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- Опубліковано 14 жов 2024
- An update on the Quick 861DW, and probing its current consumption in comparison to the Atten 858D+ with the TTi I-Prober
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I agree that the flickering lights is likely due to the light design and not the Quick. We have multiple workstations all running Quick861DW during Practical Board Repair School week, in a crappy old building in New York State on 120VAC similar to Louis's shop. We have no problems with flickering from the Quicks, but one of our students that bought the Quick have reported flickering when back at home.
iPad Rehab I have a couple different LED lights in my home lab. Some of them flicker when I use triac based heaters, and some don't.
It is odd that the JBC at full tilt does no flickering though from the same outlet.
could it be the duty cycle that the triac switches at or possibly an inductance induced by the heating element design?
But is it in the same position on your bench? If it's radiated interference then the placement of the device matters more than the outlet it's plugged into. I noticed that you said the Hakko caused flickering too and you had it right next to where you had the Quick. Also, the JBC may have some kind of shielding around it's element.
Wait--Didn't you change to LED lights? That could be the variable. Ours are still old school fluorescent tubes and incandescent--because.....you know what I think of LED lights!
If you're seeing 7-8amp load at 240v, that would mean roughly double the amps at US 120v. That pretty much maxes out the average branch circuit here in the US, 15-20amp depending on the breaker. Probably exactly explains the flickering lights if they are on the same circuit as the lighting. Not to mention whatever else may be on that same branch circuit
Either that or it's just a shitty design light to begin with?
I thought lights should always be on their own lower current circuit for safty since people (grandma etc.) fiddle with the bulbs.
Doug Kahler: AGREED. The first time I saw Rossman rattling on about the lights dimming, an apprentice electrician could see the Quick was simply loading the circuit. Nothing mysterious. I see it all the time in old buildings.
Simon Ashton probably depends on that electrical code Louis' place was built under. I've seen all kinds of different amperages used. My apartment built in the 60s has 20amp breakers for all the 120v outlets, high current 240v stuff like AC, Stove, Clothes dryer all have 60amp breakers. The house I grew up in built in the 80s had 15amp breakers for all the 120v stuff. My grand parents house had the old lamp socket screw in type fuses, literally like 4 fuses for the entire house rated at 15amp each I think. No idea when that house was built. Commercial is obviously going to be somewhat different from residential. Based on how Louis describes the place I'd bet the electrical is kinda dated
Simon Ashton - Lights are always on an entirely separate circuit here in Oz, both domestic and commercial.
Flickering lights is most likely volt-drop on the mains within his property, especially if it's on the end of a long run from the consumer unit / fusebox.
Most light dimmers use phase control as ON/OFF control would lead to unacceptable flicker.
I think Louis's problem is high resistance mains wiring. 1-2kW bursts that the Quick draws is causing mains voltage to dip.
I was surprised to see both Quick and Aten use ON/OFF control rather than phase control.
Phase control gives much lower current spikes and much finer control at the expense of higher RF emissions.
Yes, I was also surprised to see non-phase switching. And yes, higher RF emissions are the result of the sharp edges in phase control.
Problem with phase control is that is hard to make it compliant for high current loads. Biggest problem is distortion power factor which is highly regulated in most of countries, in EU for example there are maximum permissible harmonic current limitations for devices that can be sold to general public (professional equipment with input power P > 1 kW have no limitation but professional equipment is defined as: "Professional equipment for use in trades, professions or industries and which is not intended for sale to the general public.").
And in this case it would not make much more difference, heating element have big enough thermal inertia (mass and heat capacity) so phase control will not give much finer control, it would produce negligible gain.
Phase control is noisy and completely unnecessary for something like a heater since it will respond quite slowly.
Yep, and cycle control is easier - you only need an optoisolator with zero crossing detect built in to fire your triac. Cheap as chips
it is often forbidden by regulation for heater loads. Although it would cause less visible flicker.
So the key difference between the Quick and other 1000W loads is that the Quick is really a 2000W load being turned off and on in an intermittent and unbalanced pattern. So anything that would blink once from turning on a 2000W resistive load will blink from the Quick. The asymmetry probably makes things worse, as there's a big unwanted DC component to the load.
