The Disturbing Case Of The "Mummified" Family In The Colorado Rockies
Вставка
- Опубліковано 25 січ 2024
- Click betterhelp.com/enigma for 10% off your first month of therapy with our sponsor BetterHelp. Join over 4 million people who’ve met with a therapist on BetterHelp and started living a healthier, happier life.
This video covers the disappearance and deaths of the Vance family in the Colorado Rockies.
Link to Patreon -
/ themissingenigma
Podcast Version: www.spreaker.com/show/the-mis...
E-Mail: YTthemissing@gmail.com
Facebook: profile.php?...
Instagram: / the_missing. .
Twitter: / missingenigma
Special Thanks to Fxllxng for Audio Support.
Check out his work here: open.spotify.com/artist/5ynqo...
Don't forget to check out BetterHelp! Follow this link betterhelp.com/enigma for 10% off your first month.
Taking a Better help sponsorship is embarrassing
Why? Who cares? If it allows this channel to produce content we can enjoy, does it matter? Easy to be a critic eh...@@camerontolley8597
I love the music you have in your videos
You're gonna lose subscribers - Better Help is a BS scam and people know it!
No UA-camrs with ANY dignity have accepted a sponsorship from them in almost 2 years... just sayin'.
@@LittleBlueOwl318theyre supposedly reformed. Im sure theyve done theirbdue diligence with sponsors. Consider the channel youre watching.
There's a reason indigenous people and people living sustainably in rural areass of Arica, South America etc virtually *never* do so in isolated couples or small family groups. Its because it is brutally hard work, even on the most productive land. Humans need cooperative, multi-family communities to make it long term.
And the knowledge of how to deal with the harsh conditions, and proper equipment needed. These people seemed to have no real knowledge of all the supplies they would need. Looking at what they brought, seemed like just the most basic stuff you'd take if you were camping normally in the summer for a week. I believe they would've gotten more supplies or tried to leave when winter set in, but they were trapped after the forest service towed their vehicle. Still can't believe they did that! If that's normal protocol they need to make changes so they're not leaving folks trapped to die in the mountains wtf!
Even the Indigenous people, the Ute tribe, migrated to lower elevations in the winter rather than staying in the high San Juans and other mountainous areas. And even with their thousands of years of survival experience, they often faced starvation if the game was poor or they didn't have enough forage stored for a particularly hard winter.
They really had no idea. None of the stuff they had was anything I'd waste time packing into the mountains. They apparently had no knives, no guns, no axe or other tools, no real outdoor clothing, especially winter outdoor clothing and gear, no skis or snowshoes, and no way to signal for help in an emergency. A fishing pole was the only food-gathering tool they had, and there are damn few fish in the creeks and lakes up there in the high country, especially in the winter. And they had no tools to break through the ice to reach what fish there might have been. They had no way to hunt for larger game, and there is precious little forage in the mountains even in the summer.@@krisfinley6706
It's why so many people died early in life in "the good times".
@@PipsqwakIt's a similar story with the Pueblo and other Indigenous peoples in the desert southwest. Even their 'permanent' settlements were regularly abandoned for the season or for years to decades depending on flood and drought conditions. A huge part of sustainable subsistence living is knowing when to fold em and relocate.
Extremely tragic that the 14 year old was dragged into this.
I'm just so mad at them. Why did they choose there of all places? Why didn't they move to Florida or Mississippi anywhere warm enough to make off the grid living much easier?!! Why didn't the aunt and son just leave the mom out there?
It could legitimately be called child abuse to take an underaged kid into this situation, and why the rest of the family didn't stop that from happening is beyond me. Probably they. just didn't realize that the mom was seriously going to stay out there in the mountains. But she also had no right to take that child out there without telling the truth to his father. If she'd survived, she could have been prosecuted for that.
@jimmyjaime43 lol
@jimmyjaime43they literally starved him to death dummy
I was once a 14 year old boy. I can easily picture the women talking about living off grid and the boy himself being the one happily encouraging them to do so, over and over until they decided to venture out into the wilderness. They might have been talked into it by him, and went because he told them he would "handle things" that came up he was a man!. The women might have decided to go thinking they didn't want to disappoint him. They also had crosses around their necks. They might have trusted God and angels being there for them and make the decisions no matter what. They also probably thought their car would get them out of trouble, too. Then they got sick and quickly lost all their strength. You can be fine when you go to sleep and sick as a dog when you wake up. They then might have just gave up all hope because they knew they'd never make it through the harsh winter.
This is not living "off grid" - this is dying out in the open
What a pointless tragedy
This seems more like mental illness, stoked by the right wing conspiracy nonsense around the COVID pandemic. There seems to have been an attempt to try “off grid” living, but was woefully inadequate.
Why didn't the Forest Service report the abandoned car to the police? An abandoned car in a remote area like that that's sat for 2 months should have had them concerned about a possible missing person. Hmmm 🤔
Maybe they did? They weren’t reported as missing & they didn’t have phones.
I'll bet they knew who's car it was and had it removed without telling the people, leaving them to perish in the cold. Typical authority's.
@@cosmicdebris42What a ridiculous thing to say. What possible evidence could you have for this? Think before you speak.
touch a nerve? Heed the Baa?@@cowboydan507
@@cowboydan507its not beyond the realm of possibility. authorities have been shown to do much worse.
Their mistake was thinking they were living off grid. All they were doing is camping off the grid.
And not even camping very well. The stuff they had with them was packed like teenagers would pack to go to a sleepover or something. Totally useless for survival.
It seems like they'd never even camped before, ever. There's some basic camping rules they missed, let alone more advanced things. Just absolute insanity.
They were in a worse position than the average homeless person. There is a reason homeless people live in cities and not mountains!
Exactly. Especially in this area, you need a LOT to survive off the land. I've been homesteading in the area for multiple years now and with all my hard work I'm nowhere close to being self sufficient. And I have a house. That can't be blown over in our crazy winds here, though it's sure been tested.
This was a sad one. I feel for the kid big time. What a horrible way to go.
Right!? 😮 The poor kid.
