saying a hardflip is the same as a hardflip back180 is like saying kickflip and backsideflip is the same thing.. "Hey bro you cannot BS flip this gap on your videopart, it's ABD, this other dude already kickfliped it." Dave Bachinsky kickflip El toro, but noone Backside flipped it ever (looking at you Scheckler). It's mental, just because they both to a kickflip rotation they are 2 very different tricks. Also lateflips are partially hated bc most people can only do them on flat, cannot do gaps or flip in or out of grinds/slides. I don't think anyone hates PRod's nollie lateflip crooked grinds. Same thing AG did this over a big ass hubba, it is not the same as doing a "clown flip" on flat.
Facts! Nyjah is a beast but that doesnt mean that Aurelien shouldnt have scored more on those tricks. Hardflip late flip? come on thats an insane trick to do over a hubba/gap on competition.
You pop and flick the exact same for all the hardflip variations though, while kickflip and BS flip feel very different from the pop and flick all the way to the catch. I agree that it should be scored higher though
No one is saying a hardflip is the SAME as a hardflip 180. It's just a variation of the base trick: Hardflip. The whole point was Aurelien did a hardflip and 2 variations of it, so because of thatit underscored.
@@javieracarrilloavendano4846 If you're talking about variations then Nyjah did multiple nosegrind variations including his 2nd and 3rd best trick makes. Those obviously should have been docked. The last one was supposed to be a crook, but IMO it was an accidental nosegrind. They weren't though because it's a nonsense rule if you count variations. Every trick in skateboarding is arguable a variation on like 10 basic tricks. Hell, a nosegrind is a variation on a 50-50 as far as I'm concerned so it's a repetition of something he did even more times because 50-50, 5-0, nosegrind are all variations of the same trick if you're going to start arguing over varations.
I agree that nyjah did amazing in this comp and i'd even say he deserved the win, but that being said aurelien's banger was grossly underscored even if it was just another hardflip variation because that was probably one of the heaviest trick ever done in competitive skateboarding.
Exactly my opinion. I think a 93-95 would have been fair and would have put him in front of Nyjah, but then Nyjah would have overtaken him with the last trick anyway. TBH the last trick was a bit overscored IMO and I think who should have won is debatable, but the hardflip late flip was just clearly underscored. The judging rulebook is dumb in general to me though. People can't clean up sketchy makes which is why Mauro did crook nollie flip out after his sketchy nollie crook nollie flip out. He couldn't clean up the nollie crook nollie flip which is just dumb IMO.
@@dngrouscrgo Nyjah's fakie flip nosegrind was his fourth fakie flip variation though which is technically just a kickflip riding backwards so his 10th kickflip variation. This variation logic is strange. Variation means different thus not repetitive.
@@CleverTricksGames fax this is just well worded bullshit that hard flip late flip is beyond hard... And to get it 1st try.... and your exactly right bruhh a variation is a similar trick...not the same so what is a fs flip the same trick as a fuckin kickflip now...what a load of shit. All the judges just got a nyjah hard on that's all and these scores are just them stroking there nyjah hard on's 😂
it’s cool as long as the people knew they were getting a board thrown at them. I saw a vid of Lil Uzi Vert tossing a phone into a crowd and it cracked someone’s skull it was bad
ya not sure why DD didn't like the play, that wasn't a dick move, it was a really cool gesture of thanks to the fans for supporting a great performance.
both extremely talented athletes. but here you see the clear cut difference between someone who spent their entire childhood competing at the highest level versus someone who did not. aurelien has nyjah covered in athleticism, but its hard to stay on the level someone who was borderline forced into giving up half their childhood to be better than everyone else
@@zkipa Excuses moi mais la différence n'est pas si nette que tu veux bien le faire penser. Et c'est justement parce qu'il est le patron de la SLS depuis longtemps que Nyjah est toujours surnoté ou plutôt les autres sont sous noté. Et tu connais quoi de l'enfance d'Aurelien? il a dû remplacer son père décédé par le skateboard alors lui aussi a consacré son enfance à cette discipline. Nyjah est très fort c'est vrai et la plupart du temps il a mérité ses victoires mais là quand on le voit en discussion avec Ribeiro ( qui s'est fait volé aussi) ça se voit qu'il est gêné parce qu'il sait très bien que Aurelien a été meilleur sur cette compétition. Mais c'est pas grave maintenant il a la confiance ça ne va pas tarder qu'il devienne numéro un
@@Graigy69 Nyjah deserved this win because he played it by the book. Of course that hardflip lateflip was insane, but no way he could score higher points with so many hardflip variations over the same gap. It's simply too repetitive and the rule book is very clear about that. Aurelien should learn to play the game.
Nyjah is always working on new tricks and not replying on what he’s got on lock. You gotta respect that. But I think think the hardflip lateflip was underscored.
@@huguesquemlaude7087 We really haven't, he's only used it since last year iirc. Dude changes his bangers more than any pro in top contests and that's a big reason why he wins so much. He has a huge bag of bangers and gives the judges variety.
Nyjah plays the game better than anyone else from a competitive standpoint (anyone that has watched Nyjah compete knows this by now). I respect his hustle and determination. He also has an insane bag of tricks. If Aurelien want's to win against him, he needs to play the same game. He definitely has the skills and the style to win. I think a lot of people really wanted Aurelien to win, so there was baked in bias, which contributed to the outcry imo.
The variation logic doesn't check out though. On Nyjah's cab nose blunt he had already done 2 other cab variations. On the fakie flip nose grind he had already done 3 other fakie flip variations. The point is variations make them different tricks. You wouldn't score a backside flip lower because a skater did a kickflip earlier on. That hardflip late-flip deserved higher ( I can see argument for style but the difficulty is too far off the charts) but that tre flip accidental blunt deserved less so it kind of evens out.
I don't think it's the same, all of those cabs tricks were so different, and two of them weren't really major tricks. Aurelien kept hardflipping over the same obstacle.
100% look at the crowd they know who won. At first I thought maybe it was the technical rules that gave the wrong outcome. Then I realized it was not the rules, but the application of the rules. It is the "Nyjah Bump" we have all seen it before, and we will see it again. Happens in every sport.
