What Stormgate does better than StarCraft 2
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- Опубліковано 28 тра 2024
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Timecodes:
00:00 Things that all RTS struggle with
00:59 Mechanics
02:31 Time-to-kill & Battle duration
03:20 Maps and landscape
#sc2
#stormgate
#starcraft2
#esports - Ігри
Check out Our new Project FGC Storyteller - www.youtube.com/@fgcstoryteller
& My personal SC2 Channel - www.youtube.com/@Gaming_Essays
Timecodes:
00:00 Things that all RTS struggle with
00:59 Mechanics
02:31 Time-to-kill & Battle duration
03:20 Maps and landscape
What I"m hearing is that, partly, with tabs and whatnot, they've returned to the Command and Conquer style base/unit production: On giant tab for buildings (with hotkey) and one giant tab for units (with hotkeys).
Not doing a 'new' thing but an older alternative, that still works.
Why the hell we have a hotkey for all warpgates but no hotkey for all barracks in sc2? Is it some kind of balance feature?)
No clue tbh. The difference isnt huge though, its just one less control group for you to use
No clue tbh. The difference isnt huge though, its just one less control group for you to use
I would guess it's because the units come out directly out of barracks, meaning that if you have barracks in 2 different corners of the map, it's likely very important where the marine will pop out. Whereas with Warp Gates, it doesn't matter so much; the unit will appear where you choose anyway.
it is, you can't warp all marines into the opposite side with a medivac
the droppods with marines in them of the campaign would be absolutely broken in balance
Protoss needs the extra macro help they are slow
Hey i am WC3 and little bit of AOE and CnC enjoyer since back in the old days played as kid, i like the effort of new RTS game, I am just used to highly visible healthbars and not that big of a army to manage and also having a HERO with items and lvling up that is what is missing for me.
reason 1: protoss doesn't exist in this game, reason 2: protoss doesn't exist in this game, reason 3: protoss doesn't exist in this game
So that´s why nobody talks to you in real life then.
As much I wan to like storm gate. I really don't like the style and texture of it. It's like Sc2 back in alpha. Looks so rubber. Even wc3 looks better than this.
I mean looking at gta 5 before release for example I’d say the graphics make sense at this stage of development.
@@mrnoblemonkey8401 Heard the "but its beta" excuse like 100 times and 99 out of that 100-game ended up releasing exactly as it was on beta. Better to criticize graphics now at least there is slight chance that devs take notice.
Remeber star crafts pre release gameplay graphics
Not to mention that Starcraft and Warcraft both have great lore behind their games
Good thing that the devs recently addressed this by saying the "art style" is nowhere near complete. Because they want to design maps and get balance right first, before they finalize the maps and have to make changes due to balance.
When's it come out?
Playing sc2, I could get to diamond with good macro, but my micro was always what let me down. I just could never get past switching micro managing different units, no matter how hard I practiced
Thanks for the video!
Stormgate feels good to play, but boring to watch.
Starcraft 2 feels good to watch, but annoying to play.
That's my takeaways from both games. The faster paced nature of SC2 makes high level games extremely fun to watch, especially in TvZ where you could see actions happening constantly across multiple points in the map. In Stormgate it's not unusual for fights to last for a while before you can even tell who's having the advantage, and because we don't have game winning units that can singlehandedly win a fight like Corruptors or Banelings, but that also means you don't feel as much tension during the fight. Marine spltting a Corruptor shot or sniping Banelings before they hit is intense to watch, while a huge hit that wipes out a bunch of units is usually a pretty hyped up moment
Stormgate co op will be way better with way more heroes units ... maps ... and mission variants than SC2's terrible co op.
You know the saying, no pain not gain.
On the length of battles, does anyone feel that Stormgate is somewhere between WC3 and SC2?
I remember meeting a guy called basset on the stormgate ladder
was that you?
Yes
@@EsportsStoryteller nice :D
Good video.
Haha when Starcraft came out I thought it was extremely easy to control and user friendly...........because I was used to Warcraft 2.
