Is the Indian Motorcycle 116 Engine Right For You?
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- Опубліковано 4 жов 2024
- The 116 engine is not at all the same beast as the Thunderstroke 111. The bike's character changes, and depending on what you're looking for from your Indian, it may or may not be for you.
I just bought my first Indian. I got the 2019 Indian Chieftain 111 because of your video. Thank you bud!
FOCUS MAN FOCUS!!!!!!!!!!!! Your all over the place with this video.
Just this video??? :)
Even I subscribed 5/10/19 great video man. Looking forward to seeing you at the shop soon. And the length of the video was fine you were explaining your experience with the bike and letting your followers know what you knew and how you felt.
I have the Rush slip-ons on my stage 2 Indian 111. When they (my Indian dealer) installed them, they replaced the header pipes with another with no catalytic converter. The bike is the best sounding v-twin I've ever heard. I even had my Harley friends compliment me on the awesome sound.
had my 111 up graded to 116 its now a high performance motor and has to be ridden like it is
Bring it to Rob’s dyno in
Gardner MA and get an ECU dyno tune to fix the off idle issue. The stalling is a fueling and throttle position issue.
A dyno tune is the better way to go with PCVX. When you have one of the best tuners in the country especially ecu/ecm tuning not far from you. Remote tuning is the second best option.
I was there at Rob"s Dyno today picking up my Vision got it tuned via PCVX and ecm tune. . I mentioned the issue and he said, Yup I fix allot of those.
Thanks for the review...I was feeling a little salty after buying my 2019 chieftain w the 111 and a few months later seeing the 116 offered stock. Not so much now. That stalling issue is the most alarming...hope you can get that sorted out with limited hassle. Thanks again...stay safe! (Don’t get me wrong I LOVE my bike and Indian Motorcycles in general...this is my 2nd)
I really appreciate your candor, because you are the only one I've found saying this about the 116. Keep up the good work.
My 116 pounds out low rpm torque.
It walks away from a stop in 2nd gear no problem.
There was a rod problem with the first big bore kits, they reused the stock rods. When tuners removed the factory red line there were rod failures.
Today all Big Bore Kits come with Carrillo Racing Rods that are bullet proof.
All issues are well taken care of with today's BBK 116, just hang on.
It’s not just your motorcycle that stalls. I added the 116 to my 2018 Chieftain Limited and as soon as I did, I noticed that it stalls out. It even caused me to drop it on a turn because it stalled on me. I was furious! I’ve gotten used to it by now, but I wasn’t happy at all after spending over $3000 to get it.
It needs a tune...
Robert Simmons
Tuner for sure.
The 111 ecm is also a learning device.
My dealer will run any of the bikes reflashed or that have had the battery disconnected a minimum of a hour stop light to stop light in city traffic.
I takes mine a couple of weeks to relearn if I just freeway ride.
Once it dials in its fine.
Hi Night cruiserMA
I just bought a 2019 indian chieftain darkhorse. (smoke bronze). I traded in my victory vision which I kept for nine years. I put reinhart pipes and lowers on the bike and it truly is a great bike . I watched your video (Sally's surprise) I really love this bike. Thanks again and again.
Hi Mark! Thanks very much! That's a beautiful bike! I just picked up my Ruby Red Metallic Chieftain Limited, and I was torn until the very last minute between that and the Smoke Bronze. Awesome choice. Thank you for watching!
I love that you get tickled at yourself. And it wasn't "negativity" it was truth. In my 2 demo rides , I had the exact same experiences! I stalled it at a light, it was abrupt and spotty, wide open or nothing. I could not successfully feather the clutch, it was too jumpy. tons of power but not usable for me. stage 1 or 2 with cams is as far as I would go on my 2017 RM. If I had a 2019 with ride modes , I don't think I would do anything.
I will get the 111 - spring/classic with the stage 3 , thanks for the insight , your assessment is on point
Thanks for your informed analysis. If I were going to buy a new Indian, preferring chrome for its long lasting beauty, I'd probably opt for the Springfield base and add the Stage 2 upgrade. It's about half the cost of the Stage 3 [116] upgrade and would yield a better bang for the buck. There's no denying the Chieftan looks awesome and has several amazing features, but the Springfield would cost about $5k less. That's important to me as I'm 74, retired and on a fixed income. If I could afford it though, I'd probably get the Chieftan Limited. It's just a gorgeous bike.
