I have no comment on this book or series, but your commentary on YA vs Adult fantasy was interesting. It reminded me of Le Guin, being a female author, also having Earthsea pinned as YA, whereas I feel it's more like "Ageless fantasy": compelling for young readers, but very deep and rewarding for adults. What YA fiction do you recommend?
I completely agree about Le Guin. Earthsea may be the least YA series that has been categorized as YA. I mentioned in my Earthsea video that many of my college students struggle to understand A Wizard of Earthsea. I think part of the issue was that, back in 1960's, anything fantasy was automatically considered for children (something that really irked Tolkien). But I also agree that Le Guin being a woman had something to do with it. One of my favorite "YA" series is His Dark Materials by Philip Pullman (the first book being The Golden Compass). I don't think Pullman necessarily wrote it with YA in mind, but it gets marketed that way, probably because the protagonists are children. A classic for me would be C.S. Lewis's Narnia Chronicles. Christopher Paolini's Inheritance Cycle (book one being Eragon) is a nice introduction to many fantasy tropes for younger readers. One that my daughter and I both read a while back is Children of Blood and Bone by Tomi Adeyemi. And, of course, how could I not include the Harry Potter books? And how about The Hobbit? Finally, I would say A Darker Shade of Magic is a great YA book, and I'm going to encourage my younger daughter to read it. That's a very partial list, to be sure, and I don't consider myself extremely well read in YA fantasy. I'm sure some viewers could add a lot to the list.
I also haven’t read this book but the talk about YA and how the can make the sexual themes subtle, I think a very good example Is the golden compass/northern lights and the whole his dark materials series.
NotcarlXD42eii o's I definitely agree. As I mentioned above, His Dark Materials is one of my favorite YA series. It’s one example of a series that works for younger and older readers because it has a story and protagonists that younger readers find engaging but also contains sophisticated themes that keep older readers going.
Terry Pratchett is an author that underlines Philip's point perfectly - none of the Discworld books have graphic violence, sex, or really even strong language, but it's the complexity of the themes, references and language itself that place it into adult fiction. He also has multiple YA books, and those easily just as good. Another good one is Joe Abercrombie - lots of sex, violence and cursing in his adult novels, with everything being toned down in his Shattered Sea YA series. Garth Nix has several series that straddle the borders. The Keys to the Kingdom is middle grade/YA to my mind, but still fun. While his Sabriel series is YA/adult, and a great read too.
Rob Paul I hadn’t thought of Pratchett’s Discworld books in this context, but that’s an excellent point. So much of the best humor in those books would have gone over my head when I was a kid (there was no YA category back then), but they’re a blast now. I’m curious about Abercrombie’s YA foray. I love his adult fantasy, so I should give those books a try at some point.
Thank you! The YA/adult fantasy conversation is an interesting one, I think, especially as it's not something with a clear boundary. It's even problematic to talk about it in terms of age since there are some very mature younger readers who can handle more complex stories as well as some older people who enjoy the relative simplicity of YA books.
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy also, I think for some people, YA is a pejorative. It's definitely not MY thing, but I don't think YA equals low quality.
@@TheLibraryofAllenxandria I agree -- some people do think YA means low quality, but YA serves an important purpose, and there are some great YA books. Not only that, but I bet sales of YA fantasy are bigger than sales of adult fantasy (I don't know that, but call it a hunch).
I just read this book. I feel the same way about it as you do. Honestly it was kind of meh. I thought the concept of the different Londons and the whole magic system was great and had huge potential, but I didn't really get enough world building to fully enjoy it. I felt like the characters were all fairly surface level, with the minor exception of Kell and Lila. I actually really didn't like Lila at all. To me, her character felt sort of 'not-like-other-girls' and I found her personality was constantly changing. She also came across as rash and fairly selfish. She is 19 in the story, and I myself am also a 19 year old girl. Despite that, I did not feel any kind of connection to her character. This is one of my best friends favorite series, so I'll probably end up reading the whole trilogy, but if it weren't for that I'm not sure I would continue with it. Great video!
Thank you, Soomin! I really wanted to love this book, and while I liked it, I didn’t love it. Since you’re reading on for your friend’s sake, I’d be grateful if you’d let me know what you think once you’ve finished. Perhaps it improves? Best wishes!
I’ve had this book sitting on my Kindle for a few years now but kept putting it off for some reason. Thank you for your great review! Sorry for spamming your earlier videos - just trying to catch up on your backlist! :)
Navi Sahota Your comments are not spam at all - quite the contrary! I’m grateful that you would watch and comment on any of my videos, and I always welcome your insights. Thank you!
Hi there! 🤗 While I can see what you mean when you say that the Dane twins are underdeveloped and can seem a bit "flat" I'd like to encourage you to pick up the next book in the series. The characters gain more personality in my opinion while we learn more about their motivations and backstories and for my taste the setting is getting more engaging with each book. I read mostly adult fantasy and I agree with you that ADSOM would be better described as a more mature YA. Just discovered you through Elliot Brooks and really like your channel! Have a great day!
Bookish Kathy Thank you! I’ve been hoping someone would tell me something like this, so I’m glad to hear that you feel like the books improve. There was a lot to like about the first book, like the setting, and I thought the two main characters had some potential to become really interesting. So, your endorsement has given me a reason to rethink whether I’ll continue- thank you!
Great review and intro once again . I used to read a lot of YA when I was in my teens, but now that I am an adult I rarely read any YA(and is a big reason why I won't pick up a book). The real world is raw, brutal and complex and YA books seldom contain these elements which is the main reason why I do not enjoy YA books as much. However, YA books are the reason why I am a constant reader today so there is definitely nothing wrong with these types of books. I just don't enjoy them that much but I am always open for suggestions.
