I think either could work but I like the idea of banning 1-2 heroes from each class (Mage/Defender/Fighter/Healer) each week from the meta heroes. I think that would really shake things up and keep the game mode fresh. it would also probably level the playing field to an extent
Hey man, on point as always. I read a suggestion once a while back, what if they made every tower and every keep map available for the players to choose ? We would see a much bigger variety of teams. It is true that all they have been releasing lately is new heroes and barely any new content. So much potential and so many ideas have been mentioned on their discord.. More Faction Trial stages, Ultra nightmare Void Rift difficulty, Epic champion ONLY content etc etc. We’re at the point where pulling for new heroes is only worth it if they are META for GvG and that’s it. Take care and see you in the next one 🤘🏼
Thanks man! I love the idea of being able to choose your own tower map, maybe with some limits - like maybe you have a pool of 5 maps and you have to pick a certain number of each to make sure people don't just stack whatever becomes the best map over and over. I think you bring up a larger point here that I wholeheartedly agree with - there's just not enough content in the endgame. Like you said there's SO many opportunities for them to make new content. I'd love to have something to work towards in this game that isn't GvG but like you pointed out that's really the only reason to pull these days. If they aren't going to make changes to arena and GvG they need to put out more challenging content.
Yeah I don't mind getting outspent by the opposition but it's supremely frustrating (and boring) to go against the same Praetus/Torodor/Cyrus comps every single week season after season
Other problems are - Too many unusable tiles. Garnet Guards. Mages Range. All of these things push everyone into the same teams. Can’t deploy mages, because they are at risk of garnet guards. You have a tile where archers can hit off the back deployment. Of course you could use lily’s anti death, but then your tank gets ran through. I think just removing the guards would bring more diversity. It’s definitely been worse since they can to town.
I mean fundamentally it might bring more diversity but that diversity would literally only mean even more op defences (people would only change defences if they were even stronger then the current meta defences with garnet guard handicaps). I think gvg is already too defence favoured
I agree with most of your points but I don't know that removing the GG's really solves the problem, though they've definitely exacerbated it. Personally I think a lot of these issues are a lot more palatable if things change on a week in week out basis
I don't like this idea. Basically, every guild will just get rid of carnelian, lili and ezryn and then there is no competitive defenses you can build anymore. Or remove torodor, brokkir and cyrus.
Totally agree, I know ppl don’t want their op hero’s nerfed So I wish they would nerf Lilly and carnelian they literally make it impossible Without giga chad BP to get through a tank and the window with the op Dps is so small it kills the game mode.
Yeah their fatal damage saving mechanic really enables a lot of these meta comps. The only problem I see with removing that is that we'd all just steamroll these teams otherwise. The more I talk about it with folks the more I think there needs to be some mechanical changes to really fix the game mode
I agree with you. We’ve been saying it with my guild as well. Too many same teams. Either limit how many heroes can be deployed by the entire guild. Or like you said only certain heroes allowed during that week of gvg. Or multiple maps like each stronghold has 6 different maps.
💯 just shake it up! I think that would go a LONG ways towards making it feel fresh each week, not to mention encourage people to use some forgotten heroes
@@BluntgutsGaming ya they gotta do something. At least give the attacker a chance to win. It seems to be all defense. And the rewards aren’t even worth giving my full attention if I know I have no chance to do anything
That would be amazing be able to ban a certain hero each week. Moontoon has a game called Mobile Legends Bang Bang and that feature is availble during battle. So the meta is change every fight.
Come on now. Same bans same picks, every match. Mlbb matchmaking is a disaster and always has being. Moonton only interest is money. I like the idea for bans every week in this game though. Only because never seen it before. But I’m sure eventually the same combos/style will rise up eventually
@@BluntgutsGaming what im thinking is a hero ban per week (1 or 2 hero maybe). Afterwards that hero cannot be ban for the succeeding 3 weeks. That would keep the meta changing per week.
I understand your frustration being in a guild pushing for overload the last 2 seasons. The new maps change it up for the first few weeks but then “meta” comps get found and then your fighting the same teams. I myself don’t have Ingrid or Carn. But I have a come up with variations of the meta defenses that work well. Two weeks ago when we were recruiting we literally asked if they had Ingrid as a requirement…. For gvg purposes. I like the idea of factions weekly!!
Yes, 100% man, viability is way too dependent on having specific heroes, requiring them in recruiting just proves that point. Hopefully they make some changes in future seasons!
@BluntgutsGaming keep up the good work bro. Use your platform to draw attention to it. If the last few weeks have proven anything, it's that moonton are NOT DEAF! 👊
Banning heroes or getting rid of heroes doesn't change the gap from what blunt is saying top 20 guild in overlord should face each other repeatedly and not face anyone lower, until someone enters that top 20.
Personally I'm not all that concerned over losing to the P2W folks, although I may not have done a great job of communicating that in the video. It can be frustrating no doubt, but the lack of diversity in defenses is pretty consistent across all of Overlord and high Plat 3. I'm mainly just tired of facing the exact same heroes every week basically since July when Ingrid was released
imagine a guild wide restriction or a restriction on any one keep and its towers on how many of a specific hero can be deployed? (maybe have less restrictions for lower ranks but increasing restrictions as you go up?)
For a bit more diversity they could add 5 different tower maps to each stronghold. And have a different map for each keep as well. We're a mid level guild in PIII, and we usually get a very easy fight followed by an impossible fight. Or the other way around. It is never a close battle.
I like the idea but I think it needs to change at regular intervals to keep things fresh. I've noticed the same thing the last couple of seasons, it's either a guild we can't touch or a guild we dominate, there's not much in between. I think it's because there are fewer people playing the game mode competitively but that's just speculation
From my view its an issue hard to address, because banning certain teams might weaken the available defenses - suddenly everyone will get overrun. On the other hand, current format is far from ideal. Like it has been mentioned by others, there are some general limitation such as unusable tiles or units range - which lead to this meta. I agree with your view that since Ingrid, there were no specific OP characters - maybe Wukong and second NM lord next? My general suggestion would be to introduce new demon soldiers, especially the flying ones - to add disposable flying dmg unit and also flying tank unit which could aggro attacks - supporting other units. More dmg buffers would be also welcome. There are lot of demon soldiers that I have never seen and probably never will see being deployed.
