Adoptive parents need to tell daughter ASAP, the moment they allowed the bio mom into her life without the daughter knowing was THE MOMENT they took away the daughter's choice to make her own decision whether to allow her bio mom in her life or not.
TBH I think they should have been honest about it from the beginning, since research shows that nearly always brings more healthy outcomes, but sooner is better than later.
I think the adoptive parent is just insecure and that's why they're withholding this info from the daughter. When that child grows up and she finds out that her birth mom was trying to reach out to her, she will be angry at the adoptive parents for not telling her sooner. Those adoptive parents seem to me like they don't know how to parent and don't understand how traumatic it will be for the child.
As an adopted child, the parents need to tell the child I say around maybe 4 or 5. This is just my opinion, but I feel that the longer you wait the more the child will resent you.
Yep. They needed to tell her as early as possible. They keep waiting and being selfish. The longer they do so, the more distrust she will have in them.
@@tylerj7298 also a transracial adoptee. But I like that I was told so early that I don’t even remember being told. It was just so normalized. That’s the way we thought everyone joined their families. My parents told me and my sibling about my cousin who was going to be born, and one of us said something about signing papers.
She wasn’t attacked. She acknowledged she had misused her words. It’s not fair to say that to dad’s can’t teach their daughter how to take care of themselves hygienically when puberty comes around. Once everyone made it clear that as long as there is a female figure around to help there, shouldn’t be any issue. It was simply the way she worded herself that was incorrect, and they moved on. She was not attacked.
I went to school with someone who found out her "aunt" was her mother when she was 18. It didn't go well. She didn't care that she had a fabulous childhood where all of needs and wants were met. It was that she wasn't told for so long that made her angry.
@@violetevergarden5160 Yes discovering that your lived reality is a lie and your aunt or your two-dad’s bestfriend is actually your mom at 18 (because the two dads for whatever reason are afraid to broach the conversation) is gonna be traumatizing and that lie is going to be on them. But ultimately that is the Dad’s decision to make the biological mom relinquished that power when she gave her daughter to them. Also who knows the daughter might reach out on her own to find out since it’s open…and when she realizes the phone number on the adoption documents is one already in her contacts it’s going to be a mess that The Dads have to clean up. Either way you slice it, it’s gonna be a mess but it’ll be worse the longer the Dad’s put it off.
And if it's bc of the dads preventing and not the mother not wanting to be involved, I'd figure the child would be more resentful to the fathers for not letting that relationship happen. Don't agree with Erik's point of the fathers' trust being affected. Telling the child the truth would prevent that, not brushing off the mother
@@BecauseIWannaComment that’s true but we still don’t know the reason why she put her up in the first place, maybe the other parents have a reason to avoid her rn 🤷♂️ we only got to hear her side🌚
@@user-sy5bj5nd6x I'm not saying they aren't justified, but if it was in the adoption clause and she already sees the daughter consistently now I doubt she's seen as that bad of an influence to tell her. Either way I'm moreso saying the argument that it would negatively affect her trusting the fathers seems like it could be avoided by them just telling her
@@BecauseIWannaComment Yeah I agree. The child should be told sooner rather than later and all 3 adults should be present. Lmao imagine if the kid grows up and watches this video 😂😂
@@idrk3707 naturally they would it’s not a matter of should or shouldn’t. Just like women don’t know everything men deal with it’s more so a matter of personal experience than general knowledge. It doesn’t mean men don’t have a general understanding but it means there are things women know from personal experience that’s not necessarily generally discussed
Depends on their education. That's a broad generalization that you're making. I would, for example, be certain that a male gynaecologist would have better knowledge of female-specific anatomy than 99.99% of women who are not gynaecologists themselves. Even if they are nurses or read some medical/anatomy and physiology texts they would be better educated in that area than most women are.
Gay couples often can lean on other women in their family or friend circle for such matters. It was clarified later as well. It was pointed out as problematic because such arguments are used against adoption by gay parents often.
I agree the parents should tell her themselves but I also think they shouldn’t wait too long. The longer they wait, the more that little girl might feel betrayed when they tell her. They should give a clear timeline to the birth mom of when they’re gonna tell their daughter.
Are you kidding lol. I don’t care who you are, whether you’re a doctor, or gay father, or grew up in a house with sisters - learning about your body autonomy from someone who has real lived experiences is different. I have a cousin who was adopted to gay men, and she came to my mom for help with puberty-related advice,,, same with one of my friends.
thank you!! Like no amount of reading books, hosting interviews or female companionship can replace gender-specific experiences. I don't even know why that girl suggested that a male person can supplement their parental position for lived experience.
Either way, gay or not, I don't feel comfortable with a non-biological father tryna teach a girl about her hoo-haa. It's weird enough with a biological father ...so imagine this. The world is too scared of being cancelled that they'll risk kids
exactly, the daughter will need someone who experiences the same so they can relate and talk more comfortably about it, and actually give advice from an womans pov
As someone who found out they were adopted at 18, and whose birth mother was apparently around for most of my life, please tell your children where they came from. You can be scared of losing love or respect from your adopted child, but you will lose so much more if you keep up a lie for that long. Don’t make the same mistakes as many other parents, tell your kids when they’re adopted.
The fact that the girl already knows this woman and sees her frequently changes everything. The parents need to tell her that this woman is really her mother and as soon as possible but only the parents can do that because if she or someone else does it, the child can really have trust issues with her dads. If she didn't know her birth mother in the first place, it would be easier to accept the fact she's adopted cause the mother is unknown and the birth father aswell, she has 2 loving dads and there is no problem. But she knows the mother so the dads have to tell her
As someone who was raised by gay dad's and is queer myself it isnt problematic to point out that cis gay men don't know about the experience of having a period etc... it is a real thing I faced growing up dealing with things my gay dad's just didn't get or understand because they don't have a uterus or ovaries .... it's real it doesnt make them bad parents it's just a real experience that does happen. It's not homophobic to point that out. It is however not a validation for the mother to be a better parent. Nor is it any different from a single dad raising his daughter who might go through the same thing.... She made a choice to give her up it should be up to the adoptive parents and the child when she's ready.
Thank you for sharing your experience & perspective. -How long do you think she should wait, when the couple isn’t giving any context after 11 years of waiting on this matter, that was contingent to them even adopting her? As in, had they not agreed, they wouldn’t have this child at all?
@@cassie-jj2ur there’s transgender and cisgender. Cisgender is you are born as the gender you identify yourself as. Like a girl who is born with body anatomy associated with girls and women.
I wouldn’t really say that it is FULLY just about the dads, but it is a big part of the issue. Losing trust towards the parents that took you in is detrimental to the family itself.
i agree , the kid should be first , but the fact that it impacts that dads will directly impact the kid. if paige told her daughter without the dads’ permission, there’s a chance that they’d be pissed off and not let the daughter see paige. and like erik said, it could potentially have the daughter lose a lot of trust in her parents for not telling her earlier. that’s not really about how her dads would feel - feeling like you can’t trust your parents when you’re only 11 is Terrifying
@@anjunxis Well honestly the longer the Dads push away the birth mother, the worse it will be for the child. She will be resentful that they lied to her for so long when her biological mom was in her life for many years and she didn’t know. Since Paige said she’s planned it with them many times but they fell through, I think the fathers are scared their daughter will lose trust in them. It’s best for all the adults to be present and tell the kid as soon as possible.
The only frustrating part coming from the people on the no side was they kept acting like she was wanting to just tell her daughter without the permission of the two dads when she specifically said that she wouldn't tell her without their permission.
@@sydneyrobinson7022 The fact that her daughter knows about her mom doesn't mean she is gonna become her mom, cause she gave her up, dads wouldn't want it probably
I cannot believe so many people were on team “no”. Her being young is better. If they kept that secret from me for 18 years and then had my mom IN MY LIFE the whole time but didn’t know she was my mom, I’d never forgive anyone.
I think they were on team no because they wanted the "parents" to either tell her first or maybe tell all together. It's a touchy subject thinking about this woman that I grew up with is my mother and not once did the parents that raised me say a word. Think the no's are of the thought of how it should be done not that it shouldn't be done.
Girl it is not at all problematic to say that a gay couple doesn’t know about periods and women’s issues. They haven’t experienced what women have. Stop trying to be PC
There are many mothers who never explain periods to their child. Facts is most female I know only learned about periods through school or online. Any parents has the ability to educate on periods no matter their sex. Any parent has the ability to neglect teaching a child about puberty. You do not need to experience something to be able to educate your child on it.
I don't know why you guys think periods have to do anything with this 💀 she's not her mom anymore she gave her up 11 years ago and she's asking wether she should tell her that she gave birth to her, even if she told her she wouldn't become her mom and guide her through puberty, the child still has parents and she's not one of them, she gave that up.
Saying that her comment about female puberty was problematic… a bit of a stretch. Of course someone with female anatomy can commiserate and explain these changes in a different way. Be real.
@@pov2799 yeah, they completely shut down her reasonable line of thought. They also made her feel bad which was really uncalled for. She was not trying to be hurtful at all.