J Djurholm Honestly, I enjoy YA books most when I’m reading them with my daughters - well, just my younger daughter these days since the older one is nearly 23 and doesn’t read YA any longer. But you’re absolutely right that YA books serve some really important functions, and one is to make readers out of young people. One trilogy often billed as YA that I highly recommend is His Dark Materials, the trilogy by Philip Pullman that begins with The Golden Compass (completely ignore the awful movie they made on it). It has two children for protagonists and is entertaining, but it also has some very sophisticated themes. Great to hear from you, as always!
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasyThanks for the reply! I loved His Dark Materials as a teen. I enjoyed the story but probably missed some of the underlying themes. If I ever get children I might re-read this series for them.
YA books tend to have less complexity, flat characterization, too many of the same tired tropes, and a lack of originality. Not for me. But if they get teens to read, I'm happy they're out there! As always, good review, Mr. Chase. Keep flipping those pages, sir.
Robert Hall Thanks! I think you summed it up pretty well for me too, though I have had loads of fun reading YA type books with my daughters. I’m flipping away! (the pages, I mean)
Haven’t read the series but it sounds interesting. Format wise, I think this is your best review. You’re getting a lot more comfortable in front of the camera!
The Serpent Thank you! Yes, I felt good about the format of this one too. Still room for improvement, but it’s a work in progress. A Darker Shade of Magic is solid YA reading, in my opinion. I’m recommending it to my daughter, and it could be a light break from some heavier stuff.
Loved the Elven! Once again good review! May I suggest you read and review Traitor's Blade the first in the Greatcoats series written by Sebastian De Castel. Would be very interesting to hear your thoughts on this Alexandre Dumas inspired Novel/ series.
That's great to hear that you enjoyed the Elven, and thank you! I think Mike over at Mike's Book Reviews has been reading the Greatcoats series, right? Your description of it as inspired by Dumas grabbed my interest right away, especially since I just read The Three Musketeers last year. It's officially on my radar now, so thank you!
I never did read beyond A Darker Shade of Magic, though a couple people did assure me that the series improves. I would, however, like to try some other books by Schwab.
I’ve always enjoyed the premise of this book but I haven’t gotten into it just yet. I’m a big fan of V.E Schwab’s Vicious series. I’d say it is YA because it isn’t the most complex of stories but it’s on the side of older YA due to the amount of violence. I glad you spoke on the differences between YA and Adult fantasy but didn’t necessarily say one is worse or better than the other. I think a lot of times people miss out on great stories because they feel the book won’t be sophisticated or detailed enough for them.
Joe's Review Journal Thank you! YA most definitely serves an important function, and I’m guessing that the audience for YA fantasy is bigger than the audience for adult fantasy, so anyone would be mistaken to dismiss YA. It’s unfortunate that, for some people, the YA label carries a negative connotation. I’ve had a great time reading some YA books with my daughters and on my own. Always great to hear from you!
Enrico Zangari Thank you! I’m excited to make the video too - it’s a rare chance to use some of the work I did twenty years ago while writing my PhD dissertation. I promise not to make it too dry, though!
I saw that. Those are very popular and renowned books. Hope to see one on less popular books like maybe, the mysterious benedict society , the nevermore series, storm crow series by Kalyn Josephson, and one very interesting series call Amberlough dossier series by Lara Elena Donnelly , last magician by Lisa Maxwell and also Legend series by Marie Lu etc. 😁
You hit the nail on the head with your review. I heard great things about this book and wanted to give it a go. Perhaps its the series that was good, but seriously it only got good in the last two hours of reading. I'll give it 3 of 5 stars and I will not be reading any more of this series...
There were some interesting concepts in the book, but I never felt like any of them were developed in a way that I found satisfying. Best wishes for your next read!
I agree with you that the difference between YA and adult fiction lies primarily in its complexity and not so much in its subject matter. There are books about children and teenagers written for adults, which doesn't make these children's fiction or YA, mainly because of the psychological details. A lot of classic fantasy I would classify as YA, including Tolkien, Robert E. Howard, Moorcock's Elric stories, Wagner's Kane stories, David Gemmell (Legend), Terry Goodkind (Wizard's First Rule) and also Trudi Canavan (The Magician's Guild), although I guess she's not "classic fantasy" since her first fantasy novel was published in 2001. And I suspect The Wheel of Time and Mistborn are YA, although I haven't read them yet. But I also have the impression that most fantasy published today is YA, there is a lot of contemporary/urban teen fantasy out there, with incredible sales. It's great that you're discussing so much mature stuff, we need more of that. Thanks again.
My pleasure! Some people might bristle at the suggestion, but I mean nothing negative when I say that Mistborn, and Sanderson’s Stormlight Archive, definitely feels like it has at least one foot on the YA side of fantasy. Sanderson has done a lot for the genre by bringing in readers, and YA books play an important role. That said, I think it’s important to be upfront about which books are more mature and complex so that readers know what to expect.
I agree this book is definitely YA, and honestly I would not recommend the second or the third books. I thought the first book was just average but because of the positive reviews I decided to try the second book as well. And it's mainly just filler. A lot of mysteries that were set up in the first book are not explained in any of the books, and if you want a complex story this series is not really the best option. This was the first video of yours I've seen, and it was very good! Also love your shirt :)
Thank you! I really wanted to love A Darker Shade of Magic, but, for the reasons I mentioned, I didn’t feel compelled to keep going in the series. I’ll probably try something else by Schwab, though - I hear good things about Vicious. It’s great to hear from you, and thanks for watching and commenting!
I agree with you that A Darker Shade of Magic feels more YA for a lot of it. Particularly the villains as you said. I found this book to be a bunch of fun. I will probably continue on with the series.
I agree that it’s fun. In my case, I’d like to try other stories by Schwab. I’ve heard good things about some of her other books, so I’m going to give them a try eventually. Thanks for watching and commenting, Gregory!