I think you make some good points here. If banning a certain faction suddenly means there are no viable defenses then I think that's symptomatic of a broken game mode and probably means they need to do a larger overhaul. While I'd love to see Demon Soldiers used to fix the situation they've tried that repeatedly and if anything it's just further limited the viable defenses in the game mode. I think the best suggestion I've seen is to buff/debuff certain factions on a rotation rather than outright banning them. I think, if done right, that could really shake things up and add mor excitement to the game mode
What if they made each tower have specific faction alignments and rotate them. Would give a reason for people to choose spots. Would also let WoR/Moon play with tower paths that favor faction specific strats and challenges.
That's a fun idea, although I think they'd need to do some balancing because there are some factions that just get completely steamrolled right now. If they combined it with buffs that were tied to the towers that could address that tho
@@BluntgutsGaming I think that's perfect. See, not all stages are built and balanced the same. Having some stages able to take full advantage of their abilities while others have theirs worked against lets you build into or against their balance level. A perfect example would be stage hazards that apply to both sides (but inherently favor one or the other) like field-wide shields, persistent regen so unsustained poke is less useful, explosive barrels (which we don't get any of outside of those challenge stages). For the stronger factions, having TWO lanes would be possible, as well, adding to defensive woes.
I wouldnt mind certain factions a week. Need a variety so people dont get screwed. Itll be more interesting but the krakens will still shine which is fine. But at least you can attack certain defences
Another solution could be to give us more demon soldiers (and make them a little easier to farm) that give us the tools to challenge some of these OP comps.
I agree in theory but it seems like they've been trying that for a while and it's only made the problem worse. If they can figure out how to do it effectively I'd be all for it!
I think they should faction limit each week not hero limit. Limiting one hero (except the broken lords) i dont think would help enough. Limiting an entire faction would change things big time.
I agree, but my concern is that if you ban say Arbiters then do we just see everyone using NM and Esotericists? I think if you ban a few key heroes then you could force people to figure out some new comps. Maybe a combination of the two where a few heroes are banned and certain factions get buffed each week...there's a lot of options. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!!
Exactly Bluntguts Im endgame and live for GvG style content in other games I've played, but WoR the GVG sux so bad. I find defences so ridiculously strong even when my BP is higher. Game suffers everywhere from thee 2 arbiters being gods in all PvP content. I'll get a lord again for Praetus banner and if I dont get him or something good I'll prob quit as its about these 2 heroes. Demon soldiers get melted by so many damage dealers. The fool needs to be re-run as without the fool Maw is useless. EDIT- game also suffers as OG players had the original souls stones and most made Praetus/Ingrid A3-5 try and get that now....the only answer is they nerf these 2 which they wont do - or power creep them....which is a scary thought.
Yep, there's like 5 heroes across all of the competitive game modes that are basically irreplaceable. If you have them you're competitive, if you don't then you're not and no amount of farming can make up for it. I don't think they can/should nerf them because of the money spent to get them, but they need to find a way to make some of the other heroes compelling to use, even if it's just because of a weekly buff or restriction or whatever
agree with all of this, just frustrating & stale. I also think that uncapped demon levelling is also absolutely broken. needs to be capped, and there needs to be catch up mechanics for early/mid game accounts
Catchup mechanics are sorely needed imo, and another reason why we need more heroes to compete with the Ingrids and Praetus' and Valderons of the world. I think a lot of people have already abandoned the game mode and the population is just going to continue to decay if these dynamics continue
I feel like this is a game problem with all end game content. Amusingly I think there is not enough hero variety to fulfill similar roles. I think Ingrid or Prateus is fine if they have counters or equivalent heros. The problem is they have to skew power towards ancient exclusive heros for money, Most long term players have most of the non ancient heros they want, especially with that select your hero compensation. Like you, I am rambling, but I agree that end game requires more challenges to overcome. Also with continued recent undermining of trust with the summoning system it is hard to want to by into the system.
Hey man, just saying. All those defense are beatable.im on top 5 guild in my server and yeah peatrus and his queen rules the defense. But youre right. Its really depend on your BP. I dont know the solution maybe moonton need to realease more higher BP heroes ? Anyway keep making content man i love it
Oh yeah they're definitely beatable, although probably not consistently at my BP. My point was that even in a more even match there's just not much variation in the heroes and defenses. I wasn't complaining about not being able to take on a top 5 guild defenses, honestly I didn't even try very hard because the match was kind of over before it started. I just want some more variety and viability so we aren't fighting the same 3 defenses over and over and the game mode gets stale. I appreciate the kind words, and you watching!!! ❤️
I think you brought up some really important points and the lack of diversity is a huge missed opportunity! There are so many amazing champs that we can’t use because they are in the wrong faction or just lack core requirements that gvg has nowadays. Healers are in the worst spot, where in the top 10 guilds you will rarely see anything besides Lilly and Carnelian with the odd Ezryn. Any other healer is basically a free win at this point. Tanks are in a very similar spot, where the meta is Brokkir, Regulus, Cyrus or Torodor. People that lack Cyrus or Torodor are unlikely to be able to set up two teams that can compete. Ingrid and GGs have made GvG comps a lot more narrow since you need to account for so many things now, which only leaves a few heroes/ factions that can fill those spots. I believe that mid OL GvG is the most fun (besides when you face one of the top guilds that just lost to MAD). A lot of the problems are made by the player base and the desire to always optimize, so the only way to fix this is a forced diversity such as x amounts of uses per hero per month/week. Any map they are creating in the future that suits other mages will suit her even more… I would love to see changes and I unfortunately don’t have high hopes for pvp in wor at this point (even though I still love it). Keep making content!