When doing a cab nose blunt, the cab isn’t the main trick. The noseblunt is. The cab is just a way to get into that noseblunt. So even though he already did a couple cabs, they don’t apply to the cab noseblunt. Every one of aurelians hardflips was just that, a hardflip. Nyjah didn’t do a a noseblunt variation of a cab, he did a cab variation of a noseblunt. Every one of aurelians hardflips was a hardflip variation
I don’t mind Nyjah winning whatsoever, but the score for that hardflip late flip is straight bullshit, especially when that score determined the winner. I’ve never thought the judges are biased but this has me scratching my head. It’s a little sus, to say the least.
It wasn't gonna determine the winner Nyjah and some more skaters still had their trick to set...which means they could bump him out anyways. What it sortof meant was Nyjah last trick was a victory lap... because his wasn't enough, I agree with the score...I don't think he deserved the W, but 2nd was perfect. Arulian would have been better off lacing a switch hardflip over that same gap than doing the regular hardflip late flip NBD. These dudes need to learn going switch pays off. This isn't park or vert.
Agree with everything except it determining the winner. With the switch heel crook I think nyjah won. But there really should have been a lot of added pressure with it being a do or die
Agree with your assessment, though I do think the HfLf was low-balled a little despite the repetition. But Nyjah's trick bag is deep, diverse and he so often lands clean af. I also agree with other comments (which have been common for ages) that long, tech slide/grind tricks or unique tricks on other obstacles, that creatively use the course, should be scored higher in best trick too, rather than basically forcing people to stay on the one obstacle if they're interested in winning. Occasionally this happens, like Joslin's massive ollie to fakie in the 2016 SLS super crown, but mostly it's like stay on the big rail/hubba or take that 8(0) baby.
Well I said first also it's cause of the variety. But hard to say, cause where Aurelien did hardflips, Nyjah did kickflips and fakie flips. So If Aurelien would've lead on the hardflip late flip, Nyjah would had have much more pressure on the sw heel crooks. So like that it could had gone either way.
I would bet that nyjah already has a stats guy working for him. If comp skating keeps growing, it's a matter of time before they become a necessity for the best comp skaters.
@@thehoror01 Yeah, the day these stuff had insane large prize money, skaters had to COMPETE. It's not your normal skate part anymore. It's way beyond that today. In esports competitions, they have stats guy, they even have some mental conditioning done to players. I mean in martial arts like boxing and mma, they study their opponent and look for his weakness, that's how it is when things get serious, you have to be technical. It may look dirty to amateurs but that's how it goes to get the medal and prize money. But if the community of skaters doesn't want that, then they have to campaign to stop competitions like this and remove skateboarding from the Olympics.
Isn't it just as much repetition to do every trick to a same ledge in individual trick section? In run section it seems to be important to use the park as versatile as possible. Didn't seem to affect the scoring to use the same ledge as much as you can.
I mean I like Nyjah. his skate parts are amazing and hes consistent on every competition BUT Im kinda bored of his 5 same best tricks. hes doing like 3 of them last 5 years on every single final and at this point I would rather see some unstable late flips from aurelien than 27 nosbl from nyjah on every stop.
@@vengon9655 you couldn't be more wrong. I don't particularly like his style, but he is the one who has changed his bag of tricks the most over the years. This is just objective.
No, it means he's cheap and wins based on what, technicalities? (Let's not forget his popularity) and it's totally bullshit. Every SLS I can tell u what shit Nyjah is gonna do before his run even starts dude lmfao
Wow, skateboarding geek squad is on high alert! Thanks for the breakdown. Keep up the good work. You and Gary Rogers would make an amazing odd couple for contest commentary.
You could also debate that doing different variations of the same trick is not repetition though. I would have thought that doing the same variation of the same trick would be repetition but sure...
I was intended to write about french bashing, but your analysis is so clever and well documented that I'll satisfy with Aurelien second...yeah, that's a lot of hardflips...🇲🇫🤗
Je comprends aussi le raisonnement. Mais je trouve dommage de ne pas noté convenablement un tricks "historique" en compétion, au profit de Nyjah qui rentre les 4 même Bangers depuis 5 ans a chaque finale.
If you look at the runs section and best trick section, I think it turned out pretty fair.For the runs section Aurelien had some sick tricks,but he didn't have any nollie tricks, fakie tricks or switch tricks. In the best trick section, The 360 flip to nose grind/blunt slide was not clean and honestly the score was a little higher than it should have been. The hardflip late flip was sick,but not perfect. I think Aurelien has to have more signature/virstle tricks to beat Nyjah.We have to remember Nyjah used to do hardflips all the time,but in contest he would do a hardflip as a safe trick to win contest not as a banger to blow minds and win.The hardflip late flip could have been a 92,but I think the 360 flip to nose grind/ blunt slide hurt the score for the hardflip late flip.I really think Nyjah saw that the hardflip late flip could have been a little higher,but he did show the difference between him and Aurelien's skill level in the best trick. Aurelien did do some sick tricks though! All in All,the judges were tough at this contest.
I don't have a problem with nyjah winning, but only with the score that hardflip late flip got for being an NBD at a contest. Reminds me of what they used to do to Luan(and did a lot at SLS last year). anyway, great video, cheers from a fellow data scientist whose also into skate
I agree with the hard flip late deserving a better score but a sw heel flip crooked is a NBD to my knowledge and also a really really difficult trick, but no one has ever seen anything like a hard flip late flip
@@joeyandrews7123 yeah, the "wow factor" of the hardflip late flip is way higher, we'd have to think and dig through lots of archives to know if the trick you mention was an NBD, Aurelien's trick does immediately trigger the "omfg I've never seen such thing at a contest", just like shane o'niel when he did that sw 360 double(I think this was the trick) and got 9.9 at sls
lateflips can be caught , but skaters do not do them to perfection yet, or mix the right combos to it. The scored was high and the front shave kickflip aka hard flip was proper since the flip can cancel out if popped to high with a weak flick. How ever the second flip needs more of a rocket format and kicked earlier so it sticks to the feet. I do one in 99 in the china video of vancouver BC in damion keers part at the new west skate park. So not un nbd plus hard flip and front popshuves are the same thing unless one frontside flips and rotates back frontside for a proper speed in the kickflip. also hard flip is a stupid name for an easy trick that every one does wrong. tldr
They literally changed SLS contests because of Nyjah. People are tired of seeing him do the same tricks every contest and win. Nyjah never does hardflips, rarely tries anything that isnt in his wheel house and just snoozes up the contests. just go back and look at his win reels, its the same type of trick every single win other than when he kickfliped that huge gap to win. AG dropped an absolute hammer of a contest trick, and should have been awarded the score, period. At the end of the day this is skateboarding, and who can do the best tricks wins. Thats what its about, AG's trick was better its that simple.
