Waistcloth or WASTEcloth? - Did Version 2 actually fix anything? || PSO2 NGS
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- Опубліковано 5 вер 2024
- A bit before Version 2 released, I made a video about Phantasy Star Online 2: New Genesis reviving dead outfits with the "waistcloth" fix in the next major update. It's been almost a month since PSO2 NGS gave us the Waistcloth width slider, which is accessible through the salon & of course I've been testing how it effects all kinds of outfits! The change we got are... well... Let's talk about it in the video. lol
Was our big "W" a big "L" this time?
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💥Tags: #vtuber #pso2ngs #phantasystar #commentary #fashion #asmr #mmorpg #discussion #phantasystaronline2newgenesis #sega #2023 #version2
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I'm really happy it's in the game at all since from reading forum posts, it seemed like it was even a problem in base game. It's inclusion was one of the biggest things that could've happened when it came to fashion and it was one of the main things I was hype for when it came in the version 2 update. With that said, there's a decent amount of items that need either the waistcloth width slider to go much further or to get their collision detection reworked entirely.
Agreed!
yeah i did notice this too and I agree with you. honestly I'm glad that they acknowledged it at all, hopefully they can look into fixing it more in the future
i think what the slider does is it changes the physics of the skirt at the hip level. I wonder if maybe the reason they did that is because of the way they rig the clothes onto the character model. idk im just spitballing based on my experience with skyrim mods LOL
The root problem with layerwear and outfits is that the bulk of the designs use Japanese body types as a base along with it being showcased on default models( since global has a different min/max height limit w/o fashion) along with the technical debt inherited from base (like the weirdness associated with stomachs especially on wider bodies, etc), so the issues are more noticeable if you prefer playing with characters that don't use similar propotions.
Gotta love western censorship
Omg yess I'm disappointed too skulls!! One of the outfits I was really looking forward to wearing was the off shoulder knit sweater that is the ultimate lamp shade piece of outerwear in the game and if you have a curvy body type you can forget about wearing it and it looks like I still won't be able to and it's a shame because it's such a cute piece of attire 💔
So many cute layering wears sets that are basically unusable. >.<
I have quite a few looks in mind that I may never be able to do properly.
@Skulls Nightshade
I always felt the Dev model designers never plan for extreme body shape for their outfits. As petite, apple, inverted triangle sizes are commonly design to work characters the best.
If you have a size shape of brick, pear and hourglass; that is also uncommon in designed with NPCs and showcasing characters. Those shapes looks very off when et to extreme ends of the sliders.
This could be a culture thing between Japan and Western views on ideal body shape. Also we do know that Global character designer is slightly different than the Japanese version.
Lastly there more people using large character shapes on global for sure. As everyone above the normal average body shape in real-life.More people designs are taller and width to the far ends of slider.
My character is pretty much above average in shape wise... Yet, I see people taller and wider than me. That kind of mocking the character creation in a way as some Americans don't have a self-image view with their characters. Plus I think your never really told what is the normal size when creating a character for the first time. As more players are shock when they first meet our heroine that make some people want to redesign right away.
This was a very useful video. I never knew how to actually apply this change but even the changes are very ineffective for most flared-waist outfits.
On the last video about this I've commented that I hope they fix the core issue of the shelf/poof problem with ba's and ou's and not do a blanket workaround. It's mainly the waist area that causes it, especially with outers because for me, they are still unwearable. It seems like the slider mainly targets the thighs more than anything, which helps but can be better.
Yeah that was my fear as well. & It happened. For the outfits that I want to be able to wear it only effects 2 or 3 :(
I think it's more about how a cloth is rigged to the body. You can clearly see some cloth are made to fit the waist perfectly, and has some parts below it rigged to a different part of the body that'll just botch the whole thing.
Glad you bring this issue up, sadly feels like global feedback never reaches across the water. Hopefully Vocal jp customers are saying what we are saying.
Miness Lodia's skirt just went from an umbrella to a lampshade. Also it doesn't reduce Thousand Rim's Tassets as much as it should. Though even if it did Thousand Rim Tassets still have cloth physics despite being solid metals plates, this is something that someone at SEGA would have had to MANUALLY rig and apply to the outfit.
I think the reason the waistcloth feature doesn't act as well as it could is because outfits have to account for a variety of different body types. Considering that outfits anchor to the player character, when they make an outfit they have to account for this variety. Too small of a waistcloth diameter, and outfits don't flow off correctly and droop. Too large of a waistcloth diameter, then the outfit parachutes off the character. They could probably adjust the intensity of the Waistcloth Width slider in the future, but if its too intense it might have the unintended side effect of clipping or negatively affecting the outfit quality. Maybe newer outfits in the future will be designed around the waistcloth feature in mind and function better.
THANK YOU for saying something about this. When i went to the salon to try it and noticed how little of a difference it made.... bruh
The problem is they don’t consider thickness. The less curves on your T2 the better the outfits come out unfortunately
I got a skinny avatar, & the bloat is still there.
