One man didn't, he only gave us all the illusion that he had. He had a bunch of blank spaces to fill in and needed two other people to help him write the world history books.
@@shooshooshooshooshooterI realize my comment probably sounds harsher than I intended it to be. I just meant he didn't do what Tolkien did and actually fill in the histories for all of these places. He made us think he did the same amount of work (which is still incredible), by giving just enough detail for us to fill in the blanks. And it's not fair to say he came up with it all, when he had two super fans help him with his world history books. They had to correct him several times on things he forgot, so they deserve some recognition. One person came up with a really cool world/story, he gave the illusion it had a complete world history (since Tolkien is the only one crazy enough to spend a decade creating the worlds history first). and then when people wanted more, he had help from two super fans to fill in the blanks he hadn't considered.
@@Chadius_Thundercock As it should be. GRRM stated that his world's mystery is part of how our own once was. History isn't clear on every little detail, TWOIAF proves this and even Fire and Blood where you have 3 separate accounts of the Dance from 3 separate sources. This reflects true human history as we simply did not know everything back then and by no means has that changed today.
I don't know why but whenever I hear about Asshai, I imagine the remnants of a civilization that experienced a truly catastrophic nuclear meltdown. Magical nuclear energy for sure but still. Might explain the polluted water and weird, mutated fish
you should check out Preston Jacobs + David Lightbringer's videos on this topic, really in depth looks on the idea westoros living in a post nuclear timeline!
Probably the world of game of thrones was once a thriving advance/modern civilization before some worldwide cataclysmic event neither it will be manmade through magic or natural phenomenon happened.
I really hope we get an expanded lore book on far East Essos, some lore on Ulthos would be cool also, but with the way things are going with ASOIF Idk if it will ever happen.
Don't you think it's strange that some people will study the history of a made up world but they won't study history of the real world. Fucked up isn't it?
most of these lore books compendiums by GRRM are written from the lens of the maesters, so i have a feeling even if we get a extended look into the far east, it'll almost be what the maester's want us to believe about asshai, which i absolutely love.
The world of Ice and Fire is so massive and so interesting there is near limitless potential for story telling. I can easily imagine horror stories, Romances, Epics of nations and clashing armies, political intrigue, and etc.
Sadly i don't think we will see the end if the book series. George seems to have lost all desire to finish even Winds, let alone do a whole book after that to complete Dreams of Spring
Rivers can definitely be polluted on their own. Though to a certain extent it depends on what you mean by pollution. As long as you don’t define pollution as specifically human caused, then it can very much happen naturally. One of the biggest killers on the Oregon Trail in the US was water that had dissolved lime in it, which is toxic and would kill people who drink it. Toxic water usually comes from natural chemicals or materials that dissolve in the water, or are pulled up from the ground. It is also possible for things to be naturally radioactive (like bananas, though that’s very very minuscule) and stuff like that being exposed to the water for long periods of time could also make it toxic, as well as cause it to potentially glow. It is harder for rivers to become naturally polluted than still water like lakes, because the flowing naturally removes water and replaces it more regularly, but if the source of the river is toxic, then it is much easier.
So, if Stygai upriver were dumping something in the water, it could be the cause. (Or further upriver.) Stygai is rumoured to be filled with corpses and possibly has had dragons in the area. The name Stygai seems close other words for vampires, shtriga and stregoi being two that popped up in my google search. I sort of like the idea that there are vampires there, and whatever they are doing is what’s polluting the river.
In real life one of the biggest "polluters" (again, depends on what exactly one means by this, but for our purposes it will just mean any form of contamination not standard in river water) would be volcanic eruptions or similar seismic activity. This could be our culprit here given that the Shadowlands are supposedly volcanic, and the river is literally called "Ash". If you're correct then I would think that this is the most logical explanation.
Asshai reminds me of the former Minas Ithil, the Gondorian City of the Moon, mutated by evil into Minas Morgul, the City of the Dead where the ringwraithes live.
I believe, the Valyrians were the original inhabitants of Asshai and hid their identity due to the cataclysm they caused and the enemies they made, who would kill anybody who could possibly still know how to tame dragons: 1) Asshai people discovered how to tame dragons, harnessing their power 2) By that power they became a gigantic kingdom, therefore Asshai's size. Possibly Stygai functioned as a political headquater/palace 3) At some point they went to far, causing a cataclysmic event, possibly by war amongst themselves or by overusing their power (parallel to nuclear war or chernobyl) 4) This event includes a sudden emission of intense radiation/magic power, causing genetic deformations in fish (and possibly the deformed and misunderstood inhabitants of Stygai) and luminescent water as well as turning fused black stone into greasy black stone 5) They flee to Valyria and, since they made a lot of enemies, hide their identity and claim strangers from Asshai taught them how to tame dragons (their origin explaining their pale skin and lighter eyecolors which makes sense in a darker city but not in Valyria) Dragons are a strong parallel to nuclear power (notice how dragons are not only weapons, but used to build roads and buildings, just like nuclear power is used for weapons as well as power plants)
Dragons were created, they didn't always exist, there were only 40 dragonlord houses which is far from all of velaryia. House high tower is old it's said alicent looks velaryian but in house of the dragon alicent didn't do magic herself or ride dragons, and meyles had no problems screeching at alicent. So alicent is from a old house of non dragon riders, and prior to dragons they had some of most accomplished magic users. It was likely over use of magic, the dragon lords and a certain somebody using dark meteor magic that ruined them. Also purple eyes come from relation to amathyst empress
I really would have loved it, if GRRM had added Hydras to the story. Like maybe in Sothoryos or as Valyrian art work. I can just picture Balerion The Black Dread fighting a Hydra in the ruins of the Valyrian Freehold. That would be awesome!
I once heard a theory that when Euron does his Blood Sacrifice, he won't summon a Sea Dragon or a Kraken but, like the Old Valyrians, creates a chimera of the two and spawns a Hydra. That would be badass.