@@culturebreath369 I know! Why didn't the aunt and son just leave the crazy mom?!? Maybe they thought she would die? Why did the women continue to stay out there once the boy was dead?!!??
no car long walk@@WhitneyDahlin
Too weak and sick by the time the boy died, and possibly too cold and the snow too deep for them too walk anywhere.@@markgelk
The snow could have been 4 feet deep. How long would you last hiking miles and miles on foot, on a deserted mountain? They were dead either way@@WhitneyDahlin
I live in a big bell tent for 3,5 years now, with solar energy, wood stove & petroleum stove, running water just next to my tent and a new bell tent every 18 months (they deteriorate) and all the comforts just next door. Even then it is a challenge in winter! I live in Europe, with a very moderate climate, so no snow storms, extreme cold and long freezing periods. I absolute love my lifestyle, but what that family did was absolute insane and so ill prepared it could only be a death sentence. So sad for the adults, but for the boy...they abused and hurt an innocent boy to death. Thats criminal.
What is a bell tent?
@@jturtle5318 A dome tent.
I lived with a wood / coal stove as my only heat source in a bunker with no shower and no toilet for 6 years. Wood is the most expensive heat source there is when you consider all the work involved, and I say that even after accounting for the fact that I got all my wood for free. So when I bought this house in 2011, with a kitchen, bathroom, and gas heat, I felt like a king. I know I could survive living off-grid, but I wouldn't do it willingly.
Almost forgot, I've experienced winters where it got down to -20C here in eastern Germany.
There are parts of Europe with snow storms and such,
Are you in the Mediterranean?
Can’t fathom taking a child into a situation like that.
Please stop doing ads for Better Help. They have scammed and hurt their users and steal their data.
You're more than welcome to not watch the channel's content. Do that.
Agree 100%. Always saddens me when UA-camrs I like advertise services like that.
I am sure he will stop. Lot of backlash. Nick is class A
@@johnqpublic2718And I am also more than free to bring this up to a creator I have watched for years in hopes of warning him and others. If he continues, I am dipping, but I would like to give a creator I watch a chance to fix this situation.
And you can just as easily not respond to my posts if you don't like my content.
@@hiddelsubbledees458ikr? It's spreading like the plague all over again. Creators need to vet who they promote to their viewers better.
How can you expect to survive off grid if you don't have any kind of permanent structure to use for shelter? This was an "accident" waiting to happen.
The only saw I noticed on site was a hacksaw near the lean-to. I cannot imagine the amount of energy needed to cut all that wood for the structure with a hacksaw. If that is the case an assumption can be made that the 14 year old did the work and it appears he was the first to pass on.
They had toilet paper, and top ramen, lol😂
Not trying to make light of this tragedy, its just comical how all they seemed to have in their "homestead" was a tent, a crappy blanket, canned food/top ramen, and toilet paper. This was so preventable.😢
@@sanniwartinen3595 Absolutely! They were clearly not prepared to move off grid. Dumb mistake that unfortunately cost them their lives and that of their son/nephew. The adult women should’ve known better than to be so reckless.
@@elonever.2.071 I saw that too! They were using a saw for metal to cut wood. Must've taken forever to cut that. They obviously had zero knowledge about a lot of things besides outdoor survival skills. Just the fact that they left their car in the parking lot far away, had no weapons, no cell phones, like, what the hell were these people thinking? Looks like they watched too many episodes of Grizzly Adams, and if a bear showed up, they'd probably try to pet it.
bad timing for this, I mean no disrespect to those that passed but I've said for years that tents are body bags for city folk , maybe I been up a holler to long but I'm fine with that
I can see the appeal of living off-grid - but in a building or houseboat, with solar panels and/or wind turbine, and a reliable source of food and clean water. But life as a permanent camping vacation? This family's inadequate supplies and equipment, and the chaos of their campsite, screams 'mental illness' to me.
Yes it wasn't very bright. And the fact they dragged a kid with them. That really angers me.
Yeah, screams neglect and mental illness by the parents. Poor kid was just a victim of their parents
Yes depression and paranoia
Mental disorder is devastating in isolation. That poor child - 14 years old. Child abuse. I have a 14 year old son. This is grievous and inspires pure, incandescent rage in my soul. No one knew they were planning to do this? That they were not capable or equipped mentally, physically or emotionally?? It’s obvious just looking at the photos of the adult women they were nowhere near fit enough or had any idea what it would entail to survive like this. They don’t even appear to be weekend warriors hiking as a pastime or even RV glamping. Yet, they expected to survive the winter in a tent in remote wilderness without adequate supplies??? They just disappeared without ANYONE knowing or checking on them or calling a welfare check in dead of winter? How could they possibly think they could survive this way?
On top of that, in one of the coldest spots in the country in winter.
I know! My thoughts exactly …
Entitlement and the attitude of "It couldn't possibly happen to me". Everyone's the hero of their own story after all until they're not.
Perhaps they did realize they could die and went ahead with it.
And choosing a cold location with horrible winters.
Dont let situations like this occur with children ppl. If someone is being sketchy, as these women were, and there is a child involved, report it to someone. Even if a child is with their parent it doesnt make it ok for them to disappear. Especially if their parent is the kind to think the world is ending to the extent they should flee the grid. All the ppl who witnessed the decline of these women, and just let then wander off with that boy smh.
Both parents were 100% culpable in their son's tragic, agonising, and totally preventable death. It takes two people to create another human being, a woman and a man.
If you are one of two people who brought a child into this world, your most important duty is to keep that miniature human being happy, healthy and ALIVE, at the very least, to the age of 18. This poor little boy was failed by both his mother and his father.
At least his mother had mental illness as some small measure of an excuse. Why was his Dad playing such a small role in his life? Boys especially really need a loving father's love, support and guidance when they reach their teens.
@@glamdolly30 pure speculation, but the family courts are most often very slanted towards mothers. I wouldnt be surprised if that father was denied access, even with the mother being ill. I got lucky, and my ex didnt put up a fight. Otherwise my kids wouldve been trapped with their abuser. Also a possibility that he was just a piece of shit, or mental himself. Gotta ask what kinda guy gets involved with such a mentally ill female.
Honest question, in a circumstance like this what good would that do? I doubt a child would be removed from a parent because someone reported that they were planning to live off grid. Especially if they were only planning on being out there for a couple months and then returning for the winter. It sounds like this case was a combination of a lot of factors that came together tragically but it’s hard to place sole blame on any one thing or person.
@@jotun.616 WOAH - Easy there! Lots of speculation in your post - we simply do not know details of the parental history here.
As I'm sure you're aware, it is statistically, many times more likely than the father was abusive to her/his offspring, than vice versa. The fact that she, not he, had custody, supports that theory.
