I came to Orthodoxy from Judaism 25 years ago, trying to figure out which jurisdiction to join was challenging. After studying the history of the Church , the new calendar was a significant issue enough for me not to want to participate in. It is not for me to say that they don't have Grace but I had to make a decision. Thank you for this wonderful lecture!
Thank you! I really appreciated the context regarding Elder Ieronymos statement when he said he was “with all”. A lot of people misuse and abuse that quote. I’ve even seen NCs use it to show he supported New Calendarists!
The New Calendarists who say this should learn to read more carefully. He only says “with all” after being asked about the Old Calendarist factions. It’s also unfortunate that many who knew him did not write down the things which he said concerning his thoughts about this and about Archbishop Auxentius. Today it has become word of mouth.
“A quote from Elder Joseph the Cave dweller from the Holy Mountain one who again those who follow the New calendar never cease to grasp at in pushing their point across but they do so in vain. Do not fear he says the Masons are devising many plans and want many things but only if the Lord of all allows them to, without his will as he said neither a hair nor a leaf falls. He shall despise their councils, here the Elder is telling us not to worry about what is going on since God knows all and will show us all the way. God does not approve of innovation or of heresy and so these things will appear and be revealed when he wishes and we will know what to do”- Hierodeacon Ieronymos “Saint Nektarios of Aegina a very beloved Saint, one who is loved by those on the New calendar but was in no way pleased by that innovation said “We should not change the calendar because all our feasts of our church have been established on it especially the eternal pascha” The Two men he was speaking to replied “But if the church accepts the reform which is happening.. what are we to do”… “You remain as you are” he said “you will not follow the reformers because the Gregorian has been condemned by two Pan Orthodox councils under patriarch Jeremias in 1592 and 1593 two councils and a anathema in 1843 it is impossible for Orthodox to accept the change, I do not accept or follow anyone even if I stay alone” The two men replied “but if we do not have a priest or priests what will we do and if we do not have a Church and have everyone with the New calendar there how do we deal with it”. “Why are you worried” he said. “Your homes will become Churches” “If you read in the history of our Church in times of rebellion many houses have become places of common prayer. All this and much more was said.”- Hierodeacon Ieronymos, (From a Periodical from the Monastery of Esphigmenou on the Holy Mountain)
@@GenuineOC “A quote from Elder Joseph the Cave dweller from the Holy Mountain one who again those who follow the New calendar never cease to grasp at in pushing their point across but they do so in vain. Do not fear he says the Masons are devising many plans and want many things but only if the Lord of all allows them to, without his will as he said neither a hair nor a leaf falls. He shall despise their councils, here the Elder is telling us not to worry about what is going on since God knows all and will show us all the way. God does not approve of innovation or of heresy and so these things will appear and be revealed when he wishes and we will know what to do”- Hierodeacon Ieronymos “Saint Nektarios of Aegina a very beloved Saint, one who is loved by those on the New calendar but was in no way pleased by that innovation said “We should not change the calendar because all our feasts of our church have been established on it especially the eternal pascha” The Two men he was speaking to replied “But if the church accepts the reform which is happening.. what are we to do”… “You remain as you are” he said “you will not follow the reformers because the Gregorian has been condemned by three Pan Orthodox councils under patriarch Jeremias in 1592 and 1593 two councils and anathemas in 1843 it is impossible for Orthodox to accept the change, I do not accept or follow anyone even if I stay alone” The two men replied “but if we do not have a priest or priests what will we do and if we do not have a Church and have everyone with the New calendar there how do we deal with it”. “Why are you worried” he said. “Your homes will become Churches” “If you read in the history of our Church in times of rebellion many houses have become places of common prayer. All this and much more was said.”- From a Periodical from the Monastery of Esphigmenou on the Holy Mountain
This is the "Genuine Orthodox Church". It's a separatist group from the rest of the Orthodox world including the GOC. These guys are a small sect that think they are the true church and the rest of us Orthodox are all wrong.
5:14 This was my exact question (my layman thinking) to some "world orthodox" priests, as an inquiring catechumen. They couldn't give me a coherent answer. By the new Calendars thinking, the holy dates and miracles in time do not matter.