The reason the Thunderstroke 111 is desirable is because of its low rpm character and high torque output. It’s somewhat old school in that regard, like pre-war old school. It lopes along at 2000rpm better than almost anything. That’s really what Indian got right over either the HD TwinCam or the Milwaukee 8. On the other hand, the 116 is seemingly trying to compete with the M8 107/114 midrange rpm power. And the PowerPlus (Challenger) is just smashing the CVO and Screamin’ Eagle Stage IV engines.
I had the converter removed from my headers on my Stage 2 using Rush slip-ons. Sounds amazing.
Can you upload a video with ... Best wishes 👍
The bike's starting and clutch pull stall sounds like a tune issue. They should be able to remap it and help that out.
NightcruiserMA: Thanks for making this video. I just booked a 2020 Indian Springfield (Classic) and one of my most pressing decisions to make has been whether to upgrade to the 116. After watching your video, I have decided to keep the stock engine configuration.
I need an Indian 111, I don't need a 116
Awesome review as always. I appreciate that you always give pros and cons. I was thinking about this 116 but now I may hold off for a while, thanks to your honest review. Keep up the great work!
My 2014 Vintage was a 111, but the original owner put a 2stage by dealer., cams, air intake, .... I understand your points about the differences between a 111 and a motor with mods. Mine also tends to stall as in conditions that you described. As to smoothness at taking off from stop is very different, and vibration too as one should correctly expect. My friend had a 2017 Chief with no mods. Quietier, smoother, etc, etc. Personally I would not have spent the xtra bucks to do mods on the motor, since racing & competing with other riders is not my thing. On the plus side, I enjoy the heft of this full sized bike vs a Scout. And as for the new SuperChief, I prefer my bike well over the new so called Chief. Just my thoughts, my own experience.
in your video you stated that you had a problem with the bike stalling on you when you pull the cluth to downshift. you said it droped the RPM and stalled. i got a 2019 roadmaster with the 111 and it does the same. where you able to find the problem? i went to see my dealer but as usual, everytime you see your dealer, the car or bike works great. what was the problem with yours and what did you do to rectify it?
Stage 2 cams dropped the torque below 2000 rpm. It now hates riding below that. I miss lugging the engine man it sounded so good and felt strong before. Now it’s faster above 3000 rpm but that’s not what cruisers are all about. Kinda regret the upgrade. But planning on going with lloydz torque cams, the 558. Those should bring back the torque and then some
I picked up my 2018 Chieftain Dark Horse back in February of 2018. I had ridden the 111 and the 116 demos the dealer had and just told them to put a complete blacked out 116 on the bike and I'd pick it up in 2 weeks. I also had the bike upgraded with "Elite" items like passenger accommodation, upgraded floorboards and pegs, all Indian LED lights, and a flared windscreen. From that perspective the bike is absolutely beautiful. But from day one the bike ran terrible. Then I connected with a couple of guys on the forums who had their connecting rods come through the engine case. Soon after the "stop sale" and news came out about a redesign.
If your not going to get a proper tune on a 116, don't waste your time or money. The stock mapping and timing is complete trash. I waited until my bike was updated with the "fix" which included the beefier Carillo connecting rods and redesigned pistons. I knew I wanted to get the bike tuned and running right so I waited until Biketoberfest in Daytona since I knew most of the vendors would be there with their mobile dynos. I ended up going with Lloyd's/Indian of Charlotte who was setup there on the corner before you cross the bridge. I will tell you, those guys know what they are doing and set me up with a Dynojet PCVX and a completely custom tune for my bike. The result is 123 plus HP and 144 plus TQ. It is by far one of the strongest Indians I have heard of. It runs like a completely different bike. Gone are all the bad habits you mentioned in your video...except for the increased clutch pull obviously.
Look, there are lots of people out there selling snake oil for this bike. What I can tell you is my experience. The complete 116 kit (Stage 1 Intake, Stage 2 Exhaust, and Stage 3 BBK) is the perfect match for this bike when properly tuned. And a proper tune is the key. Before, I was like you, pluses and minuses of the 116. Now, I can't find a single bad thing about the 116. Like I said, unless your going to get a proper tune, don't waste your time on a 116. A proper tune in my opinion is a tune done specifically for your bike, not an off the shelf tune from someone else. These bikes will have so slight a differences that in order to get the most out you have to have a tune for YOUR bike. Is it expensive? Yes and no. My complete tune including a PCVX was around $800. It was money well spent.