This is a series that’s high on my list. I want to start alternating between female & male authors. So I’ve already picked this series up and it’s just waiting for me to get done with some other series.
Tyler Black Nice! I hope you’ll enjoy it. I liked it, and I’m telling my daughter she should give it a try. I’d love to hear what you think once you’re into the series. By the way, I think it’s awesome that you’re alternating between female and male authors - good way to expand your horizons.
I wish I had watched this video before deciding to read this book! I find the labels of "young adult", "new adult" and "adult" confusing; your explanation of the difference being that of complexity is incredibly helpful! One thing that really turned me off A Darker Shade of Magic is something I've observed in other fantasy novels, even though I'm new to the genre. Supposedly "strong" female characters (e.g. Lila) demonstrate traits of what we now call "toxic masculinity", e.g. a refusal to admit any vulnerability, feelings of rage whenever they think someone pities them (i.e. feels empathy toward them), a quick temper with the knee-jerk reaction to any unpleasantness being to threaten or mete out violence (e.g. Lila wanting to attack anyone who she perceives as insulting her, Nynaeve from Wheel of TIme hitting pretty much everyone who annoys her; I think even, to a lesser degree, Molly and Althea from Robin Hobb's books are like this). I am quickly becoming addicted to your channel - thank you for your great videos! 🙏
Thanks, Heather! You make an excellent point - toxic behavior isn’t cool no matter the gender of the character. Lila’s behavior at times was awful, and I’m pretty sure many would have viewed it as inexcusable from a male character, no matter how difficult his circumstances. I’m happy that you’re enjoying the videos!
Love your reviews. Great content as always. I wanted to pick this series but what to do there are so many books to read. I did finish the The Immortals of Meluha by Amish Tripathi (Shiva Trilogy). It is an amazing book you should read that one. I will begin the second book soon I wanted to take a break from it and read a standalone novel.
GAUTAM CHAWLA Would you believe that I just ordered the Shiva Trilogy today? The Immortals of Meluha will be on my next TBR video - I’m very excited to read it! Thanks, as always, for watching and commenting!
Good review. I always heard mixed things about this series, guess they were correct. Do you plan on doing any sci-fi book reviews in the future or is your only focus on fantasy?
Judge Holden Thanks! I don’t consider myself very well read in sci-fi, though I definitely like certain authors, like Dan Simmons and Frank Herbert. My academic background is that I’m a medievalist (Old English, Middle English, Old Norse), and I’ve also studied comparative mythology a bit, so fantasy feels more like my wheelhouse, or my playground perhaps. That’s a long way of saying that I’ll likely stick to fantasy. Great to hear from you, as always!
I have been hearing alot of good reviews about this book and author. I'm interested in a read through, especially if the first book can work as a stand alone. Unsure if I will get to it soon as im in the middle of WoT and am checking out Tad Williams Memory, Sorrow and Thorn series as he has inspired a lot of the Fantasy giants of the modern day. The issue with YA is that I feel like publishers want to slap it on any book they possibly can in order to broaden the appeal in marketing. YA sells very well and a lot of parents don't think twice about letting their kid pick up any YA book since well its YA and ment for a younger audience. Ya is just too broad in that it can be a book written for a middle schooler or a book written for a college freshman or sophomore or a book never intended to be YA by the author. These are very different demographics being marketed to and categorized in the same way. Its like some YA books are comparable to the Disney channel while others are more like the CW. The use of language, plot lines, stories, complexity, structure and over all feeling are just wildly different. It's because of this weird marketing that I've shyed away from the YA section. Thats not to say YA writing is bad. There's plenty of great writing in the YA genre. The problem is publishers exerting to much control in an attempt to maximize profit. The authors most often don't get a say when it comes to marketing their book. To a point that makes sense as authors aren't marketing experts, and are very emotional invested in their work, but once the intended audience changes and other potentially sexist trends arise in the industry it can typecast the author, their work and how they are represented. If the Hobbit was written and published today would it be marketed as YA since it was written with a younger audience in mind, with more simplistic language? Somthing about that just seems off.
D A Excellent points! I think at the heart of what you’re saying is the fact that the YA category began essentially as a marketing tool. You’re also on target when you say that definitions of YA are all over the place. Personally, I tend to enjoy complexity in what I read, unless I’m reading with my daughter or going for something light. I don’t read a lot of YA, but, whatever it is, it has some usefulness as a category since I’m going to have different expectations of a book if I know it’s YA ahead of time. Spot on about The Hobbit, which probably wouldn’t be published today since publishers are far more scared of taking chances. Enjoy WoT and Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn - I love them both. Thanks for the excellent comments!
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy You hit the nail on its head when you mentioned publishers not wanting to take chances. The core purpose for them is to make money and familiarity sells. I think we have all read a great book (me with a game of thrones series) and then looked for books like that one to read after. This is how I found Tad Williams. I was talking to my friend who was getting annoyed at pop music for being short, repetitive, and simple. He called it catchy crap. He listens to prog rock and wants to hear more of that on the radio. I told that the whole reason for pop being repetitive, short and catchy is so that new listers can know a song on the first or second listen, enough to sing along. They are more likely to like what they know and buy the cd or grow an affinity for the artist. Its hard to do that with a 10 min prog rock song on your first listen, let alone get the air time for it on the radio. Pop industry producers want to produce music provern to sell that builds familiarity very fast with new potential consumers that sounds like other music they have bought. Any large industry will do something similar. Their infinite growth model wouldn't work if they kept on taking chances with unproven entities in the marketplace that aren't familiar to the consumer and don't fit their formats constraints. With any product, books or pop music, what releases and how it's marketed relates heavily to the BCG matrix. A star changes with differnt market trends but the thing that stays constant is the want companies have to produce stars and avoid dogs. So alot of familiar work is produced and its harder for unique work to be put out as its uncertain to sell or have a relatively big market share. While the matrix is primarily used to judge products on the market, marketing experts will judge a not released product by the current market trends. So the BCG matrix and how products fall on it are influencing what gets produced. I think many authors are placed into YA to turn their potential question mark in the marketplace into a potential Star by mere association even if it doesn't fit that particular book. Its also a genre that is somewhat looked down on. An average or not so good book in YA can be passed by an adult reader as fine or good since it ment to be read by a kid while a really good book in YA would probably exceed expectations and be praised even more than if it were not YA. Lets take the Hunger Games. Great series by a great author but I think I wouldn't have liked it as much if it weren't considered YA. I would have have different expectations going in and been more critical of the world building, amongst other things. As bad as it sounds people do have lower expectations when reading and judging YA and it can and often works in a books favor, which is good from a publishers perspective.