The real sign of their hypocrisy is actually with an Elder which they recently canonized. They celebrate the Elder Joseph the Hesychast on the 16th (he reposed on Dormition, but his feast was moved one day ahead) of August. The Elder Joseph reposed on the Old Style on the Holy Mountain, so according to the new calendar, he died on the 28th (so his feast should be 29th, with the movement of the feast). They celebrate his day, 13 days prior to his actual day of death, and he reposed after the calendar change took place. There is no way to hide this discrepancy.
@@GenuineOC It is 9 hours driving time to Toronto from my current home; however, we are planning to move soon and are praying for guidance on where to live. Can you direct me to possible upcoming locations in the U.S.?
Forgive me for my ignorance, but is the GOC Makarios synod in communion with HOCNA? I know there was a break in 2019, but has it been restored since then? I was under the impression also that Holy Theotokos Convent was under HOCNA as well.
@@JettWatson24 No the two Synods are not in communion. Met. Makarios of Toronto, the last original hierarch of HOCNA chose to remain in communion with Archbishop Makarios in 2019, while the rest of the Hierarchs broke communion with Archbishop Makarios since they were unwilling to sign a confession of faith against the teachings of Fr. Anthony Bulatovich and ‘Bishop’ Gregory Lourie. The Holy Theotokos Convent remained and remains under Metropolitan Makarios of Toronto who is a member of the Synod of Archbishop Makarios.
I have an important question. Does the Genuine Orthodox Church venerate or accept Saint Paisios, Saint Jacovos, or even Saint PORPHYRIOS? If there is no grace in World Orthodoxy, then isn’t it impossible for these saints to be real saints? Right? There must be a mistake or fake??? Because only the true church can give Birth to Saints, right? Is that true according to your lessons…Please clarify this information for everyone here again.
@@Mother-of-Church We absolutely do not believe in those 3 false saints. Their lives may have benefit and nice stories, but that is not enough to say they are saints. Even those who are outside of Christianity may have nice stories which could bring benefit. We look at the faith. Those three believed steadfastly that Patriarch Bartholomew was a “gift from God” and a true confessor of the faith. From this we see that they themselves were delusional, and so we do not accept them. Leaving out the question of the old and the new, grace or no grace, this alone proves that they are not one in mind with us the orthodox, and so they cannot be called orthodox themselves. Orthodoxy is first and foremost faith, if any of our dogmas are changed, the faith is not found there. This is why there is no grace with the ecumenists.
@@GenuineOC Kýrie eléison, Iisoú Christé, eléison imás. May God forgive us all for the false spirit of ecumenism…but for the false spirit of judgment and fear-mongering that prevails in the genuine church too. Lord have mercy…
@@Mother-of-Church It is enough to be with Christ in his church. We celebrate the saints of God who were part of his Church, and who taught its teaching as their own. We don’t need to celebrate those who participated in its destruction. We should never make judgements about their state of being now, or their personal faith in God, but “judge the righteous judgment” and see what they taught, and decide whether or not we can follow such a thing. Miracles can come from the enemy also. To be strict in your faith is not fanatical.
@@GenuineOC To deny someone salvation and to set oneself on God’s throne, making decisions beyond God, is more than just fanatical and very dangerous. Through satanic pride and judgment, this fearmongering is produced-claiming to be privileged, to be saved, and to be one among the few. This is why the Church will not thrive and grow. On one hand, there is a desire to be humble and marginalized, yet on the other hand, there is pride in how many people have been mobilized worldwide. One should also distance oneself from this stank and many false spirits, as it has nothing to do with true spirits of HUMILITY!
@@GenuineOC To deny someone salvation and to set oneself on God's throne, making decisions beyond God, is more than just fanatical and very dangerous. Through satanic pride and judgment, this fearmongering is produced-claiming to be privileged, to be saved, and to be one among the few. This is why the Church will not thrive and grow. On one hand, there is a desire to be humble and marginalized, yet on the other hand, there is pride in how many people have been mobilized worldwide. One should also distance oneself from the stank and this false spirits, as it has nothing to do with the true spirit of HUMILITY.
You missed that it was befitting to declare New Calendarist without Grace by the introduction of the 1920 Encyclical Alone.. You censored all the deliberation between Chyrsostom Florina and Bishop Matthew in their agreed condemnation of New Calender as Graceless, Despite Florina temporarily retracting on this belief, on his death bed he admitted to it.