I'm of the view that both parents should take equal responsibility for the children they conceive together. If that were the case here, the mother could not have taken the reckless, unilateral decisions she did, which directly led to the death of their teen son.
Again, we're in the dark about this family. I would however 100% condemn the decision to tow away a car parked in a remote area without cellphone service, particularly with Winter approaching. As @TheMissingEnigma said, removing that vehicle amounted to a death sentence for three people. I sincerely hope lessons are learned.
Looks like they were trying to make a somelike hobbithouse?
Reminds me a lot of Christopher McCandless’ story. Shame how many people overestimate their own ability while underestimating what it takes to survive outside of typical society.
Where is your other leg? Your profile picture makes it look like you only have one.
@@userequaltoNulldude
Really? Reminds you… A LOT? lol the only common feature here being death there is literally nothing else whatsoever that crosses over…
@@Ytbkt For me I see two cases where people disenchanted with society took off into the woods because they were convinced they could make it outside the constraints of regular existence. While their motivations were different, both fundamentally believed life would be more fruitful in the wilderness (which I understand has a lot to do with potential mental illness in the case of the family). To me they are also similar because in each case ignorance and inexperience created situations in which escape became impossible (McCandless’ paralysis and the family’s car being towed).
These two groups had different motivations for their departures, but in both cases similar facets of overconfidence and flawed decision making lead to very tragic, and arguably preventable, outcomes.
@@AnastasiaPersika ok, makes sense! I withdraw my objection.
The fact feces was found around the place is an indication they were very ill. The fact only a small tent was there looks like they didnt mean to stay the winter. Its so sad - especially the 14yr old. 😢
I think they got that beaver fever, of they were starving they would have finished the food, I think they got too sick.
@@OligosFew shitting yourself to death alone in the woods, not on my bucket list guys, I think I'll leave the off the grid stuff for other people
no it isnt. grow up.
@@keastymatthew2407
Psychopath at least they show empathy
@@kofi-kun6420 😆😆
I really appreciate your old school vibe and how you take us way beyond the headlines.
This is how real media used to be.
Seriously! Now it’s just activists pretending to be journalists. And they always put their own opinions and seem to cover and lie or “bend” the truth or purposely leave things out. It’s sad. Especially for big issues we have 😢 sad
He reminds me of an extra on a cowboy movie from the 1950's
@@sicooper4230oh absolutely! He's just got such an inviting and warm vibe
He’s certainly a breath of fresh air from the click bait douch bags of UA-cam who sensationalize everything. Channels like his are what makes UA-cam great
@@AS-qg1xu I didn't realize that. What did he leave out?
Towing the car without even considering that someone could be out there injured or missing? that seems very negligent.
Ever met pigs?
Agreed
Yeah, seems like a pretty huge oversight.. whole story is ridiculous tbh.. what a waste
They tow hundreds of cars every year. People leave their cars all the time. You can't blame this on the forest service for towing a car after two months. Even if they hadn't towed the vehicle, it would have been buried under feet of snow.
Yes, it’s all the government’s fault…
Paranoia is an underrated and very dangerous mental disorder. Anyone feeling this way should seek help and I say that with kindness. Living with paranoia is not a healthy or happy way to live. It can destroy your life and in this case lead to death. So sad.
Exactly. Dr Grande speculated that especially one of the sisters displayed symptoms common to conditions like schizoid personality disorder. Seems the other sister really just went along with her, like a folie a deux type situation
Ya im so paranoid I almost never leave the house, I have no friends or social life. Almost all my money goes towards ammo and freeze dried food which I bury underground. Idk im probally being unreasonable but time will tell.
@@cascadianrangers728 being self-aware is the first step, hopefully you have a shelter and you're not in the woods in a tent in the winter in Colorado
No one with paranoia is going to seek help. Loved ones have to intervene
I'm 39. Looking back it's plagued me my whole life. I'm working on it now but wish it hadn't taken so long.
I bet they thought they could hunt and grow their food and make a nice shelter. Then they realized it was hard. They didn’t clean their water and they got sick. No car with chronic diarrhea equals dehydration, add hypothermia and dead.
This is bugging me. I'm thinking they didn't even make it to winter. Mountains can easily be in the 20's at night in the summer. The placement of everything seemed like they hadn't been fighting deep snow/drifts. The clothing certainly seemed more cold summer than winter. It wasn't even great for that. Not sure how the tent stayed up. I'm a little confused that animals didn't scatter them. I REALLY THINK the authorities need to run plates on all towed vehicles and follow up with families. It could have been stolen or indicated lost hikers.
the tent wouldn't have made it through the winter without someone knocking the snow off it. so they probably made it through most of winter, the last heavy snow at least, which could be as late as May in the area.
If someone was alive was alive deeper into the winter, that might explain the lack of animals, especially if the area smelled bad from whatever disease they had
they were so thin when they died and in their photos they were overweight. i truly wonder how long it would take to become that thin.
They got sick. There are many bacterial infections that will cause "hypovolimic shock." In a 6 hour time span, you will lose all the water from your body. It's super fast. You must have fluid in your body. If you don't, your heart can't pump, your kidneys can't function, your blood pressure goes down to the 40 range, and you die. It would explain mummified bodies. It would be very unusual for this to be food born illness. It comes from water, or an unknown virus, which is not bacteria. I almost died from it. Living in San Jose, California. Not camping, or living off grid. I just got sick one evening. Vomiting at first, but by 2am I was crawling to the bathroom for the 6th time, with clear water coming out of my butt. I was being mummified while alive. I crawled to the phone and got to emergency room. They stuffed 3 IV bags into me in 5 hours. My blood volume was was gone. I had very little pressure for my organs to function. They thought it was virus? Arsenic poisoning does exactly this. Anyway, it was never determined. There are areas in the Tahoe area off of Highway 50 where you can't use the water in winter. Not even to brush your teeth. You can't use the water.
They left civilization due to misinformation over a virus, only to die by another one. Poetic justice. Except that poor, poor boy. Absolutely wicked what those witches did to him.
Edit: I just read the second half of your post. I'm so sorry you went through that and glad you're ok now. Sounds absolutely terrifying!
@@Youser999 "Poetic justice" - You sound like a narcissist and/or sociopath
@@Youser999They we’re more ignorant than wicked.
@@Youser999 Where's the justice? You're talking out of your ass.