Many believe it was a massive fire Wyrm that attacked Balerion and Aerea Targaryen in Valyrian and the wounds that he received there actually killed him and not old age
"hic sunt dracones": Asshai is the modern day Space Jockey a la the Alien franchise - sometimes the idea of something is more intriguing than what it actually is. It's the ultimate play on the JJ Abrams mystery box but taken to such a beautifully uneasy and supernatural extreme. Personally speaking, I almost somewhat hope GRRM doesn't ever explore more of Asshai because it's truly up to us as readers and fans to believe what we want to, and the coolest part is: almost all of it can be true (or false) because of how little (but also ALOT) that we know about it. Asshai has got to be one of the coolest locations in ALL of fantasy lore, from the idea of figuring out whether it even existed, to the fact that SO much of the ASOIAF lore 'can' originate from Asshai, all the way to these diabolical creatures both confirmed and theorized - the feeling i get when reading about Asshai is truly unmatched, and I hope he lets this be something our imaginations can continue to infinitely theorize even after the series is over.
You need to read some Lovecraft. Asshai is pretty much lifted straight out of Lovecraftian lore. Also parallels Stygai nicely with the city of Pteion from Conan the Rebel, which is in the country of Stygia on the River Styx. Y'ghatan from the Malazan series, Shadar Logoth from Wheel of Time, or even real world tales of the Scholomance. Point being, ancient lost cities destroyed through evil magic or evil rites are far from exclusive to GRRM.
@@fenixchief7 never said it was unique to this series lol! very aware of lovecraft and GRRM’s use of his tropes within ASOIAF, even with the deep ones and the black stone as well. Really clever uses but love how GRRM portrays it vs how Lovecraft kinda gives you everything to some extent
Euron greyjoy has and there's lots there and also the biggest empire ever in that area was empire of the dawn. Valeryia had a doom maybe this city went another way, azor ahai was from another area
Asshai, the lands beyond the Five Forts and it's relations to the Long Night always fascinates me! Were the White Walkers mistaken to be the Lion of the Night and it's demons?
The White Walkers bring the cold, and cold brings them. Asshai graphical depictions sometimes feature snow covered mountains. Unless there is an ice tundra beyond Asshai or Stygai, the WW aren't very likely, I think. Also, it wouldn't be as satisfying reveal if it's the same enemy we already know of. Well, what do I know anyway...
@@eraldylli but don't you think the white walkers are allegorical to climate change? Don't you think Valeria and Asshai existing only as ruined shells is a warning against nuclear proliferation? An author may have fun living in their fictional world but typically they have something to say about the real world via allegory.
I'm thinking not white walkers because literally every human civilization tries to take them down. It's an odd thing because every culture talks on a long night and not necessarily snow related. So we know the region azor ahai came out of. It was within the former empire of the dawn. Now if he's pre velaryian doom why's he fighting walkers? Earliest beings in westeros were also not man. The children made the night king, the nights king which is 13 commander comes long after him. I wonder if where azor ahai came from they still knew myths of great empire of the dawn because the lion and another being had the supposed first human ruler of the empire of the dawn, depending where azor ahai is on the timeline I'm not sure he'd want to fight the lion god because in his culture he's not a bad entity and yet azor ahai stopped some walkers and now everybody wants to be him, it's ingrained in Targaryen culture but azor ahai caused a long night, im only guessing he fought the walkers or he'd not be called a hero after what he did
It would be cool to hear that if the so called dragons living in asshai ended up being a hydra whose heads kept falling but resembled dragon head so much that people thought that the hydra head remains in asshai are the remains of dragons
Asshai probably isn’t what people think. George mirrors the real world with his books. Europeans thought that Africa was a far more mystical place than it actually was once upon a time. As they had only really had contact with Northern Africa and Ethiopia. I think it’s best not to take Asshai so literal.
In comparison with the amount of other stuff the characters don’t ‘take literal’ that ends up being literal I’d say until George says otherwise read it as literal .
@@Noshushpls George give an example he says the people in Yiti believe the Lannister’s are literally golden lions. Are they psychically golden lions? No obviously not plus his magic system has a lot of pseudo science that’s why he made his dragons have four limbs and not 6 so it could fit with life on the planet.
@@houseofmendoza5442 I’ve never heard of a dragon having 6 limbs so I don’t see your point also yes he does that from a writers perspective it’s very common to use metaphors to draw comparisons but story telling wise everything seems to be pretty on the nose
@@Noshushpls most dragons have 4 legs plus wings which are considered limbs George’s have to hind legs plus wings which is 4. So it very commons for dragons in mythology to have 6
@@houseofmendoza5442 all dragons have hind legs ?? They’re exactly the same he just doesn’t consider them limbs by what your telling me and I’m confused how him adapting mythological creatures to be more individual to his world for story telling has anything to do with whether he’s speaking in relative terms and metaphors or if he’s being literal
I simultaneously want more stories from the continents that aren't westeros, while kinda not wanting them. These areas are mysterious and interesting, but if martin ever decides to explain more about them, they'll lose the mystique that makes me want to know more
My main theory about the Shadow Lands is that whatever happened there helped to cause the Long Night. The whole thing sounds like aftermath of a meteor strike. A pretty massive one that basically caused an mini ice age. A meteor strike can cause irradiation so that could’ve been what caused the poison river. Hell, it could’ve affected the mountainside and changed the shape of the landscape making those large mountains that block the sun from the city. But, I’m veering into Lightbringer territory so I’ll shut up.
Something worse then a dragon that even people who can control shadows fear. I'm thinking it has to be humanoid maybe something made completely from shadows. Or maybe it has to be a type of wight we have fire wights, ice wights and would it be such a stretch to have shadow wights.
Stygai reminds me of Minas Morgul. Also an abandoned ghost city, poluted waterstream and haunted. (+ nazgul keep, so maybe it is smth similar occupying Stygai)
Dragon lords are the product of genetic manipulation probably the dragons themselves as well, so asshai could be the origin point of dragonlords in such they literally created them as a experiment/product which would explain why the birth problems within the bloodline
This location somehow is very intriguing.(like we have to learn the lesson from its history that maybe a key wisdom for a better future world or some sort) I really wanna know a lot lot more but I just can't which fuels my curiosity even more.