Yeah, in most cases men can’t explain women’s puberty from lived experiences. However, it doesn’t mean they can’t effectively help their growing daughter. It’s condescending, if anything, to assume that they haven’t researched or learned anything before going into it. I’m not sure what’s problematic specifically, so if anyone could explain why that’d be great.
@@krust9976 I don’t think anyone doubts that they will be well researched and try to help, but research has nothing on lived experience. Nothing can replace the knowledge of living with female anatomy and having been through 100s of menstrual cycles. Not acknowledging that is just ignorant
Her parents should tell her ASAP. Never lie to an adopted child. That sends the message there is something wrong or bad about their adoption. Why else would you have to lie?
Bruh they are two men, she’s gonna figure it out anyways , it’s not lying if it’s out in the open. It’s not like they can keep this secret forever like heterosexual family adopting a kid from the same race. Some of you donkeys really lack common sense, it’s borderline astounding.
How is that problematic? There are many anatomical and physiological differences between men & women. I completely understand what Leesie is saying. By the same token, I do not doubt in my mind that two men couldn't help navigate their daughter in that phase of their life. It's just a little different, as men do not experience what we do.
I think it’s problematic because men are capable of teaching their daughters about female anatomy and buying period products and such. There are also so many women who fail to teach their girls about their own bodies, so it really doesn’t have to do with gender so much as wether or not you teach your kids something so important.
@@jcam5064 I was never taught anything by my traditional parents. I had to learn everything on my own by experience or the internet. I believe two cis men can handle a daughter as long as they make sure they know what they are doing. And if there is a trans guy involved, then there is that as well.
@@jcam5064 There’s a difference between being an actual pilot and researching how to fly a plane and how planes work. The fathers can certainly help but they don’t have the same lived experiences as a young girl going through puberty.
@@jcam5064 There’s a difference between knowing period products and female anatomy and actual dealing with a period and knowing how it feels like. I have no doubt that her fathers will research and teach her what they know. The main problem is that during puberty, kids want to know that they’re normal and that they’re not the only ones going through this. There are so many things involved in women’s cycles besides periods, like mood swings, cramps, and other body and mood changes. While her dads can definitely teach the technical aspects, I believe the girl needs female figures in her life who can share her experiences and emphasize with her.
It wasn't fair to the girl that got attacked for saying something like "the dads won't know how to help with periods". Like she didn't mean in a mean way?! It's just facts? Like yes they ca research and everything but like they haven't put up a tampon up their v@gine and don't know how it feels and how to do it? That does not mean she NEEDS a mother to help but it just wasn't a big deal to be attacked over by the other girl (in red jacket). It was so out of line and RUDE
this ^ she wasn't even being remotely nasty or underhanded about it. u can do all the research u want - there are things in LIFE (not just this circumstance) u will never TRULY 1000% understand n relate to unless u experience them. that's just fact. i can research pps all i want - i still won't understand/ know what it's like to have my genitals extend beyond the inside of my body lmao. thinking u can COMPLETELY wholeheartedly understand something u are limited to observing and researching as if u have personally experienced it (when you literally can't and never will) is unrealistic n kinda arrogant imo
That wasn’t an attack at all. They had a respectful convo. And I think the “cut off” was to keep Leesie from going too far in a statement that could be seen as offensive, to keep her from really getting attacked in these comments
This is a conversation that the adoptive parents need to be a big part of, not to mention I would highly recommend a child therapist help guide the conversation. This could cause the child to have a lot of pain if it is not expressed properly. Edit: I just want to add that the agreement she has for an open adoption (them telling the child who she is) is most likely not legally binding.
I'm sorry, but the parents don't get priority, biological or adoptive. This is about the kid. They didn't ask to be adopted. This kid needs to be told regardless of if the dads are ready for it, because it's not about them. It's about their daughter. There's a reason everyone agreed that if she found out from someone else she would lose trust in the dads. because by not telling her, that is BREAKING trust.
I 100% agree with this and was going to comment it myself. If the adoption parents are willing to have the mom close enough to the child, they should be willing to explain to the child who she is. Seeing as it's 2 fathers, the child will eventually start asking questions and by that time, finding out the woman that was so close to her is the mother, would probably hurt and confuse the child even more. It's not about how the adoptive parents feel anymore, it's literally about the child and how that news will affect her growing up.
@@catalinarossi the gay dude literally said it’d be better to tell her now than to wait until she was say 18, but that it should come from the parents and not Paige
@@catalinarossi Why? They suggested to wait until the adoptive parents cooperate, and that is the healthiest way. For the adoptive parents to have a proper conversation about it and to introduce her in a proper way. That's how it should be. If in any circumstances you think the bio mom should just scare the child by saying hey I'm your mom out of nowhere then I feel sorry for your thinking process.
@@jhsemoxitha3821 I feel sorry for your thinking process if you think the child will be all accepting and brush it off easily when she finds out at a oIder age. Just scroll up to the most liked comments and you’ll see most people including many adoptees agree the daughter should know now. The younger you tell them the easier they are to adapt to the new information, again take it from someone with a adopted autistic cousin and from common sense overall.
It shows that present-day adoption politics, especially when gay parents are involved, have mostly to do with what these adults selfishly want for themselves instead of what eventually works for the kids' benefits.
Because many adoptive parents get kids to feel like parents instead of actually caring about the child. And when the real parent is introduced they feel intimidated. Adoption industry is gross. Its like they just want to buy kids and not care.
Idk why that women telling the girl what she said was “problematic” irritated me so much. Women obviously know more about the female anatomy than men, it was just a fact.
Erik is only empathizing with the parents bc they’re gay like him. He doesn’t think about the daughter. He just wants the parents’ power over their daughter’s life to be protected. Knowing where you come from will never hurt you. It’ll only push you forward in life.
So what? If they didn’t have that discussion, it’s because the child didnt really care enough to ask, besides, she’s gonna find out about reproduction soon and question about it eventually. It’s not like it’s something you can hide like heterosexual parents who adopt a child with the similar race.
Many many of the gay couples who have kids through surrogacy are like this. They don't want to have to face the reality that they need to include someone else in the kids life at all
I disagree with you, I'm sure he was thinking of the daughter. He was just worried she wouldn't trust her parents anymore if they weren't the ones to tell her (it would seem like they tried hiding it). Think of how the daughter's life would be impacted if her relationship with her adoptive parents is strained.
@@fark69an egg donor isn’t a mother and has no rights. So what other people need to be included? A lot of times you don’t know who the egg donor is just a description of them
i agree. he was also extremely bias tho. he seemed like he was more concerned with the dads reserving the power & trust that comes with the title of “parental guardian” than he was with what would be better for the daughter in the long run. even after being presented with the fact that the child has been questioning and the dads keep “planning” to tell her and renigging all he could do was talk about not wanting them to lose trust.
I feel like there's a factor that nobody took into account but that I think is important: What kind of relationship does he have with her daughter? She said that they knew each other and saw her frequently, so, is she her teacher? Her nanny?. I feel like this really matters and if the child sees her as a role model, then I feel like it would be appropriate and even helpful to tell her while she is young.
The guy kept saying "it's the parent decision and not once spoke of how the child will feel and her/his decisions " then projecting his own feelings on the child by knowing her own mother
Omg the centering of the parents in this situation is so damn frustrating to hear as an adoptee. The child’s needs are what matter. This should be her choice.
Adoption perspective is commonly like that unfortunately. I got you because I wanted a kid and couldn't have a biological one, you should be grateful I gave you a better life, you need to love me and not ask about your biological family 😔
As an adoptive parent and as someone who listens to adoptee voices. The best thing to do is to let your adopted child know the truth. They deserve it, it's their life. This question should be for adoptees
Can I ask what is the perfect age to tell them ? It's my birthday today and I'm nineteen. I have not been adopted but I learned three weeks ago by my mother that my dad, whom I grew up with since the day I was born, isn't my biological one. i don't know how to feel and my mother told me about her doubts of when to tell me, and I don't even know when could have been the best time myself...
@@brucebanksshow not exactly. the underlying issue in both scenarios is the child not knowing where they come from. the ethical dilemma is concerning when to tell the child that you know where they come from/don't know where they come from.
The aggression thr woman got about the period question was unnecessary. You can have a difference of opinion without raising your voice and making the woman feel small. I don't believe it was a problematic question by the way. It's unfortunate that she got shut down instead of having a calm discussion or a calm debate.
YES!! she kept talking over and made the girl feel like she's putting people down. All she was trying to say is that men physically don't know what things like periods feel like, etc.
Yeah she has stated that she only didnt press it more because she knew people would despise her and attack her for it, so it wasn't worth the argument.
i don’t think it’s problematic to point out that there is an obvious biological difference that any male of any sexuality has between any female. like, obviously they’re not gonna 100% know what it feels like to have a uterus or female body parts, just like a female doesn’t know what it feels like to be a male 100%.
I’m in the middle here, 1 thing is that your child deserves to know who her real mother is but at the same time it could end in a big mental struggle and overthinking for the kid
Will definitely get worse as she gets older though. It's all dependant on the two fathers but it isn't fair for them to say they'll tell the daughter, but then not tell the daughter. One could argue they're not ready, but if that's the case why not communicate it? Instead of avoiding.