I don't feel the need to see any justice in this tragic death. They made the mistake of drinking water from a possible vector source. Or they ate an animal that had been poisoned with arsenic. I am so very sorry this happened. It is quick. Not super painful. By the fifth hour, you are half dead. It is that fast. So, you all need to remember stuff and keep it in your survival cap, even if you are home in a city. ❤️
Yeah, I live up in the Rockies and them picking Gunnison just really blows my mind precisely because it is known to be very snowy, very low temperatures, and harsh. I have to think they're original plan was to get something started and then leave, but they drank contaminated water and were suddenly too weak to do very much. What really surprises me though, is that the Park Service towed the car without trying to make sure that no one was still camping in the area? I don't want to assume they didn't look, but do we know if they did? Just wondering about what efforts were made on their part to find the owner of the car via VIN or license plate? Anyway, great video and thanks for making it!
Is it possible that even though the roads were plowed there was enough snow in the area that it could have prevented them from hiking down to the car? November seems a little early in the season, but I know in Arizona a lot of camping areas in the high mountains are closed for winter on November 1st because occasionally heavy snows will fall that early.
@@maxwellschneiter Our first winter in the Rockies we got 20 in (50.8 cm) before Halloween, so, yes, most definitely. And I believe Gunnison in particular is very cold & snowy during the winter, which really starts late Sep and goes to sometimes beginning of June, lol
Pretty sure it's just a case of two women being stupid and getting a child caught up in their idiocy.
I think any of us who have ever lived in the Colorado mountains immediately said WTF at the location of their campsite.
What do you think about there being no animal predation on the corpses? I would think the bones would be scattered and the tent/campsite disturbed, there’s so many little bits and pieces in this story that just don’t add up.
That the park rangers apparently didn’t contact the police (or if they did, that the police didn’t listen) when no one retrieved the car they towed after a week or two is insane. That really was a death sentence.
It really is. I'm no fan of pigs or any of the kind but I've hadn't for decades of experience in the northwest, I've never heard of forest service towing cars unless it's like blocking a road
Many people go hunting for weeks at a time or camping or hiking or for this various reason if somebody was injured you wouldn't remove a car which is literally bothering absolutely nobody in the middle of the mountains
Yes I thort that towing the car and not notifying someone was odd
I've seen parks that threaten towing after dark...what happens if I twist my ankle and take longer than expected? Shelter stolen, now I'll just freeze?
Most large parks will have you give them your name, cellphone number, and car description before heading out on the trails (at least where I live) so either they call you or send SAR out. But at the town park I work at they will lock the car in and or tow it if it is there past 10pm, but that is a park that is within a mile of a road at all points, and so far there have been multiple instances of people leaving their cars because they got drunk with buddies
So if ranger contacted the police and police tried to contact the owners who apparently didn't carry their cell phones and didn't tell their families where they went and no missing persons report was filed. That leaves police with nothing to follow up on.
I hate ads that show water in the mountains and say something like 'pure as a mountain stream.' They're anything but. I got seriously ill once in Colorado after drinking from a stream while on a hike. Luckily I was staying in a town and could get to medical care. I can't imagine what these folks were going through out there with no way out. So terrible.
It's way better than stagnant water, but a lot of people think that means it's clean when it isn't. The way I had it told to me by a survivalist type was that you shouldn't be afraid to drink it unsterilized if it's an emergency, not because it's safe, but because dehydration will kill you quicker than giardia and most other diseases will begin to show symptoms. Unless help comes, which it likely will, it will almost certainly just delay the inevitable. It's a hell of a thing
Damned (maybe) if you do, but definitely damned if you don't.
@@saudade7842
I was told by a guy that lived in colorado that the locals know not to drink the water off the mountain because it was poisonous. ( not from there, I grew up in MI and the rivers here don't come with that warning) I did google it before I posted. I'll copy and paste what it says. " Copper, arsenic, cadmium, mercury, zinc, and lead all occur naturally in the rock of Colorado's mountains; and mining and mineral processing can expose large quantities of them to erosion and runoff, resulting in potential contamination of nearby surface waters."
I didn't catch if they were locals or maybe the water purifiers weren't able to handle all of it or not working properly.
Water-borne GI illnesses were a leading cause of death historically, before you could get UV fluids and antibiotics. It used to kill a decent percent of all humans.
I live in Colorado. I have been to Gunnison and have a family member who attended Western University. Gunnison is known for ridiculously cold winters and getting snow fall that is absolutely absurd. But the summers are lovely as it sits in valley at a lower elevation than the mountains that surround it. It's unfortunate about this family and horribly sad. I've felt how cold it is up there and seen the snow. It's no joke.
Couldn’t agree more. I’ve lived in co my entire life and Gunnison can be a brutal place to stay at during winter.
They were relying on a Hyundai to get out with the snow?? They should have hiked out.
My bf almost got snowed into a canyon in Colorado. He was about seven miles from his car when the weather started to turn. He said that by the time he got back to his car, there was a foot of snow on the ground, and when he woke up the next day at his moms house, it was about eight feet deep. And the place he hiked into was REMOTE… he said he was barely able to find the main road and drive back to the highway.
My grandson's name is Gunnison! It is a beautiful area!
I forgot about that family. My mom lives in Colorado Springs and I live just north of Santa Fe, NM. While I have gone camping off and on for most of my life, and I have recently been watching bushcrafting videos, I know that as a 57 year old woman with diabetes that it's not something I could do, especially during the winter time. You're right that they were ill prepared for their new life, and it's a sad tragedy for their loved ones. Thanks for giving us the information.
How can anyone believe you can live in a tent in winter climate without experience and proper gear? Doing something like this in a remote place would be tough even with the proper preparation and gear, living like this even in summer with this little stuff would be risky. It must have been a real nightmare.
which make me wonder had they planned to leave before the snow?
My understanding is Rebecca had developed paranoia and conspiracy ideas .
She was the dominant one and wanted to go off grid. She believed watching UA-cam videos about survival would sustain them.
Very ignorant and ill prepared.
Because the adults here were severely insane and stupid (both).... Flee the grid is one thing... Live like a severely mentally ill (as in profound chronic and acute delusional psychosis not something like depression anxiety or PTSD) homeless person in the public park land. What these people did is not homesteading.. It was not living off grid. It was living like an insane homeless person. Living off grid means coming in with an RV, travel trailer or other living structure... Alternative would be to come in during warm season and complete build on a home before winter. A home does not mean a tent unless it's a tent complete with wood stove and long term construction, like a yert dwelling basically.....