Whenever I do a switch front bigspin lateflip down a set or drop or anything I always land on the board before it hits the ground most people that do lateflips catch them in the air before the board lands
I kind of agree because I understand the point you make and what the rules state. Should we then consider bs kick flip as a variation of kick flip and score it slightly above a previous kick flip over the same gap? Not sure about that. What about tre flip or even switch tricks?
I definitely am not a AG fan but the throwing the board is big valid the hype, and the overall excitement that trick brought him, I would never think docking him would be appropriate. That’s a big part of skateboarding, the celebration 🍾 big props to all the skaters though.
if difficulty and variety of tricks is king to these competitions, seems like Andy Anderson would win every one he entered. Remember when Jay Adams would show up to a contest with the "true attitude of skateboarding" of doing your own thing, having style and fun? That was considered too hard to judge, but so does modern skate competitions that still really come down to unwritten rules you must conform to.
I'm looking forward to when someone wins a competition THPS style, and manuals the entire course, flipping into and out of every grind and landing back to manual the entire thing. And then losing to Nyjah because it was considered "not enough variety, just one long manual" :p
"accepted by skate culture" is definitely an unwritten rule, esp when tricks come and go in popularity or have a split acceptance, like pressure flips. Just glad I'm not a judge.
great video and i totally agree with you on the overall ruleset, that aurelien "didnt play it as good" as Nyjah... that said, landing that Hardflip Lateflip, as an NBD... come on, the 91 isnt even close to be fair, stylish or not...
Bro I love Aurelien but 2 hardflip fs board, 2 hardlips over the bubba on his runs 4! 3 more on the best trick - Hardflip reverse 1st trick, hardflip late flip 4th attempt, and on the 5th attempt he got it right, ORIGINALITY, REPEAT went a long way, I believe the judges really took the judging criteria seriously, it's not possible 7 hardlips.
it’s diff for jamie cause he’s mainly a flat skater who’s known primarily for his insane trick innovations. now imagine if someone like louie lopez threw down a late flip down a 2 block as an ender. ppl would question that more than they would be impressed
Agree. Except for the frowned upon comment on late flips. I think that was a decade ago. Late flips are insane and can be as stylish as any other tricks
Best video you have made imo. The judging criteria played such a big role here. The rules are the rules, and being that these 2 dudes were so neck and neck the rules really showed their purpose in the situation at hand.
you have a great points and overall I agree with you except one thing. I would not call hardflip and ghetto bird as a repetitive trick. as a skater I know aswell how different these tricks are in case of technique
I have a homie who can't hardflip for shi, but he landed a ghetto bird in a game of skate. He has NEVER landed a hardflip. Some variations, although "harder", are fundamentally easier. Like, backlip is hard but if you have kickflips down it's easier to flip in without worrying about getting your trucks over.
First time seeing one of your videos. Great job researching and explaining your opinion. I think you standardize points for all tricks like in a video game. There is a panel of 25 pros not competing in this contest that rate each trick and you take the average score for each trick. The judges on the day can only add points for speed, style and clean landings, or subtract points for sketchy landings, etc. specific to the contest each obstacle is given a bonus for how big/small, long/short difficult/easy it is. Then there is link bonus. Step of your board to get set up no bonus. Do a trick on the 1/4 pipe link bonus and it multiplies. Do the same trick in multiple runs minus 25% the second time. Scores are tabulated real time but only shown as they show the replay of the run on the big screen for transparency. This way everyone gets to see where they won or gained bonuses. Extra bonus for the line section if you choose two separate lines to skate.
There's actually no indication that he actually read F* all, he just so happens to generally not repeat so many tricks, but who knows. He for sure cares that much about winning that I wouldn't put it past him to have actually read it that extensively tho lol.... Also there's NO SHOT hardflip Late flip is should be docked for "RePitTIuON" at that point to that Scale.... That ALONE and in the CLUTCH was pure hyped and You'd think repetition would be more so the same trick on different sized obstacles or gaps that arent super big in size but who knows.... Hell even a Hardflip vs Hardflip BS 180 since this is SKATEBOARDING is a big difference, dockable I guess sure, but for fucks sake, TWO FLIP TRICKS IN ONE on the Hardflip Late flip down the big set.... NAHHHHHH bro... At that point and with how hype that is, that's within discretion but again I'm not a judge. 🙃🥴🥴Nyjah dont PLAY by any means, already ledgend status, but those judges dooooo 🤐🤐
you dont even have to study lol just don't do your trick over and over with a variation.. i feel like most competition skaters nowadays do that, they got their one trick that they can land 100% and just do it into everything or add a little twist to it and it's a bit boring to watch tbh, the level of skating is still fucking insane tho but nyjah deserved to win imo
@@cyberinsurgent9910 ya i mean i agree with you that a hardflip late flip over that big ass hubba should probably have won, but @hood below has a good point that for the spectator it isn't as exciting to see three different hardflip variations. whereas everytime Jah rolls up you never know what he is going to throw down - which is really exciting.... but then again no one knew a hardflip late flip was about to happen either so idk dude its so hard to really judge without bias. At any rate, both skaters are probably going to the olympics anyways haha
Idc what anyone says, but I’ve been skating for 20 years and Nyjah has earned everything he has received. Dudes a beast since he was a kid and understands skateboarding competition
I was watching this live with my bro who isn't familiar with the skaters. I told him that Nyjah will win, he always does and the judges love him but they're not scoring him higher than he's worth, they just score the other skaters too harshly at times.
He threw his board because thats what pro skaters do buddy. Maybe you haven't watched enough contests but thats what skaters do. Its just a fun thing that pro skaters do when they're happy
i personally dont rlly care that nyjah won but i care that a hardflip late flip gets a 91 instead of 95+. that shit is insane. i dont give a fuck if hes got other hardflip variations
Judges do give a fuck about repetition though, it's their job to apply the rules. They HAD to duck points for repetition, it would have been a 95+ otherwise.