Polluted water is kinda normal but there's also the good ol Preston Jacobs theory about the world of ice and fire being an post apocalyptic world so if we're going by this theory then I'm gonna say that shadowlands might just be a nuclear plant that blew up resulting in the surrounding getting polluted and absolutely fucked also dragons might just be mutated lizards or something like that and demons might just be something humanoid that was mutated into a demon or it might just be myth
i swear how do you keep finding stuff to talk about in the series? i thought ik everyhting and then you spoil me with more content thank you bro i may have to read the books
as to your question of natural toxic places: YES. there are natural nuclear reactors, one such one was found in africa. some african countries were going to mine and sell ractor grade uranium until they found out all the correct isotope had already undergoe rapid nuclear decay. Heavy metals can naturally occur and make places toxic, but more often acid springs will create toxic gases and very acidic water. specialized fish can live in the water. most cave fish are known for being clear or bioluminecint and acid spring fish, even in sunlight, follow this trend. ghost grass is pure fiction., no plant grows in that like ness but is based on a reasonable plant. ghost grass is most likely a fungus or an sedinadary animal like a worm or pollop. being translucent has few advantages for a plant. I think deamons are heavily mutated reptaloids and authropods. I think the unnammed species is likely a mutated dragonfly that spews acid and is basically massive. (dragonflies are superube predators and are mostly limited by their intellegence and size)
David Lightbringers channel has a great, logical theory about how dragons could very well have originated in the Shadowlands and about an ancient people that had dragons and dragonstone. Check out his video titled The Great Empire of the Dawn part 1. I think you'd really like it. Also, I just wanted to say I am a new subscriber and I love your videos. Thank you!
usually, unless a natural source is continually polluted (like sulfur from an active volcano and ash being released), water usually clears on its own with the exception of nuclear waste leaking into the source. if it's from an aquifer, and the aquifer is polluted, it's permanently tainted. i'd guess that something is happening in that city that continues to pollute...
If the river ash runs from the mountains, i would assume something “evil” and toxic/poisonous would live in the mountains poisoning the surround area. A poisonous hydra with 7/9 heads does sound worse than a dragon. Its implied dragons were created as chimeras by asshai/valyrians. Its my head cannon that they created some massive hydra as a weapon (probably would be easier than dragons since large poisonous lizards exist not far to the south in sothoryos) but it turned against them, either that or it was set on them, poisoning the land so they had to flee to valyria, integrated with the locals to remove their names and from history (departed from the annuls) and thats why dragon riders have silver hair and amythest eyes, theyre descendants of the amethyst empress/her people either fleeing from the hydra or the bloodstone emperor. Where better to run to than a land of summer and fire to escape the long night/suffocating darkness of hydra poison
I think something akin to a mountain dwelling Cthulhu would be worse than any dragon. Plague spreading Nurgle like humans or unkillable shadow ghouls could also be worse than dragons.
It’s very possible that the ground source of the river is polluted due to some underground geologic activity releasing minerals and or other toxic deposits into the water table
Me personally something far more ancient and horrific that can rival a dragon is probably something lovecraftian. Like I believe George has his own like Tolkien nameless things and watcher in the water, there must be some kind of creatures like that that has no name but horrifying to look at and far ancient and use cosmic magic that’s the only way I think who cma rival dragons and why shadowland people fear the corpse city and play the lovecraft creatures look like they smell of rotten flesh and sea stuff so I wouldn’t be suprise why it’s called the corpse city
The other place in the stories rhat has mountains like that is beyond the wall and planets are spheres they say that Asshai is the end of the world just like how historically we thought there was a physical end and it didn’t go round in a loop but I think good chances are Asshai is just where the lands connects all the way back around AKA Asshai is connected to the lands north of the wall of Westeros (just a theory) also makes sense because they make it out like the WW are a bigger threat to everyone not just Westeros despite the fact they also say they can’t swim meaning there must be some way the land connects if the prophecy is accurate
hey can you guys tell me what you guys think of this theory for bran in the show. idk maybe it doesn't make sense or its already a known theory or maybe im just to high i was watching this Got rewind for benjen stark and i seen bran being his normal self and he told benjen that he doesnt know how to control it. referring to the three eye raven powers. well that got me thinking, how can you even give your powers to someone else? is that something that is in the books. well hear me out what if blood raven isnt dead, or he died but somehow is spirit went into bran. sooo when bran finally learns to control his powers, he is basically giving bloodraven control of him like a warg. thats why hes this emotionless shell of his former self. at the end of the series its bloodraven who says why do you think i came all this way.
Who was it that flew off on Balerion and disappeared for a good while. Then came back with creatures under her skin, and burning up to the point she was smoking? Maybe those are the things they speak of
It probably mostly boils down to "hic sunt dracones", there be danger over there. It's unexplored and foreign. And the natives would generally benefit from their neighbors being afraid to set foot deeper into their lands. Herodotus writes of a people of werewolves living in today's Ukraine and Carpathians. Of course there weren't any werewolves around there, but it's curious to note that all Slavic people (who most likely originate in these exact parts) have some kind of carnival rites where they dress into long furs and wear scary masks, most commonly used for rituals of welcoming spring and driving away evil spirits and just to note, this stuff persisted in the Balkans till today, despite Christianity. There have been multiple instances of these same peoples using such a garb and behavior to scare away potential invaders. Allegedly there is an instance where Croatian people living around Mohács in today's Hungary drove away an invading Ottoman force by creeping into their midst under the cover of the night, wearing their ceremonial garb (horned willow masks painted with blood and fur garbs and cloaks) and scared the ever living life out of the Turks. After a short skirmish, the Turks fled for their lives. Of course in an open battle and knowing they are fighting peasants the Turks would trample them, but in these circumstances they thought they were beset by demons and fled. Who knows how many such events occurred. The older the word and the lesser the general knowledge, the easier it must have been to pull such a trick off.