Anti Vax nutnobs
There seems to have been some mental illness in the mix. And I have even seen YT comments where the person thinks that if they know a few plant names, watch survival videos and made a stick lean-to once, that means they can “live off the land.”
In the pandemic and unemployed, they may have come to legitimately try to live off grid, or thinking they could make “I built an off-grid shelter” videos themselves and get money that way.
If it's accurate that the boy died first and was moved out of the tent, I could also imagine the women committing themselves to exile. If they did plan to return at any point, how do you go back to your waiting family after that? How do you get back in your car, drive to your waiting loved ones, and tell them their beloved 14 year old son/brother/sibling/nephew/friend died in the woods and he's either left out there, or in the boot of the car?
If it were me, I don't know if I could do that. So if he did die first, their plans (if they had any) might have drastically changed.
You are spot on I think. But I also think they could have been worried about criminal charges. I’m not sure if any would or could have been brought, but since he was a child, I wonder if a child neglect resulting in death charge would have been brought against the mother if the mother and her sister had went back to civilization.
Yeah, it sounds like a situation that started off bad enough and spiraled quickly. Whatever delusions drove them to do this, we'll never really know but if they planned to leave before winter, can you imagine the enormity of discovering their way out was gone? Camping in the most temperate weather/area would still have been a challenge with their lack of supplies. They probably crawled to make it back to that car and get out. They more than likely knew they were dead as soon as they turned around to go back to the campsite. Brutal.
Agreed. If my son died, I would want to die too. So sad.
It's so cruel that their car was towed away.
I don’t want to speak ill of the dead, however the lack of education and basic bushcraft skills in these women is frightening. It was as if they had never even camped before in their lives. The biggest issue was not notifying a friend are family to where they were located. Also, I can’t get past the fact that they didn’t trust the government and wanted to “off grid”, so they set up camp on GOVERNMENT land?
The most devastating part of this case is the loss of the innocent child. This was child abuse and neglect. He trusted the adults in his life to care for him and keep him safe. Instead he froze and starved to death. The final days of his life were probably horrifying. Then his Mother and his Aunt drug his body out of the tent and left him outside alone. ALONE.
Bingo!
I also find it extremely sad that his body was left like that, outside of the tent. Not even any evidence of a ceremonial effort.
This kid was starved to death. This was not just an 'accident', this was a CRIME.
and supose they were just setting up camp and had their car towed?
@@user-xg3uy6hq9g
The truck had been there for a while by the time it was towed. What alarms me is that the park service didn't report it to the police or that the police didn't look into it further.
However... had I needed the car, but realized it was towed, I would have probably moved the camp site to the road so I could get help. This assumes that they were still in good health at the time it was towed AND they realized it was towed. (What did the journals state, if anything?)
@@user-xg3uy6hq9g Killing someone via shitty planning is still negligent homicde, especially if you are the guardian and the person is a minor. They could have left a note, told people where they were, had emergency communications, practiced in less harsh climates before going full moron, ect ect. Anyone getting their survival advice off tv, movies, or books without actually practicing it IRL before being in a survival situation is very, very dumb. Sadly youtube and tv have convinced dumb people it's easy because they saw it all happen in a 15 minute video.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negligent_homicide
This whole situation is not passing the smell test..something went terrible wrong....they obviously new at some point they couldn't handle the situation..if ur starving and get to the point were u know ur die..why not try to walk out..or leave a note..a journal..follow the rd u drove in back to wherever..either all 3 of them were the stupidest ppl to ever go camping..or they purposely ended their lives..hows there no note...no single fires...im gonna say they planned it..or atleast one of them planned to commit suicide...or maybe they were just very uneducated stupid ppl...maybe Bigfoot would not let them leave..either way its a interesting mystery ❤
Well nobody to face charge's,no wonder someone may run for the hills or off grid
We go camping a lot and that lean-to is exactly the type of thing my kids would build. I can picture the 14 year old building that to have his own space and privacy and keep himself occupied, all full of gung ho to begin with. Only to have something go terribly wrong. So sad.
25:10 They probably didn't take any cell phones. If the reason for moving off the grid was due to paranoia of government, then a trackable cell phone is the last thing they wanted.
Well, I may, or may not share their distrust of the powers that be, but this was just crazy. It's takes training, experience, and a lot of good gear to survive long term in the wild, especially during winter. You need proper clothing, a good quality cold weather tent, and a good source of food for everyone present. That tent looked like cheap crap that came from Walmart. They make great insulated tents that are made for wood burning furnaces and extreme temperatures. You also need good sleeping bags that are rated for the temperatures your going to be in. Also being a gardener myself, it's not just as simple as digging a hole, throwing in seeds, and a few days later you got delicious veggies. You've got to have proper soil, you've got to take care of the seedlings once they start growing with water and fertilizer and so much more. Theirs no guarantee that vegetables would even grow in that area. This is a tragedy that was completely avoidable and just sad.
Either way low intelligence or paranoid schizophrenic.
She was a nutcase. They never stood a chance.
You would think that if the forest service seen a abandoned car sitting in the same place for 2 months they would find it suspicious and would alert the authorities. I would have had concerns about the situation
I'm not surprised in tow-happy America. And not surprised they just shrugged and never gave it another thought.
@@scockery"tow happy America" sounds like someone's past due on their car payment
@@Dullahan161 I'm more referring to laws, ordinances, petty businesses and predatory towing companies. I know a guy who got his truck towed because he backed into a parking spot to unload stuff and left his pickup like that over night.
You would think, but people dump stuff in the wilderness all the time, and most park staff are overburdened and underpaid. I sure wish if someone saw my car sitting somewhere for that long that they'd call at least a few rangers to go poke around the vicinity, maybe yell into the trees that they're towing the vehicle to see if anyone came out.
🤣@@Dullahan161
They sold all their possessions and couldnt buy better equipment and more food? Like wtf?
And they barrowed $500 From their father for supplies.. 🤷
Plus they stole stuff from relatives. The adults were absolute numbskulls.
Flee the grid is one thing... Live like a severely mentally ill (as in profound chronic and acute delusional psychosis not something like depression anxiety or PTSD) homeless person in the public park land. What these people did is not homesteading.. It was not living off grid. It was living like an insane homeless person. Living off grid means coming in with an RV, travel trailer or other living structure... Alternative would be to come in during warm season and complete build on a home before winter. A home does not mean a tent unless it's a tent complete with wood stove and long term construction, like a yert dwelling basically..... Any sane person buys the land and sets it up .