Yup, nyjah is the best! Haters try to say he is overrated but he sets the bar higher than anybody in this planet! That’s why he’s been winning for decades… if you think nyjah is not good than you don’t know what skateboarding is about
The judges are doing a disservice to skateboarding if they aren't celebrating NBD's. Some guy called Tony landed the most famous NBDs 10 minutes after the competition ended!
-Arm movements during the trick i think, not after . Very loose interpretation there. ( probably shouldve scored less) -Repetition is not well defined. In current formulation i would consider only SAME tricks as repetition. So when adding a variation like a late flip to an already done hardflip, thats pretty much a new trick. Very subjective tho
Like a lot of people I saw the score for the hard flip late flip on UA-cam and was so pissed but after watching the comp I have to agree that Nyjah is just too good. He plays the game, is more Inserting to watch with his bag of tricks, and is just so damn consistent. Ya no one is doing the late flip stuff that AG is doing but who tf else is doing switch heel crooks?? Would love to nyjah do something down the set though that would be sick.
While they couldn't do it consistently enough to pull it in the best trick I bet half the people there could switch heel crook that if you gave them an hour. I'd bet a ton no one else would land hardflip lateflip over the hubba in an hour.
@@christopherpedersen1820 and foh bro nobody is doing the shit Nyjah does when he's on, period. You just like to hate on dude. Nyjah can do that treflip 5050 shit, he can do the Japanese guys back breaker stuff, and he's got shit nobody else really does...an hour? This ain't an hour give me a chance...it's a contest, you only got so many chances to get something clutch. AG skated incredibly, not taking it from him he deserved 2nd which is commendable...but that hardflip late flip was gross and idgaf if it was contest NBD, it's a silly ass weird looking trick that needs to stay in batb on flat ground. He's lucky he didn't get an 8.5 for it. And I hope they rate it lower if he ever gets another one. He's too good to be picking such goofy ass tricks. If he does it switch...now we are talking, I'll gas that slightly higher. But regs, flying over the damn hubba the shit looked dumb.
@@christopherpedersen1820 you clearly dont understand how hard and rare a sw heel crooks/nosegrind is. Not many on this planet could do that on that obstacle without eating a lot of shit. And how about Aureliens heeltouch on the landing? It doesnt matter because you cant be impartial? Personally i prefer when the new guys do good and win, but when nyjah is skating like that it is what it is
saying a hardflip is the same as a hardflip back180 is like saying kickflip and backsideflip is the same thing.. "Hey bro you cannot BS flip this gap on your videopart, it's ABD, this other dude already kickfliped it." Dave Bachinsky kickflip El toro, but noone Backside flipped it ever (looking at you Scheckler). It's mental, just because they both to a kickflip rotation they are 2 very different tricks. Also lateflips are partially hated bc most people can only do them on flat, cannot do gaps or flip in or out of grinds/slides. I don't think anyone hates PRod's nollie lateflip crooked grinds. Same thing AG did this over a big ass hubba, it is not the same as doing a "clown flip" on flat.
Facts! Nyjah is a beast but that doesnt mean that Aurelien shouldnt have scored more on those tricks. Hardflip late flip? come on thats an insane trick to do over a hubba/gap on competition.
You pop and flick the exact same for all the hardflip variations though, while kickflip and BS flip feel very different from the pop and flick all the way to the catch. I agree that it should be scored higher though
No one is saying a hardflip is the SAME as a hardflip 180. It's just a variation of the base trick: Hardflip. The whole point was Aurelien did a hardflip and 2 variations of it, so because of thatit underscored.
@@javieracarrilloavendano4846 If you're talking about variations then Nyjah did multiple nosegrind variations including his 2nd and 3rd best trick makes. Those obviously should have been docked. The last one was supposed to be a crook, but IMO it was an accidental nosegrind. They weren't though because it's a nonsense rule if you count variations. Every trick in skateboarding is arguable a variation on like 10 basic tricks. Hell, a nosegrind is a variation on a 50-50 as far as I'm concerned so it's a repetition of something he did even more times because 50-50, 5-0, nosegrind are all variations of the same trick if you're going to start arguing over varations.
@@javieracarrilloavendano4846 all of those over the same obstacle in the same way
I agree that nyjah did amazing in this comp and i'd even say he deserved the win, but that being said aurelien's banger was grossly underscored even if it was just another hardflip variation because that was probably one of the heaviest trick ever done in competitive skateboarding.
Exactly my opinion. I think a 93-95 would have been fair and would have put him in front of Nyjah, but then Nyjah would have overtaken him with the last trick anyway. TBH the last trick was a bit overscored IMO and I think who should have won is debatable, but the hardflip late flip was just clearly underscored.
The judging rulebook is dumb in general to me though. People can't clean up sketchy makes which is why Mauro did crook nollie flip out after his sketchy nollie crook nollie flip out. He couldn't clean up the nollie crook nollie flip which is just dumb IMO.
The fact that he repeated a hard flip variation for the fourth time makes it a perfectly justified score imo
@@dngrouscrgo Nyjah's fakie flip nosegrind was his fourth fakie flip variation though which is technically just a kickflip riding backwards so his 10th kickflip variation. This variation logic is strange. Variation means different thus not repetitive.
@@CleverTricksGames he popped his tail so many times, ugh repetetive….
@@CleverTricksGames fax this is just well worded bullshit that hard flip late flip is beyond hard... And to get it 1st try.... and your exactly right bruhh a variation is a similar trick...not the same so what is a fs flip the same trick as a fuckin kickflip now...what a load of shit. All the judges just got a nyjah hard on that's all and these scores are just them stroking there nyjah hard on's 😂
He tossed the board to share the moment (arguably a massive one in skating history,) with the fans in the crowd. It was the play.
yeah that’s just hype. felt like the narrator was about to say he launched a projectile in the stands or something
I've seen this happen a lot, giving away hyped equipment on a trick or victory is very Common.
Even race drivers throw helmets.
it’s cool as long as the people knew they were getting a board thrown at them. I saw a vid of Lil Uzi Vert tossing a phone into a crowd and it cracked someone’s skull it was bad
ya not sure why DD didn't like the play, that wasn't a dick move, it was a really cool gesture of thanks to the fans for supporting a great performance.
