Zack's last point is the most important. If you want to really reduce emissions, use the right tool for each task. Pickup truck when you need to haul heavy loads, bike or e-bike when you're going less than a mile, walk when you're going less than half a mile. No sense using a 7,000 pound truck just to pick up a gallon of milk from the corner store.
One argument you don't hear much is the amount of effort it takes to get petrol to the pump. There's the intial extraction, delivery to refinery, refining process, delivery to central storage, from there to petrol station and finally into your car. All along this process a lot of electricity and diesel is being being burned before it even gets to your car. Then your car starts putting out Co2.
@@Elusive_Chicken correct, but you don't pack up a truck load of electricity in the back of a a vehicle consuming electricity to deliver the electricity to a status n where vehicles charge. As the video states, the greenness of an ev also depends on where you live and how clean the grid is there. Nothing is going to be 100% clean even after the earth is on 100% renewables as the products used to produce electricity also currently depend on parts that can't always be recycled. Hauling fuel using vehicles that consume fuel to locations that store fuel for vehicles to then collect and burn the fuel is what (I believe) Paul's comment is referring to.
But, the extraction and processing for those are many times more costly and more toxic to the environment. And, unlike a combustion engines are 100% recyclable and uses less energy to reprocess. Batteries are harder to reprocess.
As usual, well done sir. On the recycling front I’d call out American Manganese and Li-Cycle too. I’ve visited Li-Cycle’s hub plant in my hometown of Rochester, NY (in an old Kodak building). The amount they can already process is impressive and it’s scaling up fast.
I agree on the bullet trains comment! After riding a few bullet trains in Spain, they were so incredibly efficient & fun to ride in! I wish the U.S. had a better public mass transportation system like that .
To me most people that don't want EVs always come up with the excuse of "It's going to cost $20k when you have to replace the battery pack". But I don't think they know how long the battery packs will last if taken basic care. I guess they feel like they're the same as any other battery that you replace every 3-4 years. Most likely if you drive your EV long enough that it literally disintegrates you're most likely to be left sitting on the battery pack that still works. I just feel it's very odd to argue like that
a lot of their arguments against EVs are based in ignorance of the technology or things they hear other ignorant people say (and believe them). That's why we should respectfully try to inform people that are open to it.
Thank you for acknowledging public transport and high speed railways like bullet trains. They are truly currently the most efficient of transportation. Teslas in Tunnels things is just a glorified distraction from real public transport.
Except there will always be a huge chunk of the population who do not like public transport, like me. I don't want to sit together with strangers in a box. I want to listen to music loudly with good 13-15-speaker system. I like to smoke in my car. All things public transport can never replace. The only thing that would change it is if you introduce laws that prohibit all freedoms with your own car (like driving only on certain days).
@@John-gi3es If I pay for it, then i like my amenities. Here in Finland train ride costs quite a lot more than paying for the gas for the same distance in your car. ETA is similar.
This video is exactly what we needed. Most people are talking about how dirty EVs are ( ie; pollution caused in battery manufacturing and in electricity production) as compared to ICE vehicles without doing much research. Glad You went through all the trouble of researching and finding the right information.
Especially for a country as populus as America, many major corridors can have bullet trains or even just normal overnight sleeper trains (who doesn't want to sleep at one city and wake up arrived at your destination?!?!) More trains/public transport in general will kill off so much inter/intra city traffic too
There is something else that must be taken into consideration with ICE vehicles. It's rarely discussed but used crankcase oil is not recycled at 100%. Even with 98% of used motor being recycled over 200 million gallons of highly toxic used crankcase oil is improperly disposed of every year, and a significant chunk of this number comes from DIY oil changers who pour it down storm drains, into ponds lakes and streams or bury it in their back yards. It's a major source of MTBE in ground water. Used motor oil is loaded with toxic substances such as benzene, lead, zinc, and cadmium. Millions of extremely toxic used oil filters are simply discarded in the trash or landfills. This nonsense does not happen with EVs.
I would love to see updated numbers factoring in towing, ideally residential boat/RV towing. So far that has been my biggest hold up switching to an EV truck vs gas. Our average weekly towing range would be 30-40 miles, however we regularly tow 100-200 miles at a time.
take your normal range and at least cut it in half. Multiple tests have been done pulling light trailers and most rvs are 5-6k lbs anything smaller doesn't normally have a real bathroom or an ac unit. boats depend on the model. most people buying these would be using a 18-20ft boat and often fiberglass models with somewhat large motors. boats in the that class are typically 3500-4000lbs. sure the ultra light 12ft aluminum skiff with a 9hp motor is gonna be significantly lighter but if you are going that small a kayak could easily take that small boats job and be transported by anything
Excellent and well researched video. Thank you for putting this out. It was a really fair, nuanced assessment of the ICE vs. Electric debate. Looking forward to your bullet train video! I would love a high speed rail system in the US.
@@IV.olution diesel has other problems though and almost all regular american cars/truck are gasoline. Many diesel vehicles have been caught up in emmisions scadals, including my dads VW. EV's are still more efficient so there is just not much reason to spend time and money switching from gas to diesel for limited benefits.
Would love one too. A big component of increasing public transport will be reforming zoning to allow denser development that is also public transport/pedestrian/bike friendly. The twin cities 2040 plans and things like the Highland Bridge development on the site of the old ford plant in St. Paul are hopefully steps in that direction.
I've often been skeptical of all the claims about how "green" electric cars actually are, and this puts everything into perspective. Great video as always!
Zack even forgot to mention the CO2 produced during extracting, transport, refining and distributing of fuel. It's like a NFL all-star facing a 2 years old. And the difference will increase. ICE is dead. Exxon CEO's know it. That's why they are investing in clean energy. Ford CEO's know it. That'S why Ford is investing in RnD. They all know it. Only average Joe petrol heads don't know it. Yet.
Thank you so much for mentioning that trains should be used more... but a much bigger impact is the lack of short range public transit. An inefficient old diesel bus is better than the cleanest EV because of how many more people it moves - even when it's only half utilized.
I absolutely agree about bullet trains. Public transportation isn't big enough here in the US as it should be, especially for longer distance travel. Being able to take the train in the Bay Area to travel between multiple cities is great. They are working on making all electric trains which I'm excited for but won't be out for a few years.
Both short/medium/long distance should just have trains, whether if it's bullet train or sleeper train or even just a decent 100-125mph train between major/minor population centres would help soooooo much.
Bullet trains won't take you up into the mountains like a Rivian. I'm hoping with self driving cars we will get more car sharing. You might not need to own a car or truck but maybe you can rent one cheaper if renting is the main marketplace.
@@JLars if combined with a cable cart you can get into the mountains with 2% emmision compared to an electric car. Btw an electric bike that you can take on the train can get you up a mountain.
Very interesting video. According to your data, electric vehicles "cleaner" than I thought. It will be interesting to see the future of battery recycling. Great video 👍
Thank you for making this video. I bet you have a wider audience than many who drive EVs. Also, on the use of cobalt in batteries: one thing people often miss is that a very large majority of all cobalt produced today is used for refining oil, not for batteries.
If I remember it correctly Kurzgesagt showed a fact once that was that producing an entire electric vehicle emits as much as laying 2 meter road (I think 2+2 lane). So while we can electrify our vehicles as much as we want, we must also examine new ways of creating the infrastructure to use those vehicles.
Hey there Zack! Two months ago I started wondering about this question. I asked a lot of friends and smart people I know what they think about it. Most of them answered without really considering anything witch i didn't really like. I really love when some well know facts are explored and actually proven with real data. It really made me happy to see all the statistics. What I am trying to say is: Thank you for making this video! Thank you for sharing all this ways to make the world a better place with all your videos! Edit: P.S. I really agree about the bullet trains idea.
I so badly want to show this video to a client of mine that’s completely against EV’s for the emissions debate. I know it’s above her intellect though so I’d be wasting my time, trying to argue with a brick wall basically. I love my tesla 100%.
If you want to get even deeper into the geeky #'s - Check out engineering explained video on the same topic! He goes through the math and explains it all step by step.
@@abdullahunal1108 Engineering Explained is how I knew the conclusion of this video before I even clicked on it. Still though, always appreciate another well researched video on the topic to point at.
Wow, did you read my mind? I've been meaning to write to you and ask if you could educate everyone about how green EVs are compared to ICE vehicles. Thanks for the video Zach
I've been seeing this debate going on for a while now and it was really annoying to not have too many simple videos to point people to that explained it well enough to understand for everyone.
Great video Zack! As always, thanks for including links to sources and for not sugar coating or biasing towards the facts that EVs aren’t *quite* as green as we sometimes hear from manufacturers/media.
I agree! I'm especially thankful for his honesty and the in-depth explanation because it helps people in the market for a new vehicle make a better decision on their own instead of just saying bUy tHis riGhT nOw bEcAuSe eLeCtRic. So thank you, Zack! It's very refreshing to watch.
Although there are a few factors not considered in the video which would add up to the "cleanness" difference between gas and electric. Zack talked about the production of energy, but didn't consider that gasoline also has to be produced and transported to each gas station. That adds a huge amount of emissions to gas powered cars again making EVs a lot "cleaner" Another thing is that even if the difference would be 30% in favor of EVs, which may sound like not much imagine that after all cars change to electric and we improve the cleanness of power production that'll be over 30% less of all vechicle emissions, which make up 40% of global CO2 emissions. That's over 2 billion metric tons of CO2 less per year.
@@malcewicz oh 100 percent agree, but maybe that’s more content for another video! I would for sure be interested in the breakdown of the emissions costs of: gas generation/transportation, battery materials mining/refinement/transportation, etc.
@@malcewicz good observation! I agree with Chris; this would be great to see in a future video. I think it would also be super interesting to see the process of recycling the batteries.
Great video as always. The other thing to consider is how oil (actually bitumen which is like natural asphalt) is literally strip-mined with bulldozers when being retrieved from tar sands such as in Alberta in the Athabasca formation on land that used to be boreal forests. It then must be super heated to release the petroleum and treated before it is sent down keystone. The carbon footprint of just retrieving that oil is tremendous. So why do we always talk about mining for batteries but not strip mining for oil?
We always talk about strip mining for batteries because (generally) people have been acting like EVs are totally carbon neutral OR immensely more neutral than ICEVs when the actual case has been arguably the opposite and potentially much more ecological damage in a much shorter amount of time (100 years of gas/diesel vs the last 10-20 of EV progression). And because everyone has been talking about the downsides of oil plenty already, no one (until recently) really spoke about downsides of EVs.
Nice video, i’m glad you mentioned the current metrics from Tesla as they truly give a prospective of true emissions once we pass the point of EVs made with 100% recycled ore
I don't agree with not including the CO2 release from the mining, refinement and delivery of gasoline/diesel. If you don't include it you might as well not include emissions coming in from production of electricity. The processes mentioned above all emitt large amounts of CO2.