Haha, I mean there's really no need the matchmaking is so terrible we're currently winning 100% - 0% in the match after this, and that's not an exaggeration, that's literally the score right now. I really don't care about losing to people that have better accounts/wallets than me. Like I said in the video the homogeneity of defenses is everywhere in overlord and high plat 3, it just gets worse the higher up the ranks you go
love you put some suggestion to that criticism. In my opinion Moonton is way too much focused on new heroes and stuff (haha - this and ONLY this brings them some more money, we all know that) and they don´t focuse to other game content as we players would like they have. It is good to bring something new now and then but as you said - it is CRUCIAL to maintant especially PVP content FRESH. Arena is total joke - this thing should be reworked MONTHS ago - but they just don´t care enoug. but that idea with using only specific heroes/demons or what so ever on that GvG seems briliant to me. Personaly - I would pick some randome heroes and demons roaster each week. Even "fraction only" related GvGs would become stereotype after some time. We need some total randomeness in this.
Using a watcher team is that off meta without ingrid is crazy in theory but my A5 Kigiri melts, and i can guarantee that nobody else runs the same team, something needs to change
Agreed GvG and Arena have both been meh since Ingrid...and as a person missing both Praetus and Ingrid, have no chance. The recent summoning controversy has chased almost half my guild from the game and these modes didn't help with the way they are
Yep, 100%, it's just the same teams over and over again. I'd say banning a meta hero from each type, or the idea of a weekly buff/nerf to certain factions would really motivate people to diversify their defenses
Played against The shire on Wednesday. 70 to 80% were copy paste defence 😅😅. Some with higher awakenings but dam...we hit walls hard I was happy i managed to beat the guild leaders defence at least while everyone else failed 😂
Yeah man, it's just so homogenous and it gets worse and worse as you move up the ranks. I don't expect to beat people that have significantly outspent me but it seems crazy that there are basically just 3 teams you fight over and over again
@BluntgutsGaming yeap. With awakening chaos and essentially it's talks of. "These are the teams we need" geee...itll be very easy to summon specific champs haha Now that I see anceints is messed up with pity...not summoning or spending until this game really fixes their dam issues
Yeah man, PvP/Competitive game modes are the only things that keep me engaged in these games. I think there are a lot of folks that feel the same so I hope they make some changes!
Honestly, ...as much as I share your sentiment, this is sadly the reality of gatcha games with PvP content. No matter what you do the top whales will always have the better champs and gear. Even if you introduce rotating Faction, you're mostly penalizing played with less hero choices. All the top whale won't care because they'd have pretty much all champions so they will find the best meta for those rotation.
GVG defo needs balance. At times, the guild you're facing are way stronger with well developed accounts which would question how this pairing is determined as it's hardly fair when your guild gets steamrolled by an opposing guild that has no business showing up on your radar and vice versa. Also I noticed for the 1st time that ranged dps would target healers instead of the tankier units sent ahead. Wondering if this was a new thing implemented unless I didn't get the memo.
Is that right about the healers? I haven't noticed that but I'll look into it. I think you're 100% right the matchmaking seems to get worse and worse every season, but I also just wonder if it might be that there are fewer guilds playing the mode competitively so there just aren't as many good matchups unless you're in the top 10
I like some of the ideas here but I don't think they'd really be workable at all levels. Like, having changes by the week or even by the match is going to be *way* more than most guild leaders outside of Overlord/pushing for overlord are going to want to manage. So I think my solution would be something like the following, to try to balance the needs of lower level guilds with the top-level competitive ones: - Shorter seasons, maybe each just a month or so - Guilds compete within a closed "league" for each season - Rules are open at the lower leagues, but starting in Platinum (or equivalent in the new system) some of the restriction/ban ideas may start coming into play (but maybe only per season), while the Overlord-level league has the most restrictions/bans in effect, and changing the most frequently - Promotion and relegation between leagues at the end of the season (guild leaders maybe can refuse promotion if they don't want the added burden of the new rules. Or maybe they just live with it and expect to get pounded if they don't step up their oversight of the guild) There are probably some unintended consequences of this that I haven't yet thought through, but I think this would be a better system at most levels, with less of the ridiculous match-to-match variance that we've seen with the current system.
Hey Holo, thanks for sharing your thoughts. I really like the idea of making the restrictions or changes only applicable in the higher ranks of GvG, or even the closed league idea. I think you're right and most of my concerns here are probably only applicable to the top 100 or so GvG guilds
I mean at the end of the day it is a gacha game. The only thing that can separate all the players are how big your wallet is and how much luck you get.
Yeah I did not intend to complain about the spenders, if it came off that way then I'll just say unequivocally now that isn't why I made this video. GvG in Overlord (along with many other competitive areas of the game) has become so homogenous it's ruining the game imo.
Every game mode has heroes that are OP and heroes that are useless. I find your idea of releasiong OP heroes like Ingrid constantly very bad. If they do, people will complain that everyone uses new OP hero everywhere and all teams are the same. Not to mention that it will become jarring to always chase the new monthly flavour. I understand your frustration, my guild is similar to yours, at the verge of Overlord. Two seasons in a row we fell down in the last round and missed OL by a thread. It's maddening that at a certain level you hit a guild that is just impossible to beat, no matter what you do. But I also played this game long enough to understand that it's not only the heroes that decide that. There are also countless hours of study and hundreds of thousands of GR2 grinds for BP and demons. And generally a shitload of hard work. The reason why some factions dominate is pretty simple. Their lords are very good in GVG. Pope, Cyrus, Torodor, these are units that are very powerful even without their lord bonuses. If you take Harz for example and give him an exclusive piece that allows him to resurrect at least once, he would become very viable in GVG and more Northern teams will spawn. I don't know if you saw the new Monkey King limited hero? He gives 1 resurrect to everyone in 2x squares from him, perhaps he will be a good add-on to GVG and push more Watcher teams forward. I like the idea of boosting certain factions during a season. I was thinking of adding Aurion(the MC commander), as some sort of general that can give various bonuses in GVG. There are options if there is a will. Anyway, thanks for sharing your thoughts! I enjoy your level headed view of things, even if I maybe don't always agree with it. It's refreshing to see that there are still CCs out there that are not always looking for the sensational. All the best!