If she finds out when she is older she will feel very betrayed by her fathers. Especially considering they introduced the bio mom already without telling her. It is the father’s responsibility to keep that from happening.
It's odd to me that the dads chose to allow the mom to be involved in their daughter's life in some way while simultaneously not telling their daughter who she is. I think the dads are creating a situation that will make their daughter feel betrayed for keeping this information from her. I think the dads need to tell their daughter who the woman that she sees actually is.
Oh no. I really had hope at the beginning, but after reaching the end of the video, im afraid she felt swayed into not telling her which is the most HORRIBLE decision 😩
i quite literally have gone through this exact same situation myself. i was adopted as a baby. my birth mother is my aunt. i grew up around her, being told that my brothers were my cousins. i finally asked who my birth parents were last year when i was 20. it was life changing. tell her as soon as you can. i just wish i was told when i was that young. so much hurt has built up for too long
SPOILER Honestly I agree with both, obviously the adopted dads should tell their daughter first out of respect because she would want it to come from them first because of that trust they should have. However if the bio mom has been in her circle for a while and if her birth daughter doesn't know, I think if everyone waits to tell her the truth, she would probably be weirded out and wouldn't trust anyone anymore, why wait until she's older, 11 year olds are very intelligent, it's not about the parents, it's about their daughter and kids are very curious. She's gonna find out one way or another
While I agree that a child should have a same sex parent for any bathroom issues that may arise, I don't believe anyone has all the information on something just because they experience it. We need to ask for outside points of view to get the whole picture on anything!
@@mollykins8h yes but women still have more knowledge cuz they actually experience it. It’s more easier to relate to people who gone through the same thing and have the same symptoms as you
it is problematic and they explained why, yeah obviously..but gay couples likely have family members who are women and have menstrual cycles and went through puberty. acting like she won't have access to that information just because she has two dads is disingenuous
Every child deserves to know who their parents are. I think all adoptions should be open adoptions. And ideally they know from a young age so they don't feel conflicted later in their identity.
Not every....In fact a kid is way better without knowing ever that he was abandoned under any circumstances. I fell like it's cruelty and child abuse in disguised.
Maybe because the mother will be known in this case... but children who are adopted and know from the beginning can get very, very confused, stressed, anxious and full of mixed feelings based on the unknown... it's hard for children to process all this and they also have intuition that affects them... i agree that open adoption should be important... but it's such a difficult topic really.
Lying and deception will never end well. She should sit the girl down and say "now that you're getting to this age, I need to tell you something". Whatever happens after that happens but at least the little girl will have a full context to make of it what she wants to.
tell her before it’s too late and she feels like you’ve hidden yourself from her, appearing as a different person but still appearing in her life isn’t fair.
She already knows she’s adopted. I think the parents (adoptive) should ask her if she is interested in meeting her biological parent. Not every adopted child wants to. It would be a different story is she didn’t even know she’s adopted but I expect her to be aware of that. I do question having the bio mother in her life if they weren’t gonna make it clear from the start. The child is older now and I think it should be her decision if or when.
For real. Regardless of any decision, the situation this child is in by having her biological mother in her life under the pretense that she’s someone else is awful.
@@Ali-ru9vx I get that, but it’s possible for her friends to find it and connect the dots based on her “Aunty Paige’s” name and the situation described in the video. Idk kids are very conniving and resourceful🤷🏾♂️ so it could be a possibility
I wouldn't be surprised of the daughter already suspects her to the mom and she just wants confirmation. 11 year olds can definitely put the pieces together easily if given enough context. I think it's better for the child to know sooner since she's already asking. It's going to be a hard transition no matter how they dice it but with therapy and strong adults around her to help her through, she'll have a larger chance of coming out okay than the truth literally staring her in her face and everyone avoids it.
She should definitely tell her as early as possible. Obviously, with two dads, she knows she has a mother somewhere. It doesn't need to be lied about by omission.
She need to demand it to be told. As someone who grew up around lies, I’ve learned to trust no one. You are there for you, everyone else has other motives
Adoption is very necessary, but children deserve to know who their biological parents are from the very beginning. The adoptive parents should not be the main concern here, the child should be.
@@harrisonfreund7845 I think that it's important to remember that adoption is widely considered to be inherently traumatic. There are ways of explaining tough situations to children without putting them in danger. I'd also like to add that vulnerable children often turn into vulnerable adults, so if a child is deemed too vulnerable to know about their biological heritage, I'd definitely argue that them going off and finding their bio family at 18 with zero time for information to settle is going to put them in danger. Protecting children by lying to them, withholding important information, and taking away their autonomy is quite a risky move in the long run. Also, the kind of situations you're talking about are very much not the norm. Children who come from truly, truly awful bio family's are often permnently removed from the home and from their bio parents long after birth, and are therefore definitely entitled to hear a sensitive, appropriate, and accurate account of why they were placed up for adoption.
@@harrisonfreund7845 I understand where you're coming from, and ultimately I do think that adoptive families should have access to mental health professionals and qualified social workers so that they can make informed family choices which cause minimal harm. I just cannot think of many circumstances in which it would be okay to withhold key information about a child's heritage, regardless of how ready they appear. Especially as the adoptee in this video is 11, an age in which young people are learning about themselves and rapidly developing a more mature sense of self, I think it's important that the kid knows everything there is to know about themselves and where they come from so that their identity doesn't suddenly come crumbling down later in life. Children are much more capable than we give then credit for, and they're more able to adapt to new situations and information than many adults. I don't think there are many groups of people more able to cope with big revelations than children, so I don't see how delaying the kids knowledge about her bio family would benefit her in any way
I'll be honest, watching this video upset me a little. Although the circumstances weren't even slightly identical to this one, having the option to say yes or no still felt extremely great. I was once asked whether I wanted to be adopted but I chose to decline. I recognize that this is a sensitive matter for non-bio parents, however, the child's feelings are something that is frequently disregarded. Whether or not you are their biological parent, your child will always be your child, but whether you like it or not, they still have a different parent. The reason why the foster care and adoption systems are so flawed is that these kids are misled about their early lives and treated like interchangeable items in these systems.
Hidden truths are unspoken lies. The fathers need to step up, because the longer they wait, the more she'll resent them and seek the birth mother. This isn't hurting anyone but the daughter. She should've known all along if she still has a relationship with the birth mother. They might've felt less worthy to have their daughter know all along, I don't know their thought process, but truth & openness always prevails.
I had a friend who didn’t know her aunt was actually her mother, my friend found out about this when she was 21. I think if she found out sooner, it would have been better for their relationship. They unfortunately don’t have a relationship and she Greatly dislikes, her aunt/mother for not knowing for her whole life.
the way they misinterpreted her entire purpose of being there, as if she was going to go around the dads back to tell a daughter she quite literally birthed of her own parentage, is infuriating me rn
agreed! it was important to find people who are both eloquent AND have life experiences that are relevant to the episode. it's hard to find that, but jubilee really struck gold with the casting of this ep.
You should absolutely tell them, just don’t expect anything. You gave them up for whatever the reason was so it’s now their decision if they choose to accept you. But you should absolutely inform them because imagine going through life not knowing where you belong.
they're going to distrust them anyway ... so many people are emotionally immature, it drives me crazy. the dads already waited too long if this isn't the first time she's asked who her mom is.
The second she says she want to know who her biological mother is, they should reveal all information they have. Being that she’s been in the child’s life for what’s most likely years..it should have been revealed when she entered the child’s life. If she wasn’t already in the child’s life it would be a different story.
I think what wasn't highlighted enough in this conversation was the fact that she is still in contact with the child. That could lead to resentment and distrust. If she wasn't in contact with the child then i''d agree to wait. But at this point, the longer they wait, the worse it'd be for the child mentally. She has 2 dad's, i'm sure she is smart enough to know that she is adopted. However, it's her KNOWING her mom while simultaneously NOT knowing her mom that is rubbing me the wrong way.
Idk, I would be PISSED if I was lied to like that for soo long, especially if they waited until I was an adult. The parents and mother should all tell her together sooner rather than later.
Whew, this group went back and forth!! Very complicated situation. I hope she can reveal that she is the mother some day and I hope her daughter welcomes her into her life
I’m so tired of people censoring their truth just to not hurt somebody’s feelings. It’s a fact, gay men don’t experience things girls do growing up, and that doesn’t make them bad parents. It’s just a fact and it’s different to have a woman with that experience be there for those things. It’s not homophobic it’s literally just a fact. Everyone’s needs to stop letting that weird fear mongering of “being problematic” or “getting cancelled” stop them from telling the truth. It’s toxic to society.
red jacket girl is so confusing, "that's problematic you cant say that" she was literally adopted likeee, she has much more of an experience than you do, and yes, you need a woman to tell her how to deal with female body issues, because the men will never experience that themselves; also when she switched over from "no" to "yes" the second time at the q&a she was hella aggressive about it
It's been three weeks since my mother told me my father isn't my real father. Today is my birthday and I'm 19 a y.o who has to reconstruct her whole identity. I'm having a literal identity crisis with myself. My mother told me her therapist was advising her to tell me in my preteen years, but she couldn't get herself to do it. And my father (not biological) didn't want to tell me at the beginning of my life. And I can assure you, I try to ask me what could have been the best for me discovering this and I don't even know myself... My parents were both scared I think, especially my mother. Scared that it would destroy my life or my relationship with my dad or idk...