Lady Danelle Lothston seems more or less like a direct reference to Countess Elizabeth Bathory, the supposed 'Vampyric' Hungarian blood countess. Hell, even the Lothston sigil is a bat. She was also said to practice the dark arts. So vampires might actually exist in this world.
@@up5619 the idea of humaniod creatures is very common in his world. There are lizard men, winged men and his version of vampires are referred to as "bloodless" men.
Why not nuclear powered spaceships... Since we see The Terraformers Sigil twice in the show.... And the Steel Angels worship the same Pale Child Bakkalon. After the God On Earth returned to be with his people after 10,000 years, the children Broke the Pact and blew up the moon and attacked Kadath certain they could kill the humans with Floods and SQuishers. But the human, losing technology lost contact with their space brothers and the humans psychics are now trying to wage a war against the children. This would explain the reason nothing lives up there. I think the HUmans ran from Kadath, using their dragons or spaceships to make the 5 forts with giants during the war, when they have been fighting for and against the children for thousands of years, retreated to the Shadow and they finally were attacked by the children detonating them, the Bloodstone Emperor was not insane for wanting to get information from space and from Stygia, which was the hold of the humans against the squishers the humans had no choice but to push into Asshai and take it with their weapons... This is where all the technology came and deteriorated Much like symbolically technology destroys nature it is a haven from the nature of the children. Now, knowing the Children Lie and so do the Maesters, combined with the fact that human cannot advance and all the tech was stripped, the humans are being held down by the Children, and they have to lower their numbers and another moon explosion will help for 10k more years. The humans had fighter bloodlines, necromantic bloodlines and psychic bloodlines, Squisher Bloodlines... The Children have dream and warg bloodlines... And there are at least 3 different hiveminds on this planet or trying to affect it... The Lord of light is likely Psychics from the Angels in space, Brynden Rivers is the almost summer king who Bran has to warn Jon about and then kill... HImself. Since Bran is Hodored by Brynden. They are tools of the Other..... The Other Hivemind... And the corrupted by humans hivemind that also may contain original Bran the builder... . And there is the Green Hivemind on the ISle of Faces.... And the Esso Ulthos Hivemind that could be controlled by yet another.... Perhaps the Mazemakers, who were using the darkness and mazes to bring about Dream and Psychic powers... This was important to them. I wonder when it said "Early stories says Dragon roosted on the tower at Battle Isle"... Maybe they were not Dragons but ships.... The God Emperor had 10k years of Steel Angel reinforcement of the homeworld of the Hurangen/Children.... It was only after the main dude went away the Children attacked...
Its incredible that one man created such a vast and complex world.
One man didn't, he only gave us all the illusion that he had. He had a bunch of blank spaces to fill in and needed two other people to help him write the world history books.
@@kyleellis1825 must be easy to do then.
Off you go, Kyle.
@@shooshooshooshooshooterI realize my comment probably sounds harsher than I intended it to be. I just meant he didn't do what Tolkien did and actually fill in the histories for all of these places. He made us think he did the same amount of work (which is still incredible), by giving just enough detail for us to fill in the blanks.
And it's not fair to say he came up with it all, when he had two super fans help him with his world history books. They had to correct him several times on things he forgot, so they deserve some recognition.
One person came up with a really cool world/story, he gave the illusion it had a complete world history (since Tolkien is the only one crazy enough to spend a decade creating the worlds history first). and then when people wanted more, he had help from two super fans to fill in the blanks he hadn't considered.
@@shooshooshooshooshooter you think George has the work ethic to make up this world all by himself? plus most of the world is vaguely described
@@Chadius_Thundercock As it should be. GRRM stated that his world's mystery is part of how our own once was. History isn't clear on every little detail, TWOIAF proves this and even Fire and Blood where you have 3 separate accounts of the Dance from 3 separate sources.
This reflects true human history as we simply did not know everything back then and by no means has that changed today.
I don't know why but whenever I hear about Asshai, I imagine the remnants of a civilization that experienced a truly catastrophic nuclear meltdown. Magical nuclear energy for sure but still. Might explain the polluted water and weird, mutated fish
You've seen too much Simpson's if you think all nuclear waste does is give fish a third eye and add a glow to water.
I call it “magical Chernobyl”. That’s the vibe I get from it.
doesnt sound too far off from the Doom of Valyria but maybe more so with blood magic.
you should check out Preston Jacobs + David Lightbringer's videos on this topic, really in depth looks on the idea westoros living in a post nuclear timeline!
Probably the world of game of thrones was once a thriving advance/modern civilization before some worldwide cataclysmic event neither it will be manmade through magic or natural phenomenon happened.
I really hope we get an expanded lore book on far East Essos, some lore on Ulthos would be cool also, but with the way things are going with ASOIF Idk if it will ever happen.
Don't you think it's strange that some people will study the history of a made up world but they won't study history of the real world. Fucked up isn't it?
@@Me-qp8vz Is it?
Shhhh!! He will hear you and WoW will be behind another 2 years!
@@thebystander1636 Winds is never coming out. Get to grips with reality.
most of these lore books compendiums by GRRM are written from the lens of the maesters, so i have a feeling even if we get a extended look into the far east, it'll almost be what the maester's want us to believe about asshai, which i absolutely love.
The world of Ice and Fire is so massive and so interesting there is near limitless potential for story telling. I can easily imagine horror stories, Romances, Epics of nations and clashing armies, political intrigue, and etc.
