not timeless art. I own many, many manga and anime series and books. This is not what I want to represent Catholicism.
The young converts I know want authentic, historical Christianity. They want ancient hymns and chant, not pop music or Haugen/Haas or OCP. We want reverence and to be Holy, set apart, for Christ. We want Mass to look like heaven. We do not want Mass to look like the world or Protestantism.
Do better Vatican. Do better.
It's a mascot for an event in Japan next year. This is meant to only gain publicity for the event. The Vatican will be bringing an original Caravaggio painting to Japan as well. These people know what they're doing
We can have both.
This has nothing to do with the mass, its just a mascot and its cute.
Chill.
I cannot conceive of a single situation in which anyone is going to be brought closer to Christ because of some cringe "hello fellow youths" chibi anime mascot. So bad and so out of touch.
Total Luce Love! Imagine having beef with an adorable mascot. :P
Paul Spotted!
@@ExodiaSC hey my nigga what you doing here
Imagine not be disturbed by the Vatican hiring a guy who creates devil inspired art work for vibrators creating children charters for Catholics.........are we really that pathetic?
isnt that a dogwhistle
@@AiwaSchawa YOU KNOW MY OOMFIE EXODIASC??? :OO
I see it as a positive. The more positive light Catholicism gets, the more inclined people will be to join. It doesn’t violate any doctrines and it not irreverent. It’s not like people are making any Luce icons or anything.
As a young person who occasionally enjoys some anime. This is incredibly unattractive to me and even more so my secular peers. The only people I see really liking this are terminally online Twitter catholics who are obsessed with anime girls
Yup. Pretty fair analysis.
Says the guy that has left 7 comments on one video.
@@divebombexpert2619 yup I read the comments in the first 5 or so minutes this was posted because I'm home. The horror
@@sengan2475 So it's fine when you do it but a problem when others do it.
@@divebombexpert2619 commenting for 5 minutes on a brian Holdsworth video is the same as obsessing over anime girls on twitter. so true! what are you even arguing for?
I'm Gen Z. This is cringe, like priests rapping.
You are Gen Z and so what?
Italians didn't need to make a little anime girl figurine. They have the real one, her name is Georgia Meloni.
lol. Manufactured by WEF
According to an Italian catholic news article the author of the mascot has had some different customers previously which aren't exactly aligned with Church teaching: pride and the porn industry specifically.
So I would say that it's not just about what the Church decides to do with popular culture, it's also who they involve in doing it.
It speaks volumes about how misguided this kind of decision is.
I agree with you Brian, despite there being a loud majority in the comment section. I don't see how Catholics who are aware of the current state of the Church look at something like this and at the very least scratch their head and say "that's the best we could do?!" If this isn't trying to reach out to the world by using the mechanisms of the world, than I don't know what is. This is on par with changing liturgical music to match 70's music to be "hip." The Church has a responsibility to use the arts to elevate the thoughts of sinners to heavenly things, not to employ cheap signification. This "mascot" has no transcendence, permanence, and evangelizes poorly. It looks silly now and will continue to grow in silliness as time progresses.
I say all of this as a Catholic artist and woodcarver trying to find places where my labor can be put to help make sanctuaries beautiful again. There is a abdication by much of the church to make "good" art.
A few things I’d like to chime in here.
First, I’m a bit late to the conversation, but your view on this is spot on. Calling for deeper discussion about it is very much needed. And synodal as well.
Second, this earnest desire for being relevant is what I see in many settings involving the youth and general public at large: this kind of “cultural” approach is counterproductive precisely because instead of drawing from our deep treasures, it speaks of truths as if they were nothing important enough to challenge pop expectations.
And, finally, while your reflection is great as usual, this time your audio is not as clear as we are accustomed.
We stan Luce in this household
Based and Lucepilled.
When the pope commissioned the Cappella Sistina to Michelangelo, he wanted the most modern and pop artist of that time. Church always did the same.
This is simply not true because industrialized pop culture did not exist in that era. Do not conflate "new" with modern.
To be honest, I never heard of the mascot before clicking on this video. I was fully expecting to hate it, but I actually kind of like it😅 i love that it's wearing a rosary.
I agree with Brian that the Church needs to embrace what sets it apart from the world (beauty, tradition, sacrifice) rather than try to conform itself to current trends, but really the mascot is not so bad!
For the segment of Catholics who enjoy anime and Japanese culture, they will cherish it. It sort of reminds me of Matt Fradd's Catholic lofi videos, which are much beloved.
I like Luce, and I'm not afraid to say it 😂
The problem is these old bishops in the Vatican have no clue what they are dealing with since they know 0% of the internet. They're probably be able to give some of the best homilies you might ever hear but definitely not anything pop-culture. Anime is notorious for many practices and fantasies that are considered heretical in Christianity. This could become problematic in the future when these old bishops and cardinals die and the newer yet less traditionally Catholic generation takes over. I believe Luce could be one of the many salt flakes being dropped into the wound of the Catholic Church as it continues to accept things that has been seen as problematic throughout its history. The world really needs to tackle the issue of Anime culture taking over everything.
I myself am Gen Z and it upsetting to see what direction the Church is going.
Boomers being Boomers
This comment made me nearly vomit. What are you a bernie voter?
@@Mal0Imperzia Oh my God, you almost threw up at your own comment? There is still time you to delete
Because it can not possibly be a simple staff.
I don't think there is anything wrong with the mascot, it cute and adorable, the problem is the generational gap and the identity most people associate with pop culture, if we were to attribute let's say why most people fancy themselves heroes, in D&D style, games its because they have belief and faith in the Greeko Roman Christian virtues that, and that is nothing wrong, the problem is people make fun of it, thinking its lame, for example, I used to help old people cross the street and lift there bags, hell an old lady gave 5$ for that,
Materialism is not the problem its the lack of humanity in it, that we associate with the physical world,
The neme "Luce" remembers me a name of an angel that is against God. 😭😖 Let's pray for the church
Imagine being a "Trad" and questioning the church.
Many forget the church is not a democracy. The Pope is basically a King, and hence he doesn't need anyone's opinion in the matter.
God is in control, wether you like it or not, and He will reach the youth however He sees fit. Just like Guadalupe had symbols that natives understood.
I have no interest or idea about what anime is and how does that then appeal to all Catholics.... why not Sponge Bob ?
Because it's for the Japan Expo
Anime is Japanese animation. Like Naruto, Dragon Ball and etc. In America there's some adult cartoon which are like anime but isn't truly anime but anime-like.