@@danube466 We don’t deal with rumours or “he said she said,” just facts. As I said in the talk, it was actually impossible to declare the state church graceless based on the introduction of the New Calendar alone, because that would mean that Met. Chrysostom of Florina (being part of the state church until many years after the introduction of the new calendar) would have also been without the grace of God, which would also mean that Bishop Matthew was ordained by a false Bishop. This is the illogical type of thinking which caused the Florinite-Matthewite fights and was entirely irrelevant to the talk.
@@amykim6838 He did not admit to it on his death bed, he admitted to it in a synodical encyclical years before his death. Whether or not he agreed with the encyclical is not known.
@@godsaveus4380 It would be nice if anyone was willing. Unfortunately when one tries more hypocrisy is brought forth and so they’re afraid to do so. The information which is provided is not well known in the English-speaking world. In the Greek-speaking world however it is widely known and spoken about often. It’s probably brand new for most people hearing.
@@constanceconstance2555 There are not only two. There have been divisions since the 1930s. It’s not a simple answer to the question, but when the faith is attacked, unity is the hardest thing to keep.
Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw. And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David? But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, _This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils._ And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house. He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. Wherefore I say unto you, _All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men._ And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come (Matthew 12:22-32).
Wow you guys are so off that's not what happened in Astoria , you guys are just mad Metropolitan petros because he was going to join the canonical Church at the end of his life Can you stop already with the calendar issue we all know it was UNcanonical and it shouldn't have happened half of the Orthodox World accepted it for almost all of us we were born into it why don't you promote Unity all our voices could join together and go against ecumenism
Those voices who are against ecumenism are to be found within the Old Calendar Churches with confessing Bishops, not those who have compromised the faith in the Patriarchates. We are not mad about anything, these are the facts…
@@TheHackingWeaselBeing against something doesn’t mean you’re not part of the problem. Remaining in communion with ecumenists places you with their confession of faith whether you like it or not.
@@GenuineOC yes but here is where is your problem is(GOC) this is when the church has a council all together then they make a decision whether someone doing something wrong gets excommunicated Again when the church gets together you know the church the one that you guys left. There have been a lot of Miracles the so-called new calendar churches and it's not our faults we were born into it our church fathers even said it in God's time it will all come back together . you guys decided to walk away what does that make you. Remember a Schism is worse than a heresy and I'm only quoting the church fathers
@@TheHackingWeaselUnderstand it in a different way. In 1924, the Church of Constantinople changed, they caused a schism. When one leaves the others, they are the schismatics. The Greek Church changed, no other Church did. The Christians in Greece who did not accept change are those who remained as they were, they are the True Orthodox Christians, how can they be the cause of schism? The only ‘crime’ they committed was doing absolutely nothing. The issue of the calendar evolved into the heresy of ecumenism, which is why we declared them heretics eventually. There is no need for a council to declare heresy, when the heresy had already been condemned! In fact, without the heresy of ecumenism, the calendar change was condemned 3 times. I think you should watch the talk again and pay attention. These things are explained.
Did you repent for supporting and accepting the teaching "Name-worshipping" condemned by the entire Church? We are told that this is why you left hocna. Did you ask forgiveness from all the people you slandered who left before you?
If you wish to ask someone a question directly, it would be a good idea to do that. Not to publish a bunch of questions on a public forum directed to a person who will never read them here.
Do you people even know what a calender is? It's to correct align the solar year to the seasons. The Julian calender is much less precise that the new Gregorian calender, the new is much more precise to the actual length of the time it takes the Sun to revolve around the Earth 1 time. Besides, it was a heathen, Julius Caesar, who promulgated the calender, the church fathers only lived during a time when this was the calender used. Even Venerable Bede knew about the creeping discrepancy back in the days. A calender has to do with astronomy and mathematics, it's not matter of theology or faith. Do you guys fire off your New Year fireworks in January too and decline if your boss wants to celebrate your birthday in the Gregorian?
@@locksmith9498 Leave the calendar aside, ignore the name which we are called (Old-calendarists), and try to defend the blatant ecumenism and unfounded heretical beliefs which exist today within those who follow the new calendar. Why are we against the calendar change? “You will know them by their fruits.” But some people, those saints and holy hierarchs which came before us, were able to foresee these fruits and understand immediately what it really meant to “change the calendar.” Our fight is not against days and hours, but against ecumenism. If you can drop the calendar issue and defend its fruits, good luck to you.