Their point still stands though, even without factoring that in, it's still better. You can basically dismantle the opposition to EV's arguments with just the "best case" scenario for the ICE vehicle. It would have been nice to know the data anyway but thats a whole lot more research and variables that would just give people ammunition to miss the point entirely and nitpick whatever stats were used and dismiss the entire video.
I am not sure why it was not included in the video but I still have to give him credit because he said "let's give the ICE car the best fighting chance" or something to that sense. And considering that even with basically the best possible case where fuel wasn't even considered in that mind, the ICE car still fell behind an EV.
Damn right that should've been included. It's total bs imo the mpge standard accounts for energy losses from the source to the battery. But gas mpg standards require no such calculation. That right there tells anyone with a brain a bunch about "standards" Not to mention stuff like oil change emissions and impact. Air filter manufacturing, spark plug manufacturing, catalytic converters use platinum metals groups and we manufacturer plus replace hundreds of millions of those world wide each year. All the belts n hoses on combustion vehicle's that evs don't have or need to be maintained or replaced. All the fluids not required by evs vs ICE. They don't include those in videos like this one, because it would paint a crystal clear picture of how insanely better overall for the environment and being sustainable evs truly are. I ran a repair shop as a manager when I was younger and we did everything we could to reduce our impact. All oil was sent to a state recycling facility(fun fact less than 60% of oil is even recycled here in the U.S. and it takes over a gallon of used oil on average to get back 2.5 quarts of re sellable product. Product that took energy to transport, energy to re refine, energy to re package&transport again etc. We recycled all the oil filters to. We drip dried them on special racks and sent them in to another facility to get recycled. Here in the U.S. alone it's estimated we do 424,000,000+oil changes each year. With over 27,000 small businesses that exist just to change oil. And produced over 160,000 TONS of wasted steel just from the oil filters each year. We also sorted all metals we could into various bins to get picked up by a salvage scrap company under contract. We sorted all our cardboard, we recycled&resold all the tires we pulled off the cars to. Despite everything we did? The impact of servicing about 250 combustion engine cars a week was staggering. And as we have over 275,000,000 personal use ice vehicle's otr here in just the U.S. You can imagine the true impact of servicing them. 😐
It wasn't included because it doesn't change the numbers. Getting the gas to a station isn't huge compared to the refinement and mining for gas. Both electric and ICEs need fossil fuels to go (with exceptions) so those numbers would be very similar. The outcome would still be electric vehicules are better in the long run they just may need a little less time to pass up ICEs. No point in adding something minor that doesn't change the outcome.
Zack, I really want to thank you for this video. Since the birth of EVs, there was always this daoubt in my head. How green are green technologies applied to vehicles. Since the mining, transporting, manufacturing, recharging and pollution from batteries heavy metals and acid? and whatnot. BTW, that series of videos of your electric humvee is top notch! I just loved them. I know it required too much work, resources and probably sleepless nights, but you came through all obstacles. Cheers from Mexico.
Interesting video! Thank you! Want to mention that after melting the metal, you won't have the same amount of metal because it burns a bit of it while melting, so there won't be a real endless circle of recycling.
Thank you for sharing this much needed info. Both sides argue that their cars are much greener and better for the environment, and you have made everything crystal clear with all the data and calculation. Truly a one of a kind UA-camr! 👍🏾
@@Satsu1NoHado Most of the people in the world have brown skin, some darker and some lighter. We shouldn't still be calling anyone black/negro or white either. That came from the colonists and there are underlying meanings to these labels that have nothing to do with the variety of different peoples falsely identified by them.
An important factor to remember with this conversation is the long-term goal of electric vehicles. Yes, there are carbon emissions from producing and driving them, and that's not changing anytime soon. However, this is the first step in creating a greener transportation system overall. While electric vehicles are currently reliant on fossil fuels, they will accept any electricity they are fed. Gas powered vehicles only accept fossil fuels in order to run. By beginning the transition to electric vehicles, we are consolidating greenhouse gas emissions into centralized locations, which down the line will be much easier to transition to renewable energy than the millions of "power plants" currently on the road. With the way green technology has become a selling point, it is important to question proposed new technologies to fight climate change, but it is also important to consider the context of the conversation, and whether the narrative around a technology is being influenced by parties with an interest in suppressing that tech. If electric car adoption takes off, the fossil fuel industry stands to lose a lot of money in gasoline sales due to the increased efficiency of EV charging. This is an industry with a history of targeted marketing campaigns to change public perception around climate issues to their favor. In the past few months, I have noticed a lot more people talking about the environmental cost of lithium mining and battery production, especially in response to people talking about the environmental benefits of using an EV. This is an easy argument to disprove (as seen in this video), but people who have no pre-existing interest in EVs may not be exposed to it. This sows doubt in whether electric vehicles are better for the environment (they are), and might cause someone on the fence about what new car to buy to lean away from an EV. This is clearly not evidence of propaganda from the fossil fuel industry, but a reminder that ExxonMobil alone has spent hundreds of millions of dollars funding disinformation campaigns. The climate cost of EVs is a conversation that needs to be had, but be sure to remember that there are people with a profit motive to convince you that climate action is not in your best interest.
Thanks for the video and a pretty interesting data that you researched. I think there is a couple more things to consider here. First one is you go on the EPA's website and look at the percentage of "dirty" energy produced and then include it in your calcs; however, the plants which produce the clean energy are already working on nearly max capacity, and every additional electric vehicle which gets added to the grid would need to consume energy mainly from the "dirty" sources. There are still going to be times when you probably can get some of it out from clean sources, like charging a vehicle at night when energy consumption is relatively low, and Hydro + Wind + Nuclear can produce the needed power (they're estimated at 59.2 in Utah, but probably much lower in some less green states). Unfortunately there is no data which shows the energy source at a certain time of the day. Second one is you focus only on CO2 only; however, there is a lot of harmful toxic elements produced to mine the materials for the battery and produce it.
He kinda did talk about those others, but only focusing on the reciclyng part, wich would be fine if they were a big enough % of cars on the street (they aren't) so I consider this point still unanswered
Clean energy production is not maxed out. Nuclear and Hydro maybe, but wind and solar are typically producing more power than can be used which then gets wasted. And more batteries help with that a lot. And for charging at night, most power generation is only at 20-25% of the total capacity for the grid. Obviously solar is directly being used at night, but it is through battery storage. But wind, nuclear, and hydro are all still running at night and playing a larger part of the total grid needs. The main true dirty power is coal. That is getting reduced every year, at least in the US. Natural gas isn't great, but it is still far cleaner than gasoline/diesel burning engines. Plus cleaner power generation is growing every year. More batteries, more wind, and more solar. For the focus on CO2, that is more easily understood. But batteries are also undeniably better than burning oil in nearly all other cases. Burning oil causes acid rain, puts a massive amount of crap in the air, and is literally fatal if there is too much in the air. It's also tied to cancer, brain damage, and numerous illnesses. Mining for battery materials isn't perfect, but it is a massive amount better. Seriously think about it. A mine runs for a single day and produces enough material for tens of thousands of batteries that will each last multiple decades and can then be recycled.
Zack did a great job with this video, you can see a lot of research was done. Its enjoyable. I do think this subject merits more videos with more in-depth information. Miss-information and ignorance is what petrol economies rely on to thrive.
It's unfortunate that we live in a time with so much easy access to valid and accurate information and simultaneously so much misinformation and ignorance on different subjects.
As always, great video. I own both an EV and ICE vehicle (Chevy Bolt, F150 SuperCrew). I know quite a few other EV owners out there and I don’t know any of them that bought an EV with the primary reason of saving the environment. But if you talk to someone who hates EVs (and there are a lot out there) they suddenly have become huge environmentalists because “EVs are worse for the environment”. Having a data driven argument showing they aren’t as environmentally friendly as one would think, but still better than an ICE vehicle in the long run, is refreshing.
This is a top notch video, nice to see not shilling for gas or electric just telling it how it is from the vehicle's production to end of life. Keep it up Zack!
Really nice video, I didn't heared it in the video but one point to be mentioned is that even if the powergrid used for charing isn't very low CO2 right now, most of the country are shifting their electricity production quite rapidly and the EV that you buy today will become "greener" without doing anything from your side.
They are though??? Ev batteries are so expensive to recycle it's not really done. They aren't really recyclable at all. Just check Teslas number (sketchy as they are) the point to how hard and unrecyclable these batteries are. You get like nothing back from them at all.
@@OutOfNameIdeas2 It's all about cost, not because they can't do it. Even plastic, a well known item that could be recycled are often in the trash. Simply, it costs more to recycle than to make new from scratch. Until it's more profitable to recycle than to make from scratch, it's not going to happen. It's just business. At some point when it's so expensive to mine for minerals to make new batteries, then perhaps it will become profitable to recycles.
Thanks for making this video, Zach. I know that electric vehicles start off in more “environmental debt.” However, I still can’t wait to get my Rivian. It’s videos like this one that really help bring some clarity to a conversation that is often not done very well.
Start the comparison at. 1) Oil in the ground. 2) Electricity needs generation . The generate the electricity. . Then consider the use of *the same electricity* mix to either refine the oil, of go straight to the EV. THAT'S where they're nett zero. *Now* move the vehicles (burn the fuel!)
But that still doesn't account for how dirty the batteries themselves are. The acid rain produced in areas that have to mine for the rare earth minerals needed. The horrible labor practices in areas that dig for these materials. What happens to the battery when its done in only 10 or so years? Not only that. But now we must rely more on China for these materials. EVs are worse for the environment when you account for the batteries
@@inisipisTV you... you really don't know what you're talking about. Almost by definition, ICE cars are less eco-friendly than EVs, and the only way that could possibly change is with synthetic fuels
I'm glad you mentioned that getting energy from the grid is far more efficient than getting the same amount of energy out of an ICE and thus less dirty, because people rarely consider that.
Which is a total lie. Or just uneducated per say. A dirty grid would mean you need to drive about a million KM to be equivalent to a regular suv. (Comparing long range Tesla's) *By Dirty grid i mean the average European grid
@@Voltaic_Fire The troll doest account for the same "dirty grid" being used to refine the "dirty oil" which is then burned as "dirty fuel". They never do.
Amazingly clear video. One point though, is that as long as your grid is not over 100% green, every additional EV powered from the grid will have 100% "dirty" electricity, not the current mix of dirty and green of the grid. We need to think in terms of marginal effects: the green portion of the grid has low elasticity (the total amount produced will not adapt to demand), while the the "dirty" has full elasticity (it will adapt to every change in demand). Since only the "dirty" portion adapts, the new EV on the grid creating this extra demand will be powered by 100% dirty energy. That being said, if the new EV purchase is accompanied by an additional 100% green electricity production capable of running it, such as your home solar panels, then the EV can be considered to be effectively powered by 100% green energy, even if you actually charge it from a partially "dirty" grid. This is true, too, even if the extra electricity is produced elsewhere on the grid, such as in a new big green power plant, where economies of scales can also kick in.