D A More great insights here! The pop music analogy is quite apt. Going with the proven formulas produces a lot of repetition with little imagination but provides a certain amount of safety. Unfortunately, that sort of thinking is certain death for good writing (and music and art). It’s sad to think we’re so limited creatively by this huge entity we call “the market”, and it makes it really hard for new voices to be heard, but there have always been individuals who find ways to work around the status quo and introduce something thoughtful and refreshing. Great point too about how people tend to be kinder when a book is hiding behind the YA label. I can’t disagree with you there, but I still feel like there’s a place for books marketed to younger readers. Among other things, they can help form habits in younger people that lead to a lifetime of reading. Still, you’re right that there’s plenty to be skeptical about the way YA books are marketed. Great to read your thoughts!
Bcz of everything you have said in this video, I have been on the fence about picking up this series. It doesnt feel convincing enough for my tastes so far. PS: Have you read Wheel of Time? Would love to hear your thoughts on that!
Anish Kohli Yes, I’ve read Wheel of Time. While I consider it one of the greatest achievements in fantasy, I have a couple small criticisms, but I highly recommend it. I have a video review of the series as a whole if you’d like to watch it. It’s a big commitment, but we’ll worth it!
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy I have started WoT and I am well into book #3. While I am so far really enjoying what is going on, I am starting to worry if it is as formulaic as Harry Potter, where a showdown between the chosen one and the big bad happens at the end of each book.
Anish Kohli WoT is somewhat formulaic, and it leans on familiar tropes like the chosen one. That said, it handles the tropes well, and there are some surprises. It’s also a much more mature read than Harry Potter, of course, and the world building is incredibly rich with some fairly complex and conflicted characters.
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy I don't mind tropes as long as they are well done. And I am already seeing that the world building is very good, along with character that are interesting. I just am more concerned about that end of book showdown between Rand and Dark one being repeated in every single book for all 14 books. Bcz that will wear thin really fast 😅
Sorry, cannot help motivate you to read on. 😅 Agree with most everything you said, and nothing about it grabbed me or made me want to pick up anything by Schwab again. Though I'm tempted by the premise of another series by her.. the Vicious one. Darker Shade, however, was just a bad book to me, wether it was YA or adult.
Rob Paul I really wanted to like A Darker Shade of Magic, and it was okay. I’m even recommending it to my younger daughter, but I’m afraid you’re basically right. I’ve heard good things about Vicious. Perhaps worth a try.
DNF this book in Chapter 1. I was knocked out of immersion by such a glaring stupidity that it stunned me, for a minute and totally diverted me from any interest in this story. In chapter one, it is clearly stated that, 'In order to pass between these worlds, you must go through a door made with a symbol drawn in your own blood. The exact same symbol needs be on both sides of this door and both sides are essentially the exact same location in two parallel worlds.' So, in oder to go to World B from World A you have to already have been to world B and set up a door mark. ?!?!? So, HOW did this ever start??? How did anyone ever travel if you need to have been there in order to go there? >FACEPALM< If the author meant to say that the 'Best' way or the Easiest Way or the Preferred way... she didn't So my confidence in this author whom I had no prior experience with drops to Zero. If you are the kind of person who doesn't notice such things or prefers to overlook them, enjoy! I just cant spend my time on such things.
Llywylln Gryffyn Yes, that does sound a bit sloppy. As I said in the video, I didn’t get the impression that Schwab had really thought through or developed the magic. I was more bothered by the flatness of the secondary characters, though. There are some fun aspects to the book, but, like I said, I won’t be continuing with the series. Thanks for commenting!
Enjoyed the review. Have considered picking up this series. I may get to it, but there are quite a few other books/series that take precedence. On book 10 of WoT Malazan Full read of Robin Hobb RoTE Book of the Ancestor (currently on book 1) Brian Lee Durfee’s series On and On ... :)
I can't argue against any of those books! That's a big problem I have as well -- there are too many wonderful fantasy books and series out there for me to get to them all. I guess that's actually a good problem, though. I love WoT, Malazan, and the Farseer Trilogy (I'll be reading more Hobb soon). I haven't read Book of the Ancestor or Durfee's books yet. As you say, on and on. . .
I have no comment on this book or series, but your commentary on YA vs Adult fantasy was interesting. It reminded me of Le Guin, being a female author, also having Earthsea pinned as YA, whereas I feel it's more like "Ageless fantasy": compelling for young readers, but very deep and rewarding for adults. What YA fiction do you recommend?
