Ancient Coins: Should you slab your coins?
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- Опубліковано 22 кві 2021
- Third-party grading and slabbing is very popular on modern coins, particularly on the US market. The slabbing of Ancient Coins, however, is a relatively new thing and has caused quite a bit of division between ancient numismatists.
Today, lets go over a couple of positive and negative sides of slabbing your ancient coins, so you can determine with a little bit more information if you want your coins slabbed or not!
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Handling coins is the most important part of collecting, at least for me
Agreed 100%!
Even if all ancient coins were ugly, the sheer age gives them some sort of majesty
I agree
@@ClassicalNumismatics I 100% agree with you guys!.
I also agree!!!!!!
That's what makes it more intimate then just going to a museum
Excellent topic. I’m 63 and have been collecting since I was five. Out of the thousands of coins I have in my collection, only four are slabbed. It is incredibly satisfying putting on a pair of gloves and holding a coin in your hand that someone else held all those years ago. Being able to examine the coin from all sides is important to me. In a slab the coin becomes just an object in a piece of plastic. It loses that sense of history and wonder of who hands it has passed through before getting to me. When I watch UA-cam videos of people sending out coins to be slabbed, they rarely say they are doing it to protect the coin but talk about how much more money they can get for the coin if it gets the grade they want. To me slabbed coins are more for people that are just flipping coins to make a quick profit.
I'm not a coin guy, I just have a passing interest, but I collect interesting and historical firearms and I feel very similarly. Not only do private collectors often take better care and do a better job at documenting and cataloguing important historical firearms, they also often actually use these items. They keep them running, if possible. It really is something extraordinary to use a relatively complex mechanical machine in the exact same fashion it's original owner did 180 or 200 years ago, and in the same exact fashion many others have between that time and now. The sense of connection, to me at least, is unparalleled.
I heartily agree
Agree 100%. I get angry when youtube throws a video at me from people like Acousha Collectible because I absolutely get this awful feeling with that guy's videos. It's the dark side of coin the hobby -- so-called 'investors' who don't actually spend their money on something that could actually grow and produce something (i.e. actual investment).. they put their money into things just hoping to flip. Buy slabbed coins, picking through people's older slabs to look for more conservatively graded coins so they can try to get a CAC sticker on the slab and put up the coin for a higher price. It's a big nasty scheme that takes all the fun out of coin collecting. I'm like you; I have a total of 3 slabbed coins. Those 3 coins are steel cents (one from each mint). I bought them because they are steel and I wanted something that would most likely keep them from rusting in the future and thus keep looking nice. We knew the whole "slab everything" idea is a monetization scheme the moment the grading companies started posting their own price guides.
I agree but at the same time I can have slippery hands and messy work areas and slabs help keep them safe. What I do is I keep some slab free so I can get my "touchy fix" Haha. Usually my favorites that I know I'll keep forever and coins that are mint or I'll resale, I'll slab. I'll also slab to get information on coins I don't know much about.
Currently I'm debating whether I should slab a Ptolemy coin that I recently found from the Svornos collection. The rainbow patina is amazing and it feels so heavy and good in the hand but it looks like it has been slabbed prior due to 4 little "holder" marks on the coin . I found it in a box at a numismatic shop in the corner with a price of $120. It looks ChXF at the worst. This place treats ancients like a red headed step child for some reason. I also found aMS Tiberius tribute penny there as well for 80$
I bet you have an amazing collection.
I could never slab my coins. I have to handle them with my bare hands. If I wasn’t able to do that, I wouldn’t want to collect them.
This really is a fantastic channel.
Thanks! Im glad you like it :)
i am a beginner collector with no source of income (still 17) so as of now, I prefer cheap ancient coins, worn and torn, within my budget I just wanna hold a piece of history in my hands, look at its features, frequently touch it with my hands (carefully of course!), so in conclusion I would prefer unslabbed coins, probably in the future too, when i would be able to buy iconic coins i just want to touch them physically, if i wanted it inside a plastic container, from which i can't remove the coin, why would i buy it in the first place?
excellent points. Can never understand imprisoning beautiful coins in a slab. I guess it comes to whether you look at coins as an investment or an emotion. :)
Another option is also DIY Slabs like Lighthouse QuickSlabs and other brands too. They have a nicer black background and you can reopen the cases anytime you like. Also a good option if you want to display your coins too.
But I don't think they make thick holders.
@@samu0450
No thick holders for thick tetradrachm type coins but I have improvised by combining 2 inserts together and using 2 of the back cases of the holders and some artist tape with good results.