I’ve heard a lot of people discuss this topic but I feel like I trust your take the most. EVs are currently cleaner over the course of the life of the vehicle and it’ll only get better!!
@@user-rg8mc4el8w We already have battery tech in the works that does not use lithium. So your argument is flawed. As battery continues to advance EV's will continue to get greener and greener than ICE vehicles can ever hope to be.
Great video. My main problem switching to an EV is the range and towing. If I plan to take a roadtrip I want to get between 400-500 miles per charge, not 200-250. Towing is another thing all together
We just kept our gas vehicle around for stuff like that. Bought an old, used, Leaf but kept the old gal as a vintage deal for roadtrips or loaning out. I understand people are crunched for space and might not be able to insure two vehicles or whatever though. :)
Yeah, range anxiety is really still a big deal for a lot of people it seems. I've personally seen a lot of YT videos where people do road trips with them all the time and it only adds a few minutes or an extra hour or two in travel time for charging. Those videos sealed the deal for me and I'm actually already looking to get my second EV in another year or two. But I agree, I can't wait for new battery tech to come out where the range is possibly doubled and charging times are decreased significantly.
@@ProXcaliber we actually get pretty frustrated with the gas car now coming home from airport or wherever having to stop and spend $$ on gas instead of just rolling into the garage and going to bed. Looking at some not-too-accurate F to E gauge like "can we make it home, do we need to stop and get gas," haha range anxiety reborn
Same boat. Really hoping to see some big battery breakthroughs in the next few years(solid state?). Faster charging and more storage, as well as reducing the effects of a too hot/cold environment on a battery. For towing I think 600 miles without load(which for me would get me about 300 miles while towing) would suffice for me, I think those with larger trailers, more is going to be necessary. Still excited about the prospect of electric vehicles, and the fact that I could add solar and storage to my house and forgo needing the grid altogether is also really appealing. We are aiming to do an electric for more day to day and then keeping our truck for pulling the camper and hauling stuff.
Thanks for the shoutout for Bullet Trains. Great video as always. Being from the UK I paused at “25 mpg is really good”, then I remembered the US Gallon is about 25% less than the imperial gallon
Did I miss something or was there no discussion about the energy required for extraction of oil and manufacturing it into gas? That is a very high energy process which would balance out or surpass the production of electricity.
How about the energy required to mine coal and natural gas that runs the power plants? Or the carbon impact of building “clean” energy sources such as solar, wind, or hydro
@@HoHoPlays fair enough but I would argue building out the refining process and everything else around it cancels out. That is why I would suggest that including the generation of electricity from the overall estimate as it’s disingenuous to overall break even point in favour of ICE vehicles.
I want a Zero DS motorcycle. I wish I could afford even a used one. If people weren't happy with their electric vehicles, they would be available cheap used.
@@OutOfNameIdeas2 I love it when petroleum trolls post pictures of copper mines, and say they're Lithium mines. No, Lithium mining isn't destructive, and Lithium is recyclable.
@@riparianlife97701 You might want to watch Louis Rossmann's videos about Zero Motorcycle. If you're the kind of person who likes owning and repairing your vehicles, Zero Motorcycle is not for you.
I love the Mass Transit plug at the end, it really is what we SHOULD be thinking about. Any company or person concerned with the environment should be putting all their resources and money to advancing mass transit in America. America is so ridiculously behind the vast majority of the rest of the world (that aren't deep in Oil money) that it would take decades to get our infrastructure caught up and thats only if rural areas ever get out of the way (they wont)
Lots of good information man. I love that you're willing to talk about this when many people just assume that EVs are the perfect answer. And let's get some great trains in this country.
This is my favorite misconception to shut down instantly. All it takes is some thought and data, and it leaves deniers speechless. Such a good video, will be referencing all the time when telling people about our cars!
Great job Jerry 👍 But I sense something missing on your video that would be amazing to know. How about compare buying a new electric truck vs maintaining your old car? Which would be the most carbon efficient way to go? Even though, loved your video. 👍👌
2 Factors that remained untouched in this well researched video: 1. Carbon emission for mining and distillation of 1 gallon of gasoline. 2. Average life of EV is considerable more than IC Engine vehicle because EVs have much less moving parts. So, if we factor in all these, the breakeven point for EVs may arrive way before 2 years.
THIS! He mentioned emissions for producing and transporting gas to the pump, but then didn't factor that in at all. And yet he did factor in the carbon footprint of providing electricity to EV chargers. That's a rather unfair comparison, and yet EVs still easily win.
There are a ton of 2011-2013 Nissan Leafs here in NZ that all have between 60k-130k kilometres on the clock and most are only getting a scrape over half of their original distance on one charge, that seems like a pretty bad case for the environment. Not sure about the newer models though
The problem with Nissan's cars are that they aren't talking very good care of their batteries. Nissan lacks active cooling in their packs and batteries don't really like getting hot.
Something I just wondered: why only look at co2 emissions? Are there any other bad substances that are beeing released during the production of petrol / batteries?
Great content as always! The question that never seems to be addressed though, it the impact on the earths crust. The leaching, toxic chemicals, depletion of are earth metals, holes in the ground, etc.
As someone that lives in Europe, our city planning is not as car centric and cities are often easy to walk and cycle. Even so there's currently a shift to make our cities even more pedestrian and bicycle friendly, with model cities being Amsterdam and Copenhagen. Trains are also an important part of that development. Cycling through a park and seeing people out and about to get where I need to be, is a lot more appealing than highways, traffic jams and pollution.
Highways traffic Jams and pollution are way better than having to walk into a city where the majority of its people are just looking to rob and stab their next target. Not everything in life comes from your own specific point of view and a lot of countties in Europe need to realise that. My own included. They want happy families to walk all around town but refuse to do anything about the junkies who'll literally attempt to kidnap your kid so they can afford a bag of heroin.
@@kavalogue More realistic issue is junkies stealing bikes or bike parts and selling them for easy low risk money. I would love good electric bike but hesitant to leave it anywhere public.
A couple things you may have forgotten to take into account. First, EVS are a significantly heavier and therefore go through tires more frequently (Some of this can be negated by buying special tires for EVS but not completely) then you also have to take into account increased damage to the road system because of that weight. Mining for battery components such as lithium and Cobalt often take place and third world countries employing child labor, paying very little, exposing the surrounding country to toxic runoff, and exposing the miners to toxic substances such as Cobalt dust which causes types of lung diseas. Add to that states like California who are blocking the sale of gasoline cars in just a few years while at the same time asking people not to charge their electric cars because of their failing power grid. I think people need to be more educated about some things before making their decision. As opposed to just saying it's green and blocking the sale of gasoline cars. Just my thoughts. 🤷♂️
By that same token, you need to consider that gasoline for ICEs needs to be transported to each gas station by trucks that themselves burn gas and are manufactured for that only purpose in the first place. Need to consider also oil refining to produce gas, which is incredibly polluting as well. Then tankers that bring the extracted oil to shore and to refineries, and they consume an outrageous amount of fuel. End of the day, EVs are still cleaner even if they are charged from a fossil-based grid, especially a natural gas-based grid as you eliminate the refining and transportation step.
@@edoardoruggeri1 that's true to an extent and I'm not saying there's no advantage either them. I was just pointing out a couple of things he forgot to mention. And also my opinion that EVS should not be mandatory anywhere.
@@alexk7977 You can look at the micro scale of anything. Considering the statistics of electric VS ICE there billions more tyres being used by ICE cars. There’s also the gas being transported across the country in tankers to each gas station. Then you factor in how many old cars are on the road with many times worse gas mileage and emissions than the F150 in the video. Then Modified cars like coal rollers, ricers, muscle cars, etc. No matter which way you look it, electric cars are objectively better for the environment over time. The issue I see is that they just not viable in a lot of places. Here in Australia it wouldn’t be possible out in the outback and the bush. Sometimes a gas station is hundreds of kilometres away. You can’t drive a few hundred kilometres and then wait an hour to charge up. Electric infrastructure needs to be 100x more developed than it currently is for it to work here.
throw in towing too, evs generally lose about half of their battery range while towing even light loads, and twice the charging for the same distance can up the emissions as well. plus time is money and waiting an hour to charge up when youre in a hurry wouldnt be cool. i think they should stick to smaller cars and definitely not mandate anything. maybe the best of both worlds is the answer, some ppl drive evs, some drive ice and some use hybrids, oil will last longer since the ice drivers have thinned out and we might have more time to build up the power grid, try to make evs with better energy density in the batteries, or even make hydrogen happen, all while not forcing anything on anyone.
@@alexk7977 I think the reason he didn't mention that is because it's not really in the scope of this video. Also lithium isn't mined in any 3rd world country, most come from Australia and Chile. While Cobalt mainly comes from the corrupt DPR Congo the vast majority is not mined by children, since they aren't very effective. Today 98% of that cobalt is consumed in refining oil.
And also don’t forget that the grid can (and in a lot of places does) get greener every year, making your ev greener (if you charge from the grid). This is a big factor often discounted. You can’t really make an ice car greener afterwards without having to alter the car itself. With Evs owners don’t necessarily have to do anything (but solar is of course awesome).
The thing at the moment with recycling EV batteries, is it is not an easy process. It is not a cheap process. It is not an energy efficient process. And it certainly is not a clean process. Hopefully that will improve over time.
One of the biggest concerns that I have with EVs (EV Trucks) is that they aren't as powerful right now compared to the ICE counterparts. As of now the only thing the Rivian is good at is, quick acceleration and low hauling/ towing. My current truck can haul twice as much as a Rivian can and still have a greater distance. I want to see Rivian come out with a stronger utility version. A small example would be being able to operate/ run a plow on the front of the vehicle in the middle of winter.
I'm not sure about towing capacities because I have never actually had to tow anything. But from my understanding, most EVs have a ton of torque, albeit at the cost of range (I'm assuming) while towing or hauling. That said, if you aren't towing or hauling more than say once a month or maybe 2 or 3 times a month then do you really need an ICE truck? Especially for long distances.
@@ProXcaliber That's a valid point. I'm in Northern NY I haul horses during most of the year. My range is roughly 450 miles per tank hauling 4 horses, so about 10,000 in weight all together. In the winter months I'm usually plowing driveways for roughly 14 - 17 hours a day with the plowing weighing about 400 ish pounds on the front axle. Id love to see an HD version of the Rivian, main reason is that Diesel is expensive.
It's actually not the lack of power, Ev's have much more power than ICE vehicles. But the issue is to deliver that power range gets decreased and issue here is actually the time required for refueling of EV's. Once that gets sorted there would be no reason to use a ICE vehicle anymore.
@@legolas3241 I do get your point, as you're not knocking EV's.....you want one that will fit your use case. Unfortunately your use case is not the normal. Most F150s go their entire life having never towed anything and having nothing more than some plywood or bags of mulch in the bed. That's kind of the sad reality. I hope one day someone makes what you're looking for though.