@@locksmith9498 As far as I’m aware there are some Churches with the Old Calendarists in Sweden, but in Europe in general there are plenty. To have liturgy in the vernacular is very important, maybe that is why many don’t understand these issues, they don’t understand what’s being said in Church in general.
@@GenuineOC My family's issue is not ecumenism but to actually find Orthodox services here in the diaspora in Sweden that we can comprehend. Most parishes cater to their own ethnic group. That's the main issue we have to deal with. How can my Baptist be convinced of the truth of Orthodoxy if she is unable to understand what is prayed or sung during the services? Same goes for my 12 year old daughter. We ourselves are to blame I am sure. Even so, this is MY country.
@@locksmith9498 It is true that all ethnic churches should be using first the language of the people and also include their own language, but unfortunately there are differences in opinion on that. However, this and ecumenism, and any other issue which plagues the orthodox world should be everyone’s issue.
The problem with these old calendarists is that it has been pointed out many times that the documents they are claiming from 1583 are actually forgeries. But they continue to insist.
Even without those two councils ever existing, which let’s be honest, the simple people of Greece had no clue about, the ecumenist issue and its tie to the calendar is still relevant and that is truly what we’re looking at here.
I came to Orthodoxy from Judaism 25 years ago, trying to figure out which jurisdiction to join was challenging. After studying the history of the Church , the new calendar was a significant issue enough for me not to want to participate in. It is not for me to say that they don't have Grace but I had to make a decision. Thank you for this wonderful lecture!
Once someone sees the problems in the Ecumenists Churches it’s impossible to unsee.
🙏 Many thanks from Germany! God bless you all.
Thank you! I really appreciated the context regarding Elder Ieronymos statement when he said he was “with all”. A lot of people misuse and abuse that quote. I’ve even seen NCs use it to show he supported New Calendarists!
The New Calendarists who say this should learn to read more carefully. He only says “with all” after being asked about the Old Calendarist factions. It’s also unfortunate that many who knew him did not write down the things which he said concerning his thoughts about this and about Archbishop Auxentius. Today it has become word of mouth.
“A quote from Elder Joseph the Cave dweller from the Holy Mountain one who again those who follow the New calendar never cease to grasp at in pushing their point across but they do so in vain. Do not fear he says the Masons are devising many plans and want many things but only if the Lord of all allows them to, without his will as he said neither a hair nor a leaf falls. He shall despise their councils, here the Elder is telling us not to worry about what is going on since God knows all and will show us all the way. God does not approve of innovation or of heresy and so these things will appear and be revealed when he wishes and we will know what to do”- Hierodeacon Ieronymos
“Saint Nektarios of Aegina a very beloved Saint, one who is loved by those on the New calendar but was in no way pleased by that innovation said “We should not change the calendar because all our feasts of our church have been established on it especially the eternal pascha” The Two men he was speaking to replied “But if the church accepts the reform which is happening.. what are we to do”… “You remain as you are” he said “you will not follow the reformers because the Gregorian has been condemned by two Pan Orthodox councils under patriarch Jeremias in 1592 and 1593 two councils and a anathema in 1843 it is impossible for Orthodox to accept the change, I do not accept or follow anyone even if I stay alone” The two men replied “but if we do not have a priest or priests what will we do and if we do not have a Church and have everyone with the New calendar there how do we deal with it”. “Why are you worried” he said. “Your homes will become Churches” “If you read in the history of our Church in times of rebellion many houses have become places of common prayer. All this and much more was said.”- Hierodeacon Ieronymos, (From a Periodical from the Monastery of Esphigmenou on the Holy Mountain)
This monk made a flawless presentation of the history of our Genuine Orthodox Church of Greece Congratulations !!!
Hi from genuine orthodox Christian church in Bali 👋
Where is that St Nektarios quote from?