@@BopWalk very nice! I am looking at getting some lighthouse holders as well. Do you have a pic of the thick holder you made?
@@samu0450
It's basically 2 of the back pieces of each (any) lighthouse holder and sandwiches both back pieces together for maximum inside space and literally pieced both back pieces together with masking/artist tape. I also glued 2 holders together that fit my Athena/Owl tetradrachm.
Also good thing to note, if your coin is 19mm, use a 18mm coin holder so the coin will actually stay put.
@@samu0450 Yeah, but now Lighthouse makes Magic Capsules, which are great for holding thicker coins. I love 'em.
never
Excellent! I would only add: slabbing also makes impossible close examination that would allow you or an expert to jugdge the authenticity of the coin; you cannot, for instance, check the edge. Although they are now including the weight, they do not include other physical data (such as diamater, thickness, etc.) which may be important if you are conducting a study. Finally, slabbed coins are difficult to compare when you are making a die link study, which is essential specially in Greek coins.
Unfortunately slabbing is no proof of authenticity of any coin. Generally there is no advantage of slabbing coins for serious collectors, the only profit have firms providing it.
They have Machines that can at lest tell you if is Gold or silver, Through the slabbed plastic. That will not tell you the Complete picture of a coin and it's eccentrically differences.
I have bought many NGC coins and have unslabbed all of them. I appreciate the additional opinion on the authenticity but do not always agreed with the attribution (ancient coins). The unslabbing is for the reason others have expressed here - I like the physical connection with the past. So if you are collecting to invest, keep the slab, otherwise enjoy the experience
It's hard to imagine anyone buying ancient coins, only as an investment, without having so much of an interest or ever developing an interest!
Personally, I hate those coin prisons that prevent me from appreciating them to their full extent. However, I find a great success those capsules that can be opened and closed easily and safely, and that incorporate a material designed to protect the coins.
I fully agree with the final statement given in the video. I love to interact with my coins - feel, smell, breath it. So I would never cover them with plastic. Again congrats for the great video!
Lol... smell the coins.. not always a fun thing. I have thousands of asian cast coins (the coins with square holes in the middle), and while smell is supposed to be useful in authentication of asian cast coins, many of them do not have a pleasant smell. I dunno if it is the soil in which they were found or the chemical compounds that formed the patinas, but they have a distinct odor that I tolerate but would rather not smell.
@@kotto7877, when I get off a plane in Asia, often I can tell I’m in Asia just by the smell. 😊
You have to hold ancients in your hands, just like the ancients.
I can understand why people would slab some extremely expensive or rare coins, but I own no slabbed ancient coins myself.
Very much prefer countermarks and ancient damage.. that is your coolest coin.
This video is excellent, can't wait to share it with all my slabber friends!!!
here is my opinion.
i own both slabbed and raw coins (us and ancients, 80% ancients are raw). i believe that with slabbing ancients, it is fine however they should include more information on the labels and guarantee it for sure like david sear does (sear certfies coins without slabbing them, very trusted in the community).
i own slabbed ancients bc i transitioned from 10 yeaes plus of US Coin collecting (i still do). most of my ngc slabs are of valuable coins; i love to hold and own my coins when i can, i 100% agree with you that there is nothing else like holding an ancient. however for people like me who have a skin condition (eczema/certain allergies, makes it hard to always carry coins raw) & people converting from US, slabs are not bad at all.
Only issue with slabs are the lack of authentic guarantees & lack of info. also some scrupulous individuals price slabs much higher than they should be, but not many do this in my opinion. i have found several good deals on nice slabbed ancients & have paid high too.
if they started doing all this, would you buy coins slabbed? ill continue to buy both lol!
keep in mind this is only a summary of the slab problem, so i haven't addressed everything.
u/savixe, if you ever wanna talk/see some of my slabbed ancients or raws, hit me up on my reddit.
cheers!
Being 72 years old, i remember when a VF was NOT called an XF and a XF was not hiked to AU by either dealers or Grading Services. Today we are told it’s a matter of opinion…..BS….. it’s a matter of greed!
Never understood slabbing. There's nothing better than handling an ancient coin with care
I get why people slab their coins, but I don’t want to look at my coin through a scratched, reflective plastic window.
Same
Beautiful daric
As a new collector to ancients, Knowing some history on the slab helps, But for now prefer raw coins, being able to get some gloves on and handling them.
Excellent video. This was a much needed explanation outside of coin collecting forums.
I personally don't like handling coins but I favor DIY Slabs which you can reopen whenever you want and I love displaying them that way. Plus the black background is better than the white background of NGC slabs. I have tray holders that fit 6 slabs each tray and it's been a real joy so far.