I agree on the unit production part, its really an innovative way to pull in new players who arent used to RTS. I think its very smooth with Stormgate, that all units are under 1 tab and the more structures you build that create units, are all automaticly assigned into that unit tab. The first time i played it, i noticed it and i was blown away with it. But i also think the game is very smooth and yes, its a bit slower then SC 2 but not very much i would argue and i think its right in the sweetspot between Warcraft 3 and SC 2 in terms of game speed. I also agree that the new additions they added to maps, certainly allows more room for counterplay and surprise attacks. I am honestly really amazed what they have done the past year with Stormgate, the game is in a really good state and sure their are a lot of things to be improved. But so far i find it a very promising game.
@2:10 aka c&c3 style macro
is that you, Basset?
Yep
Can't trust anything you say after saying that turtling is a problem in SC2 but not in SG when 90% of late game is just deathball vs deathball
for now sc2 is a lot better, a lot more fun to play and watch.
a lot more action and very different action.
Sg for now is not better, not even close.
I feel like they played it too safe and i don't find anything new or exciting that makes me want to try it.
C&C4 "one step in the wrong direction"
That step was throwing away the whole game and making some completely unrecognisable rubbish, so it was a pretty big step
My personal thoughts on the game are very similar to yours. Stormgate had nailed it as to how the game feels and plays out, to me üt feels like the gsme just needs to be fleshed out.
RTSs need to get their shit straight
for some reason some ppl think micro (stutterstepping/kiting) is cool because its so mechanically demanding and their mothers and sisters cant do it
but usually ppl who play strategy games want to play them (u guessed it) by addressing them strategically (or at least tactically), the micro/reaction speed part should be of little importance
i would argue that macro should be reduce so you can have more time controlling your army, insteaad of reducing micro for macro
@@TheChosenOne462well u r not wrong in the sense that "busy work" is a bit potato
starcraft etc intentionally make busy work tedious/unautomatized so that the player has to cut corners on the micro scale to not fall behind of the macro scale (sometimes)
what u want is probably still to make the decisions on a macro scale, but not have them so annoying/tedious to do
decision making is what makes for a good strategy game, and not if someone is capcable of athletically do what they think is optimal (micro) or be bothered by uninspired micro work (like managing worker or queuing up more troops)
agree
@@TheChosenOne462I mean sure if you want to make a MOBA
i think you dont even understand the fact there are subgenres within every genre. take an rts like BAR for example where micro is completly nonexistent because its pure big army battle fiesta and compare it to lets say wc3. they are BOTH rts games, but they target a complete different audience with an completly different game design. you cant.
''the micro/reaction speed part should be of little importance'' i am not sure you even played an rts in your life besides that.
you know.. you have that... its called SINGLE PLAYER GAME.
I don't see myself playing Stormgate... as you said in the LATE GAME in SC2 sometimes the players don't want to risk their armies, making it a stale game, but in Stormgate the damage is not huge in a second so the battles develop better, making it a slower game from the start, which could lead to people getting bored as well.
I hope the game has an incredible good and memorable campaign, I barely remembered SC1 when played SC2 but the first thing I did was the Campaign and the story hooked me and made me love the Starcarft World, which later translated in me playing ladder for years.
Also there is an incredibly interesting video about RTS, I don't know if you watched it but you should ua-cam.com/video/XehNK7UpZsc/v-deo.html
Actually, my experience with stormgate was that it felt *more* engaging and less boring than sc2, as even if your opponent is camping you got stuff to do on the map.
I don't see how this game will be successful with only 2 playable race .
I agree that Stormgate did a great job with hotkeys, especially in using grid style hotkeys while still keeping attack move on A. Great summary, definitely looking forward to more from Stormgate!
StarCraft 1 and 2 always stood out in the RTS landscape for one thing above all others: extremely conservative design.
StormGate is looking a lot like an SC3 would have. Sadly it doesn't look like it's going to do much to solve the issue of the game being too hard for most people to control. SC turned being hard to control into a virtue, but that isn't going to cut it in the current gaming landscape any more.
They have plans to make campaign/coop easier & more enjoyable for newer & frankly, shit players.
They have plans to make campaign/coop easier & more enjoyable for newer & frankly, shit players.
I cant see the game qualities while the units design still so bad.
my opinion ? doa rip
Stormgate is amazing so far BUT the only rts i think has the potential to overcome sc2 by far is zero space. Game is in alpha 2 and is S I C K ! Unit pathing unit variety strategic depth animations combat system.