The positives still outweigh the negatives IMO. Many people tend to keep their cars for at least 5 years, by which time an EV will have saved a ton on emissions. And let's not forget that it seems he didn't even factor in fuel transportation or processing all of which add up to make ICE cars even more pollutant.
Yes. 100% for building a way better train infrastructure and reducing our reliance on vehicles per person. You made a great point at the end with this comment though - people don't buy a 7K lbs vehicle to move 200#... They buy them to move their boat, ATV, camper, snow mobile, projects and whatever. When hauling loads, in colder climates (with up to 40% loss in the winter), and the other things that greatly impact electric efficiency - the math seems to suggest that gas power (or even better some kind of hybrid option) is way more efficient than electric.
I've been both intrigued and very skeptical about EV's and their batteries versus the tried and true ICE. This looks like a pretty objective, well researched comparison. I still wouldn't buy an electric vehicle right now (not like I could afford one anyway lol), but I'm curious to see how much better both they and the grid will be in say 10 years.
If you really care about the environment, drive less and take public transport as much as you can… Using a 2 ton vehicle to move a person is never efficient.
I tried that, but it was miserable in my town. I took the bus to the local community college a few towns over. Took over an hour and 10 minutes to go 7 miles. With my own car, I get there in less than 25 minutes most of the time. Biking when it is 110 F is not pleasant at all.
Nice high level analysis of EVs. As some others have pointed out, solar panels have their own manufacturing impact but so does the drilling, refining, and distribution of gasoline. Then there is differences in towing efficiency, which for EV trucks might reduce range by over 60% while an ICE truck will lose a far smaller percentage of range towing/carrying the same load. Nevertheless, I am hopeful for where EV production will take us, especially with so many improvements in battery technology each year.
Zack this is another great video!! This needs to go viral to show all the EV haters and naysayers the real truth about the environmental impacts of an EV.... although they won't believe it 🙄
You can't reason a person out of a mindset that they didn't reason themselves into. The only way some people will learn is with results and seeing everything going green and maybe even manufacturers going full EV sooner.
@@Aayush2614 Rivian currently has a warranty for 8 years or 175k miles. So let’s give it 10 years tops. Who gets rid of a truck at 10years? Especially one where the body and electric motor should last way longer. Do you think recycling batteries is easy? As well 80% capacity is useless when you consider it the base model only has 370km range to Beginn with. I think it’s a legitime question as I think electric cars can live much longer than traditional cars but I’d like to see a battery replacement factored in at this point. As battery technology gets better this point may be mute. I’m not trying to diss electric cars I like them myself. I’m just trying to get a realistic picture of what it would look like
@@Talkurran a phone with 1 year battery warranty goes for 4-5 years with 70-80% of its battery capacity. So why you expect 10 years battery life for highly sophisticated EVs. Your assumptions could be wrong here. Specially for those EVs which are made in 2022 with all those advancements in softwares within BMS. Further, a lot of recycled lithium’s would already be in use after 20 years or the industry could totally get away from the lithium for something else.( I expect 20 years of battery life for this specific truck and still retain 70% battery capacity). And also if we do change an entire battery after 10 years (very unlikely), it would be on par with fuel vehicle in terms of production pollution which is still beneficial because EVs are technically more convenient, faster, smarter and feature rich. I ride a dirt cheap Chinese electric scooter since 6 years with lithium ion battery and even that haven’t lost much range since then.
something to keep in mind if power usage efference is important to you is that charging your EV on a consist schedule can greatly help the grid , allowing computer that manages the source of power to have base load plant available when you plug in as apposed to the less efficient rapid response plants
This has got to be the most informative video on emissions between gas and electric. Ive never really understood where all the numbers come from and this was very informative
I would just like to say something about Huel. I actually decided to try it after watching this video. And from my experience, Huel has a pretty bad after taste and there is definitely better things out there. That being said I ordered the Chick'n & Mushroom Pasta, Mac & Cheeze, and the Cajun Pasta. Both the Mushroom Pasta and Mac & Cheese had that bad aftertaste, but the Cajun Pasta was pretty good. So if you want to try some make sure to try the Cajun Pasta. I also heard the Mexican Chili doesn’t have that aftertaste so you might want to try it. If I decide to order more I will definitely be getting the Chili and Cajun pasta. But for the price I am not sure I will be buying any more.
Thanks @jerryrigeverything for a really well researched and presented video. I love you presentation style and even your sponsor spots are fun... think I'll order some Huel!
Electric vehicles are too damn expensive for most to covert to. If the gvnmt subsidised or had its own industry providing these cars " at cost" there would be a hugh take up in e.v ownershipwhich in turn would be much better for the countries air quality and co2
The most important point Zack made is that not only are EVs less polluting after only about 3 years of use but that the process of construction and recycling is becoming rapidly more efficient so the circle will be squared over time. The 200K lifecycle of a conventional vehicle will also be much greater with less rotating and reciprocating components involved. The increased use of non corroding composite recycled materials will surely extend durability and ultimately reduce the need for a recycling process and associated emissions. It’s just the clean energy generation part that needs work at a governmental level!
Nice done, nice comparison....but in long turns, it will change the curve to the disadvantage of electricity. Because engine can easily run without replacing 500 km.Which cannot be said about battery pack, Which you must replace within 100,000 km or seven years,,Sometimes even much earlier...
Great info, just a small side note, 100% clean electricity doesn't actually exist. Solar and others still need you to build the power plant that will eventually need to be replaced. That doesn't raise the emissions of solar energy anywhere near that of fossil fuels, but still it's noteworthy that there are emissions related to that as well.
@@JerryRigEverything Absolutely! It was just a small detail that's good to remember in calculations. But like I said it doesn't really change the outcome and didn't mean it as critique, but more just as a nice to know fact. Love your videos! Can't wait to see the Humvee finished
Hoping for this kind of content: Durability test for Pen displays ex: Wacom, Huion and Ipad. I just wonder if I can travel with these expensive gadgets and to have peace of mind.
Great video. There are additional things we often forget. Pollution is not only CO2, gas cars have more liquids that require changing (often there are also leaks to ground, e.g. oils polluting ground or even making roads slippery especially dangerous for motorcycles). Also gas cars create more dust from breaks (polluting our lungs). And last thing, even if electric car would produce same amount of pollution/CO2 (because of polluting power grid) they do not produce this pollution where most humans live/work (e.g. in large city centers).
I really like the technology connection video regarding the breakdown of electricity used and cost per charge. Also how most people only need a 7kwh charger
Fossil fuels also have to be obtained from the earth, just like lithium. The energy savings obviously isn’t perfect, but it’s the first real generation of EVs. We need to continue innovating. Thanks for the amazing content!
thank you for bringing up a balanced discussion of a BEV. so tired of people acting like BEVs are the end all solution to vehicular pollution/environment impact problems.
Huge thanks to Huel for sponsoring this video! Quick, easy, and tastes great up the mountain!: jlinks.io/jerryrigeverythingsept22
Like i said on your apple video... the problem with aluminium is not getting it out the ground, it's refining it by elecetrolisis
So nice to see huel from breaking bad sponsoring the video!
What has happened to the eHummer project? Is it scrapped?
I’m sorry but you missed one more factor. The cost of moving gasoline across the country is also a factor as Electricity is way cheaper to transport
Jerry when will homemade electric car video come?
Zack's last point is the most important. If you want to really reduce emissions, use the right tool for each task. Pickup truck when you need to haul heavy loads, bike or e-bike when you're going less than a mile, walk when you're going less than half a mile. No sense using a 7,000 pound truck just to pick up a gallon of milk from the corner store.
But if you're at a specific Houston hotel and need to get to a luggage shop 800 metres away, you can't walk.
I wish there were more corner stores. Zoning has all but destroyed them in suburbia
Or look if you even need to reduce emissions and the fact is you don't.
I don't know about you but 5 miles is still comfortable by bike for me.
@@MrNamenloser21 especially in January and a foot of snow! 😁
One argument you don't hear much is the amount of effort it takes to get petrol to the pump. There's the intial extraction, delivery to refinery, refining process, delivery to central storage, from there to petrol station and finally into your car. All along this process a lot of electricity and diesel is being being burned before it even gets to your car. Then your car starts putting out Co2.
Very valid point and one I like to bring up as "double dirty double duty".
Transporting electricity isn't lossless either.
And how many childs have die to make those batteries...nobody wants to admit that too
@@Elusive_Chicken correct, but you don't pack up a truck load of electricity in the back of a a vehicle consuming electricity to deliver the electricity to a status n where vehicles charge. As the video states, the greenness of an ev also depends on where you live and how clean the grid is there. Nothing is going to be 100% clean even after the earth is on 100% renewables as the products used to produce electricity also currently depend on parts that can't always be recycled. Hauling fuel using vehicles that consume fuel to locations that store fuel for vehicles to then collect and burn the fuel is what (I believe) Paul's comment is referring to.
But, the extraction and processing for those are many times more costly and more toxic to the environment. And, unlike a combustion engines are 100% recyclable and uses less energy to reprocess. Batteries are harder to reprocess.
So good to see a video on EV tech where you actually think very deeply about the WHOLE process and not just the tail pipe.
As usual, well done sir. On the recycling front I’d call out American Manganese and Li-Cycle too. I’ve visited Li-Cycle’s hub plant in my hometown of Rochester, NY (in an old Kodak building). The amount they can already process is impressive and it’s scaling up fast.
I also love your videos last one about houses was awesome 🙏
If they do youtuber tours..... let's collab.
Yes please collab!
@@shamrocks120 glad you liked it!
@@JerryRigEverything I’m game!
I agree on the bullet trains comment! After riding a few bullet trains in Spain, they were so incredibly efficient & fun to ride in! I wish the U.S. had a better public mass transportation system like that .
honest appraisal without bias...rare indeed
Gracias
To me most people that don't want EVs always come up with the excuse of "It's going to cost $20k when you have to replace the battery pack". But I don't think they know how long the battery packs will last if taken basic care. I guess they feel like they're the same as any other battery that you replace every 3-4 years. Most likely if you drive your EV long enough that it literally disintegrates you're most likely to be left sitting on the battery pack that still works. I just feel it's very odd to argue like that
a lot of their arguments against EVs are based in ignorance of the technology or things they hear other ignorant people say (and believe them). That's why we should respectfully try to inform people that are open to it.
Thank you for acknowledging public transport and high speed railways like bullet trains. They are truly currently the most efficient of transportation.
Teslas in Tunnels things is just a glorified distraction from real public transport.
I honestly don't think that the Teslas in tunnels thing is ever going to really take off.
@@ProXcaliber it was to avoid bullet trains but now they aren’t gonna do either
Except there will always be a huge chunk of the population who do not like public transport, like me. I don't want to sit together with strangers in a box. I want to listen to music loudly with good 13-15-speaker system. I like to smoke in my car. All things public transport can never replace.