Heater element design will influence how evenly heated the air is, but the same power going into the same airflow will end up at the same temperature after it's mixed, the efficiency is always going to be 100%. Poor coupling will just make the element run hotter/burn out faster. Ideally you put some screens after the heating element, so you get well mixed air with very little turbulence.
People always try to put some magic or high science in basic things just to excuse higher prices, latest since the invention of religions. I haven't seen any hot air station that has that much room on the heating element that the air wouldn't be heated effectively, that happens only if the airflow is too fast, this is a very basic and logic procedure which you can watch on every water heater that uses propane or other burning gas, as more water flows as higher are the flames. I love EEVBlog and Dave just for his accent, but this comparison got worse with the second video, it doesn't make the Quick look better, but the Atten worse and worse, but this is absolutely unfair, this thing is just fantastic if you think about how cheap it is. A bigger station by Ayouye or whatever they call them, with built in turbine in the main housing would be fair and would show if the Quick is worth it. Just because Weller etc. is more expensive doesn't excuse the price of a cheaper brands, if a Ayouye etc. can do the same performance for lower price. Finally this stuff is all produced in China where people get all the same wages, so you just make the owners of China Inc. richer if you buy more expensive stuff, that isn't seriously better than cheaper ones, but the cheaper ones show that it is possible to produce it cheaper and prove just the increase of the profit.
Wilson - Oh FFS, the Atten *is* worse than the Quick in practically every aspect except price. So what? Why is that "unfair"? It is what it is.
If you want a cheap hot air station then buy the Atten.
Because it is a completely different class, like I wrote in detail Dave. This reminds me of how car magazines in Germany make VW look bettet than other cars, just compare for example an old rusty Ford Ka with a brand new VW Phaeton so the VW will win in every aspect except price, but this is for the most people the most important part, the price-performance ratio. I know it's about the Quick but why you need to make the Atten worse than it is if its just a Review of the Quick? And no, none of them have what I need, not even JBC with their huge colored touchscreens and millions of submenus, so I build myself one, but using this "cheapo" handle, just some little settings and this thing works perfectly, I bought new heating elements with the handle around two years ago and still didn't need one of them.
The amount of time air is in contact with the heating element is an intermediate consideration, not a goal. Turbulence near the heating element will improve coupling between the heating element and the air, but if you have a design that mixes the air after the heating element, you don't necessarily have to care. Things you want to accomplish with the design are keeping the heating element in a temperature range it can tolerate, uniformly heating the air, having laminar flow exiting the nozzle, and accurately controlling the temperature.
I notice that from the Quick scope traces that the TRIAC control doesn't always switch on alternating halves of the mains cycle i.e. a positive half cycle is sometimes followed by another positive half cycle. This may produce a DC current draw on the mains input. It would be interesting to put DC ammeter on the input mains to see if there is any consistent DC current draw. This may have an effect on other equipment connected to the same circuit. Also, supply authorities are usually very unhappy with any equipment that draws any significant DC from the mains supply.
there are many hairdryers which use a diode for their low power setting. e.g. 1200W/600W. It seems to be not that big problem in reality .
You guys might want to checkout the Quick 957DW+ runs about $119.99 I recently bought one and it's a really well built unit I would suggest this model over any other cheap hot air station out there
That one would be ways closer to a fair comparison and would show if you just pay the name or serious difference.
Quick makes some nice stuff I would stay away from all those cheap sub $100 stations I did a lot of looking before I bought the 957DW+ it's the nicest station for the least amount of money out there, basically I would just avoid any of the hot air stations that have the fan in the handle and get one with an internal pump.
Regarding the lights flickering, I have to answer "yes and no" to the question of whether the lights are at fault. Of course design elements of the lights contribute significantly, especially if they're LED bulbs. LEDs are nonlinear devices and with poor regulation on the input, are very susceptible to flicker and smaller variations in voltage. I have tried and owned several varieties of LED bulbs from 100W replacements, 40W & 80W fluorescent tube replacements, as well as a very nice and bright LED drop light/work light I purchased from the Homeless Despot. Some are far more susceptible than others, the drop light is definitely one of the most sensitive.