Barrett Powell ... DAUMM that was FANTASTIC thank you for that info 👍👍
Barrett, thanks for the great info. Just to clarify, did you go to the Indian dealership in Charlotte and they installed the Lloyds PCVX for you?
@@vinniepeele8979 Yes. The Myrtle Beach and Charlotte Indian are apparently owned by the same group. They are also in partnership with Lloyds. They all had a mobile dyno unit setup down in Daytona at Biketoberfest and were doing installs and tunes. They installed the PCVX and did a custom dyno tune on the bike. They had the bike for about 3.5 hours.
For the record, I don't totally believe their dyno numbers though. It is about 10 HP and TQ higher than any other bike I've seen. I'm getting a dyno run locally in the next few weeks just to verify.
@@BarrettPowell Thanks Barrett for the info!
I have my 2017 Chieftain upgraded to 116 & the correction of the connecting rods done since November 2018 & I love it! It's true that the torque is ever so slightly lower than the 111 at takeoff, but it shines everywhere else. There is no throttle jerkiness anywhere. Wonderful smoothness. While the 111 motor is sufficient the 116 is worth the upgrade.
Open the valves for a longer period of time and add compression then flame outs can be a problem. Mapping can help sometimes. A little bit extra throttle with some clutch work will end your problem.
You bring up a lot of good points that also applies to the Harley M8 engines as well. The bigbore 114 and 117s are those higher RPM power engines, and they dont pull so much at low RPM, which is why I'm going with the 107 with an S&S 475cam, but skipping out on all the bigbore options. I want to keep that strong low end torque while pushing my high RPM power up a bit. Keeping 100ft lbs of torque at the rear wheel, the entire way up till 5000RPM sounds like a much more fun and useful motorcycle.
Always enjoyed your content. Haven’t heard from you for awhile …
Taking off in any gear other than 1st is lugging the engine, which can damage it.
I am not sure the engine size is really that important. This is just a marketing ploy to sell bikes. I know that it is the marketing department's job to market bikes but there is more to the feel and enjoyment of riding than a number on the side of the engine. For example Harley 96, Victory 100. Harley 103, Victory 106, Harley 107, Indian 111, Harley 114, Indian 116, Harley 117. It is just like the razor commercials, this one has 2 blades, mine has 3 blades, mine has 4 blades, this the best with 5 blades and so on. I think they believe we are idiots who will just buy the bike with the biggest number on the engine. What about power and torque, feel and sound, reliability and ease of servicing. These considerations are more important than a number. Someone who thinks that their bike is better than another one because the number on the side says 116 instead of 111 is missing the whole point of riding.
Interestingly, since I did a test ride before buying, I knew what the 116 felt like and it does in fact feel much stronger than the 111 over 2k rpm. It's not as much of a marketing ploy as much as it's something I feel is poorly implemented. Where you're right is that it doesn't matter for the style of riding that most Indian or Harley riders wants. I'll take the 111 all day for its smoothness and flexible power range.
I agree. I ride a 96 cube Harley 2 up all over and have no need for the biggest motors to have a great ride. If I go Indian, it'll be a 111.
Those engine upgrades like the higher rpm. So gun that shit and watch it throw you on your ass.
Ok already, get to the point.
My bike is a 2017 Chieftain, dressed up to be a Roadmaster.
I’ve had the 116 kit installed with Lloydz 585 cams, Lloydz stage two air box, Reinhardt slip ons. Bike was Dino tuned with tuner card installed. It peaks power at ~3000 rpm, very noticeable power, actually awesome power. My bike runs at 106 hp and 138 ftlbs of torque at the rear wheel. Did I need to do this, hell no!, but I’m an old motor head and it’s my excuse. The only noticeable thing is when the bike is not calling for throttle, say 30mph @ 2000rpm, coasting, it appears to stutter, not stall or miss, just a stutter. As soon as you give some throttle, it just picks up and goes.
Chickens hanging out at the end of a driveway, like a little chicken party. My friend you are hilarious.. my wife was cracking up listening to you while I'm watching your video.. It's like you have ADD. You keep going off subject.. it's funny. I learned some things in this video and I appreciate it.
Long winded but useful information. Thanks
Great review. I've got a 2022 SFDH that had the same issues with the engine cutting out. I replaced the battery in the key fob. Was that the same problem for you?
Get an aftermarket tune (such as one from the PCVX) and that will fix a lot of issues. If you have a warranty claim then you can always flash back to the factory tune.