Thanks for the detailed and well reasoned response! I take your point about hero-chasing but I also don't think it's healthy to have 3-5 heroes be the determining factor for account success in most of the competitive game modes. Imo that's just poor design, and there's no amount of farming that you can do to overcome not having an Ingrid or Praetus or Valderon or Cyrus. Personally I think the best idea is to have a weekly, biweekly, or monthly rotating nerf to some set of the meta heroes, encourage people to find new comps and give people a reason to build and develop some of the less used heroes in the game. Appreciate your thoughts and you tuning in!! ❤❤❤
all of those teams that you showed and mentioned are beatable with right strategy and BP affiliations + good demon levels.. YES all of those Ingrid teams are perfectly beatable... Biggest problem here is that you dont belong in Overlord, the fact you are there is already impressive with your farm and money spent on the game.... you cant actually expect to be a match for top 3 - 5 guild with your BP, gear farm and money invested in hero awakenings... whole this rant is pretty much pointless, this is a gacha game and pvp in gacha will always be p2w if you like it or not. best thing you can do is to join some Plat 3 or lower guild and compete on your level to have some fun and decent chance to win your attacks and start working on your BP heroes / BP gear so your win rate will improve I agree on these 2 things tho, there needs to be more end game content especially in PVE (they nerfed GB2 too much and it is too easy and boring) and we need more GVG heroes to add diversity.
"problem is you don't belong in overlord" Overlord is about 35 teams, and Arbiters are probably top 35. Not top 10 though, and it's only the awful matchmaking system that has them fighting Eternals and Awakened Choas, who just got 3&4 in the Gauntlet. Only 1 close battle last season, the rest were comfortable wins or losses. The matchmaking system (or the scoring system) needs the overhaul most in my opinion.
I appreciate you watching, but our guild has finished in OL multiple times and we're very competitive against most guilds outside the top 10. In this video I was trying to make a point about how little variation there is in high level GvG, not complain about losing out to people that have spent more than me. This dynamic isn't unique to the top 5 or 10 guilds on OL, as I mention in the video it's just more true the higher you go. There has been no change to the meta since July, and I think that's a big problem that is only going to get worse after this next round of Ingrid and Praetus banners.
@@Timko234 💯the matchmaking seems to get worse each season, but I also wonder if that might be because there are fewer people trying to play this game mode competitively. I think if people felt like they could compete without the perfect set of heroes then there would be a lot more interest, engagement and competition in GvG
@@BluntgutsGaming this rant didnt sound like you were complaining about variation only but okay... also variation means that they will bring new GVG meta breaker heroes that will make it even harder than it is now coz u will have to pull for them = spend more money to stay competitive. anyway it doesnt change my main point, you are not losing because there is not enough variation, we have enough factions that work in GVG atm, problem is that this map require way more BP from attackers and thats why you feel bigger gap between your guild and top 5 guilds lets say, you need good demon levels and high BP affiliations to deal with defense on current map vs previous season, especially vs Ingrid / Pope and Eso teams.... NM teams are actually very doable but I wont spoil the strat how to deal with them :) [any NM formation] So yea, variation wont help you here, it would only increase "low spenders agony" coz of fomo for new meta, we either need better matchmaking in GVG, different point system or you will have to spend more money on BP heroes / BP gear farming to get any shot vs top guilds....
I'm surprised at how much u CC complain ...it's like u want the devs to make everything possible for u as u not for the people paying the game ...GBG is perfect ....no need to change it ....Arbiter is Supreme....no need to change that ...just pull all ur shards every week till u get a full team then go mess up those defences
I'm glad you enjoy it! I have no problem losing to people that outspent me, but most of the guilds in the top 32 are filled with carbon copy defenses with little variation. Personally that gets stale for me, but to each their own.
That's fair, where's the fun in the game after you've beaten everything then though? I play these games because I want to build my account, but right now there's really not much to build towards.
@ you find no fun with a sense of accomplishment? 90% of players are still far from where your at. I agree there should always be a form of challenge for endgame players. I just think it should remain in pvp. In pve you have already earned the right to have a cake walk in what ever comes next in my opinion.
@ I think there’s a ton of untapped potential on how much more they can do with pvp content. Like more arena maps or allowing ten hero deployments on even bigger maps in gvg with either more chances to use maw or cutting the total attack count in half.
Rotating usable factions or banning certain heros sounds great.
That can't happen this a tower defense game.
I think either could work but I like the idea of banning 1-2 heroes from each class (Mage/Defender/Fighter/Healer) each week from the meta heroes. I think that would really shake things up and keep the game mode fresh. it would also probably level the playing field to an extent
@@Greyden666it can very much happen lmao
Hey man, on point as always. I read a suggestion once a while back, what if they made every tower and every keep map available for the players to choose ? We would see a much bigger variety of teams.
It is true that all they have been releasing lately is new heroes and barely any new content. So much potential and so many ideas have been mentioned on their discord.. More Faction Trial stages, Ultra nightmare Void Rift difficulty, Epic champion ONLY content etc etc. We’re at the point where pulling for new heroes is only worth it if they are META for GvG and that’s it.
Take care and see you in the next one 🤘🏼
Thanks man! I love the idea of being able to choose your own tower map, maybe with some limits - like maybe you have a pool of 5 maps and you have to pick a certain number of each to make sure people don't just stack whatever becomes the best map over and over.
I think you bring up a larger point here that I wholeheartedly agree with - there's just not enough content in the endgame. Like you said there's SO many opportunities for them to make new content. I'd love to have something to work towards in this game that isn't GvG but like you pointed out that's really the only reason to pull these days. If they aren't going to make changes to arena and GvG they need to put out more challenging content.
Yup this is how I feel too, honestly even in my video it was insane. It’s like running into a wall, when you yourself are a rock
Yeah I don't mind getting outspent by the opposition but it's supremely frustrating (and boring) to go against the same Praetus/Torodor/Cyrus comps every single week season after season
Other problems are -
Too many unusable tiles.
Garnet Guards.
Mages Range.
All of these things push everyone into the same teams. Can’t deploy mages, because they are at risk of garnet guards. You have a tile where archers can hit off the back deployment. Of course you could use lily’s anti death, but then your tank gets ran through.
I think just removing the guards would bring more diversity. It’s definitely been worse since they can to town.
