*Side note: as you may have noticed from my other videos, my channel is based on real life driving and how I can reach that “realistic” aspect in the sim. That is what my review is based on. Most of you get it, but unfortunately some others seem to not want to understand the purpose of the review. At the end of the day, everyone can enjoy the game/sim they want. My views are my own, as I mention all the time. I was basing myself off of my real life driving and how close I can get to it. Side note 2: I am not paid by iRacing currently and I have never been in the past. I have no contract with them. I state my own opinions and that’s it. Sorry to disappoint a few with this statement. And with that being said…. Morad go vroom 😂. Thanks to those who get it. I appreciate everybody who disagrees but can have a civil conversation about it. We’re all in this together!
@danielmorad, well, maybe I did take it too personally and I'm sure we all want that, close to perfect sim that can give us realistic or if you want fun, as not everyone will experience rl driving, so yea maybe I over react but as you will hold a big influence over your audience maybe it would be nice or a better review once you have given the title more time to give it a more fair review, with it dialed in. I understand your a busy guy with the season still ongoing, so maybe in 6 months a second review I'd watch.
I’m grateful for the honesty and the real-life reference. The entire reason we enjoy sim racing is because we prefer a realistic reflection of driving in our pretend race cars. I find it bizarre that people would defend ACC’s depiction of racing without having any real-life experience of GT cars.
I truly didn't see how you could favor iRacing over ACC (in spite of the fact you actually race these things as a professional). Your description of finding the sweet spot just shy of triggering the ABS on iRacing was so enlightening! Thank you so much for that video.
Hey Daniel, like you, I’ve been lucky enough to race GT3 in real life too over in Britain, with BMW (M6 and M4 GT3) & McLaren 720S. I found ACC a useful platform for me when learning the limits of a GT3 car before stepping behind the wheel in real life. I agree with the points you made about sound, it’s all a bit over-egged in ACC, but one factor I really appreciate in ACC is the setup parameters you can change have quite a realistic effect on the car, similar to what you’d expect in the real world. Naturally, I prefer ACC as a GT3 simulation model over something like iRacing or RF2, but I respect anyone who has any differing opinions on the matter because we all have our biases when it comes to this topic!
I have a genuine question on the braking and ABS. It seems like it's all over the board with what people say, and I'm 100% not saying anyone is wrong. I'm actually curious if it differs based on the driver and how they use braking in their own driving in GT3. I've seen people on UA-cam say it's the best ABS simulation, and of course some don't say that like Daniel mentions here. I've also watched the GT World races and I've heard the announcers (and possibly the guest driver doing announcing) say that they 100% the brakes and use the ABS on hard deceleration. Interestingly, in the Daytona 24 race they spoke about how the GTE cars are now using ABS when they never have before, and they had a couple of the drivers join them in the booth and the GTE drivers talk about how hard it is for them to go from the old GTE cars without the ABS, to the new GTE cars where they have to remind themselves to use all of the brakes and rely on the ABS. Then again, they don't say how much they're using the ABS, like Daniel has mentioned in the past he'll use the ABS as a notification that it's time to back off just a little on the brakes, but also not stay in it and let the ABS do all of the work. So that's what makes me wonder if it's a driver to driver perspective and how they use the systems, or if it's general use where everyone generally does it the same and people are making it sound like that's not the case. Or could it even be using ABS in a different way from car to car?
To avoid possible confusion, a slight correction: there were no "new GTE" cars in this year's Daytona 24, or any IMSA race after the end of the 2021 season. The WeatherTech series GT cars are all GT3 now, except for the Corvette which is the GTE/GTLM car with ABS and other modifications to roughly equate it with the GT3's ("GTD" in IMSA terms) while GM develops a true GT3 version which will debut next year. Former GTE drivers have commented as you said regarding ABS, but they're driving GT3 class cars now. This year was also the last for GTE at Le Mans and the WEC, and those cars still do not have ABS. Back on topic - I have no real world racing experience besides some karting - but I've got a few thousand hours in various racing sims and I seem to struggle with braking in ACC more than others. My skils are probably no better than average, but it just seems inconsistent. I think I'm doing the same things but some laps the car just doesn't slow the same, and i end up off track. It's frustrating. Thanks Daniel for the videos, this is great insight for us. Daniel go vroom!
This is why people with real life experience don't openly comment, as soon as they do there are schmucks asking their own pointless questions which they will then reiterate in every other comment section as gospel lmao. Of bloody course it differs based on the driver and how they use braking in their own driving in GT3 🤦♂@@Hardcaslte
the benefit of the noise being somewhat overbearing is that you can hear what you can't feel, I always turn up things like tyre noise in any sim I play. I know your review was based more on things that make the game feel more realistic but I just wanted to mention my experience.
You can also tune many audio settings individually, onboard engine, exterior engine, tyres, chassis, opponent, etc.... Would super easy to tune it as in real life if that is what you're looking for...
Daniel, do yourself and the community a big favour and do the same thing on rF2. Your honest review based on real-life experience makes the difference for all of us. Thank you!
I don't think we need a real driver to tell us that rF2 is way better than acc and iRacing, it speaks for itself but unfortunately its just not popular to the mainstream player so for a youtube vid it would get the less views than iRacing or acc. I would love to see Dan play AC1 but that kind of falls into the same category even though its has a way higher daily player rate.
I will get to it for sure. I just need to do that after the race season. It’s ramping up in august until end of October. It’s going to be crazy stretch.
@@MrThedestroy3r Well its one of the most preferred sim's along with AC1 for irl drivers to practice so not sure where got that info. look I really like Daniel Morad's streams and youtube advice and I like hearing what hes got to say. But like many people I drive real cars too, they might not be full on race cars but I can drive cars I owned or have driven in rf2 and AC1 and they can be bloody close to the real thing. At the end of the day it comes down to experience and what to look for with physics and tire models and setting up the sim correctly.
I started on ACC for about two years and then got into iracing. I now race on both. Obviously I am not a racing driver by any stretch of the imagination. What I find different is that ACC is far more intense when close racing compared to iracing. One makes me sweat and the other doesn’t. I found iracing far more easier to drive in than ACC. The braking difference was easy to overcome after the first couple of races. I also find iracing ffb very wafty. They are different games and have their pros and cons but ultimately they are games that we play for the racing to have fun.
Well we're not comparing which game is more "fun".. We're comparing acc to a real car.. Which is acc,, This channel complains about the game having too many sound effects 😂 which can be adjusted but ok,, too many sounds 👍
@@SupernaturalPowerzthe only reason we have this comparison is because of the community’s obsession with which is closer to real life. Talk about focusing on the wrong thing. This comes from the same people that insist on calling them “sims” and get offended if you call them games.
Thanks for your honest review of the game. Can you do the others sims like AMS2, Rfactor2, Raceroom, Rennsport, etc.. also? As a pro driver your opinion in regards to realism is important. It's information we, as simracers only, never can get by ourself. After you can do a top 5 of your favorite sims or make a video what each sim does the best!
There is no "realistic" game! Just different flavors. But the "Rennsport" thing... You DO understand that they have gone "all in" with their chips, and are aiming to get iRacing's subcribership 1000 fold? They want to legitimize esport sim racing to the point it gets televised on major sports channels globally. They will either win big or bust. They are playing a high stakes game!!!! How much have they spent on the last 2 expos? a Million dollars US each time? And all the prize money? They are really trying to make a significant impression! I truly hope they succeed! But I have dim hopes in reality. (if they succeed, can you imagine how much they can invest in the "physics" and "force feedback"???)🤤🤤🤤
Would be interesting to see a comparison with first AC at it's present state to which it has been elevated by modding community. First of all I'm talking about cars with extended physics which includes more advanced tire model, complex suspension geometry simulation, aerodynamics and so on. Also, today new CSP preview came out and introduced car body flex and moving driver body weight influencing overall weight balance of a car!👀
The body flex is unused and undocumented, mainly because it's bad. Maybe later it can be used as a visual representation. Ilja devved it, not Jackson. COSMIC can support a 2nd chassis for flex, though.
I agree but Even vanilla AC is much better than ACC. it just feel right to drive even if its supposedly ''less advanced" a sim can have all the technical stuff but if it feels wrong its just wrong. looking forward to AC2!
@@JallyTeeCars in AC have non existent inertia and the cars have too much resistance/wobble in FFB like Daniel is pitching in this video. It seems like something Kunos is not willing to work out. Then the throttle and brakes require way too much pressure more than real life.
its fair, i knew its not 100% realistic and things are far off but its the best we can get besides iracing in terms of gt3 racing, and its fairly priced too. Its always good to hear opinion from a real life gt3 driver without much experiance in ACC, trying to drive the way you would in real life thats the key thing here. Of course the more you woould drive the more you would learn the way to be fast in ACC which isnt particulary realistic but as u mentioned its fun and gives us the glimpse of real life racing. I myself have like 2,5k hours in ACC, i also played Iracing for few months and i like both of the sims but im stick with ACC due to the pricing and yes, i couldnt get used to Iracing breaking after ACC.
If developers dont sit up and listen to this type of video they're missing out on a real opportunity to take a look at things that people identify as potential issues. Ive never driven a car on a race track in my life, but can imagine its a bit of a dance to get around quickly, not a binary set of commands at certain parts of the circuit. As always, great video Daniel 👊
Thanks Dave. I’m sure it’s a super complicated process in getting it right. I have a lot of respect for devs but if they want to improve a simulation game, just ask the drivers. I’m happy to help. Not here to bash but just want it be right if it’s called a “sim”
That was the kindest, SCATHING review I think ive ever seen. SO Canadian, and I love it! I used to race in the SCCA, sponsored by Brian Nott (R.I.P (Black Forest Motorsports)before I became disabled and even though ive got a decent fanatec rig, no matter which game I try, I just can't find that "tires on the asphalt" feel that I used to feel irl. That scrubbing feeling, the tire stuttering across the track when understeering and the rear end slide from oversteer or that perfect grip feeling that you grow to look for when your tires are in the "zone". I certainly cant afford to buy a motion rig but i wish i could find a sim that has those feelings programmed into its ffb. The closest i came was with rfactor2 at Sebring, but i had to fiddle with the settings every time i tried playing the tging and my seat time is far too limited by disability pain for me to spend 2 hours setting up a game to play and then not be able to play it because im in too much pain. You're honest review here really reinforced all of the stuff that I found troubling with ACC and in all honesty, ive lost quite a bit of interest in continuing to try using ACC to enjoy racing again in a sim environment. The A.I. cars are beyond obnoxious and hard enough in themselves to try and live with for me to continue fooling with ACC. Thank you so much for your honest review here with ACC. 🙏
Daniel, make sure you turn off the in-game damping settings in ACC and use firmware damping. ACC's damping is basically there for people who want zero oscillations, at the expense of being overdamped in most cases.
@@Rene_Bo I would turn all of the in-game FFB stuff off except GAIN and apply friction, damping and (little) inertia via firmware. To me it feels like ACC aims for a roughly 1:1 software gain and driver gain correlation in regards to mid-corner torques, so for a 10Nm wheel you would want to run 70-80% gain in ACC for a realistic 7-8Nm mid-corner. For a 20Nm wheel you would run 35-40% and so on. I haven't actually measured, but it's just my rough impression. Obviously the bumps will be unrealistic due to no PS simulation.
@@Rene_Bo Correct settings vary car-to-car but they're generally pretty similar. So for a PS car, hefty friction for the rack (About 2Nm for PS usually), hefty damper for either hydraulic fluid or EPS damper logic (and some simulation reasons, to help with oscillations) and a little bit of inertia to account for the components but also for simulation reasons, to help with oscillations near center. Inertia makes oscillations in transient worse, so beware. Generally on most bases 30/30/10 is a good starting point. I run more on Alpha Mini mainly driving roadcars, closer to 50/40/10. Not all bases will have "100%" mean the same thing so beware. There is no way to fully counteract oscillations in transient situations with DirectInput wheelbases, and the inertia setting that tunes out *all* oscillations near center is too high of a setting realistically and will result in a really high oscillation amplitude in transient, so I generally believe in minimizing inertia-induced oscillation and then just applying proper friction and damping. In GT cars where you will mostly be gripping the wheel and producing some natural damping from your hands, you can go closer to realistic settings, but I get a better experience going a bit higher on damping for drifting.
Thank you for checking out ACC, especially after the recent update. maybe you should offer your help with improving the game. I think working with a real driver could be a great benefit for everybody
@@ryomaprime3130 of course they should pay him. They could also advertise with his expertise. But I think Daniel wouldn't give his name for a product that he isn't 100% satisfied with
@Nathaniel87 Daniel just did "help with improving the game." Short of joining their R&D team anyways. He spent time testing out the latest update, made notes of what felt real to him, what could possibly be better & why he feels driving ACC too much would adversely affect his racing in real life. He then put together a 17 or so minute video about his conclusions which most know takes way longer than 17 minutes to compile & edit. He then shared those conclusions with anyone/everyone that chooses to watch it by uploading it to UA-cam. 👍
Iracing for me, but having a break from it as I started to focus to much on safety/i-rating then enjoying myself. Assetto corsa(w/manager) is my other go to sim.
About the FFB. Remove all "effects" in your wheelbase software. No damper no friction no inertia. Wheel should be completely light when not in the car. But make sure it receives damper info from the game. In game settings: Gain to preference, damper to preference(as low as possible without wobbling on the straights) No road effects Dynamic damper at 100%
ACC was the first sim I played. It was a lot of fun until I tried iRacing. However, going from ACC to iRacing was challenging due to the braking. I would consistently lock up in Iracing when I wouldn’t in ACC. However, once I learned how to brake in iracing, it’s made transitioning to other sims MUCH easier. I feel like iRacing taught me brake control whereas ACC taught me ABS control.
iRacing's braking is still wrong: while it follows the logic of decaying grip with downforce it's tuned completely wrong. In real life for the most part of hard brakings you want to kick the pedal almost as hard as possible and then bleed pressure off, it's that sudden increase of braking pressure that initiates the braking and makes all of the difference from stopping too late or nailing the entry. In iRacing you want to apply that pressure very gently and release it just as much, dragging a little percentage of braking all the way into the apex in what is known as trailbraking, which is also way too powerful compared to real life. This is because if you're pressing the brakes (no matter how much) you're basically asking some grip from the tyre, same goes for every time you turn the wheel; you'll understand that if you brake and turn at the same time you're inevitably taking potential performance out of both of these. In real life you'd expect the car to slow down into the apex but at the same time lose a bit of turning ability, generating some understeer, although very light. When you're off both brakes and the throttle, called coasting, that's when you get the most neutral rotation of the car usually. Trailbraking in iRacing never produces understeer because the lateral grip generated while holding very small percentages of input is much higher than you'd expect therefore coasting not only is useless but it's also detrimental. No sim does braking right because in real life the braking is calculated in how much weight you're applying to the pedal, from 0 to potentially infinite. In a game or sim they need to digitalize this and put a hard stop at one point, basically levelling the playing field. The way they did it in ACC is simply dumb because if two people brake at the same time applying 100% pressure until the apex, how on earth does one overtake the other?
@@danielebrambilla2290 nice insights! in the case of trailbraking / coasting in iracing i feel there is a lot of difference between the different gt3 cars. the way you describe is how i perceive to porsche to handle for example, but not so much the front engine cars. I also disagree that it is always faster to apply brake pressure slowly if you look at the telemetry of reasonably fast lap times. sure, weight transfer seems to be more delicate than in acc, but its not like you can never "kind of" kick the pedal in a hard braking zone. edit: talking about single lap pace and ignoring nurturing tyres over a stint.