Remap the bike with a PVCX from FuelMoto and the remote tuning
I have a 2014 Indian classic. I put the performance slip on exhaust, big sucker intake. Road the bike for a year. 10,000 km. Performance cams came out and I got them installed. Road with the performance cams for 2 years. Complained about stalling at lights, bucking at light cruise at 1600 rpm and the rattling noise was excessive. Wasn't able to get it fixed despite numerous dealership repair visits for those issues. I just recently removed my performance cams and had stock cams put back in to see if it was the performance cams causing issues. I have now verified that it was the performance cams causing the issues. To me the heads up on the rattling noise and the jerking at light cruise in lower gears might be a trade off for the performance. But the random stalling at lights and hard start is unacceptable. I now ride happily with the stock cams.
I have the indian stage 2 cams in my roadmaster and mine doesn't do that. All you had to do was get a PCVX and flash the bike and all the issues will go away
Great honest review thanks,I'm looking at a 18 chieftain and have been on the fence because of the 111. But your review helps a lot thanks. From moms also.
I think you should look at buying a dynjet PVCX, I have a Springfield with S&S filter and V&H pipes, the tune on that really brought the bike to life
Do you have the 116 as well?
@@NightcruiserMA No just a 111, however the 16 model was strangled by Indian to get it into Euro4 emissions and be able to sell upgrades, they now don't sell any performance upgrades here but have given us the full powered bike, having a pvcx allows you to put tunes on the bike that have been developed by 3rd parties, I'm currently running a dynojet one but also have the fuelmoto onrs available to me
Love Indian and I am still undecided on buying one. But there is no way I would drop big chingo on engine and "upgrades". That is the problem with US bikes. You pay top dollar for a substandard bike. (And that is by manufacturer standards folks) . It is the elephant in the room that nobody ever wants admit. You buy an Indian or HD and the first choice you have to make is between stage 1, 2 or 3. Why? Because your brand new bike will sound mediocre, and your performance will be just enough to legally get you down the road. You want your Indian (or HD) to be the best it can be off the showroom floor? Be prepared to drop $1000's of dollars above the price tag to make it so. On that Darkhorse.... You will be paying a ton of money just to get a passenger seat, backrest and pegs! People get angry at car dealerships adding $300 for mats. But when Indian and HD does it everyone thinks it some sort of bragging rights to spend money above and beyond to make their brand new bike "better". Why don't these US companies make the bikes "better" right out of the crate?
Thanks for being completely honest about the 116. It's only purpose is to upgrade ego's and increase your maintenance issues. Even the advertisement for the 116 is uncomfortabke to watch as it is literally two guys with a measuring tape.
PVCX with a proper tune like for example from CraigB from FuelMoto solves completely the issue meanwhile. Stock EPA mapping seems not to be the first choice.
I love my 111 stage 2. Thanks for another great review.
Hello Nightcruiser... Missed your vlogs. Do you no longer make them. Really enjoy them. Hope to see more of them again. Have a great Christmas and also New Year. Ride safe.
Another great video NightcruiserMA !! When can we expect another ?
Although I have mistakenly started off in 2nd a couple of times, I didn't know that you can do it, and it doesn't hurt the bike. I have a 2016 Chieftain (111).. I love it by the way
Thanks for the video. I ride a 2015 Indian Roadmaster with a 111, and I love it but have been thinking about upgrading it so I can have the ride command and what not. I am honestly not sure if I wan to stay with the Roadmaster or not, but I am seriously considering the new Indian Pursuit. By the way, I absolutely loved to go walking as a kid and tried to get my parents to go walking with me.
A loss of bottom end torque is always a trade off when you go to larger cams. The bigger cams move the power curve up in the rpm range of course with more power but should be understood
Years back I bought a brand new Victory. For 3 years I had problem after problem. Polaris didn't feel they needed to help with all the issues. It just scares me off from ever buying an Indian. I've never gone through all that with the Harleys that I've owned.
Thx for sharing-very helpful insight. I’ve never been interested in big-bore kits/addt’l power...just to have a bike at that level is a blessing so the 2019 Chieftain 111 would tickle me sufficiently. Ride safe & be well. PeaCe.
Just started watching your channel, really good reviews & very well produced. You're doing a great job , 10/10👍👍😎
Not sure about your low torque issue from a standstill. My buddy’s 116 leaves my M8 in the dust on takeoffs.