Starcraft is the best 👌 👍 😍 🥰 ☺️ 💖 and the boys are very excited about it 😀 😄 😊 🙌 ❤️ 😁 😀 😄 😊
nice content, but feels to me this is more of the perspective of a casual player and not a esports player.
Saying that maps dont really matter that much in sc2 can only come from someone who has not played at a higher level as it is so crucial of every part of the game.
That may be, but 99% of players are casual.
@@marcbecker1431 true, was just surprised by this pov because of the Channel Name 😄
I've been a GM zerg on EU since 2016. It's not that they don't matter, the impact is just less in comparison with Stormgate and some other RTS games. I might be wrong, but I think casual players don't feel the map significance in SC2 as much as they would in Stormgate. My highest peak in SC2 was around 6400 mmr, in SG I was TOP 100 during open beta, and while I could comfortably play the same BOs in SC2 on almost every map, it was a pain (and fun) to adjust to each map in SG. Again, that's just my perspective
Im excited about stormgate and really feel they can iron out the downsides of the game
oh ya?
@@mickeyromeo yeah
I forced myself to play 10 games and gave up. it's such a miserable game, really overhyped. Extremely boring units, and what a cluster of balls, the time to kill really makes it even worse and highlighting just how much of a slog the engagements are.
So far I have to agree, I hate the style of everything, maps, building and units, with few exceptions. The game itself is boring and doesn't even remotely come close to SC2. I hope I'll be proven wrong, but I don't have high hopes, also it seems to me that devs aren't particularly listening to the feedback
StormGate indeed made a lot of cool features, but for me this game is boring. It's OK to play, but so boring to watch. Also the artstyle is awful, for me it looks like a mobile game. Well, I had a lot of expectations, I wanted SG to be SC2 successor, unfortunately it doesn't look like it. I came back play SC2, because I think it's still going to be the biggest RTS in the world in terms of player base and esports.
Anyway, I wish good luck to SG.
I still in late alpha/early beta stage. So we'll see if things change.
the huge campaign and massive lore universe they have planned is way better!
Some real losers in the comments. Ironically, they are proving the exact premise of this video. There are some real, actual losers in RTS and other genres that aren't even actually good, just tunnel-visioned and pretentious.
I agree , how much of a pathetic mess must your life be to accept trash like SG as acceptable. No respect for themselves
Nothing special, other than being a nice Live Streaming game propaganda.
They're using A.I.
Age 2 is the best RTS ever created. Except the graphics.
Stormgate is dogshit and will NEVER take off xD it looks sooooo bad. You can't really compare it with a masterpiece such as SC2
Unfortunately correct. Stormgate doesn’t do a single thing better than SC2 and it’s nearly 2 decades later.
People say “just give them time, SC2 had years and years of refinement”
The issue is they didn’t learn from any of that refinement and are starting from the beginning.
If this game were to survive development, which it won’t because they are out of money and the game currently sucks, within 2 years, they would be forced to speed everything up from TTK to movement to pacing.
A lesson that was learned in SC2.
This is probably the best advertisement for stormgate i have seen. I must say i was a bit put off it, but nice to know what's actually better rather than just look and see weird uncanny valley sc2 unit ripoffs.
Answer: Nothing and sc2 is a very old game. What a shame.
if all these macro advantages make you happy then you are a noob...this game friendly mechanics make the game so much easier and noob friendly...hate every word you said in this video.
I've been a GM zerg since 2016... Those things are not so much for top level players but for more casual players who need easier access for a large audience to jump on it and make it successful. It's a big problem for RTS genre that needs to be tackled, otherwise it'll be difficult to attract and maintain new players
The reality is content creators like this are looking for an “in” with FGS.
They aren’t going to get that “in” by being honest about the game. By the time the game fails due to bad ideas and no one being honest, being “in” with FGS will mean nothing lol.
@@bartonfile6569 We'll have a big review when the game comes out. This video just highlights some of the cool esports features in Stormgate. It doesn't mean the game has no drawbacks
Guys why do you have to be hating so much, as the guy said this is for new players to get into rts, the genre won’t survive with its current player base, because it has fallen behind from other genres such as fps. As a medium skill player I appreciate this addition, I have played sc2 for like 5myears and I’m decent, but this still helps, I don’t see the big issue and just using the blanket statement of everything you said in this vid was bad is not a constructive argument
if sc2 is the best game that has ever been created for you...maybe I wont listen the rest of the video