I've been screaming for more clothing alteration options for a bit and mention it everytime a survey surfaces. I prefer my digital "Barbie" dolls to be thicc and the clothes don agree. Was pumped when the slider was announced and then disappointed when it didn't really work out. I know they want to limit some of our control for degeneracy, but accessories alone make that a mute point. Still, blessed be this game just on character customization alone. Combat is fun too, but phashion, y'all.
Combat is fun, I LITERALLY have best in slot gear... but I will ALWAYS say that Fashion is the TRUE endgame XD
Im 61 in all gear, bis is too expensive for me at the moment. I've an addiction and the only remedy is more outfits and accessories...
Lmaoooo!! I was waiting for you to notice!! This shit is way worse now!! Looks like a damn umbrella ☂️
Yeah I was so disappointed that it didn't work like attended I hope they can fix is it keep up the good work
Need a slider for the waist band hoop and it needs to be size adjustable on at least 2 axes (X and Z) with possibly a Y position adjustment. Else my girls are stuck wearing skin tight outfits and swimsuits forever.
I think they should add two sliders, one in the crouch/inner thigh area? and the other more on the upper hip area; if that makes sense. I think it would fix a lot of skirts, long shirts or even jackets.
OOOh good point! Give us the option to adjust it in multiple spots. Maybe one day.
YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSS please say it louder for the people in the back!!!!!!!
I think a better solution is to add polygon adjustments that allows you to move from upper stomach down to the thighs. Just like how you can adjust the position and rotation of it in accessories. I believe it will be something like that in the future, or just allow us to let it completely clip through our body and that might be even better lol.
hello
@@xblaze20o93 hello!
I have that trouble with my male character and female character it’s annoying but hopefully they can fix it.
I’m not a fashion person but I like my character looking good.
Hopefully in a patch or update they can fix it.
That slider pretty much adjusts the width of the skirt around the lower hip area and has a noticeable effect on long skirts and jackets/coats, however as you point out the issue around the high hip area has not been solved but this is a definitely a change pointing on the right direction. Ideally they keep this slider as it is AND add the slider for the high hip area because you gotta use both in order to fix the rig on several base/outerwear pieces.
Problems: 1: model too wide (dat legs!!!), 2: waistcloth fix starts with the waist bone (physique), the waist adjust doesn't make any difference (the bell effect is because of that)
Solutions: 1:remodel with physics (coughfootsizetoocough) 2: perspective is gold, look your sides to model (believe me, it makes a world of difference) 3: petite models when rounded ticker looks better when you look the waist bone and widening shoulders are needed (optional) 4: have fun with the results (i give you this because this video makes me aware about that and my character looks more gorgeous now)
Keep the good work, ma'am. 😉
Yeah, it looks like the slider is just adjusting the skirt taper and not the actual waist. I appreciate hpw you adjusted the body shape to see if it helped, but I noticed you didn't adjust the character's thick thighs. I suspect that might be the cause of the lamp shade thing.
I should’ve included that in the video but I’ve played with the thigh slider too. Unfortunately with a large waist it’s not much of a difference 😤
@@SkullsNightshade Now I'm curious how that outfit looks on my slim character. I like how your channel focuses on the cosmetics of the game.
There's an outer that poofs out really badly. I was hoping the update would fix, but the slider does nothing. Would be nice if they put more effort into things like this.
I wasn't sad because they failed this "fix". I was because, it wasn't surprising.
I complain about this issue since day 1 and a lot of my characters have this problem, don't even need to max the size, it happens at 30% of scale. And that's why I avoid to buy skirts and dresses.
I'd like an improvement but even this fixes some of the stuff I wanted to use for a long time
Remember that simple cutesy dress from like literal 2nd ngs scratch? It actually looks good now!
Awesome! Good to hear you found one that works well! I really like the newer outfits, the slider helps ALOT.
After testing it with a dozen or so T1 outers & outfits it became obvious that the "waist" slider ONLY affects the tip of the material (no matter where it is), which gives a hook like shape. The real "poof" starts around the navel area for us, the model thinks my hip/butt is twice the size it actually is & pre-empts the curve.
Glad I'm not the only one who experienced this. I even submitted a ticket to see if I was going crazy. Here's the response from SEGA quote "Regarding the specific issue raised, please be aware that the effect of the [Waistcloth Width] setting may vary depending on various factors, including the selected Waist/Legs Selection, as well as the type of outfit being worn.
While we understand it is not perfect, we would like to assure you that the [Waistcloth Width] function is currently operating as intended." Guess SEGA wants us to make only petite little T2s...hmm, loli complex much lol? Oh well, I just hope they'll refine it abit it'll take a long time.
I can see the moving forward thinking on the outfits. This just calls for them to release new “Ver. 2 Spec Revival” tickets 😂
Oh no 😂
I thought it was just me tweaking when I was playing around with the slider a few days ago. It's the same for male characters too when it comes to long, draping outfits. It does nothing.