@@markuskenel The Porsche being rear engined requires more trailbraking (deeper into the corner) because by holding the brakes you're loading the front axle, effectively pushing the front tyres into the ground, expanding their contact patch and extracting more grip, with the unwanted effect of overheating and wearing them. By doing this, you can lift the rear and make it rotate in a more predictable way, being able to play on the edge of grip. It is a very hard car and also one of a kind though, as the AMG for example having a longer wheelbase and being front engined is naturally more loaded at the front and will tend to have a more precise and direct front end so a lot of trailbraking does nothing but creating more understeer, to which you might respond with more turning input and therefore creating oversteer. I haven't driven every single car in iRacing but I tried almost all the GT3's and they all require the same trailbraking technique.
I'm always surprised how different drivers' comments regarding braking can be. I listened to several interviews (Romain Monty, James Baldwin etc) and they all say that they crush the brake pedal 100% IRL. and others like Daniel say just the opposite. surprising
Well there's no such thing as "100%" IRL, you can always press the pedal harder. But almost any GT3/GT4 onboard will show the drivers are heavily leaning on the ABS in the big braking zones.
I actually feel the braking between the sims is the same essentially. If you assume 60% on iracing is 100% on acc. If you would deadzone the last 40% of your pedal from your iracing settings for acc you can use pretty much the same technique.
@@daviddanser8011what happens if you brake 61% does abs just take over up to 100% because if not (to my 16:50 understanding) it wouldn't be the same? I don't play either game. I was just curious. I've played a lot of ac and was interested in acc but there definitely seems to be different than I had hoped
I know what you mean about that mid corner wobble on the wheel! I think there trying to simulate the tire digging into the pavement. I’m an avid player of ACC usually when that feeling comes I find I’m getting my best lap times. I’m also an ex race car driver. Never driven GT3. But raced karts and formula cars and briefly touring cars. I’m always comparing also. But I’ve given up lol. It’s a game and it’s fun! Thank you for the video!
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Good point too. These games and software titles are full of compromises. They are supposed to be fun and cater to millions of users with different hardware, skills and expectations.
Thanks Daniel, your insight between RL and game is priceless. The fact the we have reached a stage in gaming that we are able to compare it to RL is amazing. Thanks
Great video Dan. The brake always felt off to me as well. You need to nail the brake point and smash the pedal 100% and that just never seemed like how driving a car works to me.
That's what telemetry suggests. Peak braking IRL is probably higher than what peak braking can be achieved in ACC. It's one reason why ACC needs more braking on average.
Quick note from someone who played ACC for years and just got iRacing two months ago. After like 60h in iRacing i saw a dramatic improvement in my braking in ACC and irl karting. Previously I felt like every hard braking corner is a gamble if I make it or not. Now I have so much more control on the brakes and I don't lean on ABS that much anymore. I feel like I just have much more control of the car. In 2 months I went from being 2-3 seconds slower than the fast times on LFM to being more like 1,5 seconds off in both quali and race pace. Let's see how far I can take this driving both sims back to back for some time.
Awesome vid, big guy. I bet the community would love it if you could review the other sims, like raceroom, rf2 and ams2 as well. Personally iRacing and raceroom are my favorites, but they drive a bit different.
great video! i haven't played ACC much, but I appreciate the honest input... and you presented the negative feedback in a totally professional way so I hope the rest of the conversation (and i'm sure there will be a lot :) stays at the same level ..
Interesting and brave video. This topic can be like mixing gasoline, dry wood and burning napalm. As a sim racer, predominantly ACC, I've seen a few of these videos now and other real race car drivers have said the opposite, but one thing Ive learned is that you will find the realism in what ever sim you're familiar with. So drive what you find more realistic.. As you said at the end of the video "it's all pretend", but personally I can pretend more realistically in ACC. Love the content looking forward to your next video. 👌😊👍
Great video, personally never got on well with ACC even with a DD wheel just can't get the feel of the car as you say. I get that people learn how to play the game and master it if you put the hours in, just don't have those hours to do it and generally end up frustrated not knowing where the pace is as you can't sense it from the car or the data they provide
What i do in all of the sims when i practice to get fast really fast is to practice on rain with slick tires and try to push as hard as i can there u learn how to control the car and get a better sence when u got grip and when not. After some practice i go back to dry weather much better car controll and sence of where the limit is and Grip. i usually never sim-race i do for 1-3 weeks a year sometimes im off 1-1.5seconds behind the Aliens so yeah this training works :)
Thanks for making the video. My problem with it is that it still doesn’t seem like you put in enough time or even have your control /audio settings dialed in correctly. You admit it yourself in the video . There are also racing drivers on UA-cam who disagree with what you are saying, though they have criticisms with it just as you do with iRacing. Personally, I’ve had to adjust my wheel settings and my pedal settings when switching between the sims to achieve the proper feel. I will say that I agree in that if we had a nice blend it would be close and that there is no perfect sim.
I still need to optimize it but I can tell you right now, even with max optimization, it still feels off. It’s fun but it isn’t realistic vs some other titles.
@@danielmorad I appreciate your reply but my confusion is that you have other people who drive at your level who are disagreeing with you and it's like who do we TRUST?! haha. As someone who has done sim racing for a very long time the settings make a huge difference with what's going on. I 100 percent believe for you that it's not there for your style and preferences, I kind of take issue with how you call it a video game level thing, because you are having quite the influence on a lot of people who hang on your word. But honestly that's them instead of you. I am heavy into flight sim and have a long career in the Air Force and that community has a very similar issue where pilots will disagree on the accuracy of public sims on which is more realistic and isn't. It's super interesting to see given they fly the exact same machinery. I definitely respect your opinion, though I admit I am eager to find out if there are more drivers who agree with you...then we can all have those who prefer iRacing and all those who prefer ACC just argue at a roundtable for your next video haha.
I think when it comes to the sound point that you brought up, I believe it is so that it can at least to some extent compensate for the feedback you can't get from a sim no matter your setup. Some of the actual F1 drivers have really bizzare sound settings in iRacing, especially the tyre sound, just so that they can get an advantage from the sound that compensates for lack of some realistic feedback. I might not be 100% correct, but I've heard that more than once so there might be some merit to it.
I love the way you articulate everything (especially in this video). Perhaps the makers of ACC should listen to you (and others at your level), and maybe focus on being able to "tune" settings based on your feedback. So, if the player wants a game experience...great. However, if they want it to be as realistic as possible (based on expert feedback), we can choose specific driver recommendations. I know this is a big ask (based on physics), but that over features/graphics etc. would be a killer feature/benefit.
Awesome video!!! Thank you for the honest feedback. Your honesty and experience is what makes your channel the best out there. Keep up the great work!!!
thanks for the honest and well argued review. I'd be very curious if you could do the same with Rfactor 2 (which in my humble opinion is still the greatest in terms of pure driving feel)
Fake news, online rf2 race on leagues are just perfect, just miss a multiplayer and rating. LFM is intresting too, and s397’is working on a new compétition system. I ve been playing rf2 online race since 1 year without issues
Wow, first of all I apologize it took me 5 days to watch this & thank you so much for making this! I don’t quite understand the the lash out from our fellow ACC drivers, you are a real driver & we asked for your opinion so thank you Daniel for putting the time together to make this video. Our team has these same discussions & as I’ve mentioned we are divided up on both platforms as a team. If you don’t mind sharing one other opinion it be much appreciated. David Perel, James Baldwin for example more so the former have many hours behind the wheel of a real GT3 car as well & prefer ACC as their more “realistic” Sim I guess proving it comes down to preference sometimes? Thanks so much for sharing everything & we look forward to seeing you soon 🤙🏽
Thank you for this video. I really appreciate a real-life perspective on it. You should try ALL sims and give us your opinion: - Automobilista (2016); - rFactor 2 (2013); - Assetto Corsa (2014); - Automobilista 2 (2020).
Interesting what you said about braking into high speed corners in ACC. I find myself intuitively braking softer into high speed corners and comparing to fast drivers’ telemetry I see that that’s where I’m losing time and I have to force myself to brake hard there and I don’t feel entirely comfortable with it.
Ok really good stuff Daniel!! Im mainly on ACC and a little on RF2, the pricetag on iRacing is holding me back.. Would love to hear your thoughts on other sims, such as ams2, rf2 and raceroom - perhaps even Rennsport if you got a beta for it 🤩
Very detailed explanation. I thoroughly loved this. These are the kind of things developers need to listen to in order to further improve on sims going forward. Thank you so much for taking the time to make this video :)
Thanks for your honest opinion. Your videos are very interesting. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and expertise with us. I would be very interested in your opinion about RFactor 2. As you probably know, many say that it has the most realistic driving physics. And I also have to say that this seems the most realistic for me too. For me it is the only sim who really creates a sense of connection to the road. But i am not a race driver. You are so i would be very happy to hear your opinion. 😊 Best regards
As a real world pilot who has the odd discussion with simulator pilots I think I understand your point of view. As a pilot,what I want from a simulator is something that encourages me to think as I would when operating a real aircraft. What simmers want is that notional feeling and experience of flight which is usually brought about by exaggerating certain aspects whilst dampening down others. I guess as real world racing drivers, what you want from a sim might not be what dreamers like me want to experience.
Thanks for this Daniel. I went from ACC to iRacing and haven’t looked back, for similar reasons you suggested. Good luck in Europe (assume you’re racing lol).
Thanks for the video With 100+ hours on ACC, I recently switched to iRacing and I prefer the driving in iRacing. I feel more connected to the road (never drove a gt3 or gt4 of course) and the braking is much better. I had to relearn how to brake from smashing to 100% to true finesse
@@ETKAE That makes sense. I'm glad that ACC offers a variety of cars/tracks/dlc at a fair price. It just means that many racers get to experience awesome racing at various price points. That's definitely a win.
I think the feel of disconnect in ffb and steering is something i could never get used to. I have a hard time finding that sweet spot and attack each lap consistently. I feel im always guessing when im attacking corners in ACC which just felt weird to me and I have quite a lot of hours in the game.
Yeah, finding the sweet spot based on feel can be very tricky in ACC. I say this as someone with over 550 hours in ACC. Still my only sim so far, apart from having tried iRacing for a month or so, but unlike Daniel I didn't like the FFB in iRacing at all. Felt very light and numb in my opinion. Funny how that works, the exact opposite. Maybe it's because I only tried the MX-5s but the FFB (and the pricing especially) is what made me bounce off iRacing hard. I think FFB is a matter of personal taste as well probably. But going back to ACC: I think attacking corners in ACC is based more on memory than feel, and that makes ACC very difficult to master IMO. I'll admit I'm still struggling with the braking in some of the corners although my shitty setup probably has a lot to do with it as well (no rig yet). But since comparing myself with telemetry from Popometer I've discovered that my braking still needs work, especially brake release. The fast guys tend to brake a little bit earlier than I do, then lean on the ABS for quite a long time, and then release the brakes relatively quickly but smoothly. That's going to require some adjusting from me due to bad habits, but I've only made this discovery thanks to the telemetry and not the feel I get from the sim. You really have to remember like: "oh, now this corner is coming up again, I have to hold the brakes for this long, and release the brakes like that" etc, and that's for every corner in every lap. But not every corner requires 100% brake. That upsets the balance of the car too much. Look at Nils Naujoks, he explains is very well. Hoping AC2 improves on some of these areas a bit. For sure it's good to hear these things from a real driver. Would like to see you do a video on the other sims as well if you feel like doing that.
@@nimz7309 I don't like to guess on what the car is doing. This is what ACC feels like to me most times as I have a hard time feeling what the front end is doing. I understand these are all "games" we play and its impossible to get a full ass in seat feel as in real car but as you said because the lack of feedback ACC becomes a lot harder to master. I am totally talking about steering feedback, braking in ACC never really bothered me that much. As for iracing ffb some cars do feel completely numb vs others. MX-5 has never been that exciting to drive in iracing.
@@danielmoradi don’t think i have ever seen so mutch good comments and discussions under a video. I am just reading it all for so long. Lovely community in simracing
Great points you go by in the video; I always felt disconnected in ACC to the point to not enjoying the experience. There are a few sims that taunt real life physics it would be nice to have the view of a real driver, those been: rFactor2, raceRoom Bout has licensed GT3 content, it would be nice to have your view
See I feel the same way about iRacing how you feel about ACC. Played aboutt he ssme amount of time on both. Just cant get comfortable in iRacing and seetle right in in ACC. I think you nailed it when you said its a preference thing and its all racing at the end of the day. Happy safe and clean racing everyone!!
Daniel Morad, there is a Brazilian pilot named Vitor Genz who does a good job of explaining the differences between simulators and real life. It's great to see real pilos talking about their impressions of the simulators. Because few people have the opportunity to drive real cars. That's why your impressions about how much reality simulators can offer are very important. Keep up the good work, we just have to thank you for your time dedicated to trying to translate these two worlds. Thank you and success!
my thoughts exactly, I play it after a big update to see if they've made it closer to my liking then it gets parked until the next update. You should do a similar video on Assetto Corsa, I have all the sims and I always end up back on AC
@@danielmorad well wat are you waiting for its pretty inexpensive and not difficult to get content manager up and running. been doing a bunch of sim drifting on it
@@danielmorad yeah, don't just play vanilla AC though, content manager and the latest custom shader patch really bring the best out of the game. Yeah the drifting and the mod tracks and cars for the drifting is unreal on AC, you will LOVE IT!
I had the same feeling about mid corners. I thought it was my wheel setting but I never quite know what the car is doing or going to do feedback wise and never felt connected to the car. Tire temp model changes from lap to lap felt very extreme on how it affected handling.
I didn’t play the game because of it. But recently I gave it a try again and it’s much better in my opinion. The 1.9 update has something to do with it for sure.
This is a relief to hear! I got on ACC for the first time last night after 300+ hrs on GT7 and I was freaking about how difficult it was to trail brake into a corner. Also, the brakes never felt adequate for the car and too much braking vibration with little feedback.
I love ACC, it's my main sim. One reason is the lowfuelmotorsport platform, which provides a rating system and seasonal championships like iRacing. I like the graphics and the sharp FFB. But in terms of physics I fully agree: the suspension is too stiff (although it was improved a lot eith 1.9), and braking... you can of course brake like on iRacing or rFactor2, but you will be a lot slower. And that's why I think in terms of physics and how the car behaves is much better on the other two mentioned sims. But another major thing that puts ACC higher for me is the SRO license... while unfortunatly it's not possible to recreate a full GT World season because a lot of tracks are missing, you still have to admit, that the whole GT3 experience is best on ACC. Other Sims are either missing a lot of cars and the ones included are outdated. But like you said, Dan: there should be room for all of them, because no sim is perfect, each one has it's strengths. Many people overlook Automobilista 2, because they think it's just a total conversion of Project Cars 2... but in fact the physics are great, much like rF2 or even more like iRacing, the graphics are great, less demanding as ACC and thus very fluid and smooth. And not only the devs Reiza Studios announced Le Mans coming to AMS2, but the GT3 roster is said to be upgraded too. The only thing - huge part - that hinders AMS2 from being more popular is the online multiplayer, which is clunky and rarely existend, because there is no major platform with hosted races. But who knows? Well AMS2 has become my go-to sim for racing on the Nordschleife.
I really like the way you put this. And I totally agree that there is space for everybody to enjoy, which ever game they like. I don’t understand why there is so much hostility. My opinion is at the end of the day, my opinion. I drove the car in real life. I can share what I feel, but it doesn’t mean that it’s not fun for others to enjoy. I feel like there’s a sense of tribalism with this. I can see in some of the comments that people are very angry. It’s like they want me to say it’s good just for them to enjoy it.