And to think HBO would make such a thing until season eight of course
Sadly i don't think we will see the end if the book series. George seems to have lost all desire to finish even Winds, let alone do a whole book after that to complete Dreams of Spring
Rivers can definitely be polluted on their own. Though to a certain extent it depends on what you mean by pollution. As long as you don’t define pollution as specifically human caused, then it can very much happen naturally. One of the biggest killers on the Oregon Trail in the US was water that had dissolved lime in it, which is toxic and would kill people who drink it. Toxic water usually comes from natural chemicals or materials that dissolve in the water, or are pulled up from the ground. It is also possible for things to be naturally radioactive (like bananas, though that’s very very minuscule) and stuff like that being exposed to the water for long periods of time could also make it toxic, as well as cause it to potentially glow. It is harder for rivers to become naturally polluted than still water like lakes, because the flowing naturally removes water and replaces it more regularly, but if the source of the river is toxic, then it is much easier.
So, if Stygai upriver were dumping something in the water, it could be the cause. (Or further upriver.) Stygai is rumoured to be filled with corpses and possibly has had dragons in the area. The name Stygai seems close other words for vampires, shtriga and stregoi being two that popped up in my google search.
I sort of like the idea that there are vampires there, and whatever they are doing is what’s polluting the river.
In real life one of the biggest "polluters" (again, depends on what exactly one means by this, but for our purposes it will just mean any form of contamination not standard in river water) would be volcanic eruptions or similar seismic activity. This could be our culprit here given that the Shadowlands are supposedly volcanic, and the river is literally called "Ash". If you're correct then I would think that this is the most logical explanation.
the source of the Ash's pollution might come from one of the ingredients of wildfire, the one that turns it green and so deadly
a Belmont was glad to see one of the best rendition of Lord Dracula in the thumbnail
🖤
Asshai reminds me of the former Minas Ithil, the Gondorian City of the Moon, mutated by evil into Minas Morgul, the City of the Dead where the ringwraithes live.
Whycreate never disappoints
I believe, the Valyrians were the original inhabitants of Asshai and hid their identity due to the cataclysm they caused and the enemies they made, who would kill anybody who could possibly still know how to tame dragons:
1) Asshai people discovered how to tame dragons, harnessing their power
2) By that power they became a gigantic kingdom, therefore Asshai's size. Possibly Stygai functioned as a political headquater/palace
3) At some point they went to far, causing a cataclysmic event, possibly by war amongst themselves or by overusing their power (parallel to nuclear war or chernobyl)
4) This event includes a sudden emission of intense radiation/magic power, causing genetic deformations in fish (and possibly the deformed and misunderstood inhabitants of Stygai) and luminescent water as well as turning fused black stone into greasy black stone
5) They flee to Valyria and, since they made a lot of enemies, hide their identity and claim strangers from Asshai taught them how to tame dragons (their origin explaining their pale skin and lighter eyecolors which makes sense in a darker city but not in Valyria)
Dragons are a strong parallel to nuclear power (notice how dragons are not only weapons, but used to build roads and buildings, just like nuclear power is used for weapons as well as power plants)
They weren't lol
Dragons were created, they didn't always exist, there were only 40 dragonlord houses which is far from all of velaryia. House high tower is old it's said alicent looks velaryian but in house of the dragon alicent didn't do magic herself or ride dragons, and meyles had no problems screeching at alicent. So alicent is from a old house of non dragon riders, and prior to dragons they had some of most accomplished magic users. It was likely over use of magic, the dragon lords and a certain somebody using dark meteor magic that ruined them. Also purple eyes come from relation to amathyst empress
@@AshePBlack I can confirm, I created the dragons.
I saw Dracula from Castlevania and I thought "I mean... Belmont _is_ a House"
Whenever I see you making ASOIF content it makes my heart sore like an eagle on the Great plains of America
I really would have loved it, if GRRM had added Hydras to the story. Like maybe in Sothoryos or as Valyrian art work. I can just picture Balerion The Black Dread fighting a Hydra in the ruins of the Valyrian Freehold. That would be awesome!
I once heard a theory that when Euron does his Blood Sacrifice, he won't summon a Sea Dragon or a Kraken but, like the Old Valyrians, creates a chimera of the two and spawns a Hydra. That would be badass.
Many believe it was a massive fire Wyrm that attacked Balerion and Aerea Targaryen in Valyrian and the wounds that he received there actually killed him and not old age
I love how Westeros is likely the most boring setting of this world.
It makes me furious personally lol
Good ole’ colonization 👌🏾 she never fails
"hic sunt dracones": Asshai is the modern day Space Jockey a la the Alien franchise - sometimes the idea of something is more intriguing than what it actually is. It's the ultimate play on the JJ Abrams mystery box but taken to such a beautifully uneasy and supernatural extreme.
Personally speaking, I almost somewhat hope GRRM doesn't ever explore more of Asshai because it's truly up to us as readers and fans to believe what we want to, and the coolest part is: almost all of it can be true (or false) because of how little (but also ALOT) that we know about it. Asshai has got to be one of the coolest locations in ALL of fantasy lore, from the idea of figuring out whether it even existed, to the fact that SO much of the ASOIAF lore 'can' originate from Asshai, all the way to these diabolical creatures both confirmed and theorized - the feeling i get when reading about Asshai is truly unmatched, and I hope he lets this be something our imaginations can continue to infinitely theorize even after the series is over.
You’ve described this feeling perfectly ! We don’t need when you’ve given us just enough to let our imagination go on a rampage.
You need to read some Lovecraft. Asshai is pretty much lifted straight out of Lovecraftian lore. Also parallels Stygai nicely with the city of Pteion from Conan the Rebel, which is in the country of Stygia on the River Styx. Y'ghatan from the Malazan series, Shadar Logoth from Wheel of Time, or even real world tales of the Scholomance.
Point being, ancient lost cities destroyed through evil magic or evil rites are far from exclusive to GRRM.
@@fenixchief7 never said it was unique to this series lol! very aware of lovecraft and GRRM’s use of his tropes within ASOIAF, even with the deep ones and the black stone as well. Really clever uses but love how GRRM portrays it vs how Lovecraft kinda gives you everything to some extent
This and Valyria are my favorite places to hear about, I hope hbo really indulges us with a show where a character visits there
Euron greyjoy has and there's lots there and also the biggest empire ever in that area was empire of the dawn. Valeryia had a doom maybe this city went another way, azor ahai was from another area
Asshai, the lands beyond the Five Forts and it's relations to the Long Night always fascinates me! Were the White Walkers mistaken to be the Lion of the Night and it's demons?