The only thing that would change it is if you introduce laws that prohibit all freedoms with your own car (like driving only on certain days).
@@misterxmistery7424 public transport is to get from point a to point b fast, not to smoke or listen to music
@@John-gi3es If I pay for it, then i like my amenities. Here in Finland train ride costs quite a lot more than paying for the gas for the same distance in your car. ETA is similar.
This video is exactly what we needed. Most people are talking about how dirty EVs are ( ie; pollution caused in battery manufacturing and in electricity production) as compared to ICE vehicles without doing much research. Glad You went through all the trouble of researching and finding the right information.
jerry's not being gentle with this one, cracked the windshield already!?
awesome video bro, lookin forward to the next one
glass is glass and glass can break 😂
@@mannixmd underrated comment ahah
oh yea you see the deeper grooves aye?
So fascinating. Great research. Bullet train please.
Especially for a country as populus as America, many major corridors can have bullet trains or even just normal overnight sleeper trains (who doesn't want to sleep at one city and wake up arrived at your destination?!?!)
More trains/public transport in general will kill off so much inter/intra city traffic too
Trains are the future. The only way to reduce traffic fatalities and car traffic is with viable alternatives to driving.
@@arthurgu3800 flying. Trains are as much the future as horses.
Aptera is better
There is something else that must be taken into consideration with ICE vehicles. It's rarely discussed but used crankcase oil is not recycled at 100%. Even with 98% of used motor being recycled over 200 million gallons of highly toxic used crankcase oil is improperly disposed of every year, and a significant chunk of this number comes from DIY oil changers who pour it down storm drains, into ponds lakes and streams or bury it in their back yards. It's a major source of MTBE in ground water. Used motor oil is loaded with toxic substances such as benzene, lead, zinc, and cadmium. Millions of extremely toxic used oil filters are simply discarded in the trash or landfills. This nonsense does not happen with EVs.
I would love to see updated numbers factoring in towing, ideally residential boat/RV towing. So far that has been my biggest hold up switching to an EV truck vs gas. Our average weekly towing range would be 30-40 miles, however we regularly tow 100-200 miles at a time.
take your normal range and at least cut it in half. Multiple tests have been done pulling light trailers and most rvs are 5-6k lbs anything smaller doesn't normally have a real bathroom or an ac unit. boats depend on the model. most people buying these would be using a 18-20ft boat and often fiberglass models with somewhat large motors. boats in the that class are typically 3500-4000lbs.
sure the ultra light 12ft aluminum skiff with a 9hp motor is gonna be significantly lighter but if you are going that small a kayak could easily take that small boats job and be transported by anything
Excellent and well researched video. Thank you for putting this out. It was a really fair, nuanced assessment of the ICE vs. Electric debate. Looking forward to your bullet train video! I would love a high speed rail system in the US.
RIP the boring company :(
I think he should have talked about diesel since that is more efficient that petrol by around 30%.
@@IV.olution diesel has other problems though and almost all regular american cars/truck are gasoline. Many diesel vehicles have been caught up in emmisions scadals, including my dads VW. EV's are still more efficient so there is just not much reason to spend time and money switching from gas to diesel for limited benefits.
Would love one too. A big component of increasing public transport will be reforming zoning to allow denser development that is also public transport/pedestrian/bike friendly. The twin cities 2040 plans and things like the Highland Bridge development on the site of the old ford plant in St. Paul are hopefully steps in that direction.
@@Blackburnian737 the only diesel emmission scandal was caused by vw.
I've often been skeptical of all the claims about how "green" electric cars actually are, and this puts everything into perspective. Great video as always!
Zack even forgot to mention the CO2 produced during extracting, transport, refining and distributing of fuel.
It's like a NFL all-star facing a 2 years old. And the difference will increase.
ICE is dead. Exxon CEO's know it. That's why they are investing in clean energy.
Ford CEO's know it. That'S why Ford is investing in RnD.
They all know it. Only average Joe petrol heads don't know it. Yet.
Thank you so much for mentioning that trains should be used more... but a much bigger impact is the lack of short range public transit. An inefficient old diesel bus is better than the cleanest EV because of how many more people it moves - even when it's only half utilized.
I absolutely agree about bullet trains. Public transportation isn't big enough here in the US as it should be, especially for longer distance travel. Being able to take the train in the Bay Area to travel between multiple cities is great. They are working on making all electric trains which I'm excited for but won't be out for a few years.
Both short/medium/long distance should just have trains, whether if it's bullet train or sleeper train or even just a decent 100-125mph train between major/minor population centres would help soooooo much.
Bullet trains won't take you up into the mountains like a Rivian. I'm hoping with self driving cars we will get more car sharing. You might not need to own a car or truck but maybe you can rent one cheaper if renting is the main marketplace.
@@JLars if combined with a cable cart you can get into the mountains with 2% emmision compared to an electric car.
Btw an electric bike that you can take on the train can get you up a mountain.
I forgot that the US still hasn't electrified their most of their rail network like the rest of the world...
Id like bullet trains if I could drive my truck onto one.
Very interesting video. According to your data, electric vehicles "cleaner" than I thought. It will be interesting to see the future of battery recycling. Great video 👍
Actually, he didn't even mention how the gasoline is produced and transported. Which means they are way greener than the video says. 👍
Read the Tesla impact report. May 2022.
Interesting.
(PDF on line)
@@donnerstal he also didn't talk about lithium mines go look up those and tell me its greener. Lol its not better just different
Thank you for making this video. I bet you have a wider audience than many who drive EVs.
Also, on the use of cobalt in batteries: one thing people often miss is that a very large majority of all cobalt produced today is used for refining oil, not for batteries.
If I remember it correctly Kurzgesagt showed a fact once that was that producing an entire electric vehicle emits as much as laying 2 meter road (I think 2+2 lane). So while we can electrify our vehicles as much as we want, we must also examine new ways of creating the infrastructure to use those vehicles.
Hey there Zack! Two months ago I started wondering about this question. I asked a lot of friends and smart people I know what they think about it. Most of them answered without really considering anything witch i didn't really like.
I really love when some well know facts are explored and actually proven with real data.
It really made me happy to see all the statistics.
What I am trying to say is: Thank you for making this video!
Thank you for sharing all this ways to make the world a better place with all your videos!
Edit: P.S. I really agree about the bullet trains idea.
Volvo has done a detailed study about this topic. You might want to take a look at that one also.
I so badly want to show this video to a client of mine that’s completely against EV’s for the emissions debate. I know it’s above her intellect though so I’d be wasting my time, trying to argue with a brick wall basically. I love my tesla 100%.
If you want to get even deeper into the geeky #'s - Check out engineering explained video on the same topic! He goes through the math and explains it all step by step.
Engineering Explained channel also has a well researched video if you're interested. Search "Are Electric Cars Worse For The Environment? Myth Busted"
@@abdullahunal1108 Engineering Explained is how I knew the conclusion of this video before I even clicked on it. Still though, always appreciate another well researched video on the topic to point at.
As a fellow Zack. I enjoy this channel.
Wow, did you read my mind? I've been meaning to write to you and ask if you could educate everyone about how green EVs are compared to ICE vehicles. Thanks for the video Zach
I've been seeing this debate going on for a while now and it was really annoying to not have too many simple videos to point people to that explained it well enough to understand for everyone.
Great video Zack! As always, thanks for including links to sources and for not sugar coating or biasing towards the facts that EVs aren’t *quite* as green as we sometimes hear from manufacturers/media.
I agree! I'm especially thankful for his honesty and the in-depth explanation because it helps people in the market for a new vehicle make a better decision on their own instead of just saying bUy tHis riGhT nOw bEcAuSe eLeCtRic.
So thank you, Zack! It's very refreshing to watch.
Although there are a few factors not considered in the video which would add up to the "cleanness" difference between gas and electric. Zack talked about the production of energy, but didn't consider that gasoline also has to be produced and transported to each gas station. That adds a huge amount of emissions to gas powered cars again making EVs a lot "cleaner"
Another thing is that even if the difference would be 30% in favor of EVs, which may sound like not much imagine that after all cars change to electric and we improve the cleanness of power production that'll be over 30% less of all vechicle emissions, which make up 40% of global CO2 emissions. That's over 2 billion metric tons of CO2 less per year.
@@malcewicz oh 100 percent agree, but maybe that’s more content for another video! I would for sure be interested in the breakdown of the emissions costs of: gas generation/transportation, battery materials mining/refinement/transportation, etc.
He's driving a electric truck lol he's definitely biased towards electric vehicle
@@malcewicz good observation! I agree with Chris; this would be great to see in a future video.
I think it would also be super interesting to see the process of recycling the batteries.
Great video as always. The other thing to consider is how oil (actually bitumen which is like natural asphalt) is literally strip-mined with bulldozers when being retrieved from tar sands such as in Alberta in the Athabasca formation on land that used to be boreal forests. It then must be super heated to release the petroleum and treated before it is sent down keystone. The carbon footprint of just retrieving that oil is tremendous. So why do we always talk about mining for batteries but not strip mining for oil?
We always talk about strip mining for batteries because (generally) people have been acting like EVs are totally carbon neutral OR immensely more neutral than ICEVs when the actual case has been arguably the opposite and potentially much more ecological damage in a much shorter amount of time (100 years of gas/diesel vs the last 10-20 of EV progression).
And because everyone has been talking about the downsides of oil plenty already, no one (until recently) really spoke about downsides of EVs.
I appreciate that you ask these questions and make content about it.
Zack is so chill and reasonable, i love it. he's the MKBHD of mechanical stuff
@@brandonchutt312 well you can apply not so heavy on every single word here, besides Zach have almost 8 million subscribers
Why can't it be " MKBHD is Zack of Tech stuff " more accurate lol
@@brandonchutt312when did MKBHD become a Apple fanboy?
Who the hell is MKBHD?
Nice video, i’m glad you mentioned the current metrics from Tesla as they truly give a prospective of true emissions once we pass the point of EVs made with 100% recycled ore
I don't agree with not including the CO2 release from the mining, refinement and delivery of gasoline/diesel. If you don't include it you might as well not include emissions coming in from production of electricity. The processes mentioned above all emitt large amounts of CO2.
Their point still stands though, even without factoring that in, it's still better. You can basically dismantle the opposition to EV's arguments with just the "best case" scenario for the ICE vehicle. It would have been nice to know the data anyway but thats a whole lot more research and variables that would just give people ammunition to miss the point entirely and nitpick whatever stats were used and dismiss the entire video.
I am with you there. If you account for the energy production for the EV then you need to do the same for the ICE.
I am not sure why it was not included in the video but I still have to give him credit because he said "let's give the ICE car the best fighting chance" or something to that sense. And considering that even with basically the best possible case where fuel wasn't even considered in that mind, the ICE car still fell behind an EV.