Im gay myself but it's totally true that two dads can't do everything on their own without female guidance I dont think that the questions that the girl will be asking at 13 will be answered fully by men ...
Very interesting and moving episode. A friend’s husband found out when he was in his sixties that he had been adopted. His adoptive mother was on her deathbed when he learned that. The information shattered his life. He then spent years trying to find info on his birth parents. Found out he had several birth siblings. He and my friend were so sorry his adoptive parents had never told him (his adoptive father had died by that point). Of course, his situation is different from the one presented here. The young girl knows, obviously, that she has a birth mother. Anyway, great episode.
Adoptive parents and mother sit down and tell the daughter together, that she’s her real mom. Also she will obv learn soon that those two dads are not her parents and they’re hiding something from her, so that will destroy their trust anyway. Just assure her that nothing will change and they all love her
Kids should be told the truth as a routine thing growing up with it will be common to them. It’s after the fact when they find out older could make them hostile..
Leesie made a valid point. While I’m sure the girls two dads will do a great job guiding her through puberty, they aren’t able to relate to her female experience in the same way a mother can
I think the younger the girl knows, the better? The older that woman gets, the worse it will be? This made me cry haha. I hope it works out later that the mother wants to give.
Not only should you be considerate of her reaction now, be considerate of her reaction later. What if she figures it out by herself? One option wins by a landslide.
I feel like the guy who said he's a gay father is making it about how it would backfire on the parents if the child was told but it's not about how the parents will feel. The child needs to know where he/she came from period and I personally would rather know at a younger age than when I'm 18 and feeling betrayed because I was lied to for years. Just my opinion 🤷♀️
Her child is going to be so angry when told. She'll probably hate her for a long time and come on here and ask if she should forgive her mother for lying to her. The adoptive parents should tell her and then give her time to choose when she wants to meet her mother.
Ikr! Obviously two gay men can’t reproduce with each other so she’s going to match the pieces already. It’s selfish of the couple to keep it a secret from her.
7:35 as a parent you need to act in the best interest of the child but this guy says it’d be amazing for her- but not her parents. if it’s amazing for her, surely you need to tell her!!
The child should definitely be told sooner than later, but with her adopted parents and the birth mom at the same time. No doubt the trust issues and spite will be worse if the child is told when they are an adult.
DEAR ADOPTED PARENTS: She gave birth to this child. She didn’t get an abortion. Let that sink in. Let her see her child sooner than later. Your child won’t runaway but instead will grow to respect you as parents because you as parents weren’t selfish by keeping the birth mom away. She already established she’s not trying to be in her child’s life as a mom. If you wait until your child is 18 to then let the birth mom reunite with her child, he or she could EASILY resent the parents AND the birth mom. Everyone in this scenario is a little bit selfless and selfish. How lucky are you as gay parents to even have a child specifically chosen for you by a straight white female. Talk about breaking the glass ceiling.
Playing a waiting game with this babies life and development. As an educator and lover of children - give her the chance to make a choice. All of the parents need to get it together and become the kingdom that she needs for her to progress forward, further and as a unit knowing that she has 3 amazing people behind her supporting her and loving her. We are all learning life comes with no manual, be kind, be understanding and be h o n e s t .
As someone who is adopted. She needs to tell her. She needs to put her foot down with the adoptive parents if they keep saying yes, she needs to address that she can’t keep going round and round. As disheartening it is, there will be trauma either way. I was told when I was 4 who my bio mom was and I’ve known her, but no matter how long the kid knows, the feeling will always be that she didn’t want me. It’s better to address it while she’s young so there is more time for a better bond and forgiveness, if she finds out later in life after knowing her, she will hold resentment. They all need to be prepared to put the child through therapy through the transition, because no matter how well they think she can handle it she needs to be able to process and work through the information.
Actually the younger you tell the child the better it is to develop a healthy relationship with both parents. Also, the switching around is a horrible concept. You either go one way or the other and stick to it regardless.
The longer they go without telling her the more betrayed she is going to feel. The more angry she is going to be at perhaps her birth mom or her parents.
Since people are already asking: It is mentioned in the video that the child was put up for an open adoption, meaning the parents share identifying information. How the birth parent is integrated in the child’s life is dependent on the adopting party. Edit: With this being said, it’s not legally enforceable to include them in parenting responsibilities. Some states do make the agreement legally binding, so AT MOST a refusal of contact can be brought to a judge.
Children deserve to know their full picture. Children should know young and children deserve honesty. Whenever possible open adoption should be the goal. I think it’s incredibly selfish of the dads to not tell the child. They are letting Their own fears get in the way of what is best for the child.
The fact that she’s already in her daughter’s life changes absolutely everything. It’ll be an even more of a shocker to the little girl😢 If/when they decide to tell her, it should be with the help of a child therapist!
Adoptive parents need to tell daughter ASAP, the moment they allowed the bio mom into her life without the daughter knowing was THE MOMENT they took away the daughter's choice to make her own decision whether to allow her bio mom in her life or not.
For real. Wild that they’ve concocted whatever lies about the bio mother’s identity to their daughter
very true.. im surprised this perspective wasn't mentioned in the vid at all
TBH I think they should have been honest about it from the beginning, since research shows that nearly always brings more healthy outcomes, but sooner is better than later.
i agree, the adoptive parents need to tell her asap but don’t think bio mom should tell her in any circumstance.
I think the adoptive parent is just insecure and that's why they're withholding this info from the daughter. When that child grows up and she finds out that her birth mom was trying to reach out to her, she will be angry at the adoptive parents for not telling her sooner. Those adoptive parents seem to me like they don't know how to parent and don't understand how traumatic it will be for the child.
As a person who was adopted, it's best to tell the child as young as possible. It's very frustrated learning later than earlier
As an adopted child, the parents need to tell the child I say around maybe 4 or 5. This is just my opinion, but I feel that the longer you wait the more the child will resent you.
Yep. They needed to tell her as early as possible. They keep waiting and being selfish. The longer they do so, the more distrust she will have in them.
@@tylerj7298 that’s when my mom told me and I never even thought much of it when she told me. I was just like “oh” 💀.
@@timotheechammywammy3214 My mom didn’t have to tell me I was adopted because it was obvious. I’m black and both my moms are white and gay 😂
@@tylerj7298 also a transracial adoptee. But I like that I was told so early that I don’t even remember being told. It was just so normalized. That’s the way we thought everyone joined their families. My parents told me and my sibling about my cousin who was going to be born, and one of us said something about signing papers.
Kind of wild how the actual adoptee got attacked for her sentiments, she probably has the best insight as someone who is actually adopted
Yep
I found it pretty hypocrtical
Ironically she was attacked for sayjng women have the best insight into female puberty lol
She wasn’t attacked. She acknowledged she had misused her words. It’s not fair to say that to dad’s can’t teach their daughter how to take care of themselves hygienically when puberty comes around. Once everyone made it clear that as long as there is a female figure around to help there, shouldn’t be any issue. It was simply the way she worded herself that was incorrect, and they moved on. She was not attacked.
Grammar was a little messed up bc I used Siri lol
I went to school with someone who found out her "aunt" was her mother when she was 18. It didn't go well. She didn't care that she had a fabulous childhood where all of needs and wants were met. It was that she wasn't told for so long that made her angry.
I mean, it's not like she won't know that she is adopted by the time she's 18 when she has two dads
@@clarajarl Being lied to your whole life is still traumatizing.
100%
yep
@@violetevergarden5160 Yes discovering that your lived reality is a lie and your aunt or your two-dad’s bestfriend is actually your mom at 18 (because the two dads for whatever reason are afraid to broach the conversation) is gonna be traumatizing and that lie is going to be on them. But ultimately that is the Dad’s decision to make the biological mom relinquished that power when she gave her daughter to them. Also who knows the daughter might reach out on her own to find out since it’s open…and when she realizes the phone number on the adoption documents is one already in her contacts it’s going to be a mess that The Dads have to clean up. Either way you slice it, it’s gonna be a mess but it’ll be worse the longer the Dad’s put it off.
Talk to the parents first, but as an adopted person they should definitely tell her. If not she will feel betrayed, believe me.
And if it's bc of the dads preventing and not the mother not wanting to be involved, I'd figure the child would be more resentful to the fathers for not letting that relationship happen. Don't agree with Erik's point of the fathers' trust being affected. Telling the child the truth would prevent that, not brushing off the mother
Omg same profile pic... Sister
@@BecauseIWannaComment that’s true but we still don’t know the reason why she put her up in the first place, maybe the other parents have a reason to avoid her rn 🤷♂️ we only got to hear her side🌚
@@user-sy5bj5nd6x I'm not saying they aren't justified, but if it was in the adoption clause and she already sees the daughter consistently now I doubt she's seen as that bad of an influence to tell her. Either way I'm moreso saying the argument that it would negatively affect her trusting the fathers seems like it could be avoided by them just telling her
@@BecauseIWannaComment Yeah I agree. The child should be told sooner rather than later and all 3 adults should be present. Lmao imagine if the kid grows up and watches this video 😂😂
I don’t think the period statement was problematic. Men of any sexuality know less about female issues during puberty.