@@TruthistrashMost of the insane homeless people in my town at least live close to the shelters. Except for one lady. She lived in a small thicket behind a Kroger. I guess she was fine for years, people knew her, but she was harmless and allowed to stay. They found her frozen to death last year. She was right by help.
@@carlycrays2831 she probably had little she wanted to live for
So they arrived in August when that area is stunningly beautiful and may have decided, lets live here. They had lived in Colorado Springs not too far away but the springs gets a lot less snow than the mountains do. So they decided to try out living there in August. The Forest Service kindly let the car stay there either hoping someone would come back for it or having tried to contact the registered owner but got no response of course. Also no missing persons report was filed so at that point it just looks like an abandoned car. They probably did check the trails nearby but found no evidence of hikers in distress. So no reason to look any further.
The camp they made was at 10,000 feet of altitude which requires 2-3 liters of water per day per person. That's a lot of water to carry to and fro and filter especially at that altitude. They may have gotten impatient and drank some of the water right out of the creek or stream exposing them to infection. Then there's altitude sickness. Added to dragging yourself out of your tent to go to the bathroom due to stomach sickness and you have a real exhaustion situation, even if you do have enough food, which they didn't. Ironically they were surrounded by pine trees whose bark can be boiled to make a medicinal tea that could have helped them get over the stomach sickness, as long as they didn't continue to drink the unfiltered water. Seems like all 3 were sick at the same time so all were at reduced capacity and just slowly slipped away. Very sad.
Thanks for another well-researced video!
If paranoia played a role in their decision to live off-grid, I can imagine them leaving their phones behind intentionally. That could also explain why they hid the details of their plan, even from family members.
This is such a sad, cautionary story. I appreciate you taking a respectful look at it.
What an incredibly sad video. I wish there was an emergency phone at least near the car area to call for help. RIP to all three people.
I live on a very popular lake. Last year a family from Chicago were vacationing and rented a pontoon boat. They left the dock and hadnt been out for five minutes when one of the older male passengers decided to jump off the boat and into a lake that is 150 ft deep. They recovered his body the next morning. His family said he didnt know how to swim. He thought the water looked safe. People do dumb things and you sometimes just have to scratch your head.
How can water look safe if you can't swim?
No family members that knew he couldn’t swim jumped in to save him? That is weird.
@@caseyj779 No its not. there is a demographic in society where learning how to swim isnt in their curriculum. There were no able swimmers on the boat.
@@harrycarrey5124 Okay then why were they out in a boat with nobody that can swim? That in and of itself makes no sense. Also boats are required to have life jackets for everyone on board. I know this because I have a boat that I have went out on the water in several states with. It still is very strange to me. Also what demographic is it that we are not teaching how to swim? I would really like to know why we are failing children in that way. Knowing how to swim is very important. It can flood anywhere and even the best swimmers can lose their lives. If someone doesn’t know how to swim at all they will for sure parish if it were to flood. Are our ymcas no longer offering swim classes for kids?
Feel sorry for the boy ,, bless him
My parents have a vegetable garden and I have learned that there’s a time and place when to plant vegetables.
Some vegetables don’t mind a late frost, others a late frost would kill them.
Carrots can stay in the ground after a frost, but I know from experience that it’s a pain in the neck to get them out of the frozen ground in one piece.
Rebecca no doubt overestimated how easy it would be and possibly in her paranoia, didn’t believe that the place was going to be as harsh as it was during the Winter, or, as you suggested, the plan was never to stay for the Winter and when they discovered the car gone they became stranded.
I can't even imagine how difficult it would be to establish a vegetable patch in virgin bushland. The ground would probably be rock hard and filled with roots and the soil would be incredible impoverished. If you could dig up a bit of dirt and bung some seeds in, you might get something to grow, but it wouldn't be abundant, healthy and heavily cropping plants. I guess that, since the police don't appear to have found any attempted garden, that it was an idea that was abandoned as soon as they put spade to soil and found it impossible to dig.
@@carolyns99 very true, we helped spread manure, bone meal and blood meal in new vegetable patches to help the soil be more nutritious and remove rocks and clumps up grass; and this was from fields that had either been pasture or garden patches when my dad was young.
One garden area had been a garden almost consistently for over forty years, fifty plus years now, and we were still finding and removing rocks from it.
And we had the help of machines to till the ground and not doing it by hand.
Gardening is hard work. I would have to double check with my dad, but I believe that he plowed the new plot in the fall the year before so there wasn’t as much grass, and I don’t think he expected much from the new plots either.
Not only that, but most vegetables don't grow in high-altitude Colorado. The ground can be frozen in the mountains for 9 months a year, nights can be frosty even in the summer, the soil is mostly mineral and not organic, and even if you got something to grow, animals would promptly eat it. @@carolyns99
@@carolyns99 It's *very* hard work. An old friend of mine lives semi-off grid in Northern Ontario, and every summer he grows a gorgeous garden around his cabin. But it's not enough for him to live off of; it's more a money saving suppliment, and something he loves to do. And it's a *LOT* of work. The first season he started it, he had to dig up all the land he wanted to use, then bring in extra topsoil and manure, because the area he'd cleared just wasn't the kind of soil that veggies would grow well in. Then came figuring out the best timing and placement for every different crop, and the neverending challenge of keeping the local wildlife from eating his food before he can! It needs constant weeding, watering, and other care. There's been a lot of trial and error. He's also learned a lot from the local tribal elders (of which he just became one!) about traditional ways to keep hungry insects away, and bigger pests, too. But for all the drawbacks, he loves his garden, just like he loves his cabin in the woods and his peaceful life out there.
@@thing_under_the_stairs I certainly get that. I have a corner block which is mostly garden and large amount of that is vegie plots. I have a fenced block, a good climate, good soil and access to heaps of free seaweed to keep it fed - but it's hard work nevertheless.
Despite not being in tip top physical health, I keep at it because I love fresh vegies and I want to be able to supplement the dry foods I have stored away should the world go insane (again). But there is no way I could keep us (just hubby and me) fed much above starvation level (if at all) if all we had was the garden to live off.