Originally I saw it in Greek in a periodical by the Monastery of Esphigmenou on the Holy Mountain
@@GenuineOC “A quote from Elder Joseph the Cave dweller from the Holy Mountain one who again those who follow the New calendar never cease to grasp at in pushing their point across but they do so in vain. Do not fear he says the Masons are devising many plans and want many things but only if the Lord of all allows them to, without his will as he said neither a hair nor a leaf falls. He shall despise their councils, here the Elder is telling us not to worry about what is going on since God knows all and will show us all the way. God does not approve of innovation or of heresy and so these things will appear and be revealed when he wishes and we will know what to do”- Hierodeacon Ieronymos
“Saint Nektarios of Aegina a very beloved Saint, one who is loved by those on the New calendar but was in no way pleased by that innovation said “We should not change the calendar because all our feasts of our church have been established on it especially the eternal pascha” The Two men he was speaking to replied “But if the church accepts the reform which is happening.. what are we to do”… “You remain as you are” he said “you will not follow the reformers because the Gregorian has been condemned by three Pan Orthodox councils under patriarch Jeremias in 1592 and 1593 two councils and anathemas in 1843 it is impossible for Orthodox to accept the change, I do not accept or follow anyone even if I stay alone” The two men replied “but if we do not have a priest or priests what will we do and if we do not have a Church and have everyone with the New calendar there how do we deal with it”. “Why are you worried” he said. “Your homes will become Churches” “If you read in the history of our Church in times of rebellion many houses have become places of common prayer. All this and much more was said.”- From a Periodical from the Monastery of Esphigmenou on the Holy Mountain
What Synod are you part of? I'm in the GOC
GOC under Abp Makarios
This is the "Genuine Orthodox Church". It's a separatist group from the rest of the Orthodox world including the GOC. These guys are a small sect that think they are the true church and the rest of us Orthodox are all wrong.
@@T_Wozna where do you attend?
@@vromogata3807 ROAC
5:14 This was my exact question (my layman thinking) to some "world orthodox" priests, as an inquiring catechumen. They couldn't give me a coherent answer. By the new Calendars thinking, the holy dates and miracles in time do not matter.
The real sign of their hypocrisy is actually with an Elder which they recently canonized. They celebrate the Elder Joseph the Hesychast on the 16th (he reposed on Dormition, but his feast was moved one day ahead) of August. The Elder Joseph reposed on the Old Style on the Holy Mountain, so according to the new calendar, he died on the 28th (so his feast should be 29th, with the movement of the feast). They celebrate his day, 13 days prior to his actual day of death, and he reposed after the calendar change took place. There is no way to hide this discrepancy.
Bless, Fathers. Where can I find a directory of your monasteries, convents, and parishes in the U.S. and Canada? I am in NY and would like to visit.
@@user09587 I will direct you to our website which lists our Parishes: genuineoc.blogspot.com/2022/12/churches-and-monasteries.html?m=1
@@GenuineOC Thank you.
@@GenuineOC It is 9 hours driving time to Toronto from my current home; however, we are planning to move soon and are praying for guidance on where to live. Can you direct me to possible upcoming locations in the U.S.?
@@user09587 Send and email to the email linked on the channel and I’ll give you directions to that.
@@GenuineOC Thank you, I just sent it.
Forgive me for my ignorance, but is the GOC Makarios synod in communion with HOCNA? I know there was a break in 2019, but has it been restored since then? I was under the impression also that Holy Theotokos Convent was under HOCNA as well.
@@JettWatson24 No the two Synods are not in communion. Met. Makarios of Toronto, the last original hierarch of HOCNA chose to remain in communion with Archbishop Makarios in 2019, while the rest of the Hierarchs broke communion with Archbishop Makarios since they were unwilling to sign a confession of faith against the teachings of Fr. Anthony Bulatovich and ‘Bishop’ Gregory Lourie. The Holy Theotokos Convent remained and remains under Metropolitan Makarios of Toronto who is a member of the Synod of Archbishop Makarios.
@@GenuineOC Ah I see. Thank you for the clarification.
I have an important question. Does the Genuine Orthodox Church venerate or accept Saint Paisios, Saint Jacovos, or even Saint PORPHYRIOS?
If there is no grace in World Orthodoxy, then isn’t it impossible for these saints to be real saints? Right?
There must be a mistake or fake??? Because only the true church can give Birth to Saints, right? Is that true according to your lessons…Please clarify this information for everyone here again.
@@Mother-of-Church We absolutely do not believe in those 3 false saints. Their lives may have benefit and nice stories, but that is not enough to say they are saints. Even those who are outside of Christianity may have nice stories which could bring benefit. We look at the faith. Those three believed steadfastly that Patriarch Bartholomew was a “gift from God” and a true confessor of the faith. From this we see that they themselves were delusional, and so we do not accept them. Leaving out the question of the old and the new, grace or no grace, this alone proves that they are not one in mind with us the orthodox, and so they cannot be called orthodox themselves. Orthodoxy is first and foremost faith, if any of our dogmas are changed, the faith is not found there. This is why there is no grace with the ecumenists.