I mean fundamentally it might bring more diversity but that diversity would literally only mean even more op defences (people would only change defences if they were even stronger then the current meta defences with garnet guard handicaps). I think gvg is already too defence favoured
Facts
I agree with most of your points but I don't know that removing the GG's really solves the problem, though they've definitely exacerbated it. Personally I think a lot of these issues are a lot more palatable if things change on a week in week out basis
@@killeranu3221 I’d rather have the option to use more hero’s than be pigeonholed into limited hero’s. But yes, you are also correct.
I completely agree with you, thanks for the video Bluntguts!
Thanks, Haze!! Hopefully they make some changes in future seasons! What changes would you like to see?
A format where each guild could ban maybe like 3 heroes would be interesting. The meta would certanly get very interesting
I don't like this idea. Basically, every guild will just get rid of carnelian, lili and ezryn and then there is no competitive defenses you can build anymore. Or remove torodor, brokkir and cyrus.
@@SassyEmotions hmm sure, a way around that could be to restrict bans, so if you ban lets say Carnelian, you cant ban another support
Totally agree,
I know ppl don’t want their op hero’s nerfed
So I wish they would nerf Lilly and carnelian they literally make it impossible Without giga chad BP to get through a tank and the window with the op Dps is so small it kills the game mode.
Yeah their fatal damage saving mechanic really enables a lot of these meta comps. The only problem I see with removing that is that we'd all just steamroll these teams otherwise. The more I talk about it with folks the more I think there needs to be some mechanical changes to really fix the game mode
i love your content. keep it up!
Thanks man!! Appreciate you watching ❤❤
I agree with you. We’ve been saying it with my guild as well. Too many same teams. Either limit how many heroes can be deployed by the entire guild. Or like you said only certain heroes allowed during that week of gvg. Or multiple maps like each stronghold has 6 different maps.
💯 just shake it up! I think that would go a LONG ways towards making it feel fresh each week, not to mention encourage people to use some forgotten heroes
@@BluntgutsGaming ya they gotta do something. At least give the attacker a chance to win. It seems to be all defense. And the rewards aren’t even worth giving my full attention if I know I have no chance to do anything
That would be amazing be able to ban a certain hero each week. Moontoon has a game called Mobile Legends Bang Bang and that feature is availble during battle. So the meta is change every fight.
Come on now. Same bans same picks, every match. Mlbb matchmaking is a disaster and always has being. Moonton only interest is money. I like the idea for bans every week in this game though. Only because never seen it before. But I’m sure eventually the same combos/style will rise up eventually
Yep, I think it would go a long way, but I think it would need to be a rotation otherwise it would end up just being the same bans each week.
@@BluntgutsGaming what im thinking is a hero ban per week (1 or 2 hero maybe). Afterwards that hero cannot be ban for the succeeding 3 weeks. That would keep the meta changing per week.
Bro knows the best revenge. No screen time 😂 love it
Hahahahahaha this made me actually LOL! Get back to your caves, Celestials Eternals 😜
100% agree!
Thanks for watching ❤❤
I understand your frustration being in a guild pushing for overload the last 2 seasons. The new maps change it up for the first few weeks but then “meta” comps get found and then your fighting the same teams. I myself don’t have Ingrid or Carn. But I have a come up with variations of the meta defenses that work well. Two weeks ago when we were recruiting we literally asked if they had Ingrid as a requirement….
For gvg purposes. I like the idea of factions weekly!!
Yes, 100% man, viability is way too dependent on having specific heroes, requiring them in recruiting just proves that point. Hopefully they make some changes in future seasons!
I'm with ya bro! I agree 👍 midgame, and the guilds we are put against are master level.
And that sucks!! I imagine it's hard to get into the game mode if you're just matched up against teams you can't compete against
I understand what you're saying, we need more heroes in 3 NEW factions!! Plus more time. Hang in there bro.
LOL glad we're on the same page man 🤣👊. I think there's a lot they could do to shake things up, hopefully they're open to making some changes
@BluntgutsGaming keep up the good work bro. Use your platform to draw attention to it. If the last few weeks have proven anything, it's that moonton are NOT DEAF! 👊
100% to their credit they are usually pretty receptive to community feedback, lets hope they listen this time!
Banning heroes or getting rid of heroes doesn't change the gap from what blunt is saying top 20 guild in overlord should face each other repeatedly and not face anyone lower, until someone enters that top 20.
Personally I'm not all that concerned over losing to the P2W folks, although I may not have done a great job of communicating that in the video. It can be frustrating no doubt, but the lack of diversity in defenses is pretty consistent across all of Overlord and high Plat 3. I'm mainly just tired of facing the exact same heroes every week basically since July when Ingrid was released
imagine a guild wide restriction or a restriction on any one keep and its towers on how many of a specific hero can be deployed? (maybe have less restrictions for lower ranks but increasing restrictions as you go up?)
I'd love it! ❤❤
For a bit more diversity they could add 5 different tower maps to each stronghold. And have a different map for each keep as well.
We're a mid level guild in PIII, and we usually get a very easy fight followed by an impossible fight. Or the other way around. It is never a close battle.
I like the idea but I think it needs to change at regular intervals to keep things fresh. I've noticed the same thing the last couple of seasons, it's either a guild we can't touch or a guild we dominate, there's not much in between. I think it's because there are fewer people playing the game mode competitively but that's just speculation
100% agree. Haven't played in a week.
From my view its an issue hard to address, because banning certain teams might weaken the available defenses - suddenly everyone will get overrun. On the other hand, current format is far from ideal. Like it has been mentioned by others, there are some general limitation such as unusable tiles or units range - which lead to this meta. I agree with your view that since Ingrid, there were no specific OP characters - maybe Wukong and second NM lord next? My general suggestion would be to introduce new demon soldiers, especially the flying ones - to add disposable flying dmg unit and also flying tank unit which could aggro attacks - supporting other units. More dmg buffers would be also welcome. There are lot of demon soldiers that I have never seen and probably never will see being deployed.