Exactly, she was acting like the typical twitter moron
they shouldnt.
@@idrk3707 naturally they would it’s not a matter of should or shouldn’t. Just like women don’t know everything men deal with it’s more so a matter of personal experience than general knowledge. It doesn’t mean men don’t have a general understanding but it means there are things women know from personal experience that’s not necessarily generally discussed
Depends on their education. That's a broad generalization that you're making. I would, for example, be certain that a male gynaecologist would have better knowledge of female-specific anatomy than 99.99% of women who are not gynaecologists themselves. Even if they are nurses or read some medical/anatomy and physiology texts they would be better educated in that area than most women are.
Gay couples often can lean on other women in their family or friend circle for such matters. It was clarified later as well. It was pointed out as problematic because such arguments are used against adoption by gay parents often.
I agree the parents should tell her themselves but I also think they shouldn’t wait too long. The longer they wait, the more that little girl might feel betrayed when they tell her. They should give a clear timeline to the birth mom of when they’re gonna tell their daughter.
💯
Agree!
Especially because now she's involved in a lie the longer it goes on. That's an awful predicament.
Yes
as an adopted child, i agree
I would feel absolutely betrayed if I was told at such a late age that someone was either my father or mother.
same that's why tell them at a young age instead of 18 because you spent all your life like this and it could lead to embarrassment and youknow
Ultimate betrayal....
leesie was on point the entire time. it made me extremely upset when the others tried to undermine her point.
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Thats bc lgbt mafia
Exactly! Plus she was an actual adoptee
Are you kidding lol. I don’t care who you are, whether you’re a doctor, or gay father, or grew up in a house with sisters - learning about your body autonomy from someone who has real lived experiences is different. I have a cousin who was adopted to gay men, and she came to my mom for help with puberty-related advice,,, same with one of my friends.
thank you!!
Like no amount of reading books, hosting interviews or female companionship can replace gender-specific experiences. I don't even know why that girl suggested that a male person can supplement their parental position for lived experience.
Either way, gay or not, I don't feel comfortable with a non-biological father tryna teach a girl about her hoo-haa. It's weird enough with a biological father ...so imagine this. The world is too scared of being cancelled that they'll risk kids
exactly, the daughter will need someone who experiences the same so they can relate and talk more comfortably about it, and actually give advice from an womans pov
Why are you soo homophobic, transphobic and bigoted.
@@evilgrin1 cry about it.
As someone who found out they were adopted at 18, and whose birth mother was apparently around for most of my life, please tell your children where they came from. You can be scared of losing love or respect from your adopted child, but you will lose so much more if you keep up a lie for that long. Don’t make the same mistakes as many other parents, tell your kids when they’re adopted.
The fact that the girl already knows this woman and sees her frequently changes everything. The parents need to tell her that this woman is really her mother and as soon as possible but only the parents can do that because if she or someone else does it, the child can really have trust issues with her dads. If she didn't know her birth mother in the first place, it would be easier to accept the fact she's adopted cause the mother is unknown and the birth father aswell, she has 2 loving dads and there is no problem. But she knows the mother so the dads have to tell her
yesssss
As someone who was raised by gay dad's and is queer myself it isnt problematic to point out that cis gay men don't know about the experience of having a period etc... it is a real thing I faced growing up dealing with things my gay dad's just didn't get or understand because they don't have a uterus or ovaries .... it's real it doesnt make them bad parents it's just a real experience that does happen. It's not homophobic to point that out. It is however not a validation for the mother to be a better parent. Nor is it any different from a single dad raising his daughter who might go through the same thing.... She made a choice to give her up it should be up to the adoptive parents and the child when she's ready.
Thank you for your honesty 🙏🏾
Thank you for sharing your experience & perspective. -How long do you think she should wait, when the couple isn’t giving any context after 11 years of waiting on this matter, that was contingent to them even adopting her? As in, had they not agreed, they wouldn’t have this child at all?
Hi there! What does cis mean?
Thank you. Goodness gracious. People are blowing this out of proportion. The way that mixed girl came for that black woman was way too agressive.
@@cassie-jj2ur there’s transgender and cisgender. Cisgender is you are born as the gender you identify yourself as. Like a girl who is born with body anatomy associated with girls and women.
The fact that the decision was semi based off how the Dads would feel is mind-blowing. Its not about them its about the kid.
EXACTLY
I wouldn’t really say that it is FULLY just about the dads, but it is a big part of the issue. Losing trust towards the parents that took you in is detrimental to the family itself.
i agree , the kid should be first , but the fact that it impacts that dads will directly impact the kid. if paige told her daughter without the dads’ permission, there’s a chance that they’d be pissed off and not let the daughter see paige. and like erik said, it could potentially have the daughter lose a lot of trust in her parents for not telling her earlier. that’s not really about how her dads would feel - feeling like you can’t trust your parents when you’re only 11 is Terrifying
@@anjunxis Well honestly the longer the Dads push away the birth mother, the worse it will be for the child. She will be resentful that they lied to her for so long when her biological mom was in her life for many years and she didn’t know. Since Paige said she’s planned it with them many times but they fell through, I think the fathers are scared their daughter will lose trust in them. It’s best for all the adults to be present and tell the kid as soon as possible.
exactly
and with his perspective they are kind of setting themselves up. like what can you expect after waiting so long practically lying to her.
The only frustrating part coming from the people on the no side was they kept acting like she was wanting to just tell her daughter without the permission of the two dads when she specifically said that she wouldn't tell her without their permission.
what concerned me is when the mother said she does not want to be a mother in her kid life despite wanting to have her daughter acknowledge her.
@@sydneyrobinson7022 The fact that her daughter knows about her mom doesn't mean she is gonna become her mom, cause she gave her up, dads wouldn't want it probably
I cannot believe so many people were on team “no”. Her being young is better. If they kept that secret from me for 18 years and then had my mom IN MY LIFE the whole time but didn’t know she was my mom, I’d never forgive anyone.
I think they were on team no because they wanted the "parents" to either tell her first or maybe tell all together. It's a touchy subject thinking about this woman that I grew up with is my mother and not once did the parents that raised me say a word. Think the no's are of the thought of how it should be done not that it shouldn't be done.
@@queenruth2109 Yeah
ITS ABOUT THE KID NOT THE PARENTS-IM ADOPTED, I would want all three to tell me the truth together at age 11.
Girl it is not at all problematic to say that a gay couple doesn’t know about periods and women’s issues. They haven’t experienced what women have. Stop trying to be PC
They all jumped her lol and the gay dad was about to pop off
that isnt pc? Alot of moms dont tell their daughters either so???
There are many mothers who never explain periods to their child. Facts is most female I know only learned about periods through school or online. Any parents has the ability to educate on periods no matter their sex. Any parent has the ability to neglect teaching a child about puberty. You do not need to experience something to be able to educate your child on it.
I don't know why you guys think periods have to do anything with this 💀 she's not her mom anymore she gave her up 11 years ago and she's asking wether she should tell her that she gave birth to her, even if she told her she wouldn't become her mom and guide her through puberty, the child still has parents and she's not one of them, she gave that up.
not all women have the same experiences! is a mother any less qualified because she doesn't have the same specific experiences her daughter will? NO
Saying that her comment about female puberty was problematic… a bit of a stretch. Of course someone with female anatomy can commiserate and explain these changes in a different way. Be real.
Exactly!!
@@pov2799 yeah, they completely shut down her reasonable line of thought. They also made her feel bad which was really uncalled for. She was not trying to be hurtful at all.
@@pov2799 exactly what i just commented. She did not mean it in a malicious way whatsoever.
Yeah, in most cases men can’t explain women’s puberty from lived experiences. However, it doesn’t mean they can’t effectively help their growing daughter. It’s condescending, if anything, to assume that they haven’t researched or learned anything before going into it. I’m not sure what’s problematic specifically, so if anyone could explain why that’d be great.
@@krust9976 I don’t think anyone doubts that they will be well researched and try to help, but research has nothing on lived experience. Nothing can replace the knowledge of living with female anatomy and having been through 100s of menstrual cycles. Not acknowledging that is just ignorant
Her parents should tell her ASAP.
Never lie to an adopted child. That sends the message there is something wrong or bad about their adoption. Why else would you have to lie?
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Bruh they are two men, she’s gonna figure it out anyways , it’s not lying if it’s out in the open. It’s not like they can keep this secret forever like heterosexual family adopting a kid from the same race. Some of you donkeys really lack common sense, it’s borderline astounding.
Even worse if she finds out about by some random person.
YES
How is that problematic? There are many anatomical and physiological differences between men & women. I completely understand what Leesie is saying. By the same token, I do not doubt in my mind that two men couldn't help navigate their daughter in that phase of their life. It's just a little different, as men do not experience what we do.