I completely agree about Le Guin. Earthsea may be the least YA series that has been categorized as YA. I mentioned in my Earthsea video that many of my college students struggle to understand A Wizard of Earthsea. I think part of the issue was that, back in 1960's, anything fantasy was automatically considered for children (something that really irked Tolkien). But I also agree that Le Guin being a woman had something to do with it. One of my favorite "YA" series is His Dark Materials by Philip Pullman (the first book being The Golden Compass). I don't think Pullman necessarily wrote it with YA in mind, but it gets marketed that way, probably because the protagonists are children. A classic for me would be C.S. Lewis's Narnia Chronicles. Christopher Paolini's Inheritance Cycle (book one being Eragon) is a nice introduction to many fantasy tropes for younger readers. One that my daughter and I both read a while back is Children of Blood and Bone by Tomi Adeyemi. And, of course, how could I not include the Harry Potter books? And how about The Hobbit? Finally, I would say A Darker Shade of Magic is a great YA book, and I'm going to encourage my younger daughter to read it. That's a very partial list, to be sure, and I don't consider myself extremely well read in YA fantasy. I'm sure some viewers could add a lot to the list.
I also haven’t read this book but the talk about YA and how the can make the sexual themes subtle, I think a very good example Is the golden compass/northern lights and the whole his dark materials series.
NotcarlXD42eii o's I definitely agree. As I mentioned above, His Dark Materials is one of my favorite YA series. It’s one example of a series that works for younger and older readers because it has a story and protagonists that younger readers find engaging but also contains sophisticated themes that keep older readers going.
Terry Pratchett is an author that underlines Philip's point perfectly - none of the Discworld books have graphic violence, sex, or really even strong language, but it's the complexity of the themes, references and language itself that place it into adult fiction. He also has multiple YA books, and those easily just as good.
Another good one is Joe Abercrombie - lots of sex, violence and cursing in his adult novels, with everything being toned down in his Shattered Sea YA series.
Garth Nix has several series that straddle the borders. The Keys to the Kingdom is middle grade/YA to my mind, but still fun. While his Sabriel series is YA/adult, and a great read too.
Rob Paul I hadn’t thought of Pratchett’s Discworld books in this context, but that’s an excellent point. So much of the best humor in those books would have gone over my head when I was a kid (there was no YA category back then), but they’re a blast now. I’m curious about Abercrombie’s YA foray. I love his adult fantasy, so I should give those books a try at some point.
I really enjoy your reviews. I also really liked the commentary on categorization at the beginning!
Thank you! The YA/adult fantasy conversation is an interesting one, I think, especially as it's not something with a clear boundary. It's even problematic to talk about it in terms of age since there are some very mature younger readers who can handle more complex stories as well as some older people who enjoy the relative simplicity of YA books.
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy also, I think for some people, YA is a pejorative. It's definitely not MY thing, but I don't think YA equals low quality.
@@TheLibraryofAllenxandria I agree -- some people do think YA means low quality, but YA serves an important purpose, and there are some great YA books. Not only that, but I bet sales of YA fantasy are bigger than sales of adult fantasy (I don't know that, but call it a hunch).
I just read this book. I feel the same way about it as you do. Honestly it was kind of meh. I thought the concept of the different Londons and the whole magic system was great and had huge potential, but I didn't really get enough world building to fully enjoy it. I felt like the characters were all fairly surface level, with the minor exception of Kell and Lila. I actually really didn't like Lila at all. To me, her character felt sort of 'not-like-other-girls' and I found her personality was constantly changing. She also came across as rash and fairly selfish. She is 19 in the story, and I myself am also a 19 year old girl. Despite that, I did not feel any kind of connection to her character. This is one of my best friends favorite series, so I'll probably end up reading the whole trilogy, but if it weren't for that I'm not sure I would continue with it. Great video!
Thank you, Soomin! I really wanted to love this book, and while I liked it, I didn’t love it. Since you’re reading on for your friend’s sake, I’d be grateful if you’d let me know what you think once you’ve finished. Perhaps it improves? Best wishes!
I’ve had this book sitting on my Kindle for a few years now but kept putting it off for some reason. Thank you for your great review! Sorry for spamming your earlier videos - just trying to catch up on your backlist! :)
Navi Sahota Your comments are not spam at all - quite the contrary! I’m grateful that you would watch and comment on any of my videos, and I always welcome your insights. Thank you!
Hi there! 🤗
While I can see what you mean when you say that the Dane twins are underdeveloped and can seem a bit "flat" I'd like to encourage you to pick up the next book in the series. The characters gain more personality in my opinion while we learn more about their motivations and backstories and for my taste the setting is getting more engaging with each book.
I read mostly adult fantasy and I agree with you that ADSOM would be better described as a more mature YA.
Just discovered you through Elliot Brooks and really like your channel! Have a great day!
Bookish Kathy Thank you! I’ve been hoping someone would tell me something like this, so I’m glad to hear that you feel like the books improve. There was a lot to like about the first book, like the setting, and I thought the two main characters had some potential to become really interesting. So, your endorsement has given me a reason to rethink whether I’ll continue- thank you!
Great review and intro once again .
I used to read a lot of YA when I was in my teens, but now that I am an adult I rarely read any YA(and is a big reason why I won't pick up a book). The real world is raw, brutal and complex and YA books seldom contain these elements which is the main reason why I do not enjoy YA books as much. However, YA books are the reason why I am a constant reader today so there is definitely nothing wrong with these types of books. I just don't enjoy them that much but I am always open for suggestions.
J Djurholm Honestly, I enjoy YA books most when I’m reading them with my daughters - well, just my younger daughter these days since the older one is nearly 23 and doesn’t read YA any longer. But you’re absolutely right that YA books serve some really important functions, and one is to make readers out of young people. One trilogy often billed as YA that I highly recommend is His Dark Materials, the trilogy by Philip Pullman that begins with The Golden Compass (completely ignore the awful movie they made on it). It has two children for protagonists and is entertaining, but it also has some very sophisticated themes. Great to hear from you, as always!
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasyThanks for the reply! I loved His Dark Materials as a teen. I enjoyed the story but probably missed some of the underlying themes. If I ever get children I might re-read this series for them.
J Djurholm That’s an excellent plan - it’s so much fun reading to kids.