@@danielmorad Jup... I'm part of a big german sim racing community as a moderator, following one of the fastest ACC drivers and I already got DMs like "you gotta see this, Morad is roasting ACC!". And I am like "yeah, well, not roasting maybe, but I see it almost exactly his way, I think iRacing is far more relatable on how the cars are feeling", and many of our longterm community members know my opinion, that I had my problems with ACC when I dipped my toes deeper into sims like iRacing and rFactor 2. And I am far away from being a real life racedriver, I don't know if I could go anyway near as fast on a track like in the virtual world without sh***ing my pants, lol. And like you said, the tyre model is great on ACC. rFactor 2 was said to have the best tyre model, but I think it's too punishing concerning flat spots... makes you better and more precise on your braking foot, yes, but one time braking a little too hard and your tyres are imediately turning into cubes =). And... your opinion is your's, people should deal with it and calm down. There are real world race drivers who really put some time into ACC, but some of them are formula drivers or are seated in other cars like Porsche or Audi, maybe those feel closer to the real thing on ACC, than the AMG. I have one suggestion for you, Dan: Maybe try the Porsche 992 GT3 Cup and the AMG GT4, if you haven't. Braking still feels different then on iRacing, but you can't smash the brake like on GT3s. And another suggestion concerning Force Feedback: I don't drive with a Simucube wheelbase, but very similar in strength and FFB performance, and I think you might have too much damping on it. I remember you prefer a dampened FFB because it feels more realistic (even as a non-racing car driver I know that you don't feel road texture in your wheel, but with your butt and if you have one foot off the pedals, so again I agree with you, haha). I run with 10% damping because I use a tactile transducer on my seat, but I still feel exactly when grip loss occurs.
When I drive GT3s in sims other than ACC, it's not that simple. I played iRacing, RF2, Raceroom, and most recently, GTR2. You try to brake in GTR2 at 100% with low ABS assist, the car will lock up and outright spin. The driving school wants you to brake with finesse. ACC has taught me some terrible habits about braking which it's a bit hard for me to shake off. Now that I remember, I said the exact same thing to myself back when I was driving GTEs in RF2's endurance league. Now I get the whole picture. Thanks Daniel. Your feedback has been very insightful. :)
This is exactly how I feel about ACC and there could not be a better word than "Numb" to describe the FFB feel. I would love to be able to enjoy ACC, graphics is superb and I know people are having tons of fun in the LFM league, I just couldn't get the settings work for me. I'm regularly on Iracing and Raceroom, would love to hear your thoughts about Raceroom
I assume this could be a result because of "wrong" driver settings and ingame FFB settings. I don't have a current iRacing subscription, but I have ACC, AC, AMS2, RF2 and Raceroom installed and for me ACC is providing the best FFB, it feels fantastic and realistic on most of the tracks. But there are also some tracks where it's feeling realy numb on the front, e.g. Watkins Glen.
@@_antwonTT6 I can show you real GT3 drivers that are training on ACC and say its quite realistic. He just doesnt want to like it. I mean, he doesnt have to, but this is not a review at all.
@@lupo_aim I can also show you the ACC GTWC Events that were held on ACC with Current Roster drivers during the Covid season who literally got up and walked away mid race because of how much everything they do IRL does not translate to this game. Again, You calling him a schill is a little off the mark fam. Everyone has a preference. He didnt go the GamerMuscle route where he shits on every single thing about that game. He gave real life experience into his opinion and somehow that touched a nerve with you.
Great video and kudos to Daniel for taking the time to make it. I can really apreciate his honesty. But, there is one thing everybody seems to forget and that is the fact that very few of us race in real life. For Daniel it makes one hell of a difference if he wants to practice on a SIM, on how close it is to the real thing. For the rest of us, well It's just a choice we make of what for us, feels close to the real thing. For us, other then having an opinion about a SIM, it really makes no difference what we drive since we don't have the real thing to compare with. And the best way to proof this is by looking at the hardware we use. I would say that I have a fairly decent hardware setup, but that still does'nt make me the fastest or best driver out there. I'm about average, that's it and I can life with it, because I enjoy it and have lots of fun. There are people out there that have low-end equipment, but are among, if not the fastest drivers out there. In other words, the pressure point of the brake pedal or how sensitive it is don't mean squad if you have the "best" SIM and G29 or T150 pedals. As I can appreciate this video and the work Daniel put into it, again great work, it does'nt make me switch to another SIM. I got ACC, because I love GT cars and only drive Porsche. I got AC, rfactor and RaceRoom but startet out with PC2 on PS4, but basically only drive ACC. I say each his own as long you enjoy what you're doing.
While your point still stands I’d say this. Keep in mind this is also just one racing drivers opinion. Plenty of other racing drivers on UA-cam who have a different opinion than his with ACC. Ones who took the time with it like he did with iRacing. Keep in mind Daniel himself had his biases against it before he tried it and admitted himself he didn’t give it enough time. He even says that here. He, like us and other racing drivers, has his own preferences . We also fine tune audio and control settings. It really sounds like he hasn’t figured this out even though he does this with iracing .
@roewedge maybe he does this because he is looking for a true to realism of the car he is racing. It's clear to me acc does not do this. He states it multiple times, his chanel, specifically when reviewing racing titles looks at it from a real world view of that specific car. I don't know what more you could ask for. Yes, fine tunning is important to extract lap time and feeling to an extent, but it's very clear acc does not resemble the real thing. It should be a relatively fast adjustment period to figure out. You don't need to spend that much time to tell if it resembles the real thing, iracing appears to be more similar hence the amount of time he spends on that sim platform. Just my opinion..
@@robertulrich7150 The problem is he went into it already knowing he wasn't going to like the game. He's highly affiliated with iRacing even if he wants to say he isn't. He is biased as heck. His first time he was playing the game with all the assists on while complaining. You can't spend days or even months fine tuning your setup for one game and then turn around and spend an hour or two on another without fine tuning and have an honest and valid opinion. I've seen plenty of other real life GT3 drivers say the complete opposite of what he's saying. He can have his opinion but people shouldn't take it as fact because he's a GT3 driver in real life, which seems like he wants people to do. Especially when he's heavily invested and plays iRacing and has his setup fine tuned for it. I do like a lot of his content, I'm not trying to shit on him but when it comes to the reviews on ACC, it just seems like he wants to stir up controversy to get more attention on his channel.
@TurncoatTony I don't know, man.... I've heard this same conversation a hundred times. I've jumped back and forth on both and they feel pretty different. I'm also a no life porsche gt3/4 guy as well. However, I do race other cars/series here and there. The fact is no game/simulator is going to be 1/1 to a specific car unless it was built to the specs of that car/track. My question is, what creates realism in terms of replicating a similar driving experience. I've driven both for a long time and had many conversations with IRL drivers in all sorts of classes. My results from asking is most prefer iracing mainly due to the way the brake Is applied in the late phase. (Not car specific) In my opinion, the braking model is probably one of the most important aspects. Yes it's not the only thing, but to me that's the most important. I don't just use the sim to race online, I use it to practice and translate to the track. I think either one of these sims will help do that. However, in my opinion from conversation of non affiliated UA-camrs to iracing/acc, seems like iracing is slightly ahead. I've asked many of the same questions to many current and past drivers, not because it's who's right or wrong but for choosing the right path to invest time to practice and enjoy.
I was there at COTA (May 20th & 21st) watching and had a go on one of the Fanatec setup they had on the 2nd floor viewing area above the paddock. I didn’t mess with any settings and used the AMG GT3 on COTA just since I thought it was cool to play what was happening IRL right in front of me. First thing that occurred to me was just how much you had to slam the brakes to avoid locking up and going off track in the corners. I’m coming from a pretty entry or low-mid level Thrustmaster Load Cell Pedals and T300 wheelbase, so the increased overall FFB from the stronger direct drive wheel took some getting used to. My IRL track experience is 5 laps in a Ferrari 458 Challenge Evo around a smaller track in Modena, but other than overall braking requiring a hefty push, I don’t recall having to push it darn near all the way down on nearly every corner. Main thing I wanted to ask you: what are the IRL setups like compared to those used to achieve competitive lap times in ACC? Are the real cars setup closer to the base setup ACC starts you with, or do they lean more towards the setups of people like Fri3d0lf that utilize negative toe, camber, positive rake, etc. ? Any info would be greatly appreciated! Love your insight on these topics!
your views on braking and mid-corner were pretty much the feelings I had.... with my limited experience. Unfortunately ACC doesn't get as much drive time from me compared to iRacing because of the overall dampened feel of ACC. The ACC tire model feels much better to me tho
always found the vagueness of braking in ACC very unintuitive compared to other sims. feel you just have to run several laps of trial and error until you find the right way
I have been on iracing for 5 years tried ACC in the beginning and realized it had a long way to go . After the 1.90 release and spending a lot of time on it fine tuning it which did take a lot of time which i dont think you did i wont go back to iRacing till they fix the ice racing affect and the poor graphics . Iracing is about making money now i feel. I think your to bias towards iracing due your coaching on it and scared to run iracing down . This is my opinion. Sorry if it offends .😂
I agree with you the graphics need to be updated. Unfortunately with a subscription service, they do not want to risk losing a piece of that revenue by updating graphics to a point where some cannot use the service.
@@smoove7932 They've literally been upgrading the graphics in the engine. The problem is they have to update all the tracks to make use of it. Which takes a lot of time, because they basically have to redo everything from scratch to make use of it.
There are a lot of different oppinions out there. And tbh, i am tired of that "iracing is the holy grail, vs acc is better" stuff. There are IRL drivers that say ACC is right, and there are IRL Drivers that say iRacing is right. So what now? The problem here is that the iRacing fanboys just listen to their "iRacing is better"-Drivers and the ACC fanboys only listen to their "ACC is right"-Drivers. So all of this makes no sence! There is no IRL Driver our there who is "more right" than another. At the end this are all just Video Games and people should enjoy what they want! And what you should not forget here: Daniel is a main iRacing driver. He never put the same effort into ACC which he puts into iRacing. Thats a huge thing and quite biased. I was iRacing main, and switched to ACC long time ago, because out of the Box, in ACC it felt like driving a CAR that has weight, while in iRacing it feels in EVERY car the same and somehow nowhere near that, what i can feel in a IRL car. But again, thats also just an OPPINION. There is no right and wrong...
@@danielmorad you are going to have to judge that for yourself. Original AC is looming with correlation issues to production cars and the GT3 cars feel like they are on ice. It’s a dated game and it shows itself quickly.
@@Cal3000 That's just the original content GT cars from Kunos being modeled badly, the game engine and physics are still superior. 3rd party mod cars such as those from RSS have far better suspension and aero values which make the cars perform very similarly to ACC and iRacing.
@@1o891 the problem I have is that content is all over the place with the quality level. Nothing really feels refined. In a sea of content, there’s only a few good mods.
Great video. I’m so glad you are having the wobble/bouncing effect in the corners, I thought there was a problem with my wheel. I really enjoy ACC but the wobble just puts me off. Let’s hope they dial it out in a future update.
This comparison between ACC and a real GT3 is mind blowing because it makes you realize that it's all extremely subjective. In fact, on the subject I have read and sometimes personally listened to opinions of drivers of real GT3 cars that are very contrasting if not completely opposite: what for some is a strong point of the simulator is for others a flaw. Ultimately these types of videos seem to be made solely and specifically to accumulate views and nothing more.
I turned off "dynamic dampening" in ACC and the interpolation filter/inertia/friction/dampening in the driver and have a way better feeling now. I have not been racing GT3 but BMW M2 a little.
Thanks for you honest, helpful and unbiased comments from an expert professional drivers point of view. We need more real race-car drivers doing these comparisons, rather than simply experienced sim-racers, or worst of all straight up fanboys. Your views certainly impact my view of ACC as they should, and not just because they are not inconsistent with my discomfort with ACC (I've installed and tried and uninstalled about 10 times minimum). Your video will trigger untold amounts of cognitive dissonance among many fanboys and no doubt you will bear the brunt of that ire. So appreciate you all the more for your clarity and seriousness. Keep these coming. You certainly have found a great niche. How about doing the same for RF2, AC, AMS2 & others?
I've had ACC since it came out and cannot understand how the brakes can be so much worse than AC, which came out almost a decade ago. There is nothing realistic about ACC brakes
Thx for your opinion mate ,Im like you ,that want the racing feeling to be so close to real life,but I haven't tried a real racecar ,so your feedback is amazing I have played sim for 20 + years and still Loving it ,so thanks again and have a fantastic New year
Daniel, with respect your expertise and focus on realism in relation to handling would be best served comparing rFactor 2 to real life. Would love to see a video on that
Interesting video. I have never driven anything near a real racecar or been on a racetrack so I would never be able to review realism when choosing what sim to drive. I think this is true for 95% of all simracers. So I guess there are two approaches. 1. Find a real racecar driver, like Daniel here and listen to what he says. The problem with that is that another real racecar driver says that another game is more realistic. I guess the reason for that is that the two are valuing different aspects of realism, for Daniel the brakes are the most important part of realism, for another is how tires or downforce are modelled. So both would be right but it depends on the view. Also, what sim you played the most. I think that if we drive the same sim all the time, we know what to expect in a way that makes us "forget" that it might not be as realistic as we think it is. 2. Forget about what real racecar drivers think. For most of us, we will never be on the same level when it comes to being at the limit of what car can do, and even if we did, does it matter if it is very close to real life or not? We won't drive real racecars so we will have no use of the realism anyway. Me, I am a 2. I don't care if it is realistic in the sense that it is driving like a real racecar, I will never be able to actually tell the difference anyway. I want it to feel believable for ME. Does it feel like I am in a game or a car? If it feels like a car, I am happy. That's why I value graphics and sound, not more than the driving but more than small differences in FFB or ABS behavior. Yeah, the sound maybe overdone in ACC, but when I drive a car I can hear the reverberation from walls in a tunnel or pebbles on the ground shooting from the wheel into the inside of the car. So I am happy. And I play almost all sims depending on what I want to drive. For GT3, its ACC, For endurance, iRacing, for just driving around against AI probably AMS2. I also tipped my toes into AC1 multiplayer on LFM to try more types of cars.
Can you please make a video on how to correctly setup the brakes in iracing? How they should feel, how much force, settings for making it easier to trailbrake, etc.
It would be great. Although I really like how challenging the breaking is in iRacing, I have the feeling I have to apply too little force on the pedal although my load cell is at 100% (I own a Fanatec CS v3)
We’ll wait for Daniel’s answer, of course, but I believe he said 40-50 kg of force on the brake pedal. He also has a video where he demonstrates using the muscles in the thigh for the initial braking and then anchors his heel and uses his the fast-twitch muscles to control the anchor for the fine small movements to modulate and trail brake.
@PloSkys73 a good way to decide track purchases is head to the forums and have a look at the class of car you want to focus on. have a look at past schedules. As for most of the c+ license series the community votes on tracks. There will be certain tracks that are featured more often than others across the different series... ie GT3 will be at more mid to large size tracks that feature in current series irl worldwide.. where say GR86/Mx5 is going to see more variety of tracks in the mid/shorter size
Thanks a lot, for the review, your time, and for the risk of doing a video like that, some people can't undrestand that other people can have another point of view about sims or anything, in this case you are a real life GT3 and GT4 driver and most of us not so for me is why your opinions are so valuable. Thanks again.
My pleasure. I know that there are some people who emotionally cannot handle the truth. It’s tough these days in 2023 for people to acknowledge what is true. These are just the examples. I am bringing as a real life driver who drives the very car I was testing. I just find it astonishing how many haters came out to comment with empty statements and no facts.