@@GenuineOC Kýrie eléison, Iisoú Christé, eléison imás.
May God forgive us all for the false spirit of ecumenism…but for the false spirit of judgment and fear-mongering that prevails in the genuine church too.
Lord have mercy…
@@Mother-of-Church It is enough to be with Christ in his church. We celebrate the saints of God who were part of his Church, and who taught its teaching as their own. We don’t need to celebrate those who participated in its destruction. We should never make judgements about their state of being now, or their personal faith in God, but “judge the righteous judgment” and see what they taught, and decide whether or not we can follow such a thing. Miracles can come from the enemy also. To be strict in your faith is not fanatical.
@@GenuineOC To deny someone salvation and to set oneself on God’s throne, making decisions beyond God, is more than just fanatical and very dangerous. Through satanic pride and judgment, this fearmongering is produced-claiming to be privileged, to be saved, and to be one among the few. This is why the Church will not thrive and grow. On one hand, there is a desire to be humble and marginalized, yet on the other hand, there is pride in how many people have been mobilized worldwide.
One should also distance oneself from this stank and many false spirits, as it has nothing to do with true spirits of HUMILITY!
@@GenuineOC
To deny someone salvation and to set oneself on God's throne, making decisions beyond God, is more than just fanatical and very dangerous. Through satanic pride and judgment, this fearmongering is produced-claiming to be privileged, to be saved, and to be one among the few. This is why the Church will not thrive and grow. On one hand, there is a desire to be humble and marginalized, yet on the other hand, there is pride in how many people have been mobilized worldwide. One should also distance oneself from the stank and this false spirits, as it has nothing to do with the true spirit of HUMILITY.
You missed that it was befitting to declare New Calendarist without Grace by the introduction of the 1920 Encyclical Alone.. You censored all the deliberation between Chyrsostom Florina and Bishop Matthew in their agreed condemnation of New Calender as Graceless, Despite Florina temporarily retracting on this belief, on his death bed he admitted to it.
@@danube466 We don’t deal with rumours or “he said she said,” just facts. As I said in the talk, it was actually impossible to declare the state church graceless based on the introduction of the New Calendar alone, because that would mean that Met. Chrysostom of Florina (being part of the state church until many years after the introduction of the new calendar) would have also been without the grace of God, which would also mean that Bishop Matthew was ordained by a false Bishop. This is the illogical type of thinking which caused the Florinite-Matthewite fights and was entirely irrelevant to the talk.
Is it true that he admitted it at his death? I didnt know this?
@@amykim6838 He did not admit to it on his death bed, he admitted to it in a synodical encyclical years before his death. Whether or not he agreed with the encyclical is not known.
Може ли превод на български език?Към владиката Димитрий ли сте?
Може, сега има превод на блгарски език. Ние не сме со Владиката Димитриј.
Благодаря за превода!
I'm told point by point that this is a really twisted, manipulated history. Can you ask the other side to post a rebuttal? I've already heard a lot.
@@godsaveus4380 It would be nice if anyone was willing. Unfortunately when one tries more hypocrisy is brought forth and so they’re afraid to do so. The information which is provided is not well known in the English-speaking world. In the Greek-speaking world however it is widely known and spoken about often. It’s probably brand new for most people hearing.
@GenuineOC I'm going to ask.
@@godsaveus4380 The side of the GOC-K has over and over again been told, just not challenged enough.
Why is there a separation between two genuine Orthodox groups?
@@constanceconstance2555 There are not only two. There have been divisions since the 1930s. It’s not a simple answer to the question, but when the faith is attacked, unity is the hardest thing to keep.
Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw. And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David? But when the Pharisees heard it, they said,
_This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils._
And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house. He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. Wherefore I say unto you,
_All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men._
And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come (Matthew 12:22-32).