The White Walkers bring the cold, and cold brings them. Asshai graphical depictions sometimes feature snow covered mountains. Unless there is an ice tundra beyond Asshai or Stygai, the WW aren't very likely, I think. Also, it wouldn't be as satisfying reveal if it's the same enemy we already know of. Well, what do I know anyway...
@@eraldylli but don't you think the white walkers are allegorical to climate change? Don't you think Valeria and Asshai existing only as ruined shells is a warning against nuclear proliferation? An author may have fun living in their fictional world but typically they have something to say about the real world via allegory.
@@qwopiretyu thats a bit of a stretch,to say asshai and valeyria are allegorical but what do i know
@@amogus1415 I mean I ain't read a book in years, I'm inferring a lot there to be sure.
I'm thinking not white walkers because literally every human civilization tries to take them down. It's an odd thing because every culture talks on a long night and not necessarily snow related. So we know the region azor ahai came out of. It was within the former empire of the dawn. Now if he's pre velaryian doom why's he fighting walkers? Earliest beings in westeros were also not man. The children made the night king, the nights king which is 13 commander comes long after him. I wonder if where azor ahai came from they still knew myths of great empire of the dawn because the lion and another being had the supposed first human ruler of the empire of the dawn, depending where azor ahai is on the timeline I'm not sure he'd want to fight the lion god because in his culture he's not a bad entity and yet azor ahai stopped some walkers and now everybody wants to be him, it's ingrained in Targaryen culture but azor ahai caused a long night, im only guessing he fought the walkers or he'd not be called a hero after what he did
It would be cool to hear that if the so called dragons living in asshai ended up being a hydra whose heads kept falling but resembled dragon head so much that people thought that the hydra head remains in asshai are the remains of dragons
Asshai probably isn’t what people think. George mirrors the real world with his books. Europeans thought that Africa was a far more mystical place than it actually was once upon a time. As they had only really had contact with Northern Africa and Ethiopia. I think it’s best not to take Asshai so literal.
In comparison with the amount of other stuff the characters don’t ‘take literal’ that ends up being literal I’d say until George says otherwise read it as literal .
@@Noshushpls George give an example he says the people in Yiti believe the Lannister’s are literally golden lions. Are they psychically golden lions? No obviously not plus his magic system has a lot of pseudo science that’s why he made his dragons have four limbs and not 6 so it could fit with life on the planet.
@@houseofmendoza5442 I’ve never heard of a dragon having 6 limbs so I don’t see your point also yes he does that from a writers perspective it’s very common to use metaphors to draw comparisons but story telling wise everything seems to be pretty on the nose
@@Noshushpls most dragons have 4 legs plus wings which are considered limbs George’s have to hind legs plus wings which is 4. So it very commons for dragons in mythology to have 6
@@houseofmendoza5442 all dragons have hind legs ?? They’re exactly the same he just doesn’t consider them limbs by what your telling me and I’m confused how him adapting mythological creatures to be more individual to his world for story telling has anything to do with whether he’s speaking in relative terms and metaphors or if he’s being literal
I simultaneously want more stories from the continents that aren't westeros, while kinda not wanting them. These areas are mysterious and interesting, but if martin ever decides to explain more about them, they'll lose the mystique that makes me want to know more
Exactly itt like a boundaries of the lore and story, we must not forget the main story is a song of ice and fire
Big up the castlevania thumbnail. A show absolutely EVERYONE should watch
My main theory about the Shadow Lands is that whatever happened there helped to cause the Long Night. The whole thing sounds like aftermath of a meteor strike. A pretty massive one that basically caused an mini ice age. A meteor strike can cause irradiation so that could’ve been what caused the poison river. Hell, it could’ve affected the mountainside and changed the shape of the landscape making those large mountains that block the sun from the city.
But, I’m veering into Lightbringer territory so I’ll shut up.
But you arnt far off, didn't he make vids discussing this and how euron wants to use the meteor again
Good work! And your passion for the topic is also great.
Having Castlevania on thumbnail and talking about Essos. Chad.
Something worse then a dragon that even people who can control shadows fear. I'm thinking it has to be humanoid maybe something made completely from shadows. Or maybe it has to be a type of wight we have fire wights, ice wights and would it be such a stretch to have shadow wights.
We have fire wights?
I’d be awesome to see a video in the areas further east and the city’s there. Like the Cities of the Bloodless Men and the City of Winged Men.
I love the idea of vampires in GoT my favorite genre in my heart 💜 you should write your own lore about this lore bro that would be dope
Amazing analysis and video as always your
What I fantastic video about one of the coolest place I’ve ever been described in a work of fiction.
A dragon is no slave.
The underrated chapters that I'm looking forward to in WoW is brans. Hes our best chance at learning more of westerosy History and the further east.
Stygai reminds me of Minas Morgul. Also an abandoned ghost city, poluted waterstream and haunted. (+ nazgul keep, so maybe it is smth similar occupying Stygai)
Yes!!!!!!
YESS! I’ve been waiting for more videos about the shadow lands
Dragon lords are the product of genetic manipulation probably the dragons themselves as well, so asshai could be the origin point of dragonlords in such they literally created them as a experiment/product which would explain why the birth problems within the bloodline
This location somehow is very intriguing.(like we have to learn the lesson from its history that maybe a key wisdom for a better future world or some sort)
I really wanna know a lot lot more but I just can't which fuels my curiosity even more.
I absolutely hope that TWOW will arrive and ADOS after that :c
love your vidsss!!!!!!!! specialy when its about the targaryens or shadow lands
We want an animated show about this place with Arya exploring it 👀
we do?
@@GlizzyGoblin757 yes, we do
@@mekasa6721 no we don't especially not Arya.