I have a 1500W or so Ryobi heatgun that I believe also uses a triac for pulsing the power to the heating element, and especially if plugged into the outlet on the drop light, the flickering is not something you can ignore (especially upon initial warmup). There is also another more common source of LED lights flickering that never seems to bother incandescents or fluorescents. I have a 5HP rated air compressor. The motor draws about 28A at full load. The compressor unit obviously cycles at less than 60Hz but also produces noticable flickering at the exact same frequency of the compressor. This is a common issue elsewhere as when I worked at the power company, customers also had this complaint. I was unaware at the time of what the problem was but the power company had spent resources doing voltage studies without finding anything. Too bad understanding of electronics is less prevalent in the power industry than others which focus more on the design of such devices.
Anyway, I guess the point is, I haven't found a lot of LED bulb designs that are particularly resistant to this problem(Not saying they shouldn't be, but it's not like you can go to the store and find a bulb that says "certified not to be a piece of garbage with switching or oscillating loads." Perhaps I should test the modules/bulbs I have and do a comparison.
On a side note, cheap LED bulbs can be noisy as heck, as I think you've gone over in one of your videos. I also had a similar issue where BLDC motor windings at work were picking up radiated emissions from an LED bulb on the workbench. Added a toroid to solve the problem and it quieted down my scope readings significantly. Didn't realize the windings were working as an antenna at that point, but it makes complete sense now. And that would also explain why grounding the aluminum housing helped, as I was improving the effectiveness of what is essentially an EMI shield around this big antenna!
LED bulbs generally leave a lot to be desired in terms of quality electrical design from many brands.
Here's why it causes lights to flicker:
The circuit doesn't use TRIACs. It uses the FETs as half wave switches which are synchronized on the line frequency. This is fairly common in many power hungry regulating heating circuits and the same flickering light effects also occur with the use of photo copiers and laser printers as well. 120 volt devices need more amperage so the effect is much more noticeable than with 240V. If your lighting has regulated power inside then the flickering will not be present.
If the device is powered on an outlet that shares the same circuit as the lighting and has relatively resistive wiring like Alumin(i)um and/or far from the power panel and/or the power panel is a distance away from the feed point of the utility supply, the lights will have a more pronounced flicker.
Try a temperature regulated soldering or hot air station and a non-regulated work lamp with a 30+ meter light to medium duty extension cord and those current pulses will make the light flicker!
I found that flickering is especially noticeable on my line voltage T8 LED fluorescent retrofit tubes with the ballasts bypassed and removed from the fixture. It's particularly bad on one 12 ga. short run copper branch close to the 208V 200 amp three phase panel. My espresso machine really affects them when I first turn it on in the morning. A nuisance I am willing to endure for my java.
The flickering issue is something the standards talk in relation to the noise treatise. It is not a simple load control issue. You could of course do a continuous power control by utilizing a portion of every half cycle in what is called phase control. Then it is a noise issue and the line filter is effective remedy. With the zero switching, there is very little noise generated and we start talking about the flicker. The line filter does nothing to prevent this from propagating to the power grid.
However, here come some more interesting details. The type of lights has a great influence to the observed flicker. But so does the frequency of the heat proportioning. And then, there is the real crux: If the controller is not forcing full cycles every time, the resulting DC plays havoc to any transformer. The DC saturates the transformer core and the primary draws HUGE surge current. Rather than a breaker, the transformer(s) present the dominant line impedance and a 5 or 10 kVA transformer has higher impedance than, say 50 or 100 kVA transformer. So, even clean full wave switching has different drops at different transformer sizes, without the DC effect, but the DC adds “insult to the injury”.
Of course, incandescent lights flicker less than faster responding lights (fluorescent ones). And on electronic light controls (compact fluorescent and LED) the effect could be determined by their Hold Up time, but many of them use so small main capacitors that there is almost no time. When you the add the DC caused transient, it shows right through.
The human eye notices flicker most strongly at certain frequencies, like 2 - 20 Hz, and also more when the light is on the side instead of directly at the center of the view.
So, plenty of different details, but in this case I would say there has been a small transformer providing either 120 V or 230 V, whichever was applicable. Then there is the occasional production of half wave, i.e. DC. Bad combination...
Dave, can you time how long each takes to fill a bag with air?
If the Quick is 120L/ min then the Atten MUST be marketing fap just look at the super cute turbine in the Quick vs. the fan in the Atten!!n
Switching on/off at zero crossings is the cleanest less noisy way there's to do it.