@@joachim847 those who altered the faith have committed such a sin
Wow you guys are so off that's not what happened in Astoria , you guys are just mad Metropolitan petros because he was going to join the canonical Church at the end of his life
Can you stop already with the calendar issue we all know it was UNcanonical and it shouldn't have happened half of the Orthodox World accepted it for almost all of us we were born into it why don't you promote Unity all our voices could join together and go against ecumenism
Those voices who are against ecumenism are to be found within the Old Calendar Churches with confessing Bishops, not those who have compromised the faith in the Patriarchates. We are not mad about anything, these are the facts…
@@GenuineOC oh okay so only you guys are against ecumenism not anyone else seriously rethink your comment
@@TheHackingWeaselBeing against something doesn’t mean you’re not part of the problem. Remaining in communion with ecumenists places you with their confession of faith whether you like it or not.
@@GenuineOC yes but here is where is your problem is(GOC) this is when the church has a council all together then they make a decision whether someone doing something wrong gets excommunicated
Again when the church gets together you know the church the one that you guys left.
There have been a lot of Miracles the so-called new calendar churches and it's not our faults we were born into it our church fathers even said it in God's time it will all come back together . you guys decided to walk away what does that make you.
Remember a Schism is worse than a heresy and I'm only quoting the church fathers
@@TheHackingWeaselUnderstand it in a different way. In 1924, the Church of Constantinople changed, they caused a schism. When one leaves the others, they are the schismatics. The Greek Church changed, no other Church did. The Christians in Greece who did not accept change are those who remained as they were, they are the True Orthodox Christians, how can they be the cause of schism? The only ‘crime’ they committed was doing absolutely nothing. The issue of the calendar evolved into the heresy of ecumenism, which is why we declared them heretics eventually. There is no need for a council to declare heresy, when the heresy had already been condemned! In fact, without the heresy of ecumenism, the calendar change was condemned 3 times. I think you should watch the talk again and pay attention. These things are explained.
Did you repent for supporting and accepting the teaching "Name-worshipping" condemned by the entire Church? We are told that this is why you left hocna. Did you ask forgiveness from all the people you slandered who left before you?
If you wish to ask someone a question directly, it would be a good idea to do that. Not to publish a bunch of questions on a public forum directed to a person who will never read them here.
Do you people even know what a calender is? It's to correct align the solar year to the seasons. The Julian calender is much less precise that the new Gregorian calender, the new is much more precise to the actual length of the time it takes the Sun to revolve around the Earth 1 time. Besides, it was a heathen, Julius Caesar, who promulgated the calender, the church fathers only lived during a time when this was the calender used. Even Venerable Bede knew about the creeping discrepancy back in the days. A calender has to do with astronomy and mathematics, it's not matter of theology or faith. Do you guys fire off your New Year fireworks in January too and decline if your boss wants to celebrate your birthday in the Gregorian?
@@locksmith9498 Leave the calendar aside, ignore the name which we are called (Old-calendarists), and try to defend the blatant ecumenism and unfounded heretical beliefs which exist today within those who follow the new calendar. Why are we against the calendar change? “You will know them by their fruits.” But some people, those saints and holy hierarchs which came before us, were able to foresee these fruits and understand immediately what it really meant to “change the calendar.” Our fight is not against days and hours, but against ecumenism. If you can drop the calendar issue and defend its fruits, good luck to you.
@@locksmith9498 As far as I’m aware there are some Churches with the Old Calendarists in Sweden, but in Europe in general there are plenty. To have liturgy in the vernacular is very important, maybe that is why many don’t understand these issues, they don’t understand what’s being said in Church in general.
@@GenuineOC My family's issue is not ecumenism but to actually find Orthodox services here in the diaspora in Sweden that we can comprehend. Most parishes cater to their own ethnic group. That's the main issue we have to deal with. How can my Baptist be convinced of the truth of Orthodoxy if she is unable to understand what is prayed or sung during the services? Same goes for my 12 year old daughter. We ourselves are to blame I am sure. Even so, this is MY country.
@@locksmith9498 It is true that all ethnic churches should be using first the language of the people and also include their own language, but unfortunately there are differences in opinion on that. However, this and ecumenism, and any other issue which plagues the orthodox world should be everyone’s issue.
The problem with these old calendarists is that it has been pointed out many times that the documents they are claiming from 1583 are actually forgeries. But they continue to insist.
Even without those two councils ever existing, which let’s be honest, the simple people of Greece had no clue about, the ecumenist issue and its tie to the calendar is still relevant and that is truly what we’re looking at here.
Who is the Archbishop of this church?
Archbishop Makarios of Athens.