@@danielmoradYes, that is unfortunately true. I am very curious to hear more feedback after your season. According to my gut feeling and logical thinking, I see it like this: 1st place rFactor2 2nd place RaceRoom 3rd place Assetto Corsa 4th place AMS2 (It's slowly getting going, but it's still taking time). The interesting thing is that the first two sims run on the isiEngine. rF2 runs on the isiEngine 2.5. This engine is predestined to simulate motorsport. rFactor Pro also runs on this engine, but it is reserved exclusively for professional teams such as F1. Normal people like me have no access to it. But that's not a bad thing, because rF2 is a derivative of rFactor Pro. Have you never come into contact with it? The truth is, I've never sat in a real sports car. But my mind tells me and the vast majority confirm that these sims are currently the non plus ultra.
I recently purchased the GT4 pack for 7.99 on ACC. I was surprised how nice they are, nicer than GT3 which I mostly try to drive. Possibly the faster the car type the harder it is to simulate. These are games and, in my opinion, firstly tehy should be rated for the game quality. I like ACC as a game, the interface, the graphics, the stability, the speed of loading, the price, the details and concentration on something and then I have never driven a GT3 or GT4 so I cannot comment on the sim quality. Your video, the one with the helmet camera in the AMG GT3 is pretty striking. Forget considering these things not as games. I wanna see the sim racers driving, as committed as yourself, running around half a million dollar of machinery inside a can...good luck. In my sim I also have air conditioning. None better than yourself are aware of the difference. It's total.
Simulators should be evaluated on realism, accuracy and representation, it is simple. Calling something a game does not excuse its shortcomings in relation to other games that do those things better. That comparison is the point here.
@@SvalbardSleeperDistrictou could easily make a video like this on iracing as well. There is a lot of things wrong (tyre model fi) and not realistic there either. Just other stuff. Let’s face it not a single simulator is realistic, There is plenty of real life drivers who find acc the most realistic so it is also a matter of preference and what you are used to in the end.
@@daviddanser8011 Even if we assume that this overly vague framing is accurate, that does not change anything in the point I was making in my reply to the original comment. I wasn't even suggesting any specific sim is more realistic than another.
@@SvalbardSleeperDistrict It's a game, for the others please buy a GT3 car. Maybe, maybe Dallara, Ferrari simulators are somehow closer to something. For sure though, if a game doesn't load, doesn't look pretty, isn't stable, it's affordable, there's no reason to play it. I'm having a hard time understanding how people that don't drive GT3 or run Ferrari's simulator or similar are expecting these things to be realistic.
@@zzmadd Ok buddy, if all you can do is repeat the same nondescript, contentless, vague line of "it's a game" and refuse to recognise difference between arcade and simulation, and degrees of quality of realism between different simulations/simcades, I cannot help you further. Play Mario Kart and tell yourself it's the same as iRacing/ACC/rFactor/etc because they are all "games".
Impressive review with nice deconstructions of key elements -- especially the braking and mid-corner FFB. The feel of load transfer and slip angle in the tires/chassis when near the limit has always been a learning curve for me in every sim. Predominant has been the 'numbness' as you also described it and I have found myself relying on sound as much as anything else to fish for cues. Many have posted recommendations on your critique and it would be great to see if any of the community's suggestions has improved your experience. Knowing how to dial in your sim setup is so important and having your IRL experience is such a plus. Also, I would love for you to explore how you alter your inputs/racecraft based on the particular physics model. Really enjoying your content and appreciate your mature approach demonstrated at the end of this video...Moradness!
I’m totally open to optimizing the game and trying it again. I’m not here to bash anybody in particular or anyone. I just gave my honest feedback about what I thought as a real life driver who drives the exact same car in real life. In fact, I am actually in the video game. That should make anybody want to play it.
@@danielmorad Your unbiased feedback came through loud and clear for me...there will always be biased fanboys though. But you know this. So many other interesting topics for you to explore through your unique lens. Let's go!
Just did about 5 hours of back to back comparisons of iRacing vs ACC using the same tracks and cars. After being an ACC fan, I'm now converted to iRacing for its familiar feel, natural feel. It has a special, controllable feel over ACC. I never thought I'd be converted, yet I am! My friend too!
Daniel, thanks so much for your feedback on trying to make Sim driving more realistic for all of us who are not real Racing Drivers! Would love to hear more about other sims too, but don't want you to feel any added pressure from the Community! Love anything you can help Sim Drivers with though, and it's all appreciated!
That is so weird, my driving, especially when it comes to braking, is so different from what you are describing...for instance i was practicing in snetterton today and i rarely go full 100% on the brakes, a lot of times i keep it between 20 to 70% unless i'm braking on a straight line for an hairpin...
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What you pointed out about the brakes is probably what puts me off in every simulator I've tried, except for Sports Car GT and Need For Speed Porsche Unleashed from decades ago, which felt more realistic than anything since then (but I was playing those with keyboard). I just couldn't point out what was feeling odd, but it was probably the brakes and the mid-corner experience. I watched your other video on the AMG GT4 in iRacing. It seems I should give that a try too, as I've never tried iRacing before. To date, I've found real-life cars (even the least powerful ones) more enjoyable than any car in a simulator. Real cars don't even have to be high-powered to offer a pleasurable drive. It's so great that you can share your real-world experience and compare it with the simulators. I am glad I discovered your channel!
I've been waiting for this video for very long time. Many thanks Dan! I used to be an ACC fanboy, but the more I improve my driving technique and understand how the weight transfer and braking works of a car, the more I realize that ACC is still far from where it should be. I would love if you could do the same with RFactor 2. In my humble opinion, the physics are closer to iRacing but the tire grip is overdone. In other words, it feels that tire grip is infinite.
Get exactly what you say about the braking. I've found I've learned the most about braking in the last 6 months by getting rid of abs and tc on every car I drive, so I can better learn thresholds. I started initially with the GT4 Maserati which has none anyway. Hasn't made me a particularly quick driver, but I have made improvements with my own times and a much better understanding of control and able to achieve consistency. I've found that much more enjoyable and immersive than just stamping on the pedal. Works for me, anyway. Also re. Mid corner feel - maybe it's the slip? I don't get the same feel as they did achieve in AC1, where the wheel stiffens up until you break grip when it goes loose. For me, that feels much better, but I'm no racer irl. Enjoy your content very much
@Daniel: Thank you very much for sharing your impressions of ACC with your background as an professional race driver. You trying to be diplomatic, but somehow I have also the feeling you are reviewing ACC form the perspektive of an IRacing driver :D. IRacing and ACC(@LFM League) are todays most played racing sims. Both, ACC and IRacing have their strengs & weaks regarding realism I think. I just want to add some points from the perspektive as automotive engineer. As you pointed out, the tire model of ACC is very detailed - this is no coincidence because pirelli is the official supplier regarding tires in real GT World Challange Championship. So actually you are driving pirellis in ACC and can feel the input/influence from pirelli engineers. Also the different traction control systems and other systems of the cars are simulated in detail in ACC, because Kunos as official simulation developer of the GT World Challange has the best access to real GT World Challange driving data. In comparison to other simulations like also IRacing, they are simulated/implemented only rudimentary. When it comes to braking, I think IRacing is the better training tool, because in ACC u can really smash the brakes and be fast. But in Iracing ABS is also not very well / not implemented realistic. I think both leading racing simulations IRacing and ACC are very good and finally everyone must test for themselves and check which simulations suits personally best.
Actually I stopped driving ACC because half of the time I didn’t feel what the car was doing. Which is crucial for a low average driver like me. I don’t mind the sound though, even in your comparison. Anyway, thank you for the video!
Must be mad cause you’re trash at racing in general. Not all of us can be legends like Morad but you can have fun trying without idiotic comments such as yours.
I also play both and can agree with his feedback. When I tryed to find words for what I felt was "The car feels like a callous board I' sitting on. The only feedback if what I am doing is right or wrong is given by visual impression, not by feel or haptical feedback, especially on corner entry".
Informative review! Each SIM is different, so that would necessitate that each SIM be optimized on your hardware and peripherals so get the best out it. Users love to claim that a SIM isn’t that great with this and that, but it’s usually that their PC and peripherals are not tweaked properly for each SIM.
It’s 100% down to all of those factors. It also comes down to budget as well. I’m reading a lot of the comments and the number one issue why people don’t want to try other sims is because price
I agree that pricing of a product does enter into the evaluation by users who are judging the complete package as a purchasing consideration. But, from another evaluation view of how well does a SIM perform as a SIM compared to other SIM’s regarding a limited range of scope like physics implementation, or even more specifically tires, or braking effectiveness, then pricing seems like it is almost not a consideration because of the targeted scope of a review and comparison process.
Even though one SIM may be priced quite a bit higher than others, that still doesn’t prevent me from wanting to experienced that SIM in comparison to all the others.
In fact, that after spending the funds for the higher priced SIM, and then experiencing the quality of it, then you can ask yourself, is it really worth the price to you for whatever reason/s you may have. So, value for price seems somewhat a totally separate subject verses, how well does it perform as a SIM comparatively.
Similarity, a SIM’s “ fun factor” may not have much to do with pricing or physics either. I think it comes down to specifying up front when doing any sort of evaluation that this is a certain type of evaluation that includes this and that, or may not include this or that in the considerations.
Good feedback. As an ACC player I am disappointed at your overall dumping on the game, and would appreciate some insight on your in-game controller settings and how you developed the setups you used. Eg. maybe (not likely), you had brake power set to something less than 100% for some unknown reason. The sound seems like something you could easily tune out via the in-game settings, but I think some elements are the way they are to help the situational awareness of the player, since we don't feel going over marbles or oversteer through anything other than the wheel.
ACC engine and tire model, rf2 physics and ffb, iracing sounds, ui and online races model. That might be the best sim! Great video! I have the same feeling with ACC compared to iRacing
iRacing is for over 90% of all Real world Racing drivers, their Simulation of choice.. thats says all for me. My friends and me like Racing competitive on iRacing more too. At the end of the day, pick whatever You enjoy the most..
Daniel, now would be great to test the RaceSimStudio's Mercedes GT3 mod for Assetto Corsa 1, i've heard its one of the most realistic experiences, so of course would be awesome to see if you agree with it.
That sounds like a great idea. Due to how hectic my race season is through August, September, and October, I will have to reserve this for after my racing season, but I will definitely do it.
"The thing that kills it for me as being a realistic simulator is like... basically the reason you bought it for in the first place." There Daniel, I fixed the main statement of your closing remark for you. Cause it's not what you actually said, but it's definitely what I heard. It's not what I wanted to hear, but I can accept it for what it is. Hopefully AC2 will be the physics model AND the pricing structure we really want. Dare I say, we deserve.
My biggest question would be how much time have you actually spent playing ACC. Hope you provide some of this context in the video. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
THe details are very glossed over here. Your'e saying that for braking you need to have it at 100% all the time in ACC, but I don't find that experience to be true at all really. In fact that gradual pressure percentage braking is exactly what I've been doing to learn ACC the best. For one thing, there are details missing, such as what level ABS you're using for each car. WHAT CARS are you comparing to begin with? If you're speaking on IRL for a BMW GT3, are you using the same vehicle in ACC? And which year/model? There's a lot of missing information here that has me with an eyebrow raised. While I understand that you have rep as a race car driver, a proper comparison is still a proper comparison. This just seems....to be missing too much to take this into proper credibility.
*Side note: as you may have noticed from my other videos, my channel is based on real life driving and how I can reach that “realistic” aspect in the sim. That is what my review is based on. Most of you get it, but unfortunately some others seem to not want to understand the purpose of the review. At the end of the day, everyone can enjoy the game/sim they want. My views are my own, as I mention all the time. I was basing myself off of my real life driving and how close I can get to it.
Side note 2: I am not paid by iRacing currently and I have never been in the past. I have no contract with them. I state my own opinions and that’s it. Sorry to disappoint a few with this statement.
And with that being said…. Morad go vroom 😂. Thanks to those who get it. I appreciate everybody who disagrees but can have a civil conversation about it. We’re all in this together!
@danielmorad, well, maybe I did take it too personally and I'm sure we all want that, close to perfect sim that can give us realistic or if you want fun, as not everyone will experience rl driving, so yea maybe I over react but as you will hold a big influence over your audience maybe it would be nice or a better review once you have given the title more time to give it a more fair review, with it dialed in. I understand your a busy guy with the season still ongoing, so maybe in 6 months a second review I'd watch.
I’m grateful for the honesty and the real-life reference. The entire reason we enjoy sim racing is because we prefer a realistic reflection of driving in our pretend race cars. I find it bizarre that people would defend ACC’s depiction of racing without having any real-life experience of GT cars.
re: side note 2. Are you gonna do an iRacing "HONEST" review too?
I truly didn't see how you could favor iRacing over ACC (in spite of the fact you actually race these things as a professional). Your description of finding the sweet spot just shy of triggering the ABS on iRacing was so enlightening! Thank you so much for that video.
PLEASE DO AMS 2 REVIEW PLEASEEEEEEEEE
Hey Daniel, like you, I’ve been lucky enough to race GT3 in real life too over in Britain, with BMW (M6 and M4 GT3) & McLaren 720S. I found ACC a useful platform for me when learning the limits of a GT3 car before stepping behind the wheel in real life. I agree with the points you made about sound, it’s all a bit over-egged in ACC, but one factor I really appreciate in ACC is the setup parameters you can change have quite a realistic effect on the car, similar to what you’d expect in the real world. Naturally, I prefer ACC as a GT3 simulation model over something like iRacing or RF2, but I respect anyone who has any differing opinions on the matter because we all have our biases when it comes to this topic!
This is the perfect comment. I totally agree with it. All of it.
I have a genuine question on the braking and ABS. It seems like it's all over the board with what people say, and I'm 100% not saying anyone is wrong. I'm actually curious if it differs based on the driver and how they use braking in their own driving in GT3.
I've seen people on UA-cam say it's the best ABS simulation, and of course some don't say that like Daniel mentions here.
I've also watched the GT World races and I've heard the announcers (and possibly the guest driver doing announcing) say that they 100% the brakes and use the ABS on hard deceleration.
Interestingly, in the Daytona 24 race they spoke about how the GTE cars are now using ABS when they never have before, and they had a couple of the drivers join them in the booth and the GTE drivers talk about how hard it is for them to go from the old GTE cars without the ABS, to the new GTE cars where they have to remind themselves to use all of the brakes and rely on the ABS. Then again, they don't say how much they're using the ABS, like Daniel has mentioned in the past he'll use the ABS as a notification that it's time to back off just a little on the brakes, but also not stay in it and let the ABS do all of the work.
So that's what makes me wonder if it's a driver to driver perspective and how they use the systems, or if it's general use where everyone generally does it the same and people are making it sound like that's not the case. Or could it even be using ABS in a different way from car to car?
To avoid possible confusion, a slight correction: there were no "new GTE" cars in this year's Daytona 24, or any IMSA race after the end of the 2021 season. The WeatherTech series GT cars are all GT3 now, except for the Corvette which is the GTE/GTLM car with ABS and other modifications to roughly equate it with the GT3's ("GTD" in IMSA terms) while GM develops a true GT3 version which will debut next year. Former GTE drivers have commented as you said regarding ABS, but they're driving GT3 class cars now. This year was also the last for GTE at Le Mans and the WEC, and those cars still do not have ABS.
Back on topic - I have no real world racing experience besides some karting - but I've got a few thousand hours in various racing sims and I seem to struggle with braking in ACC more than others. My skils are probably no better than average, but it just seems inconsistent. I think I'm doing the same things but some laps the car just doesn't slow the same, and i end up off track. It's frustrating.