Peak power there is 1.41*220[volts]*7[amps] -> *2.17 kW*
For Louis to confirm, he could run an extension to the unit from another circuit that's feed from a different phase than his lights. That would cinch it.
Have you talked to Mr. Rossmann whether he could fix his flickering issues?
When a TRIAC is used in the _Cycle control-configuration_ In industrial applications they normally switch a *full sine-wave* to prevent EMC-issues.
I have seen similar lighting flicker (in incandescents) while using a ~1.5kW DIY heater controller that did the same ON/OFF type control (i.e. not phase angle control). This was with reasonable (230V) mains wiring and separate lighting circuits - I think it happened when the controller ended up dropping/adding pulses at a low enough frequency for the bulb filaments to not filter it out and the human eye to respond.
In the us, lights and sockets are often on the same 120v as far as I know. 1000w is going to put a fair load on that circuit so I'm not surprised his lights flickered. I saw that a lot when I was in the US.
same problem with europe 230v
I think Louis flickering issue was with the 120v NA version rather thsan the 220v version that Louis is currently using. I had thought that on Louis's review of the Haku that Paul S. was able to show that the heating element for the Quick unit was replaceable via removable of a couple of screws off the head.
It would be great of such devices had 2(3) ratings:
1 - lower bound Maximum power - guaranteed minimum of usable power
2 - upper bound current draw - for circuitbreakers and wirethickness
3 - instantaneous power - surge-current protection.
We had an old washingmashine that would regularly throw the fuses. Checked the specs - should be alright. Used a powerclamp - instead of the rated 1500 W it was pulling way over 3000 W with spikes of over 20 Amps (mind you middle europe, 240V). The old non-resetable fuses were fine with those bursts, but not the new ones.
(and wow, 20 Ampspikes are a tad bit bad )
I have been watching your videos for a few months now. I love to watch as you repair and/ or reverse engineer products. I'm wondering if you'd consider reviewing a particular product that is often converted into remote control robotics. The topic is power wheelchairs. More specifically, Curtis controllers, power modules, accessory modules and the drive motors as a system. I believe that power wheelchairs use the can-bus system, adopted from the automotive industry. To my understanding, this is a serial based technology. I would love to see the waveforms that control the motors: fwd, left, right, reverse, turn left, turn right, etc. displayed on an oscilloscope or analyzer. It would be interesting to see the digital pulses that command the attached devices.
If you're up for it, perhaps you could repurpose a power wheelchair with vertical lift seat into a remote control appliance carrier. For instance, You could use it as an aid to relocate and assist with the installation of window air conditions. The elevating seat would help you to set the height of the window AC to match the height of the window casing.
Thank you for the many fantastic videos and resurrections from dumpster diving and factory clearance of electronics.
HI Dave. My 861DW have a little problem: in the same airflow setting, the higher temperature, the faster the airblower spin. That means inconsistent air output in different temperature for fixed airflow setting
I am a This Old House(TV Show) fan too, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if those old New York buildings and/or the power grid they share wasn't designed for 1000 watt loads or the grid they are on is old and the transformers are nearly depleted.
His area could have an old transformer that the electric company is trying to squeeze it's last dollar value out of until it's efficiency isn't worth the cost, they can cost $20,000-$80,000, are supposed to last 40 years, and may have a construction that uses toxic substances so there is also cost in hazardous disposal.
Thanks Dave.
I use QUICK 861DS for at least 4 years, and i Can confirm the flickering problem. You can try to replicate this issue by connecting Desktop Lamp and Quick to the same extension Cord. In my case it is circular CFL lamp with magnifying glass, ca. 20W. The main light is not affected.
Yes, 15 minutes is quick for Dave!
Those stations with fan in the handle from attn or whatever are likely peak flow and unregulated. They probably don't flow that much with a nozzle attached. Perhaps the quick doesn't truly regulate it either but likely makes a whole lot more static pressure and is much less influenced by the nozzle.