I think it’s problematic because men are capable of teaching their daughters about female anatomy and buying period products and such. There are also so many women who fail to teach their girls about their own bodies, so it really doesn’t have to do with gender so much as wether or not you teach your kids something so important.
@@jcam5064 I was never taught anything by my traditional parents. I had to learn everything on my own by experience or the internet. I believe two cis men can handle a daughter as long as they make sure they know what they are doing. And if there is a trans guy involved, then there is that as well.
@@jcam5064 There’s a difference between being an actual pilot and researching how to fly a plane and how planes work. The fathers can certainly help but they don’t have the same lived experiences as a young girl going through puberty.
@@dapo3538 why can’t aunts or sisters help then
@@jcam5064 There’s a difference between knowing period products and female anatomy and actual dealing with a period and knowing how it feels like. I have no doubt that her fathers will research and teach her what they know. The main problem is that during puberty, kids want to know that they’re normal and that they’re not the only ones going through this. There are so many things involved in women’s cycles besides periods, like mood swings, cramps, and other body and mood changes. While her dads can definitely teach the technical aspects, I believe the girl needs female figures in her life who can share her experiences and emphasize with her.
It wasn't fair to the girl that got attacked for saying something like "the dads won't know how to help with periods". Like she didn't mean in a mean way?! It's just facts? Like yes they ca research and everything but like they haven't put up a tampon up their v@gine and don't know how it feels and how to do it? That does not mean she NEEDS a mother to help but it just wasn't a big deal to be attacked over by the other girl (in red jacket). It was so out of line and RUDE
this ^ she wasn't even being remotely nasty or underhanded about it. u can do all the research u want - there are things in LIFE (not just this circumstance) u will never TRULY 1000% understand n relate to unless u experience them. that's just fact. i can research pps all i want - i still won't understand/ know what it's like to have my genitals extend beyond the inside of my body lmao. thinking u can COMPLETELY wholeheartedly understand something u are limited to observing and researching as if u have personally experienced it (when you literally can't and never will) is unrealistic n kinda arrogant imo
I agree!
Lol true, what she said was honestly valid so the cut off came across as tone def.
I agree! Middle school was TOUGH for me. I wouldn’t love my parents any less if they brought in a woman to teach me about these things.
That wasn’t an attack at all. They had a respectful convo. And I think the “cut off” was to keep Leesie from going too far in a statement that could be seen as offensive, to keep her from really getting attacked in these comments
All I got to say is the longer the 2 dads wait the angrier that child is going to be.
Exactly, she will find out no matter what and it is gonna hurt more then later
This is a conversation that the adoptive parents need to be a big part of, not to mention I would highly recommend a child therapist help guide the conversation. This could cause the child to have a lot of pain if it is not expressed properly.
Edit: I just want to add that the agreement she has for an open adoption (them telling the child who she is) is most likely not legally binding.
I'm sorry, but the parents don't get priority, biological or adoptive. This is about the kid. They didn't ask to be adopted. This kid needs to be told regardless of if the dads are ready for it, because it's not about them. It's about their daughter. There's a reason everyone agreed that if she found out from someone else she would lose trust in the dads. because by not telling her, that is BREAKING trust.
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽😭🙌🏽
I 100% agree with this and was going to comment it myself. If the adoption parents are willing to have the mom close enough to the child, they should be willing to explain to the child who she is. Seeing as it's 2 fathers, the child will eventually start asking questions and by that time, finding out the woman that was so close to her is the mother, would probably hurt and confuse the child even more. It's not about how the adoptive parents feel anymore, it's literally about the child and how that news will affect her growing up.
Finally, the comment I was looking for. The most important person here is the child.
THIS! I wish one of them said this. I was so annoyed
I do agree!
as an adoptee, please tell her. I feel betrayed by the things my adoptive parents held back due to trying to "protect me" when I was young.
You can blame the woke Afro girl and the gay dude. I feel very sorry for the little girl.
@@catalinarossi the gay dude literally said it’d be better to tell her now than to wait until she was say 18, but that it should come from the parents and not Paige
@@catalinarossi You are the woke one in here.
@@catalinarossi Why? They suggested to wait until the adoptive parents cooperate, and that is the healthiest way. For the adoptive parents to have a proper conversation about it and to introduce her in a proper way. That's how it should be. If in any circumstances you think the bio mom should just scare the child by saying hey I'm your mom out of nowhere then I feel sorry for your thinking process.
@@jhsemoxitha3821 I feel sorry for your thinking process if you think the child will be all accepting and brush it off easily when she finds out at a oIder age. Just scroll up to the most liked comments and you’ll see most people including many adoptees agree the daughter should know now. The younger you tell them the easier they are to adapt to the new information, again take it from someone with a adopted autistic cousin and from common sense overall.
Why was Erik so concerned with the feelings of the fathers & not what’s best for the literal child. So strange.
It shows that present-day adoption politics, especially when gay parents are involved, have mostly to do with what these adults selfishly want for themselves instead of what eventually works for the kids' benefits.
Because he’s projecting
Because many adoptive parents get kids to feel like parents instead of actually caring about the child. And when the real parent is introduced they feel intimidated. Adoption industry is gross. Its like they just want to buy kids and not care.
We all know why 🤥 as did everyone they casted but they couldn't say it out of fear
Simple...dude is selfish !
Idk why that women telling the girl what she said was “problematic” irritated me so much. Women obviously know more about the female anatomy than men, it was just a fact.
Erik is only empathizing with the parents bc they’re gay like him. He doesn’t think about the daughter. He just wants the parents’ power over their daughter’s life to be protected. Knowing where you come from will never hurt you. It’ll only push you forward in life.
Knowing where you come from will never hurt you... what a load of nonsense.
So what? If they didn’t have that discussion, it’s because the child didnt really care enough to ask, besides, she’s gonna find out about reproduction soon and question about it eventually. It’s not like it’s something you can hide like heterosexual parents who adopt a child with the similar race.
Many many of the gay couples who have kids through surrogacy are like this. They don't want to have to face the reality that they need to include someone else in the kids life at all
I disagree with you, I'm sure he was thinking of the daughter. He was just worried she wouldn't trust her parents anymore if they weren't the ones to tell her (it would seem like they tried hiding it). Think of how the daughter's life would be impacted if her relationship with her adoptive parents is strained.
@@fark69an egg donor isn’t a mother and has no rights. So what other people need to be included? A lot of times you don’t know who the egg donor is just a description of them
The more you drag it out, the worse it is going to be.
Casting Erik was brilliant. His perspective was so crucial in this conversation.
nope he was annoying af and was defending the gay dads too much just because he's a gay dad too
Agreed, Erik made some really great points 🙌🏻
@@lawtraf8008 how was he “annoying” for sharing a perspective?
@@lawtraf8008 oh noooo someone offering their pov who’s in a similar situation to add emotional context😢
i agree. he was also extremely bias tho. he seemed like he was more concerned with the dads reserving the power & trust that comes with the title of “parental guardian” than he was with what would be better for the daughter in the long run. even after being presented with the fact that the child has been questioning and the dads keep “planning” to tell her and renigging all he could do was talk about not wanting them to lose trust.
I feel like there's a factor that nobody took into account but that I think is important: What kind of relationship does he have with her daughter? She said that they knew each other and saw her frequently, so, is she her teacher? Her nanny?. I feel like this really matters and if the child sees her as a role model, then I feel like it would be appropriate and even helpful to tell her while she is young.
Omg I wad waiting for that the whole time
The guy kept saying "it's the parent decision and not once spoke of how the child will feel and her/his decisions " then projecting his own feelings on the child by knowing her own mother
Omg the centering of the parents in this situation is so damn frustrating to hear as an adoptee. The child’s needs are what matter. This should be her choice.
Adoption perspective is commonly like that unfortunately. I got you because I wanted a kid and couldn't have a biological one, you should be grateful I gave you a better life, you need to love me and not ask about your biological family 😔
As an adoptive parent and as someone who listens to adoptee voices. The best thing to do is to let your adopted child know the truth. They deserve it, it's their life.
This question should be for adoptees
Yes!
Can I ask what is the perfect age to tell them ? It's my birthday today and I'm nineteen. I have not been adopted but I learned three weeks ago by my mother that my dad, whom I grew up with since the day I was born, isn't my biological one. i don't know how to feel and my mother told me about her doubts of when to tell me, and I don't even know when could have been the best time myself...
@@macaron4280 that's a whole different scenario.
@@brucebanksshow not exactly. the underlying issue in both scenarios is the child not knowing where they come from. the ethical dilemma is concerning when to tell the child that you know where they come from/don't know where they come from.
@@macaron4280 happy birthday!
The aggression thr woman got about the period question was unnecessary. You can have a difference of opinion without raising your voice and making the woman feel small.
I don't believe it was a problematic question by the way. It's unfortunate that she got shut down instead of having a calm discussion or a calm debate.
YES!! she kept talking over and made the girl feel like she's putting people down. All she was trying to say is that men physically don't know what things like periods feel like, etc.