It's all fun until the board cuts someone's head open
Solid video, thank you for busting out the rule book on us. I always come here and leave more educated every time
watching Nyjah in slow mo u realize how insane the tricks are but Aurelian is very high tier in terms of everything. Glad to see some competition
both extremely talented athletes. but here you see the clear cut difference between someone who spent their entire childhood competing at the highest level versus someone who did not. aurelien has nyjah covered in athleticism, but its hard to stay on the level someone who was borderline forced into giving up half their childhood to be better than everyone else
@@zkipa Excuses moi mais la différence n'est pas si nette que tu veux bien le faire penser. Et c'est justement parce qu'il est le patron de la SLS depuis longtemps que Nyjah est toujours surnoté ou plutôt les autres sont sous noté. Et tu connais quoi de l'enfance d'Aurelien? il a dû remplacer son père décédé par le skateboard alors lui aussi a consacré son enfance à cette discipline. Nyjah est très fort c'est vrai et la plupart du temps il a mérité ses victoires mais là quand on le voit en discussion avec Ribeiro ( qui s'est fait volé aussi) ça se voit qu'il est gêné parce qu'il sait très bien que Aurelien a été meilleur sur cette compétition. Mais c'est pas grave maintenant il a la confiance ça ne va pas tarder qu'il devienne numéro un
@@Graigy69 Nyjah deserved this win because he played it by the book. Of course that hardflip lateflip was insane, but no way he could score higher points with so many hardflip variations over the same gap. It's simply too repetitive and the rule book is very clear about that. Aurelien should learn to play the game.
Nyjah is always working on new tricks and not replying on what he’s got on lock. You gotta respect that. But I think think the hardflip lateflip was underscored.
Exactly what people forget. If Aurelian learns some switch tricks instead of another hardflip he might do better next time
bro we've seen dat cab noseblunt sooo many time in competition ....
@@huguesquemlaude7087 We really haven't, he's only used it since last year iirc. Dude changes his bangers more than any pro in top contests and that's a big reason why he wins so much. He has a huge bag of bangers and gives the judges variety.
Switch style is always ugly. Just be 2x better at regular
@@Dan16673 lies
Nyjah plays the game better than anyone else from a competitive standpoint (anyone that has watched Nyjah compete knows this by now). I respect his hustle and determination. He also has an insane bag of tricks. If Aurelien want's to win against him, he needs to play the same game. He definitely has the skills and the style to win. I think a lot of people really wanted Aurelien to win, so there was baked in bias, which contributed to the outcry imo.
you re right
Exactly. Jagger Eaton is one skater you can tell that just straight up looks at competitions with the same mindset Nyjah does. Imo
This is exactly it
I love how chill Nyjah is about these things...he just pumps harder...for everybody...he's always hyped when homies do well.
@@dongiv196 lol
Simple matter of the fact is that, Judges should be actual Skateboarders judging a Skate competition. Not Pencil pushers.
They may not be well know but Daniel LeBron and Garret Hill are skateboarders that judged the contest
The judges are actual skaters. Lol
Amazing video. Thanks for it all. So clear now.
Thank you, I needed this. I need to call the olympics and apologize...
hahahaha
The variation logic doesn't check out though. On Nyjah's cab nose blunt he had already done 2 other cab variations. On the fakie flip nose grind he had already done 3 other fakie flip variations. The point is variations make them different tricks. You wouldn't score a backside flip lower because a skater did a kickflip earlier on.
That hardflip late-flip deserved higher ( I can see argument for style but the difficulty is too far off the charts) but that tre flip accidental blunt deserved less so it kind of evens out.
I don't think it's the same, all of those cabs tricks were so different, and two of them weren't really major tricks. Aurelien kept hardflipping over the same obstacle.
100% look at the crowd they know who won. At first I thought maybe it was the technical rules that gave the wrong outcome. Then I realized it was not the rules, but the application of the rules. It is the "Nyjah Bump" we have all seen it before, and we will see it again. Happens in every sport.
When doing a cab nose blunt, the cab isn’t the main trick. The noseblunt is. The cab is just a way to get into that noseblunt. So even though he already did a couple cabs, they don’t apply to the cab noseblunt. Every one of aurelians hardflips was just that, a hardflip. Nyjah didn’t do a a noseblunt variation of a cab, he did a cab variation of a noseblunt. Every one of aurelians hardflips was a hardflip variation
@@blizzard13east29 did nyjah win anything last year?
Cry
Love these breakdowns
This definitely opened my eyes to the scoring system. Thank you 🙏
I love how you followed this as far as you could through to completion. Someone has definitely been slacking
great video as usual
Absolutely beautifully job, data. Thank you
I don’t mind Nyjah winning whatsoever, but the score for that hardflip late flip is straight bullshit, especially when that score determined the winner. I’ve never thought the judges are biased but this has me scratching my head. It’s a little sus, to say the least.
It wasn't gonna determine the winner Nyjah and some more skaters still had their trick to set...which means they could bump him out anyways. What it sortof meant was Nyjah last trick was a victory lap... because his wasn't enough, I agree with the score...I don't think he deserved the W, but 2nd was perfect. Arulian would have been better off lacing a switch hardflip over that same gap than doing the regular hardflip late flip NBD. These dudes need to learn going switch pays off. This isn't park or vert.
@@Siegefya spot on. All the Aurelian fans don’t understand that
Agree with everything except it determining the winner. With the switch heel crook I think nyjah won. But there really should have been a lot of added pressure with it being a do or die
I don’t understand the problem with him throwing his board, he’s hyped up and gave a complete to a fan who will most likely never forget it
Wow! Definitely opened my eyes to the overall scoring system and rule book break down 😯. Next level my friend. Time to hit that subscribe button 😎
Nyjah is a veteran, he knows how this work
Thank's for Video ; ) GJ
Well said. Great video.
Great stuff
Agree with your assessment, though I do think the HfLf was low-balled a little despite the repetition. But Nyjah's trick bag is deep, diverse and he so often lands clean af. I also agree with other comments (which have been common for ages) that long, tech slide/grind tricks or unique tricks on other obstacles, that creatively use the course, should be scored higher in best trick too, rather than basically forcing people to stay on the one obstacle if they're interested in winning. Occasionally this happens, like Joslin's massive ollie to fakie in the 2016 SLS super crown, but mostly it's like stay on the big rail/hubba or take that 8(0) baby.