@@finalfrontier001 ok maybe not Arya but these places need to be explored
The floating black mass from beyond the wall
Polluted water is kinda normal but there's also the good ol Preston Jacobs theory about the world of ice and fire being an post apocalyptic world so if we're going by this theory then I'm gonna say that shadowlands might just be a nuclear plant that blew up resulting in the surrounding getting polluted and absolutely fucked also dragons might just be mutated lizards or something like that and demons might just be something humanoid that was mutated into a demon or it might just be myth
Post apocalyptic isn't really a theory since the Long Night was a factual apocalypse and the Doom was a cataclysm.
i swear how do you keep finding stuff to talk about in the series? i thought ik everyhting and then you spoil me with more content thank you bro i may have to read the books
I swear George uses "and worse things" to hint about white walkers, isn't that what was said about the white walkers beyond the wall.
And asshai gives me the creeps something about it just creeps me out
as to your question of natural toxic places:
YES. there are natural nuclear reactors, one such one was found in africa. some african countries were going to mine and sell ractor grade uranium until they found out all the correct isotope had already undergoe rapid nuclear decay. Heavy metals can naturally occur and make places toxic, but more often acid springs will create toxic gases and very acidic water. specialized fish can live in the water. most cave fish are known for being clear or bioluminecint and acid spring fish, even in sunlight, follow this trend. ghost grass is pure fiction., no plant grows in that like ness but is based on a reasonable plant. ghost grass is most likely a fungus or an sedinadary animal like a worm or pollop. being translucent has few advantages for a plant. I think deamons are heavily mutated reptaloids and authropods. I think the unnammed species is likely a mutated dragonfly that spews acid and is basically massive. (dragonflies are superube predators and are mostly limited by their intellegence and size)
David Lightbringers channel has a great, logical theory about how dragons could very well have originated in the Shadowlands and about an ancient people that had dragons and dragonstone. Check out his video titled The Great Empire of the Dawn part 1. I think you'd really like it. Also, I just wanted to say I am a new subscriber and I love your videos. Thank you!
love the content
So mystery 😮😊
The only GRRM Shadowland I was able to explore is The Shadow of the Erdtree. And there is flame god there too.
Worse than demons.....maybe it's the Nazgul
You can really see the Lovecraftian influences in lands of far Essos.
usually, unless a natural source is continually polluted (like sulfur from an active volcano and ash being released), water usually clears on its own with the exception of nuclear waste leaking into the source. if it's from an aquifer, and the aquifer is polluted, it's permanently tainted. i'd guess that something is happening in that city that continues to pollute...
@whycreate. You forgot about the Updogs.
I must resist... the urge... ah, fuck it!
Whats updog?
If the river ash runs from the mountains, i would assume something “evil” and toxic/poisonous would live in the mountains poisoning the surround area. A poisonous hydra with 7/9 heads does sound worse than a dragon. Its implied dragons were created as chimeras by asshai/valyrians. Its my head cannon that they created some massive hydra as a weapon (probably would be easier than dragons since large poisonous lizards exist not far to the south in sothoryos) but it turned against them, either that or it was set on them, poisoning the land so they had to flee to valyria, integrated with the locals to remove their names and from history (departed from the annuls) and thats why dragon riders have silver hair and amythest eyes, theyre descendants of the amethyst empress/her people either fleeing from the hydra or the bloodstone emperor. Where better to run to than a land of summer and fire to escape the long night/suffocating darkness of hydra poison
I think something akin to a mountain dwelling Cthulhu would be worse than any dragon. Plague spreading Nurgle like humans or unkillable shadow ghouls could also be worse than dragons.
GRR Martin need to write a story taking place in ASOIAF world but in a land far away with completely new characters and creatures.
Many many massive lakes, rivers streams near or connected to volcanoes are insanely toxic (low ph) where only few types of bacteria live in.
It’s very possible that the ground source of the river is polluted due to some underground geologic activity releasing minerals and or other toxic deposits into the water table
Me personally something far more ancient and horrific that can rival a dragon is probably something lovecraftian. Like I believe George has his own like Tolkien nameless things and watcher in the water, there must be some kind of creatures like that that has no name but horrifying to look at and far ancient and use cosmic magic that’s the only way I think who cma rival dragons and why shadowland people fear the corpse city and play the lovecraft creatures look like they smell of rotten flesh and sea stuff so I wouldn’t be suprise why it’s called the corpse city
Ghost Grass kind of sounds like White Walkers.
Children of the forest are creatures he created and I'd say white walkers but they are essentially just undead/wights
Maybe I imagined this but aren’t Daenaerys eggs from Dreamfyre?
It's not like they have nuclear reactors? Don't speak so fast - I don't disbelieve the post-apocalyptic theory of GoT.
Judging from the thumbnail, I thought this was going to be about Castlevania.
I always image the twisted fish as Joker fish.😅
you shuld work more in the endings, kinda felt like cut down. great work though!!
Knowing George, the Hydras' are gonna have seven heads.
What could be worse than dragons or demons in the Shadowlands? My bet's on the Jailer.
The other place in the stories rhat has mountains like that is beyond the wall and planets are spheres they say that Asshai is the end of the world just like how historically we thought there was a physical end and it didn’t go round in a loop but I think good chances are Asshai is just where the lands connects all the way back around AKA Asshai is connected to the lands north of the wall of Westeros (just a theory) also makes sense because they make it out like the WW are a bigger threat to everyone not just Westeros despite the fact they also say they can’t swim meaning there must be some way the land connects if the prophecy is accurate
I think the heart of the shadow is a celestial object. That destroyed the word and ended the Dawn Empire.
i just want winds to come out man
hey can you guys tell me what you guys think of this theory for bran in the show. idk maybe it doesn't make sense or its already a known theory or maybe im just to high
i was watching this Got rewind for benjen stark and i seen bran being his normal self and he told benjen that he doesnt know how to control it. referring to the three eye raven powers.
well that got me thinking, how can you even give your powers to someone else? is that something that is in the books. well hear me out what if blood raven isnt dead, or he died but somehow is spirit went into bran. sooo when bran finally learns to control his powers, he is basically giving bloodraven control of him like a warg. thats why hes this emotionless shell of his former self.
at the end of the series its bloodraven who says why do you think i came all this way.