I agree but I don't think that was aggressive just uncalled for
That's the aggression of "tolerant" people whenever someone says something that deviates from.their cultish beliefs.
Yeah she has stated that she only didnt press it more because she knew people would despise her and attack her for it, so it wasn't worth the argument.
@@cyberspace7208 🔥🔥🔥🔥
i don’t think it’s problematic to point out that there is an obvious biological difference that any male of any sexuality has between any female. like, obviously they’re not gonna 100% know what it feels like to have a uterus or female body parts, just like a female doesn’t know what it feels like to be a male 100%.
Exactly
I’m in the middle here, 1 thing is that your child deserves to know who her real mother is but at the same time it could end in a big mental struggle and overthinking for the kid
Will definitely get worse as she gets older though. It's all dependant on the two fathers but it isn't fair for them to say they'll tell the daughter, but then not tell the daughter. One could argue they're not ready, but if that's the case why not communicate it? Instead of avoiding.
@@shehz yea I think the 2 fathers should tell her not the mom but at a more young age than 12+
If she finds out when she is older she will feel very betrayed by her fathers. Especially considering they introduced the bio mom already without telling her. It is the father’s responsibility to keep that from happening.
They should have told her the moment her bio mom became a part of her life
It's odd to me that the dads chose to allow the mom to be involved in their daughter's life in some way while simultaneously not telling their daughter who she is. I think the dads are creating a situation that will make their daughter feel betrayed for keeping this information from her. I think the dads need to tell their daughter who the woman that she sees actually is.
I hear you, but we don’t know the entire story or the dad’s side of the story.
Oh no. I really had hope at the beginning, but after reaching the end of the video, im afraid she felt swayed into not telling her which is the most HORRIBLE decision 😩
i quite literally have gone through this exact same situation myself. i was adopted as a baby. my birth mother is my aunt. i grew up around her, being told that my brothers were my cousins. i finally asked who my birth parents were last year when i was 20. it was life changing. tell her as soon as you can. i just wish i was told when i was that young. so much hurt has built up for too long
SPOILER
Honestly I agree with both, obviously the adopted dads should tell their daughter first out of respect because she would want it to come from them first because of that trust they should have. However if the bio mom has been in her circle for a while and if her birth daughter doesn't know, I think if everyone waits to tell her the truth, she would probably be weirded out and wouldn't trust anyone anymore, why wait until she's older, 11 year olds are very intelligent, it's not about the parents, it's about their daughter and kids are very curious. She's gonna find out one way or another
And the parents are making it more about them than the child.
I'm not trying to be rude, but I feel like the gay couple are insecure knowing her daughter get to fill the "mother role".
That was not problematic at all at the end of the day women know better than anyone else about their own anatomy and going through puberty
While I agree that a child should have a same sex parent for any bathroom issues that may arise, I don't believe anyone has all the information on something just because they experience it. We need to ask for outside points of view to get the whole picture on anything!
@@mollykins8h yes but women still have more knowledge cuz they actually experience it. It’s more easier to relate to people who gone through the same thing and have the same symptoms as you
it is problematic and they explained why, yeah obviously..but gay couples likely have family members who are women and have menstrual cycles and went through puberty. acting like she won't have access to that information just because she has two dads is disingenuous
@@kennedy3682 people would feel more comfortable if it was their mother telling them instead of female relatives
@@Salma-gq9tf exactly. that's how i viewed her comments.
Every child deserves to know who their parents are. I think all adoptions should be open adoptions. And ideally they know from a young age so they don't feel conflicted later in their identity.
Not every....In fact a kid is way better without knowing ever that he was abandoned under any circumstances.
I fell like it's cruelty and child abuse in disguised.
@@deadmanx484if they are adopted, they know they were abandoned.
Yeah
Maybe because the mother will be known in this case... but children who are adopted and know from the beginning can get very, very confused, stressed, anxious and full of mixed feelings based on the unknown... it's hard for children to process all this and they also have intuition that affects them... i agree that open adoption should be important... but it's such a difficult topic really.
@@taylie673 not every adopted child has been abandoned 😶
Lying and deception will never end well. She should sit the girl down and say "now that you're getting to this age, I need to tell you something". Whatever happens after that happens but at least the little girl will have a full context to make of it what she wants to.
tell her before it’s too late and she feels like you’ve hidden yourself from her, appearing as a different person but still appearing in her life isn’t fair.
She already knows she’s adopted. I think the parents (adoptive) should ask her if she is interested in meeting her biological parent. Not every adopted child wants to. It would be a different story is she didn’t even know she’s adopted but I expect her to be aware of that.
I do question having the bio mother in her life if they weren’t gonna make it clear from the start.
The child is older now and I think it should be her decision if or when.
💯 agree
As an adopted person this is pretty gross. People don’t know how traumatic this could be
For real. Regardless of any decision, the situation this child is in by having her biological mother in her life under the pretense that she’s someone else is awful.
Can we see more of Aurora (girl with orange hair) her smile, vibe, and tone made me feel so comforted 😩. I can tell she has such a sweet genuine soul.
She looked so happy to be there🥺
omg how comforting was she??? i REALLY hope she's recasted in more vids
I can confirm she is one of the sweetest and most genuine souls you will ever meet! Congratulations Aurora, beyond proud of you!
people really go to Jubilee with their problems instead of visiting a therapist 💀
Hey I mean it's free 🤷♀️
Very true 😂😂😂 exposing themselves
What’s crazy is the child might grow up and watch this video one day 🤔
@@dapo3538 doubt that’s ever gonna happen since the face is blurred
@@Ali-ru9vx I get that, but it’s possible for her friends to find it and connect the dots based on her “Aunty Paige’s” name and the situation described in the video. Idk kids are very conniving and resourceful🤷🏾♂️ so it could be a possibility
@@dapo3538not her real name
Children can handle anything as long as you tell them the truth and support them.
So true
Absolutely
I wouldn't be surprised of the daughter already suspects her to the mom and she just wants confirmation. 11 year olds can definitely put the pieces together easily if given enough context. I think it's better for the child to know sooner since she's already asking. It's going to be a hard transition no matter how they dice it but with therapy and strong adults around her to help her through, she'll have a larger chance of coming out okay than the truth literally staring her in her face and everyone avoids it.
She should definitely tell her as early as possible. Obviously, with two dads, she knows she has a mother somewhere. It doesn't need to be lied about by omission.
She need to demand it to be told. As someone who grew up around lies, I’ve learned to trust no one. You are there for you, everyone else has other motives
Adoption is very necessary, but children deserve to know who their biological parents are from the very beginning. The adoptive parents should not be the main concern here, the child should be.
@@harrisonfreund7845 I think that it's important to remember that adoption is widely considered to be inherently traumatic. There are ways of explaining tough situations to children without putting them in danger. I'd also like to add that vulnerable children often turn into vulnerable adults, so if a child is deemed too vulnerable to know about their biological heritage, I'd definitely argue that them going off and finding their bio family at 18 with zero time for information to settle is going to put them in danger. Protecting children by lying to them, withholding important information, and taking away their autonomy is quite a risky move in the long run. Also, the kind of situations you're talking about are very much not the norm. Children who come from truly, truly awful bio family's are often permnently removed from the home and from their bio parents long after birth, and are therefore definitely entitled to hear a sensitive, appropriate, and accurate account of why they were placed up for adoption.
@@harrisonfreund7845 I understand where you're coming from, and ultimately I do think that adoptive families should have access to mental health professionals and qualified social workers so that they can make informed family choices which cause minimal harm. I just cannot think of many circumstances in which it would be okay to withhold key information about a child's heritage, regardless of how ready they appear. Especially as the adoptee in this video is 11, an age in which young people are learning about themselves and rapidly developing a more mature sense of self, I think it's important that the kid knows everything there is to know about themselves and where they come from so that their identity doesn't suddenly come crumbling down later in life. Children are much more capable than we give then credit for, and they're more able to adapt to new situations and information than many adults. I don't think there are many groups of people more able to cope with big revelations than children, so I don't see how delaying the kids knowledge about her bio family would benefit her in any way
I'll be honest, watching this video upset me a little. Although the circumstances weren't even slightly identical to this one, having the option to say yes or no still felt extremely great. I was once asked whether I wanted to be adopted but I chose to decline. I recognize that this is a sensitive matter for non-bio parents, however, the child's feelings are something that is frequently disregarded. Whether or not you are their biological parent, your child will always be your child, but whether you like it or not, they still have a different parent. The reason why the foster care and adoption systems are so flawed is that these kids are misled about their early lives and treated like interchangeable items in these systems.
Hidden truths are unspoken lies. The fathers need to step up, because the longer they wait, the more she'll resent them and seek the birth mother. This isn't hurting anyone but the daughter. She should've known all along if she still has a relationship with the birth mother.
They might've felt less worthy to have their daughter know all along, I don't know their thought process, but truth & openness always prevails.