Nyjah has been Goku and Aurelien is Vegeta showin up
Very well done! Nyjah has been doing this for so long, and understands how the game works.
Well I said first also it's cause of the variety. But hard to say, cause where Aurelien did hardflips, Nyjah did kickflips and fakie flips. So If Aurelien would've lead on the hardflip late flip, Nyjah would had have much more pressure on the sw heel crooks. So like that it could had gone either way.
I would bet that nyjah already has a stats guy working for him. If comp skating keeps growing, it's a matter of time before they become a necessity for the best comp skaters.
No
@@thehoror01 Yeah, the day these stuff had insane large prize money, skaters had to COMPETE. It's not your normal skate part anymore. It's way beyond that today. In esports competitions, they have stats guy, they even have some mental conditioning done to players. I mean in martial arts like boxing and mma, they study their opponent and look for his weakness, that's how it is when things get serious, you have to be technical. It may look dirty to amateurs but that's how it goes to get the medal and prize money.
But if the community of skaters doesn't want that, then they have to campaign to stop competitions like this and remove skateboarding from the Olympics.
that was a valid point of view, i would not have thought any of this if it werent for the vid
Isn't it just as much repetition to do every trick to a same ledge in individual trick section? In run section it seems to be important to use the park as versatile as possible. Didn't seem to affect the scoring to use the same ledge as much as you can.
Fully agreed!
I mean I like Nyjah. his skate parts are amazing and hes consistent on every competition BUT Im kinda bored of his 5 same best tricks. hes doing like 3 of them last 5 years on every single final and at this point I would rather see some unstable late flips from aurelien than 27 nosbl from nyjah on every stop.
yeah with this dude’s logic then nyjah’s cab to grind or even flip to grind should’ve been penalized for repetition.
whenever they do a trick outside the main big zone in the individual trick section, they get penalized.
@@vengon9655 you couldn't be more wrong. I don't particularly like his style, but he is the one who has changed his bag of tricks the most over the years. This is just objective.
Agreed! Nyjah is a great contest skater because he understands the rules and how they judge. But this was a great contest to watch!
I think the contest was pretentious and whack and I think I will not watch such clown circus anymore.
No, it means he's cheap and wins based on what, technicalities? (Let's not forget his popularity) and it's totally bullshit. Every SLS I can tell u what shit Nyjah is gonna do before his run even starts dude lmfao
The hardflip late flip was insane. Easily a 9.5+
"tell me that you didn't watch the video without telling me that you didn't watch the video"
@@fekigrejps7859 I'm just saying. Even if he already did 2 other hard flip variants
Thx GH
Nice analysis mr Data.
Wow, skateboarding geek squad is on high alert! Thanks for the breakdown. Keep up the good work. You and Gary Rogers would make an amazing odd couple for contest commentary.
hahah great idea!!!
I agree and broke it down in my head 2 seconds after it happenned just like you haha
ay the switch heel crook was ridiculous tho
You could also debate that doing different variations of the same trick is not repetition though. I would have thought that doing the same variation of the same trick would be repetition but sure...
ur my favorite channel
Now that someone has properly explained this situation I'm not so pissed off anymore.
I was intended to write about french bashing, but your analysis is so clever and well documented that I'll satisfy with Aurelien second...yeah, that's a lot of hardflips...🇲🇫🤗
Du bon pain ça prend de la sueur, pas des hardflips!
We need to see something new from him. Enough with the hardflips.
Je comprends aussi le raisonnement. Mais je trouve dommage de ne pas noté convenablement un tricks "historique" en compétion, au profit de Nyjah qui rentre les 4 même Bangers depuis 5 ans a chaque finale.
The day a switch heel krook (down a hubba first try) is considered worse than hard flip late flip, is the day I stop skating and start unicycling.
Ny killed it man. It’s hard to hate on him as a skater. Don’t know him personally, don’t really care. Incredible talent.
Yeah, he’s hated coz he is better than everyone else. Humans are envying creatures
If you look at the runs section and best trick section, I think it turned out pretty fair.For the runs section Aurelien had some sick tricks,but he didn't have any nollie tricks, fakie tricks or switch tricks. In the best trick section, The 360 flip to nose grind/blunt slide was not clean and honestly the score was a little higher than it should have been. The hardflip late flip was sick,but not perfect. I think Aurelien has to have more signature/virstle tricks to beat Nyjah.We have to remember Nyjah used to do hardflips all the time,but in contest he would do a hardflip as a safe trick to win contest not as a banger to blow minds and win.The hardflip late flip could have been a 92,but I think the 360 flip to nose grind/ blunt slide hurt the score for the hardflip late flip.I really think Nyjah saw that the hardflip late flip could have been a little higher,but he did show the difference between him and Aurelien's skill level in the best trick. Aurelien did do some sick tricks though! All in All,the judges were tough at this contest.
I don't have a problem with nyjah winning, but only with the score that hardflip late flip got for being an NBD at a contest. Reminds me of what they used to do to Luan(and did a lot at SLS last year). anyway, great video, cheers from a fellow data scientist whose also into skate
agreed, that should have been a 94-95 trick imo
I agree with the hard flip late deserving a better score but a sw heel flip crooked is a NBD to my knowledge and also a really really difficult trick, but no one has ever seen anything like a hard flip late flip
@@joeyandrews7123 Ronny Creager did it in the 90s switch over a pyramide
@@joeyandrews7123 yeah, the "wow factor" of the hardflip late flip is way higher, we'd have to think and dig through lots of archives to know if the trick you mention was an NBD, Aurelien's trick does immediately trigger the "omfg I've never seen such thing at a contest", just like shane o'niel when he did that sw 360 double(I think this was the trick) and got 9.9 at sls
lateflips can be caught , but skaters do not do them to perfection yet, or mix the right combos to it. The scored was high and the front shave kickflip aka hard flip was proper since the flip can cancel out if popped to high with a weak flick. How ever the second flip needs more of a rocket format and kicked earlier so it sticks to the feet. I do one in 99 in the china video of vancouver BC in damion keers part at the new west skate park. So not un nbd plus hard flip and front popshuves are the same thing unless one frontside flips and rotates back frontside for a proper speed in the kickflip. also hard flip is a stupid name for an easy trick that every one does wrong. tldr
This is the WWE of skateboarding. You feel me brother. Woooo
Sad but true…
They literally changed SLS contests because of Nyjah. People are tired of seeing him do the same tricks every contest and win. Nyjah never does hardflips, rarely tries anything that isnt in his wheel house and just snoozes up the contests. just go back and look at his win reels, its the same type of trick every single win other than when he kickfliped that huge gap to win. AG dropped an absolute hammer of a contest trick, and should have been awarded the score, period. At the end of the day this is skateboarding, and who can do the best tricks wins. Thats what its about, AG's trick was better its that simple.