I've seen laser printers do something weird with my lights. I have this theory about how power and phases works that I was going to mention. Like 1 line from a breaker really has this like wattage ability before some wire somewhere starts to overheat. If you took a 240 volt or 120 volt appliance you could tap about the same amount from one phase or two under that maximum. The appliances resistance limits the current draw... I think certain devices were inherently additive in terms of their coil arrangement to add power. In that case you'd definitely benefit from 2 phases.
Yup, probably Mr Rossman has more power devices or old electrical installation (high resistance at some corroded/loose connections?)
This switching triac regulation of power devices (like this heater and possibly other devices in his office) makes momentary power consumption much higher than the rated average and current power throttling.
Your Quick device with ~7 amps peak on 230V means 1150W momentary rms power.
Truth is, that i.e. induction heater plate at lowest power setting actually has momentary power exactly the same as on maximum setting. This is the same for almost all other power devices.
So, if you have 10 power devices of 1000W max rms power and you turn them all at 10% of maximum (100W average per device) - than actually your momentary rms power reaches 10000W (just as if you would use them at 100%) - that may be enough to decrease voltage in his mains and make the lights flicker. The breakers wouldn't necessarily trip from that - depends on particular breaker type.
If that is the case for Rossman, than no filtering device will help him, he just reached the limits of his mains power supply (which is surprising, but maybe he has very old electrical installation or smth).
You're on the right track! Just hope that your example never demands a pulse all at the same moment! BreakerClick! See my comment also... ;)
True, especially if the device is half-wave, then you are certain that momentary power consumption is double of the rated average maximum.
Hey Dave, you could make a video measuring the electric fields around the hose, to see if it's indeed acting as an antenna. I remember you have the oscilloscope tips for it.
I could a series of half a dozen videos investigating every aspect of emissions, it's a deep rabbit hole.
EEVblog hahaha yes, but still a very interesting and not so much explored rabbit hole
Hi Dave, I'm surprised you didn't emphasise strong enough that it is burst control not phase control of the heater.
I think you have smaller harmonic components due to each wave form being sinusoidal zero crossing, rather than chopped sinusoidal waves of phase control.
When doing the power measurements, did you measure the voltage being applied to the heater, in case there were losses in the controller.
Light control uses phase control, these heaters use pulse burst control.
Get a light dimmer and show us the waveforms and show the comparison, a good video experiment.
Tom.
Very nice ! Could it be his wiring is too weak ? On that particular part of the circuit at least maybe
Is a higher airflow really needed when it increases the likelihood of blowing components off of the PCB?
Almost no chance. The surface tension of the solder will keep parts in place
it depends i already lost 0402 parts this way. but sometimes you need the power
And here I come a year later to say that I too have my main LED light flicker in my lab. I suspect it is due to interference with the dimmer. Nothing else, other than maybe the laser printer (to a lesser degree), does the same. My house was built in 2014 and all wiring is 12 AWG solid core and all circuits are 20A (120V). All my breakers are both AFCI and GFCI but no trips to date while using the Quick 861DW.
0:14 You have a custom Keysight scope with your logo on?! New EEVblog product on it's way or just a nice gift from the Keysight guys?
Yes, it's a custom overlay.
Hi Dave, can you maybe anser we some questions regarding that station? I was wondering how the heating element is exactly working. So I guess it runs on AC? And the AC Voltage of the heating element is regulated? Thank you very much in advance!
11'50" The Atten had more hours running. It may have some of the heating spiral material evaporate/oxidate, causing it to be slightly under its spec'ed power.
There is nothing wrong with the Atten, it is a fantastic product if you think about its price, up from 25$, but there's a lot wrong with this comparison. If they just bring the quality of the Atten to the price of the Quick, you would get a 5in1 multi-functional super soldering station and all other companies would go bankrupt.
It is likely due to having 110V and pulling about 10A impulse current and that on old cable. Louis has also problems with his AC in the summertime. So it might is a good thing that his leas is running out.
Hello. If you had the opportunity to similarly compare the new HOT AIR Atten ST-862D model with the Quick 861DW, I would be very interested in such a professional disassembly and check what is inside.
Unless there are other heat losses such as through the casing, a given airflow with a given temperature rise must always require the same power input. Thermodynamics 101.