Yes, DIY slabs are alright. And Magic Capsules are really nice for odd shaped and thick coins. I love the way that my Athens owl tetradrachm looks in a magic capsule.
@@kotto7877
Really?? I never heard of Magic Slabs, if you say they have holders for very thick coins I'm a happy man!
If you slab your coins, you can’t hold them in your hands. If the coin is “mint state” and touching the coin would lower the value, then sure.
My Roman coins are in lighthouse coin books! I love to take them out and hold history in my hand.
Lovely stuff! Im glad you enjoy them so much
I would never buy a slabbed coin, unless it's so beautiful that I want it, to free it at home (not to manipulate it frequently, but to see it on an elegant medal showcase). Anyway, I really don't need a third party (nor even a first, actually I only trust myself to evaluate if I find a coin beautiful or not). I collect coins I like and I can afford, simple as that.
Very helpful video. Thank you.
Thanks! Glad you liked it. Hopefully people dont see this as a rant of some sort, but as a personal opinion based on facts that will help them come up with a decision to slab or not.
Also, putting a coin in a blender would be the owner's choice too... and it's legal. But I still have a problem with it ;)
a very good video. I like both ways and will buy a coin raw or slabbed if it's a coin I want and enjoy keeping them and looking at them either way.
I like buying from my dealer because he puts them into custom slabs where they can stay protected, has a tag with a description but they are also easy to remove and handle if you wanted too.
I often recommend this types of "slabs" for collectors looking for an alternative to NGC slabs. These are indeed quite practical. They offer good protection, and as you said, you can actually open them and enjoy the coin!
@@ClassicalNumismatics I love them
Hello, very interesting video, thank you dear 👍
Very good explanation. Personally I prefer to touch the coins myself but would not mind to have a few valuable and in XF condition graded and slabbed.
I think this topic is very interesting, because it makes me realize the gap between modern coin collectors and ancient coin collectors.
Slabbed coins are pretty much widely accepted and most often preferred with modern coins, and that is how I started collecting. I’m used to the price guides and standard grading scale that come with slabbed coins. With ancient coins, it’s obvious to me that the community leans towards raw coins. As I’m new to the ancient hobby and learning more, I’ll be buying slabbed coins for now, but in the future I’d love to own some raw ancient coins that I can display on a tray and can hold and examine up close. Until that gap is bridged though, I think I’ll be buying slabbed coins.
As far as I know, museums wouldnt slab their coins. So if they don't slab ancients then I won't.
Slabing is only good if you want to sell your coins because people blindly waste more money on a slab. But trully I don't see any more benefit, the grades are very arbitrary and depend on how much of a good day is the coin grader is having, you can grade your coins multiple times and almost always get different gradrs for the same coin. The only reason why it is popular rigth now is because a lot of people make their bussineses whith their PCGS or NGC subcriptions... And in all that you loose the ability to see your coin in detail and handle it... You loose a lot of the experience of collecting coins. Not worth it.
I understand and respect the choice for slabbing ancient coins. I personally wouldn't slab even my most precious as a museum piece. I want to be able to hold it as it's been for millennia
I have a mix of slabbed and unslabbed, mostly based upon the value of the coin. I just don't feel comfortable with a coin that costs $1000 or more loose, or not authenticated by a third party. That said, I like handling coins just as much as anyone, so I have many lower valued coins that I can touch to my heart's content. I do think its important to be able to touch them, especially if you're showing them to someone who might be new to collecting coins. That touching of history is important. I just don't think every coin needs to be laying loose in a tray. I'm not going to criticize anyone, though, for either choice they make. Now if you decide to carve your initials in that tetra....
Very sensible and logical decision from you!
And yes, absolutely NO sharp objects get near any of the coins 😂
Exactly
Love Grading coins, I get wanting to touch them but for me the most important part is storage and keeping them safe. It also makes it very easy to display them, and anyone who wants to see one of my coins can instantly know what it is off a very clean and simple label
you could always...you know... white it down or tell people what they are.
Imagine owning an ancient coin and never being able to hold it. Wear gloves, wash your hands..whatever, just hold the coin and appreciate it!
While slabbing may be the right thing to do for preservation and makes sale easier and safer *but* it deprives you of the best thing of accident coins. To hold them in your hands. I personally don’t Slab ancient coins
for me id only slab coins that are essentially mint and would get damaged from the slightest tray rubbing or scratching or look worse for finger prints etc.
in ancient coins thats a very very small number of coins imo that i would bother with. There are plenty of great looking coins from F- EF or countermarked coins that i feel do not really need to be slabbed and tbh dont see any demand for it either
I keep my coins in little plastic containers in columns because trays aren't cheap. If you have a tray recommendation I'd like to hear it. For now though they are in very easy to open plastic capsules that let people I don't trust handle them, and people I do trust take them out.