I think you make some good points here. If banning a certain faction suddenly means there are no viable defenses then I think that's symptomatic of a broken game mode and probably means they need to do a larger overhaul. While I'd love to see Demon Soldiers used to fix the situation they've tried that repeatedly and if anything it's just further limited the viable defenses in the game mode. I think the best suggestion I've seen is to buff/debuff certain factions on a rotation rather than outright banning them. I think, if done right, that could really shake things up and add mor excitement to the game mode
What if they made each tower have specific faction alignments and rotate them. Would give a reason for people to choose spots. Would also let WoR/Moon play with tower paths that favor faction specific strats and challenges.
That's a fun idea, although I think they'd need to do some balancing because there are some factions that just get completely steamrolled right now. If they combined it with buffs that were tied to the towers that could address that tho
@@BluntgutsGaming I think that's perfect. See, not all stages are built and balanced the same. Having some stages able to take full advantage of their abilities while others have theirs worked against lets you build into or against their balance level. A perfect example would be stage hazards that apply to both sides (but inherently favor one or the other) like field-wide shields, persistent regen so unsustained poke is less useful, explosive barrels (which we don't get any of outside of those challenge stages).
For the stronger factions, having TWO lanes would be possible, as well, adding to defensive woes.
I wouldnt mind certain factions a week. Need a variety so people dont get screwed. Itll be more interesting but the krakens will still shine which is fine. But at least you can attack certain defences
Yeah let the Krakens have it, idc about that honestly, I just want to face some different teams!!
Another solution could be to give us more demon soldiers (and make them a little easier to farm) that give us the tools to challenge some of these OP comps.
I agree in theory but it seems like they've been trying that for a while and it's only made the problem worse. If they can figure out how to do it effectively I'd be all for it!
I think they should faction limit each week not hero limit. Limiting one hero (except the broken lords) i dont think would help enough. Limiting an entire faction would change things big time.
I agree, but my concern is that if you ban say Arbiters then do we just see everyone using NM and Esotericists? I think if you ban a few key heroes then you could force people to figure out some new comps. Maybe a combination of the two where a few heroes are banned and certain factions get buffed each week...there's a lot of options. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!!
@ agreed but the same Logic holds true just banning a certain hero no? At least banning entire factions you massively limit the pool.
Just my thoughts
I 100% agree. Carnelian and Lili are just ruining gvg. There are no alternatives.
Yeah they're a huge part of the problem, no doubt
Exactly Bluntguts Im endgame and live for GvG style content in other games I've played, but WoR the GVG sux so bad. I find defences so ridiculously strong even when my BP is higher. Game suffers everywhere from thee 2 arbiters being gods in all PvP content. I'll get a lord again for Praetus banner and if I dont get him or something good I'll prob quit as its about these 2 heroes. Demon soldiers get melted by so many damage dealers. The fool needs to be re-run as without the fool Maw is useless. EDIT- game also suffers as OG players had the original souls stones and most made Praetus/Ingrid A3-5 try and get that now....the only answer is they nerf these 2 which they wont do - or power creep them....which is a scary thought.
Yep, there's like 5 heroes across all of the competitive game modes that are basically irreplaceable. If you have them you're competitive, if you don't then you're not and no amount of farming can make up for it. I don't think they can/should nerf them because of the money spent to get them, but they need to find a way to make some of the other heroes compelling to use, even if it's just because of a weekly buff or restriction or whatever
Banning different factions each week could be interesting, or having certain factions (or even just disabling other Lord Bonuses) on different towers?
Personally I don't love the idea of banning whole factions but disabling or nerfing lord bonuses for a week would definitely shake things up
agree with all of this, just frustrating & stale. I also think that uncapped demon levelling is also absolutely broken. needs to be capped, and there needs to be catch up mechanics for early/mid game accounts
Catchup mechanics are sorely needed imo, and another reason why we need more heroes to compete with the Ingrids and Praetus' and Valderons of the world. I think a lot of people have already abandoned the game mode and the population is just going to continue to decay if these dynamics continue
GvG is boriiiiing as hell but its mandatory in order to be in a guild that even clears apocalypse 1 and 2 .
Yeah frfr, they need to shake it up so more people WANT to play the game mode
Great vid
Thanks man, appreciate you tuning in ❤
Same all way down in gvg.
Yes some people spend to win, rarest faction arbiter, yet most prevalent.
Like idea of can't use certain heroes per season
I feel like this is a game problem with all end game content. Amusingly I think there is not enough hero variety to fulfill similar roles. I think Ingrid or Prateus is fine if they have counters or equivalent heros. The problem is they have to skew power towards ancient exclusive heros for money, Most long term players have most of the non ancient heros they want, especially with that select your hero compensation. Like you, I am rambling, but I agree that end game requires more challenges to overcome. Also with continued recent undermining of trust with the summoning system it is hard to want to by into the system.
Hey man, just saying. All those defense are beatable.im on top 5 guild in my server and yeah peatrus and his queen rules the defense. But youre right. Its really depend on your BP. I dont know the solution maybe moonton need to realease more higher BP heroes ? Anyway keep making content man i love it
Oh yeah they're definitely beatable, although probably not consistently at my BP. My point was that even in a more even match there's just not much variation in the heroes and defenses. I wasn't complaining about not being able to take on a top 5 guild defenses, honestly I didn't even try very hard because the match was kind of over before it started. I just want some more variety and viability so we aren't fighting the same 3 defenses over and over and the game mode gets stale.
I appreciate the kind words, and you watching!!! ❤️
I think you brought up some really important points and the lack of diversity is a huge missed opportunity! There are so many amazing champs that we can’t use because they are in the wrong faction or just lack core requirements that gvg has nowadays.
Healers are in the worst spot, where in the top 10 guilds you will rarely see anything besides Lilly and Carnelian with the odd Ezryn. Any other healer is basically a free win at this point.
Tanks are in a very similar spot, where the meta is Brokkir, Regulus, Cyrus or Torodor. People that lack Cyrus or Torodor are unlikely to be able to set up two teams that can compete.
Ingrid and GGs have made GvG comps a lot more narrow since you need to account for so many things now, which only leaves a few heroes/ factions that can fill those spots.