I had a friend who didn’t know her aunt was actually her mother, my friend found out about this when she was 21. I think if she found out sooner, it would have been better for their relationship. They unfortunately don’t have a relationship and she Greatly dislikes, her aunt/mother for not knowing for her whole life.
the way they misinterpreted her entire purpose of being there, as if she was going to go around the dads back to tell a daughter she quite literally birthed of her own parentage, is infuriating me rn
This was probably the best episode of this show.
The casting of people just worked for this type of episode.
Omg thank you!
agreed! it was important to find people who are both eloquent AND have life experiences that are relevant to the episode. it's hard to find that, but jubilee really struck gold with the casting of this ep.
You should absolutely tell them, just don’t expect anything. You gave them up for whatever the reason was so it’s now their decision if they choose to accept you. But you should absolutely inform them because imagine going through life not knowing where you belong.
This is SUCH a well produced video, massive well done to Jubilee
they're going to distrust them anyway ... so many people are emotionally immature, it drives me crazy. the dads already waited too long if this isn't the first time she's asked who her mom is.
The second she says she want to know who her biological mother is, they should reveal all information they have. Being that she’s been in the child’s life for what’s most likely years..it should have been revealed when she entered the child’s life. If she wasn’t already in the child’s life it would be a different story.
I think what wasn't highlighted enough in this conversation was the fact that she is still in contact with the child. That could lead to resentment and distrust. If she wasn't in contact with the child then i''d agree to wait. But at this point, the longer they wait, the worse it'd be for the child mentally. She has 2 dad's, i'm sure she is smart enough to know that she is adopted. However, it's her KNOWING her mom while simultaneously NOT knowing her mom that is rubbing me the wrong way.
Idk, I would be PISSED if I was lied to like that for soo long, especially if they waited until I was an adult. The parents and mother should all tell her together sooner rather than later.
Erik's focus on entirely on the adoptive parents, not the best interests of the child
Whew, this group went back and forth!! Very complicated situation. I hope she can reveal that she is the mother some day and I hope her daughter welcomes her into her life
I’m so tired of people censoring their truth just to not hurt somebody’s feelings. It’s a fact, gay men don’t experience things girls do growing up, and that doesn’t make them bad parents. It’s just a fact and it’s different to have a woman with that experience be there for those things. It’s not homophobic it’s literally just a fact. Everyone’s needs to stop letting that weird fear mongering of “being problematic” or “getting cancelled” stop them from telling the truth. It’s toxic to society.
That period statement was not problematic they so sensitive 😭
I was not expecting this to be the most controversial one.
red jacket girl is so confusing, "that's problematic you cant say that" she was literally adopted likeee, she has much more of an experience than you do, and yes, you need a woman to tell her how to deal with female body issues, because the men will never experience that themselves; also when she switched over from "no" to "yes" the second time at the q&a she was hella aggressive about it
It's been three weeks since my mother told me my father isn't my real father. Today is my birthday and I'm 19 a y.o who has to reconstruct her whole identity. I'm having a literal identity crisis with myself. My mother told me her therapist was advising her to tell me in my preteen years, but she couldn't get herself to do it. And my father (not biological) didn't want to tell me at the beginning of my life. And I can assure you, I try to ask me what could have been the best for me discovering this and I don't even know myself... My parents were both scared I think, especially my mother. Scared that it would destroy my life or my relationship with my dad or idk...
Happy Birthday 🙂🎂🎉!!
Im gay myself but it's totally true that two dads can't do everything on their own without female guidance I dont think that the questions that the girl will be asking at 13 will be answered fully by men ...
Thanks for your honestly. Leesie’s questions were certainly not problematic and definitely reasonable.
Very interesting and moving episode.
A friend’s husband found out when he was in his sixties that he had been adopted. His adoptive mother was on her deathbed when he learned that. The information shattered his life. He then spent years trying to find info on his birth parents. Found out he had several birth siblings. He and my friend were so sorry his adoptive parents had never told him (his adoptive father had died by that point). Of course, his situation is different from the one presented here. The young girl knows, obviously, that she has a birth mother. Anyway, great episode.
Thats the worst time to tell that.
@@jonahmordhaim2705 quite literally.
I think she needs to be told she deserves to know
Adoptive parents and mother sit down and tell the daughter together, that she’s her real mom. Also she will obv learn soon that those two dads are not her parents and they’re hiding something from her, so that will destroy their trust anyway. Just assure her that nothing will change and they all love her
Kids should be told the truth as a routine thing growing up with it will be common to them. It’s after the fact when they find out older could make them hostile..
Leesie made a valid point. While I’m sure the girls two dads will do a great job guiding her through puberty, they aren’t able to relate to her female experience in the same way a mother can
I think the younger the girl knows, the better? The older that woman gets, the worse it will be? This made me cry haha. I hope it works out later that the mother wants to give.
Cracking up at how ole gurl immediately talked herself into going back to the yes side lmao. 😂
Not only should you be considerate of her reaction now, be considerate of her reaction later. What if she figures it out by herself? One option wins by a landslide.
Mom doesn’t know that daughter knows that we know that she knows her mom is actually her mom.
I feel like the guy who said he's a gay father is making it about how it would backfire on the parents if the child was told but it's not about how the parents will feel. The child needs to know where he/she came from period and I personally would rather know at a younger age than when I'm 18 and feeling betrayed because I was lied to for years. Just my opinion 🤷♀️
Hey 👆 Thanks For Watching You've Won A Prize. DM in the Above Telegram name 👆🤗🎁.
My concern is if they wait too long and the child finds out before being told then won't the child distrust her dads and her biological mom?
Her child is going to be so angry when told. She'll probably hate her for a long time and come on here and ask if she should forgive her mother for lying to her. The adoptive parents should tell her and then give her time to choose when she wants to meet her mother.
I mean they've already met many times and know each others. She just doesn't know that this woman who always visit her is actually her mom.
@@lawtraf8008 Yes but if she ever finds out, which she will eventually because the truth always comes out, she will have so much anger towards her.
Ikr! Obviously two gay men can’t reproduce with each other so she’s going to match the pieces already. It’s selfish of the couple to keep it a secret from her.
7:35 as a parent you need to act in the best interest of the child but this guy says it’d be amazing for her- but not her parents. if it’s amazing for her, surely you need to tell her!!
The child should definitely be told sooner than later, but with her adopted parents and the birth mom at the same time. No doubt the trust issues and spite will be worse if the child is told when they are an adult.
Knowing and understanding periods are two different things something that men can't understand in it's full
If you wait until a kid is 18 to tell them a secret, they’ll feel like they’re whole life was a lie💯
DEAR ADOPTED PARENTS: She gave birth to this child. She didn’t get an abortion. Let that sink in. Let her see her child sooner than later. Your child won’t runaway but instead will grow to respect you as parents because you as parents weren’t selfish by keeping the birth mom away. She already established she’s not trying to be in her child’s life as a mom. If you wait until your child is 18 to then let the birth mom reunite with her child, he or she could EASILY resent the parents AND the birth mom. Everyone in this scenario is a little bit selfless and selfish. How lucky are you as gay parents to even have a child specifically chosen for you by a straight white female. Talk about breaking the glass ceiling.
Y’all take everything as problematic I can’t 🙄 love this video tho!
Its ridiculous asf
Playing a waiting game with this babies life and development. As an educator and lover of children - give her the chance to make a choice. All of the parents need to get it together and become the kingdom that she needs for her to progress forward, further and as a unit knowing that she has 3 amazing people behind her supporting her and loving her. We are all learning life comes with no manual, be kind, be understanding and be h o n e s t .
As someone who is adopted. She needs to tell her. She needs to put her foot down with the adoptive parents if they keep saying yes, she needs to address that she can’t keep going round and round. As disheartening it is, there will be trauma either way. I was told when I was 4 who my bio mom was and I’ve known her, but no matter how long the kid knows, the feeling will always be that she didn’t want me. It’s better to address it while she’s young so there is more time for a better bond and forgiveness, if she finds out later in life after knowing her, she will hold resentment. They all need to be prepared to put the child through therapy through the transition, because no matter how well they think she can handle it she needs to be able to process and work through the information.
Actually the younger you tell the child the better it is to develop a healthy relationship with both parents. Also, the switching around is a horrible concept. You either go one way or the other and stick to it regardless.
The longer they go without telling her the more betrayed she is going to feel. The more angry she is going to be at perhaps her birth mom or her parents.
Since people are already asking:
It is mentioned in the video that the child was put up for an open adoption, meaning the parents share identifying information. How the birth parent is integrated in the child’s life is dependent on the adopting party.
Edit: With this being said, it’s not legally enforceable to include them in parenting responsibilities. Some states do make the agreement legally binding, so AT MOST a refusal of contact can be brought to a judge.
I love how Jubilee casts people who can somewhat relate to the situation
Children deserve to know their full picture. Children should know young and children deserve honesty. Whenever possible open adoption should be the goal. I think it’s incredibly selfish of the dads to not tell the child. They are letting Their own fears get in the way of what is best for the child.
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
The fact that she’s already in her daughter’s life changes absolutely everything. It’ll be an even more of a shocker to the little girl😢
If/when they decide to tell her, it should be with the help of a child therapist!
feels like a bunch of egos. if the child is asking, there's no debate.