Nice work,. I would really appreciate same test with best bst-863 hotair station. Thanks
My first Hot Air Station was not exactly the Atten 858D bta similar Mdel for about 35€ but it was very difficult to work with this device i tried calibrating it but when i choose 350°C it reaches about 550-620°C during heating process and after this when it says its reached Temperature the Temps drop slowly to about 200°C! So u have only a small Time Period where u can solder correctly and when i used the heating time to heat the area from far and start soldering as the station says got the Temp it works to desolder smaller parts but i destroyd many components and donor boards till i got it with this station! After purchasing the Quick i did not burn any PCB so i wouldnt recommend the Atten 858 or similar stations to anyone
Ever tried a jbc hotair? its horrific how awesome they work (and heatup in 3 seconds...), wish they are cheaper...
Having seen Louis lab/shop on youtube I would say that he needs an electrician as most likely every thing is on the same feed and there is a high resistance somewhere like a poor connection.
Is there a option to turn off the heating element and leave the pump running for cold air?
Thank you Dave
I strongly suspect these devices using 'burst fire' mains modulation would fail the latest mains 'Flicker' regulations. These regulations came in due to concerns over epilepsy induced from low frequency light flicker.
...... Made me nervous watching the Atten gun facing the Keysight screen, ( with that dodgy cradle switch).
Still going strong ? i need one of these
Did you create the oscilloscope keypad overlay yourself?
No, Keysight made it for me for a giveaway promo.
I wonder what issues might come up from switching only half cycles. DC bias is something to be avoided with mains devices, right?
in theory: yes . practically many (most?) hairdryers use a single diode for the half power setting.
From what I got the 220v one does not have the problem and Louis actually changed to 220 to get away from it.
I have the 110v personally, and no matter what I do anything florescent flickers.
Surely that would draw the same current on the 120V side of the 120V-240V inverter? Or is the small amount of filtering in the inverter smoothing out the spikes just enough?
Depends on the available outlets. In the US you can actually ask for a 220V outlet to be installed (also used by people that do electric welding). I also believe that other appliances such as central heating operates at 220V by default.
Buildings over there get a split phase supply - 120-0-120V. 240V circuits are easily installed - but they're allergic to using them for general purpose applications.
Running it floating would be the plan, Not tied or sinked to the line off my trusty 2548 Trace
I designed an autoclave a number of years ago and there is an EMC rule that relates to the switching on and off times for power devices. Essentially there is a formula that dictates the number of ON / OFF cycles that are allowed in a given period of time and it is intended to reduce flicker and is in fact called the 'flicker directive'. The formula is based on the current drawn and the load / power factor. This is not of course to be confused with true DC based duty cycle controllers which average out current drawn. It resulted in a 25 second minimum power cycle time for a 3Kw resistive load and I would guess that your device does not meet that standard.
Thanks for sharing 😀👍
The thing creates a lot of line noise : uneven number of half cycles, randomly.
Thank eevblog
There is a new station BST-863 on paper it's slightly better than quick 861DW.
Good morning. My name is Jesse and I'm from Brazil. I could make a video with tips and tutorials on how to identify a Quick Hot Air rework station from the original to the fake one.
hi, which digital oscilloscope that display realtime analogue audio signal at good to high frame rate like analogue CRT oscilloscope?
Crappy 120V mains power, that's the problem. Ceiling lights on the same circuit as the sockets doesn't help either. Fixed ceiling lights are ALWAYS on a separate circuit in the breaker box/consumer unit, no matter how many rooms you have.
In the UK and Europe.
forgot to write: I live in central Europa.
Mine just failed on it's second use. Something in the blower came loose and it's making a loud racket.
Which is good for iPhone pcb between them quick 861dw or bst best 863..... I want to buy one please sir
Dear Lord!!! They just pick you apart at every go!!!! Next they'll harp just because you exhaled at the wrong moment!! ;)
NICE FACTS - Thanks
The problem is when you have YT influencers who use personal preference as their review conclusion for tech gear of this nature, rather than true scientific reasoning or experimentation, they only create stupid irrelevant content. Your previous video was a shocker in comparing the Atten against the Quick. Different board locations and different techniques in testing the solder's liquidity. People were right to criticise you for it. You spent more time heating the actual chip than the pins when using the Atten. No mention of the actual tip sizes just "the biggest you had" and no mention if they were the same size. If you pay 3 times the price you should expect better outcome of course. However, you could have got the Atten down to 30 seconds if you applied the tweezers and heat like you did with the Quick and that is still a good result.
i wonder if its a resistor configuration to change the airflow or wattage
Hmm...