Whenever I do a switch front bigspin lateflip down a set or drop or anything I always land on the board before it hits the ground most people that do lateflips catch them in the air before the board lands
those close up faces are so meme potential
Guys when this happened I literally just stopped watching. Nyjah could land a kick flip & get a 9.3. A hard flip late flip isn’t a fucking 9.1
I kind of agree because I understand the point you make and what the rules state. Should we then consider bs kick flip as a variation of kick flip and score it slightly above a previous kick flip over the same gap? Not sure about that. What about tre flip or even switch tricks?
nope
i just did both these tricks in tony hawk and the hardflip late flip had better score
The mvp! Haha hell ya
Nyjah and Yuto know the system and play it to their advantage the best. Can’t knock that.
dude, nyjah did a fakie flip nose grind and got a 93. Aurelien does a NBD and get a 91, you think that makes sense?
I definitely am not a AG fan but the throwing the board is big valid the hype, and the overall excitement that trick brought him, I would never think docking him would be appropriate. That’s a big part of skateboarding, the celebration 🍾 big props to all the skaters though.
The second the contest ended the first thing i said was “Dumb Data’s gonna have a field day”
I was hoping you’d discuss this
Nyjah know how to play in competition.. that's how it works. He study before compete.
if difficulty and variety of tricks is king to these competitions, seems like Andy Anderson would win every one he entered. Remember when Jay Adams would show up to a contest with the "true attitude of skateboarding" of doing your own thing, having style and fun? That was considered too hard to judge, but so does modern skate competitions that still really come down to unwritten rules you must conform to.
I'm looking forward to when someone wins a competition THPS style, and manuals the entire course, flipping into and out of every grind and landing back to manual the entire thing. And then losing to Nyjah because it was considered "not enough variety, just one long manual" :p
"accepted by skate culture" is definitely an unwritten rule, esp when tricks come and go in popularity or have a split acceptance, like pressure flips. Just glad I'm not a judge.
Dumb data, perfect name for this channel.
Sewa and P-Rod are the only people I've seen that make late flips look stylish.
Feels like saying hardflip variations is like saying multiple switch tricks should be penalised.
great video and i totally agree with you on the overall ruleset, that aurelien "didnt play it as good" as Nyjah...
that said, landing that Hardflip Lateflip, as an NBD... come on, the 91 isnt even close to be fair, stylish or not...
And the critique of late flips doesn't even apply. The board touched the ground as his feet touched the board. He made it look really cool.
Heel touch, if it was a game of skate you'd make him redo it
That hard flip, late flip was 🔥 I don’t know who says it’s not pleasing to the eye, because it def wasn’t me 👀
2:38 Nyjah's so good he can be in 2 places at once
Bro I love Aurelien but 2 hardflip fs board, 2 hardlips over the bubba on his runs 4! 3 more on the best trick - Hardflip reverse 1st trick, hardflip late flip 4th attempt, and on the 5th attempt he got it right, ORIGINALITY, REPEAT went a long way, I believe the judges really took the judging criteria seriously, it's not possible 7 hardlips.
Whoa whoa whoa,who calls late flips illegal😭bro we’re rooting for Jamie griffin because hes brought late flips to light and they’re awesome af
it’s diff for jamie cause he’s mainly a flat skater who’s known primarily for his insane trick innovations. now imagine if someone like louie lopez threw down a late flip down a 2 block as an ender. ppl would question that more than they would be impressed
All great points and will explained. I agree with you… Nyjah was the better competitor that competition.
hahahaha this man READ the rule book
Agree. Except for the frowned upon comment on late flips. I think that was a decade ago. Late flips are insane and can be as stylish as any other tricks
Dude just bc you try a super hard trick doesnt mean its gonna be scored higher thats why skating in the olympics is also a sport of its own
Aurelien shoulda fist pumped after landing the tre flip nose blunt like he meant it.
After seeing this video surprisingly everything makes sense
Some people take skate contests too seriously. A lot of skaters would rather put out a street part then skate a contest.
Best video you have made imo. The judging criteria played such a big role here. The rules are the rules, and being that these 2 dudes were so neck and neck the rules really showed their purpose in the situation at hand.
you have a great points and overall I agree with you except one thing. I would not call hardflip and ghetto bird as a repetitive trick. as a skater I know aswell how different these tricks are in case of technique
I have a homie who can't hardflip for shi, but he landed a ghetto bird in a game of skate. He has NEVER landed a hardflip. Some variations, although "harder", are fundamentally easier. Like, backlip is hard but if you have kickflips down it's easier to flip in without worrying about getting your trucks over.
Who cares about skate comps anyway, Nyjah is good he deserves his praise, anyone saying otherwise should get over it and get good
you say who cares about skate comps, but the rest of your comment it's literally you caring about it
ultimate devil's advocate
@2:56 shanes face 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Agreed that four hard flips in a comp is just too repetitive. The scoring was fair considering this piece of info.
Japab is stacked
. Nyjah is beast .
Aurilean got dem hardflips on 🔒
First time seeing one of your videos. Great job researching and explaining your opinion. I think you standardize points for all tricks like in a video game. There is a panel of 25 pros not competing in this contest that rate each trick and you take the average score for each trick. The judges on the day can only add points for speed, style and clean landings, or subtract points for sketchy landings, etc. specific to the contest each obstacle is given a bonus for how big/small, long/short difficult/easy it is. Then there is link bonus. Step of your board to get set up no bonus. Do a trick on the 1/4 pipe link bonus and it multiplies. Do the same trick in multiple runs minus 25% the second time. Scores are tabulated real time but only shown as they show the replay of the run on the big screen for transparency. This way everyone gets to see where they won or gained bonuses. Extra bonus for the line section if you choose two separate lines to skate.