Thanks Daniel for the videos, this is great insight for us. Daniel go vroom!
try assetto corsa (with csp mods,) and but properly built cars like URD, united racing porsche . You will really love that!
This is why people with real life experience don't openly comment, as soon as they do there are schmucks asking their own pointless questions which they will then reiterate in every other comment section as gospel lmao. Of bloody course it differs based on the driver and how they use braking in their own driving in GT3 🤦♂@@Hardcaslte
the benefit of the noise being somewhat overbearing is that you can hear what you can't feel, I always turn up things like tyre noise in any sim I play. I know your review was based more on things that make the game feel more realistic but I just wanted to mention my experience.
Well said.
Max verstappen ups the tires sound in sim racing too I believe for that exact reason
the braking is still bad
@@mermertago1437 okay?
You can also tune many audio settings individually, onboard engine, exterior engine, tyres, chassis, opponent, etc.... Would super easy to tune it as in real life if that is what you're looking for...
Daniel, do yourself and the community a big favour and do the same thing on rF2. Your honest review based on real-life experience makes the difference for all of us. Thank you!
I don't think we need a real driver to tell us that rF2 is way better than acc and iRacing, it speaks for itself but unfortunately its just not popular to the mainstream player so for a youtube vid it would get the less views than iRacing or acc. I would love to see Dan play AC1 but that kind of falls into the same category even though its has a way higher daily player rate.
@@JallyTeethere are a lot of real drivers who don't prefer rf2 over iracing. It's not as perfect as you think.
I will get to it for sure. I just need to do that after the race season. It’s ramping up in august until end of October. It’s going to be crazy stretch.
@@JallyTee RF2 Feels pretty bad IMO. Not good at all, very spongey, gamey and unnatural.
@@MrThedestroy3r Well its one of the most preferred sim's along with AC1 for irl drivers to practice so not sure where got that info. look I really like Daniel Morad's streams and youtube advice and I like hearing what hes got to say. But like many people I drive real cars too, they might not be full on race cars but I can drive cars I owned or have driven in rf2 and AC1 and they can be bloody close to the real thing. At the end of the day it comes down to experience and what to look for with physics and tire models and setting up the sim correctly.
I started on ACC for about two years and then got into iracing. I now race on both. Obviously I am not a racing driver by any stretch of the imagination. What I find different is that ACC is far more intense when close racing compared to iracing. One makes me sweat and the other doesn’t. I found iracing far more easier to drive in than ACC. The braking difference was easy to overcome after the first couple of races. I also find iracing ffb very wafty. They are different games and have their pros and cons but ultimately they are games that we play for the racing to have fun.
Couldn’t agree more with that last sentence. It’s all about fun.
Well we're not comparing which game is more "fun".. We're comparing acc to a real car.. Which is acc,, This channel complains about the game having too many sound effects 😂 which can be adjusted but ok,, too many sounds 👍
@@SupernaturalPowerz well I can’t compare any game to real because I’m not a racing driver and I’ve never driven a race car. Sound is subjective.
@@SupernaturalPowerzthe only reason we have this comparison is because of the community’s obsession with which is closer to real life. Talk about focusing on the wrong thing. This comes from the same people that insist on calling them “sims” and get offended if you call them games.
Thanks for your honest review of the game. Can you do the others sims like AMS2, Rfactor2, Raceroom, Rennsport, etc.. also? As a pro driver your opinion in regards to realism is important. It's information we, as simracers only, never can get by ourself. After you can do a top 5 of your favorite sims or make a video what each sim does the best!
Don't do rennsport it's still beta my brother
Especially in beta phase it's important he gets to test it
@@EricW6800 you can't judge and unfinished game
Ams2 has greatly improved
There is no "realistic" game! Just different flavors. But the "Rennsport" thing... You DO understand that they have gone "all in" with their chips, and are aiming to get iRacing's subcribership 1000 fold? They want to legitimize esport sim racing to the point it gets televised on major sports channels globally. They will either win big or bust. They are playing a high stakes game!!!! How much have they spent on the last 2 expos? a Million dollars US each time? And all the prize money? They are really trying to make a significant impression! I truly hope they succeed! But I have dim hopes in reality. (if they succeed, can you imagine how much they can invest in the "physics" and "force feedback"???)🤤🤤🤤
Would be interesting to see a comparison with first AC at it's present state to which it has been elevated by modding community. First of all I'm talking about cars with extended physics which includes more advanced tire model, complex suspension geometry simulation, aerodynamics and so on. Also, today new CSP preview came out and introduced car body flex and moving driver body weight influencing overall weight balance of a car!👀
The body flex is unused and undocumented, mainly because it's bad. Maybe later it can be used as a visual representation. Ilja devved it, not Jackson.
COSMIC can support a 2nd chassis for flex, though.
Ye I would love to see him try that out too because to me nothing is better then that
I agree but Even vanilla AC is much better than ACC. it just feel right to drive even if its supposedly ''less advanced" a sim can have all the technical stuff but if it feels wrong its just wrong. looking forward to AC2!
Updated physics is so much better 👍
@@JallyTeeCars in AC have non existent inertia and the cars have too much resistance/wobble in FFB like Daniel is pitching in this video. It seems like something Kunos is not willing to work out. Then the throttle and brakes require way too much pressure more than real life.
its fair, i knew its not 100% realistic and things are far off but its the best we can get besides iracing in terms of gt3 racing, and its fairly priced too. Its always good to hear opinion from a real life gt3 driver without much experiance in ACC, trying to drive the way you would in real life thats the key thing here. Of course the more you woould drive the more you would learn the way to be fast in ACC which isnt particulary realistic but as u mentioned its fun and gives us the glimpse of real life racing. I myself have like 2,5k hours in ACC, i also played Iracing for few months and i like both of the sims but im stick with ACC due to the pricing and yes, i couldnt get used to Iracing breaking after ACC.
Exactly same.
If developers dont sit up and listen to this type of video they're missing out on a real opportunity to take a look at things that people identify as potential issues.
Ive never driven a car on a race track in my life, but can imagine its a bit of a dance to get around quickly, not a binary set of commands at certain parts of the circuit.
As always, great video Daniel 👊
Thanks Dave. I’m sure it’s a super complicated process in getting it right. I have a lot of respect for devs but if they want to improve a simulation game, just ask the drivers. I’m happy to help. Not here to bash but just want it be right if it’s called a “sim”
That was the kindest, SCATHING review I think ive ever seen. SO Canadian, and I love it! I used to race in the SCCA, sponsored by Brian Nott (R.I.P (Black Forest Motorsports)before I became disabled and even though ive got a decent fanatec rig, no matter which game I try, I just can't find that "tires on the asphalt" feel that I used to feel irl. That scrubbing feeling, the tire stuttering across the track when understeering and the rear end slide from oversteer or that perfect grip feeling that you grow to look for when your tires are in the "zone". I certainly cant afford to buy a motion rig but i wish i could find a sim that has those feelings programmed into its ffb. The closest i came was with rfactor2 at Sebring, but i had to fiddle with the settings every time i tried playing the tging and my seat time is far too limited by disability pain for me to spend 2 hours setting up a game to play and then not be able to play it because im in too much pain.
You're honest review here really reinforced all of the stuff that I found troubling with ACC and in all honesty, ive lost quite a bit of interest in continuing to try using ACC to enjoy racing again in a sim environment. The A.I. cars are beyond obnoxious and hard enough in themselves to try and live with for me to continue fooling with ACC. Thank you so much for your honest review here with ACC. 🙏
Lmk if you ever need to let go of some stuff. I'm interested.
@michaelserrano8339 Hey Mike! All of the kit that I use, I've bought for my son. He will inherit all of my belongings in a few months....
Daniel, make sure you turn off the in-game damping settings in ACC and use firmware damping. ACC's damping is basically there for people who want zero oscillations, at the expense of being overdamped in most cases.
So you would turn dynamic damping down?
@@Rene_Bo I would turn all of the in-game FFB stuff off except GAIN and apply friction, damping and (little) inertia via firmware.
To me it feels like ACC aims for a roughly 1:1 software gain and driver gain correlation in regards to mid-corner torques, so for a 10Nm wheel you would want to run 70-80% gain in ACC for a realistic 7-8Nm mid-corner. For a 20Nm wheel you would run 35-40% and so on.
I haven't actually measured, but it's just my rough impression. Obviously the bumps will be unrealistic due to no PS simulation.
@@ArchOfficial cool.. will try that for sure! Im on SC2 and actually running Daniels GT3 profile on Truedrive
@@Rene_Bo Correct settings vary car-to-car but they're generally pretty similar.
So for a PS car, hefty friction for the rack (About 2Nm for PS usually), hefty damper for either hydraulic fluid or EPS damper logic (and some simulation reasons, to help with oscillations) and a little bit of inertia to account for the components but also for simulation reasons, to help with oscillations near center. Inertia makes oscillations in transient worse, so beware.
Generally on most bases 30/30/10 is a good starting point. I run more on Alpha Mini mainly driving roadcars, closer to 50/40/10. Not all bases will have "100%" mean the same thing so beware.
There is no way to fully counteract oscillations in transient situations with DirectInput wheelbases, and the inertia setting that tunes out *all* oscillations near center is too high of a setting realistically and will result in a really high oscillation amplitude in transient, so I generally believe in minimizing inertia-induced oscillation and then just applying proper friction and damping.
In GT cars where you will mostly be gripping the wheel and producing some natural damping from your hands, you can go closer to realistic settings, but I get a better experience going a bit higher on damping for drifting.
I will be sure do try that. Thanks a lot.
Thank you for checking out ACC, especially after the recent update. maybe you should offer your help with improving the game. I think working with a real driver could be a great benefit for everybody
Kunos isn't particularly well-known for being receptive to feedback, even from pros.
Most naïve comment of the day ;)
Why, do u pay Daniel to do this or Kunos??? Nothing comes for free😅
@@ryomaprime3130 of course they should pay him. They could also advertise with his expertise. But I think Daniel wouldn't give his name for a product that he isn't 100% satisfied with
@Nathaniel87
Daniel just did "help with improving the game."
Short of joining their R&D team anyways.
He spent time testing out the latest update, made notes of what felt real to him, what could possibly be better & why he feels driving ACC too much would adversely affect his racing in real life.
He then put together a 17 or so minute video about his conclusions which most know takes way longer than 17 minutes to compile & edit.
He then shared those conclusions with anyone/everyone that chooses to watch it by uploading it to UA-cam.
👍
Iracing for me, but having a break from it as I started to focus to much on safety/i-rating then enjoying myself.
Assetto corsa(w/manager) is my other go to sim.
About the FFB. Remove all "effects" in your wheelbase software. No damper no friction no inertia. Wheel should be completely light when not in the car. But make sure it receives damper info from the game.
In game settings:
Gain to preference,
damper to preference(as low as possible without wobbling on the straights)
No road effects
Dynamic damper at 100%
I will try that
All settings FFB?
ACC was the first sim I played. It was a lot of fun until I tried iRacing. However, going from ACC to iRacing was challenging due to the braking. I would consistently lock up in Iracing when I wouldn’t in ACC. However, once I learned how to brake in iracing, it’s made transitioning to other sims MUCH easier. I feel like iRacing taught me brake control whereas ACC taught me ABS control.
this is what i feel exactly!
iRacing's braking is still wrong: while it follows the logic of decaying grip with downforce it's tuned completely wrong. In real life for the most part of hard brakings you want to kick the pedal almost as hard as possible and then bleed pressure off, it's that sudden increase of braking pressure that initiates the braking and makes all of the difference from stopping too late or nailing the entry. In iRacing you want to apply that pressure very gently and release it just as much, dragging a little percentage of braking all the way into the apex in what is known as trailbraking, which is also way too powerful compared to real life. This is because if you're pressing the brakes (no matter how much) you're basically asking some grip from the tyre, same goes for every time you turn the wheel; you'll understand that if you brake and turn at the same time you're inevitably taking potential performance out of both of these. In real life you'd expect the car to slow down into the apex but at the same time lose a bit of turning ability, generating some understeer, although very light. When you're off both brakes and the throttle, called coasting, that's when you get the most neutral rotation of the car usually. Trailbraking in iRacing never produces understeer because the lateral grip generated while holding very small percentages of input is much higher than you'd expect therefore coasting not only is useless but it's also detrimental. No sim does braking right because in real life the braking is calculated in how much weight you're applying to the pedal, from 0 to potentially infinite. In a game or sim they need to digitalize this and put a hard stop at one point, basically levelling the playing field. The way they did it in ACC is simply dumb because if two people brake at the same time applying 100% pressure until the apex, how on earth does one overtake the other?
@@danielebrambilla2290 nice insights! in the case of trailbraking / coasting in iracing i feel there is a lot of difference between the different gt3 cars. the way you describe is how i perceive to porsche to handle for example, but not so much the front engine cars. I also disagree that it is always faster to apply brake pressure slowly if you look at the telemetry of reasonably fast lap times. sure, weight transfer seems to be more delicate than in acc, but its not like you can never "kind of" kick the pedal in a hard braking zone. edit: talking about single lap pace and ignoring nurturing tyres over a stint.
@@markuskenel The Porsche being rear engined requires more trailbraking (deeper into the corner) because by holding the brakes you're loading the front axle, effectively pushing the front tyres into the ground, expanding their contact patch and extracting more grip, with the unwanted effect of overheating and wearing them. By doing this, you can lift the rear and make it rotate in a more predictable way, being able to play on the edge of grip. It is a very hard car and also one of a kind though, as the AMG for example having a longer wheelbase and being front engined is naturally more loaded at the front and will tend to have a more precise and direct front end so a lot of trailbraking does nothing but creating more understeer, to which you might respond with more turning input and therefore creating oversteer. I haven't driven every single car in iRacing but I tried almost all the GT3's and they all require the same trailbraking technique.
I compared a lot of onboards with telemetry, iracing is pretty accurate.
I'm always surprised how different drivers' comments regarding braking can be. I listened to several interviews (Romain Monty, James Baldwin etc) and they all say that they crush the brake pedal 100% IRL. and others like Daniel say just the opposite. surprising
Well there's no such thing as "100%" IRL, you can always press the pedal harder. But almost any GT3/GT4 onboard will show the drivers are heavily leaning on the ABS in the big braking zones.
Not every corner I suspect 😊
James has also said that you trail brake much more in the real thing
You just discovered sponsorship man :D
James Baldwin is an amateur driver. Big difference.
I sense 7 minutes of braking critique incoming lol.
It isn’t that bad lol. It’s actually reasonable tbh
You took it easy on the game 😂
I actually feel the braking between the sims is the same essentially. If you assume 60% on iracing is 100% on acc.
If you would deadzone the last 40% of your pedal from your iracing settings for acc you can use pretty much the same technique.
@@daviddanser8011what happens if you brake 61% does abs just take over up to 100% because if not (to my 16:50 understanding) it wouldn't be the same? I don't play either game. I was just curious. I've played a lot of ac and was interested in acc but there definitely seems to be different than I had hoped
So iracing does all these things just like real life?
I know what you mean about that mid corner wobble on the wheel! I think there trying to simulate the tire digging into the pavement. I’m an avid player of ACC usually when that feeling comes I find I’m getting my best lap times. I’m also an ex race car driver. Never driven GT3. But raced karts and formula cars and briefly touring cars. I’m always comparing also. But I’ve given up lol. It’s a game and it’s fun! Thank you for the video!
Good point too. These games and software titles are full of compromises. They are supposed to be fun and cater to millions of users with different hardware, skills and expectations.