My 111 goes head to head with the M8 107 until we both hit 6th gear and my 111 just walks away from it. A lot of my HD friends were shocked that after a few miles I would catch up to the 114 M8 and walk away from it also. The 114 M8 is way more responsive on the bottom end but the 111's top end seems unmatched yet so far. I'm planning on doing the 116 upgrade to surprise the shit out of my buddies next season.
“I have a turbo but I don’t like turbos.” I’m done watching this video.
LOL! I know, I know, I know... but hear me out... it *almost* makes sense. I was lured toward a used 2014 Audi S8. Twin turbo S8 with 520 stock HP, now pushing 620 with a couple of mods. I mean, it's forgivable that it's a turbo.... 0-60 runs around 3.1 seconds.
Have you experienced glowing cylinder heads with this upgrade?
most people aren't stupid. we know where power will come on. you can choose different cams that will give you more torque. a performance upgrade is something that will be a bit different and most people are smart enough to know it wont run like a stocker.
I think that's true with almost any aftermarket add on. But when it is a kit that is built by the manufacturer and installed only by dealers, I think most people have different expectations.
Compression release valves help the starting issue
Aftermarket tuning will resolve the torque and power delivery fairly drastically. Stock Indian tuning leaves some to be desired. Yes, I own one that has gone through all the variations with this kit.
Why should you go aftermarket, void your warranty, on a product they designed. Harley makes tuners for their upgrades. They also have a smart auto tuner.
duane howard
A tuner has yet to void anyones warranty.
The 2 bikes that came apart with tuners and big bore kits received new engines with Carrillo rods.
Where do you guys come up with this crap?
Hey, thanks for the review. A couple questions...
1) What ride mode were you in? Does it make it less, "twitchy" if you go to Tour mode? When you say, "twitchy", do you mean the throttle is more sensitive and responsive to movement? If so, I would think, with more torque/HP, it's going to be more sensitive. I've heard the new 108 is super-sensitive, like a Scout on steroids. And, that's what I would expect for a drive-by-wire, water-cooled bike. My Scout responds instantly.
2) Did you have cylinder deactivation on? My SF 111 drops to nearly stalling when I have it activated, thought it's never stalled. It just drops from about 850 down to 800 RPM
Also, I'm sure you know this but for others not familiar with the 116, the production 116 is NOT the same engine as the 116 big bore kit for the 111. So, don't get the 116 kit and expect to have the same performance as the production engine. The production 116 has a smoother power curve and I think is more tame across the power curve whereas the 116 big bore kit seems to be kind of quirky. It has a sharper torque curve from what I can tell. I don't have one but the folks I know who have them seem to have to constantly hit the throttle, (like HD riders seem to do, non-stop every chance they get), to keep it, "cleared out" and running.
Anyway, thanks again. Nice riding where you're at. I'm from Michigan but I live in AZ and I miss the foliage, etc. of the Midwest/East. Safe riding.
Hi JustMe. Thanks for the questions. Although I would like to be more helpful, this was a 2018 bike. This was the first iteration of the 116 (it was a kit upgrade of the 111) and had some issues. The 2018 bikes did not have any sort of ride modes. That came with the 2019 models I believe. Thanks!
@@NightcruiserMA Ah, okay! I thought it was the new 2020 production 116! Then yes, I've heard much of the same that you were saying about the "kit". Twitchy, inconsistent torque curve, etc.
@@axslinger99 If I could have had a 2020 model when this video was released on October 23, 2018, I'd have had a lot more views... lol
@@NightcruiserMA Yea, didn't see that. LOL.
Hope you and Jo are doing well these winter months.
Let me save you all some time. The new bikes that come with the 116, it is not the same as getting the kit. The bikes dont come with the cam, the kit does. So new 116 stock is not as good as the upgrade kit.
Decent video though. People don't understand what it's like riding an Indian. They're awesome feeling. Ride safe.
Yes the stock 116 are just a bigger piston that is all no cams no tuning
Thanks for the video. I've been struggling with the decision. I'll probably stay with the 111 based on your video.
Thanks for the info, I'll stick with the 111 engine
This vid could have been four minutes long.
Could have been, but I would have had less fun making it.
Indian best of the best!!!!!This is my dream:)
Been researching these 116's, don't know if you got the stalling issue resolved, however I've ran into the same issue with my 113 Roadliner. I got a new battery installed and it solved the issue...no idea if it's that simple for you but good luck.