Damn right that should've been included. It's total bs imo the mpge standard accounts for energy losses from the source to the battery.
But gas mpg standards require no such calculation. That right there tells anyone with a brain a bunch about "standards"
Not to mention stuff like oil change emissions and impact. Air filter manufacturing, spark plug manufacturing, catalytic converters use platinum metals groups and we manufacturer plus replace hundreds of millions of those world wide each year.
All the belts n hoses on combustion vehicle's that evs don't have or need to be maintained or replaced. All the fluids not required by evs vs ICE.
They don't include those in videos like this one, because it would paint a crystal clear picture of how insanely better overall for the environment and being sustainable evs truly are.
I ran a repair shop as a manager when I was younger and we did everything we could to reduce our impact.
All oil was sent to a state recycling facility(fun fact less than 60% of oil is even recycled here in the U.S. and it takes over a gallon of used oil on average to get back 2.5 quarts of re sellable product. Product that took energy to transport, energy to re refine, energy to re package&transport again etc.
We recycled all the oil filters to. We drip dried them on special racks and sent them in to another facility to get recycled. Here in the U.S. alone it's estimated we do 424,000,000+oil changes each year. With over 27,000 small businesses that exist just to change oil. And produced over 160,000 TONS of wasted steel just from the oil filters each year.
We also sorted all metals we could into various bins to get picked up by a salvage scrap company under contract. We sorted all our cardboard, we recycled&resold all the tires we pulled off the cars to.
Despite everything we did? The impact of servicing about 250 combustion engine cars a week was staggering. And as we have over 275,000,000 personal use ice vehicle's otr here in just the U.S. You can imagine the true impact of servicing them. 😐
It wasn't included because it doesn't change the numbers. Getting the gas to a station isn't huge compared to the refinement and mining for gas. Both electric and ICEs need fossil fuels to go (with exceptions) so those numbers would be very similar. The outcome would still be electric vehicules are better in the long run they just may need a little less time to pass up ICEs. No point in adding something minor that doesn't change the outcome.
Zack, I really want to thank you for this video. Since the birth of EVs, there was always this daoubt in my head. How green are green technologies applied to vehicles. Since the mining, transporting, manufacturing, recharging and pollution from batteries heavy metals and acid? and whatnot. BTW, that series of videos of your electric humvee is top notch! I just loved them. I know it required too much work, resources and probably sleepless nights, but you came through all obstacles. Cheers from Mexico.
Interesting video! Thank you! Want to mention that after melting the metal, you won't have the same amount of metal because it burns a bit of it while melting, so there won't be a real endless circle of recycling.
Thank you for sharing this much needed info. Both sides argue that their cars are much greener and better for the environment, and you have made everything crystal clear with all the data and calculation. Truly a one of a kind UA-camr! 👍🏾
You’re not black. Why do you keep using the dark toned thumbs up?
@@Satsu1NoHado Why not?
@@Satsu1NoHado Most of the people in the world have brown skin, some darker and some lighter. We shouldn't still be calling anyone black/negro or white either. That came from the colonists and there are underlying meanings to these labels that have nothing to do with the variety of different peoples falsely identified by them.
An important factor to remember with this conversation is the long-term goal of electric vehicles. Yes, there are carbon emissions from producing and driving them, and that's not changing anytime soon. However, this is the first step in creating a greener transportation system overall. While electric vehicles are currently reliant on fossil fuels, they will accept any electricity they are fed. Gas powered vehicles only accept fossil fuels in order to run. By beginning the transition to electric vehicles, we are consolidating greenhouse gas emissions into centralized locations, which down the line will be much easier to transition to renewable energy than the millions of "power plants" currently on the road.
With the way green technology has become a selling point, it is important to question proposed new technologies to fight climate change, but it is also important to consider the context of the conversation, and whether the narrative around a technology is being influenced by parties with an interest in suppressing that tech. If electric car adoption takes off, the fossil fuel industry stands to lose a lot of money in gasoline sales due to the increased efficiency of EV charging. This is an industry with a history of targeted marketing campaigns to change public perception around climate issues to their favor.
In the past few months, I have noticed a lot more people talking about the environmental cost of lithium mining and battery production, especially in response to people talking about the environmental benefits of using an EV. This is an easy argument to disprove (as seen in this video), but people who have no pre-existing interest in EVs may not be exposed to it. This sows doubt in whether electric vehicles are better for the environment (they are), and might cause someone on the fence about what new car to buy to lean away from an EV.
This is clearly not evidence of propaganda from the fossil fuel industry, but a reminder that ExxonMobil alone has spent hundreds of millions of dollars funding disinformation campaigns. The climate cost of EVs is a conversation that needs to be had, but be sure to remember that there are people with a profit motive to convince you that climate action is not in your best interest.
Love all your videos. The factual content the research and the presentation make it worth the watching.
Thanks for the video and a pretty interesting data that you researched.
I think there is a couple more things to consider here.
First one is you go on the EPA's website and look at the percentage of "dirty" energy produced and then include it in your calcs; however, the plants which produce the clean energy are already working on nearly max capacity, and every additional electric vehicle which gets added to the grid would need to consume energy mainly from the "dirty" sources. There are still going to be times when you probably can get some of it out from clean sources, like charging a vehicle at night when energy consumption is relatively low, and Hydro + Wind + Nuclear can produce the needed power (they're estimated at 59.2 in Utah, but probably much lower in some less green states). Unfortunately there is no data which shows the energy source at a certain time of the day.
Second one is you focus only on CO2 only; however, there is a lot of harmful toxic elements produced to mine the materials for the battery and produce it.
He kinda did talk about those others, but only focusing on the reciclyng part, wich would be fine if they were a big enough % of cars on the street (they aren't) so I consider this point still unanswered
Clean energy production is not maxed out. Nuclear and Hydro maybe, but wind and solar are typically producing more power than can be used which then gets wasted. And more batteries help with that a lot. And for charging at night, most power generation is only at 20-25% of the total capacity for the grid. Obviously solar is directly being used at night, but it is through battery storage. But wind, nuclear, and hydro are all still running at night and playing a larger part of the total grid needs.
The main true dirty power is coal. That is getting reduced every year, at least in the US. Natural gas isn't great, but it is still far cleaner than gasoline/diesel burning engines. Plus cleaner power generation is growing every year. More batteries, more wind, and more solar.
For the focus on CO2, that is more easily understood. But batteries are also undeniably better than burning oil in nearly all other cases. Burning oil causes acid rain, puts a massive amount of crap in the air, and is literally fatal if there is too much in the air. It's also tied to cancer, brain damage, and numerous illnesses. Mining for battery materials isn't perfect, but it is a massive amount better. Seriously think about it. A mine runs for a single day and produces enough material for tens of thousands of batteries that will each last multiple decades and can then be recycled.
Zack did a great job with this video, you can see a lot of research was done. Its enjoyable. I do think this subject merits more videos with more in-depth information. Miss-information and ignorance is what petrol economies rely on to thrive.
It's unfortunate that we live in a time with so much easy access to valid and accurate information and simultaneously so much misinformation and ignorance on different subjects.
As always, great video. I own both an EV and ICE vehicle (Chevy Bolt, F150 SuperCrew). I know quite a few other EV owners out there and I don’t know any of them that bought an EV with the primary reason of saving the environment. But if you talk to someone who hates EVs (and there are a lot out there) they suddenly have become huge environmentalists because “EVs are worse for the environment”. Having a data driven argument showing they aren’t as environmentally friendly as one would think, but still better than an ICE vehicle in the long run, is refreshing.
I love how you mentioned that the ultimate efficiency solution would be trains!!!
This is a top notch video, nice to see not shilling for gas or electric just telling it how it is from the vehicle's production to end of life. Keep it up Zack!
Really nice video, I didn't heared it in the video but one point to be mentioned is that even if the powergrid used for charing isn't very low CO2 right now, most of the country are shifting their electricity production quite rapidly and the EV that you buy today will become "greener" without doing anything from your side.
Thats really interesting, I believed that even rechargable batteries are hard to recycle, and not worth doing. I'm glad I got this new perspective.
They are though???
Ev batteries are so expensive to recycle it's not really done. They aren't really recyclable at all. Just check Teslas number (sketchy as they are) the point to how hard and unrecyclable these batteries are. You get like nothing back from them at all.
@@OutOfNameIdeas2 It's all about cost, not because they can't do it. Even plastic, a well known item that could be recycled are often in the trash. Simply, it costs more to recycle than to make new from scratch. Until it's more profitable to recycle than to make from scratch, it's not going to happen. It's just business. At some point when it's so expensive to mine for minerals to make new batteries, then perhaps it will become profitable to recycles.
Thanks for making this video, Zach. I know that electric vehicles start off in more “environmental debt.” However, I still can’t wait to get my Rivian. It’s videos like this one that really help bring some clarity to a conversation that is often not done very well.
Start the comparison at.
1) Oil in the ground.
2) Electricity needs generation
.
The generate the electricity.
.
Then consider the use of *the same electricity* mix to either refine the oil, of go straight to the EV.
THAT'S where they're nett zero.
*Now* move the vehicles (burn the fuel!)
Now throw a hybrid truck into the mix which I believe is a more responsible transition to full ev’s while we tackle infrastructure issues
You have cleared many questions about electric vehicles. Great video as always 👍
Basically it's far better to have ONE dirty power station charging millions of cars than MILLIONS of little powers stations pretending to be cars
Nailed it.
Gas powered engines are slowly getting betting and getting more fuel efficient. Soon it'll be more environmentally friendly than a Solar powered RV.
@@inisipisTV if fuels are gone the efficiency doesn't matter bro we know sun is here till life exists or think that
But that still doesn't account for how dirty the batteries themselves are. The acid rain produced in areas that have to mine for the rare earth minerals needed. The horrible labor practices in areas that dig for these materials. What happens to the battery when its done in only 10 or so years? Not only that. But now we must rely more on China for these materials.
EVs are worse for the environment when you account for the batteries
@@inisipisTV you... you really don't know what you're talking about. Almost by definition, ICE cars are less eco-friendly than EVs, and the only way that could possibly change is with synthetic fuels
You are without a doubt, a thorough reviewer. People gush over their EVs without doing actual research.
Great video. Love the deeper thought into it. Entertaining, thought inspiring, with a soothing voice. You never disappoint with your content.
I'm glad you mentioned that getting energy from the grid is far more efficient than getting the same amount of energy out of an ICE and thus less dirty, because people rarely consider that.
I think he put it best when he said that ICE cars are basically "mini powerplant" producing their own emissions.
Which is a total lie. Or just uneducated per say.
A dirty grid would mean you need to drive about a million KM to be equivalent to a regular suv. (Comparing long range Tesla's)
*By Dirty grid i mean the average European grid
@@OutOfNameIdeas2 Please clarify what you mean, I do not understand most of what you are trying to say.
@@Voltaic_Fire Don't feed the troll, just ignore it.