Anyone torn down the 861DE?
what does rossman have?
Not showing up in my feed. Only see it posted on Facebook (yes, I know...)
UA-cam is rooted.
35th! :)))
Hot air yeah! Now is -5 C here in Berlin, so fix it!
BMR Studio Right ! We need more global warming here in the cold north 😁
Those digital oscilloscopes refresh rate and resolution really suck. I miss the analog light fast and smooth displayed capability. I think that digital ruined a lot of progress in technology in the last 30 years. What for, colors ? Gosh it sucks, all those flashy design and it cannot compare for the high quality that was made long ago. Sure you can store curves in memory but there was a hybrid tech that could do that too.
In before demonetisation ;)
Eh?
Still available for a limited time only!
Hi sir can you do Quick TR1300A
I thought that the measurement would be quick...
which on i purchase small cost
Sir my Quick 861dw when i turn on it flows 120 air ,temperature 300, 200,and 395 with air 120 cannot adjust buttons not working its brand new please help me sir.
Rossman’s is working on 110v
low voltage - high current. when I use my TS-100 with a 12 to 24V converter on the solar battery system my led lights also flicker with the current pulses. when I use it at home with a 230V PSU then no problem.
I'm telling anyone who will listen, DO NOT WASTE YOUR MONEY ON A HAKKO IF YOU CAN GET THE QUICK. If the Quick doesn't do what you need it to do then go with a Pace or a JBC. The Hakko hit air stations are horribly overpriced and borderline theft.
hi dear freand
are you can me to repair quick 861dw?
Is it hot ? Is it really hot?
wow hey...
ESD... that is all
I must continue to complain about the issue of continued remarks of cultural insensitivity and intolerance towards Mainland Chinese manufacturers. I am not Chinese, but I recognize cultural intolerance when I see it.
Once again, it is not our place to blame them with pejorative names such as "one hung low" and other racially-tinged epithets. Once again I re-assert: *It is simply NOT their fault,* but usually our own. As a nascent world economy, we should be encouraging them in better ways than making unkind remarks.
When a Chinese entrepreneur is trying to establish their market, I'm sure one of their best tenets is to do so as efficiently as possible, with as few resources they have. They then must make best use of local existing resources to accomplish those tasks. And it is a model similar to what has evolved in most other building economies. This time they have a head start by accessing information from all our earlier attempts. So when a request is fulfilled, it doesn't always come from a massive factory, owned necessarily by evil Chinese tycoons. Perhaps it is largely the efforts of hundreds of local networks and millions of people all working together to improve their life style.
So please dispel those mythical beliefs now if you would. *WE* are the ones, here in the West and elsewhere who set such rigid constraints, and it is their remarkable skills, human , natural and otherwise that has accomplished a nearly impossible task for your benefit.
Landrew0
I couldn't agree more - stop it Dave, I have used one of these 'one hung lo' units for years and have had no problems with them. I use it everyday and it has never let me down.
Chill out dude
David,
I really hope you're starting to get this straight, and not going to be routed back to basic training like so many of your peers. Even the top UA-camr in the world has done an incredible amount of work to help himself and others develop their skills. On the other hand one of the slightly lower-ranked on the scale never seemed to have received the message and has now lost his channel. I don't need to email you any news articles for you to figure out.
Just for the record it certainly appears that you are off again in the wrong direction And I have no doubt you will be starting your new lessons soon.
First tip: start paying much more attention to the down-votes; they contain much more valuable information.
Yes, I think the anti-Chinese racism does wear a bit thin. It is our countries' responsibility to police our regs (with the possible exception of chip forgery which the Chinese should do more about), even if a bit impractical to extradite thousands of small traders. But lets stick to objective facts about what we are offered and are avidly buying. Racist jokes (Wun Hung Lo etc.) wear a bit thin, and do we really want millions of Chinese citizens to think we are boorish racist loudmouths?
aussiebear22 OK, China has been a military dictatorship for a good few years and arguably don't think much of any foreigners. Doesn't mean we can't behave better if we want to.
Thanks Dave.