Who was it that flew off on Balerion and disappeared for a good while. Then came back with creatures under her skin, and burning up to the point she was smoking? Maybe those are the things they speak of
I’m fine if the shadow lands never get fully explored. It should stay mysterious.
Nice
Danny’s dragons come from Elisa Farman I think is her name
Vampires or werewolves would be cool, even though both are far from the destructive power of a dragon.
a Hydra can be killed by fire. So I doubt it would be a challenge for any dragon.
Can u make a video of the city watch
7:53 😅😅😅
I’m going to say a lich is worse than a dragon.
vampires are likely in City of Bloodless many
... that's India, right?
The thumbnail confused me as if the video was about Castlevania
WC!!!
It probably mostly boils down to "hic sunt dracones", there be danger over there. It's unexplored and foreign. And the natives would generally benefit from their neighbors being afraid to set foot deeper into their lands.
Herodotus writes of a people of werewolves living in today's Ukraine and Carpathians. Of course there weren't any werewolves around there, but it's curious to note that all Slavic people (who most likely originate in these exact parts) have some kind of carnival rites where they dress into long furs and wear scary masks, most commonly used for rituals of welcoming spring and driving away evil spirits and just to note, this stuff persisted in the Balkans till today, despite Christianity. There have been multiple instances of these same peoples using such a garb and behavior to scare away potential invaders.
Allegedly there is an instance where Croatian people living around Mohács in today's Hungary drove away an invading Ottoman force by creeping into their midst under the cover of the night, wearing their ceremonial garb (horned willow masks painted with blood and fur garbs and cloaks) and scared the ever living life out of the Turks. After a short skirmish, the Turks fled for their lives.
Of course in an open battle and knowing they are fighting peasants the Turks would trample them, but in these circumstances they thought they were beset by demons and fled.
Who knows how many such events occurred. The older the word and the lesser the general knowledge, the easier it must have been to pull such a trick off.
Wait why is Castlevania’s Dracula on your thumbnail when they are two completely different universe
Two words; Fire Wyrms.
Are you going to be doing any Elden Ring lore?
Can a male shadow binders birth a shadow bady
Ima say whats worse than a fire breathing dragon would be zombies/undead like in the korean show kingdom or resident evil 😈 🤔
Makes me so mad he created this awesome world and proceeded to explore or explain almost none of it...
Vampires would be cool
Lady Danelle Lothston seems more or less like a direct reference to Countess Elizabeth Bathory, the supposed 'Vampyric' Hungarian blood countess. Hell, even the Lothston sigil is a bat. She was also said to practice the dark arts. So vampires might actually exist in this world.
Vampires were referenced in AWOIAF, so yeah.
Hell, even dinosaurs are said to exist in Sothoryos
Maybe not in the way we imagine as vamps. Hell, Martin makes every mythical creature somewhat realistically hideous. Maybe like a humanoid mosquito?
@@up5619 the idea of humaniod creatures is very common in his world. There are lizard men, winged men and his version of vampires are referred to as "bloodless" men.
@@shooshooshooshooshooter Makes much sense I guess. Eagerly waiting to see Martin's version of Vamps in his upcoming books!
Sea dragons aren't a myth. Naga the giant sea dragon is the one who's bones origin is doubted.
There's content in this world to make stories for thousands of years! Lol
Yet this guy can’t finish the main storyline
Demons probably are like balrogs
Netflix Dracula on the thumbnail no ?
The Shadow Lands.. still less frightening than my marriage
Sooooo we have Asian empires and possibly Egyptian type empires
Why not nuclear powered spaceships... Since we see The Terraformers Sigil twice in the show.... And the Steel Angels worship the same Pale Child Bakkalon. After the God On Earth returned to be with his people after 10,000 years, the children Broke the Pact and blew up the moon and attacked Kadath certain they could kill the humans with Floods and SQuishers. But the human, losing technology lost contact with their space brothers and the humans psychics are now trying to wage a war against the children.
This would explain the reason nothing lives up there. I think the HUmans ran from Kadath, using their dragons or spaceships to make the 5 forts with giants during the war, when they have been fighting for and against the children for thousands of years, retreated to the Shadow and they finally were attacked by the children detonating them, the Bloodstone Emperor was not insane for wanting to get information from space and from Stygia, which was the hold of the humans against the squishers the humans had no choice but to push into Asshai and take it with their weapons... This is where all the technology came and deteriorated Much like symbolically technology destroys nature it is a haven from the nature of the children.
Now, knowing the Children Lie and so do the Maesters, combined with the fact that human cannot advance and all the tech was stripped, the humans are being held down by the Children, and they have to lower their numbers and another moon explosion will help for 10k more years. The humans had fighter bloodlines, necromantic bloodlines and psychic bloodlines, Squisher Bloodlines... The Children have dream and warg bloodlines...
And there are at least 3 different hiveminds on this planet or trying to affect it... The Lord of light is likely Psychics from the Angels in space, Brynden Rivers is the almost summer king who Bran has to warn Jon about and then kill... HImself. Since Bran is Hodored by Brynden. They are tools of the Other..... The Other Hivemind... And the corrupted by humans hivemind that also may contain original Bran the builder... . And there is the Green Hivemind on the ISle of Faces.... And the Esso Ulthos Hivemind that could be controlled by yet another.... Perhaps the Mazemakers, who were using the darkness and mazes to bring about Dream and Psychic powers... This was important to them.
I wonder when it said "Early stories says Dragon roosted on the tower at Battle Isle"... Maybe they were not Dragons but ships.... The God Emperor had 10k years of Steel Angel reinforcement of the homeworld of the Hurangen/Children.... It was only after the main dude went away the Children attacked...