YA books tend to have less complexity, flat characterization, too many of the same tired tropes, and a lack of originality. Not for me. But if they get teens to read, I'm happy they're out there! As always, good review, Mr. Chase. Keep flipping those pages, sir.
Robert Hall Thanks! I think you summed it up pretty well for me too, though I have had loads of fun reading YA type books with my daughters. I’m flipping away! (the pages, I mean)
Haven’t read the series but it sounds interesting. Format wise, I think this is your best review. You’re getting a lot more comfortable in front of the camera!
The Serpent Thank you! Yes, I felt good about the format of this one too. Still room for improvement, but it’s a work in progress. A Darker Shade of Magic is solid YA reading, in my opinion. I’m recommending it to my daughter, and it could be a light break from some heavier stuff.
Philip Chase sounds good. My TBR is booked for MONTHS so I’m not trying to add to much more on, lol
The Serpent I know the feeling! Too many great books to read - a wonderful problem, though.
Philip Chase yes, it’s a fantastic problem to have
Loved the Elven! Once again good review! May I suggest you read and review Traitor's Blade the first in the Greatcoats series written by Sebastian De Castel. Would be very interesting to hear your thoughts on this Alexandre Dumas inspired Novel/ series.
That's great to hear that you enjoyed the Elven, and thank you! I think Mike over at Mike's Book Reviews has been reading the Greatcoats series, right? Your description of it as inspired by Dumas grabbed my interest right away, especially since I just read The Three Musketeers last year. It's officially on my radar now, so thank you!
I so agree
I have not nor wish to finish the book
Would you say it is worth watching as a base for the other books in the series would you say?
I never did read beyond A Darker Shade of Magic, though a couple people did assure me that the series improves. I would, however, like to try some other books by Schwab.
I’ve always enjoyed the premise of this book but I haven’t gotten into it just yet.
I’m a big fan of V.E Schwab’s Vicious series. I’d say it is YA because it isn’t the most complex of stories but it’s on the side of older YA due to the amount of violence.
I glad you spoke on the differences between YA and Adult fantasy but didn’t necessarily say one is worse or better than the other. I think a lot of times people miss out on great stories because they feel the book won’t be sophisticated or detailed enough for them.
Joe's Review Journal Thank you! YA most definitely serves an important function, and I’m guessing that the audience for YA fantasy is bigger than the audience for adult fantasy, so anyone would be mistaken to dismiss YA. It’s unfortunate that, for some people, the YA label carries a negative connotation. I’ve had a great time reading some YA books with my daughters and on my own. Always great to hear from you!
Tom Chubby This is the first time I’m hearing of the New Adult category. Makes sense, and thanks for mentioning it!
I'm so looking forward to the origins of fantasy video! Great review as always. :)
Enrico Zangari Thank you! I’m excited to make the video too - it’s a rare chance to use some of the work I did twenty years ago while writing my PhD dissertation. I promise not to make it too dry, though!
Enjoy your reviews. Hope you will do a video on YA fantasy books and which one to start off with for those going into YA fantasy. 😁
Chen Keith That’s a great idea! I’ve done a video with my younger daughter on great introductions to fantasy, which is similar to a YA video.
I saw that. Those are very popular and renowned books. Hope to see one on less popular books like maybe, the mysterious benedict society , the nevermore series, storm crow series by Kalyn Josephson, and one very interesting series call Amberlough dossier series by Lara Elena Donnelly , last magician by Lisa Maxwell and also Legend series by Marie Lu etc. 😁
Chen Keith Excellent suggestions!
You hit the nail on the head with your review. I heard great things about this book and wanted to give it a go. Perhaps its the series that was good, but seriously it only got good in the last two hours of reading. I'll give it 3 of 5 stars and I will not be reading any more of this series...
There were some interesting concepts in the book, but I never felt like any of them were developed in a way that I found satisfying. Best wishes for your next read!
I agree with you that the difference between YA and adult fiction lies primarily in its complexity and not so much in its subject matter. There are books about children and teenagers written for adults, which doesn't make these children's fiction or YA, mainly because of the psychological details. A lot of classic fantasy I would classify as YA, including Tolkien, Robert E. Howard, Moorcock's Elric stories, Wagner's Kane stories, David Gemmell (Legend), Terry Goodkind (Wizard's First Rule) and also Trudi Canavan (The Magician's Guild), although I guess she's not "classic fantasy" since her first fantasy novel was published in 2001. And I suspect The Wheel of Time and Mistborn are YA, although I haven't read them yet. But I also have the impression that most fantasy published today is YA, there is a lot of contemporary/urban teen fantasy out there, with incredible sales. It's great that you're discussing so much mature stuff, we need more of that. Thanks again.
My pleasure! Some people might bristle at the suggestion, but I mean nothing negative when I say that Mistborn, and Sanderson’s Stormlight Archive, definitely feels like it has at least one foot on the YA side of fantasy. Sanderson has done a lot for the genre by bringing in readers, and YA books play an important role. That said, I think it’s important to be upfront about which books are more mature and complex so that readers know what to expect.
I agree this book is definitely YA, and honestly I would not recommend the second or the third books. I thought the first book was just average but because of the positive reviews I decided to try the second book as well. And it's mainly just filler. A lot of mysteries that were set up in the first book are not explained in any of the books, and if you want a complex story this series is not really the best option. This was the first video of yours I've seen, and it was very good! Also love your shirt :)
Thank you! I really wanted to love A Darker Shade of Magic, but, for the reasons I mentioned, I didn’t feel compelled to keep going in the series. I’ll probably try something else by Schwab, though - I hear good things about Vicious. It’s great to hear from you, and thanks for watching and commenting!
I agree with you that A Darker Shade of Magic feels more YA for a lot of it. Particularly the villains as you said. I found this book to be a bunch of fun. I will probably continue on with the series.