I just watched your video and I noticed you have the same issue that I have with the bike just cutting out randomly when you have the clutch disengaged when you are about to downshift! I thought I was the only person... I have a 2018 Indian Chieftain Classic and I only had the problem start after I got the stage 2 down at my dealership. I can't replicate the problem ever and the dealership could not replicate it either. The bike starts up quickly every time it happens but there is no rhyme or reason for the bike to stall. The only common thing is it's when I have the clutch disengaged and let the RPM's drop down and the rpm's fall and keep falling until the engine shuts off.
Sounds to me, I need an Indian Chieftain/Roadmaster 111
Great review. And good to know. I do not think a side hack will perform well with the 116. So something to think about. I wonder how the 19 mapping performs with the select a ride function.
Admittedly I'm a harley and buell guy, but I really enjoyed this video. Some of the symptoms you describe (hard starts, chugging down low, twitchy throttle) can be rectified with a good dyno tune and a decent flash tuner.
Slow speeds take it out of sport
Good video, as usual. What gloves do you wear?
I feel I'm just never gonna be able to go to Indian since I've owned my 2012 Victory Cross Country Tour. What I've seen on You Tube & Read is the power just drops off after 4,000 RPM and my Victory says please rev me to the moon. I'm normally shifting between 3 and 4 Grand but I can go all the way to 6 Grand if I want and I never down shift from 6th gear to pass on the Highway. Just don't think I could get used to it.
Is the 111 the same block as the 116 ? Or are they different engines ?
Do you have the reduced reach handlebars on this bike?
Hey @NightcruiserMA - Any thoughts on the 116 after a year (recorded spring 2018?)? It appears you were within the 500 mile break-in when you recorded this review. Missing your vlogs, hope you come back soon!
How much more horsepower and torque? What are the improvements in 0 to 60 and 1/4 mile times??? Is it a lot harder on fuel?
Thank you, just bought a 2020 chieftain thunder black basic model with the 111 which I love. I was thinking of going with the 116 kit but not now,,, whats the best slip on though. Thanks ,,,Jose.
Are you referring to a stage 2 or 3, what about just a stock engine? I was thinking stage 2. On a Indian Chief Dark Horse 116 Thunderstroke.
This was a stage 2. BUT, all of these issues are now resolved. When the 116 motor came out, it was only available though upgraded parts from Indian. They are now all built at the factory. I've ridden them and they are fantastic!
Hello NC... Where are you? Miss your videos. come on back!!! Hope all is well.
Those are all deal breakers!
Just found your channel. Dig the vid. I'm a new rider and motovlogger. Subbed ya.
I test road a Springfield dark horse and the 116 engine cut out on me first I thought I hit " N " but I had to restart the bike I was on a busy road freaked me out !
Thanks for this video. I know that my 13 Victory had that stall on downshift issue once in a while not anywhere near every day. When I had my remote tune done the ecm rewrite completely fixed that issue. Only happened on the throttle blip at slow ship downshifts where it likely wasn't even necessary to do that little rev speed matching, if that sounds similar to you maybe it's ECM issue?
Good video. What camera and mic system you using?
Hi Bob. This was done with a Sony X3000 and an external lav mic (can't remember the model.)
So with all the 116's negatives....do you ever actually use its extra power?
Well, I used it at the track, and it shined there, but that's not really comparable to street riding, which was the main purpose for the bike. I'd say no, generally.
Nightraid yourface soul. There are liquid cooled touring bikes. But the market shows people want air cooled V twins.
Not when you ride under 3,500 rpms
lol...I sure I heard you say in another 2018 summer video that Indian does make miss-step. What model year is this?? The 2019 has the different throttle modes, and wondering if this was the 2018 model.
A lot of the characteristic of how the engine responds depends on the cams.
I think Lloyds cams, not the hottest ones, are the ones that will wake up the bike and offer greater reliability than their hottest cams.
Lloyd's cams, engine timing, free flow air filter and a great exhaust will make a huge difference. I think they use something other than the P.C. 5
Here you go: The Runaway Performance Indian Motorcycle on Facebook.
We specialize in Indian performance parts and tuning!
Rylan Voss Indian
Engineers design motorcycle motors to be operated a certain way for a reason, that's why there is a first gear on the motorcycle. It is designed to be driven from a standing start in first gear, not second or any other gear for that matter....and the hard starting isn't due to "...mass of the pistons...", that doesn't even make sense, it's due to the mass of the crank.....good video though...