Thanks Daniel, your insight between RL and game is priceless. The fact the we have reached a stage in gaming that we are able to compare it to RL is amazing. Thanks
Great video Dan. The brake always felt off to me as well. You need to nail the brake point and smash the pedal 100% and that just never seemed like how driving a car works to me.
That's what telemetry suggests. Peak braking IRL is probably higher than what peak braking can be achieved in ACC. It's one reason why ACC needs more braking on average.
@@user-ln3jy4oc9tAMS2 braking is very dull. They really are struggling to get the physics right in that sim. V1.5 coming out isn’t any better at all.
Quick note from someone who played ACC for years and just got iRacing two months ago. After like 60h in iRacing i saw a dramatic improvement in my braking in ACC and irl karting. Previously I felt like every hard braking corner is a gamble if I make it or not. Now I have so much more control on the brakes and I don't lean on ABS that much anymore. I feel like I just have much more control of the car.
In 2 months I went from being 2-3 seconds slower than the fast times on LFM to being more like 1,5 seconds off in both quali and race pace.
Let's see how far I can take this driving both sims back to back for some time.
Awesome vid, big guy. I bet the community would love it if you could review the other sims, like raceroom, rf2 and ams2 as well. Personally iRacing and raceroom are my favorites, but they drive a bit different.
I will definitely get to that in the future. I need to review other Sims, but I am so busy in season right now. I need to do it when the seasons over.
great video! i haven't played ACC much, but I appreciate the honest input... and you presented the negative feedback in a totally professional way so I hope the rest of the conversation (and i'm sure there will be a lot :) stays at the same level ..
Interesting and brave video. This topic can be like mixing gasoline, dry wood and burning napalm.
As a sim racer, predominantly ACC, I've seen a few of these videos now and other real race car drivers have said the opposite, but one thing Ive learned is that you will find the realism in what ever sim you're familiar with. So drive what you find more realistic.. As you said at the end of the video "it's all pretend", but personally I can pretend more realistically in ACC.
Love the content looking forward to your next video. 👌😊👍
Great video, personally never got on well with ACC even with a DD wheel just can't get the feel of the car as you say. I get that people learn how to play the game and master it if you put the hours in, just don't have those hours to do it and generally end up frustrated not knowing where the pace is as you can't sense it from the car or the data they provide
Try rF2 with GT3 pack
That's one of the reasons I have stick with Iracing. Hard to go back to ACC.
What i do in all of the sims when i practice to get fast really fast is to practice on rain with slick tires and try to push as hard as i can there u learn how to control the car and get a better sence when u got grip and when not. After some practice i go back to dry weather much better car controll and sence of where the limit is and Grip. i usually never sim-race i do for 1-3 weeks a year sometimes im off 1-1.5seconds behind the Aliens so yeah this training works :)
Thanks for making the video. My problem with it is that it still doesn’t seem like you put in enough time or even have your control /audio settings dialed in correctly. You admit it yourself in the video . There are also racing drivers on UA-cam who disagree with what you are saying, though they have criticisms with it just as you do with iRacing. Personally, I’ve had to adjust my wheel settings and my pedal settings when switching between the sims to achieve the proper feel.
I will say that I agree in that if we had a nice blend it would be close and that there is no perfect sim.
I still need to optimize it but I can tell you right now, even with max optimization, it still feels off. It’s fun but it isn’t realistic vs some other titles.
@@danielmorad I appreciate your reply but my confusion is that you have other people who drive at your level who are disagreeing with you and it's like who do we TRUST?! haha. As someone who has done sim racing for a very long time the settings make a huge difference with what's going on. I 100 percent believe for you that it's not there for your style and preferences, I kind of take issue with how you call it a video game level thing, because you are having quite the influence on a lot of people who hang on your word. But honestly that's them instead of you. I am heavy into flight sim and have a long career in the Air Force and that community has a very similar issue where pilots will disagree on the accuracy of public sims on which is more realistic and isn't. It's super interesting to see given they fly the exact same machinery. I definitely respect your opinion, though I admit I am eager to find out if there are more drivers who agree with you...then we can all have those who prefer iRacing and all those who prefer ACC just argue at a roundtable for your next video haha.
Your insights are uniquely helpful! Much, much appreciated. All the best with the race season!
Thanks a lot!
I think when it comes to the sound point that you brought up, I believe it is so that it can at least to some extent compensate for the feedback you can't get from a sim no matter your setup. Some of the actual F1 drivers have really bizzare sound settings in iRacing, especially the tyre sound, just so that they can get an advantage from the sound that compensates for lack of some realistic feedback. I might not be 100% correct, but I've heard that more than once so there might be some merit to it.
I love the way you articulate everything (especially in this video). Perhaps the makers of ACC should listen to you (and others at your level), and maybe focus on being able to "tune" settings based on your feedback. So, if the player wants a game experience...great. However, if they want it to be as realistic as possible (based on expert feedback), we can choose specific driver recommendations. I know this is a big ask (based on physics), but that over features/graphics etc. would be a killer feature/benefit.
Absolutely. Always open to helping if they are interested.
Awesome video!!! Thank you for the honest feedback. Your honesty and experience is what makes your channel the best out there. Keep up the great work!!!
thanks for the honest and well argued review. I'd be very curious if you could do the same with Rfactor 2 (which in my humble opinion is still the greatest in terms of pure driving feel)
I hear alot of people still say it is the best in FFB department.
By far one of the best in the FBB area. Unfortunately, the online platform is so bad that you can only play it against the AI
Yes Daniel, try out RF2, but in order to get the best combination of the sim, try it with a BTCC car and ONLY drive a DLC track!
Fake news, online rf2 race on leagues are just perfect, just miss a multiplayer and rating. LFM is intresting too, and s397’is working on a new compétition system. I ve been playing rf2 online race since 1 year without issues
Wow, first of all I apologize it took me 5 days to watch this & thank you so much for making this! I don’t quite understand the the lash out from our fellow ACC drivers, you are a real driver & we asked for your opinion so thank you Daniel for putting the time together to make this video.
Our team has these same discussions & as I’ve mentioned we are divided up on both platforms as a team. If you don’t mind sharing one other opinion it be much appreciated. David Perel, James Baldwin for example more so the former have many hours behind the wheel of a real GT3 car as well & prefer ACC as their more “realistic” Sim I guess proving it comes down to preference sometimes?
Thanks so much for sharing everything & we look forward to seeing you soon 🤙🏽
Thank you for this video. I really appreciate a real-life perspective on it. You should try ALL sims and give us your opinion:
- Automobilista (2016);
- rFactor 2 (2013);
- Assetto Corsa (2014);
- Automobilista 2 (2020).
After my racing season.
@@danielmorad When you play the first Assetto Corsa, please use the RSS Mercedes AMG GT3.
RaceRoom
Interesting what you said about braking into high speed corners in ACC. I find myself intuitively braking softer into high speed corners and comparing to fast drivers’ telemetry I see that that’s where I’m losing time and I have to force myself to brake hard there and I don’t feel entirely comfortable with it.
It makes no sense. Intuitively, you want to give it a light brush but then the balance is weird and it slides.
Ok really good stuff Daniel!! Im mainly on ACC and a little on RF2, the pricetag on iRacing is holding me back..
Would love to hear your thoughts on other sims, such as ams2, rf2 and raceroom - perhaps even Rennsport if you got a beta for it 🤩
Don’t let price of iRacing hold u back
@@kevwburke let the awful tire model do that instead 🤣
And the netcode 😅
Very detailed explanation. I thoroughly loved this. These are the kind of things developers need to listen to in order to further improve on sims going forward. Thank you so much for taking the time to make this video :)
Thanks for your honest opinion. Your videos are very interesting. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and expertise with us. I would be very interested in your opinion about RFactor 2. As you probably know, many say that it has the most realistic driving physics. And I also have to say that this seems the most realistic for me too. For me it is the only sim who really creates a sense of connection to the road. But i am not a race driver. You are so i would be very happy to hear your opinion. 😊 Best regards
As a real world pilot who has the odd discussion with simulator pilots I think I understand your point of view. As a pilot,what I want from a simulator is something that encourages me to think as I would when operating a real aircraft. What simmers want is that notional feeling and experience of flight which is usually brought about by exaggerating certain aspects whilst dampening down others. I guess as real world racing drivers, what you want from a sim might not be what dreamers like me want to experience.
Thanks for this Daniel. I went from ACC to iRacing and haven’t looked back, for similar reasons you suggested. Good luck in Europe (assume you’re racing lol).
Thanks for the video
With 100+ hours on ACC, I recently switched to iRacing and I prefer the driving in iRacing. I feel more connected to the road (never drove a gt3 or gt4 of course) and the braking is much better. I had to relearn how to brake from smashing to 100% to true finesse
Same. I have no idea how to drive in ACC anymore. Everything feels off
While I agree iRacing feels better I can't get over the pricing model to actually switch.
@@ETKAE That makes sense. I'm glad that ACC offers a variety of cars/tracks/dlc at a fair price. It just means that many racers get to experience awesome racing at various price points. That's definitely a win.
I think the feel of disconnect in ffb and steering is something i could never get used to. I have a hard time finding that sweet spot and attack each lap consistently. I feel im always guessing when im attacking corners in ACC which just felt weird to me and I have quite a lot of hours in the game.
It’s tricky. It’s a skill that needs to be acquired. The comments are so good right now. I have my popcorn lol
Yeah, finding the sweet spot based on feel can be very tricky in ACC. I say this as someone with over 550 hours in ACC. Still my only sim so far, apart from having tried iRacing for a month or so, but unlike Daniel I didn't like the FFB in iRacing at all. Felt very light and numb in my opinion. Funny how that works, the exact opposite. Maybe it's because I only tried the MX-5s but the FFB (and the pricing especially) is what made me bounce off iRacing hard. I think FFB is a matter of personal taste as well probably.
But going back to ACC: I think attacking corners in ACC is based more on memory than feel, and that makes ACC very difficult to master IMO. I'll admit I'm still struggling with the braking in some of the corners although my shitty setup probably has a lot to do with it as well (no rig yet). But since comparing myself with telemetry from Popometer I've discovered that my braking still needs work, especially brake release. The fast guys tend to brake a little bit earlier than I do, then lean on the ABS for quite a long time, and then release the brakes relatively quickly but smoothly. That's going to require some adjusting from me due to bad habits, but I've only made this discovery thanks to the telemetry and not the feel I get from the sim. You really have to remember like: "oh, now this corner is coming up again, I have to hold the brakes for this long, and release the brakes like that" etc, and that's for every corner in every lap.
But not every corner requires 100% brake. That upsets the balance of the car too much. Look at Nils Naujoks, he explains is very well.
Hoping AC2 improves on some of these areas a bit. For sure it's good to hear these things from a real driver. Would like to see you do a video on the other sims as well if you feel like doing that.
@@nimz7309 I don't like to guess on what the car is doing. This is what ACC feels like to me most times as I have a hard time feeling what the front end is doing. I understand these are all "games" we play and its impossible to get a full ass in seat feel as in real car but as you said because the lack of feedback ACC becomes a lot harder to master. I am totally talking about steering feedback, braking in ACC never really bothered me that much. As for iracing ffb some cars do feel completely numb vs others. MX-5 has never been that exciting to drive in iracing.
It's called "you suck" bro. You all suck at acc. There is no "sweet spot" you can keep spamming like iRating. Welcome to the new age boy
@@danielmoradi don’t think i have ever seen so mutch good comments and discussions under a video. I am just reading it all for so long. Lovely community in simracing
Great points you go by in the video; I always felt disconnected in ACC to the point to not enjoying the experience.
There are a few sims that taunt real life physics it would be nice to have the view of a real driver, those been: rFactor2, raceRoom
Bout has licensed GT3 content, it would be nice to have your view
See I feel the same way about iRacing how you feel about ACC. Played aboutt he ssme amount of time on both. Just cant get comfortable in iRacing and seetle right in in ACC.
I think you nailed it when you said its a preference thing and its all racing at the end of the day. Happy safe and clean racing everyone!!
I mean iracing is a sim and acc is a game
Daniel Morad, there is a Brazilian pilot named Vitor Genz who does a good job of explaining the differences between simulators and real life. It's great to see real pilos talking about their impressions of the simulators. Because few people have the opportunity to drive real cars. That's why your impressions about how much reality simulators can offer are very important. Keep up the good work, we just have to thank you for your time dedicated to trying to translate these two worlds. Thank you and success!
That’s awesome. I’ll check him out :)
Let’s hope acc and other games apply pressure to iracing to keep getting better.. competition is necessary!
true! if they make their braking to be similar to iracing, that would be amazing
my thoughts exactly, I play it after a big update to see if they've made it closer to my liking then it gets parked until the next update. You should do a similar video on Assetto Corsa, I have all the sims and I always end up back on AC
I really need to get AC. I’ve seen Jimmy Broadbent play it and it seems like a lot of fun. I want to try that Japanese drifting Road.
@@danielmorad well wat are you waiting for its pretty inexpensive and not difficult to get content manager up and running. been doing a bunch of sim drifting on it
@@danielmorad yeah, don't just play vanilla AC though, content manager and the latest custom shader patch really bring the best out of the game. Yeah the drifting and the mod tracks and cars for the drifting is unreal on AC, you will LOVE IT!
@@danielmorad Join Togue Union!!!
Great video. Thanks. I would love to hear you analyze the realism of other sims, especially the original AC and rf2.
I will get to them after my racing season :)
I had the same feeling about mid corners. I thought it was my wheel setting but I never quite know what the car is doing or going to do feedback wise and never felt connected to the car. Tire temp model changes from lap to lap felt very extreme on how it affected handling.
Same
@@Time4utube I thought I was delusional with weird ffb mid corner, good to know it is not just me.
I didn’t play the game because of it. But recently I gave it a try again and it’s much better in my opinion. The 1.9 update has something to do with it for sure.
This is a relief to hear! I got on ACC for the first time last night after 300+ hrs on GT7 and I was freaking about how difficult it was to trail brake into a corner. Also, the brakes never felt adequate for the car and too much braking vibration with little feedback.
Lol go back to playing arcade games like gt7 then 😂
So I take it you've never tried to stop a real car from high spped into a corner. It's not supposed to be that skittish on the back end.
@@booost420 I get the feeling you didn't watch the video.
@@drkwsherrill it's skittish depending on your setup.
@@bmwm3man Yes, I understand tha because that's the subject of Daniel's video (that you appear not to have watched).
I wish we could have a sim that doesn't cost you a game, 110$ a year, cars, tracks...
I love ACC, it's my main sim. One reason is the lowfuelmotorsport platform, which provides a rating system and seasonal championships like iRacing. I like the graphics and the sharp FFB. But in terms of physics I fully agree: the suspension is too stiff (although it was improved a lot eith 1.9), and braking... you can of course brake like on iRacing or rFactor2, but you will be a lot slower. And that's why I think in terms of physics and how the car behaves is much better on the other two mentioned sims. But another major thing that puts ACC higher for me is the SRO license... while unfortunatly it's not possible to recreate a full GT World season because a lot of tracks are missing, you still have to admit, that the whole GT3 experience is best on ACC. Other Sims are either missing a lot of cars and the ones included are outdated.
But like you said, Dan: there should be room for all of them, because no sim is perfect, each one has it's strengths.