I agree that it’s fun. In my case, I’d like to try other stories by Schwab. I’ve heard good things about some of her other books, so I’m going to give them a try eventually. Thanks for watching and commenting, Gregory!
This is a series that’s high on my list. I want to start alternating between female & male authors. So I’ve already picked this series up and it’s just waiting for me to get done with some other series.
Tyler Black Nice! I hope you’ll enjoy it. I liked it, and I’m telling my daughter she should give it a try. I’d love to hear what you think once you’re into the series. By the way, I think it’s awesome that you’re alternating between female and male authors - good way to expand your horizons.
Philip Chase I will follow up on how I like it!
I wish I had watched this video before deciding to read this book! I find the labels of "young adult", "new adult" and "adult" confusing; your explanation of the difference being that of complexity is incredibly helpful! One thing that really turned me off A Darker Shade of Magic is something I've observed in other fantasy novels, even though I'm new to the genre. Supposedly "strong" female characters (e.g. Lila) demonstrate traits of what we now call "toxic masculinity", e.g. a refusal to admit any vulnerability, feelings of rage whenever they think someone pities them (i.e. feels empathy toward them), a quick temper with the knee-jerk reaction to any unpleasantness being to threaten or mete out violence (e.g. Lila wanting to attack anyone who she perceives as insulting her, Nynaeve from Wheel of TIme hitting pretty much everyone who annoys her; I think even, to a lesser degree, Molly and Althea from Robin Hobb's books are like this). I am quickly becoming addicted to your channel - thank you for your great videos! 🙏
Thanks, Heather! You make an excellent point - toxic behavior isn’t cool no matter the gender of the character. Lila’s behavior at times was awful, and I’m pretty sure many would have viewed it as inexcusable from a male character, no matter how difficult his circumstances. I’m happy that you’re enjoying the videos!
Love your reviews. Great content as always. I wanted to pick this series but what to do there are so many books to read. I did finish the The Immortals of Meluha by Amish Tripathi (Shiva Trilogy). It is an amazing book you should read that one. I will begin the second book soon I wanted to take a break from it and read a standalone novel.
GAUTAM CHAWLA Would you believe that I just ordered the Shiva Trilogy today? The Immortals of Meluha will be on my next TBR video - I’m very excited to read it! Thanks, as always, for watching and commenting!
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy That is so cool. Happy Reading
Good review. I always heard mixed things about this series, guess they were correct.
Do you plan on doing any sci-fi book reviews in the future or is your only focus on fantasy?
Judge Holden Thanks! I don’t consider myself very well read in sci-fi, though I definitely like certain authors, like Dan Simmons and Frank Herbert. My academic background is that I’m a medievalist (Old English, Middle English, Old Norse), and I’ve also studied comparative mythology a bit, so fantasy feels more like my wheelhouse, or my playground perhaps. That’s a long way of saying that I’ll likely stick to fantasy. Great to hear from you, as always!
I liked seeing your Thangkas in the background :)
Thank you! I enjoy them too, and perhaps they add a meditative element to the video.
I have been hearing alot of good reviews about this book and author. I'm interested in a read through, especially if the first book can work as a stand alone. Unsure if I will get to it soon as im in the middle of WoT and am checking out Tad Williams Memory, Sorrow and Thorn series as he has inspired a lot of the Fantasy giants of the modern day.
The issue with YA is that I feel like publishers want to slap it on any book they possibly can in order to broaden the appeal in marketing. YA sells very well and a lot of parents don't think twice about letting their kid pick up any YA book since well its YA and ment for a younger audience. Ya is just too broad in that it can be a book written for a middle schooler or a book written for a college freshman or sophomore or a book never intended to be YA by the author. These are very different demographics being marketed to and categorized in the same way. Its like some YA books are comparable to the Disney channel while others are more like the CW. The use of language, plot lines, stories, complexity, structure and over all feeling are just wildly different. It's because of this weird marketing that I've shyed away from the YA section. Thats not to say YA writing is bad. There's plenty of great writing in the YA genre. The problem is publishers exerting to much control in an attempt to maximize profit. The authors most often don't get a say when it comes to marketing their book. To a point that makes sense as authors aren't marketing experts, and are very emotional invested in their work, but once the intended audience changes and other potentially sexist trends arise in the industry it can typecast the author, their work and how they are represented.
If the Hobbit was written and published today would it be marketed as YA since it was written with a younger audience in mind, with more simplistic language? Somthing about that just seems off.
D A Excellent points! I think at the heart of what you’re saying is the fact that the YA category began essentially as a marketing tool. You’re also on target when you say that definitions of YA are all over the place. Personally, I tend to enjoy complexity in what I read, unless I’m reading with my daughter or going for something light. I don’t read a lot of YA, but, whatever it is, it has some usefulness as a category since I’m going to have different expectations of a book if I know it’s YA ahead of time. Spot on about The Hobbit, which probably wouldn’t be published today since publishers are far more scared of taking chances. Enjoy WoT and Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn - I love them both. Thanks for the excellent comments!
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy You hit the nail on its head when you mentioned publishers not wanting to take chances. The core purpose for them is to make money and familiarity sells.
I think we have all read a great book (me with a game of thrones series) and then looked for books like that one to read after. This is how I found Tad Williams.
I was talking to my friend who was getting annoyed at pop music for being short, repetitive, and simple. He called it catchy crap. He listens to prog rock and wants to hear more of that on the radio. I told that the whole reason for pop being repetitive, short and catchy is so that new listers can know a song on the first or second listen, enough to sing along. They are more likely to like what they know and buy the cd or grow an affinity for the artist. Its hard to do that with a 10 min prog rock song on your first listen, let alone get the air time for it on the radio. Pop industry producers want to produce music provern to sell that builds familiarity very fast with new potential consumers that sounds like other music they have bought. Any large industry will do something similar. Their infinite growth model wouldn't work if they kept on taking chances with unproven entities in the marketplace that aren't familiar to the consumer and don't fit their formats constraints.