Did you have the pipes & air intake changed too? Doesn't sound like it.
Way more power with those additions.
Does your view points from this video still stand? I VERY recently picked up a 21 Goldwing base model and I like the bike but HATE HATE HATE the shifter placement with a passion. I highly suggest anyone getting a wing to get the dct. I miss Vtwin rumble (owned an MGX21) I am heavily debating getting an Indian and trading the wing
Nope. These were very, very early 116 kits. The 116's they make now are smooth running, great sounding, reliable v-twins. I'm really recommend them.
@@NightcruiserMA if you were in the market to buy a Cheiftain today would you fork over the extra 7K+ for a DH or limited or go with a 111 Base?
#1 the clutch pull shouldn't be affected by the 116 kit. Secondly you need a better exhaust system and a dyno tune, and I believe you would have a different opinion.
The clutch pull is affected because the 116 has stiffer clutch springs. As far as the exhaust, I did have my Rush slipons on there, and wanted my Rush headers on there, too, but the 116 has issues with aftermarket headers UNLESS you want a dyno tune, which I did not. The 111 is better suited for cruising down the road in my opinion.
Thanks, was unaware clutch springs were included. After you get header pipes, a dyno tune would help the drive ability Would love to see your results after doing so, just a thought;) Appreciate your videos and discussion. Happy trails, stay safe, and keep them coming.👍🏻
@@NightcruiserMA Why would you not want the dyno tune. If its going to solve the issues you are having and make the bike run better, it would make sense to get it done.
NightcruiserMA
Thank God for Mark Dobeck.
He designed most of the tuners on the market today as well as the dynos.
Some years ago he sold all the dynojet stuff and designed a new tuner.
It is called the Dobeck EJK and is rider tunable and has no need for a dyno.
That is his latest, $250 will set you up.
Indians hands are tied, they have to meet EPA guide lines so you can't change that.
That is why we have tuners today, it is really the only reason, believe me Indian could dial these engines in perfectly if their hands were not tied.
So ride a pos and cry or pony up $250 or more and love your bike, the choice is yours...
Don't be cheap.
I’m wondering how much that changed your fuel mileage
U r the best reviewer, I appreciate your honesty
In terms of handling did Indian improve chieftain model 2018 from 2015, or are they still the same?
Thank you, I appreciate it! I can't think of anything that would have changed the handling geometry from 2015 to 2018...
Zakariya Bokhamseen
How would you improve on perfect?
Nice video! The service manager at my indian dealer told me that if I put a tuner on and if something happens to my motor that they can tell by by hooking up there computer to my bike and see that I had a after market tuner ( which could void my warranty) and indian may not warranty it. I was also told that the ecu?? Is a learning computer that the more you ride it the better it will perform.
Depends on the tuner.
When you remove the Dobeck EJK, it is gone and there is no trace left anywhere.
Your dealer sounds pretty chicken s-it, I would go elsewhere.
No doubt your dealer does not have a dyno!
Go where they know motorcycles, no one will give you warranty problems.
It sounds like your Cam choice was poor for your style of riding. Also a different tune would cure most all your manners on the bike. Take the time and FIX the issues.
So after all this when are you getting the next bike? Factory 116 kits suck if that's what you got?Who tuned it? and if its the flash for the kit too bad its horrible. You can always do better after market. Do your self a favor, regardless of Maximus or PCVX, Get the dyno ecm tume. Next best is remote tune.
Can you take it back and have them remove the parts and make it a 111 again or does this bike come as a 116? Ride Safe
Really! You're complaining about the felt clutch pressure! You're obviously are a newbie. You need to ride an old Z1R with the old Barnes clutch kit with the red springs. Geez
Dang autocorrect, "Barnett" clutch kit.
@@bartgloriacruce4242 lol, during a review, I would try to verbalize anything I could. Here in comparing it to the 111 engine's clutch, which is lighter.
It sounds pretty cool...
On your 116 upgrade, does the rear cylinder still deactivate at highway speeds? I own a victory cross country now and it drinks the fuel. If so, can you notice a difference?
The MayorH It does not, but Indians did not have rear cylinder deactivation until the 2019 models 😊
Biker tip #1 lose the wrist watch! Lol
Why?
Get a Lloyds tunner on it, and it won't stall out.
Overly lean? Who knows? I wonder if you had an aftermarket dyno run?