I believe that mid OL GvG is the most fun (besides when you face one of the top guilds that just lost to MAD). A lot of the problems are made by the player base and the desire to always optimize, so the only way to fix this is a forced diversity such as x amounts of uses per hero per month/week. Any map they are creating in the future that suits other mages will suit her even more… I would love to see changes and I unfortunately don’t have high hopes for pvp in wor at this point (even though I still love it).
Keep making content!
you could quit your overlord guild and join some silver or gold guild and rolfstomp noobs there for that wtfpwn itch....
Haha, I mean there's really no need the matchmaking is so terrible we're currently winning 100% - 0% in the match after this, and that's not an exaggeration, that's literally the score right now. I really don't care about losing to people that have better accounts/wallets than me. Like I said in the video the homogeneity of defenses is everywhere in overlord and high plat 3, it just gets worse the higher up the ranks you go
I have Anora A0 and no Ymiret and have never used her. Does she need to be higher awakening and her bond skill to be a beast in GvG?
love you put some suggestion to that criticism. In my opinion Moonton is way too much focused on new heroes and stuff (haha - this and ONLY this brings them some more money, we all know that) and they don´t focuse to other game content as we players would like they have. It is good to bring something new now and then but as you said - it is CRUCIAL to maintant especially PVP content FRESH. Arena is total joke - this thing should be reworked MONTHS ago - but they just don´t care enoug. but that idea with using only specific heroes/demons or what so ever on that GvG seems briliant to me. Personaly - I would pick some randome heroes and demons roaster each week. Even "fraction only" related GvGs would become stereotype after some time. We need some total randomeness in this.
I totally agree with you. The meta makes it so boring. Good suggestion to ban a faction like the idea
Using a watcher team is that off meta without ingrid is crazy in theory but my A5 Kigiri melts, and i can guarantee that nobody else runs the same team, something needs to change
Agreed GvG and Arena have both been meh since Ingrid...and as a person missing both Praetus and Ingrid, have no chance. The recent summoning controversy has chased almost half my guild from the game and these modes didn't help with the way they are
Perhaps banning 1 hero for each type every week would make things a little more interesting. I see 80% same defenses in guilds all the time
Yep, 100%, it's just the same teams over and over again. I'd say banning a meta hero from each type, or the idea of a weekly buff/nerf to certain factions would really motivate people to diversify their defenses
To expand can't use certain heroes expand it to gvg and arena
I think it will get even worse after this month praetus and ingrid baners
100%, everyone is just going to be running the same team in a few months
I run Torodor and Brokkir and 2 healers and 1 dps just as a stall fest but i am in mid game nowhere clost to endgame
Played against The shire on Wednesday. 70 to 80% were copy paste defence 😅😅. Some with higher awakenings but dam...we hit walls hard
I was happy i managed to beat the guild leaders defence at least while everyone else failed 😂
Yeah man, it's just so homogenous and it gets worse and worse as you move up the ranks. I don't expect to beat people that have significantly outspent me but it seems crazy that there are basically just 3 teams you fight over and over again
@BluntgutsGaming yeap. With awakening chaos and essentially it's talks of. "These are the teams we need" geee...itll be very easy to summon specific champs haha
Now that I see anceints is messed up with pity...not summoning or spending until this game really fixes their dam issues
Yeah gvg and arena are both pretty boring now
Yeah man, PvP/Competitive game modes are the only things that keep me engaged in these games. I think there are a lot of folks that feel the same so I hope they make some changes!
Honestly, ...as much as I share your sentiment, this is sadly the reality of gatcha games with PvP content. No matter what you do the top whales will always have the better champs and gear. Even if you introduce rotating Faction, you're mostly penalizing played with less hero choices. All the top whale won't care because they'd have pretty much all champions so they will find the best meta for those rotation.
Banning hero’s and factions is a fantastic idea
GVG defo needs balance. At times, the guild you're facing are way stronger with well developed accounts which would question how this pairing is determined as it's hardly fair when your guild gets steamrolled by an opposing guild that has no business showing up on your radar and vice versa. Also I noticed for the 1st time that ranged dps would target healers instead of the tankier units sent ahead. Wondering if this was a new thing implemented unless I didn't get the memo.
Is that right about the healers? I haven't noticed that but I'll look into it. I think you're 100% right the matchmaking seems to get worse and worse every season, but I also just wonder if it might be that there are fewer guilds playing the mode competitively so there just aren't as many good matchups unless you're in the top 10
I like some of the ideas here but I don't think they'd really be workable at all levels. Like, having changes by the week or even by the match is going to be *way* more than most guild leaders outside of Overlord/pushing for overlord are going to want to manage.
So I think my solution would be something like the following, to try to balance the needs of lower level guilds with the top-level competitive ones:
- Shorter seasons, maybe each just a month or so
- Guilds compete within a closed "league" for each season
- Rules are open at the lower leagues, but starting in Platinum (or equivalent in the new system) some of the restriction/ban ideas may start coming into play (but maybe only per season), while the Overlord-level league has the most restrictions/bans in effect, and changing the most frequently
- Promotion and relegation between leagues at the end of the season (guild leaders maybe can refuse promotion if they don't want the added burden of the new rules. Or maybe they just live with it and expect to get pounded if they don't step up their oversight of the guild)
There are probably some unintended consequences of this that I haven't yet thought through, but I think this would be a better system at most levels, with less of the ridiculous match-to-match variance that we've seen with the current system.
Hey Holo, thanks for sharing your thoughts. I really like the idea of making the restrictions or changes only applicable in the higher ranks of GvG, or even the closed league idea. I think you're right and most of my concerns here are probably only applicable to the top 100 or so GvG guilds
GVG is the worst atm, its the same 6 teams, im one of the only people in the top 10 guilds on forerunner using a different team
I've never been a fan of guild wars
it's the nature of gacha games, if you don't like it, find a different game.
What is the "it" here?
Im confused bro. You dont want to hit the same teams every match, but you complain about them releasing new heroes 😵💫
I complained about them releasing a bunch of mid heroes - they haven't released anyone to shake up the meta since July.
I mean at the end of the day it is a gacha game. The only thing that can separate all the players are how big your wallet is and how much luck you get.