With an established, sheltered, garden and years of experience I still have plenty of failures. It's great that more people are realising the need to start a garden but I fear some UA-cam videos give a very unrealistic idea to beginners. In this case, sadly, it may well have contributed to a tragedy.
As an indigenous Australian I learned how to live off the land from my elders whose knowledge came from their elders in an unbroken line that spans over 60 thousand years and it amazes me that people think they can gain the same knowledge after watching a few UA-cam videos
Do you drink gasoline?
What ??
Experience is necessary, they had little, if any.
many people fail to appreciate how indigenous populations literally evolved along with their lands. for example, the genome of Inuits shows specific mutations to aid survival in the bitter cold of the North, that rarely show up in non-Inuits
This is the first video of yours that I've watched. I'm impressed. You speak clearly and are empathetic to the people in the story. Thank you for telling their story so kindly. As sad as this story is, watching your video about it was a delight. Keep up the good work.
Once you take the mental illnesses/paranoias of the adults into account, its understable that no preventive measures where taken for the case they needed to leave (phones, car, check-ins, etc) because the adults clearly didn't want to be found. The paranoia wouldn't allow them to.
Its heartbreaking to see a child died because of that.
9:53 is it just me or is the cops’ silence making it significantly more eerie?
If I wanted to live off grid, I would buy I decent camper van with a solar generator to produce power and renewable energy. A tent is insanity. You need to be able to call for help or leave a note explaining you will be back. Sad that she didn't prepare. Especially for the 14 year old.
👍
Sick with giardia, a lack of real calories and no experience with cold weather camping, they may have been dead by the early fall when temperatures first dropped. People who have never cold weather camped do not understand how cold it gets and how you cannot escape the cold.
The car battery would have been dead by the time it was towed anyway, it would not have helped.
But the car could have proved shelter, even it's battery was dead.
@@AS-qg1xu The inside of a car will reach the same temperature as the outside within an hour unless you have a heat source. There is no insulation, and they're known to be a death trap in cold temps. You are better off crawling under a pile of leaves.
@@jaybirdtapsnracks3460 thank you. I didn't know this.
I don’t understand how they thought they could just live off grid with no source of food and a little tent? This case saddens me!
I think there was some mental illness involved.
They brought vegetable seeds. So sad.
Insane that the forest service would tow a vehicle without even trying to see if people were camping nearby. They should be charged with negligence or something, because no one who lives in Colorado would underestimate Rocky Mountain winters enough to think that a tent like that would keep them alive through the winter. I can't even fathom the despair they must have felt when the boy died.
That huge clump of hair was really freaky though. It practically looked like a whole scalp!
Severe hair loss can be caused by malnutrition and a lot of weight loss. They didn't say who it belonged to. Possibly the boy's hair if they tried to drag him out of the tent by the hair.
Bruh it was a 16 year old Hyundai and it probably looked like a piece of shit lol of course they towed it. Thousands of cars are abandoned every day, they can't go combing every square inch of surrounding area to look for the owner. These 2 women were clearly insane and just plain stupid, so they definitely thought they could live in a tent like that
@@elonever.2.071oh my gosh, the poor boy.
Well written and well delivered sir. I have been waiting for comprehensive coverage of this strange and haunting story.
These people literally crapped themselves to death -expiring from the effects of diarrhea induced dehydration and malnutrition. Giardia was likely passed back and forth by touching contaminated items as it is highly likely person hygiene in such a setting had become lax. Seen too many people decide to live “off grid” with no research about the place they are moving to, or any other basic preparedness end up sick, tired and worn out living a life they put no preparation into. Truth is modern life is the only hedge against natural selection for a lot of people.
😶 your last sentence reminds me of ‘industrial society and its future’
Natural selection is the kinda the reason we have modern society if u think about it, we evolved to live in larger tribes with everyone working together.
It’s always a good time to watch The Missing Enigma. Keep up the great work man, take care and have a great weekend!
What an amazing amount of evidence you put into every story it is like a detective level of research. Well done
I wonder what he does for his career? He’s so articulate.,I often try to figure out what he does. He’s super intelligent. I would love to know more about him. Such a great channel!
This doesn't look like a bug out camp, even if they weren't well versed in survival even one book on survival would have had enough knowledge to make a proper latrine and shelter, and look at the tree branches not burned for warmth, so I think that they may have been poisoned, but beaver fever would do it along with the cold but I think that it was madness that killed them.
I have viewed all your episodes, and am continually amazed and appreciative of your journalistic approach. This story is not only sad, but should be a cautionary tale for those considering similar lifestyle choices. Thank you for your well thought approach to this, and all your segments. I am a fan for life!
I am impressed, as always, to see the amount of effort and thought that you put into researching your videos. I also appreciate your non-sensational, dignified and respectful approach to telling these stories. An excellent presentation as always.
Thank you for covering this case. Your in-depth research, analysis, and compassion are unparalleled.
Wow! From what the campsite looked like, these people werent even prepared for a weekend camping trip, let alone self sustaining "off grid" living..
WTF were they thinking?
I find it odd that animals didnt eat these bodies, didnt seem to even touch them.. What a sad situation.😢
Authorities dropped the ball. There should’ve been a small search or at the very least found out who the vehicle belonged to. Under any circumstance why would a car be left in the middle of the Rockies?
I get what you are saying, but in this case, the "authorities" are the US or State Forest Service, who are not really a law enforcement branch. They see abandoned stolen cars and such fairly often on remote forest service roads, and probably believed the car to be one. Perhaps, in future, a document could be affixed to each vehicle and a period of time allowed for owners to reply as to the situation of said vehicle.
Now, if said vehicle was left there over the winter instead of being towed in November, I believe, Just how likely is is the car would have even been able to get through the snow to safety or to go and get supplies? Several feet of accumulated snow is common in the mountains of Colorado, and a front wheel drive car isn't going to be able to go through anything over something approximating a foot (.3 meters) of snow. Could it have been used as a warming point? Yes, until the fuel ran out, after that, it's just a shelter.
Ultimately, a tragic Lack of communication and experience is what happened to these people, and their situation could have been prevented with good communication and more experience and preparation.
Colorado is very thievy. Auto theft is common everywhere here.
@@Operator8282 not saying they are not at fault but there is a responsibility to ensure the safety of people in the park. If it is a stolen car wouldn’t you want to see whose car it is that got stolen? Wouldn’t you want to check to see if there is a thief that’s hiding stolen items in the woods? Very basic measures were not taken.