@@Voltaic_Fire
The troll doest account for the same "dirty grid" being used to refine the "dirty oil" which is then burned as "dirty fuel".
They never do.
Amazingly clear video. One point though, is that as long as your grid is not over 100% green, every additional EV powered from the grid will have 100% "dirty" electricity, not the current mix of dirty and green of the grid. We need to think in terms of marginal effects: the green portion of the grid has low elasticity (the total amount produced will not adapt to demand), while the the "dirty" has full elasticity (it will adapt to every change in demand). Since only the "dirty" portion adapts, the new EV on the grid creating this extra demand will be powered by 100% dirty energy.
That being said, if the new EV purchase is accompanied by an additional 100% green electricity production capable of running it, such as your home solar panels, then the EV can be considered to be effectively powered by 100% green energy, even if you actually charge it from a partially "dirty" grid. This is true, too, even if the extra electricity is produced elsewhere on the grid, such as in a new big green power plant, where economies of scales can also kick in.
I’ve heard a lot of people discuss this topic but I feel like I trust your take the most. EVs are currently cleaner over the course of the life of the vehicle and it’ll only get better!!
Till we run outta lithium
When the nukes are falling will it really matter how green your car is?
@@user-rg8mc4el8w
We already have battery tech in the works that does not use lithium. So your argument is flawed. As battery continues to advance EV's will continue to get greener and greener than ICE vehicles can ever hope to be.
Great video. My main problem switching to an EV is the range and towing. If I plan to take a roadtrip I want to get between 400-500 miles per charge, not 200-250. Towing is another thing all together
We just kept our gas vehicle around for stuff like that. Bought an old, used, Leaf but kept the old gal as a vintage deal for roadtrips or loaning out. I understand people are crunched for space and might not be able to insure two vehicles or whatever though. :)
Yeah, range anxiety is really still a big deal for a lot of people it seems. I've personally seen a lot of YT videos where people do road trips with them all the time and it only adds a few minutes or an extra hour or two in travel time for charging. Those videos sealed the deal for me and I'm actually already looking to get my second EV in another year or two. But I agree, I can't wait for new battery tech to come out where the range is possibly doubled and charging times are decreased significantly.
@@ProXcaliber we actually get pretty frustrated with the gas car now coming home from airport or wherever having to stop and spend $$ on gas instead of just rolling into the garage and going to bed. Looking at some not-too-accurate F to E gauge like "can we make it home, do we need to stop and get gas," haha range anxiety reborn
Same boat. Really hoping to see some big battery breakthroughs in the next few years(solid state?). Faster charging and more storage, as well as reducing the effects of a too hot/cold environment on a battery. For towing I think 600 miles without load(which for me would get me about 300 miles while towing) would suffice for me, I think those with larger trailers, more is going to be necessary. Still excited about the prospect of electric vehicles, and the fact that I could add solar and storage to my house and forgo needing the grid altogether is also really appealing. We are aiming to do an electric for more day to day and then keeping our truck for pulling the camper and hauling stuff.
Thanks for the shoutout for Bullet Trains. Great video as always. Being from the UK I paused at “25 mpg is really good”, then I remembered the US Gallon is about 25% less than the imperial gallon
Did I miss something or was there no discussion about the energy required for extraction of oil and manufacturing it into gas? That is a very high energy process which would balance out or surpass the production of electricity.
Everyone seems to forget this.
How about the energy required to mine coal and natural gas that runs the power plants? Or the carbon impact of building “clean” energy sources such as solar, wind, or hydro
@@HoHoPlays fair enough but I would argue building out the refining process and everything else around it cancels out. That is why I would suggest that including the generation of electricity from the overall estimate as it’s disingenuous to overall break even point in favour of ICE vehicles.
@@HoHoPlays That's nothing in comparison since oil refining and extraction requires huge amount of energy aswell.
@@dimimtb I would completely agree was just making the point that you can't put one in and not the other.
Loved this video. It is seriously getting me to consider getting an EV. Thanks Jerry. Very informative and fascinating.
Also take into consideration that companies that mine lithium and everything you need for batteries are one of the worst of their kind.
I want a Zero DS motorcycle. I wish I could afford even a used one. If people weren't happy with their electric vehicles, they would be available cheap used.
Do some fact checking. This video was somewhat untruthful when it came to the real impact of mining lithium.
@@OutOfNameIdeas2 I love it when petroleum trolls post pictures of copper mines, and say they're Lithium mines. No, Lithium mining isn't destructive, and Lithium is recyclable.
@@riparianlife97701 You might want to watch Louis Rossmann's videos about Zero Motorcycle. If you're the kind of person who likes owning and repairing your vehicles, Zero Motorcycle is not for you.
I love the Mass Transit plug at the end, it really is what we SHOULD be thinking about. Any company or person concerned with the environment should be putting all their resources and money to advancing mass transit in America. America is so ridiculously behind the vast majority of the rest of the world (that aren't deep in Oil money) that it would take decades to get our infrastructure caught up and thats only if rural areas ever get out of the way (they wont)
2:55 I will bet you, straight up, that there will be an edit of this video circulating conservative facebook pages that ends right here.
Lots of good information man. I love that you're willing to talk about this when many people just assume that EVs are the perfect answer. And let's get some great trains in this country.
Best well rounded non biased breakdown I have seen in a long time. Well done.
This is my favorite misconception to shut down instantly. All it takes is some thought and data, and it leaves deniers speechless. Such a good video, will be referencing all the time when telling people about our cars!
Ikr people are such haters coz they don't have 100k to throw just to be "green" imagine being poor what's this 2008?
@@Petar120 evs are only expensive because its new lmao. Also new cars are also mot cheap either. A fully loaded ice truck is also around 80-100k
Great job Jerry 👍
But I sense something missing on your video that would be amazing to know.
How about compare buying a new electric truck vs maintaining your old car? Which would be the most carbon efficient way to go?
Even though, loved your video. 👍👌
2 Factors that remained untouched in this well researched video:
1. Carbon emission for mining and distillation of 1 gallon of gasoline.
2. Average life of EV is considerable more than IC Engine vehicle because EVs have much less moving parts.
So, if we factor in all these, the breakeven point for EVs may arrive way before 2 years.
THIS! He mentioned emissions for producing and transporting gas to the pump, but then didn't factor that in at all. And yet he did factor in the carbon footprint of providing electricity to EV chargers. That's a rather unfair comparison, and yet EVs still easily win.
This is one of the videos where you can't appreciate Zack enough for the information he provides.
Would've been cool if you also included the math for the f150 lighting in the video. Like a 3 way comparison
Love Videos like this!!! Watching the newest model hummer in that area makes me feel so great!!! So relaxing!!
There are a ton of 2011-2013 Nissan Leafs here in NZ that all have between 60k-130k kilometres on the clock and most are only getting a scrape over half of their original distance on one charge, that seems like a pretty bad case for the environment. Not sure about the newer models though
The problem with Nissan's cars are that they aren't talking very good care of their batteries. Nissan lacks active cooling in their packs and batteries don't really like getting hot.
Something I just wondered: why only look at co2 emissions? Are there any other bad substances that are beeing released during the production of petrol / batteries?
Lots. And lots more when refining oil. But C02 is the main player when taking about climate change which is the most urgent issue at the moment.
@@JerryRigEverything - it’s more urgent at the moment because the 1% are heavily invested.
@@JerryRigEverything But Co2 is still needed for plants and trees to make O2 but nobody talks about that so let's fight this scary CO2
True there are also the heavy metals that is being dumped in the nature
@@انا_ابراهيم_البناوي 🤦🏼♂️
Great content as always! The question that never seems to be addressed though, it the impact on the earths crust. The leaching, toxic chemicals, depletion of are earth metals, holes in the ground, etc.
From drilling oil? I know. It should definitly be addressed.
As someone that lives in Europe, our city planning is not as car centric and cities are often easy to walk and cycle. Even so there's currently a shift to make our cities even more pedestrian and bicycle friendly, with model cities being Amsterdam and Copenhagen. Trains are also an important part of that development.
Cycling through a park and seeing people out and about to get where I need to be, is a lot more appealing than highways, traffic jams and pollution.
Highways traffic Jams and pollution are way better than having to walk into a city where the majority of its people are just looking to rob and stab their next target.
Not everything in life comes from your own specific point of view and a lot of countties in Europe need to realise that. My own included. They want happy families to walk all around town but refuse to do anything about the junkies who'll literally attempt to kidnap your kid so they can afford a bag of heroin.
@@kavalogue More realistic issue is junkies stealing bikes or bike parts and selling them for easy low risk money. I would love good electric bike but hesitant to leave it anywhere public.
A couple things you may have forgotten to take into account. First, EVS are a significantly heavier and therefore go through tires more frequently (Some of this can be negated by buying special tires for EVS but not completely) then you also have to take into account increased damage to the road system because of that weight. Mining for battery components such as lithium and Cobalt often take place and third world countries employing child labor, paying very little, exposing the surrounding country to toxic runoff, and exposing the miners to toxic substances such as Cobalt dust which causes types of lung diseas. Add to that states like California who are blocking the sale of gasoline cars in just a few years while at the same time asking people not to charge their electric cars because of their failing power grid. I think people need to be more educated about some things before making their decision. As opposed to just saying it's green and blocking the sale of gasoline cars.
Just my thoughts. 🤷♂️
By that same token, you need to consider that gasoline for ICEs needs to be transported to each gas station by trucks that themselves burn gas and are manufactured for that only purpose in the first place. Need to consider also oil refining to produce gas, which is incredibly polluting as well. Then tankers that bring the extracted oil to shore and to refineries, and they consume an outrageous amount of fuel. End of the day, EVs are still cleaner even if they are charged from a fossil-based grid, especially a natural gas-based grid as you eliminate the refining and transportation step.
@@edoardoruggeri1 that's true to an extent and I'm not saying there's no advantage either them. I was just pointing out a couple of things he forgot to mention. And also my opinion that EVS should not be mandatory anywhere.
@@alexk7977 You can look at the micro scale of anything. Considering the statistics of electric VS ICE there billions more tyres being used by ICE cars. There’s also the gas being transported across the country in tankers to each gas station. Then you factor in how many old cars are on the road with many times worse gas mileage and emissions than the F150 in the video. Then Modified cars like coal rollers, ricers, muscle cars, etc. No matter which way you look it, electric cars are objectively better for the environment over time. The issue I see is that they just not viable in a lot of places. Here in Australia it wouldn’t be possible out in the outback and the bush. Sometimes a gas station is hundreds of kilometres away. You can’t drive a few hundred kilometres and then wait an hour to charge up. Electric infrastructure needs to be 100x more developed than it currently is for it to work here.
throw in towing too, evs generally lose about half of their battery range while towing even light loads, and twice the charging for the same distance can up the emissions as well. plus time is money and waiting an hour to charge up when youre in a hurry wouldnt be cool. i think they should stick to smaller cars and definitely not mandate anything. maybe the best of both worlds is the answer, some ppl drive evs, some drive ice and some use hybrids, oil will last longer since the ice drivers have thinned out and we might have more time to build up the power grid, try to make evs with better energy density in the batteries, or even make hydrogen happen, all while not forcing anything on anyone.