With any product, books or pop music, what releases and how it's marketed relates heavily to the BCG matrix. A star changes with differnt market trends but the thing that stays constant is the want companies have to produce stars and avoid dogs. So alot of familiar work is produced and its harder for unique work to be put out as its uncertain to sell or have a relatively big market share. While the matrix is primarily used to judge products on the market, marketing experts will judge a not released product by the current market trends. So the BCG matrix and how products fall on it are influencing what gets produced.
I think many authors are placed into YA to turn their potential question mark in the marketplace into a potential Star by mere association even if it doesn't fit that particular book. Its also a genre that is somewhat looked down on. An average or not so good book in YA can be passed by an adult reader as fine or good since it ment to be read by a kid while a really good book in YA would probably exceed expectations and be praised even more than if it were not YA. Lets take the Hunger Games. Great series by a great author but I think I wouldn't have liked it as much if it weren't considered YA. I would have have different expectations going in and been more critical of the world building, amongst other things. As bad as it sounds people do have lower expectations when reading and judging YA and it can and often works in a books favor, which is good from a publishers perspective.
D A More great insights here! The pop music analogy is quite apt. Going with the proven formulas produces a lot of repetition with little imagination but provides a certain amount of safety. Unfortunately, that sort of thinking is certain death for good writing (and music and art). It’s sad to think we’re so limited creatively by this huge entity we call “the market”, and it makes it really hard for new voices to be heard, but there have always been individuals who find ways to work around the status quo and introduce something thoughtful and refreshing. Great point too about how people tend to be kinder when a book is hiding behind the YA label. I can’t disagree with you there, but I still feel like there’s a place for books marketed to younger readers. Among other things, they can help form habits in younger people that lead to a lifetime of reading. Still, you’re right that there’s plenty to be skeptical about the way YA books are marketed. Great to read your thoughts!
Bcz of everything you have said in this video, I have been on the fence about picking up this series. It doesnt feel convincing enough for my tastes so far.
PS: Have you read Wheel of Time? Would love to hear your thoughts on that!
Anish Kohli Yes, I’ve read Wheel of Time. While I consider it one of the greatest achievements in fantasy, I have a couple small criticisms, but I highly recommend it. I have a video review of the series as a whole if you’d like to watch it. It’s a big commitment, but we’ll worth it!
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy I have started WoT and I am well into book #3. While I am so far really enjoying what is going on, I am starting to worry if it is as formulaic as Harry Potter, where a showdown between the chosen one and the big bad happens at the end of each book.
Anish Kohli WoT is somewhat formulaic, and it leans on familiar tropes like the chosen one. That said, it handles the tropes well, and there are some surprises. It’s also a much more mature read than Harry Potter, of course, and the world building is incredibly rich with some fairly complex and conflicted characters.
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy I don't mind tropes as long as they are well done. And I am already seeing that the world building is very good, along with character that are interesting. I just am more concerned about that end of book showdown between Rand and Dark one being repeated in every single book for all 14 books. Bcz that will wear thin really fast 😅
Anish Kohli I see your point! But no worries - the books vary in their endings, and you will see the scope broaden as well.
Sorry, cannot help motivate you to read on. 😅
Agree with most everything you said, and nothing about it grabbed me or made me want to pick up anything by Schwab again.
Though I'm tempted by the premise of another series by her.. the Vicious one.
Darker Shade, however, was just a bad book to me, wether it was YA or adult.
Rob Paul I really wanted to like A Darker Shade of Magic, and it was okay. I’m even recommending it to my younger daughter, but I’m afraid you’re basically right. I’ve heard good things about Vicious. Perhaps worth a try.
DNF this book in Chapter 1. I was knocked out of immersion by such a glaring stupidity that it stunned me, for a minute and totally diverted me from any interest in this story. In chapter one, it is clearly stated that, 'In order to pass between these worlds, you must go through a door made with a symbol drawn in your own blood. The exact same symbol needs be on both sides of this door and both sides are essentially the exact same location in two parallel worlds.' So, in oder to go to World B from World A you have to already have been to world B and set up a door mark. ?!?!? So, HOW did this ever start??? How did anyone ever travel if you need to have been there in order to go there? >FACEPALM< If the author meant to say that the 'Best' way or the Easiest Way or the Preferred way... she didn't So my confidence in this author whom I had no prior experience with drops to Zero.
If you are the kind of person who doesn't notice such things or prefers to overlook them, enjoy! I just cant spend my time on such things.
Llywylln Gryffyn Yes, that does sound a bit sloppy. As I said in the video, I didn’t get the impression that Schwab had really thought through or developed the magic. I was more bothered by the flatness of the secondary characters, though. There are some fun aspects to the book, but, like I said, I won’t be continuing with the series. Thanks for commenting!
Enjoyed the review. Have considered picking up this series. I may get to it, but there are quite a few other books/series that take precedence.
On book 10 of WoT
Malazan
Full read of Robin Hobb RoTE
Book of the Ancestor (currently on book 1)
Brian Lee Durfee’s series
On and On ... :)
I can't argue against any of those books! That's a big problem I have as well -- there are too many wonderful fantasy books and series out there for me to get to them all. I guess that's actually a good problem, though. I love WoT, Malazan, and the Farseer Trilogy (I'll be reading more Hobb soon). I haven't read Book of the Ancestor or Durfee's books yet. As you say, on and on. . .
Storyline sounds complex. Might not be a good series to start for YA fantasy. 😊
Chen Keith Perhaps older YA, or what they’re calling “new adult” these days. Lots of categories!
Eeeey I was the 69nth viewer, noice
Hahahaha