Great videos! Thank you! I have only one slabbed coin. It spent 175 years under the sea, only to be encapsulated in plastic.
The polymer composition of slabs will degrade in a few decades, requiring future owners to discard them. The slab surfaces are often scratched, making viewing of the coin difficult.
100% right! And they have the audacity of putting on their website "Protection for the Ages!"
I like slabbed coins for several reasons: I love high end coins. I think it's irresponsible to drag your thumb across the face of a high end coin. You may not notice any issues in your lifetime but the next steward who ushers your coin into the next generation may notice the damage. Secondly, I like the organization. They are easy to keep in order and organized without bumping around. Finally, my job as a collector is to pass it on to the next generation in the same state that I got it in. People think their hands and fingers don't wear coins....but they do. Just carry a pocket coin for 1 year and see what happens to it. Unfortunately, people can't look beyond their lifetimes or past their "property" and want to fondle and sniff their coins. They are, quite simply, poor stewards. There are plenty of lower grade or common coins you can stick in whatever hole you want to without damaging important pieces of history. It's the same reason you aren't supposed to touch things in museums.
I've been a coin collector for 32 years.
Thanks for the great videos.
Some slab companies only grade ancient coins without authenticating them. The ancient coin market is rife with European and chinese counterfeits.
You mean Eastern Europe; and the Middle East surely; and also China?
It would be of interest 2 see a comparison. Of modern western coin design 2 the ancients that inspired them.
I have a video comparing the morgan dollar with ancient coins, have a look at my channel page!
Personally I enjoy savoring the taste of the patina under my tongue.
How many of the Ancient coins where shaved to scam the value of the coins before ridging on modern coins?.
This is more of a medieval phenomena. Ancient coins were quite thick, and hard to clip, while medieval pieces were very thin
From a beginner perspective, I would want that extra security having it in a slab. However I'm in China now and I've found many fake coin dealers with fake slabs on them.
After watching this video, it confirms my suspicion that I'm missing out the tactile sense and being able to see it from different angles.
Yes, and those fakes are coming across the ocean and showing up on ebay all the time. Slabs don't guarantee authenticity because the slabs themselves are faked. It's becoming an art to authenticate the actual slabs these days. Looking up certificate numbers isn't good enough anymore because counterfeits are made to match the actual certificate numbers. On the upside, this means that some speculators are getting burned. Maybe some of them will leave the market because of it.
great video, I am buying slabbed coins at the moment and may buy raw silver ancients in the future.
Slabbing is a racket imho
Hoping he shows how to unslab a coin.
I personally just stated collecting ancients. For me, I don’t mind if I can hold the coin or not. I come from moderns, where as you said, slabbing is pretty common place. I feel that at least having some slabs will give me a reference in how to properly grade my ancients, by having a reference.
The only area I see slabbing as beneficial is for extremely rare and expensive coins ie > $10,000. These coins are too expensive for most collectors and are frequently bought by speculators. Many of these folks won't pull the trigger unless the coin is slabbed. Slabbing of lower value coins is a waste of time and money as well as spoiling the handling factor.
Thats a valid argument, I can understand your logic behind it.
Although, imagine what an incredible experience would it be to handle a Syracuse Dekadrachm!
@@ClassicalNumismatics Thank you for the validation! I have never held a Dekadrachm. I imagine it would be amazing especially if signed by famous die maker! But imagine getting an extra 10-20K on the sale because it is slabbed and speculators are fighting over it!
That's the right word for these people -- speculators. They are not investors.
Hey i have been watching your videos for i while now, and i was wondering around how much do you think your collection is worth?
This is an information I will keep to myself :)
Slabbing will ruin the ancient market if it becomes the rule. I've had dealers, yes plural, tell me that my NGC slabbed coin was over graded. So slabbing is no guarantee of anything.