@@alexk7977 I think the reason he didn't mention that is because it's not really in the scope of this video.
Also lithium isn't mined in any 3rd world country, most come from Australia and Chile.
While Cobalt mainly comes from the corrupt DPR Congo the vast majority is not mined by children, since they aren't very effective. Today 98% of that cobalt is consumed in refining oil.
And also don’t forget that the grid can (and in a lot of places does) get greener every year, making your ev greener (if you charge from the grid). This is a big factor often discounted. You can’t really make an ice car greener afterwards without having to alter the car itself. With Evs owners don’t necessarily have to do anything (but solar is of course awesome).
The thing at the moment with recycling EV batteries, is it is not an easy process. It is not a cheap process. It is not an energy efficient process. And it certainly is not a clean process. Hopefully that will improve over time.
Keep these videos coming!
Love the content💯❤️
Love your videos, thank you.
One of the biggest concerns that I have with EVs (EV Trucks) is that they aren't as powerful right now compared to the ICE counterparts. As of now the only thing the Rivian is good at is, quick acceleration and low hauling/ towing. My current truck can haul twice as much as a Rivian can and still have a greater distance. I want to see Rivian come out with a stronger utility version. A small example would be being able to operate/ run a plow on the front of the vehicle in the middle of winter.
I'm not sure about towing capacities because I have never actually had to tow anything. But from my understanding, most EVs have a ton of torque, albeit at the cost of range (I'm assuming) while towing or hauling. That said, if you aren't towing or hauling more than say once a month or maybe 2 or 3 times a month then do you really need an ICE truck? Especially for long distances.
@@ProXcaliber That's a valid point. I'm in Northern NY I haul horses during most of the year. My range is roughly 450 miles per tank hauling 4 horses, so about 10,000 in weight all together. In the winter months I'm usually plowing driveways for roughly 14 - 17 hours a day with the plowing weighing about 400 ish pounds on the front axle. Id love to see an HD version of the Rivian, main reason is that Diesel is expensive.
It's actually not the lack of power, Ev's have much more power than ICE vehicles. But the issue is to deliver that power range gets decreased and issue here is actually the time required for refueling of EV's. Once that gets sorted there would be no reason to use a ICE vehicle anymore.
@@legolas3241 I do get your point, as you're not knocking EV's.....you want one that will fit your use case. Unfortunately your use case is not the normal. Most F150s go their entire life having never towed anything and having nothing more than some plywood or bags of mulch in the bed. That's kind of the sad reality. I hope one day someone makes what you're looking for though.
@@ian3580 I would love to have a solid HD EV Truck. Lol 😂 just gotta wait another 25 years lol
one of the first guys actually looking at the whole life cycle of a EV and the downsides it can have, thank you!!
The positives still outweigh the negatives IMO. Many people tend to keep their cars for at least 5 years, by which time an EV will have saved a ton on emissions. And let's not forget that it seems he didn't even factor in fuel transportation or processing all of which add up to make ICE cars even more pollutant.
@@ProXcaliber 100% they outweigh, however, its a little closer when comparing EV with hybrid normally hybrid trumps
Yes. 100% for building a way better train infrastructure and reducing our reliance on vehicles per person. You made a great point at the end with this comment though - people don't buy a 7K lbs vehicle to move 200#... They buy them to move their boat, ATV, camper, snow mobile, projects and whatever. When hauling loads, in colder climates (with up to 40% loss in the winter), and the other things that greatly impact electric efficiency - the math seems to suggest that gas power (or even better some kind of hybrid option) is way more efficient than electric.
I've been both intrigued and very skeptical about EV's and their batteries versus the tried and true ICE. This looks like a pretty objective, well researched comparison. I still wouldn't buy an electric vehicle right now (not like I could afford one anyway lol), but I'm curious to see how much better both they and the grid will be in say 10 years.
If you really care about the environment, drive less and take public transport as much as you can… Using a 2 ton vehicle to move a person is never efficient.
I tried that, but it was miserable in my town. I took the bus to the local community college a few towns over. Took over an hour and 10 minutes to go 7 miles. With my own car, I get there in less than 25 minutes most of the time. Biking when it is 110 F is not pleasant at all.
@@JJFlores197 oh man 110 F biking while listening to master of puppets while also smoking a joint and drinking beer, truly metal exercise HAHAHAH!
👑 thank you
the narration and video synchronization are in "the zone".
Nice high level analysis of EVs. As some others have pointed out, solar panels have their own manufacturing impact but so does the drilling, refining, and distribution of gasoline. Then there is differences in towing efficiency, which for EV trucks might reduce range by over 60% while an ICE truck will lose a far smaller percentage of range towing/carrying the same load. Nevertheless, I am hopeful for where EV production will take us, especially with so many improvements in battery technology each year.
ICE trucks loose s similar amount of efficiency while towing, but you don't feel it because you can fill up quickly and more often.
What ever happened to the hummer EV
Thanks for taking the time and making a video about this in your style!
Zack this is another great video!! This needs to go viral to show all the EV haters and naysayers the real truth about the environmental impacts of an EV.... although they won't believe it 🙄
You can't reason a person out of a mindset that they didn't reason themselves into. The only way some people will learn is with results and seeing everything going green and maybe even manufacturers going full EV sooner.
I would like to see you factor in that on average you have to replace your battery pack after 10 years. That would be huge hit to your calculations.
hmm, but why would you want to replace a perfectly working battery in 10 years? see 10:20 on the video..
Because that is propaganda and is not representative to the real world at all?
@@Aayush2614 Rivian currently has a warranty for 8 years or 175k miles. So let’s give it 10 years tops. Who gets rid of a truck at 10years? Especially one where the body and electric motor should last way longer. Do you think recycling batteries is easy? As well 80% capacity is useless when you consider it the base model only has 370km range to Beginn with. I think it’s a legitime question as I think electric cars can live much longer than traditional cars but I’d like to see a battery replacement factored in at this point. As battery technology gets better this point may be mute. I’m not trying to diss electric cars I like them myself. I’m just trying to get a realistic picture of what it would look like
@@Talkurran a phone with 1 year battery warranty goes for 4-5 years with 70-80% of its battery capacity. So why you expect 10 years battery life for highly sophisticated EVs. Your assumptions could be wrong here. Specially for those EVs which are made in 2022 with all those advancements in softwares within BMS. Further, a lot of recycled lithium’s would already be in use after 20 years or the industry could totally get away from the lithium for something else.( I expect 20 years of battery life for this specific truck and still retain 70% battery capacity). And also if we do change an entire battery after 10 years (very unlikely), it would be on par with fuel vehicle in terms of production pollution which is still beneficial because EVs are technically more convenient, faster, smarter and feature rich. I ride a dirt cheap Chinese electric scooter since 6 years with lithium ion battery and even that haven’t lost much range since then.
Thanks for providing an overview (and comparison) of the energy cost for its entire life cycle. Good to know!
firs from pakistan
💀
Same
something to keep in mind if power usage efference is important to you is that charging your EV on a consist schedule can greatly help the grid , allowing computer that manages the source of power to have base load plant available when you plug in as apposed to the less efficient rapid response plants
And charging at night or when the grid is under less load.
This has got to be the most informative video on emissions between gas and electric.
Ive never really understood where all the numbers come from and this was very informative
I would just like to say something about Huel. I actually decided to try it after watching this video. And from my experience, Huel has a pretty bad after taste and there is definitely better things out there.
That being said I ordered the Chick'n & Mushroom Pasta, Mac & Cheeze, and the Cajun Pasta. Both the Mushroom Pasta and Mac & Cheese had that bad aftertaste, but the Cajun Pasta was pretty good. So if you want to try some make sure to try the Cajun Pasta. I also heard the Mexican Chili doesn’t have that aftertaste so you might want to try it. If I decide to order more I will definitely be getting the Chili and Cajun pasta. But for the price I am not sure I will be buying any more.
Thanks @jerryrigeverything for a really well researched and presented video. I love you presentation style and even your sponsor spots are fun... think I'll order some Huel!
I'm glad you bought up the point about using a heavy vehicle to transport a light body. The car although most convenient has a huge energy debt.
Electric vehicles are too damn expensive for most to covert to. If the gvnmt subsidised or had its own industry providing these cars " at cost" there would be a hugh take up in e.v ownershipwhich in turn would be much better for the countries air quality and co2
The most important point Zack made is that not only are EVs less polluting after only about 3 years of use but that the process of construction and recycling is becoming rapidly more efficient so the circle will be squared over time. The 200K lifecycle of a conventional vehicle will also be much greater with less rotating and reciprocating components involved. The increased use of non corroding composite recycled materials will surely extend durability and ultimately reduce the need for a recycling process and associated emissions. It’s just the clean energy generation part that needs work at a governmental level!
Nice done, nice comparison....but in long turns, it will change the curve to the disadvantage of electricity. Because engine can easily run without replacing 500 km.Which cannot be said about battery pack, Which you must replace within 100,000 km or seven years,,Sometimes even much earlier...
Great info, just a small side note, 100% clean electricity doesn't actually exist. Solar and others still need you to build the power plant that will eventually need to be replaced. That doesn't raise the emissions of solar energy anywhere near that of fossil fuels, but still it's noteworthy that there are emissions related to that as well.
Sure.
Even just existing causes emissions.
Nobody is saying otherwise.
@@JerryRigEverything Absolutely! It was just a small detail that's good to remember in calculations. But like I said it doesn't really change the outcome and didn't mean it as critique, but more just as a nice to know fact. Love your videos! Can't wait to see the Humvee finished
Hoping for this kind of content:
Durability test for Pen displays ex: Wacom, Huion and Ipad. I just wonder if I can travel with these expensive gadgets and to have peace of mind.
Great video. There are additional things we often forget. Pollution is not only CO2, gas cars have more liquids that require changing (often there are also leaks to ground, e.g. oils polluting ground or even making roads slippery especially dangerous for motorcycles). Also gas cars create more dust from breaks (polluting our lungs). And last thing, even if electric car would produce same amount of pollution/CO2 (because of polluting power grid) they do not produce this pollution where most humans live/work (e.g. in large city centers).
I really like the technology connection video regarding the breakdown of electricity used and cost per charge. Also how most people only need a 7kwh charger
Fossil fuels also have to be obtained from the earth, just like lithium. The energy savings obviously isn’t perfect, but it’s the first real generation of EVs. We need to continue innovating. Thanks for the amazing content!
thank you for bringing up a balanced discussion of a BEV. so tired of people acting like BEVs are the end all solution to vehicular pollution/environment impact problems.