It seems like adjusting the body shape around the hip and thigh area does more than that slider in my opinion. If you like your women thick in the hip area, its not an option though. 😅
Yes, I've played around with T1 & the issue for the T1 players is Jackets, shirts, etc. I suppose we just have to work around it for now.
sigh. the new cute idle looks terrible with the expo tshirt :(
the arms just clip straight through the shirt, and i hoped this would fix it
Oh no. I feel that though. I like that shirt too but I don't want to change my proportions for that.
On my charcter its works kinda fine, i mean the problem zone that gets adjusted is most of the time right. I would just need more power to the slider like 180% to get better results. But at ur body that realy looks aweful. I think its made for japanese BMI :)
they basically have to go back and rework each individual asset. rework clothing sliders so they dont look terrible, make more ornaments optional, etc. most of the assets looks weird (dress physics) because the animations and models are literally copy pasted from base.
as we are so becoming used to with regards to segas "patching" stuff in NEG they simply didnt do a good enough job.
Yeah, I really would've more surprised if they actually fixed the problem. I'm not running around with a super thicc, max sliders character and its still problem. The only fix is to make Stick Stickly and that looks bad too
I thought i was the only one sees that...... I will be really glad if they repair that
Seriously. The modding community did a better job fixing outfits. Far as I can tell the issue is the zone in which the cloth touches the body part's collision zone. It can be adjusted, but can cause clipping, so for some items they would simply make that part of the body invisible as there would be no need as the part was covered by the cloth regardless. ( Edit: I believe the mfdb hoodie did this, have to log in later :p )
I can't really say how many items are effected by this issue but I know it's alot, but they really could do better, especially if the midding community can adjust and make items without this problem.
ive been waiting a million years to remove the kneepad ornaments from n-solis legs
Mnnn Im somewhat new to pso2 but I love the character customization In the phantasy star games last one I played religiously was phantasy star portable 1 and 2 and infinity I played those games so much 😅 best psp games ever
You will surprise how much peope can do in PSO2NGS.... some are not even human.
A more custom slider like the ones in the accessory settings would be better
Honestly looks like theyd have to change their procedural coding. The funny part is itd be easy, take a week or so but, itd be easy. If they changed the target mesh to the faces of the body surface, the dress would lay over the thighs normally, but if it isnt code? There's just a different weight paint for each outfit wich is AMAZING, if they considered thick characters... and they didnt, its too heavy on the thicker bodies and u can tell its procedurally generated because once u go thick, it auto maximizes and creates a sharp hook at the waist. So its easy, but they refuse to do it lmao.
Great job, devs, mission accomplished XD
This issue comes up when people use pretty extreme proportions with their body shape. If you has a wider waist, along with the wide hips, you would not need this slider. I understand that this is a videogame, and people should be able to play their phantasy, but it is undersandably difficult for game developers to make outfits that fit unrealistic body proportions.
I get where you're coming from, but nah. It's an issue with all bodytypes. For the most part it's noticed based on preference, but yeah it's an issue more often if you have wide hips but this effects even the little chopsticks.
Face it, everyone is now PLANET FATNESS LEVEL FAT, according to PSC - NGS Team. We are all Amerifats.
Phantasy Star Obese 😭
*sniff* I see how it is JP
Yeah so far it hadn't worked on the outfits I like sadly.
They need to remove the thigh, waist, and calf scaling or change it greatly. We know the clipping physics issues will be more severe on the old clothes. Like I said this affects “lighter” bodies that use the individual zones to add weight/curves.
I hoped it would be fixed because I've been trying to use this cape but it just sticks out at the bottom because my t1 don't miss leg day 😂
Thick
to say the ver 2 was dissapointing goes without saying everything from the dismal variation of monsters and battle areas to the crap creative spaces to the "fixes" and the horrible new augment of weapons and armor ... i just got my weapon to 70 yesterday cos im a causal player and its not easy to get those prims2s and you need a shit ton
Yeah, everyone expected different things. I'm not unhappy with most things in version 2 TBH. This video is focused on fashion, not the other aspects.
Lets take a DIIIIVEE
dont know why but the different horns the stance the outfit say milf skulls
PFFFT Alyx! 🤣🤣🤣
Why are you like this!? Also I felt like I gave off a "Who auntie dis?" type of vibe.
@@SkullsNightshade do you have a nephew name miles cause I feel like you be the aunt if we goin that route lol
Ah so it does exactly what I thought it does... only.. it doesn't work most of the time like all of SEGAs creations.
What is the outfit with the rips in it by the thighs?
🙏
I know what you mean because on guy outfits it makes them look like they got a big ass 😂.
Still too damn poofy, all of them lol. 😅
PAIN
indie dev pls understand
The entire point of the game has become fashion and they can't even get that right sometimes
Fuck no they didn’t fix shiiiiitttttttttt 😂😂
When this update came out I tested it with the miness lodia [se] and I was just glad it didn’t look so poofy on me.
Nice. I'm glad you found one that works for you! :D