Fakie flip 5-0 is an insane trick, unless you skate at a decent level you can’t even understand how sketchy that is down such a big obstacle
Nyjah is the best skateboarding competitor we have ever seen. I feel like he studies the rule books while everyone else just shows up.
Agreed, Nyjah has been smashing the comp skating scene for years, he deff knows the rules and how to play them to his advantage.
There's actually no indication that he actually read F* all, he just so happens to generally not repeat so many tricks, but who knows. He for sure cares that much about winning that I wouldn't put it past him to have actually read it that extensively tho lol.... Also there's NO SHOT hardflip Late flip is should be docked for "RePitTIuON" at that point to that Scale.... That ALONE and in the CLUTCH was pure hyped and You'd think repetition would be more so the same trick on different sized obstacles or gaps that arent super big in size but who knows.... Hell even a Hardflip vs Hardflip BS 180 since this is SKATEBOARDING is a big difference, dockable I guess sure, but for fucks sake, TWO FLIP TRICKS IN ONE on the Hardflip Late flip down the big set.... NAHHHHHH bro... At that point and with how hype that is, that's within discretion but again I'm not a judge. 🙃🥴🥴Nyjah dont PLAY by any means, already ledgend status, but those judges dooooo 🤐🤐
you dont even have to study lol just don't do your trick over and over with a variation.. i feel like most competition skaters nowadays do that, they got their one trick that they can land 100% and just do it into everything or add a little twist to it and it's a bit boring to watch tbh, the level of skating is still fucking insane tho but nyjah deserved to win imo
@@cyberinsurgent9910 ya i mean i agree with you that a hardflip late flip over that big ass hubba should probably have won, but @hood below has a good point that for the spectator it isn't as exciting to see three different hardflip variations. whereas everytime Jah rolls up you never know what he is going to throw down - which is really exciting....
but then again no one knew a hardflip late flip was about to happen either so idk dude its so hard to really judge without bias. At any rate, both skaters are probably going to the olympics anyways haha
Rule books in skateboarding?
Do a kickflip
Idc what anyone says, but I’ve been skating for 20 years and Nyjah has earned everything he has received. Dudes a beast since he was a kid and understands skateboarding competition
Lol
I was watching this live with my bro who isn't familiar with the skaters. I told him that Nyjah will win, he always does and the judges love him but they're not scoring him higher than he's worth, they just score the other skaters too harshly at times.
So true
He brings in the views. They know what’s up.
He threw his board because thats what pro skaters do buddy. Maybe you haven't watched enough contests but thats what skaters do. Its just a fun thing that pro skaters do when they're happy
wacky rules and sterile skating.
i personally dont rlly care that nyjah won but i care that a hardflip late flip gets a 91 instead of 95+. that shit is insane. i dont give a fuck if hes got other hardflip variations
Judges do give a fuck about repetition though, it's their job to apply the rules. They HAD to duck points for repetition, it would have been a 95+ otherwise.
Exactly
Yup, nyjah is the best! Haters try to say he is overrated but he sets the bar higher than anybody in this planet! That’s why he’s been winning for decades… if you think nyjah is not good than you don’t know what skateboarding is about
The judges are doing a disservice to skateboarding if they aren't celebrating NBD's. Some guy called Tony landed the most famous NBDs 10 minutes after the competition ended!
Number 1 lesson to learn from all this. Goofy will always win 🏆
dirty goofy riders!
Olympics should use king of the road as contest format it would be way more entertaining (I obviously know that this would never happen)
How did you catch shanes face like that
Sometimes, dumbdata, ain't dumb :D
-Arm movements during the trick i think, not after . Very loose interpretation there. ( probably shouldve scored less)
-Repetition is not well defined. In current formulation i would consider only SAME tricks as repetition. So when adding a variation like a late flip to an already done hardflip, thats pretty much a new trick. Very subjective tho
Like a lot of people I saw the score for the hard flip late flip on UA-cam and was so pissed but after watching the comp I have to agree that Nyjah is just too good. He plays the game, is more Inserting to watch with his bag of tricks, and is just so damn consistent. Ya no one is doing the late flip stuff that AG is doing but who tf else is doing switch heel crooks?? Would love to nyjah do something down the set though that would be sick.
His knee Is pretty messed up high impact is hard for him.
While they couldn't do it consistently enough to pull it in the best trick I bet half the people there could switch heel crook that if you gave them an hour. I'd bet a ton no one else would land hardflip lateflip over the hubba in an hour.
@@christopherpedersen1820 nobody will do it you're right, nobody wants to chance getting broke off on a circus trick.
@@christopherpedersen1820 and foh bro nobody is doing the shit Nyjah does when he's on, period. You just like to hate on dude. Nyjah can do that treflip 5050 shit, he can do the Japanese guys back breaker stuff, and he's got shit nobody else really does...an hour? This ain't an hour give me a chance...it's a contest, you only got so many chances to get something clutch. AG skated incredibly, not taking it from him he deserved 2nd which is commendable...but that hardflip late flip was gross and idgaf if it was contest NBD, it's a silly ass weird looking trick that needs to stay in batb on flat ground. He's lucky he didn't get an 8.5 for it. And I hope they rate it lower if he ever gets another one. He's too good to be picking such goofy ass tricks. If he does it switch...now we are talking, I'll gas that slightly higher. But regs, flying over the damn hubba the shit looked dumb.
@@christopherpedersen1820 you clearly dont understand how hard and rare a sw heel crooks/nosegrind is.
Not many on this planet could do that on that obstacle without eating a lot of shit.
And how about Aureliens heeltouch on the landing? It doesnt matter because you cant be impartial?
Personally i prefer when the new guys do good and win, but when nyjah is skating like that it is what it is
could anyone argue that late flips and double flips are 'easier' for top notch skaters? more flip time, less catch time.
Even in 1991 we knew repetition hurt scores.
What are we now, 30yrs later?
I think it’s very visually pleasing. Kind of sounds like a rule made by skaters who can’t do multiple spins in a truck.
1:27 what’s a backside hardflip?
Okay… but Hardflip lateflip, just 9.1??? Come on!!!