Yeah I did not intend to complain about the spenders, if it came off that way then I'll just say unequivocally now that isn't why I made this video. GvG in Overlord (along with many other competitive areas of the game) has become so homogenous it's ruining the game imo.
Every game mode has heroes that are OP and heroes that are useless. I find your idea of releasiong OP heroes like Ingrid constantly very bad. If they do, people will complain that everyone uses new OP hero everywhere and all teams are the same. Not to mention that it will become jarring to always chase the new monthly flavour.
I understand your frustration, my guild is similar to yours, at the verge of Overlord. Two seasons in a row we fell down in the last round and missed OL by a thread. It's maddening that at a certain level you hit a guild that is just impossible to beat, no matter what you do. But I also played this game long enough to understand that it's not only the heroes that decide that. There are also countless hours of study and hundreds of thousands of GR2 grinds for BP and demons. And generally a shitload of hard work.
The reason why some factions dominate is pretty simple. Their lords are very good in GVG. Pope, Cyrus, Torodor, these are units that are very powerful even without their lord bonuses. If you take Harz for example and give him an exclusive piece that allows him to resurrect at least once, he would become very viable in GVG and more Northern teams will spawn. I don't know if you saw the new Monkey King limited hero? He gives 1 resurrect to everyone in 2x squares from him, perhaps he will be a good add-on to GVG and push more Watcher teams forward.
I like the idea of boosting certain factions during a season. I was thinking of adding Aurion(the MC commander), as some sort of general that can give various bonuses in GVG. There are options if there is a will.
Anyway, thanks for sharing your thoughts! I enjoy your level headed view of things, even if I maybe don't always agree with it. It's refreshing to see that there are still CCs out there that are not always looking for the sensational. All the best!
Thanks for the detailed and well reasoned response! I take your point about hero-chasing but I also don't think it's healthy to have 3-5 heroes be the determining factor for account success in most of the competitive game modes. Imo that's just poor design, and there's no amount of farming that you can do to overcome not having an Ingrid or Praetus or Valderon or Cyrus. Personally I think the best idea is to have a weekly, biweekly, or monthly rotating nerf to some set of the meta heroes, encourage people to find new comps and give people a reason to build and develop some of the less used heroes in the game.
Appreciate your thoughts and you tuning in!! ❤❤❤
all of those teams that you showed and mentioned are beatable with right strategy and BP affiliations + good demon levels.. YES all of those Ingrid teams are perfectly beatable... Biggest problem here is that you dont belong in Overlord, the fact you are there is already impressive with your farm and money spent on the game.... you cant actually expect to be a match for top 3 - 5 guild with your BP, gear farm and money invested in hero awakenings... whole this rant is pretty much pointless, this is a gacha game and pvp in gacha will always be p2w if you like it or not. best thing you can do is to join some Plat 3 or lower guild and compete on your level to have some fun and decent chance to win your attacks and start working on your BP heroes / BP gear so your win rate will improve
I agree on these 2 things tho, there needs to be more end game content especially in PVE (they nerfed GB2 too much and it is too easy and boring) and we need more GVG heroes to add diversity.
"problem is you don't belong in overlord"
Overlord is about 35 teams, and Arbiters are probably top 35. Not top 10 though, and it's only the awful matchmaking system that has them fighting Eternals and Awakened Choas, who just got 3&4 in the Gauntlet.
Only 1 close battle last season, the rest were comfortable wins or losses. The matchmaking system (or the scoring system) needs the overhaul most in my opinion.
I appreciate you watching, but our guild has finished in OL multiple times and we're very competitive against most guilds outside the top 10. In this video I was trying to make a point about how little variation there is in high level GvG, not complain about losing out to people that have spent more than me. This dynamic isn't unique to the top 5 or 10 guilds on OL, as I mention in the video it's just more true the higher you go. There has been no change to the meta since July, and I think that's a big problem that is only going to get worse after this next round of Ingrid and Praetus banners.
@@Timko234 💯the matchmaking seems to get worse each season, but I also wonder if that might be because there are fewer people trying to play this game mode competitively. I think if people felt like they could compete without the perfect set of heroes then there would be a lot more interest, engagement and competition in GvG
@@BluntgutsGaming this rant didnt sound like you were complaining about variation only but okay... also variation means that they will bring new GVG meta breaker heroes that will make it even harder than it is now coz u will have to pull for them = spend more money to stay competitive. anyway it doesnt change my main point, you are not losing because there is not enough variation, we have enough factions that work in GVG atm, problem is that this map require way more BP from attackers and thats why you feel bigger gap between your guild and top 5 guilds lets say, you need good demon levels and high BP affiliations to deal with defense on current map vs previous season, especially vs Ingrid / Pope and Eso teams.... NM teams are actually very doable but I wont spoil the strat how to deal with them :) [any NM formation]
So yea, variation wont help you here, it would only increase "low spenders agony" coz of fomo for new meta, we either need better matchmaking in GVG, different point system or you will have to spend more money on BP heroes / BP gear farming to get any shot vs top guilds....
I'm surprised at how much u CC complain ...it's like u want the devs to make everything possible for u as u not for the people paying the game ...GBG is perfect ....no need to change it ....Arbiter is Supreme....no need to change that ...just pull all ur shards every week till u get a full team then go mess up those defences
I'm glad you enjoy it! I have no problem losing to people that outspent me, but most of the guilds in the top 32 are filled with carbon copy defenses with little variation. Personally that gets stale for me, but to each their own.
Personally I don’t think difficult content is good content. Just look at baloons td. None of it is hard and the game remains to be fun.
That's fair, where's the fun in the game after you've beaten everything then though? I play these games because I want to build my account, but right now there's really not much to build towards.
@ you find no fun with a sense of accomplishment? 90% of players are still far from where your at. I agree there should always be a form of challenge for endgame players. I just think it should remain in pvp. In pve you have already earned the right to have a cake walk in what ever comes next in my opinion.
@ I think there’s a ton of untapped potential on how much more they can do with pvp content. Like more arena maps or allowing ten hero deployments on even bigger maps in gvg with either more chances to use maw or cutting the total attack count in half.