@@Dollsteak69 ^
@@K11cj I was pretty sure National Parks operate at an "Enter At Your Own Risk" sort of level. The rangers and volunteers can educate you, and tell you where to not go and what to not do, but they don't patrol the parks to make sure people are safe.
Love your channel TME but not too sure about this video's sponsor to be brutally honest. Are they even qualified to be telling people what kind of therapy they need if any? Anyway apart form that I love your content. Thanks again.
This is the first time watching your channel and I really enjoyed it, and especially the end of it the way you’re telling people to be aware of what you watch on, UA-cam, that a lot of these things are edited and omitted. You’re doing a great job.
Thank you for making this video. I live in CO and saw a vague article about this in the news and was perplexed why there was not more coverage for it and always wondered what had happened. There was also 2 women who recently went missing in CO natl forests over the summer. Think that is also largely unsolved.
Keep on keeping on, Enigma.
Wish all of you a healthy and productive weekend!
Delighted to see a new show from Missing Enigma. I really appreciate your work.
IMO hypothermia creeps up on people. By the time they think they need help, they’re not making the best decisions.
And after too long you grow numb to it, or the cold can even start to feel hot (hence why some hypothermia victims undress shortly before death). One of the scariest books I've read is called "to Build a Fire" by Jack London all about the dread and horror of hypothermia
RIP to those 3 lost souls
I enjoy that you show yourself in your videos for the most part because it lets me know you are not just another Robot Generated site and you are very good and leave no stone unturned . Thank You 🎯
This is such an excellent video. Thank you for doing all the work to bring us these tough lessons.
Always superior content! Thank you!
Very sad case. I can attest to the fact that videos on UA-cam do not show you all the hardships. That was a very good point that I never considered with my own channel. I'm still new in the bushcraft/camping/hiking scene on UA-cam and have not been into for all that long (4 or 5 years). As I learned I made the mistake of thinking things would be easier than they actually are. In the cold weather I especially had some bad nights. I've since learned more, but still could not even imagine trying to survive a winter in those conditions.
I can guarantee you they had no intention to go back to their car or bring cellphones. Rebeca thought the government was after her and didn’t want to be found. She was stupid and didn’t know what she was doing and got her child killed.
Schizophrenia left untreated and unchecked
@@Balrog-tf3bg Absolutely
That’s very sad.
Where does the guarantee come from?
@@eventhorizon7234 The fact that they did not have cellphones with them at the camp. They didn’t just go missing for no reason. And her family said she was paranoid.
Love what you do. The reporting is top notch. I could listen to you for hours.
Great video, and respectful as always.
This sounds like a case of mental health issue. They don't sound like they were prepared.
The best creator on UA-cam is in the house!!
Thank you for your hard work.
Once I heard that there was ample evidence of canned food and Ramen noodles, my heart sank. Canned food weighs a lot, so there is a limit as to how much can be comfortably packed anywhere. Ramen noodles are great for carbs but have the nutritional value of heavily salted styrofoam. With that kind of diet, and clearly no knowledge about things like filtering water, hunting/fishing skills, even the know-how to just dig a basic, uhm, pit for waste....land just a flimsy nylon tent for shelter.... they just didn't stand a chance. RIP.
It's so heartbreakingly sad, especially for the boy. My heart breaks thinking of him.
Thank you so much for another awesome video. These stories are so sad and strange.
It’s a good day when Missing Enigma posts a new video!
Especially when it’s 2am
As always, a pleasure to watch.
Thanks for your honest and non-judgemental coverage of this incident. I hope it will help someone in the future.
It is so sad that one sick person caused three lives. Even a life of a poor boy. What hell he had to experience before he died. Very ill, weak, malnourished, with heavy diarrhea... none of that made those two adults look out for a help? :-( Even the auntie did think initially that there is something wrong with her sister. Yet, she decided to follow her instead of stopping her and save the boy. He was failed by both. Sadly, this is not a first case where a few people died after being mentally brainwashed by a mentally unwell individual. The poor boy!!!
Very sad, very sad story.
Well-made clip again. Thanks!
These women were not playing with a full deck
You always do such a great job with these videos! Thank you so much!!
Been waiting too long!! Great content!
What a strange case. They were clearly unprepared and I'll equipped to survive for any time in the wild. They must have realised pretty quickly that it wasn't working out so why did they not revise their plans and seek better arrangements? Toilet arrangements in the wild are well known and you never relieve yourself near camp or water sources. It's not paranoid to mistrust any government these days so I doubt Rebecca's paranoia was pathological. Such a tragic case.
👍
You don’t just decide to live off grid,when you have no clue how to do it. You have a lot of skills to learn and do,to be proficient at it. I’m surprised they weren’t eaten by bears or other forest critters.
I'm so impressed with guy. It seems he's so balanced. Great intentions with making the video, as to educate, inform and guide people about these realities. Also open-minded and unjudgemental. Nice! I live off grid and self sufficient and there's just so many different levels to it. besides different skill sets and equipment, extensive knowledge of flora and fauna, you also need to understand the spesific environment. Proper dwellings are important also.
I can see it where the mom and other woman got sick and the kid didnt want to leave them. When the food ran out, he maybe got scared or just didnt know what to do when his mom died so he just sat down until HE died. So very sad 😢
The video says most likely he died first in the tent,hence no shoes and was removed from the tent by the other two.
I would think that if the 14 yo was not physically ill (like I believe they were from either the water or something) he would have hiked into town. That's if they weren't being prevented by extreme weather conditions.
Love your channel bro!
Makes no sense. I often wish I could "run away" and live off the land but I don't like to hunt animals so I know that wouldn't last long. They should have gone in and out of somewhere for a time working on some kind of shelter at least. Can't live off grid in just a tent. At least move to the campground to get help when someone shows up.
Amazing video thank you!
I just started seeing a therapist and I'm glad I did. They help you put some things in perspective.
Where is the footage shown found? I am unable to search anywhere to find the raw footage on this case, nor recorded information.
Someone please answer me this in case I missed it. I thought there were journals found. If they were, were they journals about them or more like journals used for notes on how to do things? When i hear journals I tend to think personal journals/diaries. Perhaps the police do not want to reveal what were in the journals...idk. But I would love to know.
My thoughts to! 🤔
I am always blown away by the quality of your information.
Good coverage
Anyone know where the unblurred footage is??