Many people overlook Automobilista 2, because they think it's just a total conversion of Project Cars 2... but in fact the physics are great, much like rF2 or even more like iRacing, the graphics are great, less demanding as ACC and thus very fluid and smooth. And not only the devs Reiza Studios announced Le Mans coming to AMS2, but the GT3 roster is said to be upgraded too. The only thing - huge part - that hinders AMS2 from being more popular is the online multiplayer, which is clunky and rarely existend, because there is no major platform with hosted races. But who knows? Well AMS2 has become my go-to sim for racing on the Nordschleife.
I really like the way you put this. And I totally agree that there is space for everybody to enjoy, which ever game they like. I don’t understand why there is so much hostility. My opinion is at the end of the day, my opinion. I drove the car in real life. I can share what I feel, but it doesn’t mean that it’s not fun for others to enjoy. I feel like there’s a sense of tribalism with this. I can see in some of the comments that people are very angry. It’s like they want me to say it’s good just for them to enjoy it.
@@danielmorad Jup... I'm part of a big german sim racing community as a moderator, following one of the fastest ACC drivers and I already got DMs like "you gotta see this, Morad is roasting ACC!". And I am like "yeah, well, not roasting maybe, but I see it almost exactly his way, I think iRacing is far more relatable on how the cars are feeling", and many of our longterm community members know my opinion, that I had my problems with ACC when I dipped my toes deeper into sims like iRacing and rFactor 2. And I am far away from being a real life racedriver, I don't know if I could go anyway near as fast on a track like in the virtual world without sh***ing my pants, lol.
And like you said, the tyre model is great on ACC. rFactor 2 was said to have the best tyre model, but I think it's too punishing concerning flat spots... makes you better and more precise on your braking foot, yes, but one time braking a little too hard and your tyres are imediately turning into cubes =).
And... your opinion is your's, people should deal with it and calm down. There are real world race drivers who really put some time into ACC, but some of them are formula drivers or are seated in other cars like Porsche or Audi, maybe those feel closer to the real thing on ACC, than the AMG.
I have one suggestion for you, Dan: Maybe try the Porsche 992 GT3 Cup and the AMG GT4, if you haven't. Braking still feels different then on iRacing, but you can't smash the brake like on GT3s.
And another suggestion concerning Force Feedback: I don't drive with a Simucube wheelbase, but very similar in strength and FFB performance, and I think you might have too much damping on it. I remember you prefer a dampened FFB because it feels more realistic (even as a non-racing car driver I know that you don't feel road texture in your wheel, but with your butt and if you have one foot off the pedals, so again I agree with you, haha). I run with 10% damping because I use a tactile transducer on my seat, but I still feel exactly when grip loss occurs.
When I drive GT3s in sims other than ACC, it's not that simple. I played iRacing, RF2, Raceroom, and most recently, GTR2. You try to brake in GTR2 at 100% with low ABS assist, the car will lock up and outright spin. The driving school wants you to brake with finesse. ACC has taught me some terrible habits about braking which it's a bit hard for me to shake off. Now that I remember, I said the exact same thing to myself back when I was driving GTEs in RF2's endurance league. Now I get the whole picture. Thanks Daniel. Your feedback has been very insightful. :)
This is exactly how I feel about ACC and there could not be a better word than "Numb" to describe the FFB feel. I would love to be able to enjoy ACC, graphics is superb and I know people are having tons of fun in the LFM league, I just couldn't get the settings work for me. I'm regularly on Iracing and Raceroom, would love to hear your thoughts about Raceroom
I assume this could be a result because of "wrong" driver settings and ingame FFB settings.
I don't have a current iRacing subscription, but I have ACC, AC, AMS2, RF2 and Raceroom installed and for me ACC is providing the best FFB, it feels fantastic and realistic on most of the tracks. But there are also some tracks where it's feeling realy numb on the front, e.g. Watkins Glen.
You should review other SIMS and make it a series (raceroom, automobilista 2, etc)
His review of RacRoom would be him showing you how to uninstall XD
the last thing we need is an iRacing shill reviewing other sims he neveer really played... waste of time...
@@lupo_aim Minus that whole thing of him actually being a seated team driver in GT3 cars IRL. Calling a Pro GT Driver a iRacing shill is hilarious.
@@_antwonTT6 I can show you real GT3 drivers that are training on ACC and say its quite realistic. He just doesnt want to like it.
I mean, he doesnt have to, but this is not a review at all.
@@lupo_aim I can also show you the ACC GTWC Events that were held on ACC with Current Roster drivers during the Covid season who literally got up and walked away mid race because of how much everything they do IRL does not translate to this game. Again, You calling him a schill is a little off the mark fam. Everyone has a preference. He didnt go the GamerMuscle route where he shits on every single thing about that game. He gave real life experience into his opinion and somehow that touched a nerve with you.
Great video and kudos to Daniel for taking the time to make it. I can really apreciate his honesty.
But, there is one thing everybody seems to forget and that is the fact that very few of us race in real life. For Daniel it makes one hell of a difference if he wants to practice on a SIM, on how close it is to the real thing. For the rest of us, well It's just a choice we make of what for us, feels close to the real thing. For us, other then having an opinion about a SIM, it really makes no difference what we drive since we don't have the real thing to compare with.
And the best way to proof this is by looking at the hardware we use. I would say that I have a fairly decent hardware setup, but that still does'nt make me the fastest or best driver out there. I'm about average, that's it and I can life with it, because I enjoy it and have lots of fun. There are people out there that have low-end equipment, but are among, if not the fastest drivers out there. In other words, the pressure point of the brake pedal or how sensitive it is don't mean squad if you have the "best" SIM and G29 or T150 pedals.
As I can appreciate this video and the work Daniel put into it, again great work, it does'nt make me switch to another SIM. I got ACC, because I love GT cars and only drive Porsche. I got AC, rfactor and RaceRoom but startet out with PC2 on PS4, but basically only drive ACC.
I say each his own as long you enjoy what you're doing.
Amen to this!
While your point still stands I’d say this. Keep in mind this is also just one racing drivers opinion. Plenty of other racing drivers on UA-cam who have a different opinion than his with ACC. Ones who took the time with it like he did with iRacing. Keep in mind Daniel himself had his biases against it before he tried it and admitted himself he didn’t give it enough time. He even says that here. He, like us and other racing drivers, has his own preferences . We also fine tune audio and control settings. It really sounds like he hasn’t figured this out even though he does this with iracing .
@roewedge maybe he does this because he is looking for a true to realism of the car he is racing. It's clear to me acc does not do this.
He states it multiple times, his chanel, specifically when reviewing racing titles looks at it from a real world view of that specific car.
I don't know what more you could ask for.
Yes, fine tunning is important to extract lap time and feeling to an extent, but it's very clear acc does not resemble the real thing. It should be a relatively fast adjustment period to figure out. You don't need to spend that much time to tell if it resembles the real thing, iracing appears to be more similar hence the amount of time he spends on that sim platform. Just my opinion..
@@robertulrich7150 The problem is he went into it already knowing he wasn't going to like the game. He's highly affiliated with iRacing even if he wants to say he isn't.
He is biased as heck. His first time he was playing the game with all the assists on while complaining.
You can't spend days or even months fine tuning your setup for one game and then turn around and spend an hour or two on another without fine tuning and have an honest and valid opinion. I've seen plenty of other real life GT3 drivers say the complete opposite of what he's saying.
He can have his opinion but people shouldn't take it as fact because he's a GT3 driver in real life, which seems like he wants people to do. Especially when he's heavily invested and plays iRacing and has his setup fine tuned for it.
I do like a lot of his content, I'm not trying to shit on him but when it comes to the reviews on ACC, it just seems like he wants to stir up controversy to get more attention on his channel.
@TurncoatTony I don't know, man.... I've heard this same conversation a hundred times.
I've jumped back and forth on both and they feel pretty different. I'm also a no life porsche gt3/4 guy as well. However, I do race other cars/series here and there.
The fact is no game/simulator is going to be 1/1 to a specific car unless it was built to the specs of that car/track.
My question is, what creates realism in terms of replicating a similar driving experience. I've driven both for a long time and had many conversations with IRL drivers in all sorts of classes. My results from asking is most prefer iracing mainly due to the way the brake Is applied in the late phase. (Not car specific)
In my opinion, the braking model is probably one of the most important aspects. Yes it's not the only thing, but to me that's the most important.
I don't just use the sim to race online, I use it to practice and translate to the track. I think either one of these sims will help do that. However, in my opinion from conversation of non affiliated UA-camrs to iracing/acc, seems like iracing is slightly ahead.
I've asked many of the same questions to many current and past drivers, not because it's who's right or wrong but for choosing the right path to invest time to practice and enjoy.
Very informative, Looking forward to your review on rF2
I’ll definitely do it at the end of my season
I was there at COTA (May 20th & 21st) watching and had a go on one of the Fanatec setup they had on the 2nd floor viewing area above the paddock. I didn’t mess with any settings and used the AMG GT3 on COTA just since I thought it was cool to play what was happening IRL right in front of me. First thing that occurred to me was just how much you had to slam the brakes to avoid locking up and going off track in the corners. I’m coming from a pretty entry or low-mid level Thrustmaster Load Cell Pedals and T300 wheelbase, so the increased overall FFB from the stronger direct drive wheel took some getting used to.
My IRL track experience is 5 laps in a Ferrari 458 Challenge Evo around a smaller track in Modena, but other than overall braking requiring a hefty push, I don’t recall having to push it darn near all the way down on nearly every corner.
Main thing I wanted to ask you: what are the IRL setups like compared to those used to achieve competitive lap times in ACC? Are the real cars setup closer to the base setup ACC starts you with, or do they lean more towards the setups of people like Fri3d0lf that utilize negative toe, camber, positive rake, etc. ?
Any info would be greatly appreciated! Love your insight on these topics!
your views on braking and mid-corner were pretty much the feelings I had.... with my limited experience. Unfortunately ACC doesn't get as much drive time from me compared to iRacing because of the overall dampened feel of ACC. The ACC tire model feels much better to me tho
Agree. ACC looks great and the tires have great depth of feeling but in iRacing the car feels much more connected to the road.
always found the vagueness of braking in ACC very unintuitive compared to other sims. feel you just have to run several laps of trial and error until you find the right way
I have been on iracing for 5 years tried ACC in the beginning and realized it had a long way to go .
After the 1.90 release and spending a lot of time on it fine tuning it which did take a lot of time which i dont think you did i wont go back to iRacing till they fix the ice racing affect and the poor graphics .
Iracing is about making money now i feel.
I think your to bias towards iracing due your coaching on it and scared to run iracing down .
This is my opinion.
Sorry if it offends .😂
I agree with you the graphics need to be updated. Unfortunately with a subscription service, they do not want to risk losing a piece of that revenue by updating graphics to a point where some cannot use the service.
@@smoove7932 They've literally been upgrading the graphics in the engine. The problem is they have to update all the tracks to make use of it. Which takes a lot of time, because they basically have to redo everything from scratch to make use of it.
The cars in iRacing are easier than ever to drive... not sure why y'all keep saying "ice racing", it hasn't been like that in over 5 years.
Daniel Is right. I can't compare to iracing,never tryed it,but Acc is just bad.
There are a lot of different oppinions out there. And tbh, i am tired of that "iracing is the holy grail, vs acc is better" stuff. There are IRL drivers that say ACC is right, and there are IRL Drivers that say iRacing is right. So what now? The problem here is that the iRacing fanboys just listen to their "iRacing is better"-Drivers and the ACC fanboys only listen to their "ACC is right"-Drivers. So all of this makes no sence! There is no IRL Driver our there who is "more right" than another. At the end this are all just Video Games and people should enjoy what they want! And what you should not forget here: Daniel is a main iRacing driver. He never put the same effort into ACC which he puts into iRacing. Thats a huge thing and quite biased. I was iRacing main, and switched to ACC long time ago, because out of the Box, in ACC it felt like driving a CAR that has weight, while in iRacing it feels in EVERY car the same and somehow nowhere near that, what i can feel in a IRL car. But again, thats also just an OPPINION. There is no right and wrong...
You are absolutely right!
Very good honest review. So much info. Thx for that!
Did I missed your racing in the rain opinion in the video?😅
Original AC has better physics for some reason, even though it's an older game.
That’s what I’ve been hearing
@@danielmorad you are going to have to judge that for yourself. Original AC is looming with correlation issues to production cars and the GT3 cars feel like they are on ice. It’s a dated game and it shows itself quickly.
@@Cal3000 That's just the original content GT cars from Kunos being modeled badly, the game engine and physics are still superior. 3rd party mod cars such as those from RSS have far better suspension and aero values which make the cars perform very similarly to ACC and iRacing.
AC's main problem is still the behaviour over curbs. The rest is ok in my view.
@@1o891 the problem I have is that content is all over the place with the quality level. Nothing really feels refined. In a sea of content, there’s only a few good mods.
Great video. I’m so glad you are having the wobble/bouncing effect in the corners, I thought there was a problem with my wheel. I really enjoy ACC but the wobble just puts me off.
Let’s hope they dial it out in a future update.
we cant feel g forces in da sim, so it helps us get a feelin for what da car is doin
i love it
at least in AC, i dont play ACC
This comparison between ACC and a real GT3 is mind blowing because it makes you realize that it's all extremely subjective. In fact, on the subject I have read and sometimes personally listened to opinions of drivers of real GT3 cars that are very contrasting if not completely opposite: what for some is a strong point of the simulator is for others a flaw. Ultimately these types of videos seem to be made solely and specifically to accumulate views and nothing more.
I turned off "dynamic dampening" in ACC and the interpolation filter/inertia/friction/dampening in the driver and have a way better feeling now. I have not been racing GT3 but BMW M2 a little.
Thanks for you honest, helpful and unbiased comments from an expert professional drivers point of view. We need more real race-car drivers doing these comparisons, rather than simply experienced sim-racers, or worst of all straight up fanboys. Your views certainly impact my view of ACC as they should, and not just because they are not inconsistent with my discomfort with ACC (I've installed and tried and uninstalled about 10 times minimum). Your video will trigger untold amounts of cognitive dissonance among many fanboys and no doubt you will bear the brunt of that ire. So appreciate you all the more for your clarity and seriousness. Keep these coming. You certainly have found a great niche. How about doing the same for RF2, AC, AMS2 & others?
Interesting, thanks for doing the video. How about Assetto Corsa and rFactor 2 next?
I've had ACC since it came out and cannot understand how the brakes can be so much worse than AC, which came out almost a decade ago.
There is nothing realistic about ACC brakes
AC came out with artificial effects, ACC got rid of them.
They certainly have some extra work to make a good calculated braking handling.
@@NoNo-fi7nq Whatever Kunos is doing, RFactor and iRacing both have brake that feel natural. Threshold braking is nonexistent in ACC.
Maybe ACC can adapt something so it feels good for controller players and also for high end sim gear.
Thx for your opinion mate ,Im like you ,that want the racing feeling to be so close to real life,but I haven't tried a real racecar ,so your feedback is amazing
I have played sim for 20 + years and still Loving it ,so thanks again and have a fantastic New year
Daniel, with respect your expertise and focus on realism in relation to handling would be best served comparing rFactor 2 to real life. Would love to see a video on that
I will get to it in my off-season
Interesting video. I have never driven anything near a real racecar or been on a racetrack so I would never be able to review realism when choosing what sim to drive. I think this is true for 95% of all simracers. So I guess there are two approaches.
1. Find a real racecar driver, like Daniel here and listen to what he says. The problem with that is that another real racecar driver says that another game is more realistic. I guess the reason for that is that the two are valuing different aspects of realism, for Daniel the brakes are the most important part of realism, for another is how tires or downforce are modelled. So both would be right but it depends on the view. Also, what sim you played the most. I think that if we drive the same sim all the time, we know what to expect in a way that makes us "forget" that it might not be as realistic as we think it is.