Slabbing is just greed by this point
I have a nice Hadrian Sestertius that has a nice thick crust on the edge all around while both sides of the coin are VF. That coin I'll take out and even smell once in a while (I know im a freak but I sware I can smell history) but each time I move it, it loses some of that ancient crust
I only slab expensive ones because the holder offers extra security for the coin and it makes things a lot easier when you decide to resell especially on online platforms like eBay. I definitely agree that slabbing ancient coins have pros and cons, the label affects the value of the coin a lot, sometimes buyers can get confused if they're not familiar with NGC's grading standards, I've seen many ugly off-center coins with poor die quality slabbed with 5/5 on strike or surface quality, and many gorgeous ones with great eye appeal only slabbed with 2/5 or 3/5 score, some new collectors automatically assume those numbers represent the condition of the coin, but they often don't, take "die shift" for an example, double striking is not exactly a condition term since it has nothing to do with wears and marks, but with a "die shift" remark it will most likely bring the score down to 3/5 on surface and 4/5 on strike on most coins these days, the one in the video at 2:50 is rather unusual because NGC don't give 5/5 surface on "die shift" coins anymore. So yeah, their grading standards can be very confusing sometimes and what I'm trying to say is collectors needs to consider all the factors when submitting their coins for slabbing, one of those factors is you might get a low grade or low detail scores than what you expected, in that case, it can be a disappointing outcome and it can get harder to resell the slabbed coin than the raw coin itself
I'm new to coins, I started getting into them right before Covid. I do have a couple decades experience with other collectibles (it's different, but there's some cross-over mindset). Right now I'm only going after slabbed coins because I know enough to know I don't know enough right now. I want to know the grade, specifics of the coin and be authenticated. I'm willing to pay a premium for that.
Most of my coins are slabbed, although I do miss the physical connection to them. My new coins I buy slabbed to preserve the MS70 designation for my kids, and my important ancients I buy slabbed to guarantee authenticity (as best as possible) and preserve them. I also keep my important silver stored in a box with desiccant packets to prevent tarnish.
Perhaps I'm being too careful, but I still get the thrill of holding history through a slab.
Where can I buy ancient coins from?
I have tons of videos for beginners explaining the process, I recommend you head to my page and check it out :)
vcoins and ma-shops
As someone relatively new to the hobby. I like purchasing stabbed coins for the security, & then breaking them out
I also like alcoves, but I'm a collector, so I often buy slabs. I was worried that it might be a fake.😢
the slab is a guarantee of authenticity for me, im much more likely to cough up a bit more cash for slabbed coins
Totally your prerogative, but remember it is currently NOT a guarantee of authenticity for the service provider itself, only a well informed opinion.
Slabs themselves are counterfeited. Be careful that you don't buy fakes. Don't blindly trust slabbed coins to be real.
I slab ancient coin in order to give the buyer a sound mind when buying
That just makes me wonder if the coin is fake.
@@wormius7350 so you think Morgan dollar are fake when in a ngc slab???
@@arimoreno6521 I’m referring to ancient coins. People do make fake slabs and put fake coins in them, so I just don’t trust purchasing any slabbed coins except from a reputable auction house.
@@wormius7350 you make no sense
@@arimoreno6521 how do I not make sense? Auction houses are reputable and guarantee authenticity. But if I see a coin in a slab on ebay, I lose interest.
If I had a perfect coin I might consider getting it slabbed.
"Ayo let me get my Hammer real quick!"
I am an American numismatist with 54 years in the hobby. As such, I like both raw and slabbed coins for different reasons.
As for ancients, I am a complete neophyte, but because my father was a Greek immigrant I always harbored a desire to own an Athenian Tetradrachm Owl.
I have looked at many over the years at shows and finally found one last year that just knocked my socks off and I simply had to have it. It is a magnificent specimen authenticated and graded by NGC. AU condition. 5/5 strike & 5/5 surfaces.
Despite my desire to touch and handle this coin, I did not hesitate to buy it in a slab because it was damned expensive and I lack sufficient expertise to assess Ancient Greek coinage, so the certification had real value for me.
I also loved the way the coin is presented. The slab was not beat up and scratched. It has an attractive label with artwork of Ancient Greek ruins and some historical data on the label to inform the viewer about its age, condition, place of origin, denomination and grade. It gives the coin an almost museum-like presentation that I can well appreciate.
Having said all of this, I do at times wish I could touch this coin directly, but having held other raw specimens of this same coin in my hands at coin shows I have already sorta “scratched that itch” to touch an Athenian Owl that ancient Greeks once touched, so I don’t really feel like I’m missing out on much with this specimen being in a slab.
Also, I can always crack open the slab if I ever change my mind on that issue. However, I doubt that I will because I will most likely pass on this coin to a non-numismatist family member when I die and the coin will be better appreciated, protected, and more meaningful to my family if it remains in the slab.
So, I know that most ancients collectors detest the slabs, but they do have their place from time to time. And any future collector who obtains this coin is always free to bust it out of the slab if so inclined.