2. Forget about what real racecar drivers think. For most of us, we will never be on the same level when it comes to being at the limit of what car can do, and even if we did, does it matter if it is very close to real life or not? We won't drive real racecars so we will have no use of the realism anyway.
Me, I am a 2. I don't care if it is realistic in the sense that it is driving like a real racecar, I will never be able to actually tell the difference anyway. I want it to feel believable for ME. Does it feel like I am in a game or a car? If it feels like a car, I am happy. That's why I value graphics and sound, not more than the driving but more than small differences in FFB or ABS behavior. Yeah, the sound maybe overdone in ACC, but when I drive a car I can hear the reverberation from walls in a tunnel or pebbles on the ground shooting from the wheel into the inside of the car. So I am happy. And I play almost all sims depending on what I want to drive. For GT3, its ACC, For endurance, iRacing, for just driving around against AI probably AMS2. I also tipped my toes into AC1 multiplayer on LFM to try more types of cars.
Can you please make a video on how to correctly setup the brakes in iracing? How they should feel, how much force, settings for making it easier to trailbrake, etc.
also add a list of good tracks to purchase to practice on :)
It would be great. Although I really like how challenging the breaking is in iRacing, I have the feeling I have to apply too little force on the pedal although my load cell is at 100% (I own a Fanatec CS v3)
We’ll wait for Daniel’s answer, of course, but I believe he said 40-50 kg of force on the brake pedal. He also has a video where he demonstrates using the muscles in the thigh for the initial braking and then anchors his heel and uses his the fast-twitch muscles to control the anchor for the fine small movements to modulate and trail brake.
@PloSkys73 a good way to decide track purchases is head to the forums and have a look at the class of car you want to focus on. have a look at past schedules. As for most of the c+ license series the community votes on tracks. There will be certain tracks that are featured more often than others across the different series... ie GT3 will be at more mid to large size tracks that feature in current series irl worldwide.. where say GR86/Mx5 is going to see more variety of tracks in the mid/shorter size
@@PloSkys73Sebring is a good track to learn it's very rough, vir is a good track also.
Thanks a lot, for the review, your time, and for the risk of doing a video like that, some people can't undrestand that other people can have another point of view about sims or anything, in this case you are a real life GT3 and GT4 driver and most of us not so for me is why your opinions are so valuable. Thanks again.
My pleasure. I know that there are some people who emotionally cannot handle the truth. It’s tough these days in 2023 for people to acknowledge what is true. These are just the examples. I am bringing as a real life driver who drives the very car I was testing. I just find it astonishing how many haters came out to comment with empty statements and no facts.
@@danielmoradYes, that is unfortunately true.
I am very curious to hear more feedback after your season.
According to my gut feeling and logical thinking, I see it like this:
1st place rFactor2
2nd place RaceRoom
3rd place Assetto Corsa
4th place AMS2 (It's slowly getting going, but it's still taking time).
The interesting thing is that the first two sims run on the isiEngine. rF2 runs on the isiEngine 2.5.
This engine is predestined to simulate motorsport.
rFactor Pro also runs on this engine, but it is reserved exclusively for professional teams such as F1.
Normal people like me have no access to it.
But that's not a bad thing, because rF2 is a derivative of rFactor Pro.
Have you never come into contact with it?
The truth is, I've never sat in a real sports car.
But my mind tells me and the vast majority confirm that these sims are currently the non plus ultra.
I recently purchased the GT4 pack for 7.99 on ACC. I was surprised how nice they are, nicer than GT3 which I mostly try to drive. Possibly the faster the car type the harder it is to simulate.
These are games and, in my opinion, firstly tehy should be rated for the game quality. I like ACC as a game, the interface, the graphics, the stability, the speed of loading, the price, the details and concentration on something and then I have never driven a GT3 or GT4 so I cannot comment on the sim quality.
Your video, the one with the helmet camera in the AMG GT3 is pretty striking. Forget considering these things not as games. I wanna see the sim racers driving, as committed as yourself, running around half a million dollar of machinery inside a can...good luck. In my sim I also have air conditioning. None better than yourself are aware of the difference. It's total.
Simulators should be evaluated on realism, accuracy and representation, it is simple. Calling something a game does not excuse its shortcomings in relation to other games that do those things better. That comparison is the point here.
@@SvalbardSleeperDistrictou could easily make a video like this on iracing as well. There is a lot of things wrong (tyre model fi) and not realistic there either. Just other stuff.
Let’s face it not a single simulator is realistic,
There is plenty of real life drivers who find acc the most realistic so it is also a matter of preference and what you are used to in the end.
@@daviddanser8011 Even if we assume that this overly vague framing is accurate, that does not change anything in the point I was making in my reply to the original comment. I wasn't even suggesting any specific sim is more realistic than another.
@@SvalbardSleeperDistrict It's a game, for the others please buy a GT3 car. Maybe, maybe Dallara, Ferrari simulators are somehow closer to something.
For sure though, if a game doesn't load, doesn't look pretty, isn't stable, it's affordable, there's no reason to play it. I'm having a hard time understanding how people that don't drive GT3 or run Ferrari's simulator or similar are expecting these things to be realistic.
@@zzmadd Ok buddy, if all you can do is repeat the same nondescript, contentless, vague line of "it's a game" and refuse to recognise difference between arcade and simulation, and degrees of quality of realism between different simulations/simcades, I cannot help you further. Play Mario Kart and tell yourself it's the same as iRacing/ACC/rFactor/etc because they are all "games".
Impressive review with nice deconstructions of key elements -- especially the braking and mid-corner FFB. The feel of load transfer and slip angle in the tires/chassis when near the limit has always been a learning curve for me in every sim. Predominant has been the 'numbness' as you also described it and I have found myself relying on sound as much as anything else to fish for cues.
Many have posted recommendations on your critique and it would be great to see if any of the community's suggestions has improved your experience. Knowing how to dial in your sim setup is so important and having your IRL experience is such a plus. Also, I would love for you to explore how you alter your inputs/racecraft based on the particular physics model. Really enjoying your content and appreciate your mature approach demonstrated at the end of this video...Moradness!
I’m totally open to optimizing the game and trying it again. I’m not here to bash anybody in particular or anyone. I just gave my honest feedback about what I thought as a real life driver who drives the exact same car in real life. In fact, I am actually in the video game. That should make anybody want to play it.
@@danielmorad Your unbiased feedback came through loud and clear for me...there will always be biased fanboys though. But you know this. So many other interesting topics for you to explore through your unique lens. Let's go!
Just did about 5 hours of back to back comparisons of iRacing vs ACC using the same tracks and cars. After being an ACC fan, I'm now converted to iRacing for its familiar feel, natural feel. It has a special, controllable feel over ACC. I never thought I'd be converted, yet I am! My friend too!
Yup! Well, we will see what this is all about. Hopefully I break it down in a way that is understandable to all.
@@danielmorad ACC is a good game - but bad sim
Now try to slide the car in iRacing.
Daniel, thanks so much for your feedback on trying to make Sim driving more realistic for all of us who are not real Racing Drivers! Would love to hear more about other sims too, but don't want you to feel any added pressure from the Community! Love anything you can help Sim Drivers with though, and it's all appreciated!
That is so weird, my driving, especially when it comes to braking, is so different from what you are describing...for instance i was practicing in snetterton today and i rarely go full 100% on the brakes, a lot of times i keep it between 20 to 70% unless i'm braking on a straight line for an hairpin...
What you pointed out about the brakes is probably what puts me off in every simulator I've tried, except for Sports Car GT and Need For Speed Porsche Unleashed from decades ago, which felt more realistic than anything since then (but I was playing those with keyboard). I just couldn't point out what was feeling odd, but it was probably the brakes and the mid-corner experience.
I watched your other video on the AMG GT4 in iRacing. It seems I should give that a try too, as I've never tried iRacing before. To date, I've found real-life cars (even the least powerful ones) more enjoyable than any car in a simulator. Real cars don't even have to be high-powered to offer a pleasurable drive. It's so great that you can share your real-world experience and compare it with the simulators. I am glad I discovered your channel!
I use to play acc all the time but I now prefer iracing by a mile. Driving In iracing just feels better.
Is it more realistic?
@@alex_lll IMO it’s more realistic. I use to play ACC for hours 3 to 4 times a week. I use to be a die hard ACC player. This includes the 1.9 update.
@@Bmoncrief thanks, and while we're at it - how does RF2 compare to both of them?
@@alex_lll that’s great question. I have RF2 but I haven’t spent much time with it. I might load it up and play it tonight.
Oh, thats why I suck in the ACC, but when I change to AC or AMS2 then Im getting much better times...
I've been waiting for this video for very long time. Many thanks Dan!
I used to be an ACC fanboy, but the more I improve my driving technique and understand how the weight transfer and braking works of a car, the more I realize that ACC is still far from where it should be.
I would love if you could do the same with RFactor 2. In my humble opinion, the physics are closer to iRacing but the tire grip is overdone. In other words, it feels that tire grip is infinite.
Sponsored by iRacing 😂🎉 thanks for input and honest thoughts where to watchout in this game!
@Daniel: About braking, what's your ABS setting in the AMG IRL? And what ABS value did you dial in with your ACC review?
Get exactly what you say about the braking. I've found I've learned the most about braking in the last 6 months by getting rid of abs and tc on every car I drive, so I can better learn thresholds. I started initially with the GT4 Maserati which has none anyway. Hasn't made me a particularly quick driver, but I have made improvements with my own times and a much better understanding of control and able to achieve consistency. I've found that much more enjoyable and immersive than just stamping on the pedal. Works for me, anyway.
Also re. Mid corner feel - maybe it's the slip? I don't get the same feel as they did achieve in AC1, where the wheel stiffens up until you break grip when it goes loose. For me, that feels much better, but I'm no racer irl.
Enjoy your content very much
@Daniel: Thank you very much for sharing your impressions of ACC with your background as an professional race driver. You trying to be diplomatic, but somehow I have also the feeling you are reviewing ACC form the perspektive of an IRacing driver :D. IRacing and ACC(@LFM League) are todays most played racing sims. Both, ACC and IRacing have their strengs & weaks regarding realism I think. I just want to add some points from the perspektive as automotive engineer. As you pointed out, the tire model of ACC is very detailed - this is no coincidence because pirelli is the official supplier regarding tires in real GT World Challange Championship. So actually you are driving pirellis in ACC and can feel the input/influence from pirelli engineers. Also the different traction control systems and other systems of the cars are simulated in detail in ACC, because Kunos as official simulation developer of the GT World Challange has the best access to real GT World Challange driving data. In comparison to other simulations like also IRacing, they are simulated/implemented only rudimentary. When it comes to braking, I think IRacing is the better training tool, because in ACC u can really smash the brakes and be fast. But in Iracing ABS is also not very well / not implemented realistic. I think both leading racing simulations IRacing and ACC are very good and finally everyone must test for themselves and check which simulations suits personally best.
Actually I stopped driving ACC because half of the time I didn’t feel what the car was doing.
Which is crucial for a low average driver like me.
I don’t mind the sound though, even in your comparison.
Anyway, thank you for the video!
Great point!
Sponsored by iracing 😂😂😂
Must be mad cause you’re trash at racing in general. Not all of us can be legends like Morad but you can have fun trying without idiotic comments such as yours.
Exactly 😂
Cope.
I play both. Like both.
I also play both and can agree with his feedback. When I tryed to find words for what I felt was "The car feels like a callous board I' sitting on. The only feedback if what I am doing is right or wrong is given by visual impression, not by feel or haptical feedback, especially on corner entry".
They're all more fond of their iRating than accepting that acc is the new benchmark for Sim racing
Informative review! Each SIM is different, so that would necessitate that each SIM be optimized on your hardware and peripherals so get the best out it. Users love to claim that a SIM isn’t that great with this and that, but it’s usually that their PC and peripherals are not tweaked properly for each SIM.
It’s 100% down to all of those factors. It also comes down to budget as well. I’m reading a lot of the comments and the number one issue why people don’t want to try other sims is because price
I agree that pricing of a product does enter into the evaluation by users who are judging the complete package as a purchasing consideration. But, from another evaluation view of how well does a SIM perform as a SIM compared to other SIM’s regarding a limited range of scope like physics implementation, or even more specifically tires, or braking effectiveness, then pricing seems like it is almost not a consideration because of the targeted scope of a review and comparison process.
Even though one SIM may be priced quite a bit higher than others, that still doesn’t prevent me from wanting to experienced that SIM in comparison to all the others.
In fact, that after spending the funds for the higher priced SIM, and then experiencing the quality of it, then you can ask yourself, is it really worth the price to you for whatever reason/s you may have. So, value for price seems somewhat a totally separate subject verses, how well does it perform as a SIM comparatively.
Similarity, a SIM’s “ fun factor” may not have much to do with pricing or physics either. I think it comes down to specifying up front when doing any sort of evaluation that this is a certain type of evaluation that includes this and that, or may not include this or that in the considerations.
Good feedback. As an ACC player I am disappointed at your overall dumping on the game, and would appreciate some insight on your in-game controller settings and how you developed the setups you used. Eg. maybe (not likely), you had brake power set to something less than 100% for some unknown reason.
The sound seems like something you could easily tune out via the in-game settings, but I think some elements are the way they are to help the situational awareness of the player, since we don't feel going over marbles or oversteer through anything other than the wheel.
Thanks for the candid review!!
My pleasure
ACC engine and tire model, rf2 physics and ffb, iracing sounds, ui and online races model. That might be the best sim! Great video! I have the same feeling with ACC compared to iRacing
iRacing is for over 90% of all Real world Racing drivers, their Simulation of choice.. thats says all for me. My friends and me like Racing competitive on iRacing more too.
At the end of the day, pick whatever You enjoy the most..
Daniel, now would be great to test the RaceSimStudio's Mercedes GT3 mod for Assetto Corsa 1, i've heard its one of the most realistic experiences, so of course would be awesome to see if you agree with it.
That sounds like a great idea. Due to how hectic my race season is through August, September, and October, I will have to reserve this for after my racing season, but I will definitely do it.
"The thing that kills it for me as being a realistic simulator is like... basically the reason you bought it for in the first place." There Daniel, I fixed the main statement of your closing remark for you. Cause it's not what you actually said, but it's definitely what I heard. It's not what I wanted to hear, but I can accept it for what it is.
Hopefully AC2 will be the physics model AND the pricing structure we really want. Dare I say, we deserve.
Hopefully all the Sim companies take a step forward
@@danielmoradYes because we SIMRACERS just want perfection 😅
My biggest question would be how much time have you actually spent playing ACC. Hope you provide some of this context in the video. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
I definitely do. I tried to be as fair and honest as possible. Might surprise you actually.
Time doesn't matter. If you jump in the same car on the same track and it feels wrong then time isn't going to change that.
Time wont change realism
Great insights thanks! Would love your thoughts on AC1, Rf2 and Raceroom when you have the time!
Will do!
THe details are very glossed over here.
Your'e saying that for braking you need to have it at 100% all the time in ACC, but I don't find that experience to be true at all really. In fact that gradual pressure percentage braking is exactly what I've been doing to learn ACC the best. For one thing, there are details missing, such as what level ABS you're using for each car. WHAT CARS are you comparing to begin with? If you're speaking on IRL for a BMW GT3, are you using the same vehicle in ACC? And which year/model?
There's a lot of missing information here that has me with an eyebrow raised. While I understand that you have rep as a race car driver, a proper comparison is still a proper comparison. This just seems....to be missing too much to take this into proper credibility.
Thinking the same... love the video format! Would love to see something like this for RF2